My first Piffle was taught live by Donnie Fugit. In those days we met 6 nights a week. We sang our own songs (mostly Fugit tunes) and all smoked during the meetings. Wild times. We occasionaly got California visitors on their way to & from Valhall (hq). I also visited the Bay Area that fall and went up to Novato to the former House of Acts and visited friends there.
So, whaddayawannaknow?
Your timeline above is a bit off. By '69, California had a active Way scene, but NY did not yet. Wichita got under way after Fugit returned from SF in '69. NY got underway, if I remember, in the summer of '70 by several different people who went there. I know Stefan Emerick went there from wichita. as did Tina Ranyak & Barbara Fair.
I got involved with the Way in North Carolina in April 1972 ... 'twas real weird here in 1974-75 ... Limb Coordinator came back from a year in the Special Corps (which later became the Family Corps) ... was caught in bed with a sweet young thing who later married ANOTHER Limb Coordinator ... story goes it was at a weekend camp at Betsy-Jeff Penn 4H Camp in Reidsville, NC ... I was there ... but the story goes that his young daughter (who's married and still in the Way today) asked her mom, "Mommy, why is Daddy taking a nap with K.....?" Needless to say, things were harsh and tense between the two of them, and you just couldn't put your finger on why ... later, we got a letter from Dr. Wierwille that the two of them had decided to divorce ... I still have the letter. That was one weird time here ... but later years and other folks told me that lots of wife swapping and adultery was going on with some of the Special Corps/regular Corps who were in residence in 1974-1975 at HQ.
I also remember being very "into" witnessing to help the Word go over the USA in 1975-76 so that it would not be taken over by the Illuminati. When July 4, 1976 came and went peacefully, no one ever said anything to us at the Limb picnic ... no mention of it ... made me wonder, "Did we do it? Is the Word over the USA?" even though I knew it wasn't, I so wanted to believe it was. Still have one of the notebooks they sold during the time preceding that .. white with a "Lighting the Way for the USA"/"America Awakes" logo. That whole conspiracy theory of history was very big from 1974-76 in the Way ... probably lifted from secular magazines who also believed it, but it was presented to us as if were via revelation ... we were young and foolish, and knew no better. I still have that book, "None Dare Call It Conspiracy" somewhere.
I do remember in 75 all the hoopla about Word over America and Joyful Noise was gonna save us from the devil and communism...and Toady---I still have that book...I find it amusing every so often...but then I have my first Winnie the Pooh book to.
speaking of that...I saw Cliff Eidelmann as acredit composer credit for the music on a Lizzie Maguire movie tonight...my daughter was watching.
I remember prayers a year long all about removing impurities and all this other stuff...Jorge Dieppa...do you remember doing that to a pinapple -- I do~!
Anything and everything you'd like to share with everyone,
except full names.
I do not know what I'll find, nor do I have expectations.
I'm trying to fill in the details the best I can.
Observations about local activities,
state-wide activities, national activities,
comments made on tape, anything.
My first Piffle was taught live by Donn1e Fug1t. In those days we met 6 nights a week. We sang our own songs (mostly Fug1t tunes) and all smoked during the meetings. Wild times. We occasionally got California visitors on their way to & from Valhall (hq). I also visited the Bay Area that fall and went up to Novato to the former House of Acts and visited friends there.
So, whaddayawannaknow?
Observations on local stuff plus House of Acts would help.
Even using the twi-released stuff, the timeline is inconsistent and incomplete
on that in particular,
and it seems to be important.
And did you actually call hq "Valhalla" or was that just this post?
Your timeline above is a bit off.
By '69, California had a active Way scene,
but NY did not yet.
Wichita got under way after Fugit returned from SF in '69.
NY got underway, if I remember, in the summer of '70
by several different people who went there. I know Stef@n Emer1ck went there from wichita. as did T1na R@ny@k & B@rb@r@ F@ir.
Interesting times.
Thanks.
I'll begin correcting my timeline on that the best I can,
I can't comment on House of Acts as I simply visited the place ex post facto. Saw Jim Wahl and a few other familiar faces. Others living there were actually in Ohio at summer school.
The Wierwille coup of Heefner/Doop was during "The Way Presents" in Oakland. Can't remember if that was '72 or '73.
Locally, our scene changed a great deal when Townsend came in the fall of '70. Before that we just met as a big group every night. Usually 100 or so people. Sometimes many more. That fall we split into 4 (if memory serves) large fellowships. I remember Claudettee and a number of other familiar faces in my memory of that. After a few more months we split into smaller fellowships that were later called "twigs". I'm thinking it was 12 or 13 of them.
These changes totally changed the communal character of what was happening prior to the changes. Before he left, Fugit started wearing slacks & carrying a briefcase. And we had weekly services at a local YMCA for the whole group.
