Jesus Christ selected 12 followers that lived with him and were taught by him to become diciplened followers or disciples of his as their Lord.
Wierwille made up the way corps patterning it after the marine corps, at least some what. He liked the way marine corps were "gung ho" and would follow orders of their leadership. He wanted believers to follow him with that type of attitude.
I just saw on the news, where they interviewed some marines that lost limbs while fighting in Iraq. The reporter asked one marine who lost some fingers if he would go back to Iraq to coninue fighting, he said (I'm paraphrasing here) yes. They asked him if he thought the U.S. should still be there, he said it's not for me to decide but if my leadership tells me to go then I'll follow their orders.
The Way corps did much the same with TWI leadership, just following orders. But one major problem with that is that if the top leadership in TWI becomes corrupt, which I believe has been and probably still is the case, then following their orders may not be God's will.
See, we all are supposed to follow our Lord, Jesus Christ, who always does the Fathers will. As long as way corps are made to just follow orders from the top leaders without being allowed to follow what God's word says (correctly interpreted) or follow Jesus Christ's direction, imo it can't be fixed.
As long as way corps are made to just follow orders from the top leaders without being allowed to follow what God's word says (correctly interpreted) or follow Jesus Christ's direction, imo it can't be fixed.
Not Only the Cops but the entire organization is described here
You have to have leaders who follow God's will and second you have to have followers who are allowed to challenge leaders who aren't following God's will. TWI has neither
1) It was never a good program to begin with, so taking it back to what it was is still not "fixing" it.
2) There's no REAL education. The true Biblical scholars were run off because they tried to show vee pee the truth and the correct interpretations, definitions and lessons in the Bible and they were systematically run off by him and those after him.
3) Those responsible for the wrongs, injustices and doctrinal and practical errors of TWI are still in charge. RFR being first and foremost. She's been implicated on charges of actually procuring women for craig, lying on the stand and lying to the people of TWI about her involvement. She's not the only one!
4) Those in the top leadership positions have not been in the "real world" in so long that they've lost touch with reality and have absolutely no idea what the average person's life is like. You can't help people if you don't understand where they are and how to reach them there.
5) TWIts do not REALLY care for people. They aren't allowed to. There's a facade of it, but it's just a whited sepulchre. They refuse to get their hands dirty helping people like the good Samaritan did. He11, they don't even help their own, much less anyone else.
6) They really have nothing to offer people and their reputation preceedes them. WC have been so mis-treated themselves that it's painfully obvious to those who aren't WC. No one wants to put themselves through that.
7) Nuttin' - you get nuttin' to show for it. Dedicate your life to TWI (yep - to TWI - not to God) and they will tell you where to live, how to live, what to do with your money and time and you get nothing to show for it. ESPECIALLY, if you're full time and on their payroll - their benefits (medical, retirement, etc.).
8) You HAVE to tow the company line whether you agree with it or not - whether it's harmful to people or not.
I don't think it can be "fixed", but I don't think it ever was "fixed" to begin with.
Not Only the Cops but the entire organization is described here
You have to have leaders who follow God's will and second you have to have followers who are allowed to challenge leaders who aren't following God's will. TWI has neither
Right you are Templelady.
I was going to a church in Phoenix, where the head Pastor was asked to take a leave of absence because their board of trustees felt he was wrong in an area. Their board of trustees were made up of elders who felt he was wrong, they didn't kick him out, just asked him to take some time away from his duties for a while. Imagine if TWI's BOT's were accountable to a group of believers, who were acting on God's will. Maybe TWI could have been fixed.
but what about gathering togeter, help each other. Work as one. Establish as Way Corps Association or someting to rebuild the program, rebuild the fellowship and move The Word.
Gather them
Speak about the problems
Help each other
Improve The Way Corps.
Establish leadership.
This has already been done on some level at least. There are now a number of "offshoots". The reviews are mixed in terms of their success. Some people love them, other's would say they are ultimately no different than TWI - same problems still exist.
