Whitedove - I read your thread title and thought this would be fun, then all of a sudden I realized that it was going to be about John Lennon's death 25 years ago.
I was living outside a very small town in middle WI with my husband and baby, loving life. I was a pfal grad and attended a very sweet twig in Beaver Dam, WI. Life was very good. We rented a farmhouse that was surrounded by a cornfield on three sides with a river about 500 yards behind the house where we used to put our canoe in and go to visit our friends, whose backyard was also on the river. It was a 4.5 mile ride by car and it took 2 hours or so by canoe.
My world stopped for awhile when John Lennon was murdered. I still love most of his music. My best friend was a major Lennon fan. She was devastated by his death. I was terribly saddened, but not as personally affected.
Well, I never liked him. He was a communist, and when he was shot, I was indiffernt to it. Although I did and still do love lots of Beatles music, he was my least favorite Beatle, with Paul and Ringo my favorites, perhaps Sir Paul McCartney being my favorite altogether.
The "Just Imagine" song with the "Imagine no religion" aspect of it just ain't right. It's nice to be a dreamer of world peace, but it just isn't practical when leaving God out of it, and it is mis-leading. Sorry, but no candles lit in this home for John Lennon...
I'm a Beatles fan! John Lennon's death - at the time it seemed impossible. Why would anyone kill him? He's just a dammed singer and musician. You'd have to be crazy.
I was working at the Way Nash, and was surprised at how calloused the reaction was. It made me remember that a lot of people believed the Beatles were the Devil's boys and somehow of Satanic influence. As if saying "I want to hold your hand" or "I Am the Walrus" were the worst things that could be imagined.
John Lennon was the one who said the Beatles were more popular than Jesus, thus proving that you have to pick carefully the icons you compare yourself to. I guess if he'd said "the Beatles sell more records than Jesus ever did" he'd have really gotten crucified. What he said was pretty close to the truth, based on the 1,000's of kids who burned their records, which I guess they were using for prayer mats before that.
But it did show from what perch he viewed the world as an atheist, and the tight view he had of the world from it. I remember reading his reaction and his response, as if he was surprised it would be so offensive to some people. But it was probably more innocent than anything and he's not the first or last person to think so, just one of those who's said so.
The story of his early life I've read is sad, tragic really. His father left his mother and he and never came back. His mother left him with her sister to raise, and visited him as if she was a friend, not a mother. Later when he reconected with his mother as a young adult she was hit by a car and killed.
I like a lot of the songs that bore his stamp the most - "I'm Only Sleeping", "It's Only Love", "Julia", written to his mother and perfectly captures that elusiveness and lost love he must have felt. And I remember when he came back after so many years of not releasing any music with the single "Woman". The verses to that song illustrate his mastering of the modern song form as well as any, I think. It's simple, almost casual, as if it flowed out of him, no biggie, did it before lunch.
One of my favorites that I think is a true classic is "Norwegian Wood". The bridge is poignant, the music turn it makes. The lyrics are dry humor and the last line leaves you guessing:
I once had a girl, or should I say, she once had me.
She showed me her room, isn’t it good, norwegian wood?
She asked me to stay and she told me to sit anywhere,
So I looked around and I noticed there wasn’t a chair.
I sat on a rug, biding my time, drinking her wine.
We talked until two and then she said, it’s time for bed.
She told me she worked in the morning and started to laugh.
I told her I didn’t and crawled off to sleep in the bath.
And when I awoke I was alone, this bird had flown.
I admit I was indifferent. That video of him singing "Imagine" while Yoko opens the curtains is a classic example of socialist hypocrisy. He says "Imagine no possessions, I wonder if you can." Well, gee, John. Maybe I could if I wasn't watching you wearing expensive clothes, playing an expensive piano, in an expensively furnished room, in an expensive building, on expensivbe land.
As an artist, he was great. George taught him how to play the guitar. He got the most out of what talent he had. I'll give him that.
That night I was on my way to buy my first VCR. I had waited until they broke the $800 mark. Well that sunday, there was an ad. I called and had them hold one for me. I had to drive to what was called the inland empire in SoCal. It was a 90 minute drive each way.