In those times there was heavy opposition locally, particularly from a pastor at Grace Presbyterian. He lost a ton of youth to The Way. Prior to The Way I had actually gone there a few times and attended a summer camp with them. I'll refrain from using names, but a number became Corps, ordained, what not. Anyway, this pastor published a little study, authored in concert with a guy big in the Jesus People movement on the West coast. It was called "The Way: A Study in Biblical Heresy". I read it but can't remember it too well. Later, though, when reading the Martin blurb in his book on cults, I remember thinking that he'd taken his talking points from that earlier study distributed in Wichita.
In '71 or so I left The Way for a year and a half or two, so I'll have to leave that period of development for others. I'll just say that when i returned in '73, the look & feel of things was much different. More "corporate", HQ-oriented. Gack.
We sang our own songs (mostly Fugit tunes) and all smoked during the meetings.
Wild times.
We occasionaly got California visitors on their way to & from Valhall (hq).
I also visited the Bay Area that fall and went up to Novato to the former House of Acts
and visited friends there....
By '69, California had a active Way scene, but NY did not yet.
Wichita got under way after Fugit returned from SF in '69.
NY got underway, if I remember, in the summer of '70
by several different people who went there.
I know Stefan Emerick went there from Wichita, as did Tina Ranyak & Barbara Fair.
The Wierwille coup of Heefner/Doop was during "The Way Presents" in Oakland.
Can't remember if that was '72 or '73.
Locally, our scene changed a great deal when T0wnsend came in the fall of '70.
Before that we just met as a big group every night.
Usually 100 or so people. Sometimes many more.
That fall we split into 4 (if memory serves) large fellowships.
I remember Claudettee and a number of other familiar faces in my memory of that.
After a few more months we split into smaller fellowships that were later called "twigs".
I'm thinking it was 12 or 13 of them.
These changes totally changed the communal character
of what was happening prior to the changes.
Before he left, Fug1t started wearing slacks & carrying a briefcase.
And we had weekly services at a local YMCA for the whole group.
In those times there was heavy opposition locally, particularly from a pastor at Grace Presbyterian.
He lost a ton of youth to The Way. Prior to The Way I had actually gone there a few times and attended a summer camp with them. I'll refrain from using names, but a number became Corps, ordained, what not. Anyway, this pastor published a little study, authored in concert with a guy big in the Jesus People movement on the West coast. It was called "The Way: A Study in Biblical Heresy". I read it but can't remember it too well. Later, though, when reading the Martin blurb in his book on cults, I remember thinking that he'd taken his talking points from that earlier study distributed in Wichita.
In '71 or so I left The Way for a year and a half or two, so I'll have to leave that period of development for others.
I'll just say that when I returned in '73, the look & feel of things was much different.
My twi experiences began in western NY (near Buffalo) in 1975...
...Twi had sent six "in state ambassadors" to my home town for several months and I was the first and only person they got to take pfal...After they all left, I recruited several of my friends to take the class and we began a twig. There was no "oversight" and we regularly smoked dope and drank beer during twigs. After about a year, our fellowship had grown to about 20 people...it was loose and unstructured...everybody had fun. In 1976 I went out wow to Chicago and was introduced to some corps and began to see the legalism and heavy handed approach to dealing with people...I also began to see the hierarchy in action...
While I was out wow, twi had sent some corps into my area to coordinate the "new work" that had begun in my home town...Upon my return, I discovered that EVERY person had quit because of their experiences with the corps that had been sent there...there was NOBODY left!...
It was during my wow year that I learned from some 6th corps folks of the twi "doctrine" concerning sex...it was ok if you could "handle it"...THAT was good news for all the wows...We could only have 2 drinks but by gawd we could "bump uglies"! (I and my wow brother had found a bar that served 32 ounce drafts, so our 2 drink limit amounted to a half a gallon of beer each)...hic
;)
The twi "leaders that I was first exposed to were Johnny T, Randy A, and Duke C. My observation is that when twigs were self governing and autonomous, they thrived...when they were controlled by the heirarchy, they were stiffled and stagnant...
I can't help with the real early years, as I first heard of twi in '73. My fiancee (Mary V*nderw*rp), myself, and M*ke and J*ne Moody (both now deceased), were in a Jesus freak group when one Bill M*rton visited our fellowship, and "witnessed" to the 4 of us.
We went to his fellowship (twig) and stuck around cause we liked to argue about stuff.
The twigs then (southern Indiana) were real loose, and it was basically just hang out time around the Word. No authoritarian anything. If you were late to fellowship, you didn't get reamed a new one. They were glad you were able to make it.
I was living in a house with a bunch of the Navigator folks, and Mary was living in a house with the folks from the Lighthouse (the Jesus freak group), yet both of us kept on coming to twig, and we never got castigated for living our lives as we saw fit --- attending different fellowships other than twi.
J*hn and D*rcie Scott were the branch leaders then, and if I recollect correct -- sunday service was akin to a branch meeting, each and every week. Attendance was not required, but everyone came anyway. From what I remember J*hn and D*rcie were one of the few married folks, and no wife-swapping (or whatever) was in evidence.
Almost everyone else there in twi was a college student (Indiana University), and yes -- the twigs allowed smoking, though alcohol was banned until after the teaching.
