There is more to this article but I had to go out of town unexpectedly and now am swamped making up for lost time at work. Hopefully I'll get to it this week and then we can look at a summary/outline of what Boob and Dootie have taught us to see if TWI is actually practicing what they preach.
“Honey, you have the best decorating taste and these are beautiful. However, you did forget one thing. You are supposed to check with me, your financial adviser, before making a purchase to make sure I have placed the money in the budget for these things.
She responds by saying, “Yes, dearest honey man of god, did YOU forget one thing ? It's my inheritance we're living off of and i'll get any damn drapes i want."
She responds by saying, “Yes, dearest honey man of god, did YOU forget one thing ? It's my inheritance we're living off of and i'll get any damn drapes i want."
FINALLY! I’m able to get back to this. I think it’s important in light of how often people tell us to forgive TWI and the evil leadership. It’s important to see if TWI is operating and living the example they teach and hold their followers to.
Let’s recap:
First Bob says that it’s God’s desire and good pleasure for faithful disciples of the household of the one body to submit themselves to the word and to each other.
This long @$$ name for TWIts was a constant and, when one is a TWIt, it strokes the ego and swells the pride. Submit – another constant theme, but we really only submit to leadership and what leadership tells us the word says. I can’t recall any example of wc submitting to “Joe Believer”.)
Boob says that when loving respect for God and his word is lacking (i.e. p1ssing off leadership) in the life of a fellow believer in the household, confrontation is necessary.
(It’s never just a believer, but always a “believer in the household” or an even longer specification that the believer is in the one true household, functioning body, etc.)
Man is to be the head of the woman – the household dicktater (this has nothing to do with the article, but it’s an easy way to remind the women of this, so it’s the example used in the teaching)
The purpose of TWI is to present every man – every believer in the household – perfect, mature, complete in Christ.
Confrontation is a vital part of presenting every believer perfect in Christ. (I don’t see this in other churches and their “believers” seem to be much more peaceful and “perfect in Christ”.
The heart and manner of response of the one confronted is vital. The confronted individual/group should respond with earnest desire, mourning and fervent mind toward the leadership.
“Earnest desire” indicates the desire to have full-sharing fellowship with the leadership. Desiring to be with him physically and desire that their thoughts, speech and actions would show their association with him. (is this why Boob and the others mimic vee pee and craiggers so much, to the point of growing a goatee when craiggers did?)
“Mourning” indicates lamenting their errors and mistakes. There should be a genuine remorse and grief regarding those things they are confronted about.
“Fervent mind” from the Greek zelos. They should demonstrate a zeal, fervor and passion toward their leadership. (where is God in all this????)
Don’t hold on to hurt feelings, justifying their error and complaining about how they were confronted – the confronted should have a passion for the truth that the leaders speak. (Sorry, I just don’t see lauding these leaders over God in all this. BUT, I will say TWI did this very well and expected their followers to worship leadership like this)
I believe this is where we stopped, so this is where I’ll pick up the article.
When you blow the budget on new drapes... just get on your knees and ask hubby for forgiveness, and thank him for reproving you and keeping you strong in the household....
Then, ask him to get the step ladder to help you hang the new drapes your hauled home!
2 Cor 7:7 shows three elements necessary in the heart of the one confronted:
1) Longing to fully share with the leadership
2) Expressing genuine remorse for the error or mistake
3) Demonstrating zeal toward the leadership
All three were vital to bring comfort to Paul.
(I’m sorry. Why was the concern about Paul?? Again, I ask….Where the Eff is God in all this?? Where has TWI demonstrated these elements regarding all the wrong they’ve done??)
2 Cor 7:8-9
For though I made you sorry with a letter….I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance…
Verse 8 indicates Paul did not regret having confronted and reproved the Corinthians. Instead, he rejoiced that they grieved unto repentance. Repentance is a mental change of principle of motivation due to positive action. The Corinthians changed their minds.
Every action is preceeded by a thought. So repentance, changing of their minds, was a vital aspect of their sorrowing. They did not wallow but rather took action by changing their minds and purpose. As a result of their thinking, they also changed their speech and life-styles. This was evident by the fruit produced in their lives.
(Has TWI changed their minds? Have they changed their purpose? Have they changed their speech and lifestyles? I think not.)