I have no problem *gathering together*,*speaking of problems* or *helping one another* (it`s called a gs weenie roast :P ), but you have to consider something .....that after being away from twi...most of us cannot figure out why in the world that we would want or need *leadership*...
What is it that you think establishing leadership can do for us?
What is it you think that an improved corp can provide?
Because I`ll tell you, that I think that everything we need is right there inside of each and every one of us.....we don`t need labels or nametags anymore.
So I am curious...... why do you want to fix corps anyway?
Do you want it for yourselves ... want to be in that elevated position of authority .... or are you looking to place someone in that position of authority over your own life?
Do you want to feel like you are part of some spiritually elite group...special, or are you looking for someone to be a leader....make your choices and decisions?
Well the bigger question is can TWI be fixed ? I wouldn't bother worrying about individual components of TWI since the larger entity , in my opinion, is pretty horrible and motivated by the baser instincts in life. In terms of the Corps program, I never felt that it was that "right on" to begin with. My worst experiences in TWI always involved some gung-ho Corps guy or gal who was hell bent on telling me what to do, when to do it, and how often. Were all corps people "bad" ? I don't know. I didnt' meet them all and while I did encounter some reasonably cool Corps people it seemed that they were subject to influence by those above them so that they would cop the necessary attitude to please their leaders. Again not all were like this but enough were to make not trust any corps people or discuss anything of personal interest with them because inevitably it would be related to someone else and would even later be used against you as evidence of your spiritual shortcomings. If you were in the Corps and you made some positive contributions then good for you. I'm glad to hear it but I won't sugar coat things to make anyone feel better.
If you're actually going to do this themex, I won't be able to make any of the meetings but I will gladly volunteer, here and now, to be the New Leader of the Way Corps program. What I have to offer is too much to write here in this brief post, but it will be in my next book titled "Me - It's All You Need". You can reserve a copy of this important work FREE of charge at no expense to you or anyone, by sending $45.95 American (to cover the shipping and handling) to me at FREETRUTH.com - Packed with tomorrow's truth today, it is sure to thrill the soul and will come with an unframed print of Me, the New Leader, completely free and at no additional expense to anyone.
It will include all the anwers to all the questions I've had, important questions, but no one else's as the questions other people have are, well, stupid to be honest and I intend to be a very honest Leader of the Way Corps. Not that any else is stupid, just their questions. Once everyone's read the assigned reading from this incredible text, there won't be anymore questions, peace will reign and I can finish my next book, tentatively titled "The AfterGlow - Stories of How I Helped You", which won't be sold in any bookstore and will be offered by application only, by sending $12.95 U.S. to www.myretirmentaccount.com - Do it today before you forget, please. You'll be glad you did, at some point.
Seriously ("is this thing on???") , I wish you good fortune. I get the sense you'd like to see something come out of what's left of the Way Internationale. Just don't plan on calling yourselves The Way Corps, as I think the Way International has sued anyone using the word Way in their name, titles, logos or websites and have become increasingly suspicious of all the "One Way" signs on streets everywhere which suddenly popped up RIGHT AFTER PFAL was filmed as if that's a coincidence yaknow, , and probably feel that they are the true spiritual owners of the word Corps, and have applications pending on the use of the word "The".
I believe a fundamental re-examination of the doctrinal basics surrounding TWI itself need to be re-examined. As long as they teach a theology that makes the MOGFOT concept possible, then the Way Corps program will always breed bunches of mini-MOGs.
(MOGFOT: Man of God for our Time) (mini-MOG: miniature man of Gods)
I see nothing in the world wrong with a group of people who want nothing more than to serve God with their whole heart, mind, and body. And give up all material possessions to enable that service. This exists in many different denominations. But the theology of TWI seems to draw some people (not hardly all) who, rather than embracing this kind of attitude of self-sacrifice and service, are seduced by power.
but you have to consider something .....that after being away from twi...most of us cannot figure out why in the world that we would want or need *leadership*...