My radio couldn't reach any good radio stations so I was without radio for about an hour each way.
I bought the VCR and headed back. I had turned off the radio because the static was irritating, I never turned it back on.
I got home with this heavy VCR in my hands. I was walking through the living room and my wife was telling me about her day. Then as I was putting down the VCR to open the box, she said, "Oh and by the way, John Lennon was murdered about an hour ago".
I dropped the VCR. She made some comment like, "Oh well"
OH WELL!!!!!
I ignored that and went through the channels to find a news report. I was numb. The Way had made us think that people like John Lennon were possessed or seed boys. Well f* em, I was greatly saddened by his loss. His music was part of the soundtrack of my life.
"Help" was not just a song, it was a reflection of what I felt. He had a knack of writing songs that had meaning and substance. He was witty, he was perceptive. Fortunately, in the last few years of his life he got to live a very private fulfilling life.
Anyway, I listened for the rest of the evening to stories and accolades. It marked the end of the Beatles, in any way form or manner. (although the Threetles did play background for a few of Lennon's demos for the Beatle's Anthology)
I was amazed at the attention and outlaying of emotion all over the country and the world. I was equally amazed at the utter stupidity of leaders in The Way in the following days with their offerings to diminish the accomplishments of John Lennon. There was a "New Year's Advance", where I got earfuls of how the devil ran Lennon's life. That advance was the beginning of the end for my time with TWI. How ANYONE could diminish the murder of any person still astonishes me.
I am listening to "Because" by the Beatles on the Anthology 3 CD. Those guys could sure harmonize. He left a body of work that we can listen to for many many years to come
I was never a HUGE Beatles or Lennon fan the way some are, but still i always had great respect for not only their music but the impact that he/they had on our entire generation...
I was driving in a car with a wafer in So. Illinois when I heard the news on the radio. I couldn't believe how absolutely stunned and shocked I was, then amazingly saddened. The news completety sideswiped me. Although I would have never ever expected it to, , his death had a deep emotional impact on me.
I got very reflective and and reminissed (sp) with the other wafer who then got on his soapbox and spouted the company line about him being a seed boy--- oblivious to the fact that one of the greats of our time had been murdered. It sickened me, I stayed away for several days and mourned and then entered into a season that was a bit quieter and more internal than the previous one.
my sentiments, feelings, whatever are very much along the lines of what socks and paw have already shared... I had been out less than a year at that time... but I remember the exact place I was and what I was doing... it was one of those times for me... it made no sense...
when I hear "imagine no religion" I always thought it was referring to all of the hate and bigotry and killing that wouldn't or never would have taken place if not for religion... I never took it to mean "imagine no God"...
I had my infant son with me in our old blue van, doing morning errands. I turned the radio on, a Lennon tune was playing, and when it was over the dj said something about the late John Lennon...I couldn't believe it...it felt as if someone hit me in the chest. I had been a huge Beatles fan before getting into twi and I was so shocked and saddened to hear that he had been murdered.
BUT... then I "renewed my mind" and remembered that Wic-tor had said he was seed, plus, I wasn't thrilled with the line in "Imagine" about imagining there was no heaven, and besides, blah-coldhearted-egocentric-arrogantcultview-blah. That was one of the many times that I didn't listen to my heart but forced my mind back into the way's warped view. I am sad to say that week I even parroted the line I heard another wayfer speak "Imagine there is no John Lennon".
Thank God Almighty I've been free from that cult for 19 years this month.
This past week saw 3 days in a row of negative anniversaries. Dec 6 is the date of the Rolling Stones concert the movie Gimme Shelter was made from where 4 people died and Hell's Angels who were hired to guard the stage beat up several people. Dec 7 is of course Pearl Harbor, and Dec 8 is Lennon's assassination.
I recognized 2 of the 3 by watching my copy of the Rolling Stones Rock and Roll Circus which has John Lennon in it. For awhile now I have wondered if Jagger had anything to do with Lennon's death. I read a book once called Up and Down with the Rolling Stones by a Tony something who was Keith Richard's bodyguard and heroin dealer. Although the book says nothing about Jagger having anything to do with Lennon's death, it does paint a desperate picture of Mick's frustration with having to compete with the Beatles. Seemingly without effort, the Beatles always outdid the Stones.
