Chris continues: (It appears he is reading from a transcript of the statement he made to whoever he had gathered together at the beginning of the meetings-he is reading or relaying what he said to the group gathered here.)
"I take full personal responsibility for not having foreseen the possibility that the knowledge would affect Rev. Martindale emotionally as it appears to have done. However, to forestall the Adversary using it against us, I came, knowing what we were facing. Craig had already decided to partially share at that Corps night the material that was in the manuscript of the Passing of the Patriarch and I did not feel that running the risk of added confusion would have been of any benefit. I've been through the manuscript, numerous times, and had there been anything that could have been deleted or should have been added, I have worked and worked and worked, and I didn't fell that a partial sharing would have been a benefit to the body. I had to choose what in the situation appeared to be the best decision to forestall other and far more massive problems of hurt that were almost surely guaranteed. Since that time I have seen that the dissemination of the information was even greater than I had known at the time. I would submit to you that it was the lessor of the evils that I was presented with. It was not God's primary will in the situation, but the further we go the more perhaps you will see that we have been operating often in the third or fourth will of God, and at times well outside of His will. With the bounds of what was done to hem in the truth of God, it was the best possible choice that I could see at the time."
"I need also explain to you that I literally left the funeral for my grandfather, went directly to the airport, was picked up on Athletes, brought back here-I was scheduled to leave that night directly following so I could go back to the family, however my father, who was to have picked me up was emotionally exhausted from the day and when I called in to arrange for the pickup at the airport, he was asleep and could not be awakened-that's why I postponed it until very early the next morning-but I had very pressing family obligations that I was required to attend to."
"For the content, there is no apology except that I know that it must have stung-or worse. Of course you all that know Dr. Weirwille would know that this-excuse me-you would know of course that this was never my intent and those of you that know Dr. Weirwille must have recognized that what I put in the Passing of the Patriarch is an edited version of his comments. In fact, I read it in just slightly over two and half hours and we talked for 36 to 40 hours. For the delivery, I offer my most loving and sincere apology and accept full personal responsibilty. I believe that before we are done in the next few days, you will better understand the situations I was faced with, and if not, at least find it in your heart to overlook any wrongs that I may have been responsible for and look past my weakness and see the love of God that I have in my heart and the great desire I have to see His Word live and flourish."
"That is where we started our meetings. Then during the meetings, I explained among the household of our fellowship right here, the men and Donna that are seated on this stage, why each of the people that is here, is here. I think quite obviously this table speaks for itself (apparently indicated the BOT and Donna). And the reason that Ricardo Caberillo was brought in from Argentina and John Townsend was brought in from Kansas were things that Dr. Wierwille through the years had indicated to me that if it ever became possible to begin to put right certain things in the ministry that he recommended these two gentlemen be included. Art (Art Poling, I presume) is at my invitation because of the greatness of his heart, and because Father said put him there, so I didn't argue. Ralph was invited because he is one of the two, three people that ever asked me why did Dr. Wierwille come see you and what did he say, because of things Dr. Wierwille told my about him, and, the phrase that Father put in my mind was, a witness, and I thought myself the witness of seeing what would occur. However, he's also a born witness because it turns out although he never said it and in fact denied it, that Dr. Weirwille did cover a number of the salient facts that in the Passing of the Patriarch with Ralph. In addition, he told Ralph, before he left Boston for Scotland, that he was going to Scotland, basically, to leave his last will and testament for the ministry, which I didn't know until Ralph shared it partway through the meeting-so. And then Earl Burton, because of what he has been and what he's gonna be."
"And I also need to explain to you the exclusion of the First lady of the Way International, Mrs. Weirwille. It was at a request of Dr. Weirwille's that that occured. He requested that, if we ever begin to bring the things he mentioned to me to light, that as much as possible, I protect her heart. That is one of the heavist things that was on my heart last Wednesday night was that I had been forced into a corner that had threatened that request of Dr. Weirwille to me, and if any harm has come from that, I apologize, Mrs. Weirwille, and God'll have to take it out of my hide."
"Then we spent the rest of the day reading the manuscript because many of the men had heard it once, never read it. and there's no sense it starting on something without having a firm foundation. Then after we read it we decided that was enough for the day and we quit. (laughs). Then, yesterday morning, we got together and began a process that for want of a better term I have called a damage accessment. It is not a biblical term-I don't know a biblical term to apply to it-it is just something that I understood. When you go to a doctor he has to know what's wrong before he can understand how to start putting things right. The same would be true with a mechanic, or in many other fields. I-I am not saying that is the best termonolgy, its just happens to be the only one I could place on the process that's necessary. If you can understand what that means, then we're well are our way to understand what it was I endeavored to start with. And honestly, in looking at what's happened, it is either the first or second great loss we must look at. In some senses, perhaps, the first great loss was the falling asleep of our wonderful Father in the Word. However, the only possible point of contention for the great loss that we considered as a group and which I want to consider tonight with you as the household of God called to be here-is the only possible point of contention would be the loss of our Father in the Word, Dr. Weirwille-his presence, his knowledge of God's rightly divided word and his spirtual perception are very sorely missed and especially so at this crucial hour. However, the rectifiable loss that we need to look at is the erosion of God's Word from this ministry, the pattern of non-adherence to the written Word of God that has developed."
"Rev. Townsend got from Dr. Weirwille and has taught us for years "The Road Down". Some of you that have had the class on the Way tree or have been at various meetings may be familiar with the road down procedure that Rev. Townsend has taught us. It begins with division and ends on focusing on personality traits, etc, etc. There can be, as Dr Weirwille has so wonderfully taught us for years, no two opinions regarding truth. Truth is truth. The only possibilty of two opinions is either believing, or unbelief, but truth is truth."
(Chris then reads from Bullinger and Weirwille's writings concerning Acts 19, and the forces that caused Paul to first spread the Word throught Asia, but then having it stripped away by having the pure word replaced by other beliefs. This took about four minutes: I won't repeat it vebatim but the source is Bullingers Church Epistle's, Introduction, discussing Acts 19:10 and II Timothy 1:15, 2:18, 3:8, 4:4. Then Chap 10, God's Magnified Word -the loss of the mystery.) The section ends with "The first truths to be lost is usually the last to be regained, so it needs to be recovered and taught to people who love God and want to understand the doctrine's of his inspired Word."
NOTE: Remember, please, I am only as a matter of interest offering this transcript for clarification of what went on-I'm not making judgements on the accuracy of the information, only the accuracy of the actual content from the recording.
Chris continues:
"Both Bullinger and Dr. Weirwille in working the scriptures and teaching them pointed out to us that turning from Paul was preceeded by turning from truth. (Reads II Corth 11:3.) Our loss of the centrality and authority of God's Word, which of necessity preceeded the turning from our Father in the Word, had to have followed the same steps that Dr. Weirwille taught us in the foundational class regarding Eve and the serpent. I would like to point out to you in reading this verse some significant points: he will go to any length to accomplish what God's Word is pointing out."