What is it that you think establishing leadership can do for us?
What is it you think that an improved corp can provide?
Because I`ll tell you, that I think that everything we need is right there inside of each and every one of us.....we don`t need labels or nametags anymore.
Thou hast smitten the nail, on the head!!
labels and nametags!! Brrrrrr -- that's a chilling thought!
Maybe after that would could fix the "Hitler Youth" program. Gosh that was such a great thing (till it all got sorta screwed up, you know, later on). All those fresh, crisp, little brown shirts all marching inunison, thinking in unison, (sigh) it was so wonderful...
What might be understandable is getting together people who have a true love for God, his word, his son and his people .......... those people whose believing is simple and loving without condemnation.
Because someone was Corps doesn't mean they have it all together, and honestly I think the corps are some of the most hurt people I know, what they had to endure was hard and not all endured it well.
Just a note .......... if you want to share the word you can't only look to the Corps to do it, thats being a repector of persons to think the ex corps might be able to be fixed to share the word to those who were not corps.
Does the corps have more knowledge of the truth than the common man or woman who believes in Gods word. I don't think so. Most of what was learned had to be unlearned no matter what stage of TWI you were in.
To "fix" something, an assumption must be made that it was, at one time, NOT BROKEN.
I assert that the waycorps was an ill advised, half baked, unbiblical idea to begin with. It was screwed up from the get go and only got worse. The waycorps was an extension of Mr Wierwille's ego...Mr Wierwille took the place of the absent Christ and the waycorps took the place of the body of Christ (or at least the "household" of that body)...the structure of the waycorps and how it operated was unbiblical and only served to bolster egos and put people into bondage. Christ was not allowed to be Lord, Individual revelation, inspiration and decisions were suffocated with an ungodly hierarchy, and corporate policies. George Aars remark about the Hitler Youth program was definitely appropriate.
Fix the way corps?...
As Al Pacino once said..."I'd take a flamethrower to the place..."
Can it be fixed? I am with GrouchoMarxJr on this. It was always broken. On the other hand.
There were ego cases in the Corps, say 20% before they went in. A higher percentage when people came out because it (Way Corps) was broken. I believe there were so many people that had a great heart and wanted to serve God and his people but had no clue what they were in for. They believed all the meaness that was taught and they saw how some of their elder corps brothers and sisters had the attitude that something that came out of their body did not stink.
Thus some of the people changed attitudes about being wanting to serve too wanting to be served and that is what I believe twi wanted all along. Think about it. The attitude started with the "first corps grad" (VP) and he wanted to shovel it off on to the people who thought they were bettering their life for God. Instead it was to better the life of VP.
I'm getting like, NO orders on my books, even the ones I plan to write. Geez, I'm doing my part planning great things, you'd think...
themex, okay. A semi-cogent comment.
I think you can "fix" it, if fixing it is gathering a few or more people together who feel like you do and who want to figure something out for yourselves.
You do have a problem facing you though - any attempt to connect this to the Way International of New Knoxville is going to get shot down fast, if past performance is any indication. They're not going to have anything to do with a bunch of people that have left the Way ministry, or that they've kicked out, who want to somehow fix anything associated with THEM.
You can make the noble effort to offer, but it would be unrealistic IMO to expect anything from them.
To rebuild something of your own - hey, go for it. Like I said, I think it's counter productive to make part of the "fixing" to try and determine who of the identifiable "name" former Way leaders you're going to hook your train to for leadership. To me, that's a sign of weakness. Be your own leader, your own cause, answer your own calling. Or not, whatever suits you is fine. If you're inspired and you do though, then you have something to offer from your efforts and you've figured out where you stand instead of someone else telling you where you stand.
That's my take, which may be very off target of what you're about. You haven't really said much about what it is you're looking for or really want to do. At least for me, I can't get a clear idea of it. So I'm shooting what I got here. My thought would be - if you did this, you'll end up with something very different than anything resembling what it once was.
