I applaud you for your courage in coming here and sorting things out in order to leave.
One thing you might want to ponder, is that while The Way says they teach people to get rid of their fears, it is fear itself which keeps people bound to them.
Those of your friends who say they are reluctant to leave because "there is nothing else out there" are actually bound by an irrational fear that there is nothing in life for them outside The Way International.
I wonder how they might react if you pointed that out? Most of them are in deep denial. They would never admit it is FEAR which keeps them bound to TWI, they think it is their "commitment."
They have actually committed themselves to not even consider the possibility that they could be wrong. Why?
It frightens the hell out of them to even for a second consider that they have invested so many years of their lives into a deceptive organization.
The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse has a great section on what is called "equity rescue." It's what keeps a great deal of people still hoping against hope that things will get better, while the organization fossilizes around them.
What's worse than spending thirty years in an organization that you have discovered is a destructive cult?
I applaud you for your courage in coming here and sorting things out in order to leave.
One thing you might want to ponder, is that while The Way says they teach people to get rid of their fears, it is fear itself which keeps people bound to them.
Those of your friends who say they are reluctant to leave because "there is nothing else out there" are actually bound by an irrational fear that there is nothing in life for them outside The Way International.
I wonder how they might react if you pointed that out? Most of them are in deep denial. [They would never admit it is FEAR which keeps them bound to TWI, they think it is their "commitment."]
They have actually committed themselves to not even consider the possibility that they could be wrong. Why?
[it frightens the hell out of them to even for a second consider that they have invested so many years of their lives into a deceptive organization.]
The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse has a great section on what is called "equity rescue." It's what keeps a great deal of people still hoping against hope that things will get better, while the organization fossilizes around them.
What's worse than spending thirty years in an organization that you have discovered is a destructive cult?
You nailed it, that is exactly the issue...hope. They blame "the people, not the product...". However I have come to realize, thanks much to all you Greasers out there, that the "product" has many flaws and needs blame. Do I blame God and the Word? Absolutely Not! But the "right division" from an organization that I started to elevate above God! Does any Christian bookstore have that book? I will check. Hubby needs it too.
Hope, that is one reason we among others have stayed for so long..praying,hoping, wishing, Believing, that things will get back to "the way it was...". But from what I am hearing and learning, it never "was" good. Just what we individually experienced, esp in the beginning when we knew nothing, so learning anything from the bible was so cool, and everything was just hunky dory, until you got seasoned and expectations rose,and suddenly you are not enjoying the bible anymore. It is no longer cool information, you want more, your vain repitition is getting to you and you haven't seen any miracles.....shall i continue?
After leaving in 2000 I sat thru a class on the book of Galatians and Collosians. During the 2nd night of class i starting tearing cause I knew how it was so clear I was BETWIXTED.
this was not Way teachings either. But it was some very sound individual who took the time to teach as is..no fluff or fillers and secret agenda's. the Word of God was what I needed to get back to some saneness..I live alone no hubby....I needed it!
I have nothing to add to all the good advice that's been given. I've been out for a lot of years now. In my case it was easy to leave since almost everyone in my area left at the same time. But the feelings I had of being lost stands out in my memory. When I look back on it all now, what helped me bunches was the knowledge that He would not leave me or forsake me, and He didn't!
You know something that I noticed when I started going to a church was the love for the family and how they actually helped others. They take up a collection each month for missionaries (Nobody ever gave us anything when I went WOW.) We have a pantry for those that might need some food and a fund for those in need. You can teach him to fish, but it's hard for that person to learn if they are too hungry to concentrate. If we are a family, then family helps each other when they are in need.
When I started reading The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse, I highlighted what I thought applied directly to me and twi... I would say at least 80% of my pages are yellow!!
Also... GREAT advice to look for the love. The thing that really hit me when I started hanging out at WayDale (the website previous to this one) was the comeraderie, the dialog, and the affection that I could actually "feel" even through a computer screen, that had been absolutely absent from twi fellowships for YEARS. And I knew almost instantly which held the truth and which was full of lies.
Bliss, it was the first thing I read after I first found the websites on TWI. It showed me that I wasn't crazy and that I wasn't imagining things. It was also very healing to read. :)--> You're gonna be glad you got it.
I don't know if personal experience will help you any (of course TWI says personal experience means nothing - oops - unless you were witnessing and then it meant everything and could never be refuted) but once I started questioning doctrine the flood gates opened. God can't show you what is wrong when you refuse to believe anything might be wrong. God can't show you what is wrong when you have been convinced that to even question what you have been taught is devil spirit influence. Nice little racket twi has going.
