I think you answered your own question in saying it is doing it to itself.
The world is full of places for the sane and the insane alike to gather and unfortunately there are enough insane ones still in TWI to keep it going for awhile IMHO.
The best we can do is show some that there is, as God say's, always a way to escape. This site has already done wonders in setting people free from them. It's your's and other peoples stories and the continuing information of what is really going on that will feed peoples brain and allow them to realize the subtleness of the hypocrisy that is at work there.
So in my opinion the best thing to do is post and make current members aware of what is really going on and believe that there eyes can be opened. And for the insane ones, well, it's better to keep your enemy in one place were you can see them instead of scattering them about were you might not.
IMHO...alot of people that are confronted or even confronting themselves in this type of scenereo, have either themselves & their FRIENDS & their families to listen to & objectively choose....or they have "leadership" & farm buildings & auditoriums to help them make up their minds..."The Ministry" doesn't encourage people to "trust" their families...but instead to trust them (the leaders)...when you boil itright down..I think the only hope any of them have (since there is such great pressure put on them via leadership) is whether they can be true to themselves. Some people have GREAT difficulty with this concept..but I feel its at the ROOT of a good decision..
Claiming that folks file law suits because they are *out to destroy the ministry* is a way to deflect attention of the believers from considering the illegal conduct that brings the law suits to court in the first place.........TWI wouldnt want the followers to consider that people file lawsuits because twi has committed crimes according to the laws of this country and will be forced to face the consequences of their flagrant abuse.
As far as what I would do? Nobody could do a better job of destroying twi than mr.martindale
OK, so I allowed an easy out in my original question. Forget about the self destructive nature of the organization. What can be done to speed along the process?
If you want it to go down fast, a good class action suit (fraud, racketeering, etc) with about 500 people getting about $100,000 each should just about eat up the BOD's little pot of gold.
But, TWI Inc. will never completely go down as long as that 50 million or so is controlled by Rosie and the gang. They will live in relative comfort the rest of their lives no matter how many leave or stop their ABS.
If they dwindled down to only 50 supporters and only had meetings once a month, they would still have control of most of the the cash and assets that we provided them over the years to "move the word".
They'll just convert the assets/property to cash and downsize to a small but nice facility somewhere in the Cayman's or the Bahamas where they can publish "The Way Magazine" 6 times a year (for their 50 supporters) while living comfortably ( with servants) off of the interest and maintaining their tax exempt, non-profit status.
If you want it to go down fast, a good class action suit (fraud, racketeering, etc) with about 500 people getting about $100,000 each should just about eat up the BOD's little pot of gold.
Could one plausibly argue such a case?
But, TWI Inc. will never completely go down as long as that 50 million or so is controlled by Rosie and the gang.
Where does the $50,000,000 figure come from? Fact or guestimate?
OK, so I allowed an easy out in my original question. Forget about the self destructive nature of the organization. What can be done to speed along the process?
I thought TWI would self destruct by the early 90's.... :huh:
Unfortunately, as you mentioned shortfuse, there are those that believe TWI's lies like it's satan trying to destroy the ministry via lawsuits. Or we "cop-outs" are possed or some such nonsense!
speak the truth in love to those that still stand with the cult, maybe they'll wake up to the truth and leave. Thats probably the best we can do to help "speed along the process".
Of course, in due time it will destroy itself; but as some have said, the "leadership" will retire to the Caymans and laugh (until they got tired of each other and no one to boss around and abuse).
But, in reality, the way to speed it up is to do three things:
1. Class action lawsuit to recoup any and all "abundant sharing" - could very possibly work, but if not would seriously expose the financial end of things.
2. Get the government involved. IRS and Department of Labor to start. Seriously challenge their non-profit status. I assure you that if the government looked even just below the surface there would be strong evidence of rackettering, conspiracy, tax fraud and many other interesting things. My only fear in this approach is the reaction of twi - would they go the 'kool aid' route? or the branch davidian route?
3. Continue to offer help, advice, and support to innies and "just outies" to show that greasespot (and the rest of the world for that matter) is filled with love and that your relationship with God grows tremendously after you are released from bondage. And that the real truth does not reside with twi, but rather in a person's own relationship with God...and that truth lies in many places outside twi...but NOT there.
