I am going to deliberately stick this in the wrong thread because it relates to 1976 and the memories of JN, specifically Ted Ferrell that year. I guess we didn't hear much from Ted for the better part of a couple of years, but I remember his "comeback" (if it was really one of those) at ROA 1978. I was standing next to the stage as part of the C of E choir, and Ted was appropriately introduced to sing "Ready to Go". I remember that well because everyone stood for him when he finished. Craig then announced, "you can remain standing and I'll tell you why". We then proceeded to sing the Hallelujah Chorus with our undermanned choir. Interesting because Craig explained the standing for that as a tradition and had no qualms about keeping this tradition.
Honestly I don't remember much from the meetings. I was glad to get loose for our interim year, f'sure. I wish alfakat were here to post for he was there & has a legendary memory.
alfie, are yous till here ? this quote is from evan
oops here's the beginning of the post
Sometime in spring or summer of '76, 6th Cork had the famous "meeting that never was". We were sternly threatened not to disclose that the meetings ever took place. Wierwille made dire predictions that the country was "going down the tubes" and y'all get ready cuz it's going down.
Thanks for the chorus to Freedom Soil. Yes it is a very powerful song. I believe, were it released today it would sell a LOT of copies, especially in the Christian Contemporary category.
I don't remember the whole song, but the chorus came to mind:
"And then the Captain of salvation,
Like a lighthouse in the night,
Guided me into the harbor of God's love,
He gave me shelter from the tempest,
He's the prince of peaceful seas,
Anchored in the harbor of God's love."
Maybe this isn't the thread fot it but.... It always puzzled me, to put it nicely, that TWI never even attempted to market all that music mainstream. That fact alone cast dispersion on the top leadership as far as I was concerned. None of their reasoning for not doing it made ANY sense to me.
People who wrote the songs should consider updating them and putting them out there. Yes, I'm aware of the way that TWI holds onto their copyright issues like a pit bull. However, anyone who wrote songs while working on staff can actually present a good case that could prevail (no pun intended) in court should they actually go beyond their lawyers strong arm threats.
Brian released Captain of Salvation on his post way tape Electrified.
Freedom Soil is available on Deans Cd - Look into the Word
If you are interested in one you can email or PM me here. Next year we should have a website up and running for all you old music fans. http://itiswrittenbooks.com is the address but right now all you can do is watch it snow and play with the Christmas Balls. Cd's should run about $6.00 for the older Pressed Down,Joyful Noise, Stevie Kay,Miles of Smiles.....Plus lots of new music from some old friends.
The whole country was cracking up that year: I don't think Way mentality was exclusive. There was a presidential campaign going on, at the tail end of Watergate and Vietnam, and everybody thought their way of thinking was the one to "Save the world". Remember Carter? He was the "Saviour" of the country. In 76-77 I was a college WOW: I took an American Experience class and as part of our final grade had to make a team presentation. I talked my group into a performance of "Jimmy Carter, Superstar" and got the point across. I tried to do my final thesis on "God's plan for America", but my college professor nixed it (closed-minded little twit!) I was absolutely affected by the Way push to save the country, but it was just a natural "solution" to the current issues of the day-nobody else was coming up with anything better, and prayer and turning people to God was as good a way as any.
Reading through this thread I note that many of us talk about the alleged, attempted overthrow of the US government. This is a prime example of how Way teachings were verbally communicated perhaps so TWI could never be held accountable for it at some future time.
I point this out only because during Waydale and Gspot there have been people who have *vehemently* denied the whole conspiracy thing took place because it was never documented in writing. (They say things like "Show me where it was written and I'll believe it"). The odd thing is that most of the people making such denials were in fact active Way members at that time so I'm not sure what investment they are trying to protect by claiming it didn't happen. Of course one sees this form of denial a lot less these days on the forums but there are people who do continue to seek ways to justify and rationalize VPW's behavior even if it means attempting to change history or deny that certain things happened.
