I like what you stirred up - Sirguess, and CM, and Roy.
Seems like those who first showed up have turned their sets off a long time ago -->
Ever noticed, there can be some "off the wall" things on TV if you turn it on when nobody is watching? ( read: far-out-things-that-must-be-subject-to-scrutiny-which-serves-the-masses-with-the-side-benefit-of-turning-the-critical-eyes-away-from-what-is-currently-in-vogue)
Much of what most people call - riveting programming (Reality TV) - is about as interesting to me as watching a Test of the Emergency Broadcast System.
I enjoy a place to watch some different programming. This thread is like that.
Interactive programming.
People program themselves with the help of what is around us, using "safe" GUIs that are distributed as a sort of experiencial Shareware.
People get it figured out and then look for a way to .ZIP it up --- so they can summarize their complex path which led them to their place.
Seems like eventually, when you play all this out... Many people lead a life of letting others put notions in their heads, then look for just the right words to describe the idea.
Kind of lke looking for a Hallmark card. You know, someone else wrote it, but it says what you don't think you can.
In a way, the ideas that y'all have left here are becoming the next set of Hallmark card "messages". Written for those who have exhausted themselves at least once, wrestling with what seemed like, a thought which refused to unpack itself. Then someone comes along with some freeware - and "BANG" there is your catch of the day, laying neatly as two fillets at your feet.
.ZIP it up or un-ZIP it - pack it up or unpack it. No matter, subject or object - everyone likes a package, wrapped up, pretty.
But OH!! The Radical Suprises that await the next person who lifts the lid!
Often, I hear people talking about wanting to change, or needing to change. But, being frustrated that they do not change. Subjects get discussed, objects get identified, necessity gets assigned... but nothing happens.
in otherwords, they do not seem interested in changing their awareness/conciousness which follows such a process as mentioned above.
For too long, I thought that "I" was my mind. (Mind: the sentient side of my being that has thoughts, feelings, knowledge, intuition, etc.)
Now, I think that my "I" has a mind - but is not defined by or even properly represented by - that mind.
This simple thought can prove to be very powerful and empowering - it can allow your mind-caused problems to take on a much lower profile - giving your "I" a new level of being. One which has much more freedom and a new level of humility.
After all, isn't this part of the subject/object entanglement that gets expressed very well with an observation like:
... we live and move and have our very "being" in God.
Always liked BJ. I think the Lion King used this song, yes?
I like how you captured that sense of Christ - which I believe is the scent of life.
A person can sniff out truth if thier nose can follow and they can tell the difference between Christ and a bunny scent. Seems like you and I want to smell "the kid" more than the hippetty hoppetty of contemporary fads. Guess that is why we are still posting on this rather quiet thread.
Anyway, I like fads, too :D-->
A Love of life. I do not love explanations.
Sometimes, I think we wrestle within ourselves with the realities of the Kingdom of God. Like a dysfunctional married couple - fighting, kicking, shouting, crying -
... finally it all gives way to tired tumble - and a deep embrace and you both give way and yield to the sensation of being one - . Words no longer need to be spoken, - but who cares... it was words that started the fight anyway...
We (all of our real inner forces) should embrace. We should tumble. We should stop starting fights with a childish insistance that everything must be explained - which would lead to the erradication of mystery.
Christ in us is a fantastic mystery. If ever fully explained, its mysterious reign would/will be broken.
Every bit as seductive and outrageous as the mystery of what happens between a man and a woman in the act of union - a deep mystery like this should not sucumb to mere pre-mature explanation. It's deep meaning can not be transfered by explanation.
In the form of revelation it can be transfered....
I just read your entire post as if it was Bill Murray’s voice from “What About Bob?â€. That quote could have been an out-take from that movie – (You know - the movie where he is a nut and tracks his therapist down - after his therapist went on his summer vacation – but Bob (Bill M) absolutely refuses to go away – and drives his “sane†therapist (Richard Dreyfuss) insane. :D-->).
Anyway… **** so I guess, SirGuess, it is my move?
BTW, I never was any good at Chess. Required too much scheming for me.
