A potato has "about the same protein as a hamburger" ?
Lets break that down a bit. Have you done it?
It's the percent of Protein in each food that I was trying to relay:
Pecans 5
Banana5
Watermelon 8
Oranges 8
Cantaloupe 9
Potatoes 10
Barley 11
Almonds 12
Walnuts 13
Corn 15
Wheat 17
Peanuts 18
Wile Rice 18
Tomatoes 20
Cabbage 22
Squash 23
Cucumbers 24
Beef 26
Green beans 26
Lentils 29
Broad beans 32
Asparagus 38
Soybeans 43
Brussell Sprouts 44
Broccoli 45
Spinach 49
There are many Myths coming from the food industries. Dairy lobby spending was $3,188,754 in 2004, all used to sell their products.
Yet, the primary cause of osteoporosis is a Sedentary Work and Lifestyle. An example is Astronauts, they have massive bone loss even though they consume lots of calcium. Another example is bedridden people.
Bones are like muscles, they get stronger and grow only when you put them under stress! But the dairy industry would like us to believe it's caused from the lack of calcium, and urge us to consume at least 'three glasses a day'...
Your other comment I feel duty-bound to address:
Why must these commercial diet promoters stretch the facts so much?
This conclusion about the RAVE diet can't be true.... but I do see that comment fitting the Meat and Dairy industry :)
There are many health care professional out there that know how changing to a vegetable based diet will allow your body to heal itself.
This is what they are encouraging in the RAVE materials. The whole point of the RAVE diet is to go back to the fundamental foods... in order to give our bodies a chance to heal themselves.
They don't claim to have invented a 'new diet', just the opposite.
RAVE is a simple acronym describing what to do to heal faster.
They inform people there are Doctors out there using similar diets, and if you need help, get advice from a Doctor who is trained in plant based nutrition.
They let people know that the human body is a miracle and it's constantly trying to heal itself.
I haven't been online much lately, but I have been following this thread with some interest.
After following doctors orders faithfully for a number of years and not doing as well as I'd like to, I made a decision about 3 1/2 months ago to learn what I could to take responsibility for my own health and see what would happen.
First off, I have some cardiac issues. I have a condition from birth called IHSS which means the aorta is constricted and this in turn causes the other valves to not operate correctly. That's an oversimplification, but essentially the jist of it.
The docs pretty much suggested I should lead an almost sedentary lifestyle (which as anyone who knows me will know it's totally anathema to all that I am) and take certain meds to keep me going.
Well, I became quite overweight and terribly uncomfortable. Last year at summer Scout camp, I had to get special consideration to get rides all around instead of walk like everyone else. I did walk some, however, to the horror of my GP doc.
Around Christmas I made a decision to be in some sort of shape besides round by the time camp in July rolled around this year, so I wouldn't have to be rolled around.
Here are some changes I've made due to new information I've gotten.
1. I only eat real butter...and lot's of it...on everything...no more margarine or any of that crap.
2. I only use olive oil for cooking...and occasionally lard.
3. I gave up soda pop....both regular and diet.
4. I usually eat 2 to 5 eggs per day...many raw mixed in drinks.
5. Cut out everything white...potatoes, rice, flour, sugar etc.
6. I enjoy lotsa beef...GRASS fed and never grain fed.
7. Eat salmon at least three times a week....usually more.
8. Eat grapefruit or cantaloup every day.
9. Cut out oranges and apples.
10. I keep a little journal writing down everything I eat and the portion size.
11. I always did eat a lot of chicken and hot link sausages, so that's not a change.
12. Avoid ALL soy products
13. I break it all up into 5 meals per day, never allowing myself to feel hungry.
I'm taking the following supplements along with my regularly scheduled heart meds the cardiologist prescribed...
1. Co Q 10 (Goey should know what this is)
2. Fish oil
3. Alpha Lipoic Acid
4. Chromium
5. "Vitamin Research Co." liquid multi vitamin
6. Drink a milk shake daily of 1 cup milk, 2 raw eggs, 1/2 cup plain yogurt and 6 ounces of whey protein every day.
7. I drink a lot of water with a squirt or two of apple cider vinegar.
I exercize about an hour each day with sit ups, push ups, and walk a mile every day.
Results??????
1. I've lost 52 lbs since Feb 15, 2006
2. I can walk all over my property without getting out of breath.
3. I have too much nervous energy to sit for great lengths of time at the computer.
4. I no longer wake up with my hands "asleep" nor do they fall asleep while I'm driving.
5. After running a number of tests, my cardiologist has taken me off two of my meds, reported my heart function has improved about 20% and has told me to continue with what I'm doing.
6. I'm wearing clothes I haven't worn in over a decade, having lost 8 inches off my waist.
7. My muscle to fat ratio has improved by 12%
8. Cholesteral dropped from 190 to 170 (This is really meaningless because, as Goey has shown, that whole thing is bogus...soon the medical profession will have to acknowledge this, even tho they've known it for many years, now)
I'm not suggesting anyone do what I'm doing...I'm suggesting each of us should gather all the information we can...learn, learn, learn...all about yourself, your food, your body etc etc etc and make your own informed choices accordingly.
And YES...I manage to have a LOT of Ro*tel tomatoes...and I discovered cottage cheese covered with Pace Picante Sauce (hot) is a wonderful treat beyond words!!
And honestly, there has been nobody who has ever said anything in a loving manner about my health.
Usually just a snide remark or the like.
I do not think starving to death is a fair comparison to someone who is having trouble loosing weight.
Honestly, I have been to countless Doctors as after a hysterectomy I have been in trouble.
My holistic MD, said I have screwed up my hormones so badly that it has affected my insulin and that it is the WAY I eat, not what I eat.
I had been on a 15oo cal a day diet and Doctor given diet pills and lost nothing. (Except sleep) and it scared me.
Most had the opinion "you must eat too much" But I knew I didn't.