There's motive. His money is his means, and his opportunity was that he had an apartment right around the corner from Lennon at that Dakotas place. That could allow Mick to have known Lennon's comings and goings. Also, there's a brief conversation between Jagger and Lennon immediately before Lennon performs on the Rock and Roll Circus that is a little weird. I will always wonder about this.
Please finish your story Pawtucket: did the VCR work after you dropped it?
========================================
I was such an "egghead" in those years! I missed a lot of fun stuff. There wasn't much money in the budget to buy music then, especially when we had a number of FM music stations that played "good" instrumental music, which I preferred anyway.
WQXR played a number of such instrumental songs for quite some time after his death and I particularly liked one album done by the Boston Pops so I did buy that one. One of my favorites from that album was "Yellow Submarine" because it had some kind of instrument whose name evades me now - - but it had a slide-slap sound. That and some other Boston Pops "antics" made me laugh when I heard them. I think it took me a few months to realize what I had lost in not appreciating their music, so I was very glad they had left a lot of it. I've really enjoyed it since. My musical heart is a bit divided though....it's a toss up between the Beetles and Simon & Garfunkel. Call me strange if you like - - but that's the way it is.
When Lennon was shot, I hadn't yet been introduced to TWI. I was working in a commercial photo studio and was absorbed to taking photos of offshore oil drilling components for technical purposes. I just remember passively thinking "another rock star done gone". I was kinda sad, tho.
I think maybe we all are affected when an icon of our youth, who is similar in age, passes because it puts us more in touch with our own mortality.
Lennon was my least favorite of the Fab 4. After Yoko Ono came on the scene he diminished even more in my eyes as she seemed to be splitting the group up. It was difficult for me to image life without John, Paul, George, and Ringo, as they were such an important part of my life growing up in the 60's.
As time went on and I actually thought about the lyrics in their songs I was glad they had broken up. 'Imagine' was an eye opener, realizing they advocated world one world government and the abolishment of religion.
When Lennon was shot I remember asking myself why he decided to live in a luxery hotel and not give all his money away? If he was really for the rich taking care of everyone why did he need to wait for the government to take action? Why didn't he just empty his bank account and feed the masses?
Recommended Posts
Raf
Who?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
bowtwi
Whitedove - I read your thread title and thought this would be fun, then all of a sudden I realized that it was going to be about John Lennon's death 25 years ago.
I was living outside a very small town in middle WI with my husband and baby, loving life. I was a pfal grad and attended a very sweet twig in Beaver Dam, WI. Life was very good. We rented a farmhouse that was surrounded by a cornfield on three sides with a river about 500 yards behind the house where we used to put our canoe in and go to visit our friends, whose backyard was also on the river. It was a 4.5 mile ride by car and it took 2 hours or so by canoe.
My world stopped for awhile when John Lennon was murdered. I still love most of his music. My best friend was a major Lennon fan. She was devastated by his death. I was terribly saddened, but not as personally affected.
Edited by bowtwiLink to comment
Share on other sites
WhiteDove
No Raf he was not in the WHO but he was in another rather obscure British group....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
J0nny Ling0
Well, I never liked him. He was a communist, and when he was shot, I was indiffernt to it. Although I did and still do love lots of Beatles music, he was my least favorite Beatle, with Paul and Ringo my favorites, perhaps Sir Paul McCartney being my favorite altogether.
The "Just Imagine" song with the "Imagine no religion" aspect of it just ain't right. It's nice to be a dreamer of world peace, but it just isn't practical when leaving God out of it, and it is mis-leading. Sorry, but no candles lit in this home for John Lennon...
Link to comment
Share on other sites
socks
I'm a Beatles fan! John Lennon's death - at the time it seemed impossible. Why would anyone kill him? He's just a dammed singer and musician. You'd have to be crazy.
I was working at the Way Nash, and was surprised at how calloused the reaction was. It made me remember that a lot of people believed the Beatles were the Devil's boys and somehow of Satanic influence. As if saying "I want to hold your hand" or "I Am the Walrus" were the worst things that could be imagined.
