I believe that his name is Karl...but yes, I read the book and laughed throughout the entire thing...thought it was one of the funniest books I've ever read. A must read for all extwiers...
Yeah, most everyone here has read it by now, I think, or, at least, have heard of it.
Some of the information Karl got was, I believe even he will admit, erroneous, but for the most part, it's a devastating expose of what really went on at WayWorld.
There are those dedicated Wierwillites, though, even here at the cafe, who have a real problem with it. The truth can be a harsh taskmaster it would seem...
I emailed him and shared my thoughts with him. The book is very informative and funny! I needed to read the humor, one incident is this:
When he was called to speak in tongues and interpret, he said " Oh ___! "Reason I think it's funny is we all probably thought that," no man don't call on me!" at one time or another! LOLOL!
There was a time when people were butting heads over its "accuracy" with some claiming that portions were fabricated or embellished. And in one case someone who was strongly critical of the book hadn't even read it !!! I still haven't
figured that one out. Its like a theater critic panning a show without even having seen it.
My response to critics of the book is to suggest that they write their own. I'm being completely serious. Its not like some major league outside writer is one day going to decide to write a book on TWI (unless it goes down in flames a la Branch Davidian or Jim Jones). So I'm sure we would all be glad to read it. If you have a book's worth of Way experiences then take the time to put it down on paper or maybe put it up on a website. Its not like KK's book wrote itself. He took the time and energy to do it and I don't see why others can't do the same. Your version doesn't at all have to line up with Karl's book since it would be your view. Put it this way. There is a lot of room for more books on TWI though , admittedly, the audience might not be so large so anyone writing a book should not be in it for the money.
Frankly I think some people were upset that Karl was charging for this book and in some weird way (no pun intended) felt as if they should get it for free (since they were once in) which is an idea I think to be bizarre since he had to take the time to write it. One thing I've noticed at Waydale and Gspot is that *some* people get really, really weird when people start making even the smallest amounts of money of of Way related things (books on ebay, Karl's book, lawsuits). Its as if they feel that being in TWI at one time or another entitles them to a cut of the action. Or they feel that people seeking to get money for way related things should at least secure some general permission. I don't see this attitude so much anymore but it does pop up from time to time.
That is right; he's not the only one who can write a book. But when I read it I can relate to the practical ways he was treated cause either I was treated that way or I knew others who were.
Read it and enjoyed it. Had lunch with Karl and his son in Toledo. His son is extremely intelligent and Karl has done good by him. It was a pleasure to be in his company and buy his book.
Karl Kahlers book finished openings the locked doors for me. I had nightmares for a week as all the suppressed memories came flooding back. Then I cried for 2 weeks while practically living on the old Waydale site. Finally I had the proof that I wasn't crazy it was TWI that was.
Karl refers to TWLIL,UH, and BTS plus materials from John Judes(Lutheran pastor from MO.SYN.), J.L.Williams, Jack Sparks, Ronald Enroth, and Douglass Morton(former PFAL grad). He gives answers to Elena Scott Whitesides'book The Way:Living in Love discussed on another thread by WordWolf.
I read Karl's book when it first came out. My brother was a corps buddy of Karl's and told me I had to read it etc., etc.
Jiminy Crickets! Ok, I was in the corps a few years ahead of Karl and company, and my experience is a million light years away from his. Dang.
My conclusion is that I was way out of the loop. I actually thought that I was attending a Christian college and would get a bona fide degree out of the whole deal. Little did I (or my parents who paid for the whole dang thing) know.
I read the book and thought it was excellent. It is especially interesting because of the history it gives of the early years. I highly recommend it for anyone that was involved with the Way.
IMHO Karl gives some excellent information on early 70's Way days. His discussion of doctrines like "Athlete of the Soirit" are great.
Some of the situations that he describes are spooky in how dead-on similar they are to things that I went through. His own apparent low opinion of women comes through pretty strong, though, and colors much of the perspective.