I kept looking for answers and this Doctor was helpful in explaining what happened to me after a hysterectomy. And by my eating VERY little protein I was always dumping sugar making meals into my system which had my pancreas working over time....
Anyway, I wasn't really going to get into my person battle and reasons. My point is, while I am going through ALL of ths He LL, people think it is olay to pick on someone and ASSUME that they are a pig or something.
The point is NOT how I got here but whats it to a stranger? OR if I tell someone please do not send me any diets you are depressing me, this is not an area of my life I wish to share with you, and the response -- Not I care about your health, but --"Well, then you will loose your husband"
I don't care, if that is what is going because I gained weight, then at least I will be rid of 175 pounds.
The point is not how anyone got here it is why does anyone think it is open season to be mean to anyone who puts on a few pounds. You told us how you lost weight and you LOOK great. I am proud of you.
But, if you didn't loose weight, you would not be any "less" of a man (no pun intended) and should have never been a target of a cruel joke.
I have been. I do not get why. I really don't.
Looks are a huge part of society. Thus the make-up, surgeries etc. And I have come to terms with that. I have studied a bunch about my specific symptoms, as it does depress me, but what really gets me is pure meaness.
Like Oprah to me is a wonderful accomplished person, but she has been the target of really mean and nasty humor and remarks. Why do that to a lovely person?
Why do people feel they have that right?
That is my point.
When Liz Taylor gained weight Joan Rivers was horrible. MAking fun of her all the time with MEAN jokes. When Liz lost the weight, Joan and she were seated at a table at an event. Joan said to Liz, "I guess I really helped you loose weight." And Liz told her that her meaness was NOT helpful, and that the cruelity was crippling. She lost weight because she lost weight, Joan's meaness was NOT helpful.
They remind me of a book called FIghting the Food Giants
They had documentation that a certain food company was changing the food structure to make you more hungry after you ate it so you would it more.
We have no idea how delicate our systems are, and once messed with, how to get them back to norm. I know my hysterectomy, then HORMONE pills messed up my life terribly.
A potato has "about the same protein as a hamburger" ?
Saf-
My Doctor would completely disagree, she also says that white potatoes throw sugar into the system, where a sweet potato digests more slowly as it drizzles into the system, this keeps your insulin and fat producing systems in your bodyfrom working over-time.
Her advice was the book Sugar busters and a life style more towards The South Beach Diet.
I'm not suggesting anyone do what I'm doing...I'm suggesting each of us should gather all the information we can...learn, learn, learn...all about yourself, your food, your body etc etc etc and make your own informed choices accordingly.
Hurray Ron!!! What great success you’re having!
Learning and action seems to be the key.
My husband almost lost his leg due to poor circulation, borderline diabetes, poor eating and exercise habits. (He had a HOLE to the bone that barely coverd with a thin layer of skin~ very gross & scarey)
After seeing many doctors and getting NO results, he went to a Water Only Fasting Clinic in Northern California for three weeks. Actually, he's still there, will be done May 1st. The clinic does fasting & ‘re-feeding’, along with daily educational materials from all sorts of Doctors & Writers.
He's gotten excellent results. Normalized blood pressure, cholesterol & weight loss, all without medication, something several other doctors told him would NEVER happen for him w/out the meds. (but the meds made him very sick!)
BUT, there were some people who arrived while he was there, and the doctors didn't like what their blood work was showing, and wouldn't allow them to do the Water Only Fasting. They stayed only a short time, eating more fresh fare.
My husband is diabetic and considers the glycemic index for foods all the time. He has a booklet he received at a diabetic info class. But there is alot online, too. White bread, white potatoes, white rice--all high.
Bramble, did you see my reply w/ the protein/potato/hamburger error correction? Sorry about that
My husband is diabetic and considers the glycemic index for foods all the time. He has a booklet he received at a diabetic info class. But there is a lot online, too. White bread, white potatoes, white rice--all high.
You're right.. all the white stuff is high :)
My husband had diabetes too... His doctors didn't help him very much. For the last 3 years he did everything they told him to, and he continued to get worse, almost losing his left leg. (not to mention all the nose bleeds, headaches & internal problems from the meds)
So, we began our search for alternative, nutrition minded doctors.
He's gotten healed! No more diabetes, weight & cholesterol is down, circulation is returning, and he feels better than ever :)
There's a SEA of information out there... mind-boggling sometimes!
We found only a couple of places that seem to know what they're doing with Water Fasting. One place he didn't care much for, since they believe in evolution, which rubbed him the wrong way... But, he was healed
Concering information from the Rave Diet, Safari posted:
It exposes some facts that most people don't know about, like how the meat and dairy industry is subsidized by the government. It shows how much of our natural resources goes to feed the animals we eat, and many more fascinating facts on the care and handling of these animals.
Years ago, the common diseases of today plagued only the very wealthy. The people who could afford more 'expensive' foods.
Today, without the government support, our beef would be about $90 a pound... (something only the very wealthy could afford)
Safari, you didn't come outright and say it so I will. The Rave Diet is strictly vegetarian. No animal products period. No eggs, no cheese, no milk, no meat of any kind including fish:
No Refined foods
No Animal foods
No Vegetable oils
No Exceptions
That out of the way, I would like to see the data that supports the "fact" that beef would cost $90 per pound if not for government subsidies. Let's do some math.
IN 2002, Americans consumed an average of 67.6 lbs of beef per capita at an average price of $3 per pound. Thefore goverment subsidies amount to $87 according to the fact above.
So thats 300 million people x 67.6 lbs x $87 for a total $1.76 trillion in beef subsidies. This is close to the entire federal budget. So you see why I would like to see the data?
On another note: Attributing the cause of certain diseases to foods only the wealthy can afford beef (meat) in this case is based upon casual observation and has only a small shread of fact in it. However using this as the basis of the conclusion that the consumption of "meat" or animal products is the cause of many modern diseases, ignores many other important facts.
