MizMarple, that is hilarious. They'd really heard all those things??
I was at his burial because I was on staff at HQ when he died. I don't remember a whole lot, given that it was almost 20 years ago.
There was a simple coffin that some of the Way Builders made, and there were pallbearers (some of the revs) carrying it across the patio by the Snack Shop and down the driveway next to the Wierwille's house toward the gravesite in front of the house next to the fountain. People stood along the driveway as the pallbearers passed by with the coffin. A few people spoke, Johnny and Naomi T, I think and some others. People cried. That's all I remember.
After the Big Split, some of the former Way Corps "leaders" in my area, who were now followers of Chris Gearshift, predicted that the people at HQ would "go back on the 'dead aren't alive' doctrine" and would start claiming VP was talking to them from "the other side." LOL. I never heard that that happened, but it somehow strikes me as funny in light of what you heard from the NK ladies.
To me the gravesite service was very, very strange. The main person who spoke was Don. He certainly had the right to, though usually the immediate family elects not to. But man, it was surreal. I've been to many funerals that felt right. This one didn't.
I am a little surprised that more people here were not there for the service, or heard about the proceedings thru their respective tree spriglettes - but then some 21 years later is a long time ago already.
When VPW died, or just before, a phone call came thru and that info was desseminated among the peopullatude...it was a request from Mrs. W for prayer, that VPW was tired. Soon after, he did pass away and hmmmm....I remember being sad and even crying, alone, without much fanfare, kinda knowing something noteworthy had transpired, but not sure how much impact it would have on "the ministry." By that time, I was already relatively disassociated with the whole HQ setup, and even the organizational sap that trickled down the tree was not a major influence in my life. Alot of the bible stuff was, tho, and many people I loved were very integral to my spiritual well being.
Boy, has that garden gone untended. But foo, I digress...lol.
Give 'em time, Miz Marple. Sometimes it takes a bit for folks to get to a thread, especially if "life" and the boards are busy. You may get an eye full. :)
vee pee was long gone by the time I got involved in '93, so I can't help ya. I think it's hilarious when I hear stories like this, though...it really is a small world, isn't it? I met a guy at the airport once who's brother-in-law had been involved with TWI. The guy was dodging around the conversation once he heard I knew about TWI and sighed a huge sigh of relief when I asked him if he knew TWI was a cult. He wasn't sure if I was "in" or not and didn't want to offend me or see me go off on some tirade like his b-i-l was prone to do.
Evan, How was it surreal? Is there anything you can add to that? Just curious....not that I'm at all surprised it was surreal. :P
Well, as best I can recall, believers in general were not to attend...we were given no details about the where/when etc....no flowers etc.
It was like we were supposed to pretend that it didn`t happen.
TC`s were given a paragraph to read word for word and then we were not supposed to discuss it....just send everybody home...at least to the best of my recollection.
I was completely bewildered wondering why we hadn` been given the oportunity to pray....you know 24 hrs of prayer ... it was all very confusing and secretive.
When VPW died, or just before, a phone call came thru and that info was desseminated among the peopullatude...it was a request from Mrs. W for prayer, that VPW was tired. Soon after, he did pass away and hmmmm....I remember being sad and even crying, alone, without much fanfare, kinda knowing something noteworthy had transpired, but not sure how much impact it would have on "the ministry."
Well, as best I can recall, believers in general were not to attend...we were given no details about the where/when etc....no flowers etc.
It was like we were supposed to pretend that it didn`t happen.
TC`s were given a paragraph to read word for word and then we were not supposed to discuss it....just send everybody home...at least to the best of my recollection.
I was completely bewildered wondering why we hadn`t been given the oportunity to pray....you know 24 hrs of prayer ... it was all very confusing and secretive.
Pretty much the same experience I had as a Twig Co-ordinator. At the time, I didn't even know the man was sick, much less dying. And of course, we weren't privy to the reason why he died, just the "he was tired of the fight." I always hated how you had to be a "ministry insider" to get the non-sanitized, real version of what happened.
But that's ok. It just made it easier to leave when I did.
A sick, mean part of me wonders if this lack of information, and Wierwille's lessening of importance at the Way in general, sprung from "leadership's" secret desire for him to just dry up and blow away.
A tape of the memorial service was sent out: I listened to it at the house of a believer who was still friendly with me: it is very solemn and ceremonial, and very sad.
I was at Emporia when VP died. They had a special meeting in the room above the cafeteria to inform us. They cancelled classes for a few days. We had a memorial service. I was in a group that sang at the service. "Surreal" definately desribes my experience. Most of us had absolutely no idea he was even sick (although I later heard from a friend who was WOW and she said they had been told he was ill and to pray for him). At the time, that kind of secrecy lent credibility and an aura of "man of god" to the whole thing... stupid me.
I've never heard the of details of what happened at HQ at the time, but didn't Craig talk about everything they did in his 17th corps rant (aka 1st class-thingie where he went off about Chris Geer being possessed)? If I rememer right, Vic dictated everything he wanted... where to be buried, when, how, who speaking, singing, etc.
all very interesting input/remembrances...I remember the video tape in the auditorium being shown...VPW and the choir singing...celebrated the hope of the Hope.
BUT
more of what prompted me to post was not so much about VPW's memorial, per se, BUT rather, how things get so blown out of proportion or told and retold (often by people who don't have a clue in the first place)until it is all so much bilge, more or less.
I met with a friend (many years ago already) who told me that my former sister-in-law (with whom I spoke about stuff from the Bible) delighted in telling people that I cast spells on people by wishing and twirling on my holy spirit ring...that's crazy...I'm way too big to twirl on my ring...but it does give me pause to wonder how many angels can dance on the head of a pin...lol.