I know what you mean. I got flashbacks when I read the book too and remembered things people said to me. I remember I was at a ROA and was new and he basically humiliated me in front of other people! I guess I was shocked more than anything, but did not leave the ministry then because I was convinced that "there was no place like this anywhere". :.(
I really appreciate it that he took the effort to write a book about his experiences.
I read the exerpts from it and found a couple of the things he spoke of to be "innacurate." None theless, I won't criticise him for it. He deserves credit for putting it together.
I agree that people who have some stories to tell should tell them. I've thought about putting a book together from my time in TWI. Not to say that "my" book would be better that Karl's. I think there are many stories, many "realities" that people lived in TWI. There may be a bigger audience for them than we than we think. I was shocked by how many hits my LEAD Accident thread got.
I just got an email from Karl before I read this post and it made me laugh.
It was about 7 years ago when I was first 'introduced' to Karl Kahler online by Steve Hassan, one of the world's leading cult intervenionalists and author of "Combatting Cult Mind Control" and another book that I can't remember the name of. I'd written to Steven after checking his book out from the library and reading it. I asked him how I could get over my TWI experience. He put me in contact with Karl and a woman named Wendy Ford.
Karl and I began corresponding and when he told me he'd written a book but was not sure he was going to publish it, I BEGGED him to let me read it. I still have the copy of the manuscript that he sent me...all kazillion pages of it, in a box. I sat down and read it in, I think, ten hours. I don't think I even stopped to eat.
After being "out" of TWI for about 5 years, I was finally able to extract my BRAIN from the group that had such a hold on my every thought. I felt free for the first time in many years. I finally understood that many of the "lock-box" experiences I'd had were not unique. I began to see how corrupt TWI was, and how awful some of the people in it were.
I began begging Karl to find a way to offer it to ex-Wayfers because many of them needed to have that kind of freedom in their brain that I'd just gotten. Many others begged him as well. He finally figured out a way to self publish it so he could offer it to people for the cheapest possible price. I know he's given quite a few copies away at almost nothing...sometimes not even recouping the cost to print it.
I think many people have been liberated by the book. I know he did quite a bit of research and poured a lot of heart and soul into that book. Yes, some of the info may not be entirely correct because of things that have come to light since it was written...but I know he's gone back to make many corrections. Other times, the honesty of the people he interviewed in the book have been questioned. Is that his fault? He's done his best to offer something of help to people that cost him a lot personally. He tried to keep it as truthful as he could to the best of his ability. It was NOT his desire to write a piece of fiction but something that detailed his experience, and that of many others, while in TWI.
It blows my mind that some people can be so petty as to criticize something a man wrote in an attempt to purge a period of life from him that was very confusing and hurtful. I don't understand that kind of behavior. Petty jealousy? Maybe that's all it is.
Anyways, the book is a very interesting, entertaining read about some things that happened in the early years of TWI. There is very little post Martindale in it. Some have suggested he write a 'Cult That Snapped, Book 2' version, or "TWI2" book but he has decided that someone else should take on that task...someone who lived through TWI2. He didn't.
So, who's gonna do it?
By the way, dontcha just love the cover photograph on the book? I do. ;-)
It's definitely worth your time to read it. I read it over Labor Day weekend. Granted,he seems to be atheist, but I enjoyed his personal recollections as well as documentary.
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GrouchoMarxJr
I believe that his name is Karl...but yes, I read the book and laughed throughout the entire thing...thought it was one of the funniest books I've ever read. A must read for all extwiers...
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CM
Welcome to greasespot Jan
Karls book is quite the read
What happened imo was vpw died
and there was a major power struggle that ensued
millions of dollars at stake
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George Aar
Yeah, most everyone here has read it by now, I think, or, at least, have heard of it.
Some of the information Karl got was, I believe even he will admit, erroneous, but for the most part, it's a devastating expose of what really went on at WayWorld.
There are those dedicated Wierwillites, though, even here at the cafe, who have a real problem with it. The truth can be a harsh taskmaster it would seem...