I also place into this category the teaching that aggressive witnessing would hasten the return of christ. That was never written down either (to the best of my knowledge) yet some people deny that such an idea was ever promoted even though the bulk of people I encounter from that time know damn well that it was. There are other examples of this type of thing but these two come to mind since I've seen both mentioned here in the thread.
Speaking more generally. Even more disturbing were attempts to marginalize those posting their accounts of firsthand abuse by saying "Well I was in TWI for a long time and I never saw of heard of anything like that happening. Are you sure that perhaps you aren't confusing things or maybe embellishing things ? Where were you ? I knew Reverened so and so and he would NEVER do anything like you describe. And I was at HQ so I'm certain if something like that was happening I would have known about it".
Oh great. We all know the whole "lock box" thing and how like 10 people could see something happen only to be told to put it in the lock box so thereafter everyone denied that something even happened. This is the damaging thing about some folks who are still invested in TWI even if they long ago left. They still are protecting TWI and its leaders by perpetuating myths and denials about things. Again. I don't see it that much anymore but it was standard behavior at Waydale and the early days of Gspot.
My two cents is this: There is a difference between what people were told out in the field and what was being taught (at times) in the Way Corps. The intensity of fear increased if you happened to be with a Corps person who took all this stuff to heart and made that the motivation behind your actions. I experienced this in 75-76, being WOW with a Family Corps BL who thought the world was coming to the end any minute and we needed to spirtually behave the same way. After the Rock, for 76-77 I settled into a college town a thousand miles away, and the Corps leadership was just the opposite. Loving, encouraging, supportive, but not fanatical in the least. It is a difference in people and how the message was spread, or how the Corps people interpreted and then acted on the information they were given. It wasn't until I went into the Corps a full two years later that I heard any of this again, and again, it was a short time thing that went away.
I guess part of my point is that there was an awareness that all was not right in the world, and some people in the ministry took it to heart: but it was not an overriding issue. We taught the Word in fellowships, not survival skills.
They still are protecting TWI and its leaders by perpetuating myths and denials about things. Again. I don't see it that much anymore but it was standard behavior at Waydale and the early days of Gspot.
It happens enough.
There is a tendency among many to believe that "It wasn't like that when I was in". To admit that abuses were taking place means admitting that you were either evil for supporting the abuses, or stupid for not seeing them; so they didn't happen, or they happened somewhere else where they didn't affect where you where. Few want to admit to either being evil or stupid.
So we have those whose position is that TWI was a godly organization, full of sweet wonderful people, teaching 'God's rightly divided Word', until the day that they left
....a thousand miles away, and the Corps leadership was just the opposite. Loving, encouraging, supportive, but not fanatical in the least. It is a difference in people and how the message was spread, or how the Corps people interpreted and then acted on the information they were given....
This just about sums up the whole TWI experience. Personally I think they just never thought about how inevitable it is that this would happen.
The question is, did they just not see it or did they not care enough to see it. They being VPW and the second set of trustees. I just don't see Uncle Harry & Ermal Owens as the type to support the illicit personal gains the trustees experienced. It was not long after the time frame of this thread that Ermal & Harry died.
Both VPW and Harry shared publickly that he, Harry was the only person in the world who could get VP to rein himself in. They originally set up TWI w/three trustees, specifically those other two men, so that there would be a two to one vote that could keep VP "from doing some crazy thing."
I remember my first ROA..it was awesome..Remember folks had stands set up in the middle of the grounds so they could sell thier hand crafted items. I bought a blue leather bible cover with a white dove in the very middle of the front. I still use that same bible and have the same cover on it. It is 3o yrs. old...I remember my 2nd ROA and we had fierce storms.Dr.W picture ended up on the front page of the Way mag, he was holding an umbrella and still teaching...The whole grounds were nothing but puddles.I remember standing in my tent and holding it up so it wouldnt blow away.Yes, WAKE Up America..I was there too!! In the same time frame I went to a womens Advance..It was our area and Mrs. Wierwille came to teach us.The top of the Holiday Inn rotating restaurant, downtown Chicago..I remember her wonderful caring and graceful heart.Of course I still have our program that was handed out to us still in the original folder. Rev. Wren's wife was in charge. geesh, this is long ago. We probaly only had about 75 women attend. These were early days.