"
Anybody want me to continue? Chris starts teaching from this point but he does have some more interesting points to make.
Transcripts are a good thing. May not please everybody. May not be based on facts...except the fact that the information presented WAS presented! Thanks for this!!!
As for the date, I only know that CG read POP to the corps on Wed April 23, 1986. Could that be the "last Wednesday" he referred to? I'm told that CG intended for maybe 10 people max to read/hear the contents of it, but LCM allegedly blabbed it to enough people that many knew about it in a short time. I was on the field and didn't hear about it till a month or so after the '86 ROA.
I'm told that CG intended for maybe 10 people max to read/hear the contents of it, but LCM allegedly blabbed it to enough people that many knew about it in a short time.
johniam, yeah........I remember hearing the same thing.
But, ya know..........for reasons, I never could buy into this explanation. It just seemed to me that.......either, 1) cgeer was very sloppy and vague in delivering this so-called "last will and testament" having had over a year to process the information and all........OR......2) cgeer KNEW that this stuff would set off a chain reaction and he could slide behind the curtain only to re-emerge as "the man who was given the revelation to save twi AND HELP SALVAGE MARTINDALE'S BLUNDERS."
Didn't buy that "intended rap of cgeer" in 1988.......and I don't buy that explanation today.
Cgeer was far too cunning to NOT FORESEE this martindale eruption.
""I would like to point out to you in re-reading this verse some significant points. 'I fear less by any means' which shows that he (the serpent) will try any means, he will go to any lengths to accomplish what God's word is pointing out to us here, 'as the serpent beguilled Eve'. The word beguilled may also be translated into the word seduced, and I think perhaps because of the education we've had from televison and movies the word "seduced' may produce better mind pictures for us in this case. We've read that, and yet we've treated it as though it was rape, and not seduction. We've thought, boom, he just hits you over the head and that's the end of you. That may be the case, your place or mine, mine, that's the end of the seduction. With a willing victim, it takes very little seduction, does it? The less willing the victim, the greater the seduction that would have to be produced. 'And it was done through subtlety, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ'. If you remember the steps that Dr. Weirwille has taught us, the first is that the serpent questioned the integrity of God's word. Remember? Now Eve had a perfect bloodstream, perfect fellowship, and a wonderful renewed mind, she didn't have to work her way back to wholeness, she started with it, and yet she responded by considering. Now, we have so many alternative viewpoints in our world, that often times we have to respond by considering and holding everything in against the truth of the word of God. But her subsequent actions are what brought the clamity on her. She was already wrong in her situation by the time she responding by considering. In her life there were no alternatives until she was directly presented with one. She omitted a word, she added a word, she changed a word, what you and I today would call mishandling the word of God. Wrongly dividing the scriptures. And after all that you have a 180 degree change, a lie versus the truth. It was a seduction, like the seduction that happened in our ministry. (Reads I Corth 3:1-11).
"In all of this, since we started, the only man who has said to me initially after reading the manuscript that he would get back and stand on the Word was Howard. Every time I hear somebody say that they are standing with Craig-now I am not speaking in the context of lovingly supporting-but in the context of choosing sides, I know they that they are carnal in their thinking. Romans 8:6-7. You what enmity means-oil and water-no matter how much you shake it they are going to separate. What is the law of God? The word of God. The written word of God. Verse 8. We are not hear to deal with Quote-who are you going to stand with-end of qoute, but Quote-are you going to stand on God's rightly divided word-end quote." I told these gentlemen, we use to hear but we heard it last night so I can't say that to you I just have to say you heard it even last night, Dr Weirwille saying that we needed to the palce of saying we needed to stand if the whole ministry goes down the tubes."
"The result of division would be more than one opinion: division, more than one opinion of scriptures, which outwardly manifests itself in the rejection of Dr. Weirwille, his teaching, and his counsel, and finally focusing on his personality, which was his carnality, his flesh, which every man has, rather than focusing on his spirtuality which few men throughout all the ages have ever approached. And part of the result has been a loss of spirtuality and a re-emergence of carnal thinking that has permeated every level of our ministry: and I would say that it is rampant at headquarters. I haven't been on the other campuses: I am not an authority to speak on that, but I know that the vast majority of you were picking sides and being carnal. That puts you in a position of being at enmity with God, something that perhaps you will rectify shortly."
Note from transcriber: I could say something here, but I'm not-I figure you guys will say it for me.
Onward:
"Until this is rectified, healed, and new habit patterns of believing, trust and obedience to God and his written revealed word which is still his will are re-established-and may I say established with reliable consistency-then 'revelation' will continue to be counterfeit. Dr. Weirwille taught us that if you are not in fellowship with God your senses' mind will keep flipping up thoughts, remember that phrase? Well, if you've been thinking carnally, in other words if you have fallen into patterns which I have just outlined for you, then that would be the only possible result. Reliance must be constantly placed or in fact replaced on the written word of God, and all actions, reactions, decisions, and thoughts must evaluated and all subsequent actions enacted in light of holy scripture, God's written revealed truth, His word. And that's where we began our day yesterday, and we worked that word together."
"Obviously I dealt with other things that I'm not covering with you. I don't think it would be of profit to you. (I assume he was addressing this comment to the 16th corp(?)or staff who was in the audience), partly because what I did is go back and chronological pick up decisions that were made and document from scriptures how they could have been handled closer to the word of God (thumps his bible.) And since you weren't in on the decisions all I would do is confuse you. But that's what the issue, the basic issue that we are dealing with is not who do you stand with, but do you stand on the rightly divided, revealed word of God? Are you going to use it as your only rule of faith and practice? In your life is the word of God going to return to being the will of God? Until the situation of carnality is cured, there seems little hope for having a powerful ministry, does there?"
"Then, this morning, I shared a number of things. This morning we watched well over three hours of the Advanced class and listened to a tape from Dr. Weirwille: we just spent the morning in the Word of God. Then the afternoon we played-with you. But I shared that it was not the plan to effect the removal of one or more of the trustees, which is not God's primary will. The actions that I have taken have been to safeguard the knowledge of God's word, and the knowledge of the mystery, and that I can assure you is of greater importance than my life, and though I would hesitate to speak for you, I trust that you would see it greater than yours as well. Those of you who heard the reading of the Passing of the Patriarch will agree that Dr. Weirwille agreed with and lived up to that statement that I have just made. The continuance of the knowledge of God's word is his primary will in this situation."
