How many of you got born again, and/or spoke in tongues before you took PFAL?

[Ham]

Other threads seem to bring this up- the apparent merits or lack therof of "mr" vic's little gem of a ministry..

Personally, I did the "thing" long before PFAL.

It may not be exactly scientific, but- here's the survey.

[Ham]

Some rules here though..

choice number four- if someone that was even remotely related to der vey other than vic "led you" into SIT, this STILL belongs under number four. It was not directly done under "doc" vic's "ministry".

Edited to fix my three's and four's..

[Ham]

Number six will have to be a write in ballot- only five choices possible for the survey.

"I took the class, and either did NOT SIT, or really think I 'faked it'.'

or in other words, "It didn't do it for me".

[oldiesman]

I don't know if I was born again before twi, as I grew up Catholic. I believed there was God and Jesus, but I had many many questions.

I knew ZERO about SIT before twi. Never even heard of it. :)-->

VPW said occasionally that if the churches were doing their job, there would never had been any need for twi. Taken in that light, I believe those of us who really got involved with twi and stayed, had genuine needs that got met. Why else were we there so long? I suppose there are exceptions to everything, but it just doesn't make sense to me that those who stayed for years weren't receiving blessings from God thru fellowshipping with us. :)-->

[rascal]

I was born again, had a pretty good knowledge of the basics....

If I needed to endure the treatment of twi to learn to sit....I don`t think it was worth it.

I say life with my ignorant (according to twi) church bretheren would have been preferable.

I don`t do it much any more, and have not noticed a slackening of God`s goodness to me .

[Ham]

Thanks so far- all opinions and comments are more than welcome.

But- what I am SPECIFICALLY looking for is, what was your exact condition and what was the precise result when you took da class?

Say anything you wish, but please include, however briefly, the answer for this specific question. :)-->

[Ham]

My thoughts on this:

What you learned in twig does not count for number four. That was done under someone else's "ministry".

[oldiesman]

My exact condition was pretty messed up. Hungering and thirsting for answers as to why I was on earth. 17 yr. old male crying, blindly (as though in a dark room reaching out) asking God to tell me what it's all about.

Just so happens there was a twig fellowship right upstairs in the apartment directly above ours. The rest is history. :)-->

[Ham]

But- what was the situation before session one?

1. Were you "born again"?

2. Did you know about SIT?

3. Did you do it?

4. Did you turn into a biblical "scholar" before then?

[oldiesman]

1. I spoke in tongues before session 1 one night after twig before I took the class, so yes, I was born again before session 1.

2. Yes, I learned about SIT thru twig fellowship, before session 1.

3. Yes.

4. Assuming you mean was I well versed in scripture before then, no I wasn't. :)-->

[Ham]

The survey: What it is NOT:

Mainly, it is NOT- what was I like before "Twig"

Or "What was my condition before meeting up with another believer".

Now, What it IS:

Specifically, "what was I like before checkered flag was waved" in session one of PFAL.

[Ham]

OK.. then your vote would be number four.

[oldiesman]

Go to now, Mr. Hammeroni. :)-->

Oh well, it's your survey if that's the way you want to frame the argument. :D-->

[rascal]

Sorry Mr, Hamm, I voted ...should have left the commentary off.

[Ham]

No no no Rascal. Your commentary is MORE than welcome here! :)-->

[Ham]

Well.. before the class, lets see.

I knew the greek alphabet, and could use almost any lexicon or concordance you could throw at me..

I already had memorized the KJV titles of the books of the bible, in order..

Personally, I did not vote for number five, because these little details may or may not qualify one as a biblical "scholar".

[GeorgeStGeorge]

Before the class, I was Catholic (possibly born again) with a good knowledge of Greek (from Catholic high school). My understanding of what happened at Pentecost was WAY off. (I thought the Apostles were speaking Aramaic and that the listeners mystically "heard" them in their own languages.) I spoke in tongues in my apartment after session 11, but it (likely) wouldn't have happened without PFAL.

George

[ex70sHouston]

To tell the honest truth I think I faked it with the SIT. There is no way in that class you are going to jump into SIT.

I believe there really is SIT. I also believe that there are some people who truely SIT in TWI. I also believe that the majority are faking it or just making ignorant noise and to dumb to recognize the fact.

By the way I was born again before the class and thats one reason why I was out in four years.

[Belle]

I was already born again. I had heard of SIT but in the Baptist church I was told that people didn't do that anymore.

What attracted me to TWI was that I felt like I was getting answers to questions I hadn't been able to get in the Baptist church. NOW I consider those answers that were so exciting and feeding my ego to have are either b.s. or insignificant regarding my life and my relationship with God and JC.

I see what you're saying Ham. Most people who weren't born again before TWI were most likely lead to the Lord by someone OTHER THAN vee pee. Very, Very few people were actually born again or taught to SIT by the man himself nor by his ministry. I also think you're right. ;)-->

[oldiesman]

quote:

Very, Very few people were actually born again or taught to SIT by the man himself nor by his ministry.

Oh really?

I trow not :)-->

True, in my case it wasn't by the man himself. But by his ministry, no question.

It was the ministry of Victor Paul Wierwille that inspired me to get born again and speak in tongues. It was no mirage, no hoax. :)-->

[skyrider]

A wonderful missionary man showed me the scriptures in Romans when I was a teenager.....and I was born again with a new outlook on life.

For me, the lure of pfal was to "discern truth from error"........but the tares (at hq) and wheat were growing together. Thankfully the Lord, at harvest time, will do HIS JUST WORK in separating the two.

Today, I have a better understanding in discerning truth from error.....BECAUSE THE ERRORS AT TWI GREW RIGHT BEFORE MY EYES. The evil seeds were planted and watered via pfal.

And, now I see how deceivers and seducers can work WITHIN a corrupt system. Twi has shown me, up close and personable, the modern-day Pharisees that Jesus warned of to his disciples and followers.

[rascal]

Wow sky, that makes a lot of sense, and sure puts things in perspective.

I told the minister at my kids bible school one year when that was taught.... That there was gonna be some mighty suprised folks when they find out at the great sorting that we aren`t the *tares* some folks had us tagged to be....lol

[Ham]

As part of the record, may I add..

The folks I introduced to the word.. most who SIT'd did so only AFTER I sorted through vics bunch of hooey, and explained the phenomena in terms they could understand- yes, before the class even began.

The class coordinators were actually WORRIED that folks wouldn't get "the fullness of the spirit" on the twelfth session- I wonder why..

Apparently, there was a little check list at the end of the class, and explanations had to be given WHY they DIDN'T. You didn't want to get on THAT hot seat..

"His" ministry, indeed!

More of Stile's ministry- it was his instructions how to do it after all..

[Ham]

So far, the vast majority of votes tallied indicate that folks were "born again" before PFAL.

In a lot of ways, I think the stinking bunch tried to brand us, like some kind of cattle:

"'Way' New Birth"

You know, we are "The Way's herd".

Cattle rustlers beware..

"Well, my new birth has GOT to be better than yours, its, well, so much more biblically 'accurate'..."

[rascal]

Funny how the ministry laid such claims on our lives....