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Jan
I emailed him and shared my thoughts with him. The book is very informative and funny! I needed to read the humor, one incident is this:
When he was called to speak in tongues and interpret, he said " Oh ___! "Reason I think it's funny is we all probably thought that," no man don't call on me!" at one time or another! LOLOL!
Jan
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diazbro
There was a time when people were butting heads over its "accuracy" with some claiming that portions were fabricated or embellished. And in one case someone who was strongly critical of the book hadn't even read it !!! I still haven't
figured that one out. Its like a theater critic panning a show without even having seen it.
My response to critics of the book is to suggest that they write their own. I'm being completely serious. Its not like some major league outside writer is one day going to decide to write a book on TWI (unless it goes down in flames a la Branch Davidian or Jim Jones). So I'm sure we would all be glad to read it. If you have a book's worth of Way experiences then take the time to put it down on paper or maybe put it up on a website. Its not like KK's book wrote itself. He took the time and energy to do it and I don't see why others can't do the same. Your version doesn't at all have to line up with Karl's book since it would be your view. Put it this way. There is a lot of room for more books on TWI though , admittedly, the audience might not be so large so anyone writing a book should not be in it for the money.
Frankly I think some people were upset that Karl was charging for this book and in some weird way (no pun intended) felt as if they should get it for free (since they were once in) which is an idea I think to be bizarre since he had to take the time to write it. One thing I've noticed at Waydale and Gspot is that *some* people get really, really weird when people start making even the smallest amounts of money of of Way related things (books on ebay, Karl's book, lawsuits). Its as if they feel that being in TWI at one time or another entitles them to a cut of the action. Or they feel that people seeking to get money for way related things should at least secure some general permission. I don't see this attitude so much anymore but it does pop up from time to time.
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Jan
That is right; he's not the only one who can write a book. But when I read it I can relate to the practical ways he was treated cause either I was treated that way or I knew others who were.
Jan
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Eagle
Read it and enjoyed it. Had lunch with Karl and his son in Toledo. His son is extremely intelligent and Karl has done good by him. It was a pleasure to be in his company and buy his book.
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templelady
Karl Kahlers book finished openings the locked doors for me. I had nightmares for a week as all the suppressed memories came flooding back. Then I cried for 2 weeks while practically living on the old Waydale site. Finally I had the proof that I wasn't crazy it was TWI that was.
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outandabout
I read his book over a weekend after I got it.
I too enjoyed it and hats off for writing it.
I agree, anyone who takes the time to write a book should be able to sell it.
I've always felt that anyone has the right to write a book about their experience of something.
Closest thing to a book I ever wrote is "There I Was" in My Story. Not a book, but it is a long post. ha ha
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oldiesman
I think it's very funny and worth reading, even for us who believe twi was on the right track once upon a time.
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A la prochaine
OUTANDABOUT,
One of my favourite books!!!
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Thomas Loy Bumgarner
Karl refers to TWLIL,UH, and BTS plus materials from John Judes(Lutheran pastor from MO.SYN.), J.L.Williams, Jack Sparks, Ronald Enroth, and Douglass Morton(former PFAL grad). He gives answers to Elena Scott Whitesides'book The Way:Living in Love discussed on another thread by WordWolf.
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ex10
I read Karl's book when it first came out. My brother was a corps buddy of Karl's and told me I had to read it etc., etc.
Jiminy Crickets! Ok, I was in the corps a few years ahead of Karl and company, and my experience is a million light years away from his. Dang.
My conclusion is that I was way out of the loop. I actually thought that I was attending a Christian college and would get a bona fide degree out of the whole deal. Little did I (or my parents who paid for the whole dang thing) know.
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Outin88!
Yup, it's a good read!
My wife was in the Corpes with Karl and was very curious so we bought the book and found it to be very interesting.
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Paradiseden
I read the book and thought it was excellent. It is especially interesting because of the history it gives of the early years. I highly recommend it for anyone that was involved with the Way.
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ex10
I don't know if I would rate Karl's book as excellent. I think I would give it a very interesting, though.
:)-->
A different perspective, yes. A typical way corps person's experience......I kinda doubt it.