When I took the class in '75, R*ck (or R*ch -- I forget which) Kenn*l was the instructor, and he was the first to demand *being on time*, but that was for the class so I didn't think anything of it.
There were a lot of new folks all the time. The prospect of learning the Word with plenty of lattitude was appealing to the college students. When J*hn and D*rcie left to join the corps (6th -- I think it was), the new *leadership* was more demanding, and kinda cast a pall over the whole thing -- even though that back then was better than what one might experience today.
Our twig kept meeting 2 or 3 nights a week, and having a good time. We did stuff together besides just meeting for fellowship. Sunday meetings however, started to get more legislative, and a whole lot less fun to go to.
I can't help with the real early years, as I first heard of twi in '73.
My fiancee (Mary V*nderw*rp), myself, and M*ke and J*ne Moody (both now deceased),
were in a Jesus freak group when one Bill M*rton visited our fellowship,
and "witnessed" to the 4 of us.
We went to his fellowship (twig) and stuck around cause we liked to argue about stuff.
The twigs then (southern Indiana) were real loose,
and it was basically just hang out time around the Word.
No authoritarian anything. If you were late to fellowship, you didn't get reamed a new one.
They were glad you were able to make it.
I was living in a house with a bunch of the Navigator folks,
and Mary was living in a house with the folks from the Lighthouse (the Jesus freak group),
yet both of us kept on coming to twig, and we never got castigated for living our lives as we saw fit --- attending different fellowships other than twi.
J*hn and D*rcie Scott were the branch leaders then, and if I recollect correct --
sunday service was akin to a branch meeting, each and every week.
Attendance was not required, but everyone came anyway.
From what I remember J*hn and D*rcie were one of the few married folks,
and no wife-swapping (or whatever) was in evidence.
Almost everyone else there in twi was a college student (Indiana University),
and yes -- the twigs allowed smoking,
though alcohol was banned until after the teaching.
When I took the class in '75, R*ck (or R*ch -- I forget which) Kenn*l was the instructor,
and he was the first to demand *being on time*,
but that was for the class so I didn't think anything of it.
There were a lot of new folks all the time.
The prospect of learning the Word with plenty of lattitude was appealing
to the college students. When J*hn and D*rcie left to join the corps (6th -- I think it was),
the new *leadership* was more demanding, and kinda cast a pall over the whole thing --
even though that back then was better than what one might experience today.
Our twig kept meeting 2 or 3 nights a week, and having a good time.
We did stuff together besides just meeting for fellowship.
Sunday meetings however, started to get more legislative,
and a whole lot less fun to go to.
Suddenly the Word wasn't the main focus anymore.
Twi was. :(
David
Just for curiousity, was Navigator a Christian group like Lighthouse?
I noticed the Christians J*hn and D*rcie weren't into spouse-swapping,
but, then again, they hadn't gone into the Corps yet.
But the wife swapping reference, Wordwolf, I'll comment on that.
In 21 years in the Way, including the Corps training, my wife and I never knew about that,
or had any invitation to do so, by anyone.
All these years later, I try to imagine if someone had suggested it to us - if anyone around us was doing so -
what my reaction would have been.
I can't imagine being talked into it with some kind of "spiritual" argument, as if it was somehow allowable from the bible, or some such crap. Because of course it couldn't be. Not to mention my personal committmnt to my spouse based on our love, no small part of any decision I would make.
Reading some of the comments over the last few years that crop up I wonder - if people did this, if they weren't predisposed to it anyway. Meaning given the opportunity, a slight nudge and a beer they would have said "Sure!" regardless of how it justified or not. I mean, it seems you'd have to be pretty dammed stupid to buy into it. Or selfish. I dunno, it's hard to picture or figure out.
Dunno. My story along these lines would be boring. No wife swapping, no wrecked marriage, no divorce, no remarriages 2, 3, 4 times, no kids scattered all over the country.
The Scott's were into teaching the Word, and running fellowships.
J*m McGee (sp?), and Ed W*atherall were at IU then, and there was one heck of a good music
group going on. :)
Like I said -- the Word was pre-eminant back then. If there were any shenanigans going on, I didn't know about them. Personally -- I doubt if they happened back then, since the twigs were Word focused, and not twi focused.
Dont know if this is what you are looking for or not, but here goes.
I heard about 'twig' during my high school years. Several people that I knew went there, but those folks didnt have the best of reputations. Most were known to smoke pot and do a few other drugs.
In fact, one day while sitting in 'study hall' with my best friend, Mary, she commented that if we ever went to that 'bible class' that we would probably open up a bible and there would be a joint in the middle of it. I will never forget that mind picture.... well, lo and behold, a male friend whom I REALLY liked asked me to go to 'twig' with him sometime after I grad. high school in 1974. I believe it was maybe March 75 when I went to my first 'twig'. It was laid back and very casual. B1ll Green^ was involved, as was Sh@ri, who later married JP.
I took the class May/June 75 and was pressured to go wow that year, which I did. I cant remember how many people were in my class, but I think it was the minimum, which was 7 at the time.