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likeaneagle
can you elaborate a liitle more? I think its an internal choice?
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Outin88.
Themex,
Thats an Interesting question.
Jesus Christ selected 12 followers that lived with him and were taught by him to become diciplened followers or disciples of his as their Lord.
Wierwille made up the way corps patterning it after the marine corps, at least some what. He liked the way marine corps were "gung ho" and would follow orders of their leadership. He wanted believers to follow him with that type of attitude.
I just saw on the news, where they interviewed some marines that lost limbs while fighting in Iraq. The reporter asked one marine who lost some fingers if he would go back to Iraq to coninue fighting, he said (I'm paraphrasing here) yes. They asked him if he thought the U.S. should still be there, he said it's not for me to decide but if my leadership tells me to go then I'll follow their orders.
The Way corps did much the same with TWI leadership, just following orders. But one major problem with that is that if the top leadership in TWI becomes corrupt, which I believe has been and probably still is the case, then following their orders may not be God's will.
See, we all are supposed to follow our Lord, Jesus Christ, who always does the Fathers will. As long as way corps are made to just follow orders from the top leaders without being allowed to follow what God's word says (correctly interpreted) or follow Jesus Christ's direction, imo it can't be fixed.
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templelady
Not Only the Cops but the entire organization is described here
You have to have leaders who follow God's will and second you have to have followers who are allowed to challenge leaders who aren't following God's will. TWI has neither
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Belle
Possible? Yes.
Likely? No.
Here's why....
1) It was never a good program to begin with, so taking it back to what it was is still not "fixing" it.
2) There's no REAL education. The true Biblical scholars were run off because they tried to show vee pee the truth and the correct interpretations, definitions and lessons in the Bible and they were systematically run off by him and those after him.
3) Those responsible for the wrongs, injustices and doctrinal and practical errors of TWI are still in charge. RFR being first and foremost. She's been implicated on charges of actually procuring women for craig, lying on the stand and lying to the people of TWI about her involvement. She's not the only one!
4) Those in the top leadership positions have not been in the "real world" in so long that they've lost touch with reality and have absolutely no idea what the average person's life is like. You can't help people if you don't understand where they are and how to reach them there.
5) TWIts do not REALLY care for people. They aren't allowed to. There's a facade of it, but it's just a whited sepulchre. They refuse to get their hands dirty helping people like the good Samaritan did. He11, they don't even help their own, much less anyone else.
6) They really have nothing to offer people and their reputation preceedes them. WC have been so mis-treated themselves that it's painfully obvious to those who aren't WC. No one wants to put themselves through that.
7) Nuttin' - you get nuttin' to show for it. Dedicate your life to TWI (yep - to TWI - not to God) and they will tell you where to live, how to live, what to do with your money and time and you get nothing to show for it. ESPECIALLY, if you're full time and on their payroll - their benefits (medical, retirement, etc.).
8) You HAVE to tow the company line whether you agree with it or not - whether it's harmful to people or not.
I don't think it can be "fixed", but I don't think it ever was "fixed" to begin with.
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Outin88.
Right you are Templelady.
I was going to a church in Phoenix, where the head Pastor was asked to take a leave of absence because their board of trustees felt he was wrong in an area. Their board of trustees were made up of elders who felt he was wrong, they didn't kick him out, just asked him to take some time away from his duties for a while. Imagine if TWI's BOT's were accountable to a group of believers, who were acting on God's will. Maybe TWI could have been fixed.
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likeaneagle
Most Way Corp have been so hurt..I hurt for them.Nor can I speak for them
I know what you mean...but the battle is not the in the flesh, remember we dont wrestle against blood or flesh.
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socks
Are you thinking of the U.S. or Mexico or both/all? If it's Mexico, you might get more of a
response on some of the other ex-Wayfer websites.