Anyway, here is my move.
PROXIMITY: It can do a lot for your perception!
Ever notice that when it comes to objects – ones that ya can see – they usually require your proximity? So if you are not “there†– then neither is the object “there†for you to observe… (if ya go by what ya only can see at any given place in time.)
I think as silly and obvious as my statement is, it explains how people perceive “truthâ€.
We all “see†objects when we are aware of them.
We can only be aware of them if we are NEAR where THEY are.
Consciousness has different places because awareness has different levels.
What objects you “see†at one level – depends on your being THERE (proximity – or “nearness†in your awareness).
If a person leaves THERE and goes somewhere else, they will not see that object anymore.
So, see what I mean… people see objects – because of where THEY are. If people don’t quite see something they say.. “That is FAR fetchedâ€. Or “That’s a stretch!â€. People use common language that point to the fact that they are not “there†– and therefore, they do not see it.
Every level of consciousness or awareness has its own set of objects which can be seen. It’s own mysteries.
Jesus taught in parables – so that seeing - they would not see (those who were all caught up in the awareness of the Roman rule of Jews) and hearing - they would not hear. He was only trying to point out the objects to those who were “near†or nigh unto the kingdom of God.
He not only met people where they were at, he allowed people to stay where they were at. He honored the natural gap to exist which different awarenesses cause.
He did not walk in and start to ridicule average people for not seeing something… (unless those people happened to be passing themselves off as men of God – spiritual seers.) He knew exactly why some would see and others would not.
Jesus did not speak about objects in the same sense the “scroll scholars†talked about them. They always tried to peek into things they did not understand – by pushing and prying on words. They invented notions that were not there. They wanted to define objects they had never seen.
About Sun Myung Moon. First thing I noticed was the background of his family. What a bunch of negative spiritual crap went on in his family. Really. People going nuts left and right and needing exorcisms. All kinds of hideous stuff.
As a boy, he gets a few revelations, and is asked some questions in those conversations with God, (not unlike what I have experienced). But this is about where our train tracks diverge.
Moon practiced a whole different kind of or approach to journaling. Rather than see what God had to say, just like the first few times, he got the idea that he needed to quit waiting for God an he needed to start searching, in earnest.
He would ask God questions, then God would tell him “yes†or “no†– but no additional details. His journaling sessions sounded like cross examination of a hostile witness on the court stand.
And, boy oh boy, he had to sweat for the questions. He had to seek, big time – All he could squeeze out of God was a “yes†or a “noâ€. He had to fill in the questions and invent the whole premise – kind of like a Perry Mason show, that wouldn’t stop. Since Moon considered himself to be an intelligent person and a scientist, he was very “open†to “logical†suggestions or questions that would come to him.
One account of him was his test in front of God with Satan watching and how he told Satan to admit to his “theory†of what happened in the Garden of Eden. (Which takes up more than 50% of Moon’s explanation of how he got to be the Messiah. – so it was pivotal to him)
Satan refused to admit to Moon’s explanation of what went down in the Garden of Eden – said it did not happen that way. So, he (Moon) turned to God and said – “Ok – then YOU tell him that I am right!â€. God said, “Nope. Sorry. It didn’t happen that wayâ€. So he argued with God. Told God that it “Did so happen that way!!†– and that God had better quit screwin’ around because He knew that what he (Moon) was saying was in fact true. With more exasperation, he pressed the issue. He was NOT going to go down on this one. But, twice God gave him a “no†answer.
Finally, he wore God down. God said it DID happen – just like the way he (Moon) said. THEN, like a gloating child, he turned to Satan (since it was now 2 against 1) and THEN Satan confessed that Moon had it right.
All of this he considered to be a test by God - to prove to Satan that he (Moon) “figured it out†on his own – it was not just some “cheap†revelation that God simply gave to him – that he got for free – no sir – He had to work for this. He made this one his own!!
This became the center piece of his future revelations: that God needed a second coming of the Messiah (Why a second coming? Not for reasons that most think… this was because the job never got finished or done right the first time by Jesus.) Moon was open to this suggestion because he had already won round 1 with God and the Devil and frankly, if he could convince God and the Devil to change their minds… then he must be THE second coming!