Like tonto, I was a wow in 1976 and also went to the American Awakes show when it came to our town...
I thought it was the best overall production that twi ever did...I remember getting a "lift" from that show that carried me through some tough times during my wow year.
It is a hard pill to swallow, admitting that no matter how you look at it we were ALL deceived in one way shape or form, just by being involved.
Personally, I don't think that VPW set out to build a cult. He did, however, relish the power & adulation of being "the man," who wouldn't? I think he just didn't control his lusts and allowed them to get the better of him.
Even though I, after working at HQ for so long and spending a good deal of time w/ him, never had any actual knowledge of the rumors of illicit activities. I "knew" there had to be some truth to it when he jumped all over Harve Platig's song, "The Man I Know to Be." I never really bought the spin he put on it when he said this was something true of all of us.
I mean like, of course, who among us is perfect? Romans tells us quite plainly that we will NEVER be "the man I know to be" in this life. From that standpoint, the song meant squat to me. BUT. Factor in what we've found to be the truth of VPW's behavior and we ALL wish HE were the man HE knew to be.
That song doesn't hold a candle to the ones we've mentioned in this thread, from this time frame we're talking about. To me it seemed a feeble attempt to catch the lightning in a bottle again. Was it just me, or did it always seem "dark" whenever Harve played/sanf that song?
America Awakes...
I thought it was the best overall production that twi ever did...I remember getting a "lift" from that show that carried me through some tough times during my wow year.
That show is as timely TODAY as it was then.
We're on God's Team was a great follow-up to it.
I'm wondering... have the relative TWI newbies EVER heard this stuff??? Have you ever heard these albums, songs we're talking about?
I doubt it hcw, when I was exiting in the mid 90s, all previous materials authors and artists were being viewed as *old wine skins*...if anybody left twi...their materials were pulled immediatly from the book stores....we were supposed to empty our houses of any of these folks productions.
We weren`t even suppsed to keep photos of anyone who left the ministry
I remember wondering how somwthing that had been such a blessing for a decade ..like recorded music and books that had inspired previously could sudddenly endager us spiritually.....just because the author had become posessed and left.....it didn`t make sense...the material was still the same as when they were *spiritual*.... it was just one more thing to put on the back burner untill I could understand a bit better.
I had been "involved" in the ministry for a few years. I would go on the road and come back to a place that I had rented so I could go to "twig". I felt that there was a "we know best for you" drive to have me give up the rock n roll lifestyle and go WOW, go CORPS. Music and I were one in the same. I could not seperate the two. I also wasn't going to quit my day job.
So, in "functions", they played JN and other "ministry" music. I listened but I was underwhelmed. Some of the songs were good, some of the playing was good, some of the mixing and production was good, but I felt like someone was stepping on the hose and not allowing the full force of the talent flow. There was something missing that made it sound canned, contrived, flat. I had a few opportunities to speak with various WP members. I was left with the impression that it was okay to sacrafice the creative flow for spiritual integrity. I just did not see it that way. I wrote, a few times, what I thought were family love letters of suggestions and feedback. I got a response or two that seemed to say that I just wasn't spiritual enough and my priorities were wrong.
I saw the America Awakes thing as a little over the top. Too much hype and show business. After all, I had been involved in the ground level financing through music of the Jimmy Carter campaign. Jimmy was a nice guy and had very strong beliefs, but I was troubled that such a "folksy" individual was going to be swallowed up by the very political machine that the government certain appeared to be. Lawyers and big business seemed to run the country. Laws were argued to support their position whether it was to the good of the people or not.