Foods from animal products such as meat, milk, cheese, butter, etc have been an integral part of a diets that have sustained generally healthy civilizations for thousands of years. Cancer, diabetes and Coronary Heart Diesase were relatively unheard of until after the turn of the 20th century. This is when "Crisco" began to replace lard, margarine began to replace butter, Fresh whole milk became homoginized and pasturized. Meats got hormomes and antibiotics. Our farms and fields got covered with petsicides & herbicides. In the 50's coconut oil was replaced with hydrogenated soy and other previously unmarketable vegetable oils. Refined sugar consumption increased 100 fold. Chemical preservatives became commonplace.
If historically, we could show that an increase of animal product consumption correlates to the rise of these diseases and we had a historical vegetarian model where these diesease were rare or absent, then we might have a case for a strict vegetarian diet. However such is not the case. We have more of the opposite.
Animal products have been unfairly demonized as the culprits when the facts and good science just don't warrant it. I think it is much more likely that processed vegetable oils(trans fats), consumption of refined sugars, and processed foods in general -- along with the almost total elimination of things like fresh whole milk, tropical oils, etc are the more likely culprits. A diet that eliminates all animal products, deprives the body of some of nature's most valuable food sources.
When I say animal products, I mean whole unprocessed milk. Eggs from range chickens, & meat free from chemicals, hormones, etc. Comparing todays processed animal products with those of prior to 1900 is like comparing apples to oranges.
All the meat Andrew and I eat, we either raise it ourselves or aquire it by barter from friends or neighbors. This is why I can get grass fed beef rather than grain fed beef...all commercial beef is grain fed.
All our dairy products are obtained the same way. Our milk is NOT homogenized or pasteurized and I get fresh cream and do my own butter. Goat milk and goat cheese are wonderful.
At least 50% of the meat we eat is wild game which we kill and butcher ourselves. Wild game and grass fed beef are rich in conjugated linoleic acid.
With the exception of coffee, tea, salt, Ro*tel tomatoes, Claussen pickles, Earl Campbell hot links, Mexican chorizo, Pace Picante sauce and a few spices, my general attitude is that if I can't produce it myself or obtain it locally, I don't need it.
Goey, just reading here, and don't have all the details you'd like to see on the numbers, but will work on it. Not sure about 2002, but I'm sure consumption & spending has gone up since then ;)
What I do understand from the DVD, they are exposing the commercialized meat & dairy industries. Probably nothing like your place.
This is when "Crisco" began to replace lard, margarine began to replace butter, Fresh whole milk became homogenized and pasteurized. Meats got hormones and antibiotics. Our farms and fields got covered with pesticides & herbicides. In the 50's coconut oil was replaced with hydrogenated soy and other previously unmarketable vegetable oils. Refined sugar consumption increased 100 fold. Chemical preservatives became commonplace.
All of what you've stated there is a HUGH problem.
So what do you suggest we eat? Where do we buy meats & dairy that haven't been affected with these disease causing chemicals?
I'm not against using animal products. I'm not a strict vegan. But, TODAY there are not a whole lot of places to purchase meats that are good for us.
We bought some buffalo meat a few months ago for $25.00 a pound! Kinda pricey for our budget!
It is illegal in Michigan to SELL whole RAW milk and it's products. We have enjoyed some fresh milk from our Amish friends cows :) and eaten their free range eggs as well, but they live 6 hours away.
Refined foods in America are poisoned with chemicals. And they're so altered, that the body has a bunch of work to do getting rid of it, without getting anything good from it.
Organic foods are more expensive.
And as far as Oils... yes they're needed. But for a body that has it's blood filled with wax and other chemicals, it's okay to take a break. Crisco, margarine & other hydrogenated oils are similar to plastic in composition… stay away at all costs!
Fasting used to be used as way to allow the body to heal itself. God made our bodies to HEAL themselves, and I think it needs to be brought to the attention of those that are suffering.
Do the organic farmers receive subsidies? How about raspberry & blueberry farmers?
I'm NOT saying the RAVE diet is IT... what I'm saying is they do have some good information, exposing the 'general' way big industry is doing business... most of what is in the local grocery.
And just to clarify their acronym:
No Refined foods
No Animal foods
No Vegetable oils
No Exceptions
And EXERCISE! :)
All the meat Andrew and I eat, we either raise it ourselves or aquire it by barter from friends or neighbors. This is why I can get grass fed beef rather than grain fed beef...all commercial beef is grain fed.
All our dairy products are obtained the same way. Our milk is NOT homogenized or pasteurized and I get fresh cream and do my own butter. Goat milk and goat cheese are wonderful.
At least 50% of the meat we eat is wild game which we kill and butcher ourselves. Wild game and grass fed beef are rich in conjugated linoleic acid.
I disagree with a total vegetarian diet. When one goes vegetarian, vegan, whatever....there are a lot of things that have to be carefully monitored and compensated for because things that our bodies need aren't included in that diet. My girlfriend went vegetarian, but when she got pregnant she wasn't able to get enough protein in her diet and other nutrients that the baby needed to develop properly and healthily. Consultations with professional nutritionists confirmed that she needed to add meat back into her diet for the safety of her baby.
Ron, I was wondering where you got grass fed beef. :) That splains alot. Sounds like you live in paradise!
What I do understand from the DVD, they are exposing the commercialized meat & dairy industries. Probably nothing like your place.
In the state of Texas there are only 2 dairies licensed to sell fresh raw mikk. Both have been smeared and excommunicated from the American Dairy Association and both have been harrassed by state health officials. One recently won a lawsuit against the state health department , but it was costly. The licensing and permit costs for a fresh milk dairy of 10 cows is about 10 times that of a commercial dairy of hundreds of cows.
The American Egg board, a quasi-govermental agency, is making a false statement concerning free range chicken eggs. They claimed there was no nutritional difference between a free range chicken egg and a commerical produced egg where the chickens were confined to cages and only fed commerical feed.