Sounds like an interesting idea. Have you tried writing the Way International
to see if they'd like to host a 2 or 3 day meeting to get this started? I'd be interested
in seeing any response. Maybe they'll come down to Mexico to help everyone get
back together. You'd think they'd want to, especially if someone else was doing all the
planning, thinking and set up - you know, the "work".
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Morgan
but what about gathering togeter, help each other. Work as one. Establish as Way Corps Association or someting to rebuild the program, rebuild the fellowship and move The Word.
Gather them
Speak about the problems
Help each other
Improve The Way Corps.
Establish leadership.
This has already been done on some level at least. There are now a number of "offshoots". The reviews are mixed in terms of their success. Some people love them, other's would say they are ultimately no different than TWI - same problems still exist.
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rascal
I have no problem *gathering together*,*speaking of problems* or *helping one another* (it`s called a gs weenie roast :P ), but you have to consider something .....that after being away from twi...most of us cannot figure out why in the world that we would want or need *leadership*...
What is it that you think establishing leadership can do for us?
What is it you think that an improved corp can provide?
Because I`ll tell you, that I think that everything we need is right there inside of each and every one of us.....we don`t need labels or nametags anymore.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So I am curious...... why do you want to fix corps anyway?
Do you want it for yourselves ... want to be in that elevated position of authority .... or are you looking to place someone in that position of authority over your own life?
Do you want to feel like you are part of some spiritually elite group...special, or are you looking for someone to be a leader....make your choices and decisions?
I honestly don`t see the attraction either way...
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excathedra
dear mex, please forgive me, but i can't even think about such a question
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diazbro
Well the bigger question is can TWI be fixed ? I wouldn't bother worrying about individual components of TWI since the larger entity , in my opinion, is pretty horrible and motivated by the baser instincts in life. In terms of the Corps program, I never felt that it was that "right on" to begin with. My worst experiences in TWI always involved some gung-ho Corps guy or gal who was hell bent on telling me what to do, when to do it, and how often. Were all corps people "bad" ? I don't know. I didnt' meet them all and while I did encounter some reasonably cool Corps people it seemed that they were subject to influence by those above them so that they would cop the necessary attitude to please their leaders. Again not all were like this but enough were to make not trust any corps people or discuss anything of personal interest with them because inevitably it would be related to someone else and would even later be used against you as evidence of your spiritual shortcomings. If you were in the Corps and you made some positive contributions then good for you. I'm glad to hear it but I won't sugar coat things to make anyone feel better.
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socks
If you're actually going to do this themex, I won't be able to make any of the meetings but I will gladly volunteer, here and now, to be the New Leader of the Way Corps program. What I have to offer is too much to write here in this brief post, but it will be in my next book titled "Me - It's All You Need". You can reserve a copy of this important work FREE of charge at no expense to you or anyone, by sending $45.95 American (to cover the shipping and handling) to me at FREETRUTH.com - Packed with tomorrow's truth today, it is sure to thrill the soul and will come with an unframed print of Me, the New Leader, completely free and at no additional expense to anyone.
It will include all the anwers to all the questions I've had, important questions, but no one else's as the questions other people have are, well, stupid to be honest and I intend to be a very honest Leader of the Way Corps. Not that any else is stupid, just their questions. Once everyone's read the assigned reading from this incredible text, there won't be anymore questions, peace will reign and I can finish my next book, tentatively titled "The AfterGlow - Stories of How I Helped You", which won't be sold in any bookstore and will be offered by application only, by sending $12.95 U.S. to www.myretirmentaccount.com - Do it today before you forget, please. You'll be glad you did, at some point.
Seriously ("is this thing on???") , I wish you good fortune. I get the sense you'd like to see something come out of what's left of the Way Internationale. Just don't plan on calling yourselves The Way Corps, as I think the Way International has sued anyone using the word Way in their name, titles, logos or websites and have become increasingly suspicious of all the "One Way" signs on streets everywhere which suddenly popped up RIGHT AFTER PFAL was filmed as if that's a coincidence yaknow, , and probably feel that they are the true spiritual owners of the word Corps, and have applications pending on the use of the word "The".