My wow family, along with 2 other familes, were sent to Lafayette, LA. B*cky (later married Donnie Fug1t)was Branch Leader. She had a family of 3 other women, one who had a son. The other family, as did mine, consisted of 2 males, 2 females. Sometime during the year, B*cky's family was split and sent other places, if memory serves me correctly. We went to NOLA one time when vpw came for an area wow meeting. I guess I wore rose-colored glasses because I saw nothing amiss. We finally got one class together b4 the end of the year. But now I getting into 1976.
damn it they pressured me into buying a 3 piece suit to go to sunday services even though i was and am a jeans and tshirt man, this was back in the mid 70"s. i bought one with 2 pairs of pants and a reverable vest
I did not hear the ‘depth’ of TWI-promoted (spiritual-political) conspiracy theories until I took the AC pfal in summer `75 in Emporia.
Such conspiracy theories as the Illuminati, Communist take-over of the USA, etc. were mentioned continually by VPW at this AC. The book, None Dare Call It Conspiracy,by Gary Allen was promoted. The book, Marxist Minstrels, by David Nobel was promoted. Tapes by certain speakers (?names) were played at this AC supporting the info in these books. The Birch society was mentioned favorably.
Also, nailed to a tree just outside of the cafeteria bldg, was a supposed listing (~? 15 items) of the itemized strategies for communist take-over of the USA.
In order to promote WOW, VPW endeavored to scare us into going WOW, stating that if we didn’t go WOW at that time, we would probably loose the USA to communist take-over.
{This blends into the 1976 witnessing push with America Awakes, etc. It also blends into TWI posting in 1978 in the Carnegie Library @ Emporia of the supposed newly drafted USA ‘constitution’ with communist leanings. It also blends into the Dr. Peter Beter tapes (regarding the supposed communist covert operations which had transpired in Guyana) played for the in-residence folks at Emporia in Nov-Dec 1978 (7th & 9th WCs)}.
I confirm what JK said about "None Dare Call it Conspiracy". There was also another book called "None Dare Call it Treason", and VPW advocated reading a right-wing tabloid called "The Spotlight".
Anyway, on to my experiences.
I was witnessed to on Jan 1, 1973. I was living in Alameda and the lady that witnessed to me took me to her twig in Berkeley where btw, I met our own Kit Sober. After a couple of twigs in Berkeley, I started to go to them in Alameda. I was loaned the book "The Way, Living in Love" and it made a big impact on me.
About 80% of the TWI believers were still in high school. Me being 21 and an Army vet with a car, a decent job and money was definitely the exception. Alameda was considered hot, with 3-4 twigs and its own branch.
I can't remember any promiscuous sex or drug use during this time. Most of the kids were underage and drugs and alcohol were actively discouraged. Lots of hugging, kissing and blue balls :D
Twig meetings started out once a week, with occasional "witnessing" nights. These were usually more of an opportunity to eat and play together than to witness. Once a month there would be an area meeting at the YWCA in Oakland. Del Duncan and J*rry C*rr*di would lead the meeting. Del Duncan had a remarkable ability to logically present a teaching in a very charismatic way. I can't recall *any* teacher, TWI or otherwise that affected me as strongly as he did. There was great fellowship after the meetings. I was pretty shy in those days and I really enjoyed meeting people I could be comfortable with. Something I still miss today.
The Jim Dopp affair was still fresh in many people's memories. It was also a "locked box", so I only heard vague references to it until I had been in for a couple of years. Probably for the same reason the Marin County believers were considered "intense" compared to us in the East Bay.
The "Way of California" office was established in San Leandro. It put out a monthly newsletter called "The Grapevine". I spent a couple evenings collating and stapling issues together.
By '75 things had started to change. We got a new branch leader who started sucking the love and life out of things. Manditory witnessing, more meetings, more formality. It would still be awhile before things got bad, but in retrospect the handwriting was on the wall.
I've probably left out a bunch of stuff, but hey, it was 30 years ago...
This is a tough one for me. Are my memories the way they REALLY WERE, in the mind of a 13 and 14 year old girl? or are they the recollections of a now middle aged woman remembering her childhood?
I went to my first twi meeting on 12-31-1970.........it was called THE WAY PRESENTS.........it was held in Oakland CA. I attended, but I was only in the 8th grade. A few weeks later, I went to our family's cabin up in the Sierra Nevada mountains and met some pentecostals. They talked to me about the need to be born again and to speak in tongues. In September of 71, I started high school and met some other kids.....within a matter of months, we would all be head over heels involved in The Way. It was not yet called TWI.
My earliest memories of the Way were like Jim's........(HI JIM!!!!), I am from Alameda too!~
My early memories may be true or not true........but they are mine. We were mostly in High School .......or recently out, or some of us were "ancient" like Jim and Kit..........oh geeze........all of 20 or 21.
I think what I am saying.........for people such as my self........now 48 and out of twi of 6 years on this coming Thursday (happy anniversary to me!!).........our lives have been complicated. How do we disect where our own life memories and history stop........where do our cult lives begin........how do we seperate them.......how do we begin to make sense of it all?