Here is what they claim .... "The nutrient content of eggs is not affected by whether hens are raised free-range or in floor or cage operations." -- Link
So we are supposed to believe that there is no difference between eggs from chickens that eat fresh grass, clover, insects, worms, etc and those fed a commercial feed.
"In 2003, Pennsylvania State University researchers reported that birds kept on pasture produced three times more omega-3s in their eggs than birds raised in cages on a commercial diet. They also found twice as much vitamin E and 40 percent more vitamin A in the yolks of the pastured birds." (Mother Earth News)
Last year, I personally contacted Lou Raffel, the chairman of the American Egg Board, and aksed what studies had been done to warrant the AEB statement. He didn't know of any, but said he would check. The USDA got involved. After a month of back and forth emails between me, him and Dr Richard Reynnels of the USDA, the AEB did change the statement to make it "less misleading" than before. However that lasted only a few months and the original false statement was recently put back up when their Web Site was revamped.
To sit on the Board of Directors of the American Egg Board, one must operate a facility of at least 75,000 chickens which means that the smaller range operators are not represented at all. The commercial operators see the small range operators as a threat, and therefore are willing to give faulty information to protect their industry from a consumer shift to better quality eggs.
Reading this makes me want to SCREAM & CRY all at the same time.
This is what I'm talking about. I find it criminal how the natural way of doing things is being forced out of operation by big industry, who's chemically treated animal is not even close to being the same in quality. Animals there are being treated like machines, given hormones and chemicals to make them grow faster and bigger.
We watched thousands of male chicks being thrown live into a grinder, since they were no use to the egg farm :blink: Some places just throw them into plastic bags and let them suffocate...
There is even talk about cows being fed other cows, domestic animals, other farm and circus animals instead of grass... perhaps being mixed into their 'feed'...
And WHERE does that bacteria come from in packaged meats that cause us to become so ill when ingested?
I would add - for those of you who are trying to lose weight or have simply changed your lifestyle in an attempt to be more healthy and have found that you aren't losing weight - you might want to have your thyroid levels checked.
I have been making healthier choices in what I eat for some time now. I had also been exercising regularly for quite a time (though I did take a month off). While I did feel much healthier the extra pounds I had hoped to lose never did come off.
Well I just got my lab results back from my physical and it turns out I have a thyroid problem. The doctor says the thyroid medication will probably lower my cholesterol levels, give me more energy, and help me to lose weight.
I live in the Ozark mountains of northern Arkansas, which by most peoples standards, are somewhat backwards. It's not exactly paradise as the grocery stores only sell the same junk here that everyone else gets.
The old ways are dying off due to the younger people being suckered by contemporary media culture and the public school systems. The old timers are dwindling by attrition and not as many live to be in the 90 to 110 year old range any more due to the modern ways encroaching upon our culture.
More and more kids here, especially "townies", do what kids do everywhere and play video games and watch television in central heat or air instead of playing outdoors and working, hiking fishing etc. While leading somewhat sedentary lives, they eat and drink the chemical soups and substances that pass for "kid food" and just like their city counterparts, the parents are too sorry or too uninvolved to do anything about it and rely on psychotropic drugs to deal with the resulting chemical imbalances.
That's one of the very first things you learn as a scoutleader.
Fortunately, Andrew takes after me and enjoys the outdoors and would rather go out with his .22 and shoot a couple of squirrels and clean and cook them outside than play video games. We have a tripod set up over a fire ring out in the front yard where we cook a lot of our meals, especially in the spring, summer and fall months, but not so much in the winter...although you haven't lived until you've eaten a big bowl of deer chili cooked in an iron dutch oven over a fire in the woods in the snow...after spending the day killing, cleaning and cooking the deer.
I digress.
Not only are those free range eggs better and better for you, the meat of free range birds is infinitely better and much more flavorful, although quite a bit tougher. Not only is a free range chicken or turkey much better than store bought, it's much more nutritious and much more satisfying. Since the grocery store sells Tyson chicken leg quarters for 39 cents per pound, I buy them and hang them out by my chicken yard to lure predators while I wait with my shotgun...they're real good for that...and smoked racoon is delicious.
Anyway, this isn't exactly paradise, but after many years in Ft. Worth, Dallas, Houston, Florida, San Antonio and California, I wouldn't and couldn't live anywhere else.
There are many people I know who's stomach would turn reading about your hunting & cooking practices. A shame for them. They don't want to know 'where' the food came from, and thinking beyond the package in the store is uncomfortable for them.
As to the 'screened games & indoor play', we've had the privilege to spend a couple of weeks in a Cabin in Northern Michigan walking distance to two lakes. No TV, No Video or electronic games were there. There were beds, small bathroom with tub/shower, small kitchen and LOTS of board and card games.
There was a row boat, fishing equipment, inner tubes and varied natural wonders outside.
Our family NEVER got along better. We all worked together, and kitchen prep had never been more fun. After the first day, the kids didn't even argue, they were working & playing together.
For me, after having children, the definition of 'Paradise' took on a whole new meaning :) Sounds to me you're awfully close
Your post makes me think of the hunting and eating "policies" of a certain Motorcity Mad Man - Ted Nugent only eats meat that he's killed himself and is into exotic game meats, as well. I think it's the more honest way of eating - for those who can do it. I have no trouble with cooking game meat, but don't think I could kill unless I absolutely had to. For those who can hunt and enjoy it, I think it's the healthiest way to provide food for their family and also keeps certain animal populations at healthy levels.
In Maine there's a moose hunting lottery every year. You have to buy a ticket to enter and then only a certain number of licenses are issued by lottery - I think it's like 300 or 500 - something like that. However, there's always a certain group who are opposed to moose hunting at all - yet there are stories of gastly accidents with moose and vehicles (hitting a moose is about the deadliest thing that can happen to you in a car or SUV!) and moose getting into residential areas, etc. They don't see hunting as population control, but as cruel killing - any real hunter knows that it's best for the game and the meat to make a clean kill. And those Bullwinkle Burgers are mighty tastee! Ayah!