"As regards our brother Don: Yes, he has weaknesses and yes he had not put on the word of God to the end he walked as a spirtual man, but look at David and Saul. David did not put a hand against Saul-repeatly in the old testament we know that one does not lift a hand against a man who has been called of God. And I believe that among the household that I'm addressing now-I cannot speak for those who will listen to the tapes at the other campuses and so on, though those that I have seen on the field in the interim period between having read it and being here with you, particularily in the Uniited States, the vast majority of you have fallen into the category of carnality that we have covered from God's word tonight. You have been seduced from the simplicity that is in Christ. By the admonition of scripture, you would have of necessity be excluded from restoring in the situatuion that we have been faced with. Galatians Chapter 6:1. So anybody who has had thoughts of division, of envy, of strife or any of the other things that the scriptures have indicated to us, as carnality, are automatically excluded. Verse 2. I believe that the nine other people who I share the stage with this evening would assure you as readily as I would that the fellowship of the ten of us has been filled with love and tenderness and with a pervading atmosphere of peace. We are attempting to bear one another's burdens, and so not to walk away from the law of Christ but fulfill it."
"(Reads Verse 3). What have you that you haven't received form God? Yes, we have nine manifestations that was given to us. Yes, it is a ministry of grace, because God gave us the grace. What have we that we haven't received freely by the loving hand of our heavenly Father? The same thing we had before we took the class and came to a knowledge of the Word. Not much. (Reads verse 4 and 5.) So any of you who have harbored thoughts of division, of strife, of envy, of anything but the most holiest of love, prayer and believing, obviously do not fall into the category of being able to help restore."
"Now, I have not shared what I am going to share with you-this is something new. If Hdq'ts is going to eminate the love, the healing, and the power that's necessary to move this ministry, you will need to change from being carnal to being spirtual, putting God's word back at the level that it should have been held at from which you have been seduced. Regain those things that have been lost, otherwise, brethern, you will be part of the problem and not a part of the solution. You will be those who need restoring and not those who restore. We are restoring this evening using the word of God. Take heed to the scriptures: place the word of God as the will of God in your life. Refute the seduction from the simplicity that is in Christ and return your mind to a state of not being at enmity with God, but to a state of peace with God."
"It was not nor is it the primary will of God to remove any member of the Board of Trustees of the Way International. If you have harbored this thought, then I would recommend that we read Ephesians Chapter 4. (Reads Verse 3). Now, I wanted to give you a literal of 'endeavouring' but I can do it better in French than I can in English. It means "Bust your stupid dar-e-air." You understand that? The engish isn't quite as polite. To keep the unity of the spirit and the bond of peace. Any of you have harbored thoughts of division have not yet reached that level. We always need to realize that the Word of God is the will of God, that it means what it says, it says what it means. If God had not meant this to be that, he wouldn't have written the book. "Endeavouring earnestly, working hard to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace."
"And in closing I would say good night, God bless, I love you. We have been entrusted with the precious word of God and have had the very finest teacher. May I recommend that we make this ministry a glory to our God and a tribute to our teacher."
He then has the BOT's rise and close out each with a word of prayer-which are enlightening of themselves-but that's for tommorrow.
"Both Bullinger and Dr. Weirwille in working the scriptures and teaching them pointed out to us that turning from Paul was preceeded by turning from truth. (Reads II Corth 11:3.) Our loss of the centrality and authority of God's Word, which of necessity preceeded the turning from our Father in the Word, had to have followed the same steps that Dr. Weirwille taught us in the foundational class regarding Eve and the serpent. I would like to point out to you in reading this verse some significant points: he will go to any length to accomplish what God's Word is pointing out."
2 Cor. 11:3 - But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
He's saying if anyone turns, or has turned away from VPW and/or the ministry of the Way, it's been preceded by a rejection of "the Word".
This is classic misdirection, corny magic. It was used constantly in the Way and is stupid. Take a part of the bible and use it to say "this situation here that we're dealing with is the same as that one...What's it's saying applies directly to us now and it's the same thing".
It leap frogs over a simple question - "who says?". And the numb-brained answer is "God does, it says it right here in the Word".
It's like dealing with babies. Geer says headquarters is carnal, not spiritual. But offers no specific direction as to what that means. He says people are harboring division. Duh. His answer is to "not do that".
If there was intelligence behind this I'd say he's speaking from an "ivory tower" but that's being generous.
He just didn't have a clue that one of the major things causing fear in people was the lack of communication and open sharing. This was hardly a step in that direction. The clock was ticking in people's lives and he offers a view that amounts to "what do you have to do with your that would be any better?"
Lots of things. This exemplifies to me why it was time to move on and grow. Cut your losses, be thankful for the gains and just get away from these guys. As long as you remain in a position where they have some kind of authority they can exercise over you they won't really use it to your benefit.
Aye chiuhahua. Reading this stuff all over again gets my blood boiling. Why I don't exactly know.
Chris Geer was the idiot bus driver who had the nerve to............do something really stupid and degrading to me which I won't repeat here. And here he was setting himself up like some kind of guru who knew all.
I am so glad I got myself kicked out of the way when I did. I actually got shunned for my opinon that Chris G. was an arrogant, egotistical idiot, who was playing everybody.
The original/first reading----revelation (vomit) of Passing of the Patriarch, was Wednesday, April 23rd, 1986.
At the time I was working at the twi hq swb.......I will remember that night........every day for the rest of my life.
Years ago........I did a thread/essay on Passing of the Patriarch........A Night that will live in Infamy. You can find it in the archives.........maybe some kind soul will pull out the the link ;)
My own personal opinion..........it is mine alone, but I do believe that current and past followers of TWI, need to hear this info.......to make their own decision.
Power struggle between these two men, plain and simple. Neither won. Both are losers. In my opinion both had serious mental issues that they never dealt with and maybe were never even aware of. Both are known to have been abusive to many.
What astounds me is that many people in spin-off groups to this very day day hold CG in high esteem as the man who carries the spritual torch.
The TWI party began to come to a close at that point with Waydale later exposing some of what went on at the party. It was high time for it to end so some of us could finally sober up.
One thing I found interesting. It probably helped either bring me out of the mental fog that rests over the TWI Wayworld or helped keep me from succombing to the fog.
It was early in 1990.. I had been off staff by then for about 18 months and at the time was working, running the art dept. at the St. Marys Evening Leader Newspaper. (Side note: H. Allen, when he fired me from staff actually said, sarcastically, "Why don't you go work for the Evening Liar...." After I had finished a long freelance project, I actually did that. BTW they paid me more, half again as much more than TWI was paying me AND my wife combined. Reminds me of a scripture that says that God turns what others mean as evil towards you, His people, to good.)
Anyways. as one of the executive team at the Leader, I had continual contact with virtually every business in town and their execs, as they all advertised in our paper. Factor in the small town, everybody knows everybody factor. This became very intersting to me....
