Yes, I had read her before and thus had no reason to consider she would be trashing folks that already hurt.
And since I saw it differently all along I never had any of those thoughts that obviously others including yourself had. But yes, I can agree her wording (like mine) if you read that sentence could have enraged. And that is in part because we have had those who would attempt to pour salt into open wounds with their words.
But she never was doing that to me so I can't appreciate fully what others here obviously did.
Regarding the two posters who "know" LCM, one of them is some kind of cult researcher. I suggest that a cult researcher who is surprised at how former cult members might react to his words needs to reconsider his profession. Freud, if you're reading this, and if you're good at what you do, come back. Consider the audience and don't be surprised at the tone of some of the replies you get. It shouldn't surprise you. Don't let it turn you away.
When I read her post, I took it in the context that some of those who were willing were the ones who cried rape perhaps because they felt scorned......
Maybe they wanted more in a relationship with LCM or another MOG and when LCM or another MOG moved on they felt scorned or rejected. Thus perhaps they jumped on the band wagon of sexual abuse and cried foul when they had freely availed themselves to the MOG. Now I don't know if any of that is true, and I personally am not inferring that anyone did that, that is just what I took from reading sogwaps thread.
She wrote about her experience ... it sounds to me like Craig is someone she once loved, and still cares about on some level. ... Her post was on-topic and relevant. So why isn't there room for that topic here? Why isn't there room for her here? ... it is her story to tell, in her own words.
That just can not be allowed.
:)
This is just one from among a few topics which can not be allowed without an angry crowd stomping on you.
:)
... Is sogwap really the only one here who has had sex under morally ambiguous circumstances? I find that hard to believe, but, okay, if you say so. ...
If Freud and Jung are watching this site, they must have thought they hit a goldmine of cult dysfunction .......LOL What a case we are (oops what a case I am). I can only speak for myself.
Well, I promise to be less sarcastic if that helps.
Freud and Jung, o we barely knew thee. If they want to post, let them. I have had my doubts that they were legit, but if they want a forum to express their thoughts they have it. I didn't see anyone shutting them down. Did I miss something?
The way I see it I express my ideas, opinions and sometimes facts from the past as best I remember them. I've said before - to me - given the 35 plus years that span most of our times in the Way, the many many different places, states and locations everyone came from, the backgrounds, plus the specific things everyone did that are often so different from each other - it's no wonder to me that there are different experiences and perspectives.
If anything, GS proves that beyond the shadow of a doubt. Even as the Way attempts to promote a universal like mindedness among it's members there is in fact no such thing, outside of some very broad areas of agreement. But when it gets down to cases, this small percentage of ex-and current Wayfers that post here have very different perspectives to share, ones that often don't "agree" in the sense that everyone goes yae! and hi-fives all around at once. Some do, some don't.
But anger? I have none. The fact that I don't like something and say so doesn't mean that I'm angry about it. I don't see this as a place to get up a heavy head of steam over what amounts to the sharing of other peoples ideas that will probably never be exactly the same as mine and shouldn't be required to be.
It's the differences that are fascinating. Some I don't like, I won't lie about that. Some I think are wrong by the standards I aspire to. But behind the time I spend here is a life that's not involved in any form or fashion in anything to do with "the Way" in it's past present or future forms so ulitmately I should try to remember that more often as it's the way I view all of this - I have nothing invested i the outcome of any discussion. I would like everyone to progress on with their lives in constructive ways that make them happy. I met a lot of wonderful people while in the Way, lots of them. The future should be as bright from today as it ever was.
My biggest interest is reading what people write and I have to say I often wish I had the answer(s) for many of the questions. But I don't, other than each of us should invest the time we have in living the life we'd like to enjoy and be remembered for. It's not easy sometimes, it's very difficult at others. But overall for me it's pretty good at this point and I'm very happy and I would like to pass that on to others - if there's any doubt you're worthy of a great and satisfying life, you are. I'm sure of it. :)
Paw...I know you and I have our running battles pm'ing each other but thanks (genuinely) for what you do here. I think a 'balanced' forum is what we should all be helping you to achieve.TWI never got the 'balance' quite right and look what happened.
I read your post and took a deep sigh. I didn't even read the rest of the thread. I have been around since Waydale under different names. At first, in Waydale, it was a relief to find people with the same experiences and disappointments. When we left TWI, it was not be cause of DR. and LCM, but because of local leadership. The expert manner with which they would berate and belittle had become greater than my love of the so-called 'house-hold'. I figured I could stand on the Word by myself easier than with TWI.
I have always starved for fellowship. I had hoped upon first logging on to your site, there would be a chance of meeting some of the posters.
My first year of visits were entertaining and sometimes educational regarding the reports of TWI and the bumbling around in the dark. Then, things waxed worse and worse. It got to where I couldn't stand to come in here because of the bitterness and then the berating that I witnessed.