2 Cor 7:9 – For ye were made sorry after a godly manner [according to God’s mind and will], that ye might receive damage in nothing.
Paul confronted the believers and reproved their inappropriate behavior, speech and thinking in the household so that the believers would suffer no loss or injury! Paul, as the minister of God, was a helper of their joy.
(This one paragraph above really gets my goat!! “In the household” – blech! So that they would not suffer loss or injury! THIS, MY FRIENDS, IS THE FEAR THAT SO MANY OF US LIVED WITH FOR SO LONG! LISTEN TO THESE SEEMINGLY INNOCUOUS STATEMENTS OFTEN ENOUGH AND YOU START TO BELIEVE IT. Paul was the local WC and HE SAVED THEIR LIVES by confronting them!! This is how/why we were taught to worship the ground Boob walked on. The ground all WC walked on. Vee pee and craiggers. They could do NO WRONG – We owed our lives to them!! They kept us alive, safe and secure! You don’t need God! You have TWI leadersh1t!!)
2 Cor 7:10 – For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of, but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
Verse 10 reinforces verse 9 by saying that godly sorrow will be evidenced by repentance, a change in behavior, to salvation or wholeness which endures. This is what Rev. Martinpuke has taught us: If we make up our minds to strengthen our lives where we have weakness, we can get so strong there, we need never have weakness in that area of our lives again.
(I’m curious, think someone who has been sober and involved with AA for ten years would agree with that? Why didn’t Boob and Dootie make up their minds to protect God’s kids from craiggers and the abuse they knew was going on? Why didn’t craiggers himself, Donna and the slimy fox make up their minds to get rid of their weakness?
What happened to leading by example?)
2 Cor 7:11 - ….ye sorrowed after a godly sort….what carefulness…what clearing of yourselves….indignation…fear…vehement desire….zeal….revenge! ….clear in this matter.
This verse shows the aggressive mindset of the Corinthians as they took believing action to restore themselves to alignment and harmony with God and HIS HOUSEHOLD. Looking at all these qualities listed above will help us recognize the characteristics and attitudes indicating that change is actually happening in a person’s life after he has been confronted.
“carefulness” is the Greek word “spoude” – diligence, emphasizing no delay or waste of time in putting forth effort in whatever one is doing in his service to the Lord.
(That’s a mouthfull of a definition. Is that really what spoude means or is this an exaggerated, euphemistic definition concocted by Bob to make his point?)
So, there should be an immediate, eager response by the confronted individual to the end that there is “serious purpose” to correct his error. This is not merely an outward, happy, enthusiastic response. When a person has godly sorry, he responds by finding the scripture that addresses his hneed. Then he speaks, thinks and acts according to the word of God with immediate diligence. The desired changes can take place right away. And even with behavior patterns that may take more time to establish, this immediate, eager response initiates the process. We should not have to strain to see this; it should be evident!
(Okay, so why didn’t Dottie do something when she found out about vee pee and craiggers raping women? Why didn’t she do something when it kept happening? There was no change or eager response from her, nor from the rapists. She was in a position to stop it and kept her mouth shut!
Why hasn’t TWI come out and expressed great sorry and immediate zeal to correct all the practical and doctrinal error that they used and allowed to ruin people’s lives? There should have been teachings all over the place about confronting leadership – about not covering for leadership – about being honest to your people – about caring for the flock ----- sooooo many areas TWI should have expressed true godly sorrow and WE SHOULD NOT HAVE TO STRAIN TO SEE THIS; BOB, IT SHOULD BE EVIDENT!!)
Why hasn’t TWI come out and expressed great sorry and immediate zeal to correct all the practical and doctrinal error that they used and allowed to ruin people’s lives? There should have been teachings all over the place about confronting leadership – about not covering for leadership – about being honest to your people – about caring for the flock ----- sooooo many areas TWI should have expressed true godly sorrow and WE SHOULD NOT HAVE TO STRAIN TO SEE THIS; BOB, IT SHOULD BE EVIDENT!!)[/i][/color]
“Clearing of yourselves” is from the Greek word apologia. This word is better translated “an answer of truth in the face of accusation and criticism.” In order for the confronted one to clear himself, he must proclaim what God wills to be spoken, the truth. This requires him to know the word and will of God as it applies to his situation and then to bodly speak and evidence that word in his life.