John Lennon was the one who said the Beatles were more popular than Jesus, thus proving that you have to pick carefully the icons you compare yourself to. I guess if he'd said "the Beatles sell more records than Jesus ever did" he'd have really gotten crucified. What he said was pretty close to the truth, based on the 1,000's of kids who burned their records, which I guess they were using for prayer mats before that.
But it did show from what perch he viewed the world as an atheist, and the tight view he had of the world from it. I remember reading his reaction and his response, as if he was surprised it would be so offensive to some people. But it was probably more innocent than anything and he's not the first or last person to think so, just one of those who's said so.
The story of his early life I've read is sad, tragic really. His father left his mother and he and never came back. His mother left him with her sister to raise, and visited him as if she was a friend, not a mother. Later when he reconected with his mother as a young adult she was hit by a car and killed.
I like a lot of the songs that bore his stamp the most - "I'm Only Sleeping", "It's Only Love", "Julia", written to his mother and perfectly captures that elusiveness and lost love he must have felt. And I remember when he came back after so many years of not releasing any music with the single "Woman". The verses to that song illustrate his mastering of the modern song form as well as any, I think. It's simple, almost casual, as if it flowed out of him, no biggie, did it before lunch.
One of my favorites that I think is a true classic is "Norwegian Wood". The bridge is poignant, the music turn it makes. The lyrics are dry humor and the last line leaves you guessing:
I once had a girl, or should I say, she once had me.
She showed me her room, isn’t it good, norwegian wood?
She asked me to stay and she told me to sit anywhere,
So I looked around and I noticed there wasn’t a chair.
I sat on a rug, biding my time, drinking her wine.
We talked until two and then she said, it’s time for bed.
She told me she worked in the morning and started to laugh.
I told her I didn’t and crawled off to sleep in the bath.
And when I awoke I was alone, this bird had flown.
So I lit a fire, isn’t it good, norwegian wood.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
i was very upset today. when i was a girl, i loved the beatles, i even had a clutch bag (it was pink, my sister's was white) with their faces on it
i have 3 sisters and of course we each had a beatle
today at work my girlfriend was telling me when she heard the news about john lennon she kept hoping she had heard jack lemmon
i could not even remember the day he died. i was a wayfer damn it - 24 years old i guess - because 24 and 25 equals 49
i love music and musicians they free my soul
you may say i'm a dreamer.....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
johniam
I admit I was indifferent. That video of him singing "Imagine" while Yoko opens the curtains is a classic example of socialist hypocrisy. He says "Imagine no possessions, I wonder if you can." Well, gee, John. Maybe I could if I wasn't watching you wearing expensive clothes, playing an expensive piano, in an expensively furnished room, in an expensive building, on expensivbe land.
As an artist, he was great. George taught him how to play the guitar. He got the most out of what talent he had. I'll give him that.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
are you an arc ? :)
well good point in that i certainly don't think he was a god
like frankie valli
Link to comment
Share on other sites
pawtucket
That night I was on my way to buy my first VCR. I had waited until they broke the $800 mark. Well that sunday, there was an ad. I called and had them hold one for me. I had to drive to what was called the inland empire in SoCal. It was a 90 minute drive each way.
My radio couldn't reach any good radio stations so I was without radio for about an hour each way.
I bought the VCR and headed back. I had turned off the radio because the static was irritating, I never turned it back on.
I got home with this heavy VCR in my hands. I was walking through the living room and my wife was telling me about her day. Then as I was putting down the VCR to open the box, she said, "Oh and by the way, John Lennon was murdered about an hour ago".
I dropped the VCR. She made some comment like, "Oh well"
OH WELL!!!!!
I ignored that and went through the channels to find a news report. I was numb. The Way had made us think that people like John Lennon were possessed or seed boys. Well f* em, I was greatly saddened by his loss. His music was part of the soundtrack of my life.
"Help" was not just a song, it was a reflection of what I felt. He had a knack of writing songs that had meaning and substance. He was witty, he was perceptive. Fortunately, in the last few years of his life he got to live a very private fulfilling life.