I've said before that when I walked away from TWI I didn't look back. So even living in NK and working in the area I knew very little to nothing about what was going on out there at the time. Frankly mty dear, I didn't give a _ _ _ _ .
It happened more than once that business leaders in the community, would mention to me, "Quite a power struggle going on out there at The Way, right?" They assumed, that because of my past involvement that I knew more of it than they and were actually thinking I might be able to provide them with some of the straight dope on it.
The point of all of this... To people who were NEVER "IN", never exposed to the fog, so to speak, to those who had some real business acumen:
THE WHOLE THING WAS NEVER ANYTHING MORE THAN A BASIC POWER STRUGGLE. The exact same thing that has been going on for centuries. When the monarch grows old and dies, the minions ALWAYS fight over the remaining kingdom.
Period.
It happens in families, businesses, monarchies, everywhere, all the time.
Yet when it comes to TWI this somehow wasn't a power struggle, it was the faithful valet's last ditch effort to save the ministry.
BULL.
There IS a fog over TWI there IS an influence they cast over TWI people. We ALL were either under it, adjacent to it, beside it, or in the middle of it nurturing it and casting it over others.
What astounds me is that many people in spin-off groups to this very day day hold CG in high esteem as the man who carries the spritual torch.
This is part of the fog, man.
I think, that people who acknowledge themselves as free and independant thinkers, see their freewill involvement in certain aspects of "the ministry" as part of their own free and independant thinking.
I pose this question:
Just WHY do we need to have a single "man who carries the spiritual torch?"
That thinking is the nucleus of the FOG.
Jesus Christ is the man who "carries the spiritual torch." Wasn't it GOD who called it the CROSS??
This "man who carries the spiritual torch" concept is counterfeit.
Based on what God accomplished via Jesus, we ALL "carry the spiritual torch" no ONE more than ANY other.
Power struggle between these two men, plain and simple. Neither won. Both are losers. In my opinion both had serious mental issues that they never dealt with and maybe were never even aware of. Both are known to have been abusive to many.
igotout,
Yeah.....a power struggle to secure the rights to MOGDOM.
And, with twi-doctrine in tow......many others were claiming exclusive rights to "their people" in their state, or area, or whatever. Sorta like an animal that marks his territory with urine......to declare his presence and willingness to fight off competitors.
Veepee did it.........to Hefner/Doop/others and funneled the power/funds to ohio in late 60s/early 70s.
Just WHY do we need to have a single "man who carries the spiritual torch?"
That thinking is the nucleus of the FOG.
Jesus Christ is the man who "carries the spiritual torch."
HCW,
I totally agree......and yet, to this day, many ex-twi folk rally BEHIND THEIR FRONTMAN and push his wares, his tapes, his slogans, his insight. Ohhhh, this tape is great. You gotta hear it.
And, really......hasn't the Cgeer fanaticism fizzled and sputtered as well?
After plowing through the "teaching," all I can think of is, god, what a drama queen! And not just CG, who is a manipulator and a divider, but it seems there was always some kind of "drama" going on at TWI.
Thank God I don't have to deal with this bull anymore.
I always too though it was a power play, pure and simple. The two massive egos going at each other.
He just didn't have a clue that one of the major things causing fear in people was the lack of communication and open sharing. This was hardly a step in that direction. The clock was ticking in people's lives and he offers a view that amounts to "what do you have to do with your that would be any better?"
I remember Twig Leaders' meetings from this time. Our Branch Leader would say, "Things are getting better at HQ (according to CG)," or "Things are worse now." I would always ask "What things?" Unfortunately, my BL didn't know; all he could do was repeat these barometer readings. It drove me nuts! I didn't want to know all the deep, dark secrets in the BOT's lives. I just wanted to know what was wrong with TWI, and what was the plan to fix it. That info never surfaced.
I'm a little embarrassed to admit it but I didn't see it as a power play until that day the guy put it to me that way. The embarrassing part is that I squlched the power paly angle in my mind even though it occurred to me on the night that CG read POP that he might just be trying to take over.
"Naw, it MUST be more than THAT, he's trying to FIX things." Even though I KNEW that the way he was going about it was not the way to fix anything.
I've come to hate it when people say "things."
WHAT things, what exactly are you talking about? is always my response. It is only common sense to be skeptical when people won't get specific with you. I'm more than a little embarrassed to have fallen for the crap. Especially since I prided myself in being one of the ones NOT under the TWI influence.
Point being that if you're "in" TWI at all, you're under the influence. You can't be "in" without being "under." Especially nowadays. Even though I didn't get into the whole CG , Gartmore is the new center of the move of God's Word thing, I wasn't completely FREE of the influence.
The guy who asked me about it wasn't under the TWI influence at all. he saw it very clearly. A good sign of being under the influence is denying or being blind to very simple, common sense realities that, as the saying goes, "If it was a snake it woulda bit you."
I think that if the leaders had ever said exactly what it was that was so messed up, they would have to reveal how petty they were -- or how vile. Try these on for size...
"Suzie isn't walking in the love of God in the renewed mind in the household." i.e. Suzie doesn't notice that it drives me nuts when she cracks her gum at the water cooler.
"Suzie isn't walking in the love of God in the renewed mind in the household." i.e. Suzie wouldn't put out when I asked her to service my MOGiness.
So instead, leaders spoke in such vague generalities that we thought, Ooh, that's so heavy! Listen to all the spiritual insight that guy has! Yeah, my gripe with TWI fits what he said, he must be thinking the same thing I am. He must be getting revelation! (Wish I knew how to get that....)
So what was CG's real gripe? It wasn't the sex scandals, because he would have implicated himself. It doesn't seem to be that he wanted to take over, or he would have taken the helm right after the POP, as the BOT was eating out of his hand.
So I guess my question is, What was the BOT doing to CG that pi**ed him off so much that he initiated the POP letter so long after VPW's death?
Maybe I answered my own question. Reading over the "What's Chr** doing now" thread, it seems like there was a lot of wrangling over the making of a new foundational class. Perhaps CG was po'ed that he wasn't allowed to keep the money he was raking in on PFAL.
I'm speculating here, but I'm thinking that his march on Headquarters was designed to get the BOT to loosen the purse strings, and let more money stay in Gartmore. (And remember how much of the POP was devoted to how hard they were working on the Gartmore property?) So instead of saying, "Give me more money," Chris told them in the POP how they were all off the Word (meaning FINANCIALLY off), and how VPW loved what CG was doing, and would have supported his efforts more, except the mean BOT wouldn't listen to him anymore.
When the BOT eventually woke up and said no to CG, he wailed about how hard their hearts still were, while all the while he went about to make his break and produce his own version of PFAL.
When there's a major power play, it's usually about sex, adulation, or money. In this case, I'm betting on money.