There is nothing I would like more than to speed up twi's demise. But, in the process I want those held accountable who operate this scam and destroy lives. I want jail time and I want all the money back for those who have been hurt.
Like Goey said...it's all about the money. Nothing short of a class action lawsuit would put a dent in twi's assets...
...but the organization itself, has disintigrated to the point of no return...it's a hollow shell, nothing inside but misery and lies...and the illusion that twi tries to present, is becoming increasingly more difficult to pass off as even remotely viable. With the numbers getting even smaller, look for more downsizing to occur.
The figures represented in TWI's financial statement do not relect any funds hiddin in offshore accounts (should they actually exist).
The problem with a class action suit is getting enough relatively recently outed/quit ex-wayfers to unify and actually do it. There have been rumors for a couple of years of a class action suit, but nothing has ever come of them. Doubt there ever will.
While the BOD will probably live in relative comfort for the rest of their lives on the money that all of us gave to "move the word", we can take some comfort in knowing that thanks to the bone-headed actions of Martindale, Rivenbark, and a few others, that TWI is washed up as any kind of "ministry" and will continue to decline in numbers as they have nothing to offer or attract any new mullets. At least their poison has been contained.
GSpot has been invaluable for people looking into TWI before getting involved and for those sensing that something's "just not quite right".
The more we can get the word out there and warn people, the less likely they are going to be to have fresh meat to abuse and destroy.
Those billboards were great and there needs to be a way to make people without computers or internet know-how aware of TWI and all the lies. I just don't know how to do that without spending tons of money we don't have.
The problem with a class action suit is getting enough relatively recently outed/quit ex-wayfers to unify and actually do it. There have been rumors for a couple of years of a class action suit, but nothing has ever come of them. Doubt there ever will.
Several folks have mentioned a class action. I sometimes wonder why folks who are really teed off about their treatment haven't done this already, but all it takes is a number of folks willing to spend (pick a number, say $100 a month) for a lawyer (possibly the Allen's lawyer) and you can start a class action.
So how about 10 people volunteer to spend $100 a month for a few years to get some fair recompense. (as noted, you probably can't bring them totally down by this method).
A key ingredient in all this is to get folks who are willing to lose their $100 a month, because the end result is not guaranteed. The lawyer will be able to give you the actual odds. But hey, what's $100 a month? It's only money, and, as they say, sometimes you gotta "put your money where your mouth is" to get results.
If you attitude is trying to right the wrongs of twi and help establish something good out of sheer principle, and if you're really mad enough, then maybe $100 a month is not a problem. Go for it.
Another way is to find a good investigative reporter from an major newspaper and let them loose on a good 'ol fashion series about the organization...do I hear a pulitzer in the making???
I wonder if anyone has explored the different types of payment plans, or the chances of winning?
Come on peoples, you who hate twi...
ya gotta have some motivation to find out what you can and cannot do, and how much it cost? no?
How about someone asking the Allen's lawyer to do a class action on a contingency basis?
That way they get their third, and none of you have to shell out your own money.
Heck, if I hated twi as much as some of you, I'd be on the phone right now...
Oldies,
Probably anyone here (except you and the twit enforcement lurkers would do just about anything to put the organization out of business. Why? Not so much from hatred for the organization but for the future protection of people from sexual predators, bondage, and false teaching...among many other reasons. Yes, if it were that easy (putting $100 in the kitty) to do a class action suite I'm sure many, including myself, would do so.
I am offended that you mock (in a way) those who have strong negative feelings toward an organization who has robbed them of their money, destroyed many families, and harmed many individuals.
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JustSayNO
Welcome to "The Spot" shortfuse!!
I think you answered your own question in saying it is doing it to itself.
The world is full of places for the sane and the insane alike to gather and unfortunately there are enough insane ones still in TWI to keep it going for awhile IMHO.
The best we can do is show some that there is, as God say's, always a way to escape. This site has already done wonders in setting people free from them. It's your's and other peoples stories and the continuing information of what is really going on that will feed peoples brain and allow them to realize the subtleness of the hypocrisy that is at work there.