Back to the music....... I felt surely that if I went WOW or CORPS I would be definitely doing something musically. When a "leader" told me that the ministry had enough musicians and that I should commune with God about what my ministry in the Body of Christ really was. The Lord and I did have a talk. Although I never played music in a ministry function, I did serve as a twig leader, children's fellowship coordinator, and branch assistant. Every chance I had, I spoke to musicians in the WP group where we could discuss music, not religion or TWI and music. I found only a few who could speak to their art and artistry. Some had gotten what I termed "way-brain" where being a leader or a teacher in the ministry was more important than music-in other words they were living someone else's life.
1976- the year I THOUGHT about changing my life and going WOW. I didn't that year. Ironically, I went in 1977, the year of healing. Healing-that very topic, that next to music, was my passion. The area that I wanted to continue researching, experimenting and seeing come to pass before my eyes. And something I continue to teach.
I doubt it hcw, when I was exiting in the mid 90s, all previous materials authors and artists were being viewed as *old wine skins*...if anybody left twi...their materials were pulled immediatly from the book stores....we were supposed to empty our houses of any of these folks productions.
We weren`t even suppsed to keep photos of anyone who left the ministry
I remember wondering how somwthing that had been such a blessing for a decade ..like recorded music and books that had inspired previously could sudddenly endager us spiritually.....just because the author had become posessed and left.....it didn`t make sense...the material was still the same as when they were *spiritual*.... it was just one more thing to put on the back burner untill I could understand a bit better.
Maybe it was because the music was too creative. I wasn't around JN besides hearing their music like everyone else, but to me it was inspiring...maybe too focused on God for some leaders of later years. I did spend some time around Good Seed and know they came up with some good ones.
As far as the original question posed to start this thread...
...Yes, I was told that we were on the verge of "losing our country" back in 1976...All the previously stated conspiracy talk (Gary Allen stuff)...I also heard the same stuff. Supposedly twi came to the rescue and pulled the fat out of the fire at the last moment...same thing happened in 1980. (That's what MAL packs were all about...I was 10th corps)
During the time frame from 1975-77, many twiers attended John Birch Society meetings...I believe that Wierwille and Martindale both got much of their conspiracy info from them.
Perhaps the folks with the best insight in to that time frame would be the 6th corps.
Yes, I remember my spur of the moment visit to HQ in March 1976, just happening to pick the weekend of the big meeting at Emporia...so HQ was relatively deserted and rather cozy. Friendly too I might add; no hint of suspicion even though I was for all practical purposes unknown.
So Grouch...were you at Emporia then in the late fall of 1979 when we were given the "scoop" then that the country was falling apart? I was at HQ with VPW in front of us contacting someone who was presumably in the know about it, and letting us all hear the response.
I was in my first year in the Sickth Corpse (the 2nd half of the year). Evan - we weren't on our interim year when the meeting that never was took place.
VPW made EVERY Corps grad and interim year Corps come to Emporia for this "top secret" meeting. The reason I know that it was our first year was because I was in charge of assigning "Corps Buddies" to all the incoming Way Corps. What a dumb idea that was! I remember that Bob V!2nol@ was my Corps buddy. (in 2000 he was still in :(
Anyway, they all had to get there on very short notice - and anyone who didn't was out of the Corps. I think this meant the Corps in other countries as well, not sure (there weren't too many at the time).
I don't have as good a memory as alfakat - but I do recall hearing about the Communists taking over, heading for the hills, and buying gold. And if we didn't live up to the 5 Corps principles, run classes and witness, we'd be sunk. I do recall we weren't allowed to take notes. And Gawd forbid we told anyone about it - it was "lock box" information - and we all know what THAT means!
The 2nd half of 1976 I was a WOW in Pine Bluff, Arkansas. Awful, just awful.
I was in my first year in the Sickth Corpse (the 2nd half of the year). Evan - we weren't on our interim year when the meeting that never was took place.
VPW made EVERY Corps grad and interim year Corps come to Emporia for this "top secret" meeting.