:D-->
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Oakspear
IMHO Karl gives some excellent information on early 70's Way days. His discussion of doctrines like "Athlete of the Soirit" are great.
Some of the situations that he describes are spooky in how dead-on similar they are to things that I went through. His own apparent low opinion of women comes through pretty strong, though, and colors much of the perspective.
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Jan
I know what you mean. I got flashbacks when I read the book too and remembered things people said to me. I remember I was at a ROA and was new and he basically humiliated me in front of other people! I guess I was shocked more than anything, but did not leave the ministry then because I was convinced that "there was no place like this anywhere". :.(
Jan
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satori001
Not a bad first effort.
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HCW
I really appreciate it that he took the effort to write a book about his experiences.
I read the exerpts from it and found a couple of the things he spoke of to be "innacurate." None theless, I won't criticise him for it. He deserves credit for putting it together.
I agree that people who have some stories to tell should tell them. I've thought about putting a book together from my time in TWI. Not to say that "my" book would be better that Karl's. I think there are many stories, many "realities" that people lived in TWI. There may be a bigger audience for them than we than we think. I was shocked by how many hits my LEAD Accident thread got.
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marlene aka bunnie
Where can you buy this book? I just checked Amazon.com for Used ones and there was only one for sale at $100.00.....It can't be THAT good can it?
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Oakspear
You can order and get information here:
http://www.ex-way.com/
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Robes
I just got an email from Karl before I read this post and it made me laugh.
It was about 7 years ago when I was first 'introduced' to Karl Kahler online by Steve Hassan, one of the world's leading cult intervenionalists and author of "Combatting Cult Mind Control" and another book that I can't remember the name of. I'd written to Steven after checking his book out from the library and reading it. I asked him how I could get over my TWI experience. He put me in contact with Karl and a woman named Wendy Ford.
Karl and I began corresponding and when he told me he'd written a book but was not sure he was going to publish it, I BEGGED him to let me read it. I still have the copy of the manuscript that he sent me...all kazillion pages of it, in a box. I sat down and read it in, I think, ten hours. I don't think I even stopped to eat.
After being "out" of TWI for about 5 years, I was finally able to extract my BRAIN from the group that had such a hold on my every thought. I felt free for the first time in many years. I finally understood that many of the "lock-box" experiences I'd had were not unique. I began to see how corrupt TWI was, and how awful some of the people in it were.
I began begging Karl to find a way to offer it to ex-Wayfers because many of them needed to have that kind of freedom in their brain that I'd just gotten. Many others begged him as well. He finally figured out a way to self publish it so he could offer it to people for the cheapest possible price. I know he's given quite a few copies away at almost nothing...sometimes not even recouping the cost to print it.
I think many people have been liberated by the book. I know he did quite a bit of research and poured a lot of heart and soul into that book. Yes, some of the info may not be entirely correct because of things that have come to light since it was written...but I know he's gone back to make many corrections. Other times, the honesty of the people he interviewed in the book have been questioned. Is that his fault? He's done his best to offer something of help to people that cost him a lot personally. He tried to keep it as truthful as he could to the best of his ability. It was NOT his desire to write a piece of fiction but something that detailed his experience, and that of many others, while in TWI.
It blows my mind that some people can be so petty as to criticize something a man wrote in an attempt to purge a period of life from him that was very confusing and hurtful. I don't understand that kind of behavior. Petty jealousy? Maybe that's all it is.
Anyways, the book is a very interesting, entertaining read about some things that happened in the early years of TWI. There is very little post Martindale in it. Some have suggested he write a 'Cult That Snapped, Book 2' version, or "TWI2" book but he has decided that someone else should take on that task...someone who lived through TWI2. He didn't.
So, who's gonna do it?
By the way, dontcha just love the cover photograph on the book? I do. ;-)
Robes
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Jan
It's definitely worth your time to read it. I read it over Labor Day weekend. Granted,he seems to be atheist, but I enjoyed his personal recollections as well as documentary.
Jan
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