Anyway, I listened for the rest of the evening to stories and accolades. It marked the end of the Beatles, in any way form or manner. (although the Threetles did play background for a few of Lennon's demos for the Beatle's Anthology)
I was amazed at the attention and outlaying of emotion all over the country and the world. I was equally amazed at the utter stupidity of leaders in The Way in the following days with their offerings to diminish the accomplishments of John Lennon. There was a "New Year's Advance", where I got earfuls of how the devil ran Lennon's life. That advance was the beginning of the end for my time with TWI. How ANYONE could diminish the murder of any person still astonishes me.
I am listening to "Because" by the Beatles on the Anthology 3 CD. Those guys could sure harmonize. He left a body of work that we can listen to for many many years to come
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
the devil and the artist stuff..... very mean and weird
****
way off topic :
some people on here still think the devil is involved in things (maybe things they don't understand)....
but if it's something close to their heart, then they say the devil isn't involved....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
mstar1
I was never a HUGE Beatles or Lennon fan the way some are, but still i always had great respect for not only their music but the impact that he/they had on our entire generation...
I was driving in a car with a wafer in So. Illinois when I heard the news on the radio. I couldn't believe how absolutely stunned and shocked I was, then amazingly saddened. The news completety sideswiped me. Although I would have never ever expected it to, , his death had a deep emotional impact on me.
I got very reflective and and reminissed (sp) with the other wafer who then got on his soapbox and spouted the company line about him being a seed boy--- oblivious to the fact that one of the greats of our time had been murdered. It sickened me, I stayed away for several days and mourned and then entered into a season that was a bit quieter and more internal than the previous one.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
man you grieved for a seed boy, i think you're a seed boy g oddamnit
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Tom Strange
my sentiments, feelings, whatever are very much along the lines of what socks and paw have already shared... I had been out less than a year at that time... but I remember the exact place I was and what I was doing... it was one of those times for me... it made no sense...
when I hear "imagine no religion" I always thought it was referring to all of the hate and bigotry and killing that wouldn't or never would have taken place if not for religion... I never took it to mean "imagine no God"...
ya think maybe he touched a few lives?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
dmiller
I don't like it when anyone gets murdered.
Life snuffed out. It's senseless, useless, heartbreaking. :(
I didn't care for John's *politics*, but I did love his music.
Best *fiddle tune* the Beatles ever wrote, was GET BACK.
It's easy to jam for hours on that one! :)
25 years ago, and no I don't remember what I was doing when I *heard the news*.
Probably was at twig that night. :unsure:
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WhiteDove
http://www.content.loudeye.com/scripts/hur...6900&cid=600111
Instant karma’s gonna get you
Gonna knock you right on the head
You better get yourself together
Pretty soon you’re gonna be dead
What in the world you thinking of
Laughing in the face of love
What on earth you tryin’ to do
It’s up to you, yeah you
Instant karma’s gonna get you
Gonna look you right in the face
Better get yourself together darlin’
Join the human race
How in the world you gonna see
Laughin’ at fools like me
Who in the hell d’you think you are
A super star
Well, right you are
Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Well we all shine on
Ev’ryone come on
Instant karma’s gonna get you
Gonna knock you off your feet
Better recognize your brothers
Ev’ryone you meet
Why in the world are we here
Surely not to live in pain and fear
Why on earth are you there
When you’re ev’rywhere
Come and get your share
Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Yeah we all shine on
Come on and on and on on on
Yeah yeah, alright, uh huh, ah
Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Yeah we all shine on
On and on and on on and on
Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Yeah we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Link to comment
Share on other sites
tonto
I had my infant son with me in our old blue van, doing morning errands. I turned the radio on, a Lennon tune was playing, and when it was over the dj said something about the late John Lennon...I couldn't believe it...it felt as if someone hit me in the chest. I had been a huge Beatles fan before getting into twi and I was so shocked and saddened to hear that he had been murdered.
BUT... then I "renewed my mind" and remembered that Wic-tor had said he was seed, plus, I wasn't thrilled with the line in "Imagine" about imagining there was no heaven, and besides, blah-coldhearted-egocentric-arrogantcultview-blah. That was one of the many times that I didn't listen to my heart but forced my mind back into the way's warped view. I am sad to say that week I even parroted the line I heard another wayfer speak "Imagine there is no John Lennon".