Heres some info from the archives, This covers a wide range of years, but theres some good info on the early years. I know WW has see this, but there's some newbies that may not have.
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ex70sHouston
I think I know what your fishing for.
I jioned in 75. THings were great and everybody loved everybody.
In Houston there was only one person from the corp. It took a couple of years before I understood and liked her.
There wasn't any real power strugle or hq only things that I saw.
The ROA was great and everyone shared.
The basic concept was bible study, holding the class, and taking classes.
NO PROBLEMS.
They started for me in 78.
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TheEvan
Okay, I'll bite.
I got in early '70 in Wichita. Whaddayawannaknow?
My first Piffle was taught live by Donnie Fugit. In those days we met 6 nights a week. We sang our own songs (mostly Fugit tunes) and all smoked during the meetings. Wild times. We occasionaly got California visitors on their way to & from Valhall (hq). I also visited the Bay Area that fall and went up to Novato to the former House of Acts and visited friends there.
So, whaddayawannaknow?
Your timeline above is a bit off. By '69, California had a active Way scene, but NY did not yet. Wichita got under way after Fugit returned from SF in '69. NY got underway, if I remember, in the summer of '70 by several different people who went there. I know Stefan Emerick went there from wichita. as did Tina Ranyak & Barbara Fair.
Interesting times.
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ToadFriend
I got involved with the Way in North Carolina in April 1972 ... 'twas real weird here in 1974-75 ... Limb Coordinator came back from a year in the Special Corps (which later became the Family Corps) ... was caught in bed with a sweet young thing who later married ANOTHER Limb Coordinator ... story goes it was at a weekend camp at Betsy-Jeff Penn 4H Camp in Reidsville, NC ... I was there ... but the story goes that his young daughter (who's married and still in the Way today) asked her mom, "Mommy, why is Daddy taking a nap with K.....?" Needless to say, things were harsh and tense between the two of them, and you just couldn't put your finger on why ... later, we got a letter from Dr. Wierwille that the two of them had decided to divorce ... I still have the letter. That was one weird time here ... but later years and other folks told me that lots of wife swapping and adultery was going on with some of the Special Corps/regular Corps who were in residence in 1974-1975 at HQ.
I also remember being very "into" witnessing to help the Word go over the USA in 1975-76 so that it would not be taken over by the Illuminati. When July 4, 1976 came and went peacefully, no one ever said anything to us at the Limb picnic ... no mention of it ... made me wonder, "Did we do it? Is the Word over the USA?" even though I knew it wasn't, I so wanted to believe it was. Still have one of the notebooks they sold during the time preceding that .. white with a "Lighting the Way for the USA"/"America Awakes" logo. That whole conspiracy theory of history was very big from 1974-76 in the Way ... probably lifted from secular magazines who also believed it, but it was presented to us as if were via revelation ... we were young and foolish, and knew no better. I still have that book, "None Dare Call It Conspiracy" somewhere.
TF
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washingtonweather
I do remember in 75 all the hoopla about Word over America and Joyful Noise was gonna save us from the devil and communism...and Toady---I still have that book...I find it amusing every so often...but then I have my first Winnie the Pooh book to.
speaking of that...I saw Cliff Eidelmann as acredit composer credit for the music on a Lizzie Maguire movie tonight...my daughter was watching.
I remember prayers a year long all about removing impurities and all this other stuff...Jorge Dieppa...do you remember doing that to a pinapple -- I do~!
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WordWolf
Then you know more than I do, there.
I'm trying to construct a more complete picture of the ENTIRE
history of the organization.
Each person's experience was different,
but I'd like a more complete picture of the ENTIRE time
so anyone who wants can get a grounds-eye-view of what
happened.
And yes, where there are trends, this will help make them
clearer, but I'm looking for EVERYTHING, not just the trends.
1975 in Houston, 1 Corps grad.
1975 in Houston, no power struggles, no hq heavy involvement.
ROA was egalitarian-everybody shared.
Bible study, PFAL and other classes, period.
When we cover the late 70s, I'd love to hear the '78 story.
I want to do this one thread at a time so the threads don't get
confused with each other.
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WordWolf
Anything and everything you'd like to share with everyone,
except full names.
I do not know what I'll find, nor do I have expectations.
I'm trying to fill in the details the best I can.
Observations about local activities,
state-wide activities, national activities,
comments made on tape, anything.
Observations on local stuff plus House of Acts would help.Even using the twi-released stuff, the timeline is inconsistent and incomplete
on that in particular,
and it seems to be important.
And did you actually call hq "Valhalla" or was that just this post?
Thanks.
I'll begin correcting my timeline on that the best I can,
the next iteration of it. :)
BTW,
what year were the House of Acts Christians
muscled out of things?
When were H33fn3r and D00p shown the door?
Hm.
The Life Magazine article was on something that
could be considered breaking news.
Interesting.
