I'd guess it was from an early Way Magazine. I have wondered about that same thing. I did run the scriptures through a tape search for all of the SNS and tape of the months that VP taught. None had all the scriptures or even close to all so I would rule out those two options. The first I saw it surface was in the book Take a Stand for God-Chris Geer.
Thanks White Dove...That's a start for sure. I have a publication date of 1994 from Amazon.com for that book but it was not available there. It is a book by Chris Geer written posthumously for VPW. Anybody just happen to have a copy of that book, "Take A Stand For God", and can tell me the publisher, copyright date, and what the source Geer gived for Wierwille on that article? I suspect it is an old Way Mag article as well.
I'd like to get a copy of that book, too. I wanted to see another side to that issue and the book might have related information on it.
Eagle they come up on ebay once in a while. We sold all of the ones we had in the bookstore but Nancy Kent in the UK may have some from Gartmore left. I'll find her addresss and send it to you.
The book is out of print
The publisher Euorpean Christian Press The Way in Great Britain LTD ISBN 1 870676 40 8 Copyright 1993 The Way in Great Britain There is no source for the article.......
None on ebay today but the Our Times book is up for Auction I know Nancy has none of these for sure so if you want it thats your chance.
It also appeared in the Future Considerations Journal (also out of print)
Issue 13 May 1990 With a companion Article No Automatic Amour.
I only have one copy of that book, but I'd be happy to photocopy and get it for you. As stated, it is also in one of the issues of Future Considerations, a magazine of sorts that Geer published in the late 80s and early 90s. I may have that as well (and it would be an easier thing to photocopy). Contact me for details on getting it to you.
Dove, thanks for supplying the exact issue number. That will make it much easier to find.
In the meantime, I believe Geer went over a bunch of Wierwille's tapes and crafted articles from them for that magazine. Many of those articles were released in "Our Times," "Take a Stand for God" and "Turn Your Eyes Upon Jesus," as well as in "Future Considerations."
The Our Times book is mostly made up from reprinted Our Times Articles from the Way Magazines useally on the back cover. As Raf said the other books were from tapes and also Way Magazine articles.
Now Raf you are aware that it is a violation of the copyrights to reproduce those articles. ;) Either way Eagle sometimes things just show up at your door unannounced.
Sounds like Geer had this article and posted it in his Future Considerations before putting it in the book "Take A Stand For God". But Geer always copied an old teaching of Wierwille's so I was still wondering what the original source of the article was...the Way Mag?
The original source was most likely a live teaching. Mike might be able to help with the tape number, or if you have one of the old catalogues, you might be able to track it down that way.
Eagle you are correct it was printed first in the Future Considerations then later in the book All of the books that Raf listed were collections of things VPW wrote that never made it into print as in books that is. Chris just compiled them into one place. None of the books have any source or date for the articles in them. They could have come from live teachings,Way Magazine's, or tapes.
That article did not come from a SNS or Tape of the month I already checked for the title and the scriptures indexed long ago. That leaves a live teaching other than Sunday Services or TOM or a early Way Magazine which would have to be before 73 as I checked all the ones after that and some that I had from 71, 72 but I do not have them all from those years
In the meantime, I believe Geer went over a bunch of Wierwille's tapes and crafted articles from them for that magazine. Many of those articles were released in "Our Times," "Take a Stand for God" and "Turn Your Eyes Upon Jesus," as well as in "Future Considerations."
You guys provided all the answers, as good or better as I can,
at the moment.
I just wanted to add something on this comment,
in case anyone's curious.
In a large part, CG seems to have been (and is still?) a vpw worshipper in that
he's often treated vpw's "work" on a subject as if there's little improvement
that can be made on it.
(This is not ALWAYS true-he disagreed with policy on vpw as to whether
or not a tape-recording should include worship manifestations or not,
and his explanation was the first time I remembered hearing BG
Leonard's name. Further, he sought to improve the Advanced class,
and some of his changes WERE improvements. But I digress.)
As a result of CG's beliefs, CG spent a LOT of time editing vpw's
work for later publication. If memory serves,
"Order My Steps in Thy Word" was edited by CG and "written"
by vpw.
The book for "Living Victoriously" worked the same way,
except it MENTIONED CG editing it.
If it was representative of his work in general,
then he printed all the substance and trimmed out
insults and occasional cheapshots.
(The taped "Living Victorously" contains cheapshots
and insults not contained in the book, but much of
the rest is word-for-word. Except for announcements
and other taped comments not germane to the teaching.)
CG published several books like this, compilations of
things vpw taught-
"Take God at His Word",
"Turn Your Eyes Upon Jesus"
"Our Times"
and so on.
The timing of "Future Considerations" coming out seemed to me
to have been dictated.
Right after lcm drew his line in the sand and said
"no more soup for you" (and thus "no way magazine for you"),
CG came out with an alternative.
The format was explained in either the first issue or in a cover
letter included. I still remember the description/
Future Considerations had up to 3 parts per issue,
The journal future Considerations was discontinued with the closing of Gartmore House. Glimpses of Truth is the new Journal. Oh yeah,there was one more part to the 1st journal that continues in the new one. On the Way articles.
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WhiteDove
Eagle
I'd guess it was from an early Way Magazine. I have wondered about that same thing. I did run the scriptures through a tape search for all of the SNS and tape of the months that VP taught. None had all the scriptures or even close to all so I would rule out those two options. The first I saw it surface was in the book Take a Stand for God-Chris Geer.