(?? ?? ?? Huh ?? ?? ?? Wouldn’t an answer of truth in the face of accusation and criticism mean that they admit the truth about what they were doing wrong? Billy, did you cut your little sister’s hair? I cannot tell a lie, Mother, I did not cut my sister’s hair. :D
So, someone who’s never read the Bible, but believes in God and is considered a Christian can’t possibly get back in “alignment and harmony” then? Can’t get forgiven? Is that what Bobby is saying?)
The believer should be able to re-establish himself in the heart of the Word and the fellowship of the household to the end that he can clearly identify the allure and methods of the adversary by which he was deceived. Further, he should then be able to honestly and openly share how he has applied the Word of God to manifest the deliverance of God and what he has done to maintain his deliverance.
(Where, again, is GOD in this? I’m to “manifest my own deliverance”?
By example, Bobby, how have you, Dottie and other TWI leadership shared the allure and methods of the adversary by which YOU were deceived into covering for craiggers, allowing women to be raped, people to commit suicide, and lives to be ruined? How have YOU manifested your deliverance? How about some examples from You, Dottie, Rosie, Donna, Ramona and the others?)
“Indignation” is from the Greek word aganaktesis, which Bullinger’s lexicon defines as “physical pain and irritation: hence, vexation, annoyance” A good translation of this word would be “annoyance with Satan’s devices”.
A form of this Greek word is used in Mark 10. JC was “much displeased” when his disciples rebuked the little children who wanted to touch him. He was annoyed with Satan’s devices that were having a deleterious effect on the will of God being carried out…
Likewise, the confronted believer should have an “attitude” about the adversary and his devices. Because of the congrontation process, he would not only have a healthy respect for the adversary’s devices, but also he would have an anger at the sin. Operation of the truths and principles taught in our DTA class would replace the voids and weaknesses that allowed the adversary to gain entrance into the believer’s life to the end that he determines never to be beaten in that area again.
(Where’s the example – the LIVING EXAMPLE for us?? TWI doesn’t have a single one, do they? Didn’t think so.)
...2) Expressing genuine remorse for the error or mistake...
Why hasn’t TWI come out and expressed great sorry and immediate zeal to correct all the practical and doctrinal error that they used and allowed to ruin people’s lives?
To express sorrow and remorse, one usually has acknowledge they did something wrong, and have to be sorry they did it.
I don't get the sense they believe they ever did anything wrong.
“Fear” is reverence for God. This comes from the believer’s love and appreciation for God and His power and willingness to forgive, heal and deliver.
“Vehement desire” is a longing for or an earnest desire. It is the same word used in 2 Cor 7:7. The yearning in the heart of the believer who has godly sorrow is to have sweet fellowship with God and the disciples in the household.
(Those who weren’t involved under craigger’s reign, take note how often “in the household” is used and how we kool-aide drinkers were constantly bombarded with the message that it’s not enough to be “a believer”, but we have to be “in the household” as well. This is part of what built the great fear of leaving TWI.)
“Zeal” refers to a fervent passion in your pursuit of what is good, right and truthful. In 1 Cor. 12:31, “covet earnestly” is a form of this word. When an individual decides to correct his error, one of the evidences of that decision is his earnest desire for spiritual matters and for the best gifts in operation in his life.
The believer with godly sorrow has a vehement passion for spiritual matters. He has been tricked by Satan, living contrary to the accuracy of the Word in an area. Rather than ascribing majesty and greatness to God, he was glorifying Satan in that category. In his zeal to properly represent God, the believer now earnestly desires spritual matters to prevail in his thinking, speech and life-style.
The Greek word for “revenge” is also translated “vengance” and “punishment” in the Bible. It refers to the execution of right and justice. In 2 Thess 1:8, the word refers to the vengeance that the Lord Jesus shall execute. In 1 Peter 2:14, the word “punishment” in the phrase “punishment of evildoers” is from the same word. This again is the execution of right regarding those who do evil.