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topoftheworld
Chris continues: (It appears he is reading from a transcript of the statement he made to whoever he had gathered together at the beginning of the meetings-he is reading or relaying what he said to the group gathered here.)
"I take full personal responsibility for not having foreseen the possibility that the knowledge would affect Rev. Martindale emotionally as it appears to have done. However, to forestall the Adversary using it against us, I came, knowing what we were facing. Craig had already decided to partially share at that Corps night the material that was in the manuscript of the Passing of the Patriarch and I did not feel that running the risk of added confusion would have been of any benefit. I've been through the manuscript, numerous times, and had there been anything that could have been deleted or should have been added, I have worked and worked and worked, and I didn't fell that a partial sharing would have been a benefit to the body. I had to choose what in the situation appeared to be the best decision to forestall other and far more massive problems of hurt that were almost surely guaranteed. Since that time I have seen that the dissemination of the information was even greater than I had known at the time. I would submit to you that it was the lessor of the evils that I was presented with. It was not God's primary will in the situation, but the further we go the more perhaps you will see that we have been operating often in the third or fourth will of God, and at times well outside of His will. With the bounds of what was done to hem in the truth of God, it was the best possible choice that I could see at the time."
"I need also explain to you that I literally left the funeral for my grandfather, went directly to the airport, was picked up on Athletes, brought back here-I was scheduled to leave that night directly following so I could go back to the family, however my father, who was to have picked me up was emotionally exhausted from the day and when I called in to arrange for the pickup at the airport, he was asleep and could not be awakened-that's why I postponed it until very early the next morning-but I had very pressing family obligations that I was required to attend to."
"For the content, there is no apology except that I know that it must have stung-or worse. Of course you all that know Dr. Weirwille would know that this-excuse me-you would know of course that this was never my intent and those of you that know Dr. Weirwille must have recognized that what I put in the Passing of the Patriarch is an edited version of his comments. In fact, I read it in just slightly over two and half hours and we talked for 36 to 40 hours. For the delivery, I offer my most loving and sincere apology and accept full personal responsibilty. I believe that before we are done in the next few days, you will better understand the situations I was faced with, and if not, at least find it in your heart to overlook any wrongs that I may have been responsible for and look past my weakness and see the love of God that I have in my heart and the great desire I have to see His Word live and flourish."
"That is where we started our meetings. Then during the meetings, I explained among the household of our fellowship right here, the men and Donna that are seated on this stage, why each of the people that is here, is here. I think quite obviously this table speaks for itself (apparently indicated the BOT and Donna). And the reason that Ricardo Caberillo was brought in from Argentina and John Townsend was brought in from Kansas were things that Dr. Wierwille through the years had indicated to me that if it ever became possible to begin to put right certain things in the ministry that he recommended these two gentlemen be included. Art (Art Poling, I presume) is at my invitation because of the greatness of his heart, and because Father said put him there, so I didn't argue. Ralph was invited because he is one of the two, three people that ever asked me why did Dr. Wierwille come see you and what did he say, because of things Dr. Wierwille told my about him, and, the phrase that Father put in my mind was, a witness, and I thought myself the witness of seeing what would occur. However, he's also a born witness because it turns out although he never said it and in fact denied it, that Dr. Weirwille did cover a number of the salient facts that in the Passing of the Patriarch with Ralph. In addition, he told Ralph, before he left Boston for Scotland, that he was going to Scotland, basically, to leave his last will and testament for the ministry, which I didn't know until Ralph shared it partway through the meeting-so. And then Earl Burton, because of what he has been and what he's gonna be."
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topoftheworld
Chris continues:
"And I also need to explain to you the exclusion of the First lady of the Way International, Mrs. Weirwille. It was at a request of Dr. Weirwille's that that occured. He requested that, if we ever begin to bring the things he mentioned to me to light, that as much as possible, I protect her heart. That is one of the heavist things that was on my heart last Wednesday night was that I had been forced into a corner that had threatened that request of Dr. Weirwille to me, and if any harm has come from that, I apologize, Mrs. Weirwille, and God'll have to take it out of my hide."
"Then we spent the rest of the day reading the manuscript because many of the men had heard it once, never read it. and there's no sense it starting on something without having a firm foundation. Then after we read it we decided that was enough for the day and we quit. (laughs). Then, yesterday morning, we got together and began a process that for want of a better term I have called a damage accessment. It is not a biblical term-I don't know a biblical term to apply to it-it is just something that I understood. When you go to a doctor he has to know what's wrong before he can understand how to start putting things right. The same would be true with a mechanic, or in many other fields. I-I am not saying that is the best termonolgy, its just happens to be the only one I could place on the process that's necessary. If you can understand what that means, then we're well are our way to understand what it was I endeavored to start with. And honestly, in looking at what's happened, it is either the first or second great loss we must look at. In some senses, perhaps, the first great loss was the falling asleep of our wonderful Father in the Word. However, the only possible point of contention for the great loss that we considered as a group and which I want to consider tonight with you as the household of God called to be here-is the only possible point of contention would be the loss of our Father in the Word, Dr. Weirwille-his presence, his knowledge of God's rightly divided word and his spirtual perception are very sorely missed and especially so at this crucial hour. However, the rectifiable loss that we need to look at is the erosion of God's Word from this ministry, the pattern of non-adherence to the written Word of God that has developed."
"Rev. Townsend got from Dr. Weirwille and has taught us for years "The Road Down". Some of you that have had the class on the Way tree or have been at various meetings may be familiar with the road down procedure that Rev. Townsend has taught us. It begins with division and ends on focusing on personality traits, etc, etc. There can be, as Dr Weirwille has so wonderfully taught us for years, no two opinions regarding truth. Truth is truth. The only possibilty of two opinions is either believing, or unbelief, but truth is truth."
(Chris then reads from Bullinger and Weirwille's writings concerning Acts 19, and the forces that caused Paul to first spread the Word throught Asia, but then having it stripped away by having the pure word replaced by other beliefs. This took about four minutes: I won't repeat it vebatim but the source is Bullingers Church Epistle's, Introduction, discussing Acts 19:10 and II Timothy 1:15, 2:18, 3:8, 4:4. Then Chap 10, God's Magnified Word -the loss of the mystery.) The section ends with "The first truths to be lost is usually the last to be regained, so it needs to be recovered and taught to people who love God and want to understand the doctrine's of his inspired Word."
NOTE: Remember, please, I am only as a matter of interest offering this transcript for clarification of what went on-I'm not making judgements on the accuracy of the information, only the accuracy of the actual content from the recording.
Chris continues:
"Both Bullinger and Dr. Weirwille in working the scriptures and teaching them pointed out to us that turning from Paul was preceeded by turning from truth. (Reads II Corth 11:3.) Our loss of the centrality and authority of God's Word, which of necessity preceeded the turning from our Father in the Word, had to have followed the same steps that Dr. Weirwille taught us in the foundational class regarding Eve and the serpent. I would like to point out to you in reading this verse some significant points: he will go to any length to accomplish what God's Word is pointing out."