Moon was the right guy in the right place at the right time. Korean “prophecies†in the 40s had already been given that the second coming of Christ would occur in Korea, and probably in the hot bed of Christian thought - in the area of Pyongyang. Which just happened to be Moon’s home area.
Well - simple. I think if Moon had a chance to be on this thread when he was a kid - we (at least some of us) would have tried VERY hard to keep him from being stuck on his notion of "one way to view truth".
Ya know... if more people knew that there are different ways - I bet there would be fewer Cult leaders.
At least there would be fewer Cult followers. ;)-->
I recall many years ago, while I was still involved with twi, meeting a girl in a parking lot selling chocolate bars. When she informed me that she was a Moonie, I responded "Whoa, cool. I'm in a "cult" too!"
(after all, the "Moonies" were always listed on the same page as we were, and were despised as much).
When we parted, I bid her a blessing. And she lit up with a great smile on her face.
yeah .. i suppose a person who may see some things
could think it's because he is so special..
the one who is special is the one showing the things to you!
as promised...
so one has something revealed and another sits by in awe of the words, which is fine, but he must see that he can see and add his own special things to it
let each phophesy one by one that all may be edified...so listen consider then your own words will be there soon enough
reminds me of a teacher at work who married a girl from South America. when she gets angry or extremly annoyed at him she rattles off in her native language which he understands very little of. so it really doesn't affect him much. just that he knows she's upset. then when that passes, they calm down and fall madly in love again...
It is more or less a universally accepted axiom that true causality can never be an object - ever. Because that which appears - - is built from a causality. Causality is that which gives a reason for a thing.
If some thing has no causality - then it is not a thing. In the origins of a thing is burried its reason... which comes from pure REASON. The ultimate reason is THE causality. Like the life of a seed - is its causality for growth. Its not the parts of the seed or the sun that makes it grow... those are all contributors - but they do not embody the causality.
B)
These words may sound odd to the ears of those who are only comfortable reading KJV Bible English... but, sometimes that language is simply pre-wired to religious answers so as to prevent someone from thinking through their own thoughts. Using unfamiliar words can "jog" your mind into a place where you say... "Is that what I believe? Or is that just my hand-me-down-dogma talking?"
Ok, Causality - let me see if an illustration might be better.
Most of what people identify as "causes" today are not. In medicine (Western), we do a LOT of symptom relief... and say that a certain "symptom is CAUSING me discomfort"...
So in the name of being more comfortable, we medicate and treat symptoms which are "causing" discomfort.
The cause of the commmon cold remains a mystery... but DANG - we sure do sell a lot of symptom relief for this ailment.
Causality is the puppet master. It is the place where the sign resides... The Buck Stops Here.
When I was a kid... religion taught that a girl could get pregnant if a boy simply put his penis into her....
Sorry. But once the that this was widely discredited as NOT true... the fear motivation departed... and my graduating class only had 13 girls who were either not pregnant or had not been pregnant when it came time to graduate. (More than 50%).
So causality is the bone-chilling, truth about what the real reasons are... To bad the Baptists which spread this mis-information did not hold causality in a higher regard. Possibly fewer kids would have "risked" their futures.
Ok, Causality - let me see if an illustration might be better.
Most of what people identify as "causes" today are not. In medicine (Western), we do a LOT of symptom relief... and say that a certain "symptom is CAUSING me discomfort"...
So in the name of being more comfortable, we medicate and treat symptoms which are "causing" discomfort.
The cause of the commmon cold remains a mystery... but DANG - we sure do sell a lot of symptom relief for this ailment.
Causality is a puppet master. It is the place where the sign resides... The Buck Stops Here.
Humpty Dumpty is smashed. Causality? Some would say it was the fall. Others, it was the sudden stop at the bottom. Some say he was pushed. A few, that he got what was coming to him. One witness said he was the victim of some rogue, right wing carrots who have made a vow to smash all eggs who waddle alone - because of hate and a phobia of shells.