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WordWolf
Now, see,
that's something us later arrivals may not necessarily have HEARD.
In the interests of fairness,
I'd like a corroborating account from ANOTHER poster.
Did anyone else see that sort of thing 1974-1975?
Anyone heard that sort of thing 1974-1975?
(Remember you can tell me anonymously..)
There's something ELSE I missed. Illuminati?
Anyone?
I can't wait to compare accounts of THIS announcementto lcm's announcement that the Word was over the whole world
in the 90s....
I'm going to ask EVERYONE who was in during the Bicentennial to share on it
in the next thread...looks like we'll be spending a lot of time there.
(Thanks for the early warning.
I WAS planning on cutting the following threads to 5-year blocks,
with 2 threads per decade.)
What about these conspiracy theories, everyone?
Someone mentioned the John Birch Society once.
Then there's the Marxist Minstrels,
and some of that stuff.
PLEASE continue ALL your stories, no matter who or what.
(Just mind giving out full names, as usual.)
Please share what you remember with the rest of us.
Impurities?
Pineapple?
Please explain.
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TheEvan
I can't comment on House of Acts as I simply visited the place ex post facto. Saw Jim Wahl and a few other familiar faces. Others living there were actually in Ohio at summer school.
The Wierwille coup of Heefner/Doop was during "The Way Presents" in Oakland. Can't remember if that was '72 or '73.
Locally, our scene changed a great deal when Townsend came in the fall of '70. Before that we just met as a big group every night. Usually 100 or so people. Sometimes many more. That fall we split into 4 (if memory serves) large fellowships. I remember Claudettee and a number of other familiar faces in my memory of that. After a few more months we split into smaller fellowships that were later called "twigs". I'm thinking it was 12 or 13 of them.
These changes totally changed the communal character of what was happening prior to the changes. Before he left, Fugit started wearing slacks & carrying a briefcase. And we had weekly services at a local YMCA for the whole group.
In those times there was heavy opposition locally, particularly from a pastor at Grace Presbyterian. He lost a ton of youth to The Way. Prior to The Way I had actually gone there a few times and attended a summer camp with them. I'll refrain from using names, but a number became Corps, ordained, what not. Anyway, this pastor published a little study, authored in concert with a guy big in the Jesus People movement on the West coast. It was called "The Way: A Study in Biblical Heresy". I read it but can't remember it too well. Later, though, when reading the Martin blurb in his book on cults, I remember thinking that he'd taken his talking points from that earlier study distributed in Wichita.
In '71 or so I left The Way for a year and a half or two, so I'll have to leave that period of development for others. I'll just say that when i returned in '73, the look & feel of things was much different. More "corporate", HQ-oriented. Gack.
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WordWolf
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GrouchoMarxJr
My twi experiences began in western NY (near Buffalo) in 1975...
...Twi had sent six "in state ambassadors" to my home town for several months and I was the first and only person they got to take pfal...After they all left, I recruited several of my friends to take the class and we began a twig. There was no "oversight" and we regularly smoked dope and drank beer during twigs. After about a year, our fellowship had grown to about 20 people...it was loose and unstructured...everybody had fun. In 1976 I went out wow to Chicago and was introduced to some corps and began to see the legalism and heavy handed approach to dealing with people...I also began to see the hierarchy in action...
While I was out wow, twi had sent some corps into my area to coordinate the "new work" that had begun in my home town...Upon my return, I discovered that EVERY person had quit because of their experiences with the corps that had been sent there...there was NOBODY left!...
It was during my wow year that I learned from some 6th corps folks of the twi "doctrine" concerning sex...it was ok if you could "handle it"...THAT was good news for all the wows...We could only have 2 drinks but by gawd we could "bump uglies"! (I and my wow brother had found a bar that served 32 ounce drafts, so our 2 drink limit amounted to a half a gallon of beer each)...hic
;)
The twi "leaders that I was first exposed to were Johnny T, Randy A, and Duke C. My observation is that when twigs were self governing and autonomous, they thrived...when they were controlled by the heirarchy, they were stiffled and stagnant...
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dmiller
I can't help with the real early years, as I first heard of twi in '73. My fiancee (Mary V*nderw*rp), myself, and M*ke and J*ne Moody (both now deceased), were in a Jesus freak group when one Bill M*rton visited our fellowship, and "witnessed" to the 4 of us.
We went to his fellowship (twig) and stuck around cause we liked to argue about stuff.
The twigs then (southern Indiana) were real loose, and it was basically just hang out time around the Word. No authoritarian anything. If you were late to fellowship, you didn't get reamed a new one. They were glad you were able to make it.
I was living in a house with a bunch of the Navigator folks, and Mary was living in a house with the folks from the Lighthouse (the Jesus freak group), yet both of us kept on coming to twig, and we never got castigated for living our lives as we saw fit --- attending different fellowships other than twi.
J*hn and D*rcie Scott were the branch leaders then, and if I recollect correct -- sunday service was akin to a branch meeting, each and every week. Attendance was not required, but everyone came anyway. From what I remember J*hn and D*rcie were one of the few married folks, and no wife-swapping (or whatever) was in evidence.