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Jim
If I join, do I have to do The Cleanse?
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markomalley
I believe a fundamental re-examination of the doctrinal basics surrounding TWI itself need to be re-examined. As long as they teach a theology that makes the MOGFOT concept possible, then the Way Corps program will always breed bunches of mini-MOGs.
(MOGFOT: Man of God for our Time) (mini-MOG: miniature man of Gods)
I see nothing in the world wrong with a group of people who want nothing more than to serve God with their whole heart, mind, and body. And give up all material possessions to enable that service. This exists in many different denominations. But the theology of TWI seems to draw some people (not hardly all) who, rather than embracing this kind of attitude of self-sacrifice and service, are seduced by power.
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dmiller
Thou hast smitten the nail, on the head!!
labels and nametags!! Brrrrrr -- that's a chilling thought!
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WordWolf
Well,
Belle already beat me to everything I was planning on saying,
so you can just re-read her reply and you'll have the essence of it. :)
Since she did,
I'll take this opportunity to address the initial post specifically.
(I think we're drifting off the subject.)
The question on the table: "Is it possible to fix the Way Corps?"
I think it is a good thing when good people want to do their
utmost for God.
I think it is a good thing to want to improve in that
ability. Training programs are a standardized way to
do this, and are more efficient than some other ways.
(Although programs sacrifice QUALITY and DEPTH for
QUANTITY and SPEED. That's something to keep in
mind with ANY program.)
That over-simplifies what they need to learn, but yes.Of books, they know they know less than they think they do,
and less than they CAN know just by going online.
The more important lessons are harder to teach in a
classroom, but some can be taught by DOING,
and some by listening to someone with those skills.
God's people need many things. The Way Corps learned
ONE of those things- give them The Word-
pretty well,
but it learned almost nothing of all the others.
Fixing that is NOT easy.
The biggest problem there is that each can only offer what
HE has, and the easiest thing for them all to offer is only
what they all already know. Unless exceptional measures
are taken, all that will happen is they'll learn a little bit,
then think they learned EVERYTHING.
When it comes to training, the LAST people they should
go to should be twi,
and the last people before THEM is each other.
More benefit could be found by sending each in a DIFFERENTdirection,
to learn from different people, different situations,
learning different lessons.
A few could go into OTHER Christians' programs,
most should just get out there and DO things and
try to work under, and learn from, quality Christians
who have never heard of anything they were ever taught.
That brings up several other problems.
I explained what the problem is with "gathering them".
You may just reinforce the BAD things they learned
and fill a room with them.
Some of them are convinced they received the greatest
training in the world, and ANY words against that will be
greeted with attacks and screaming.
That's what they were TAUGHT to do by example.
So, if you speak about the problems, you likely won't
get them to agree they exist and are actually problems.
"Help each other"- I answered this already, also.
The last two, I almost feel bad to tell you.
"Improve the Way Corps.
Establish leadership."
Overall, as a program, the Way Corps was a major failure.
The useful Bible answers can all be fit into ONE year-
which is what the college division did.
That left 3 years' worth of time where little of use was
taught. They did manual labor for twi and so on.
The other really useful things were dangerous-
rockclimbing and so on.
Not everybody who wants to do their best for God
should go rock-climbing-
which we've seen.
A lot of the remaining time was learning obedience
to leadership above them,
and learning to yell at people
and ignore their needs.
As for "establishing leadership",
I'd hesitate to trust any Corps grad to be a good leader.
Not all of them WOULD make good leaders,
and their "leadership training" made for
OBEDIENT "leaders", not GOOD ones.
And vpw and lcm wanted it that way.
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George Aar
Yeah, I think it's possible.