Secretly, I think H. Dumpty had an ego problem. He loved to pontificate. He liked the high seats of authority because he thought himself the incarnate God-given ruler of the refrigerator.
His negative vibes of :superiority: were unfounded and ended up attracting other low level energy attractor patterns - like vengance. Because of the nature of the way things work... in this case, Mr. Dumpty attracted the forces which later killed him.
So it was not the fall which caused his death? (Asked the reported of the Refrigerator Times).
Nope. That is the nature of causality. Don't stop until you understand the forces behind the events. In those forces lays the rules of causality.
Love and peace will win in a head to head battle with low energy patterns. Gahndi brought the British Empire to its knees using the understanding of causality.
Hitler brought Germany death and destruction, but strengthened the world's resistance to him at the same time. It was causality at work.
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yeah funny huh
yet to be seen for the first time it seems new
i hope this station isn't turned off now...
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Too Gray Now
I like what you stirred up - Sirguess, and CM, and Roy.
Seems like those who first showed up have turned their sets off a long time ago
-->
Ever noticed, there can be some "off the wall" things on TV if you turn it on when nobody is watching? ( read: far-out-things-that-must-be-subject-to-scrutiny-which-serves-the-masses-with-the-side-benefit-of-turning-the-critical-eyes-away-from-what-is-currently-in-vogue)
Much of what most people call - riveting programming (Reality TV) - is about as interesting to me as watching a Test of the Emergency Broadcast System.
I enjoy a place to watch some different programming. This thread is like that.
Interactive programming.
People program themselves with the help of what is around us, using "safe" GUIs that are distributed as a sort of experiencial Shareware.
People get it figured out and then look for a way to .ZIP it up --- so they can summarize their complex path which led them to their place.
Seems like eventually, when you play all this out... Many people lead a life of letting others put notions in their heads, then look for just the right words to describe the idea.
Kind of lke looking for a Hallmark card. You know, someone else wrote it, but it says what you don't think you can.
In a way, the ideas that y'all have left here are becoming the next set of Hallmark card "messages". Written for those who have exhausted themselves at least once, wrestling with what seemed like, a thought which refused to unpack itself. Then someone comes along with some freeware - and "BANG" there is your catch of the day, laying neatly as two fillets at your feet.
.ZIP it up or un-ZIP it - pack it up or unpack it. No matter, subject or object - everyone likes a package, wrapped up, pretty.
But OH!!
The Radical Suprises that await the next person who lifts the lid!
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Too Gray Now
This might be a choo choo, but -
Often, I hear people talking about wanting to change, or needing to change. But, being frustrated that they do not change. Subjects get discussed, objects get identified, necessity gets assigned... but nothing happens.
in otherwords, they do not seem interested in changing their awareness/conciousness which follows such a process as mentioned above.
For too long, I thought that "I" was my mind. (Mind: the sentient side of my being that has thoughts, feelings, knowledge, intuition, etc.)
Now, I think that my "I" has a mind - but is not defined by or even properly represented by - that mind.
This simple thought can prove to be very powerful and empowering - it can allow your mind-caused problems to take on a much lower profile - giving your "I" a new level of being. One which has much more freedom and a new level of humility.
After all, isn't this part of the subject/object entanglement that gets expressed very well with an observation like:
... we live and move and have our very "being" in God.
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CM
good points TGN....
reflecting on myself-my "I", me and the me that was and is willing to take some initiative just because i know what i don't know...and look
and someone saw "me" looking...
and flowed into "me"
it has to "come" on it's own
it can't be pushed or forced
it will flow i think
i've seen it in "me" and the
stream that flowed in with me
Jesus said his burden was lite
seems we should lighten the load on ourselves
to see what comes to mind
the connections will happen
even then it must flow like a stream
rapids and all....
the point i suppose is love...
the greatest perspective of all
and that is that 0 that can be rested in
and let nature naturally become spiritual
and we stream into it with the connection
naturally, lovingly, in the image of God
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CM
i've been looking for where i could put this song
seems appropriate here, figuratively, perspectives, imagination, reality...
http://home.cinci.rr.com/mannix/images/Bil...of%20Dreams.mp3
probably need high speed connection-maybe not..