No wonder it was so barren when I made my spur of the moment solo visit to HQ that weekend. I bet that was the last time they every had everyone at the place at a one table lunch. Or have they gone back to that more recently?
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Lifted Up
I am going to deliberately stick this in the wrong thread because it relates to 1976 and the memories of JN, specifically Ted Ferrell that year. I guess we didn't hear much from Ted for the better part of a couple of years, but I remember his "comeback" (if it was really one of those) at ROA 1978. I was standing next to the stage as part of the C of E choir, and Ted was appropriately introduced to sing "Ready to Go". I remember that well because everyone stood for him when he finished. Craig then announced, "you can remain standing and I'll tell you why". We then proceeded to sing the Hallelujah Chorus with our undermanned choir. Interesting because Craig explained the standing for that as a tradition and had no qualms about keeping this tradition.
But mainly I remember Ted's inspiring singing.
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excathedra
oops here's the beginning of the post
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HCW
Yo ToadFriend!
Thanks for the chorus to Freedom Soil. Yes it is a very powerful song. I believe, were it released today it would sell a LOT of copies, especially in the Christian Contemporary category.
I don't remember the whole song, but the chorus came to mind:
"And then the Captain of salvation,
Like a lighthouse in the night,
Guided me into the harbor of God's love,
He gave me shelter from the tempest,
He's the prince of peaceful seas,
Anchored in the harbor of God's love."
Maybe this isn't the thread fot it but.... It always puzzled me, to put it nicely, that TWI never even attempted to market all that music mainstream. That fact alone cast dispersion on the top leadership as far as I was concerned. None of their reasoning for not doing it made ANY sense to me.
People who wrote the songs should consider updating them and putting them out there. Yes, I'm aware of the way that TWI holds onto their copyright issues like a pit bull. However, anyone who wrote songs while working on staff can actually present a good case that could prevail (no pun intended) in court should they actually go beyond their lawyers strong arm threats.
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Lifted Up
I was at Indy with Good Seed that year and heard plenty of good music from them.
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WhiteDove
FYI:
Brian released Captain of Salvation on his post way tape Electrified.
Freedom Soil is available on Deans Cd - Look into the Word
If you are interested in one you can email or PM me here. Next year we should have a website up and running for all you old music fans. http://itiswrittenbooks.com is the address but right now all you can do is watch it snow and play with the Christmas Balls. Cd's should run about $6.00 for the older Pressed Down,Joyful Noise, Stevie Kay,Miles of Smiles.....Plus lots of new music from some old friends.
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topoftheworld
Thanks for the "Captain" chorus, HWC.
Looking forward to the web site, WhiteDove.
The whole country was cracking up that year: I don't think Way mentality was exclusive. There was a presidential campaign going on, at the tail end of Watergate and Vietnam, and everybody thought their way of thinking was the one to "Save the world". Remember Carter? He was the "Saviour" of the country. In 76-77 I was a college WOW: I took an American Experience class and as part of our final grade had to make a team presentation. I talked my group into a performance of "Jimmy Carter, Superstar" and got the point across. I tried to do my final thesis on "God's plan for America", but my college professor nixed it (closed-minded little twit!) I was absolutely affected by the Way push to save the country, but it was just a natural "solution" to the current issues of the day-nobody else was coming up with anything better, and prayer and turning people to God was as good a way as any.
We were all so young!
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diazbro
Reading through this thread I note that many of us talk about the alleged, attempted overthrow of the US government. This is a prime example of how Way teachings were verbally communicated perhaps so TWI could never be held accountable for it at some future time.
I point this out only because during Waydale and Gspot there have been people who have *vehemently* denied the whole conspiracy thing took place because it was never documented in writing. (They say things like "Show me where it was written and I'll believe it"). The odd thing is that most of the people making such denials were in fact active Way members at that time so I'm not sure what investment they are trying to protect by claiming it didn't happen. Of course one sees this form of denial a lot less these days on the forums but there are people who do continue to seek ways to justify and rationalize VPW's behavior even if it means attempting to change history or deny that certain things happened.