I too believed that there was nothing else out there so when I first started to doubt, I did the very same thing I did before I attended my very first fellowship. I prayed. I remember it vividly. I said, "God you know how much I have wanted to know you so if this is IT you are gonna have to show me." My great big wonderful GOD did just that. What I learned in the Bible that night (back in 1981) worked! It made a difference in my life and I knew it was God's Word that had done it. Twenty years later, what twi taught no longer worked. First I saw it in finances and from there realized that twi worships twi and NOT the Word of God. My teenage son said, "Mom isn't that idolatry?" and I knew it was. At that point I didn't know what to do, so I went back to the beginning. I prayed and told God, that if TWI was NOT where He wanted me, He would have to show me because I believed it was His will for me to stay there and I was not going looking for anything else. He showed me over and over and over in many many ways that TWI was NOT where He wanted me. Just like the Bible says, the eyes of my understanding were opened and I could see clearly that the twi doctrines and rules and fear motivations and punishments were a religion and not a religion that gave glory to the God I wanted to worship.
I too thought there was nothing else out there and then I realized that the doctrines and teachings that DID work and I DID still believe didn't need to be "out there" because they were in me! I didn't need to be taught them over and over, I knew them and could apply them whenever I wanted and even teach them to someone else if I wanted.
At that point I allowed myself to re-read the Bible. This time I used a clean one, with no notes and decided that instead of reading it with twi as the "good guys" in it, (you know as Paul or Jesus etc), I was going to see what it said if I put twi in the place of the "bad guys" (the legalistic pharisees etc). I started in Romans and went all through the epistles just reading and reading with no notes to cloud anything. What an eye opener! It made much more logical sense that way than it ever did before. The Bible says a great deal about twi and it is not what "Rise and Expansion" says it says about twi!
Anyway, I don't know if anything I did might help you, but I DO know that God can and will help you just like He has me and thousands more who are now free to worship him as the loving, all-powerful, good God that He really is! (TWI's God is a very small god that is always overpowered by devil spirit influence. Worshipping him has lead to the downfall of many many people many of whom are still in or hiding out in Toledo).
Thank you for your words. A friend of mine who has been"out" for 2 years now, shared a similar story, she got down on her knees(which she never did,) and prayed "what is YOUR will Lord"?- I cryed when she told me, because it expressed the thing that I have been missing for so long..A real heart cry to be close to God, and for some reason (many actually) it was lost. All the mandates, rules, confronting, ritual, no inspiration, borrrrrrrrrrrrrring teachings, led me to this breaking point. Being still officially (unofficially) in, I see what they are trying to do....but it is like perfumed poop, it is still poop! ( good idea by the way to put the "bad guys" in the epistles) I will do it and help my hubby through it.
Napkinlady has helped SOOOOOOO MANY PEOPLE with her words of wisdom, experiences and research - particularly her awesome study on debt!!
She and her family are living the truly more abundant life now and serve as an inspiring example of how wonderful life can be when we put God back where He belongs in our life.
"A real heart cry to be close to God...." I hope many more in TWI re-cry that heart cry and listen to Him instead of TWI, cause He surely will come through for them. Glad to have you here, Bliss. :)-->
Wow, thanks Belle. And Bliss all the best to you. Just one more thing on what I did. The neatest thing about it was that when I left I didn't have the doubt and fear that so many other's had cause I knew without a shadow of a doubt that I was doing what God wanted me to do. And that even if I had screwed up and wasn't doing, God would pull a talking-foot- Balaam kind of thing to stop me because I was truly trying to do His will completely. So sure was I that when in fact a region coordinator called me and asked me not to leave, my answer was easy. I told him that I had asked God what to do and He had told me to leave, but I would be happy to ask God again and see if He had changed His mind.
Anyway, the blessings that have abounded are too many to even mention since we left. Besides they are nothing compared to what God has in store for you.
Belle,
I was SO happy to read your happy day post! Truly outside of twi is where the abundant life is nowadays!
This is a very long process I can tell. Oddly, we have shared some of the horrors of theVey with some close friends, they are appauled by it, by still see no reason to leave because " there is nothing else out there".
Bliss I have enjoyed reading about you. As for nothing out there. The church (you and your husband) would be out there, finally doing what God will work in your heart. As for work etc., you and your husband will be blessed beyond your wildest dreams. God has a plan for you, as members in particular.
By the way I love Joel Osteen & his wife Victoria, they just seem to love life & his new book Your Best Life Now is available for 14.99, it's this years best seller. Not that I would advocate following them but at least hubby would see that others do share & live the Word. He is a trinitarian but maybe God will get him beyond that one day.
Since leaving I have found so many hungry people on the internet who have received deliverance from learning the things we have been taught, ie Jesus Christ is Not God (I knew this from the Jehovah's Witnesses before coming to the Way), The Dead are Dead. So there is a ministry there for you, it's your ministry.