Thank God Almighty I've been free from that cult for 19 years this month.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
johniam
This past week saw 3 days in a row of negative anniversaries. Dec 6 is the date of the Rolling Stones concert the movie Gimme Shelter was made from where 4 people died and Hell's Angels who were hired to guard the stage beat up several people. Dec 7 is of course Pearl Harbor, and Dec 8 is Lennon's assassination.
I recognized 2 of the 3 by watching my copy of the Rolling Stones Rock and Roll Circus which has John Lennon in it. For awhile now I have wondered if Jagger had anything to do with Lennon's death. I read a book once called Up and Down with the Rolling Stones by a Tony something who was Keith Richard's bodyguard and heroin dealer. Although the book says nothing about Jagger having anything to do with Lennon's death, it does paint a desperate picture of Mick's frustration with having to compete with the Beatles. Seemingly without effort, the Beatles always outdid the Stones.
There's motive. His money is his means, and his opportunity was that he had an apartment right around the corner from Lennon at that Dakotas place. That could allow Mick to have known Lennon's comings and goings. Also, there's a brief conversation between Jagger and Lennon immediately before Lennon performs on the Rock and Roll Circus that is a little weird. I will always wonder about this.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
pawtucket
For those fans of John Lennon, iTunes is offering podcasts of the historic interview in Dec 1970 with Lennon by Jann Wenner, founder of Rolling Stone.
I've read the interview years ago, this is a treat to hear the audio. The interview is going to released in weekly segments for the next few weeks
Link to comment
Share on other sites
krys
Please finish your story Pawtucket: did the VCR work after you dropped it?
========================================
I was such an "egghead" in those years! I missed a lot of fun stuff. There wasn't much money in the budget to buy music then, especially when we had a number of FM music stations that played "good" instrumental music, which I preferred anyway.
WQXR played a number of such instrumental songs for quite some time after his death and I particularly liked one album done by the Boston Pops so I did buy that one. One of my favorites from that album was "Yellow Submarine" because it had some kind of instrument whose name evades me now - - but it had a slide-slap sound. That and some other Boston Pops "antics" made me laugh when I heard them. I think it took me a few months to realize what I had lost in not appreciating their music, so I was very glad they had left a lot of it. I've really enjoyed it since. My musical heart is a bit divided though....it's a toss up between the Beetles and Simon & Garfunkel. Call me strange if you like - - but that's the way it is.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ron G.
When Lennon was shot, I hadn't yet been introduced to TWI. I was working in a commercial photo studio and was absorbed to taking photos of offshore oil drilling components for technical purposes. I just remember passively thinking "another rock star done gone". I was kinda sad, tho.
I think maybe we all are affected when an icon of our youth, who is similar in age, passes because it puts us more in touch with our own mortality.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Stayed Too Long
Lennon was my least favorite of the Fab 4. After Yoko Ono came on the scene he diminished even more in my eyes as she seemed to be splitting the group up. It was difficult for me to image life without John, Paul, George, and Ringo, as they were such an important part of my life growing up in the 60's.
As time went on and I actually thought about the lyrics in their songs I was glad they had broken up. 'Imagine' was an eye opener, realizing they advocated world one world government and the abolishment of religion.
When Lennon was shot I remember asking myself why he decided to live in a luxery hotel and not give all his money away? If he was really for the rich taking care of everyone why did he need to wait for the government to take action? Why didn't he just empty his bank account and feed the masses?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
pawtucket
Yes it worked fine. The first thing that I taped with it was Tom Snyder's interview with Lennon from the early 70's
Link to comment
Share on other sites
frank123lol
I cut my teeth on the beatles.. Well when I was in the service I bought my first stereo an 8 track
with a bunch of bootleg beatle tapes.......
John lennon for all his faults was a thinker his music was thought provoking.......
The music lives on.........
Link to comment
Share on other sites
krys
another great name from the past....where is Tom Snyder? I miss his graceful self.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.