I also place into this category the teaching that aggressive witnessing would hasten the return of christ. That was never written down either (to the best of my knowledge) yet some people deny that such an idea was ever promoted even though the bulk of people I encounter from that time know damn well that it was. There are other examples of this type of thing but these two come to mind since I've seen both mentioned here in the thread.
Speaking more generally. Even more disturbing were attempts to marginalize those posting their accounts of firsthand abuse by saying "Well I was in TWI for a long time and I never saw of heard of anything like that happening. Are you sure that perhaps you aren't confusing things or maybe embellishing things ? Where were you ? I knew Reverened so and so and he would NEVER do anything like you describe. And I was at HQ so I'm certain if something like that was happening I would have known about it".
Oh great. We all know the whole "lock box" thing and how like 10 people could see something happen only to be told to put it in the lock box so thereafter everyone denied that something even happened. This is the damaging thing about some folks who are still invested in TWI even if they long ago left. They still are protecting TWI and its leaders by perpetuating myths and denials about things. Again. I don't see it that much anymore but it was standard behavior at Waydale and the early days of Gspot.
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jkboehme
Diazbro et al,
So as not to derail, I will start a new thread on TWI & US government surveillance of same.
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topoftheworld
Diazbro:
My two cents is this: There is a difference between what people were told out in the field and what was being taught (at times) in the Way Corps. The intensity of fear increased if you happened to be with a Corps person who took all this stuff to heart and made that the motivation behind your actions. I experienced this in 75-76, being WOW with a Family Corps BL who thought the world was coming to the end any minute and we needed to spirtually behave the same way. After the Rock, for 76-77 I settled into a college town a thousand miles away, and the Corps leadership was just the opposite. Loving, encouraging, supportive, but not fanatical in the least. It is a difference in people and how the message was spread, or how the Corps people interpreted and then acted on the information they were given. It wasn't until I went into the Corps a full two years later that I heard any of this again, and again, it was a short time thing that went away.
I guess part of my point is that there was an awareness that all was not right in the world, and some people in the ministry took it to heart: but it was not an overriding issue. We taught the Word in fellowships, not survival skills.
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Oakspear
There is a tendency among many to believe that "It wasn't like that when I was in". To admit that abuses were taking place means admitting that you were either evil for supporting the abuses, or stupid for not seeing them; so they didn't happen, or they happened somewhere else where they didn't affect where you where. Few want to admit to either being evil or stupid.
So we have those whose position is that TWI was a godly organization, full of sweet wonderful people, teaching 'God's rightly divided Word', until the day that they left
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HCW
Thanks for the info WhiteDove. B)
This just about sums up the whole TWI experience. Personally I think they just never thought about how inevitable it is that this would happen.
The question is, did they just not see it or did they not care enough to see it. They being VPW and the second set of trustees. I just don't see Uncle Harry & Ermal Owens as the type to support the illicit personal gains the trustees experienced. It was not long after the time frame of this thread that Ermal & Harry died.
Both VPW and Harry shared publickly that he, Harry was the only person in the world who could get VP to rein himself in. They originally set up TWI w/three trustees, specifically those other two men, so that there would be a two to one vote that could keep VP "from doing some crazy thing."
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likeaneagle
I remember my first ROA..it was awesome..Remember folks had stands set up in the middle of the grounds so they could sell thier hand crafted items. I bought a blue leather bible cover with a white dove in the very middle of the front. I still use that same bible and have the same cover on it. It is 3o yrs. old...I remember my 2nd ROA and we had fierce storms.Dr.W picture ended up on the front page of the Way mag, he was holding an umbrella and still teaching...The whole grounds were nothing but puddles.I remember standing in my tent and holding it up so it wouldnt blow away.Yes, WAKE Up America..I was there too!! In the same time frame I went to a womens Advance..It was our area and Mrs. Wierwille came to teach us.The top of the Holiday Inn rotating restaurant, downtown Chicago..I remember her wonderful caring and graceful heart.Of course I still have our program that was handed out to us still in the original folder. Rev. Wren's wife was in charge. geesh, this is long ago. We probaly only had about 75 women attend. These were early days.