Thanks for saying something. I'm amazed that you must have to read everything posted in here and put up with the opinions of some of the most damaged people in our country.
Absolutely Ydon`tugotochurch.... apparently though, that is the effect of past fellowship with twi that has had on so many souls...sigh and secondly doggone it...just what in the world are those damaged people doing having opinions anyway???? and THIRDLY, how dare they be allowed to express them??
It is an OUTRAGE for me to have participated on this thread today (said in my best vpw immitaion) ......no just kidding....
It is unpardonable that we haven`t appropriatly met your fellowship needs either dear.
Seriously.....Why not come into live chat and *meet* some of us there....lots of great fellowship to be had.... really... damaged goods though we arguable may be :)
Thanks for saying something. I'm amazed that you must have to read everything posted in here and put up with the opinions of some of the most damaged people in our country.
Welcome back to GS -- .Stick around. -- You should fit right in.
Suppose the entrance of posters (posers?) "Freud" and "Jung" was somebody's idea of a psychology experiment, and Greasespot was the guinea pig?
If so, I don't think it makes their participation any less valid. In some sense, Greasespot is itself a lab, conducting countless experiments consciously or unconsciously, most attempting to answer the question, "What will happen if I reveal what I think, how I feel?"
Or some may inquire, "What will they think if... [for example] we introduce Martindale?"
Martindale himself studied psychology, and he wasn't too jock-stupid or dogma-distracted to grasp, at least, a few basic principles. For all we know, he might have been one, or both, F & J, testing the waters maybe?
Learn from this stuff. Weigh it in the balances of your own power of reason. Consider. Don't just react all the time, as if you have no control over your own mind. Greasespot is a sort of crucible (note Arthur Miller reference, you literati out there), and a safe means to learn more about yourselves than you ever might from TV or your neighbors.
When you feel your feelings begin to rise, try to rise above them, now and then. Healing requires discovery. You won't discover a thing if you're always putting your feelings first. You need to think, to consider, to understand, and with all the clarity you can achieve. Your must sometimes require your feelings to follow when they most want to lead. That is inner strength.
Thanks for saying something. I'm amazed that you must have to read everything posted in here and put up with the opinions of some of the most damaged people in our country.
I think it's important to understand why people are damaged. Something that was supposed to be godly was not. We lived in a dream world in twi.
BTW, you shouldn't hate church so much. Not ALL churches are what you think they are. I used to think the same way you did when I first left twi. After I started letting God work in my heart, He led me to where I needed to be. It could be a damaged mind-set from twi which makes you think that way.
Y, would you please elaborate and explain what you mean by this?
Thanks for saying something. I'm amazed that you must have to read everything posted in here and put up with the opinions of some of the most damaged people in our country.
Thanks Belle.....exactly what Satori was trying to say.........sometimes a sentence can sound different to different people reading it depending on their mind set at the time.....asking for clarification is always better and gets away from people feeling insulted and throwing insults back and forth........resulting in a very messy food fight that Pa and his co-workers (moderators) have to clean up afterward........
I too am interested, could have been a compassionate statement of "oh my...look what TWI has done to people....what a shame." "They have been damaged so badly." (Reading that sentence with a mind set of giving the poster the benefit of the doubt - possibly she/he was feeling compassion for people when she/he typed it. Until we know otherwise we can't just take everything so dag gone personally, and jump on the keys and start flinging insults.............
As a side thought - the guidelines to posting and conversation are not limited to people that have been freed from the bonds of TWI - all people in life are taught early to treat people with respect just the way we want to be treated with respect. Being polite and considerate when conversing with people is normal behavior, jumping down people's throats all the time is not
Are there times that correcting a person is normal. Yes, but someone on another thread said it best, gosh just step away from the keyboard for awhile, take a walk, take a deep breath, anything, and then come back and read the words and see if they still sound like they are being sarcastic and insulting. Then confront or react appropriately. AGAIN JUST MY OPINION
If you think GSC people are some of the most damaged people in our country, you've led a sheltered life.
You might try spending some time with, say, someone with a serious mental illness.
People here, as far as I can tell, can function in society with jobs, homes, families, friends...
My siblings and I take care of my very mentally ill older brother. Sometimes, rarely, we will get a glimpse of the boy we remember, before the onset of his illness-- delusions, mood swings etc. Now, there, that's damage.
Thanks for the hugs exxie. Bro is doing okay right now, not terribly aggitated. His landlord likes how clean his apartment is, and is willing to overlook the bunker in the crawlspace (a sleeping bag and water bottles, energy bars...)
Housing has been the hardest part. If he loses housing he can't live with me or sis--freaks out with noise, commotion, disorder etc. out. And my other brother travels...that leaves expensive kitchenettes and motels. Disability is less than $700/month, so we all have to pitch in...