The confronted believer will demonstrate godly sorrow by his desire to change to the end that this thoughts, speech and behavior will show vengeance against the adversary. In his response to reproof and correction , a believer does not attack the leadership, list excuses or blame someone else for his predicament. He takes immediate action to mete out punishment to the adversary.
These attributes delineated in 2 Cor 7:11 show us the godly sorrow of the Corinthian believers regarding the confrontation in 1 Cor. They had an eager response to correct their error. They proclaimed and showed the truth of God’s word as it applied to their confrontation. They demonstrated annoyance with the adversary and his devices. They had a love and appreciation for God and his power – his willingness to forgive. They had hearts that yearned to have sweet fellowship with God and the leadership in the household. They had a passionate desire for matters spiritual.
As we strive to present every believer mature, perfect and complete in Christ, we can know whether a believer who has been confronted is making progress and is properly responding to the confrontation. In the household, we submit to one another. These attributes will be a heartfelt response of the believer, indicating a loving respect for God, his word and for the household of the faithful.
Hi Belle!!! This got me to laughin' fer sure. It reminded me of the many responses I got when someone came to visit a corps brother and myself while we lived in a trailer in the way woods. Our little trailer was usually decorated with over-running ash trays and empty Bud bottles. However we did use Way Magazine covers for drapes.
And we did have a few pics of John Wayne, Waylon Jennings, Bob Wills and the Texas Playboys.
Perhaps all this confrontation could have been avoided by just having a nice set of RED Drapes!
Littlehawk...yer friendly tour guide to tha bourbin region of tha Bluegrass!
Watered Garden, thanks for the kind words. Funny how odd and strange the language sounds now that we aren’t immersed in it and have the blinders off, isn’t it? Now I can hardly read their stuff without wincing.
Chas – I think now it’s so obvious the manipulation techniques they use to keep people in line. I just wish I had picked up on them earlier. It must have been so painful for our families and loved ones to watch us succumb to their ploys.
The Corinthian believers were not purposefully avoiding Paul and his leadership, oversight and direction. On the contrary, they were greatly longing to be with him physically and desired that their thinking, speech and actions would show their association with him.
In other words – TWI between the lines translation – You should be worshipping your leadership like the Corinthians worshipped Paul. Paul could do no wrong in their eyes and that’s the standard you are expected to follow. We are never wrong – if there’s a problem, it’s with you – Joe Believer!
Bramble – That house is run like a business. You wouldn’t believe the things Dottie does for Boob. When they are moving (which is almost every year), Dottie gets everything for the kitchen packed up but, because Boob refuses to eat on paper plates and with plastic utensils, she has to keep out a dinner plate and a serving of silverware for Boob to eat with. The rest of the house will be eating on paper plates, but Boob, sitting at the head of the table like king of the land, eats with his china and silver.
socks
QUOTE: The Corinthian believers were not purposefully avoiding Paul and his leadership, oversight and direction.
Maybe that's because Paul and Titus weren't greedy, money grubbing blood-sucking tics, looking to make them sell their homes and use the money to support "their ministries".
Maybe there weren't afraid of them.
Just a thought.
ROFLMAO!! Too true!
TempleLady –
Home you went and you cobbled together whatever you could remember on said subject, threw in some fancy grammatical footwork and then got on the the Math homework.
You know, you may be onto something but despite the elementary style and content, they spend months upon months writing, editing and – gag – perfecting these articles.
Kevlar
To express sorrow and remorse, one usually has acknowledge they did something wrong, and have to be sorry they did it.
I don't get the sense they believe they ever did anything wrong.
I’m afraid you’re correct about that. Despite Dottie admitting to knowing about all the rapes and despite TWI having to settle out of court to avoid losing their @$$ and despite all the witnesses who have come forward on the web and despite all the documentation from their own letterhead and despite being completely exposed – Not one leader in TWI has ever admitted to doing anything wrong.
The emporer indeed has no clothes and thinks he’s fooling everyone.
Littlehawk – I’d have been hanging out at your trailer fer shur! I would have preferred the John Wayne, Willie & Waylon posters to the Way Rags for drapes, though. :D
Boob wouldn't eat on paper plates, nor would he use plastic silverware... That's the attitude that drew me to the greatness of the misery, err, ministry. I love the "I am SO much better that YOU" attitude. Pompous effin idiot, get off the high horse.