So in my opinion the best thing to do is post and make current members aware of what is really going on and believe that there eyes can be opened. And for the insane ones, well, it's better to keep your enemy in one place were you can see them instead of scattering them about were you might not.
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Second James
IMHO...alot of people that are confronted or even confronting themselves in this type of scenereo, have either themselves & their FRIENDS & their families to listen to & objectively choose....or they have "leadership" & farm buildings & auditoriums to help them make up their minds..."The Ministry" doesn't encourage people to "trust" their families...but instead to trust them (the leaders)...when you boil itright down..I think the only hope any of them have (since there is such great pressure put on them via leadership) is whether they can be true to themselves. Some people have GREAT difficulty with this concept..but I feel its at the ROOT of a good decision..
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rascal
Claiming that folks file law suits because they are *out to destroy the ministry* is a way to deflect attention of the believers from considering the illegal conduct that brings the law suits to court in the first place.........TWI wouldnt want the followers to consider that people file lawsuits because twi has committed crimes according to the laws of this country and will be forced to face the consequences of their flagrant abuse.
As far as what I would do? Nobody could do a better job of destroying twi than mr.martindale
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JustSayNO
I agree with Rascal too. BRING CRAIG BACK and see how fast they run!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Catcup
Just sitting back, myself.
Don't need to "do" anything but enjoy watching the circus.
They do a bang-up job all by themselves.
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shortfuse
OK, so I allowed an easy out in my original question. Forget about the self destructive nature of the organization. What can be done to speed along the process?
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Goey
If you want it to go down fast, a good class action suit (fraud, racketeering, etc) with about 500 people getting about $100,000 each should just about eat up the BOD's little pot of gold.
But, TWI Inc. will never completely go down as long as that 50 million or so is controlled by Rosie and the gang. They will live in relative comfort the rest of their lives no matter how many leave or stop their ABS.
If they dwindled down to only 50 supporters and only had meetings once a month, they would still have control of most of the the cash and assets that we provided them over the years to "move the word".
They'll just convert the assets/property to cash and downsize to a small but nice facility somewhere in the Cayman's or the Bahamas where they can publish "The Way Magazine" 6 times a year (for their 50 supporters) while living comfortably ( with servants) off of the interest and maintaining their tax exempt, non-profit status.
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shortfuse
Could one plausibly argue such a case?
Where does the $50,000,000 figure come from? Fact or guestimate?
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bliss
FACT
I read their last years tax return or was that for 2003 ? It was 48 million dollars!!!!!!
Published....................somewhere? Does anybody know what site has the tax returns?
The vey tried to hide it real good, filed in ARIZONA, instead of OHIO, go figure.
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dmiller
Like John Galt, in Atlas Shrugged, I would do nothing. B)
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Outin88.
I thought TWI would self destruct by the early 90's.... :huh:
Unfortunately, as you mentioned shortfuse, there are those that believe TWI's lies like it's satan trying to destroy the ministry via lawsuits. Or we "cop-outs" are possed or some such nonsense!
speak the truth in love to those that still stand with the cult, maybe they'll wake up to the truth and leave. Thats probably the best we can do to help "speed along the process".
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TaylorCompany
Of course, in due time it will destroy itself; but as some have said, the "leadership" will retire to the Caymans and laugh (until they got tired of each other and no one to boss around and abuse).
But, in reality, the way to speed it up is to do three things:
1. Class action lawsuit to recoup any and all "abundant sharing" - could very possibly work, but if not would seriously expose the financial end of things.
2. Get the government involved. IRS and Department of Labor to start. Seriously challenge their non-profit status. I assure you that if the government looked even just below the surface there would be strong evidence of rackettering, conspiracy, tax fraud and many other interesting things. My only fear in this approach is the reaction of twi - would they go the 'kool aid' route? or the branch davidian route?
3. Continue to offer help, advice, and support to innies and "just outies" to show that greasespot (and the rest of the world for that matter) is filled with love and that your relationship with God grows tremendously after you are released from bondage. And that the real truth does not reside with twi, but rather in a person's own relationship with God...and that truth lies in many places outside twi...but NOT there.
There is nothing I would like more than to speed up twi's demise. But, in the process I want those held accountable who operate this scam and destroy lives. I want jail time and I want all the money back for those who have been hurt.