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Linda Z
MizMarple, that is hilarious. They'd really heard all those things??
I was at his burial because I was on staff at HQ when he died. I don't remember a whole lot, given that it was almost 20 years ago.
There was a simple coffin that some of the Way Builders made, and there were pallbearers (some of the revs) carrying it across the patio by the Snack Shop and down the driveway next to the Wierwille's house toward the gravesite in front of the house next to the fountain. People stood along the driveway as the pallbearers passed by with the coffin. A few people spoke, Johnny and Naomi T, I think and some others. People cried. That's all I remember.
After the Big Split, some of the former Way Corps "leaders" in my area, who were now followers of Chris Gearshift, predicted that the people at HQ would "go back on the 'dead aren't alive' doctrine" and would start claiming VP was talking to them from "the other side." LOL. I never heard that that happened, but it somehow strikes me as funny in light of what you heard from the NK ladies.
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excathedra
i don't know for some reason this makes me sad
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TheEvan
To me the gravesite service was very, very strange. The main person who spoke was Don. He certainly had the right to, though usually the immediate family elects not to. But man, it was surreal. I've been to many funerals that felt right. This one didn't.
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excathedra
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MizMarple
I am a little surprised that more people here were not there for the service, or heard about the proceedings thru their respective tree spriglettes - but then some 21 years later is a long time ago already.
When VPW died, or just before, a phone call came thru and that info was desseminated among the peopullatude...it was a request from Mrs. W for prayer, that VPW was tired. Soon after, he did pass away and hmmmm....I remember being sad and even crying, alone, without much fanfare, kinda knowing something noteworthy had transpired, but not sure how much impact it would have on "the ministry." By that time, I was already relatively disassociated with the whole HQ setup, and even the organizational sap that trickled down the tree was not a major influence in my life. Alot of the bible stuff was, tho, and many people I loved were very integral to my spiritual well being.
Boy, has that garden gone untended. But foo, I digress...lol.
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Belle
Give 'em time, Miz Marple.
Sometimes it takes a bit for folks to get to a thread, especially if "life" and the boards are busy. You may get an eye full. :)
vee pee was long gone by the time I got involved in '93, so I can't help ya. I think it's hilarious when I hear stories like this, though...it really is a small world, isn't it? I met a guy at the airport once who's brother-in-law had been involved with TWI. The guy was dodging around the conversation once he heard I knew about TWI and sighed a huge sigh of relief when I asked him if he knew TWI was a cult.
He wasn't sure if I was "in" or not and didn't want to offend me or see me go off on some tirade like his b-i-l was prone to do.
Evan, How was it surreal? Is there anything you can add to that? Just curious....not that I'm at all surprised it was surreal. :P
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rascal
Well, as best I can recall, believers in general were not to attend...we were given no details about the where/when etc....no flowers etc.
It was like we were supposed to pretend that it didn`t happen.
TC`s were given a paragraph to read word for word and then we were not supposed to discuss it....just send everybody home...at least to the best of my recollection.
I was completely bewildered wondering why we hadn` been given the oportunity to pray....you know 24 hrs of prayer ... it was all very confusing and secretive.
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Kevlar2000
Pretty much the same experience I had as a Twig Co-ordinator. At the time, I didn't even know the man was sick, much less dying. And of course, we weren't privy to the reason why he died, just the "he was tired of the fight." I always hated how you had to be a "ministry insider" to get the non-sanitized, real version of what happened.
But that's ok. It just made it easier to leave when I did.
A sick, mean part of me wonders if this lack of information, and Wierwille's lessening of importance at the Way in general, sprung from "leadership's" secret desire for him to just dry up and blow away.
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dmiller
I was on LEAD in South Dakota when docvic passed.
I got home three days later, and nobody was talking.
The only thing offered to us here was a chance to go to the
memorial service at the following Rock --- nothing more.
Any questions anyone had --- were cut short by *leadership*.
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topoftheworld
A tape of the memorial service was sent out: I listened to it at the house of a believer who was still friendly with me: it is very solemn and ceremonial, and very sad.
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TheHighWay
I was at Emporia when VP died. They had a special meeting in the room above the cafeteria to inform us. They cancelled classes for a few days. We had a memorial service. I was in a group that sang at the service. "Surreal" definately desribes my experience. Most of us had absolutely no idea he was even sick (although I later heard from a friend who was WOW and she said they had been told he was ill and to pray for him). At the time, that kind of secrecy lent credibility and an aura of "man of god" to the whole thing... stupid me.
I've never heard the of details of what happened at HQ at the time, but didn't Craig talk about everything they did in his 17th corps rant (aka 1st class-thingie where he went off about Chris Geer being possessed)? If I rememer right, Vic dictated everything he wanted... where to be buried, when, how, who speaking, singing, etc.
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MizMarple
all very interesting input/remembrances...I remember the video tape in the auditorium being shown...VPW and the choir singing...celebrated the hope of the Hope.
BUT
more of what prompted me to post was not so much about VPW's memorial, per se, BUT rather, how things get so blown out of proportion or told and retold (often by people who don't have a clue in the first place)until it is all so much bilge, more or less.
I met with a friend (many years ago already) who told me that my former sister-in-law (with whom I spoke about stuff from the Bible) delighted in telling people that I cast spells on people by wishing and twirling on my holy spirit ring...that's crazy...I'm way too big to twirl on my ring...but it does give me pause to wonder how many angels can dance on the head of a pin...lol.
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