How could anyone listen to anything this "man" says?? What a waste of his father's seed...
His parents must be so proud! I wonder how many people they have kissing their feet in the UK. Have they actually been out witnessing? Have they got a class together? What happens when there are no kids to sign up for the class and they have to - gasp - find fresh blood?
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Belle
LOL! Y'all crack me up!
There is more to this article but I had to go out of town unexpectedly and now am swamped making up for lost time at work. Hopefully I'll get to it this week and then we can look at a summary/outline of what Boob and Dootie have taught us to see if TWI is actually practicing what they preach.
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themex
:) Happy New Year Belle! :wub:
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excathedra
“Honey, you have the best decorating taste and these are beautiful. However, you did forget one thing. You are supposed to check with me, your financial adviser, before making a purchase to make sure I have placed the money in the budget for these things.
She responds by saying, “Yes, dearest honey man of god, did YOU forget one thing ? It's my inheritance we're living off of and i'll get any damn drapes i want."
See how we come to such a peaceful resolution.
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Belle
ROFLMAO!!!! excie, that was priceless!!!
Happy New Year to you, too, Them
ex!
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Bramble
Heehee Ex!
Ahh, an inheritance? That explains so much, like why they didn't ahve the budget Book of Inspectable Spending!
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dmiller
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DogLover
Loved it, excathedra ... and how true!
Lover of Dogs AND nice drapes
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Gillian Rules
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA I THOUGHT THAT BUT THEN I REALLY BEGAN TO THINK THERE WAS A DOOTY. HAHAHAHAHA
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dmiller
Hey there DogLover --- Welcome to Greasespot!
Make your self at home.
And if you find any wayGB in here,
tell that fella in your avatar,
he is free to lift his leg on them
anytime he wants to!
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Belle
FINALLY! I’m able to get back to this. I think it’s important in light of how often people tell us to forgive TWI and the evil leadership. It’s important to see if TWI is operating and living the example they teach and hold their followers to.
Let’s recap:
First Bob says that it’s God’s desire and good pleasure for faithful disciples of the household of the one body to submit themselves to the word and to each other.
This long @$$ name for TWIts was a constant and, when one is a TWIt, it strokes the ego and swells the pride. Submit – another constant theme, but we really only submit to leadership and what leadership tells us the word says. I can’t recall any example of wc submitting to “Joe Believer”.)
Boob says that when loving respect for God and his word is lacking (i.e. p1ssing off leadership) in the life of a fellow believer in the household, confrontation is necessary.
(It’s never just a believer, but always a “believer in the household” or an even longer specification that the believer is in the one true household, functioning body, etc.)
Man is to be the head of the woman – the household dicktater (this has nothing to do with the article, but it’s an easy way to remind the women of this, so it’s the example used in the teaching)
The purpose of TWI is to present every man – every believer in the household – perfect, mature, complete in Christ.
Confrontation is a vital part of presenting every believer perfect in Christ. (I don’t see this in other churches and their “believers” seem to be much more peaceful and “perfect in Christ”.
The heart and manner of response of the one confronted is vital. The confronted individual/group should respond with earnest desire, mourning and fervent mind toward the leadership.
“Earnest desire” indicates the desire to have full-sharing fellowship with the leadership. Desiring to be with him physically and desire that their thoughts, speech and actions would show their association with him. (is this why Boob and the others mimic vee pee and craiggers so much, to the point of growing a goatee when craiggers did?)
“Mourning” indicates lamenting their errors and mistakes. There should be a genuine remorse and grief regarding those things they are confronted about.
“Fervent mind” from the Greek zelos. They should demonstrate a zeal, fervor and passion toward their leadership. (where is God in all this????)
Don’t hold on to hurt feelings, justifying their error and complaining about how they were confronted – the confronted should have a passion for the truth that the leaders speak. (Sorry, I just don’t see lauding these leaders over God in all this. BUT, I will say TWI did this very well and expected their followers to worship leadership like this)
I believe this is where we stopped, so this is where I’ll pick up the article.
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ChasUFarley
So, women...
When you blow the budget on new drapes... just get on your knees and ask hubby for forgiveness, and thank him for reproving you and keeping you strong in the household....
Then, ask him to get the step ladder to help you hang the new drapes your hauled home!