Maybe after that would could fix the "Hitler Youth" program. Gosh that was such a great thing (till it all got sorta screwed up, you know, later on). All those fresh, crisp, little brown shirts all marching inunison, thinking in unison, (sigh) it was so wonderful...
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themex
WE can do a Way Corps meeting in Mexico also a GS one, Cancun soon will be open again. I can do the logistics.
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Digitalis
What might be understandable is getting together people who have a true love for God, his word, his son and his people .......... those people whose believing is simple and loving without condemnation.
Because someone was Corps doesn't mean they have it all together, and honestly I think the corps are some of the most hurt people I know, what they had to endure was hard and not all endured it well.
Just a note .......... if you want to share the word you can't only look to the Corps to do it, thats being a repector of persons to think the ex corps might be able to be fixed to share the word to those who were not corps.
Does the corps have more knowledge of the truth than the common man or woman who believes in Gods word. I don't think so. Most of what was learned had to be unlearned no matter what stage of TWI you were in.
My Honest Opinion ................. Start Fresh
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GrouchoMarxJr
"is it possible to fix the Way-Corps?"
To "fix" something, an assumption must be made that it was, at one time, NOT BROKEN.
I assert that the waycorps was an ill advised, half baked, unbiblical idea to begin with. It was screwed up from the get go and only got worse. The waycorps was an extension of Mr Wierwille's ego...Mr Wierwille took the place of the absent Christ and the waycorps took the place of the body of Christ (or at least the "household" of that body)...the structure of the waycorps and how it operated was unbiblical and only served to bolster egos and put people into bondage. Christ was not allowed to be Lord, Individual revelation, inspiration and decisions were suffocated with an ungodly hierarchy, and corporate policies. George Aars remark about the Hitler Youth program was definitely appropriate.
Fix the way corps?...
As Al Pacino once said..."I'd take a flamethrower to the place..."
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justloafing
Can it be fixed? I am with GrouchoMarxJr on this. It was always broken. On the other hand.
There were ego cases in the Corps, say 20% before they went in. A higher percentage when people came out because it (Way Corps) was broken. I believe there were so many people that had a great heart and wanted to serve God and his people but had no clue what they were in for. They believed all the meaness that was taught and they saw how some of their elder corps brothers and sisters had the attitude that something that came out of their body did not stink.
Thus some of the people changed attitudes about being wanting to serve too wanting to be served and that is what I believe twi wanted all along. Think about it. The attitude started with the "first corps grad" (VP) and he wanted to shovel it off on to the people who thought they were bettering their life for God. Instead it was to better the life of VP.
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dmiller
All right!!! Weenie roast in Cancun!!!!
:dance: 
:dance: 
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socks
Pass the Marg - a - reetahs!
I'm getting like, NO orders on my books, even the ones I plan to write. Geez, I'm doing my part planning great things, you'd think...
themex, okay. A semi-cogent comment.
I think you can "fix" it, if fixing it is gathering a few or more people together who feel like you do and who want to figure something out for yourselves.
You do have a problem facing you though - any attempt to connect this to the Way International of New Knoxville is going to get shot down fast, if past performance is any indication. They're not going to have anything to do with a bunch of people that have left the Way ministry, or that they've kicked out, who want to somehow fix anything associated with THEM.
You can make the noble effort to offer, but it would be unrealistic IMO to expect anything from them.
To rebuild something of your own - hey, go for it. Like I said, I think it's counter productive to make part of the "fixing" to try and determine who of the identifiable "name" former Way leaders you're going to hook your train to for leadership. To me, that's a sign of weakness. Be your own leader, your own cause, answer your own calling. Or not, whatever suits you is fine. If you're inspired and you do though, then you have something to offer from your efforts and you've figured out where you stand instead of someone else telling you where you stand.
That's my take, which may be very off target of what you're about. You haven't really said much about what it is you're looking for or really want to do. At least for me, I can't get a clear idea of it. So I'm shooting what I got here. My thought would be - if you did this, you'll end up with something very different than anything resembling what it once was.
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