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SafariVista
((((Goey)))),
Sorry, miscommunication on my part:
It's the percent of Protein in each food that I was trying to relay:Pecans 5
Banana5
Watermelon 8
Oranges 8
Cantaloupe 9
Potatoes 10
Barley 11
Almonds 12
Walnuts 13
Corn 15
Wheat 17
Peanuts 18
Wile Rice 18
Tomatoes 20
Cabbage 22
Squash 23
Cucumbers 24
Beef 26
Green beans 26
Lentils 29
Broad beans 32
Asparagus 38
Soybeans 43
Brussell Sprouts 44
Broccoli 45
Spinach 49
There are many Myths coming from the food industries. Dairy lobby spending was $3,188,754 in 2004, all used to sell their products.
Yet, the primary cause of osteoporosis is a Sedentary Work and Lifestyle. An example is Astronauts, they have massive bone loss even though they consume lots of calcium. Another example is bedridden people.
Bones are like muscles, they get stronger and grow only when you put them under stress! But the dairy industry would like us to believe it's caused from the lack of calcium, and urge us to consume at least 'three glasses a day'...
Your other comment I feel duty-bound to address:
This conclusion about the RAVE diet can't be true.... but I do see that comment fitting the Meat and Dairy industry :)
There are many health care professional out there that know how changing to a vegetable based diet will allow your body to heal itself.
This is what they are encouraging in the RAVE materials. The whole point of the RAVE diet is to go back to the fundamental foods... in order to give our bodies a chance to heal themselves.
They don't claim to have invented a 'new diet', just the opposite.
RAVE is a simple acronym describing what to do to heal faster.
They inform people there are Doctors out there using similar diets, and if you need help, get advice from a Doctor who is trained in plant based nutrition.
They let people know that the human body is a miracle and it's constantly trying to heal itself.
Albert Schweitzer
Nobel Prize Winner
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Ron G.
I haven't been online much lately, but I have been following this thread with some interest.
After following doctors orders faithfully for a number of years and not doing as well as I'd like to, I made a decision about 3 1/2 months ago to learn what I could to take responsibility for my own health and see what would happen.
First off, I have some cardiac issues. I have a condition from birth called IHSS which means the aorta is constricted and this in turn causes the other valves to not operate correctly. That's an oversimplification, but essentially the jist of it.
The docs pretty much suggested I should lead an almost sedentary lifestyle (which as anyone who knows me will know it's totally anathema to all that I am) and take certain meds to keep me going.
Well, I became quite overweight and terribly uncomfortable. Last year at summer Scout camp, I had to get special consideration to get rides all around instead of walk like everyone else. I did walk some, however, to the horror of my GP doc.
Around Christmas I made a decision to be in some sort of shape besides round by the time camp in July rolled around this year, so I wouldn't have to be rolled around.
Here are some changes I've made due to new information I've gotten.
1. I only eat real butter...and lot's of it...on everything...no more margarine or any of that crap.
2. I only use olive oil for cooking...and occasionally lard.
3. I gave up soda pop....both regular and diet.
4. I usually eat 2 to 5 eggs per day...many raw mixed in drinks.
5. Cut out everything white...potatoes, rice, flour, sugar etc.
6. I enjoy lotsa beef...GRASS fed and never grain fed.
7. Eat salmon at least three times a week....usually more.
8. Eat grapefruit or cantaloup every day.
9. Cut out oranges and apples.
10. I keep a little journal writing down everything I eat and the portion size.
11. I always did eat a lot of chicken and hot link sausages, so that's not a change.
12. Avoid ALL soy products
13. I break it all up into 5 meals per day, never allowing myself to feel hungry.
I'm taking the following supplements along with my regularly scheduled heart meds the cardiologist prescribed...
1. Co Q 10 (Goey should know what this is)
2. Fish oil
3. Alpha Lipoic Acid
4. Chromium
5. "Vitamin Research Co." liquid multi vitamin
6. Drink a milk shake daily of 1 cup milk, 2 raw eggs, 1/2 cup plain yogurt and 6 ounces of whey protein every day.
7. I drink a lot of water with a squirt or two of apple cider vinegar.
I exercize about an hour each day with sit ups, push ups, and walk a mile every day.
Results??????
1. I've lost 52 lbs since Feb 15, 2006
2. I can walk all over my property without getting out of breath.
3. I have too much nervous energy to sit for great lengths of time at the computer.
4. I no longer wake up with my hands "asleep" nor do they fall asleep while I'm driving.
5. After running a number of tests, my cardiologist has taken me off two of my meds, reported my heart function has improved about 20% and has told me to continue with what I'm doing.
6. I'm wearing clothes I haven't worn in over a decade, having lost 8 inches off my waist.
7. My muscle to fat ratio has improved by 12%
8. Cholesteral dropped from 190 to 170 (This is really meaningless because, as Goey has shown, that whole thing is bogus...soon the medical profession will have to acknowledge this, even tho they've known it for many years, now)
I'm not suggesting anyone do what I'm doing...I'm suggesting each of us should gather all the information we can...learn, learn, learn...all about yourself, your food, your body etc etc etc and make your own informed choices accordingly.
And YES...I manage to have a LOT of Ro*tel tomatoes...and I discovered cottage cheese covered with Pace Picante Sauce (hot) is a wonderful treat beyond words!!
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Dot Matrix
Sudo, It wasn't Kit it was me.
And honestly, there has been nobody who has ever said anything in a loving manner about my health.
Usually just a snide remark or the like.
I do not think starving to death is a fair comparison to someone who is having trouble loosing weight.
Honestly, I have been to countless Doctors as after a hysterectomy I have been in trouble.
My holistic MD, said I have screwed up my hormones so badly that it has affected my insulin and that it is the WAY I eat, not what I eat.
I had been on a 15oo cal a day diet and Doctor given diet pills and lost nothing. (Except sleep) and it scared me.