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Too Gray Now
Cool
Always liked BJ. I think the Lion King used this song, yes?
I like how you captured that sense of Christ - which I believe is the scent of life.
A person can sniff out truth if thier nose can follow and they can tell the difference between Christ and a bunny scent. Seems like you and I want to smell "the kid" more than the hippetty hoppetty of contemporary fads. Guess that is why we are still posting on this rather quiet thread.
Anyway, I like fads, too
:D-->
A Love of life. I do not love explanations.
Sometimes, I think we wrestle within ourselves with the realities of the Kingdom of God. Like a dysfunctional married couple - fighting, kicking, shouting, crying -
... finally it all gives way to tired tumble - and a deep embrace and you both give way and yield to the sensation of being one - . Words no longer need to be spoken, - but who cares... it was words that started the fight anyway...
We (all of our real inner forces) should embrace. We should tumble. We should stop starting fights with a childish insistance that everything must be explained - which would lead to the erradication of mystery.
Christ in us is a fantastic mystery. If ever fully explained, its mysterious reign would/will be broken.
Every bit as seductive and outrageous as the mystery of what happens between a man and a woman in the act of union - a deep mystery like this should not sucumb to mere pre-mature explanation. It's deep meaning can not be transfered by explanation.
In the form of revelation it can be transfered....
Some things just need to be lived... ya know?
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sirguessalot
ha. this thread reminds me of one of those chess games
where ya kinda know that ya can walk away from it for a few days and the game might still be going..hehe
this mystery reminds me of the book of revelation
as if a Bill Murray pitch line
ok, the story goes like this
it starts with a guy in the dark
in his closet or something
in the spiritual place
ya know?
anyway
he hears this voice from behind him, turns...
sees this radiant being with some amazing hair and eyes and some candles
then sees some messages and messengers and messengees singing in a choir or something
finds himself in a throneroom full of many-eyed critters at a jimi hendrix concert
finds some locks and keys and books and some easy little mysteries
end act one
and then it pretty much goes Jim Hensen from there on out
i mean...huge huge cast. earth-shattering plots and special effects. smashing-ending
our hero even meets some folks he thought were dead
and pretty much give him a thumbs up and a notepad
says good luck, see ya around
that sorta thing
but it all started with a guy who needed some candles to get started
which meant he was most likely somehow in the dark
quiet
awake
alone
and the mystery never ends
it just keeps getting more clear and vast
and stubbornly so
thankfully
imo
i wonder
which way did he turn?
when he heard that voice?
was it like Moses?
but different?
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Too Gray Now
SirGuess –
I just read your entire post as if it was Bill Murray’s voice from “What About Bob?â€. That quote could have been an out-take from that movie – (You know - the movie where he is a nut and tracks his therapist down - after his therapist went on his summer vacation – but Bob (Bill M) absolutely refuses to go away – and drives his “sane†therapist (Richard Dreyfuss) insane.
:D-->).
Anyway… **** so I guess, SirGuess, it is my move?
BTW, I never was any good at Chess. Required too much scheming for me.
Anyway, here is my move.
PROXIMITY: It can do a lot for your perception!
Ever notice that when it comes to objects – ones that ya can see – they usually require your proximity? So if you are not “there†– then neither is the object “there†for you to observe… (if ya go by what ya only can see at any given place in time.)
I think as silly and obvious as my statement is, it explains how people perceive “truthâ€.
We all “see†objects when we are aware of them.
We can only be aware of them if we are NEAR where THEY are.
Consciousness has different places because awareness has different levels.
What objects you “see†at one level – depends on your being THERE (proximity – or “nearness†in your awareness).
If a person leaves THERE and goes somewhere else, they will not see that object anymore.
So, see what I mean… people see objects – because of where THEY are. If people don’t quite see something they say.. “That is FAR fetchedâ€. Or “That’s a stretch!â€. People use common language that point to the fact that they are not “there†– and therefore, they do not see it.