"
Anybody want me to continue? Chris starts teaching from this point but he does have some more interesting points to make.
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markomalley
Transcripts are a good thing. May not please everybody. May not be based on facts...except the fact that the information presented WAS presented! Thanks for this!!!
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johniam
You bet your *** I want you to continue.
As for the date, I only know that CG read POP to the corps on Wed April 23, 1986. Could that be the "last Wednesday" he referred to? I'm told that CG intended for maybe 10 people max to read/hear the contents of it, but LCM allegedly blabbed it to enough people that many knew about it in a short time. I was on the field and didn't hear about it till a month or so after the '86 ROA.
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skyrider
johniam, yeah........I remember hearing the same thing.
But, ya know..........for reasons, I never could buy into this explanation. It just seemed to me that.......either, 1) cgeer was very sloppy and vague in delivering this so-called "last will and testament" having had over a year to process the information and all........OR......2) cgeer KNEW that this stuff would set off a chain reaction and he could slide behind the curtain only to re-emerge as "the man who was given the revelation to save twi AND HELP SALVAGE MARTINDALE'S BLUNDERS."
Didn't buy that "intended rap of cgeer" in 1988.......and I don't buy that explanation today.
Cgeer was far too cunning to NOT FORESEE this martindale eruption.
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topoftheworld
To continue:
""I would like to point out to you in re-reading this verse some significant points. 'I fear less by any means' which shows that he (the serpent) will try any means, he will go to any lengths to accomplish what God's word is pointing out to us here, 'as the serpent beguilled Eve'. The word beguilled may also be translated into the word seduced, and I think perhaps because of the education we've had from televison and movies the word "seduced' may produce better mind pictures for us in this case. We've read that, and yet we've treated it as though it was rape, and not seduction. We've thought, boom, he just hits you over the head and that's the end of you. That may be the case, your place or mine, mine, that's the end of the seduction. With a willing victim, it takes very little seduction, does it? The less willing the victim, the greater the seduction that would have to be produced. 'And it was done through subtlety, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ'. If you remember the steps that Dr. Weirwille has taught us, the first is that the serpent questioned the integrity of God's word. Remember? Now Eve had a perfect bloodstream, perfect fellowship, and a wonderful renewed mind, she didn't have to work her way back to wholeness, she started with it, and yet she responded by considering. Now, we have so many alternative viewpoints in our world, that often times we have to respond by considering and holding everything in against the truth of the word of God. But her subsequent actions are what brought the clamity on her. She was already wrong in her situation by the time she responding by considering. In her life there were no alternatives until she was directly presented with one. She omitted a word, she added a word, she changed a word, what you and I today would call mishandling the word of God. Wrongly dividing the scriptures. And after all that you have a 180 degree change, a lie versus the truth. It was a seduction, like the seduction that happened in our ministry. (Reads I Corth 3:1-11).
"In all of this, since we started, the only man who has said to me initially after reading the manuscript that he would get back and stand on the Word was Howard. Every time I hear somebody say that they are standing with Craig-now I am not speaking in the context of lovingly supporting-but in the context of choosing sides, I know they that they are carnal in their thinking. Romans 8:6-7. You what enmity means-oil and water-no matter how much you shake it they are going to separate. What is the law of God? The word of God. The written word of God. Verse 8. We are not hear to deal with Quote-who are you going to stand with-end of qoute, but Quote-are you going to stand on God's rightly divided word-end quote." I told these gentlemen, we use to hear but we heard it last night so I can't say that to you I just have to say you heard it even last night, Dr Weirwille saying that we needed to the palce of saying we needed to stand if the whole ministry goes down the tubes."
Break time-I'll be back.
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coolchef1248 @adelphia.net
more please!
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topoftheworld
Continue:
"The result of division would be more than one opinion: division, more than one opinion of scriptures, which outwardly manifests itself in the rejection of Dr. Weirwille, his teaching, and his counsel, and finally focusing on his personality, which was his carnality, his flesh, which every man has, rather than focusing on his spirtuality which few men throughout all the ages have ever approached. And part of the result has been a loss of spirtuality and a re-emergence of carnal thinking that has permeated every level of our ministry: and I would say that it is rampant at headquarters. I haven't been on the other campuses: I am not an authority to speak on that, but I know that the vast majority of you were picking sides and being carnal. That puts you in a position of being at enmity with God, something that perhaps you will rectify shortly."
Note from transcriber: I could say something here, but I'm not-I figure you guys will say it for me.
Onward:
"Until this is rectified, healed, and new habit patterns of believing, trust and obedience to God and his written revealed word which is still his will are re-established-and may I say established with reliable consistency-then 'revelation' will continue to be counterfeit. Dr. Weirwille taught us that if you are not in fellowship with God your senses' mind will keep flipping up thoughts, remember that phrase? Well, if you've been thinking carnally, in other words if you have fallen into patterns which I have just outlined for you, then that would be the only possible result. Reliance must be constantly placed or in fact replaced on the written word of God, and all actions, reactions, decisions, and thoughts must evaluated and all subsequent actions enacted in light of holy scripture, God's written revealed truth, His word. And that's where we began our day yesterday, and we worked that word together."
"Obviously I dealt with other things that I'm not covering with you. I don't think it would be of profit to you. (I assume he was addressing this comment to the 16th corp(?)or staff who was in the audience), partly because what I did is go back and chronological pick up decisions that were made and document from scriptures how they could have been handled closer to the word of God (thumps his bible.) And since you weren't in on the decisions all I would do is confuse you. But that's what the issue, the basic issue that we are dealing with is not who do you stand with, but do you stand on the rightly divided, revealed word of God? Are you going to use it as your only rule of faith and practice? In your life is the word of God going to return to being the will of God? Until the situation of carnality is cured, there seems little hope for having a powerful ministry, does there?"
"Then, this morning, I shared a number of things. This morning we watched well over three hours of the Advanced class and listened to a tape from Dr. Weirwille: we just spent the morning in the Word of God. Then the afternoon we played-with you. But I shared that it was not the plan to effect the removal of one or more of the trustees, which is not God's primary will. The actions that I have taken have been to safeguard the knowledge of God's word, and the knowledge of the mystery, and that I can assure you is of greater importance than my life, and though I would hesitate to speak for you, I trust that you would see it greater than yours as well. Those of you who heard the reading of the Passing of the Patriarch will agree that Dr. Weirwille agreed with and lived up to that statement that I have just made. The continuance of the knowledge of God's word is his primary will in this situation."