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Belle
2 Cor 7:7 shows three elements necessary in the heart of the one confronted:
1) Longing to fully share with the leadership
2) Expressing genuine remorse for the error or mistake
3) Demonstrating zeal toward the leadership
All three were vital to bring comfort to Paul.
(I’m sorry. Why was the concern about Paul?? Again, I ask….Where the Eff is God in all this?? Where has TWI demonstrated these elements regarding all the wrong they’ve done??)
2 Cor 7:8-9
For though I made you sorry with a letter….I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance…
Verse 8 indicates Paul did not regret having confronted and reproved the Corinthians. Instead, he rejoiced that they grieved unto repentance. Repentance is a mental change of principle of motivation due to positive action. The Corinthians changed their minds.
Every action is preceeded by a thought. So repentance, changing of their minds, was a vital aspect of their sorrowing. They did not wallow but rather took action by changing their minds and purpose. As a result of their thinking, they also changed their speech and life-styles. This was evident by the fruit produced in their lives.
(Has TWI changed their minds? Have they changed their purpose? Have they changed their speech and lifestyles? I think not.)
2 Cor 7:9 – For ye were made sorry after a godly manner [according to God’s mind and will], that ye might receive damage in nothing.
Paul confronted the believers and reproved their inappropriate behavior, speech and thinking in the household so that the believers would suffer no loss or injury! Paul, as the minister of God, was a helper of their joy.
(This one paragraph above really gets my goat!! “In the household” – blech! So that they would not suffer loss or injury! THIS, MY FRIENDS, IS THE FEAR THAT SO MANY OF US LIVED WITH FOR SO LONG! LISTEN TO THESE SEEMINGLY INNOCUOUS STATEMENTS OFTEN ENOUGH AND YOU START TO BELIEVE IT. Paul was the local WC and HE SAVED THEIR LIVES by confronting them!! This is how/why we were taught to worship the ground Boob walked on. The ground all WC walked on. Vee pee and craiggers. They could do NO WRONG – We owed our lives to them!! They kept us alive, safe and secure! You don’t need God! You have TWI leadersh1t!!)
2 Cor 7:10 – For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of, but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
Verse 10 reinforces verse 9 by saying that godly sorrow will be evidenced by repentance, a change in behavior, to salvation or wholeness which endures. This is what Rev. Martinpuke has taught us: If we make up our minds to strengthen our lives where we have weakness, we can get so strong there, we need never have weakness in that area of our lives again.
(I’m curious, think someone who has been sober and involved with AA for ten years would agree with that? Why didn’t Boob and Dootie make up their minds to protect God’s kids from craiggers and the abuse they knew was going on? Why didn’t craiggers himself, Donna and the slimy fox make up their minds to get rid of their weakness?
What happened to leading by example?)
2 Cor 7:11 - ….ye sorrowed after a godly sort….what carefulness…what clearing of yourselves….indignation…fear…vehement desire….zeal….revenge! ….clear in this matter.
This verse shows the aggressive mindset of the Corinthians as they took believing action to restore themselves to alignment and harmony with God and HIS HOUSEHOLD. Looking at all these qualities listed above will help us recognize the characteristics and attitudes indicating that change is actually happening in a person’s life after he has been confronted.
“carefulness” is the Greek word “spoude” – diligence, emphasizing no delay or waste of time in putting forth effort in whatever one is doing in his service to the Lord.
(That’s a mouthfull of a definition. Is that really what spoude means or is this an exaggerated, euphemistic definition concocted by Bob to make his point?)
So, there should be an immediate, eager response by the confronted individual to the end that there is “serious purpose” to correct his error. This is not merely an outward, happy, enthusiastic response. When a person has godly sorry, he responds by finding the scripture that addresses his hneed. Then he speaks, thinks and acts according to the word of God with immediate diligence. The desired changes can take place right away. And even with behavior patterns that may take more time to establish, this immediate, eager response initiates the process. We should not have to strain to see this; it should be evident!
(Okay, so why didn’t Dottie do something when she found out about vee pee and craiggers raping women? Why didn’t she do something when it kept happening? There was no change or eager response from her, nor from the rapists. She was in a position to stop it and kept her mouth shut!