Every level of consciousness or awareness has its own set of objects which can be seen. It’s own mysteries.
Jesus taught in parables – so that seeing - they would not see (those who were all caught up in the awareness of the Roman rule of Jews) and hearing - they would not hear. He was only trying to point out the objects to those who were “near†or nigh unto the kingdom of God.
He not only met people where they were at, he allowed people to stay where they were at. He honored the natural gap to exist which different awarenesses cause.
He did not walk in and start to ridicule average people for not seeing something… (unless those people happened to be passing themselves off as men of God – spiritual seers.) He knew exactly why some would see and others would not.
Jesus did not speak about objects in the same sense the “scroll scholars†talked about them. They always tried to peek into things they did not understand – by pushing and prying on words. They invented notions that were not there. They wanted to define objects they had never seen.
OK. Someone else’s move.
:)-->
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Too Gray Now
Oh, one more thing...
As an example that different awarenesses have different answers...
Check out the following - see if truth ONLY has ONE perspective or way to view it - then there is a very real opportunity to follow a cult leader.
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Too Gray Now
Those of you who know about Rev. Moon - please cut me just a little slack.
I think his re-telling of his "Snow on the Gas Pumps" type of moment (this is how a Cult leader gets informed that they have a cult to start.)
For Moon it was not snow on the gas pumps - but the story has some good learning in it.
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Too Gray Now
About Sun Myung Moon. First thing I noticed was the background of his family. What a bunch of negative spiritual crap went on in his family. Really. People going nuts left and right and needing exorcisms. All kinds of hideous stuff.
As a boy, he gets a few revelations, and is asked some questions in those conversations with God, (not unlike what I have experienced). But this is about where our train tracks diverge.
Moon practiced a whole different kind of or approach to journaling. Rather than see what God had to say, just like the first few times, he got the idea that he needed to quit waiting for God an he needed to start searching, in earnest.
He would ask God questions, then God would tell him “yes†or “no†– but no additional details. His journaling sessions sounded like cross examination of a hostile witness on the court stand.
And, boy oh boy, he had to sweat for the questions. He had to seek, big time – All he could squeeze out of God was a “yes†or a “noâ€. He had to fill in the questions and invent the whole premise – kind of like a Perry Mason show, that wouldn’t stop. Since Moon considered himself to be an intelligent person and a scientist, he was very “open†to “logical†suggestions or questions that would come to him.
One account of him was his test in front of God with Satan watching and how he told Satan to admit to his “theory†of what happened in the Garden of Eden. (Which takes up more than 50% of Moon’s explanation of how he got to be the Messiah. – so it was pivotal to him)
Satan refused to admit to Moon’s explanation of what went down in the Garden of Eden – said it did not happen that way. So, he (Moon) turned to God and said – “Ok – then YOU tell him that I am right!â€. God said, “Nope. Sorry. It didn’t happen that wayâ€. So he argued with God. Told God that it “Did so happen that way!!†– and that God had better quit screwin’ around because He knew that what he (Moon) was saying was in fact true. With more exasperation, he pressed the issue. He was NOT going to go down on this one. But, twice God gave him a “no†answer.
Finally, he wore God down. God said it DID happen – just like the way he (Moon) said. THEN, like a gloating child, he turned to Satan (since it was now 2 against 1) and THEN Satan confessed that Moon had it right.
All of this he considered to be a test by God - to prove to Satan that he (Moon) “figured it out†on his own – it was not just some “cheap†revelation that God simply gave to him – that he got for free – no sir – He had to work for this. He made this one his own!!
This became the center piece of his future revelations: that God needed a second coming of the Messiah (Why a second coming? Not for reasons that most think… this was because the job never got finished or done right the first time by Jesus.) Moon was open to this suggestion because he had already won round 1 with God and the Devil and frankly, if he could convince God and the Devil to change their minds… then he must be THE second coming!
Moon was the right guy in the right place at the right time. Korean “prophecies†in the 40s had already been given that the second coming of Christ would occur in Korea, and probably in the hot bed of Christian thought - in the area of Pyongyang. Which just happened to be Moon’s home area.