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topoftheworld
Continue:
"As regards our brother Don: Yes, he has weaknesses and yes he had not put on the word of God to the end he walked as a spirtual man, but look at David and Saul. David did not put a hand against Saul-repeatly in the old testament we know that one does not lift a hand against a man who has been called of God. And I believe that among the household that I'm addressing now-I cannot speak for those who will listen to the tapes at the other campuses and so on, though those that I have seen on the field in the interim period between having read it and being here with you, particularily in the Uniited States, the vast majority of you have fallen into the category of carnality that we have covered from God's word tonight. You have been seduced from the simplicity that is in Christ. By the admonition of scripture, you would have of necessity be excluded from restoring in the situatuion that we have been faced with. Galatians Chapter 6:1. So anybody who has had thoughts of division, of envy, of strife or any of the other things that the scriptures have indicated to us, as carnality, are automatically excluded. Verse 2. I believe that the nine other people who I share the stage with this evening would assure you as readily as I would that the fellowship of the ten of us has been filled with love and tenderness and with a pervading atmosphere of peace. We are attempting to bear one another's burdens, and so not to walk away from the law of Christ but fulfill it."
"(Reads Verse 3). What have you that you haven't received form God? Yes, we have nine manifestations that was given to us. Yes, it is a ministry of grace, because God gave us the grace. What have we that we haven't received freely by the loving hand of our heavenly Father? The same thing we had before we took the class and came to a knowledge of the Word. Not much. (Reads verse 4 and 5.) So any of you who have harbored thoughts of division, of strife, of envy, of anything but the most holiest of love, prayer and believing, obviously do not fall into the category of being able to help restore."
"Now, I have not shared what I am going to share with you-this is something new. If Hdq'ts is going to eminate the love, the healing, and the power that's necessary to move this ministry, you will need to change from being carnal to being spirtual, putting God's word back at the level that it should have been held at from which you have been seduced. Regain those things that have been lost, otherwise, brethern, you will be part of the problem and not a part of the solution. You will be those who need restoring and not those who restore. We are restoring this evening using the word of God. Take heed to the scriptures: place the word of God as the will of God in your life. Refute the seduction from the simplicity that is in Christ and return your mind to a state of not being at enmity with God, but to a state of peace with God."
"It was not nor is it the primary will of God to remove any member of the Board of Trustees of the Way International. If you have harbored this thought, then I would recommend that we read Ephesians Chapter 4. (Reads Verse 3). Now, I wanted to give you a literal of 'endeavouring' but I can do it better in French than I can in English. It means "Bust your stupid dar-e-air." You understand that? The engish isn't quite as polite. To keep the unity of the spirit and the bond of peace. Any of you have harbored thoughts of division have not yet reached that level. We always need to realize that the Word of God is the will of God, that it means what it says, it says what it means. If God had not meant this to be that, he wouldn't have written the book. "Endeavouring earnestly, working hard to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace."
"And in closing I would say good night, God bless, I love you. We have been entrusted with the precious word of God and have had the very finest teacher. May I recommend that we make this ministry a glory to our God and a tribute to our teacher."
He then has the BOT's rise and close out each with a word of prayer-which are enlightening of themselves-but that's for tommorrow.
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socks
Thanks topoftheworld!
"Both Bullinger and Dr. Weirwille in working the scriptures and teaching them pointed out to us that turning from Paul was preceeded by turning from truth. (Reads II Corth 11:3.) Our loss of the centrality and authority of God's Word, which of necessity preceeded the turning from our Father in the Word, had to have followed the same steps that Dr. Weirwille taught us in the foundational class regarding Eve and the serpent. I would like to point out to you in reading this verse some significant points: he will go to any length to accomplish what God's Word is pointing out."
2 Cor. 11:3 - But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
He's saying if anyone turns, or has turned away from VPW and/or the ministry of the Way, it's been preceded by a rejection of "the Word".
This is classic misdirection, corny magic. It was used constantly in the Way and is stupid. Take a part of the bible and use it to say "this situation here that we're dealing with is the same as that one...What's it's saying applies directly to us now and it's the same thing".
It leap frogs over a simple question - "who says?". And the numb-brained answer is "God does, it says it right here in the Word".
It's like dealing with babies. Geer says headquarters is carnal, not spiritual. But offers no specific direction as to what that means. He says people are harboring division. Duh. His answer is to "not do that".
If there was intelligence behind this I'd say he's speaking from an "ivory tower" but that's being generous.
He just didn't have a clue that one of the major things causing fear in people was the lack of communication and open sharing. This was hardly a step in that direction. The clock was ticking in people's lives and he offers a view that amounts to "what do you have to do with your that would be any better?"
Lots of things. This exemplifies to me why it was time to move on and grow. Cut your losses, be thankful for the gains and just get away from these guys. As long as you remain in a position where they have some kind of authority they can exercise over you they won't really use it to your benefit.
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J0nny Ling0
Why, thank you Socks, that was quite thoughtful. Nice to hear your opinion on this.....
JL
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socks
Dang! Where's a horn of plenty when you need one!
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ex10
Exactly socks
Aye chiuhahua. Reading this stuff all over again gets my blood boiling. Why I don't exactly know.
Chris Geer was the idiot bus driver who had the nerve to............do something really stupid and degrading to me which I won't repeat here. And here he was setting himself up like some kind of guru who knew all.
I am so glad I got myself kicked out of the way when I did. I actually got shunned for my opinon that Chris G. was an arrogant, egotistical idiot, who was playing everybody.
I guess I'm feeling really righteous now.
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coolchef1248 @adelphia.net
as you well should be ex
good for you
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Radar OReilly
The original/first reading----revelation (vomit) of Passing of the Patriarch, was Wednesday, April 23rd, 1986.
At the time I was working at the twi hq swb.......I will remember that night........every day for the rest of my life.
Years ago........I did a thread/essay on Passing of the Patriarch........A Night that will live in Infamy. You can find it in the archives.........maybe some kind soul will pull out the the link ;)
My own personal opinion..........it is mine alone, but I do believe that current and past followers of TWI, need to hear this info.......to make their own decision.
Radar
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igotout
Power struggle between these two men, plain and simple. Neither won. Both are losers. In my opinion both had serious mental issues that they never dealt with and maybe were never even aware of. Both are known to have been abusive to many.
What astounds me is that many people in spin-off groups to this very day day hold CG in high esteem as the man who carries the spritual torch.
The TWI party began to come to a close at that point with Waydale later exposing some of what went on at the party. It was high time for it to end so some of us could finally sober up.
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HCW
One thing I found interesting. It probably helped either bring me out of the mental fog that rests over the TWI Wayworld or helped keep me from succombing to the fog.