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GrouchoMarxJr
Like tonto, I was a wow in 1976 and also went to the American Awakes show when it came to our town...
I thought it was the best overall production that twi ever did...I remember getting a "lift" from that show that carried me through some tough times during my wow year.
...Socks...You should be proud. :)
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HCW
I've seen that tendancy too, Oakie.
It is a hard pill to swallow, admitting that no matter how you look at it we were ALL deceived in one way shape or form, just by being involved.
Personally, I don't think that VPW set out to build a cult. He did, however, relish the power & adulation of being "the man," who wouldn't? I think he just didn't control his lusts and allowed them to get the better of him.
Even though I, after working at HQ for so long and spending a good deal of time w/ him, never had any actual knowledge of the rumors of illicit activities. I "knew" there had to be some truth to it when he jumped all over Harve Platig's song, "The Man I Know to Be." I never really bought the spin he put on it when he said this was something true of all of us.
I mean like, of course, who among us is perfect? Romans tells us quite plainly that we will NEVER be "the man I know to be" in this life. From that standpoint, the song meant squat to me. BUT. Factor in what we've found to be the truth of VPW's behavior and we ALL wish HE were the man HE knew to be.
That song doesn't hold a candle to the ones we've mentioned in this thread, from this time frame we're talking about. To me it seemed a feeble attempt to catch the lightning in a bottle again. Was it just me, or did it always seem "dark" whenever Harve played/sanf that song?
America Awakes...
That show is as timely TODAY as it was then.
We're on God's Team was a great follow-up to it.
I'm wondering... have the relative TWI newbies EVER heard this stuff??? Have you ever heard these albums, songs we're talking about?
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rascal
I doubt it hcw, when I was exiting in the mid 90s, all previous materials authors and artists were being viewed as *old wine skins*...if anybody left twi...their materials were pulled immediatly from the book stores....we were supposed to empty our houses of any of these folks productions.
We weren`t even suppsed to keep photos of anyone who left the ministry
I remember wondering how somwthing that had been such a blessing for a decade ..like recorded music and books that had inspired previously could sudddenly endager us spiritually.....just because the author had become posessed and left.....it didn`t make sense...the material was still the same as when they were *spiritual*.... it was just one more thing to put on the back burner untill I could understand a bit better.
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masterherbalist
Ah, 1976.
I had been "involved" in the ministry for a few years. I would go on the road and come back to a place that I had rented so I could go to "twig". I felt that there was a "we know best for you" drive to have me give up the rock n roll lifestyle and go WOW, go CORPS. Music and I were one in the same. I could not seperate the two. I also wasn't going to quit my day job.
So, in "functions", they played JN and other "ministry" music. I listened but I was underwhelmed. Some of the songs were good, some of the playing was good, some of the mixing and production was good, but I felt like someone was stepping on the hose and not allowing the full force of the talent flow. There was something missing that made it sound canned, contrived, flat. I had a few opportunities to speak with various WP members. I was left with the impression that it was okay to sacrafice the creative flow for spiritual integrity. I just did not see it that way. I wrote, a few times, what I thought were family love letters of suggestions and feedback. I got a response or two that seemed to say that I just wasn't spiritual enough and my priorities were wrong.
I saw the America Awakes thing as a little over the top. Too much hype and show business. After all, I had been involved in the ground level financing through music of the Jimmy Carter campaign. Jimmy was a nice guy and had very strong beliefs, but I was troubled that such a "folksy" individual was going to be swallowed up by the very political machine that the government certain appeared to be. Lawyers and big business seemed to run the country. Laws were argued to support their position whether it was to the good of the people or not.