Anyway, I found this all rather interesting.
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Too Gray Now
Why?
Well - simple. I think if Moon had a chance to be on this thread when he was a kid - we (at least some of us) would have tried VERY hard to keep him from being stuck on his notion of "one way to view truth".
Ya know... if more people knew that there are different ways - I bet there would be fewer Cult leaders.
At least there would be fewer Cult followers.
;)-->
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TheInvisibleDan
TGN,
I recall many years ago, while I was still involved with twi, meeting a girl in a parking lot selling chocolate bars. When she informed me that she was a Moonie, I responded "Whoa, cool. I'm in a "cult" too!"
(after all, the "Moonies" were always listed on the same page as we were, and were despised as much).
When we parted, I bid her a blessing. And she lit up with a great smile on her face.
One of those unforgettable moments.
I should have gotten her number (lol).
Danny
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CM
yeah .. i suppose a person who may see some things
could think it's because he is so special..
the one who is special is the one showing the things to you!
as promised...
so one has something revealed and another sits by in awe of the words, which is fine, but he must see that he can see and add his own special things to it
let each phophesy one by one that all may be edified...so listen consider then your own words will be there soon enough
same god same christ same spirit
different colors, sounds, toungues
different flavors-some even bitter
perhaps hard to swallow
but there ain't no one forcin' nothin'
we naturally want to follow for reassurance,
a sense of belonging, fellowship
but when it's limited to following a person
slavery ensues, abuse will occur
what you are actually hearing is words right?
comparing them with your own words
words=thoughts revealed..by whom?
scriptures say a lot about man and what he is
without spirit..we all have it, but is it being
cultivated and kept like in the garden
if it's going to be "kept" then
spiritual words are sought after
here and now from the living
and then words written will come to mind
and more words
if that one who got your attention doesn't
wake you up to "the same body" then it's
going to go downhill
one god one father one spirit
who is in all and thru all
not the likeminded stuff we were subjected to
but freedom to fly, and respect for each member
and we all fall short of this glory
shoot...we all hit lows and highs
we all missfire or skip a beat at times
there isn't a person on these boards that
i haven't learned something from
reminds me of the tower of babel sort of though
where things went too far, got out of control
love lost, evil abounded,
so perhaps it's good that we don't understand
each other sometimes......
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Too Gray Now
Dang... Danny
I almost the EXACT experience. We talked for hours. What a great, kind .... and scared young woman.
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Too Gray Now
Man oh man... that is beautiful. Really.
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CM
thanks TGN,
reminds me of a teacher at work who married a girl from South America. when she gets angry or extremly annoyed at him she rattles off in her native language which he understands very little of. so it really doesn't affect him much. just that he knows she's upset. then when that passes, they calm down and fall madly in love again...
the common language of all is love
this can be seen and understood
the love that is there within us
not sex-u knew that-but love....
bigger and wider and deeper and higher
deserving exploration and giving
love always
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Too Gray Now
Ya know, love is a huge deal. It is a language - because it communicates.
As we grow, our perspective changes.
Seems like things around us change.
Like in this poem...
God Got Bigger
They had a very little God
In ancient Israel’s day.
A God of Hate and Jealousy
Though not of stone or clay.
A God superior to the rest…
(But still so very small.)
A God for just the chosen best…
(But NOT the God of all.)
But then God started to grow.
(Although He didn’t change.)
Beyond concepts from their law
From hideous and strange…
To higher heights of love and peace
To worship without fear…
God grew and grew and grew,
The nearer THEY drew near.
The more we know and learn of God
The more our spirit grows.
‘Tis the sweeter, meeker, kinder God
which grows and Grows, and Grows!