Why hasn’t TWI come out and expressed great sorry and immediate zeal to correct all the practical and doctrinal error that they used and allowed to ruin people’s lives? There should have been teachings all over the place about confronting leadership – about not covering for leadership – about being honest to your people – about caring for the flock ----- sooooo many areas TWI should have expressed true godly sorrow and WE SHOULD NOT HAVE TO STRAIN TO SEE THIS; BOB, IT SHOULD BE EVIDENT!!)
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skyrider
Why????
Because.............twi is eeeeevviiillll.
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Belle
“Clearing of yourselves” is from the Greek word apologia. This word is better translated “an answer of truth in the face of accusation and criticism.” In order for the confronted one to clear himself, he must proclaim what God wills to be spoken, the truth. This requires him to know the word and will of God as it applies to his situation and then to bodly speak and evidence that word in his life.
(?? ?? ?? Huh ?? ?? ?? Wouldn’t an answer of truth in the face of accusation and criticism mean that they admit the truth about what they were doing wrong? Billy, did you cut your little sister’s hair? I cannot tell a lie, Mother, I did not cut my sister’s hair. :D
So, someone who’s never read the Bible, but believes in God and is considered a Christian can’t possibly get back in “alignment and harmony” then? Can’t get forgiven? Is that what Bobby is saying?)
The believer should be able to re-establish himself in the heart of the Word and the fellowship of the household to the end that he can clearly identify the allure and methods of the adversary by which he was deceived. Further, he should then be able to honestly and openly share how he has applied the Word of God to manifest the deliverance of God and what he has done to maintain his deliverance.
(Where, again, is GOD in this? I’m to “manifest my own deliverance”?
By example, Bobby, how have you, Dottie and other TWI leadership shared the allure and methods of the adversary by which YOU were deceived into covering for craiggers, allowing women to be raped, people to commit suicide, and lives to be ruined? How have YOU manifested your deliverance? How about some examples from You, Dottie, Rosie, Donna, Ramona and the others?)
“Indignation” is from the Greek word aganaktesis, which Bullinger’s lexicon defines as “physical pain and irritation: hence, vexation, annoyance” A good translation of this word would be “annoyance with Satan’s devices”.
A form of this Greek word is used in Mark 10. JC was “much displeased” when his disciples rebuked the little children who wanted to touch him. He was annoyed with Satan’s devices that were having a deleterious effect on the will of God being carried out…
Likewise, the confronted believer should have an “attitude” about the adversary and his devices. Because of the congrontation process, he would not only have a healthy respect for the adversary’s devices, but also he would have an anger at the sin. Operation of the truths and principles taught in our DTA class would replace the voids and weaknesses that allowed the adversary to gain entrance into the believer’s life to the end that he determines never to be beaten in that area again.
(Where’s the example – the LIVING EXAMPLE for us?? TWI doesn’t have a single one, do they? Didn’t think so.)
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Kevlar2000
To express sorrow and remorse, one usually has acknowledge they did something wrong, and have to be sorry they did it.
I don't get the sense they believe they ever did anything wrong.
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Belle
“Fear” is reverence for God. This comes from the believer’s love and appreciation for God and His power and willingness to forgive, heal and deliver.
“Vehement desire” is a longing for or an earnest desire. It is the same word used in 2 Cor 7:7. The yearning in the heart of the believer who has godly sorrow is to have sweet fellowship with God and the disciples in the household.
(Those who weren’t involved under craigger’s reign, take note how often “in the household” is used and how we kool-aide drinkers were constantly bombarded with the message that it’s not enough to be “a believer”, but we have to be “in the household” as well. This is part of what built the great fear of leaving TWI.)
“Zeal” refers to a fervent passion in your pursuit of what is good, right and truthful. In 1 Cor. 12:31, “covet earnestly” is a form of this word. When an individual decides to correct his error, one of the evidences of that decision is his earnest desire for spiritual matters and for the best gifts in operation in his life.
The believer with godly sorrow has a vehement passion for spiritual matters. He has been tricked by Satan, living contrary to the accuracy of the Word in an area. Rather than ascribing majesty and greatness to God, he was glorifying Satan in that category. In his zeal to properly represent God, the believer now earnestly desires spritual matters to prevail in his thinking, speech and life-style.