I too have an innie there & would love to have you e-mail me as I have some questions. I am very concerned because I thought they were headed for an Exodus but now I'm not sure. Thank you for sharing, now I know that more people are waking up to the boredom of the teachings. You will have a great chance to do those teachings you have held in your hearts when you leave.
As far as leaving, you could just tell them you want to go WOW or whatever they call it now & just go. When you get there don't give them any phone numbers or communicate.
As far as your friends, you could prepare a short & sweet note informing them of your decision & why. (sort of pulling them out of the fire) then they make up their own minds. Sure glad you are here.
Bliss, this mirrors what we (from a different cult) go through in coming to grips with learning we did not have the truth, and in attempting to remove ourselves from the organization that we once believed to be from God, but is in fact all based on lies and the control of others.
Amazing, yet understandable how it would be almost identical. Love and best wishes to you as you work it all out. I've been working on it for about 2 years now, and have had to put my life literally on hold while I decide what is most important to me and what I'm willing to lose and what I want to gain.
Thanks all for your very insightful and kind words. It is nice to know we are not alone, yet we have to face this on the inside, the fight with ourselves and what we really believe. I am starting to clean the slate, so to speak, but hubby is still just finding out all that really went down and is having a very hard time sorting all out....
He believes it, with the people anyway, doctrinally, he's not going for it....not yet.
I am giving him crumbs to nibble, not to overwhelm him. He hasn't read this thread yet, just waiting for the right time. Any suggestions?
Maybe check out the "Problems with the Blue Book" or the errors in PFAL threads. Start pointing those out to him a little at a time and see how he feels.
You could order the pamphlet from John Juedes site that shows the plagarism of vee pee side by side with the originals. It's like a whopping $2.
I think, too, J B*rr*x has a site that's got the WayDale discussions on PFAL posted and those really opened my eyes! Raf has done an excellent job as well!
Something that I had in the works before the divorce decree came down was a planned meeting with some of the upper-ups who have left TWI that my ex respected a great deal. I was going to fly them into town to tell him the true story of why they left as opposed to why craig, the moneyhands and other leaders had said they left. I also was working on an outline to show him the doctrinal errors of what TWI teaches. Since he wouldn't listen to me, I was hoping that these more educated, well versed, once respected individuals would be able to get him to see how twisted the TWI doctrine is.
This is an idea I put together based on what I read in Steve Hassan's "Freedom of Mind" book. Also, appeal to your husband's "authentic self". What were his interests before TWI or before getting dead serious about TWI? Non-TWI friends? Non-TWI related hobbies? Encourage those, remind him of those and support any thing he wants to do unrelated to TWI.
Hopefully that helps. Those were things I did and I did notice a little bit of a change, but he had quit loving me when he realized I was no longer interested in being the perfect Stepford TWI wife, so much of what I did accomplished nothing.
Bliss, at this point it sounds like you are doing the right things. I would only add that I think you are right not to overwhelm your husband with too much, too soon. If twi has been his support system for a long period of time, and you overwhelm him, his instinct will be to "run and hide" within his support system. It's just human nature. You want to coax him out, not scare him back in.
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Catcup
Bliss,
I applaud you for your courage in coming here and sorting things out in order to leave.
One thing you might want to ponder, is that while The Way says they teach people to get rid of their fears, it is fear itself which keeps people bound to them.
Those of your friends who say they are reluctant to leave because "there is nothing else out there" are actually bound by an irrational fear that there is nothing in life for them outside The Way International.
I wonder how they might react if you pointed that out? Most of them are in deep denial. They would never admit it is FEAR which keeps them bound to TWI, they think it is their "commitment."
They have actually committed themselves to not even consider the possibility that they could be wrong. Why?
It frightens the hell out of them to even for a second consider that they have invested so many years of their lives into a deceptive organization.
The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse has a great section on what is called "equity rescue." It's what keeps a great deal of people still hoping against hope that things will get better, while the organization fossilizes around them.
What's worse than spending thirty years in an organization that you have discovered is a destructive cult?
Staying thirty years and one second longer.
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bliss
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bliss
oops sorry, I was trying to do the Quote thing......
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bliss
Catcup,
You nailed it, that is exactly the issue...hope. They blame "the people, not the product...". However I have come to realize, thanks much to all you Greasers out there, that the "product" has many flaws and needs blame. Do I blame God and the Word? Absolutely Not! But the "right division" from an organization that I started to elevate above God! Does any Christian bookstore have that book? I will check. Hubby needs it too.
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bliss
Hope, that is one reason we among others have stayed for so long..praying,hoping, wishing, Believing, that things will get back to "the way it was...". But from what I am hearing and learning, it never "was" good. Just what we individually experienced, esp in the beginning when we knew nothing, so learning anything from the bible was so cool, and everything was just hunky dory, until you got seasoned and expectations rose,and suddenly you are not enjoying the bible anymore. It is no longer cool information, you want more, your vain repitition is getting to you and you haven't seen any miracles.....shall i continue?