Most had the opinion "you must eat too much" But I knew I didn't.
I kept looking for answers and this Doctor was helpful in explaining what happened to me after a hysterectomy. And by my eating VERY little protein I was always dumping sugar making meals into my system which had my pancreas working over time....
Anyway, I wasn't really going to get into my person battle and reasons. My point is, while I am going through ALL of ths He LL, people think it is olay to pick on someone and ASSUME that they are a pig or something.
The point is NOT how I got here but whats it to a stranger? OR if I tell someone please do not send me any diets you are depressing me, this is not an area of my life I wish to share with you, and the response -- Not I care about your health, but --"Well, then you will loose your husband"
I don't care, if that is what is going because I gained weight, then at least I will be rid of 175 pounds.
The point is not how anyone got here it is why does anyone think it is open season to be mean to anyone who puts on a few pounds. You told us how you lost weight and you LOOK great. I am proud of you.
But, if you didn't loose weight, you would not be any "less" of a man (no pun intended) and should have never been a target of a cruel joke.
I have been. I do not get why. I really don't.
Looks are a huge part of society. Thus the make-up, surgeries etc. And I have come to terms with that. I have studied a bunch about my specific symptoms, as it does depress me, but what really gets me is pure meaness.
Like Oprah to me is a wonderful accomplished person, but she has been the target of really mean and nasty humor and remarks. Why do that to a lovely person?
Why do people feel they have that right?
That is my point.
When Liz Taylor gained weight Joan Rivers was horrible. MAking fun of her all the time with MEAN jokes. When Liz lost the weight, Joan and she were seated at a table at an event. Joan said to Liz, "I guess I really helped you loose weight." And Liz told her that her meaness was NOT helpful, and that the cruelity was crippling. She lost weight because she lost weight, Joan's meaness was NOT helpful.
So Why?
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Dot Matrix
Ron that is interesting!
GOEY
I read those articles, very interesting.
They remind me of a book called FIghting the Food Giants
They had documentation that a certain food company was changing the food structure to make you more hungry after you ate it so you would it more.
We have no idea how delicate our systems are, and once messed with, how to get them back to norm. I know my hysterectomy, then HORMONE pills messed up my life terribly.
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Dot Matrix
Saf-
My Doctor would completely disagree, she also says that white potatoes throw sugar into the system, where a sweet potato digests more slowly as it drizzles into the system, this keeps your insulin and fat producing systems in your bodyfrom working over-time.
Her advice was the book Sugar busters and a life style more towards The South Beach Diet.
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SafariVista
Hurray Ron!!! What great success you’re having!
Learning and action seems to be the key.
My husband almost lost his leg due to poor circulation, borderline diabetes, poor eating and exercise habits. (He had a HOLE to the bone that barely coverd with a thin layer of skin~ very gross & scarey)
After seeing many doctors and getting NO results, he went to a Water Only Fasting Clinic in Northern California for three weeks. Actually, he's still there, will be done May 1st. The clinic does fasting & ‘re-feeding’, along with daily educational materials from all sorts of Doctors & Writers.
He's gotten excellent results. Normalized blood pressure, cholesterol & weight loss, all without medication, something several other doctors told him would NEVER happen for him w/out the meds. (but the meds made him very sick!)
BUT, there were some people who arrived while he was there, and the doctors didn't like what their blood work was showing, and wouldn't allow them to do the Water Only Fasting. They stayed only a short time, eating more fresh fare.
Everyone is different, and education is key.
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Bramble
My husband is diabetic and considers the glycemic index for foods all the time. He has a booklet he received at a diabetic info class. But there is alot online, too. White bread, white potatoes, white rice--all high.
http://www.carbs-information.com/glycemic-index.htm
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SafariVista
Bramble, did you see my reply w/ the protein/potato/hamburger error correction? Sorry about that
You're right.. all the white stuff is high :)
My husband had diabetes too... His doctors didn't help him very much. For the last 3 years he did everything they told him to, and he continued to get worse, almost losing his left leg. (not to mention all the nose bleeds, headaches & internal problems from the meds)
So, we began our search for alternative, nutrition minded doctors.
He's gotten healed! No more diabetes, weight & cholesterol is down, circulation is returning, and he feels better than ever :)
There's a SEA of information out there... mind-boggling sometimes!
We found only a couple of places that seem to know what they're doing with Water Fasting. One place he didn't care much for, since they believe in evolution, which rubbed him the wrong way... But, he was healed
The very best to you & your husband :)
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Goey
Concering information from the Rave Diet, Safari posted:
Safari, you didn't come outright and say it so I will. The Rave Diet is strictly vegetarian. No animal products period. No eggs, no cheese, no milk, no meat of any kind including fish:
No Refined foods
No Animal foods
No Vegetable oils
No Exceptions
That out of the way, I would like to see the data that supports the "fact" that beef would cost $90 per pound if not for government subsidies. Let's do some math.
IN 2002, Americans consumed an average of 67.6 lbs of beef per capita at an average price of $3 per pound. Thefore goverment subsidies amount to $87 according to the fact above.
So thats 300 million people x 67.6 lbs x $87 for a total $1.76 trillion in beef subsidies. This is close to the entire federal budget. So you see why I would like to see the data?
On another note: Attributing the cause of certain diseases to foods only the wealthy can afford beef (meat) in this case is based upon casual observation and has only a small shread of fact in it. However using this as the basis of the conclusion that the consumption of "meat" or animal products is the cause of many modern diseases, ignores many other important facts.
Foods from animal products such as meat, milk, cheese, butter, etc have been an integral part of a diets that have sustained generally healthy civilizations for thousands of years. Cancer, diabetes and Coronary Heart Diesase were relatively unheard of until after the turn of the 20th century. This is when "Crisco" began to replace lard, margarine began to replace butter, Fresh whole milk became homoginized and pasturized. Meats got hormomes and antibiotics. Our farms and fields got covered with petsicides & herbicides. In the 50's coconut oil was replaced with hydrogenated soy and other previously unmarketable vegetable oils. Refined sugar consumption increased 100 fold. Chemical preservatives became commonplace.