Almost everyone else there in twi was a college student (Indiana University), and yes -- the twigs allowed smoking, though alcohol was banned until after the teaching.
When I took the class in '75, R*ck (or R*ch -- I forget which) Kenn*l was the instructor, and he was the first to demand *being on time*, but that was for the class so I didn't think anything of it.
There were a lot of new folks all the time. The prospect of learning the Word with plenty of lattitude was appealing to the college students. When J*hn and D*rcie left to join the corps (6th -- I think it was), the new *leadership* was more demanding, and kinda cast a pall over the whole thing -- even though that back then was better than what one might experience today.
Our twig kept meeting 2 or 3 nights a week, and having a good time. We did stuff together besides just meeting for fellowship. Sunday meetings however, started to get more legislative, and a whole lot less fun to go to.
Suddenly the Word wasn't the main focus anymore.
Twi was. :(
David
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ex10
nevermind, nobody cares :D
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WordWolf
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WordWolf
Just for curiousity, was Navigator a Christian group like Lighthouse?
I noticed the Christians J*hn and D*rcie weren't into spouse-swapping,
but, then again, they hadn't gone into the Corps yet.
That may be connected.
(Or it may not.)
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socks
My stories have too much dust on them.
But the wife swapping reference, Wordwolf, I'll comment on that.
In 21 years in the Way, including the Corps training, my wife and I never knew about that,
or had any invitation to do so, by anyone.
All these years later, I try to imagine if someone had suggested it to us - if anyone around us was doing so -
what my reaction would have been.
I can't imagine being talked into it with some kind of "spiritual" argument, as if it was somehow allowable from the bible, or some such crap. Because of course it couldn't be. Not to mention my personal committmnt to my spouse based on our love, no small part of any decision I would make.
Reading some of the comments over the last few years that crop up I wonder - if people did this, if they weren't predisposed to it anyway. Meaning given the opportunity, a slight nudge and a beer they would have said "Sure!" regardless of how it justified or not. I mean, it seems you'd have to be pretty dammed stupid to buy into it. Or selfish. I dunno, it's hard to picture or figure out.
Dunno. My story along these lines would be boring. No wife swapping, no wrecked marriage, no divorce, no remarriages 2, 3, 4 times, no kids scattered all over the country.
Boring.
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dmiller
THE NAVIGATORS . The link should answer your question.
The Scott's were into teaching the Word, and running fellowships.
J*m McGee (sp?), and Ed W*atherall were at IU then, and there was one heck of a good music
group going on. :)
Like I said -- the Word was pre-eminant back then. If there were any shenanigans going on, I didn't know about them. Personally -- I doubt if they happened back then, since the twigs were Word focused, and not twi focused.
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WordWolf
Ahem.
I called for EVERYTHING, no matter how small
it seems to you,
so long as it falls in the timeframe,
and you don't type full names so search engines
don't register the name.
It may seem small to you, but be the missing
piece to SOMEONE here.
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WordWolf
I'll be glad for anything you share.
Ok,
you were IN the Corps and heard NOTHING about it, no "if you're willing to take it" bs.
Hindsight is 20/20.
I'm trying not to judge those who indulged too harshly,
since I don't know what social pressures were brought to bear.
As to "predisposition", it appears as if this was like a number
of things with twi,
that people who were likely "candidates" were prescreened,
and that those who were more likely to go along were the
ones that were approached.
We DO know who started this talk (we have an eyewitness
account on the twi-Wonderland thread.)
I wish we had a copy of the "screening criteria", that would
be a fascinating read....
Seems that the twigs,
in your area and at that time,
didn't see that sort of thing going on amongst them.
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act2
Dont know if this is what you are looking for or not, but here goes.
I heard about 'twig' during my high school years. Several people that I knew went there, but those folks didnt have the best of reputations. Most were known to smoke pot and do a few other drugs.
In fact, one day while sitting in 'study hall' with my best friend, Mary, she commented that if we ever went to that 'bible class' that we would probably open up a bible and there would be a joint in the middle of it. I will never forget that mind picture.... well, lo and behold, a male friend whom I REALLY liked asked me to go to 'twig' with him sometime after I grad. high school in 1974. I believe it was maybe March 75 when I went to my first 'twig'. It was laid back and very casual. B1ll Green^ was involved, as was Sh@ri, who later married JP.
I took the class May/June 75 and was pressured to go wow that year, which I did. I cant remember how many people were in my class, but I think it was the minimum, which was 7 at the time.
My wow family, along with 2 other familes, were sent to Lafayette, LA. B*cky (later married Donnie Fug1t)was Branch Leader. She had a family of 3 other women, one who had a son. The other family, as did mine, consisted of 2 males, 2 females. Sometime during the year, B*cky's family was split and sent other places, if memory serves me correctly. We went to NOLA one time when vpw came for an area wow meeting. I guess I wore rose-colored glasses because I saw nothing amiss. We finally got one class together b4 the end of the year. But now I getting into 1976.