It was early in 1990.. I had been off staff by then for about 18 months and at the time was working, running the art dept. at the St. Marys Evening Leader Newspaper. (Side note: H. Allen, when he fired me from staff actually said, sarcastically, "Why don't you go work for the Evening Liar...." After I had finished a long freelance project, I actually did that. BTW they paid me more, half again as much more than TWI was paying me AND my wife combined. Reminds me of a scripture that says that God turns what others mean as evil towards you, His people, to good.)
Anyways. as one of the executive team at the Leader, I had continual contact with virtually every business in town and their execs, as they all advertised in our paper. Factor in the small town, everybody knows everybody factor. This became very intersting to me....
I've said before that when I walked away from TWI I didn't look back. So even living in NK and working in the area I knew very little to nothing about what was going on out there at the time. Frankly mty dear, I didn't give a _ _ _ _ .
It happened more than once that business leaders in the community, would mention to me, "Quite a power struggle going on out there at The Way, right?" They assumed, that because of my past involvement that I knew more of it than they and were actually thinking I might be able to provide them with some of the straight dope on it.
The point of all of this... To people who were NEVER "IN", never exposed to the fog, so to speak, to those who had some real business acumen:
THE WHOLE THING WAS NEVER ANYTHING MORE THAN A BASIC POWER STRUGGLE. The exact same thing that has been going on for centuries. When the monarch grows old and dies, the minions ALWAYS fight over the remaining kingdom.
Period.
It happens in families, businesses, monarchies, everywhere, all the time.
Yet when it comes to TWI this somehow wasn't a power struggle, it was the faithful valet's last ditch effort to save the ministry.
BULL.
There IS a fog over TWI there IS an influence they cast over TWI people. We ALL were either under it, adjacent to it, beside it, or in the middle of it nurturing it and casting it over others.
This is part of the fog, man.
I think, that people who acknowledge themselves as free and independant thinkers, see their freewill involvement in certain aspects of "the ministry" as part of their own free and independant thinking.
I pose this question:
Just WHY do we need to have a single "man who carries the spiritual torch?"
That thinking is the nucleus of the FOG.
Jesus Christ is the man who "carries the spiritual torch." Wasn't it GOD who called it the CROSS??
This "man who carries the spiritual torch" concept is counterfeit.
Based on what God accomplished via Jesus, we ALL "carry the spiritual torch" no ONE more than ANY other.
WAKE UP America.
Blessings.
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skyrider
igotout,
Yeah.....a power struggle to secure the rights to MOGDOM.
And, with twi-doctrine in tow......many others were claiming exclusive rights to "their people" in their state, or area, or whatever. Sorta like an animal that marks his territory with urine......to declare his presence and willingness to fight off competitors.
Veepee did it.........to Hefner/Doop/others and funneled the power/funds to ohio in late 60s/early 70s.
More subtle of course......but it happened.
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skyrider
HCW,
I totally agree......and yet, to this day, many ex-twi folk rally BEHIND THEIR FRONTMAN and push his wares, his tapes, his slogans, his insight. Ohhhh, this tape is great. You gotta hear it.
And, really......hasn't the Cgeer fanaticism fizzled and sputtered as well?
Yep.
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Sunesis
After plowing through the "teaching," all I can think of is, god, what a drama queen! And not just CG, who is a manipulator and a divider, but it seems there was always some kind of "drama" going on at TWI.
Thank God I don't have to deal with this bull anymore.
I always too though it was a power play, pure and simple. The two massive egos going at each other.
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GeorgeStGeorge
I remember Twig Leaders' meetings from this time. Our Branch Leader would say, "Things are getting better at HQ (according to CG)," or "Things are worse now." I would always ask "What things?" Unfortunately, my BL didn't know; all he could do was repeat these barometer readings. It drove me nuts! I didn't want to know all the deep, dark secrets in the BOT's lives. I just wanted to know what was wrong with TWI, and what was the plan to fix it. That info never surfaced.
George
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HCW
I'm a little embarrassed to admit it but I didn't see it as a power play until that day the guy put it to me that way. The embarrassing part is that I squlched the power paly angle in my mind even though it occurred to me on the night that CG read POP that he might just be trying to take over.
"Naw, it MUST be more than THAT, he's trying to FIX things." Even though I KNEW that the way he was going about it was not the way to fix anything.
I've come to hate it when people say "things."
WHAT things, what exactly are you talking about? is always my response. It is only common sense to be skeptical when people won't get specific with you. I'm more than a little embarrassed to have fallen for the crap. Especially since I prided myself in being one of the ones NOT under the TWI influence.
Point being that if you're "in" TWI at all, you're under the influence. You can't be "in" without being "under." Especially nowadays. Even though I didn't get into the whole CG , Gartmore is the new center of the move of God's Word thing, I wasn't completely FREE of the influence.
The guy who asked me about it wasn't under the TWI influence at all. he saw it very clearly. A good sign of being under the influence is denying or being blind to very simple, common sense realities that, as the saying goes, "If it was a snake it woulda bit you."
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shazdancer
I think that if the leaders had ever said exactly what it was that was so messed up, they would have to reveal how petty they were -- or how vile. Try these on for size...
"Suzie isn't walking in the love of God in the renewed mind in the household." i.e. Suzie doesn't notice that it drives me nuts when she cracks her gum at the water cooler.
"Suzie isn't walking in the love of God in the renewed mind in the household." i.e. Suzie wouldn't put out when I asked her to service my MOGiness.
So instead, leaders spoke in such vague generalities that we thought, Ooh, that's so heavy! Listen to all the spiritual insight that guy has! Yeah, my gripe with TWI fits what he said, he must be thinking the same thing I am. He must be getting revelation! (Wish I knew how to get that....)
So what was CG's real gripe? It wasn't the sex scandals, because he would have implicated himself. It doesn't seem to be that he wanted to take over, or he would have taken the helm right after the POP, as the BOT was eating out of his hand.
So I guess my question is, What was the BOT doing to CG that pi**ed him off so much that he initiated the POP letter so long after VPW's death?
Regards,
Shaz
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shazdancer
Maybe I answered my own question. Reading over the "What's Chr** doing now" thread, it seems like there was a lot of wrangling over the making of a new foundational class. Perhaps CG was po'ed that he wasn't allowed to keep the money he was raking in on PFAL.
I'm speculating here, but I'm thinking that his march on Headquarters was designed to get the BOT to loosen the purse strings, and let more money stay in Gartmore. (And remember how much of the POP was devoted to how hard they were working on the Gartmore property?) So instead of saying, "Give me more money," Chris told them in the POP how they were all off the Word (meaning FINANCIALLY off), and how VPW loved what CG was doing, and would have supported his efforts more, except the mean BOT wouldn't listen to him anymore.
When the BOT eventually woke up and said no to CG, he wailed about how hard their hearts still were, while all the while he went about to make his break and produce his own version of PFAL.
When there's a major power play, it's usually about sex, adulation, or money. In this case, I'm betting on money.
Regards,
Shaz
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