If historically, we could show that an increase of animal product consumption correlates to the rise of these diseases and we had a historical vegetarian model where these diesease were rare or absent, then we might have a case for a strict vegetarian diet. However such is not the case. We have more of the opposite.
Animal products have been unfairly demonized as the culprits when the facts and good science just don't warrant it. I think it is much more likely that processed vegetable oils(trans fats), consumption of refined sugars, and processed foods in general -- along with the almost total elimination of things like fresh whole milk, tropical oils, etc are the more likely culprits. A diet that eliminates all animal products, deprives the body of some of nature's most valuable food sources.
When I say animal products, I mean whole unprocessed milk. Eggs from range chickens, & meat free from chemicals, hormones, etc. Comparing todays processed animal products with those of prior to 1900 is like comparing apples to oranges.
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Ron G.
Something I need to add to my above post.
All the meat Andrew and I eat, we either raise it ourselves or aquire it by barter from friends or neighbors. This is why I can get grass fed beef rather than grain fed beef...all commercial beef is grain fed.
All our dairy products are obtained the same way. Our milk is NOT homogenized or pasteurized and I get fresh cream and do my own butter. Goat milk and goat cheese are wonderful.
At least 50% of the meat we eat is wild game which we kill and butcher ourselves. Wild game and grass fed beef are rich in conjugated linoleic acid.
With the exception of coffee, tea, salt, Ro*tel tomatoes, Claussen pickles, Earl Campbell hot links, Mexican chorizo, Pace Picante sauce and a few spices, my general attitude is that if I can't produce it myself or obtain it locally, I don't need it.
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SafariVista
Goey, just reading here, and don't have all the details you'd like to see on the numbers, but will work on it. Not sure about 2002, but I'm sure consumption & spending has gone up since then ;)
What I do understand from the DVD, they are exposing the commercialized meat & dairy industries. Probably nothing like your place.
All of what you've stated there is a HUGH problem.
So what do you suggest we eat? Where do we buy meats & dairy that haven't been affected with these disease causing chemicals?
I'm not against using animal products. I'm not a strict vegan. But, TODAY there are not a whole lot of places to purchase meats that are good for us.
We bought some buffalo meat a few months ago for $25.00 a pound! Kinda pricey for our budget!
It is illegal in Michigan to SELL whole RAW milk and it's products. We have enjoyed some fresh milk from our Amish friends cows :) and eaten their free range eggs as well, but they live 6 hours away.
Refined foods in America are poisoned with chemicals. And they're so altered, that the body has a bunch of work to do getting rid of it, without getting anything good from it.
Organic foods are more expensive.
And as far as Oils... yes they're needed. But for a body that has it's blood filled with wax and other chemicals, it's okay to take a break. Crisco, margarine & other hydrogenated oils are similar to plastic in composition… stay away at all costs!
Fasting used to be used as way to allow the body to heal itself. God made our bodies to HEAL themselves, and I think it needs to be brought to the attention of those that are suffering.
Do the organic farmers receive subsidies? How about raspberry & blueberry farmers?
I'm NOT saying the RAVE diet is IT... what I'm saying is they do have some good information, exposing the 'general' way big industry is doing business... most of what is in the local grocery.
And just to clarify their acronym:
No Refined foods
No Animal foods
No Vegetable oils
No Exceptions
And EXERCISE! :)
Where is this place Ron... sounds wonderful
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Belle
I like this book Sugars and Flours: How They Make Us Sick, Crazy, and Fat.
I disagree with a total vegetarian diet. When one goes vegetarian, vegan, whatever....there are a lot of things that have to be carefully monitored and compensated for because things that our bodies need aren't included in that diet. My girlfriend went vegetarian, but when she got pregnant she wasn't able to get enough protein in her diet and other nutrients that the baby needed to develop properly and healthily. Consultations with professional nutritionists confirmed that she needed to add meat back into her diet for the safety of her baby.
Ron, I was wondering where you got grass fed beef. :) That splains alot. Sounds like you live in paradise!
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Goey
In the state of Texas there are only 2 dairies licensed to sell fresh raw mikk. Both have been smeared and excommunicated from the American Dairy Association and both have been harrassed by state health officials. One recently won a lawsuit against the state health department , but it was costly. The licensing and permit costs for a fresh milk dairy of 10 cows is about 10 times that of a commercial dairy of hundreds of cows.
The American Egg board, a quasi-govermental agency, is making a false statement concerning free range chicken eggs. They claimed there was no nutritional difference between a free range chicken egg and a commerical produced egg where the chickens were confined to cages and only fed commerical feed.
Here is what they claim .... "The nutrient content of eggs is not affected by whether hens are raised free-range or in floor or cage operations." -- Link
So we are supposed to believe that there is no difference between eggs from chickens that eat fresh grass, clover, insects, worms, etc and those fed a commercial feed.
"In 2003, Pennsylvania State University researchers reported that birds kept on pasture produced three times more omega-3s in their eggs than birds raised in cages on a commercial diet. They also found twice as much vitamin E and 40 percent more vitamin A in the yolks of the pastured birds." (Mother Earth News)
Last year, I personally contacted Lou Raffel, the chairman of the American Egg Board, and aksed what studies had been done to warrant the AEB statement. He didn't know of any, but said he would check. The USDA got involved. After a month of back and forth emails between me, him and Dr Richard Reynnels of the USDA, the AEB did change the statement to make it "less misleading" than before. However that lasted only a few months and the original false statement was recently put back up when their Web Site was revamped.
To sit on the Board of Directors of the American Egg Board, one must operate a facility of at least 75,000 chickens which means that the smaller range operators are not represented at all. The commercial operators see the small range operators as a threat, and therefore are willing to give faulty information to protect their industry from a consumer shift to better quality eggs.