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ChattyKathy
Abi,
Yes, I had read her before and thus had no reason to consider she would be trashing folks that already hurt.
And since I saw it differently all along I never had any of those thoughts that obviously others including yourself had. But yes, I can agree her wording (like mine) if you read that sentence could have enraged. And that is in part because we have had those who would attempt to pour salt into open wounds with their words.
But she never was doing that to me so I can't appreciate fully what others here obviously did.
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excathedra
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outofdafog
When I read her post, I took it in the context that some of those who were willing were the ones who cried rape perhaps because they felt scorned......
Maybe they wanted more in a relationship with LCM or another MOG and when LCM or another MOG moved on they felt scorned or rejected. Thus perhaps they jumped on the band wagon of sexual abuse and cried foul when they had freely availed themselves to the MOG. Now I don't know if any of that is true, and I personally am not inferring that anyone did that, that is just what I took from reading sogwaps thread.
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Galen
That just can not be allowed.
:)
This is just one from among a few topics which can not be allowed without an angry crowd stomping on you.
:)
I too was a sinner.
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excathedra
we're all sinners. that should not be the focus in my opinion
oh god
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excathedra
i'm sure that didn't come out right
sorry
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Galen
Yes maam.
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excathedra
i hope you know what i mean
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excathedra
ps. paw i don't know if i agree with you but god love ya for running this cult ;) i mean site :)
;) :)
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outofdafog
If Freud and Jung are watching this site, they must have thought they hit a goldmine of cult dysfunction .......LOL
What a case we are (oops what a case I am). I can only speak for myself.
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socks
Well, I promise to be less sarcastic if that helps.
Freud and Jung, o we barely knew thee. If they want to post, let them. I have had my doubts that they were legit, but if they want a forum to express their thoughts they have it. I didn't see anyone shutting them down. Did I miss something?
The way I see it I express my ideas, opinions and sometimes facts from the past as best I remember them. I've said before - to me - given the 35 plus years that span most of our times in the Way, the many many different places, states and locations everyone came from, the backgrounds, plus the specific things everyone did that are often so different from each other - it's no wonder to me that there are different experiences and perspectives.
If anything, GS proves that beyond the shadow of a doubt. Even as the Way attempts to promote a universal like mindedness among it's members there is in fact no such thing, outside of some very broad areas of agreement. But when it gets down to cases, this small percentage of ex-and current Wayfers that post here have very different perspectives to share, ones that often don't "agree" in the sense that everyone goes yae! and hi-fives all around at once. Some do, some don't.
But anger? I have none. The fact that I don't like something and say so doesn't mean that I'm angry about it. I don't see this as a place to get up a heavy head of steam over what amounts to the sharing of other peoples ideas that will probably never be exactly the same as mine and shouldn't be required to be.
It's the differences that are fascinating. Some I don't like, I won't lie about that. Some I think are wrong by the standards I aspire to. But behind the time I spend here is a life that's not involved in any form or fashion in anything to do with "the Way" in it's past present or future forms so ulitmately I should try to remember that more often as it's the way I view all of this - I have nothing invested i the outcome of any discussion. I would like everyone to progress on with their lives in constructive ways that make them happy. I met a lot of wonderful people while in the Way, lots of them. The future should be as bright from today as it ever was.
My biggest interest is reading what people write and I have to say I often wish I had the answer(s) for many of the questions. But I don't, other than each of us should invest the time we have in living the life we'd like to enjoy and be remembered for. It's not easy sometimes, it's very difficult at others. But overall for me it's pretty good at this point and I'm very happy and I would like to pass that on to others - if there's any doubt you're worthy of a great and satisfying life, you are. I'm sure of it. :)
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allan w.
Paw...I know you and I have our running battles pm'ing each other but thanks (genuinely) for what you do here. I think a 'balanced' forum is what we should all be helping you to achieve.TWI never got the 'balance' quite right and look what happened.
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YIdon'tgotochurch
Paw,
I read your post and took a deep sigh. I didn't even read the rest of the thread. I have been around since Waydale under different names. At first, in Waydale, it was a relief to find people with the same experiences and disappointments. When we left TWI, it was not be cause of DR. and LCM, but because of local leadership. The expert manner with which they would berate and belittle had become greater than my love of the so-called 'house-hold'. I figured I could stand on the Word by myself easier than with TWI.
I have always starved for fellowship. I had hoped upon first logging on to your site, there would be a chance of meeting some of the posters.
My first year of visits were entertaining and sometimes educational regarding the reports of TWI and the bumbling around in the dark. Then, things waxed worse and worse. It got to where I couldn't stand to come in here because of the bitterness and then the berating that I witnessed.
Thanks for saying something. I'm amazed that you must have to read everything posted in here and put up with the opinions of some of the most damaged people in our country.