Back to the music....... I felt surely that if I went WOW or CORPS I would be definitely doing something musically. When a "leader" told me that the ministry had enough musicians and that I should commune with God about what my ministry in the Body of Christ really was. The Lord and I did have a talk. Although I never played music in a ministry function, I did serve as a twig leader, children's fellowship coordinator, and branch assistant. Every chance I had, I spoke to musicians in the WP group where we could discuss music, not religion or TWI and music. I found only a few who could speak to their art and artistry. Some had gotten what I termed "way-brain" where being a leader or a teacher in the ministry was more important than music-in other words they were living someone else's life.
1976- the year I THOUGHT about changing my life and going WOW. I didn't that year. Ironically, I went in 1977, the year of healing. Healing-that very topic, that next to music, was my passion. The area that I wanted to continue researching, experimenting and seeing come to pass before my eyes. And something I continue to teach.
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Lifted Up
Maybe it was because the music was too creative. I wasn't around JN besides hearing their music like everyone else, but to me it was inspiring...maybe too focused on God for some leaders of later years. I did spend some time around Good Seed and know they came up with some good ones.
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rascal
I must be unsophisticated in my musical tastes...lol but I gotta say that I LOVED the music of wp ... I always found it inspiring :)
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GrouchoMarxJr
As far as the original question posed to start this thread...
...Yes, I was told that we were on the verge of "losing our country" back in 1976...All the previously stated conspiracy talk (Gary Allen stuff)...I also heard the same stuff. Supposedly twi came to the rescue and pulled the fat out of the fire at the last moment...same thing happened in 1980. (That's what MAL packs were all about...I was 10th corps)
During the time frame from 1975-77, many twiers attended John Birch Society meetings...I believe that Wierwille and Martindale both got much of their conspiracy info from them.
Perhaps the folks with the best insight in to that time frame would be the 6th corps.
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Lifted Up
Yes, I remember my spur of the moment visit to HQ in March 1976, just happening to pick the weekend of the big meeting at Emporia...so HQ was relatively deserted and rather cozy. Friendly too I might add; no hint of suspicion even though I was for all practical purposes unknown.
So Grouch...were you at Emporia then in the late fall of 1979 when we were given the "scoop" then that the country was falling apart? I was at HQ with VPW in front of us contacting someone who was presumably in the know about it, and letting us all hear the response.
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Lifted Up
At Indy that year the medwow group and other associated medical people was big...bigger than the rest of us there I think.
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Hope R.
I was in my first year in the Sickth Corpse (the 2nd half of the year). Evan - we weren't on our interim year when the meeting that never was took place.
VPW made EVERY Corps grad and interim year Corps come to Emporia for this "top secret" meeting. The reason I know that it was our first year was because I was in charge of assigning "Corps Buddies" to all the incoming Way Corps. What a dumb idea that was! I remember that Bob V!2nol@ was my Corps buddy. (in 2000 he was still in :(
Anyway, they all had to get there on very short notice - and anyone who didn't was out of the Corps. I think this meant the Corps in other countries as well, not sure (there weren't too many at the time).
I don't have as good a memory as alfakat - but I do recall hearing about the Communists taking over, heading for the hills, and buying gold. And if we didn't live up to the 5 Corps principles, run classes and witness, we'd be sunk. I do recall we weren't allowed to take notes. And Gawd forbid we told anyone about it - it was "lock box" information - and we all know what THAT means!
The 2nd half of 1976 I was a WOW in Pine Bluff, Arkansas. Awful, just awful.
Edited by Hope R.Link to comment
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Lifted Up
No wonder it was so barren when I made my spur of the moment solo visit to HQ that weekend. I bet that was the last time they every had everyone at the place at a one table lunch. Or have they gone back to that more recently?
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tonto
Hope,
I'd like to hear about your year in Pine Bluff...my sister lived near there and took piffle somewhere in that time frame, I think.
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