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CM
god plays on hell of a game in the old testament
secretly, wit, wisdom-his purpose fulfilled
fooling the foolish
even the foolishness of god is wiser then men
to see that there is one god who wants life for all
to understand that there was a purpose for the wars
a jealous god-quite the understatement
what belongs to him he intends to keep
christ growing in us or we growing in christ
growing in the ability to see as it is seen
rather then hung up by our own selfish desires
to worship the Lord thy God
is a selfless act, what really is in us?
taking the focus off ourselves
yet buried within this mortal body
to uncover that which is done
a revealing, new but old and new,
and has always been there
waiting to be seen by eyes that have not seen
by ears that have not heard
reflection on the words
a considering of the impossible
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Too Gray Now
It is more or less a universally accepted axiom that true causality can never be an object - ever. Because that which appears - - is built from a causality. Causality is that which gives a reason for a thing.
If some thing has no causality - then it is not a thing. In the origins of a thing is burried its reason... which comes from pure REASON. The ultimate reason is THE causality. Like the life of a seed - is its causality for growth. Its not the parts of the seed or the sun that makes it grow... those are all contributors - but they do not embody the causality.
B)
These words may sound odd to the ears of those who are only comfortable reading KJV Bible English... but, sometimes that language is simply pre-wired to religious answers so as to prevent someone from thinking through their own thoughts. Using unfamiliar words can "jog" your mind into a place where you say... "Is that what I believe? Or is that just my hand-me-down-dogma talking?"
Anyone else wanna have a go at this???
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CM
hey TGN
good to hear ya again
could use an understanding of "causality"
to understand what you are saying better
:)
sort of understand the duck...lol
but not sure :)
is that the aflac duck? B)
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Too Gray Now
Ok, Causality - let me see if an illustration might be better.
Most of what people identify as "causes" today are not. In medicine (Western), we do a LOT of symptom relief... and say that a certain "symptom is CAUSING me discomfort"...
So in the name of being more comfortable, we medicate and treat symptoms which are "causing" discomfort.
The cause of the commmon cold remains a mystery... but DANG - we sure do sell a lot of symptom relief for this ailment.
Causality is the puppet master. It is the place where the sign resides... The Buck Stops Here.
When I was a kid... religion taught that a girl could get pregnant if a boy simply put his penis into her....
Sorry. But once the that this was widely discredited as NOT true... the fear motivation departed... and my graduating class only had 13 girls who were either not pregnant or had not been pregnant when it came time to graduate. (More than 50%).
So causality is the bone-chilling, truth about what the real reasons are... To bad the Baptists which spread this mis-information did not hold causality in a higher regard. Possibly fewer kids would have "risked" their futures.
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CM
ok understand the word-
but not all baptists teach this
so good explanation,
but this example is in your experience
i was raised lutheran and baptist so i can tell a bit different story
about what they taught us about sex
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Too Gray Now
Ok, Causality - let me see if an illustration might be better.
Most of what people identify as "causes" today are not. In medicine (Western), we do a LOT of symptom relief... and say that a certain "symptom is CAUSING me discomfort"...
So in the name of being more comfortable, we medicate and treat symptoms which are "causing" discomfort.
The cause of the commmon cold remains a mystery... but DANG - we sure do sell a lot of symptom relief for this ailment.
Causality is a puppet master. It is the place where the sign resides... The Buck Stops Here.
Humpty Dumpty is smashed. Causality? Some would say it was the fall. Others, it was the sudden stop at the bottom. Some say he was pushed. A few, that he got what was coming to him. One witness said he was the victim of some rogue, right wing carrots who have made a vow to smash all eggs who waddle alone - because of hate and a phobia of shells.
Secretly, I think H. Dumpty had an ego problem. He loved to pontificate. He liked the high seats of authority because he thought himself the incarnate God-given ruler of the refrigerator.
His negative vibes of :superiority: were unfounded and ended up attracting other low level energy attractor patterns - like vengance. Because of the nature of the way things work... in this case, Mr. Dumpty attracted the forces which later killed him.
So it was not the fall which caused his death? (Asked the reported of the Refrigerator Times).
Nope. That is the nature of causality. Don't stop until you understand the forces behind the events. In those forces lays the rules of causality.
Love and peace will win in a head to head battle with low energy patterns. Gahndi brought the British Empire to its knees using the understanding of causality.
Hitler brought Germany death and destruction, but strengthened the world's resistance to him at the same time. It was causality at work.
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