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Eagle
Thanks White Dove...That's a start for sure. I have a publication date of 1994 from Amazon.com for that book but it was not available there. It is a book by Chris Geer written posthumously for VPW. Anybody just happen to have a copy of that book, "Take A Stand For God", and can tell me the publisher, copyright date, and what the source Geer gived for Wierwille on that article? I suspect it is an old Way Mag article as well.
I'd like to get a copy of that book, too. I wanted to see another side to that issue and the book might have related information on it.
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WhiteDove
Eagle they come up on ebay once in a while. We sold all of the ones we had in the bookstore but Nancy Kent in the UK may have some from Gartmore left. I'll find her addresss and send it to you.
The book is out of print
The publisher Euorpean Christian Press The Way in Great Britain LTD ISBN 1 870676 40 8 Copyright 1993 The Way in Great Britain There is no source for the article.......
None on ebay today but the Our Times book is up for Auction I know Nancy has none of these for sure so if you want it thats your chance.
It also appeared in the Future Considerations Journal (also out of print)
Issue 13 May 1990 With a companion Article No Automatic Amour.
I have both the Journal and the book.
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Raf
Eagle,
I only have one copy of that book, but I'd be happy to photocopy and get it for you. As stated, it is also in one of the issues of Future Considerations, a magazine of sorts that Geer published in the late 80s and early 90s. I may have that as well (and it would be an easier thing to photocopy). Contact me for details on getting it to you.
Dove, thanks for supplying the exact issue number. That will make it much easier to find.
In the meantime, I believe Geer went over a bunch of Wierwille's tapes and crafted articles from them for that magazine. Many of those articles were released in "Our Times," "Take a Stand for God" and "Turn Your Eyes Upon Jesus," as well as in "Future Considerations."
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WhiteDove
Added info
The Our Times book is mostly made up from reprinted Our Times Articles from the Way Magazines useally on the back cover. As Raf said the other books were from tapes and also Way Magazine articles.
Now Raf you are aware that it is a violation of the copyrights to reproduce those articles. ;) Either way Eagle sometimes things just show up at your door unannounced.
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Raf
Come and get me.
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Eagle
Thanks White Dove and Raf,
Raf, I posted a PM to you.
Sounds like Geer had this article and posted it in his Future Considerations before putting it in the book "Take A Stand For God". But Geer always copied an old teaching of Wierwille's so I was still wondering what the original source of the article was...the Way Mag?
Thanks for helping...
Eagle
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Raf
The original source was most likely a live teaching. Mike might be able to help with the tape number, or if you have one of the old catalogues, you might be able to track it down that way.
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WhiteDove
Eagle you are correct it was printed first in the Future Considerations then later in the book All of the books that Raf listed were collections of things VPW wrote that never made it into print as in books that is. Chris just compiled them into one place. None of the books have any source or date for the articles in them. They could have come from live teachings,Way Magazine's, or tapes.
That article did not come from a SNS or Tape of the month I already checked for the title and the scriptures indexed long ago. That leaves a live teaching other than Sunday Services or TOM or a early Way Magazine which would have to be before 73 as I checked all the ones after that and some that I had from 71, 72 but I do not have them all from those years
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WordWolf
You guys provided all the answers, as good or better as I can,
at the moment.
I just wanted to add something on this comment,
in case anyone's curious.
In a large part, CG seems to have been (and is still?) a vpw worshipper in that
he's often treated vpw's "work" on a subject as if there's little improvement
that can be made on it.
(This is not ALWAYS true-he disagreed with policy on vpw as to whether
or not a tape-recording should include worship manifestations or not,
and his explanation was the first time I remembered hearing BG
Leonard's name. Further, he sought to improve the Advanced class,
and some of his changes WERE improvements. But I digress.)
As a result of CG's beliefs, CG spent a LOT of time editing vpw's
work for later publication. If memory serves,
"Order My Steps in Thy Word" was edited by CG and "written"
by vpw.
The book for "Living Victoriously" worked the same way,
except it MENTIONED CG editing it.
If it was representative of his work in general,
then he printed all the substance and trimmed out
insults and occasional cheapshots.
(The taped "Living Victorously" contains cheapshots
and insults not contained in the book, but much of
the rest is word-for-word. Except for announcements
and other taped comments not germane to the teaching.)
CG published several books like this, compilations of
things vpw taught-
"Take God at His Word",
"Turn Your Eyes Upon Jesus"
"Our Times"
and so on.
The timing of "Future Considerations" coming out seemed to me
to have been dictated.
Right after lcm drew his line in the sand and said
"no more soup for you" (and thus "no way magazine for you"),
CG came out with an alternative.
The format was explained in either the first issue or in a cover
letter included. I still remember the description/
Future Considerations had up to 3 parts per issue,
and they varied issue to issue.
"D'beni Baita" was from the Aramaic for
"from the household".
This was announcements,
and was usually the smallest part.
"Ek tou didaskalou" was from the Greek for
"from the teacher".
This was an article edited by CG and
"written by" vpw.
"Ek tou logou" was from the Greek for
"from the Word."
This was an article by CG, but, based on the
description, could be by anyone EXCEPT
vpw, who had his own category.
Early issues seemed to be almost all
"Ek tou didaskalou".
Later issues often were all
"Ek tou logou",
like the 8-parter on Abraham
that included every verse on him in
Scripture.
(It was called "an introductory study"
on him, but it was basically book length
in total. That bugged me by the start of
Part 5.)
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WhiteDove
The journal future Considerations was discontinued with the closing of Gartmore House. Glimpses of Truth is the new Journal. Oh yeah,there was one more part to the 1st journal that continues in the new one. On the Way articles.
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