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coolchef1248 @adelphia.net
damn it they pressured me into buying a 3 piece suit to go to sunday services even though i was and am a jeans and tshirt man, this was back in the mid 70"s. i bought one with 2 pairs of pants and a reverable vest
didn't want to look the same every sunday.
lol
after all i change tshirts every day
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jkboehme
I did not hear the ‘depth’ of TWI-promoted (spiritual-political) conspiracy theories until I took the AC pfal in summer `75 in Emporia.
Such conspiracy theories as the Illuminati, Communist take-over of the USA, etc. were mentioned continually by VPW at this AC. The book, None Dare Call It Conspiracy,by Gary Allen was promoted. The book, Marxist Minstrels, by David Nobel was promoted. Tapes by certain speakers (?names) were played at this AC supporting the info in these books. The Birch society was mentioned favorably.
Also, nailed to a tree just outside of the cafeteria bldg, was a supposed listing (~? 15 items) of the itemized strategies for communist take-over of the USA.
In order to promote WOW, VPW endeavored to scare us into going WOW, stating that if we didn’t go WOW at that time, we would probably loose the USA to communist take-over.
{This blends into the 1976 witnessing push with America Awakes, etc. It also blends into TWI posting in 1978 in the Carnegie Library @ Emporia of the supposed newly drafted USA ‘constitution’ with communist leanings. It also blends into the Dr. Peter Beter tapes (regarding the supposed communist covert operations which had transpired in Guyana) played for the in-residence folks at Emporia in Nov-Dec 1978 (7th & 9th WCs)}.
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Jim
I confirm what JK said about "None Dare Call it Conspiracy". There was also another book called "None Dare Call it Treason", and VPW advocated reading a right-wing tabloid called "The Spotlight".
Anyway, on to my experiences.
I was witnessed to on Jan 1, 1973. I was living in Alameda and the lady that witnessed to me took me to her twig in Berkeley where btw, I met our own Kit Sober. After a couple of twigs in Berkeley, I started to go to them in Alameda. I was loaned the book "The Way, Living in Love" and it made a big impact on me.
About 80% of the TWI believers were still in high school. Me being 21 and an Army vet with a car, a decent job and money was definitely the exception. Alameda was considered hot, with 3-4 twigs and its own branch.
I can't remember any promiscuous sex or drug use during this time. Most of the kids were underage and drugs and alcohol were actively discouraged. Lots of hugging, kissing and blue balls :D
Twig meetings started out once a week, with occasional "witnessing" nights. These were usually more of an opportunity to eat and play together than to witness. Once a month there would be an area meeting at the YWCA in Oakland. Del Duncan and J*rry C*rr*di would lead the meeting. Del Duncan had a remarkable ability to logically present a teaching in a very charismatic way. I can't recall *any* teacher, TWI or otherwise that affected me as strongly as he did. There was great fellowship after the meetings. I was pretty shy in those days and I really enjoyed meeting people I could be comfortable with. Something I still miss today.
The Jim Dopp affair was still fresh in many people's memories. It was also a "locked box", so I only heard vague references to it until I had been in for a couple of years. Probably for the same reason the Marin County believers were considered "intense" compared to us in the East Bay.
The "Way of California" office was established in San Leandro. It put out a monthly newsletter called "The Grapevine". I spent a couple evenings collating and stapling issues together.
By '75 things had started to change. We got a new branch leader who started sucking the love and life out of things. Manditory witnessing, more meetings, more formality. It would still be awhile before things got bad, but in retrospect the handwriting was on the wall.
I've probably left out a bunch of stuff, but hey, it was 30 years ago...
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Radar OReilly
This is a tough one for me. Are my memories the way they REALLY WERE, in the mind of a 13 and 14 year old girl? or are they the recollections of a now middle aged woman remembering her childhood?
I went to my first twi meeting on 12-31-1970.........it was called THE WAY PRESENTS.........it was held in Oakland CA. I attended, but I was only in the 8th grade. A few weeks later, I went to our family's cabin up in the Sierra Nevada mountains and met some pentecostals. They talked to me about the need to be born again and to speak in tongues. In September of 71, I started high school and met some other kids.....within a matter of months, we would all be head over heels involved in The Way. It was not yet called TWI.
My earliest memories of the Way were like Jim's........(HI JIM!!!!), I am from Alameda too!~
My early memories may be true or not true........but they are mine. We were mostly in High School .......or recently out, or some of us were "ancient" like Jim and Kit..........oh geeze........all of 20 or 21.
I think what I am saying.........for people such as my self........now 48 and out of twi of 6 years on this coming Thursday (happy anniversary to me!!).........our lives have been complicated. How do we disect where our own life memories and history stop........where do our cult lives begin........how do we seperate them.......how do we begin to make sense of it all?
Radar
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Outin88.
Heres some info from the archives, This covers a wide range of years, but theres some good info on the early years. I know WW has see this, but there's some newbies that may not have.
http://www.greasespotcafe.com/ipb/index.ph...2268entry2268
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