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Abigail
"put up with the opinions of some of the most damaged people in our country"
Gee, wasn't that nice
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rascal
Absolutely Ydon`tugotochurch.... apparently though, that is the effect of past fellowship with twi that has had on so many souls...sigh
and secondly doggone it...just what in the world are those damaged people doing having opinions anyway???? and THIRDLY, how dare they be allowed to express them??
It is an OUTRAGE for me to have participated on this thread today (said in my best vpw immitaion) ......no just kidding....
It is unpardonable that we haven`t appropriatly met your fellowship needs either dear.
Seriously.....Why not come into live chat and *meet* some of us there....lots of great fellowship to be had.... really... damaged goods though we arguable may be :)
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Goey
Welcome back to GS -- .Stick around. -- You should fit right in.
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satori001
Suppose the entrance of posters (posers?) "Freud" and "Jung" was somebody's idea of a psychology experiment, and Greasespot was the guinea pig?
If so, I don't think it makes their participation any less valid. In some sense, Greasespot is itself a lab, conducting countless experiments consciously or unconsciously, most attempting to answer the question, "What will happen if I reveal what I think, how I feel?"
Or some may inquire, "What will they think if... [for example] we introduce Martindale?"
Martindale himself studied psychology, and he wasn't too jock-stupid or dogma-distracted to grasp, at least, a few basic principles. For all we know, he might have been one, or both, F & J, testing the waters maybe?
Learn from this stuff. Weigh it in the balances of your own power of reason. Consider. Don't just react all the time, as if you have no control over your own mind. Greasespot is a sort of crucible (note Arthur Miller reference, you literati out there), and a safe means to learn more about yourselves than you ever might from TV or your neighbors.
When you feel your feelings begin to rise, try to rise above them, now and then. Healing requires discovery. You won't discover a thing if you're always putting your feelings first. You need to think, to consider, to understand, and with all the clarity you can achieve. Your must sometimes require your feelings to follow when they most want to lead. That is inner strength.
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Nottawayfer
I think it's important to understand why people are damaged. Something that was supposed to be godly was not. We lived in a dream world in twi.
BTW, you shouldn't hate church so much. Not ALL churches are what you think they are. I used to think the same way you did when I first left twi. After I started letting God work in my heart, He led me to where I needed to be. It could be a damaged mind-set from twi which makes you think that way.
Edited to take back the rocks I threw.
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Belle
Before we all jump to conclusions again:
Y, would you please elaborate and explain what you mean by this?
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outofdafog
Thanks Belle.....exactly what Satori was trying to say.........sometimes a sentence can sound different to different people reading it depending on their mind set at the time.....asking for clarification is always better and gets away from people feeling insulted and throwing insults back and forth........resulting in a very messy food fight that Pa and his co-workers (moderators) have to clean up afterward........
I too am interested, could have been a compassionate statement of "oh my...look what TWI has done to people....what a shame." "They have been damaged so badly." (Reading that sentence with a mind set of giving the poster the benefit of the doubt - possibly she/he was feeling compassion for people when she/he typed it. Until we know otherwise we can't just take everything so dag gone personally, and jump on the keys and start flinging insults.............
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outofdafog
As a side thought - the guidelines to posting and conversation are not limited to people that have been freed from the bonds of TWI - all people in life are taught early to treat people with respect just the way we want to be treated with respect. Being polite and considerate when conversing with people is normal behavior, jumping down people's throats all the time is not
Are there times that correcting a person is normal. Yes, but someone on another thread said it best, gosh just step away from the keyboard for awhile, take a walk, take a deep breath, anything, and then come back and read the words and see if they still sound like they are being sarcastic and insulting. Then confront or react appropriately. AGAIN JUST MY OPINION
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Bramble
If you think GSC people are some of the most damaged people in our country, you've led a sheltered life.
You might try spending some time with, say, someone with a serious mental illness.
People here, as far as I can tell, can function in society with jobs, homes, families, friends...
My siblings and I take care of my very mentally ill older brother. Sometimes, rarely, we will get a glimpse of the boy we remember, before the onset of his illness-- delusions, mood swings etc. Now, there, that's damage.
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excathedra
((((((( dear bramble and brother and family ))))))))
freud and jung were probably bored to tears
bramble, that was supposed to be a separate post from the hugs, but i did it too quickly
like this one probably
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Bramble
Thanks for the hugs exxie. Bro is doing okay right now, not terribly aggitated. His landlord likes how clean his apartment is, and is willing to overlook the bunker in the crawlspace (a sleeping bag and water bottles, energy bars...)
Housing has been the hardest part. If he loses housing he can't live with me or sis--freaks out with noise, commotion, disorder etc. out. And my other brother travels...that leaves expensive kitchenettes and motels. Disability is less than $700/month, so we all have to pitch in...
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