The Greek word for “revenge” is also translated “vengance” and “punishment” in the Bible. It refers to the execution of right and justice. In 2 Thess 1:8, the word refers to the vengeance that the Lord Jesus shall execute. In 1 Peter 2:14, the word “punishment” in the phrase “punishment of evildoers” is from the same word. This again is the execution of right regarding those who do evil.
The confronted believer will demonstrate godly sorrow by his desire to change to the end that this thoughts, speech and behavior will show vengeance against the adversary. In his response to reproof and correction , a believer does not attack the leadership, list excuses or blame someone else for his predicament. He takes immediate action to mete out punishment to the adversary.
These attributes delineated in 2 Cor 7:11 show us the godly sorrow of the Corinthian believers regarding the confrontation in 1 Cor. They had an eager response to correct their error. They proclaimed and showed the truth of God’s word as it applied to their confrontation. They demonstrated annoyance with the adversary and his devices. They had a love and appreciation for God and his power – his willingness to forgive. They had hearts that yearned to have sweet fellowship with God and the leadership in the household. They had a passionate desire for matters spiritual.
As we strive to present every believer mature, perfect and complete in Christ, we can know whether a believer who has been confronted is making progress and is properly responding to the confrontation. In the household, we submit to one another. These attributes will be a heartfelt response of the believer, indicating a loving respect for God, his word and for the household of the faithful.
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Littlehawk
And we did have a few pics of John Wayne, Waylon Jennings, Bob Wills and the Texas Playboys.
Perhaps all this confrontation could have been avoided by just having a nice set of RED Drapes!
Littlehawk...yer friendly tour guide to tha bourbin region of tha Bluegrass!
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Belle
Watered Garden, thanks for the kind words. Funny how odd and strange the language sounds now that we aren’t immersed in it and have the blinders off, isn’t it? Now I can hardly read their stuff without wincing.
Chas – I think now it’s so obvious the manipulation techniques they use to keep people in line. I just wish I had picked up on them earlier. It must have been so painful for our families and loved ones to watch us succumb to their ploys.
In other words – TWI between the lines translation – You should be worshipping your leadership like the Corinthians worshipped Paul. Paul could do no wrong in their eyes and that’s the standard you are expected to follow. We are never wrong – if there’s a problem, it’s with you – Joe Believer!Bramble – That house is run like a business. You wouldn’t believe the things Dottie does for Boob. When they are moving (which is almost every year), Dottie gets everything for the kitchen packed up but, because Boob refuses to eat on paper plates and with plastic utensils, she has to keep out a dinner plate and a serving of silverware for Boob to eat with. The rest of the house will be eating on paper plates, but Boob, sitting at the head of the table like king of the land, eats with his china and silver.
socks
ROFLMAO!! Too true!
TempleLady –
You know, you may be onto something but despite the elementary style and content, they spend months upon months writing, editing and – gag – perfecting these articles.Kevlar
I’m afraid you’re correct about that. Despite Dottie admitting to knowing about all the rapes and despite TWI having to settle out of court to avoid losing their @$$ and despite all the witnesses who have come forward on the web and despite all the documentation from their own letterhead and despite being completely exposed – Not one leader in TWI has ever admitted to doing anything wrong.
The emporer indeed has no clothes and thinks he’s fooling everyone.
Littlehawk – I’d have been hanging out at your trailer fer shur! I would have preferred the John Wayne, Willie & Waylon posters to the Way Rags for drapes, though. :D
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ChasUFarley
They should rename themselves Teflon Way International - nothing ever sticks to them!
(And what rubs off is harmful!)
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tomtuttle1
Boob wouldn't eat on paper plates, nor would he use plastic silverware... That's the attitude that drew me to the greatness of the misery, err, ministry. I love the "I am SO much better that YOU" attitude. Pompous effin idiot, get off the high horse.
How could anyone listen to anything this "man" says?? What a waste of his father's seed...
Gee, I feel better now, thanks!!
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Belle
:blink:
His parents must be so proud! I wonder how many people they have kissing their feet in the UK. Have they actually been out witnessing? Have they got a class together? What happens when there are no kids to sign up for the class and they have to - gasp - find fresh blood?
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