BTW, Mr Rafeel can be emailed at LRaffel@aeb.org ------
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SafariVista
Thank you So much ((((Goey))))!
Reading this makes me want to SCREAM & CRY all at the same time.
This is what I'm talking about. I find it criminal how the natural way of doing things is being forced out of operation by big industry, who's chemically treated animal is not even close to being the same in quality. Animals there are being treated like machines, given hormones and chemicals to make them grow faster and bigger.
We watched thousands of male chicks being thrown live into a grinder, since they were no use to the egg farm :blink: Some places just throw them into plastic bags and let them suffocate...
There is even talk about cows being fed other cows, domestic animals, other farm and circus animals instead of grass... perhaps being mixed into their 'feed'...
And WHERE does that bacteria come from in packaged meats that cause us to become so ill when ingested?
Here is a link to an article about food poisoning: http://www.pcrm.org/magazine/GM02Winter/GM02Winter01.html This made me sick! Yuck!
People should be made aware of what they're buying, and what they're missing. Where is the freedom of choice?
Now where is it that Ron lives?
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Abigail
I would add - for those of you who are trying to lose weight or have simply changed your lifestyle in an attempt to be more healthy and have found that you aren't losing weight - you might want to have your thyroid levels checked.
I have been making healthier choices in what I eat for some time now. I had also been exercising regularly for quite a time (though I did take a month off). While I did feel much healthier the extra pounds I had hoped to lose never did come off.
Well I just got my lab results back from my physical and it turns out I have a thyroid problem. The doctor says the thyroid medication will probably lower my cholesterol levels, give me more energy, and help me to lose weight.
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Ron G.
I live in the Ozark mountains of northern Arkansas, which by most peoples standards, are somewhat backwards. It's not exactly paradise as the grocery stores only sell the same junk here that everyone else gets.
The old ways are dying off due to the younger people being suckered by contemporary media culture and the public school systems. The old timers are dwindling by attrition and not as many live to be in the 90 to 110 year old range any more due to the modern ways encroaching upon our culture.
More and more kids here, especially "townies", do what kids do everywhere and play video games and watch television in central heat or air instead of playing outdoors and working, hiking fishing etc. While leading somewhat sedentary lives, they eat and drink the chemical soups and substances that pass for "kid food" and just like their city counterparts, the parents are too sorry or too uninvolved to do anything about it and rely on psychotropic drugs to deal with the resulting chemical imbalances.
That's one of the very first things you learn as a scoutleader.
Fortunately, Andrew takes after me and enjoys the outdoors and would rather go out with his .22 and shoot a couple of squirrels and clean and cook them outside than play video games. We have a tripod set up over a fire ring out in the front yard where we cook a lot of our meals, especially in the spring, summer and fall months, but not so much in the winter...although you haven't lived until you've eaten a big bowl of deer chili cooked in an iron dutch oven over a fire in the woods in the snow...after spending the day killing, cleaning and cooking the deer.
I digress.
Not only are those free range eggs better and better for you, the meat of free range birds is infinitely better and much more flavorful, although quite a bit tougher. Not only is a free range chicken or turkey much better than store bought, it's much more nutritious and much more satisfying. Since the grocery store sells Tyson chicken leg quarters for 39 cents per pound, I buy them and hang them out by my chicken yard to lure predators while I wait with my shotgun...they're real good for that...and smoked racoon is delicious.
Anyway, this isn't exactly paradise, but after many years in Ft. Worth, Dallas, Houston, Florida, San Antonio and California, I wouldn't and couldn't live anywhere else.
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SafariVista
Ron that's amazing!
There are many people I know who's stomach would turn reading about your hunting & cooking practices. A shame for them. They don't want to know 'where' the food came from, and thinking beyond the package in the store is uncomfortable for them.
As to the 'screened games & indoor play', we've had the privilege to spend a couple of weeks in a Cabin in Northern Michigan walking distance to two lakes. No TV, No Video or electronic games were there. There were beds, small bathroom with tub/shower, small kitchen and LOTS of board and card games.
There was a row boat, fishing equipment, inner tubes and varied natural wonders outside.
Our family NEVER got along better. We all worked together, and kitchen prep had never been more fun. After the first day, the kids didn't even argue, they were working & playing together.
For me, after having children, the definition of 'Paradise' took on a whole new meaning :) Sounds to me you're awfully close
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Abigail
so much info here, wow.
Goey, slow down would ya - I'm still trying to get through all the info on cholesterol! lol lol
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Dot Matrix
They sell Maverick beef at Publix here, it has not antibiotics etc. I don't know if it is corn or grass fed, but it tastes better.
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SafariVista
Hey Dot!
Where is Publix? Sounds kinda funny ;)
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ChasUFarley
Ron -
Your post makes me think of the hunting and eating "policies" of a certain Motorcity Mad Man - Ted Nugent only eats meat that he's killed himself and is into exotic game meats, as well. I think it's the more honest way of eating - for those who can do it. I have no trouble with cooking game meat, but don't think I could kill unless I absolutely had to. For those who can hunt and enjoy it, I think it's the healthiest way to provide food for their family and also keeps certain animal populations at healthy levels.
In Maine there's a moose hunting lottery every year. You have to buy a ticket to enter and then only a certain number of licenses are issued by lottery - I think it's like 300 or 500 - something like that. However, there's always a certain group who are opposed to moose hunting at all - yet there are stories of gastly accidents with moose and vehicles (hitting a moose is about the deadliest thing that can happen to you in a car or SUV!) and moose getting into residential areas, etc. They don't see hunting as population control, but as cruel killing - any real hunter knows that it's best for the game and the meat to make a clean kill. And those Bullwinkle Burgers are mighty tastee! Ayah!
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Dot Matrix
S-
Publix is in Georgia, I do not know where you are. In CA check Albertsons maybe.
But Maverick meat was the best I can do here.
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