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GrouchoMarxJr
Like Goey said...it's all about the money. Nothing short of a class action lawsuit would put a dent in twi's assets...
...but the organization itself, has disintigrated to the point of no return...it's a hollow shell, nothing inside but misery and lies...and the illusion that twi tries to present, is becoming increasingly more difficult to pass off as even remotely viable. With the numbers getting even smaller, look for more downsizing to occur.
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shortfuse
Found the site. Arizona requires disclosure, that's the reason it was found there. See this.
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Goey
The figures represented in TWI's financial statement do not relect any funds hiddin in offshore accounts (should they actually exist).
The problem with a class action suit is getting enough relatively recently outed/quit ex-wayfers to unify and actually do it. There have been rumors for a couple of years of a class action suit, but nothing has ever come of them. Doubt there ever will.
While the BOD will probably live in relative comfort for the rest of their lives on the money that all of us gave to "move the word", we can take some comfort in knowing that thanks to the bone-headed actions of Martindale, Rivenbark, and a few others, that TWI is washed up as any kind of "ministry" and will continue to decline in numbers as they have nothing to offer or attract any new mullets. At least their poison has been contained.
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Belle
Publicity, Publicity, Publicity
GSpot has been invaluable for people looking into TWI before getting involved and for those sensing that something's "just not quite right".
The more we can get the word out there and warn people, the less likely they are going to be to have fresh meat to abuse and destroy.
Those billboards were great and there needs to be a way to make people without computers or internet know-how aware of TWI and all the lies. I just don't know how to do that without spending tons of money we don't have.
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oldiesman
So how about 10 people volunteer to spend $100 a month for a few years to get some fair recompense. (as noted, you probably can't bring them totally down by this method).
A key ingredient in all this is to get folks who are willing to lose their $100 a month, because the end result is not guaranteed. The lawyer will be able to give you the actual odds. But hey, what's $100 a month? It's only money, and, as they say, sometimes you gotta "put your money where your mouth is" to get results.
If you attitude is trying to right the wrongs of twi and help establish something good out of sheer principle, and if you're really mad enough, then maybe $100 a month is not a problem. Go for it.
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WhiteDove
I used to have access to the Dun and Bradstreet ratings when I worked at a bank but I don't now,
however there are some interesting locations listed here. It used to be all under the Way Int. HDQT.
Interesting? http://smallbusiness.dnb.com/search-result...hcd2=1129650780
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Belle
Do a search nationwide without the OH restriction and there's tons more!!
Thanks White Dove!
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TaylorCompany
Another way is to find a good investigative reporter from an major newspaper and let them loose on a good 'ol fashion series about the organization...do I hear a pulitzer in the making???
Anybody know one???
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TheInvisibleDan
Class action suits appear to be great business for the lawyers at least.
By the time they were through, we might each end up a dime or even a quarter.
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oldiesman
I wonder if anyone has explored the different types of payment plans, or the chances of winning?
Come on peoples, you who hate twi...
ya gotta have some motivation to find out what you can and cannot do, and how much it cost? no?
How about someone asking the Allen's lawyer to do a class action on a contingency basis?
That way they get their third, and none of you have to shell out your own money.
Heck, if I hated twi as much as some of you, I'd be on the phone right now...
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lilbit
The lawyer held up The Way logo and said,"$100.00 a month, who'll make it two, who wants to start the biding for me"?
All the outies said in unison we'll make it three, let's kill the stupid Way tree.
But low and behold a quiet voice came floating from the back of the room, as quiet as a humming bird sings.
The damage is done thanks to LCM and some...God Bless you, Rosile.
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TaylorCompany
Oldies,
Probably anyone here (except you and the twit enforcement lurkers would do just about anything to put the organization out of business. Why? Not so much from hatred for the organization but for the future protection of people from sexual predators, bondage, and false teaching...among many other reasons. Yes, if it were that easy (putting $100 in the kitty) to do a class action suite I'm sure many, including myself, would do so.
I am offended that you mock (in a way) those who have strong negative feelings toward an organization who has robbed them of their money, destroyed many families, and harmed many individuals.
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