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Ham
Yep. And despite the apparent lack of results, somehow, you still owe your life to that "organization"..
No power to make you want to stay, but the only "power" proclaimed to be guaranteed is that which keeps you from even wanting to leave..
Don't wanna be like "them", subject to debils and all. Why, I'd rather be subject to rosie! Ptooie.
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likeaneagle
After leaving in 2000 I sat thru a class on the book of Galatians and Collosians. During the 2nd night of class i starting tearing cause I knew how it was so clear I was BETWIXTED.
this was not Way teachings either. But it was some very sound individual who took the time to teach as is..no fluff or fillers and secret agenda's. the Word of God was what I needed to get back to some saneness..I live alone no hubby....I needed it!
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Catcup
Amazon.com has The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse by David Johnson and Jeff VanVonderen for $10.39
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-h...9673764-0172603
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gc
Hi Bliss, welcome to gs, glad you're posting!
I have nothing to add to all the good advice that's been given. I've been out for a lot of years now. In my case it was easy to leave since almost everyone in my area left at the same time. But the feelings I had of being lost stands out in my memory. When I look back on it all now, what helped me bunches was the knowledge that He would not leave me or forsake me, and He didn't!
Will be praying for you and yours
gc
:)-->
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moony3424
You know something that I noticed when I started going to a church was the love for the family and how they actually helped others. They take up a collection each month for missionaries (Nobody ever gave us anything when I went WOW.) We have a pantry for those that might need some food and a fund for those in need. You can teach him to fish, but it's hard for that person to learn if they are too hungry to concentrate. If we are a family, then family helps each other when they are in need.
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TheHighWay
Bliss...
When I started reading The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse, I highlighted what I thought applied directly to me and twi... I would say at least 80% of my pages are yellow!!
Also... GREAT advice to look for the love. The thing that really hit me when I started hanging out at WayDale (the website previous to this one) was the comeraderie, the dialog, and the affection that I could actually "feel" even through a computer screen, that had been absolutely absent from twi fellowships for YEARS. And I knew almost instantly which held the truth and which was full of lies.
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likeaneagle
amen
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bliss
Ordered it, thanks all!
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Belle
Bliss, it was the first thing I read after I first found the websites on TWI. It showed me that I wasn't crazy and that I wasn't imagining things. It was also very healing to read.
:)--> You're gonna be glad you got it.
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napkinlady
I don't know if personal experience will help you any (of course TWI says personal experience means nothing - oops - unless you were witnessing and then it meant everything and could never be refuted) but once I started questioning doctrine the flood gates opened. God can't show you what is wrong when you refuse to believe anything might be wrong. God can't show you what is wrong when you have been convinced that to even question what you have been taught is devil spirit influence. Nice little racket twi has going.
I too believed that there was nothing else out there so when I first started to doubt, I did the very same thing I did before I attended my very first fellowship. I prayed. I remember it vividly. I said, "God you know how much I have wanted to know you so if this is IT you are gonna have to show me." My great big wonderful GOD did just that. What I learned in the Bible that night (back in 1981) worked! It made a difference in my life and I knew it was God's Word that had done it. Twenty years later, what twi taught no longer worked. First I saw it in finances and from there realized that twi worships twi and NOT the Word of God. My teenage son said, "Mom isn't that idolatry?" and I knew it was. At that point I didn't know what to do, so I went back to the beginning. I prayed and told God, that if TWI was NOT where He wanted me, He would have to show me because I believed it was His will for me to stay there and I was not going looking for anything else. He showed me over and over and over in many many ways that TWI was NOT where He wanted me. Just like the Bible says, the eyes of my understanding were opened and I could see clearly that the twi doctrines and rules and fear motivations and punishments were a religion and not a religion that gave glory to the God I wanted to worship.
I too thought there was nothing else out there and then I realized that the doctrines and teachings that DID work and I DID still believe didn't need to be "out there" because they were in me! I didn't need to be taught them over and over, I knew them and could apply them whenever I wanted and even teach them to someone else if I wanted.
At that point I allowed myself to re-read the Bible. This time I used a clean one, with no notes and decided that instead of reading it with twi as the "good guys" in it, (you know as Paul or Jesus etc), I was going to see what it said if I put twi in the place of the "bad guys" (the legalistic pharisees etc). I started in Romans and went all through the epistles just reading and reading with no notes to cloud anything. What an eye opener! It made much more logical sense that way than it ever did before. The Bible says a great deal about twi and it is not what "Rise and Expansion" says it says about twi!
Anyway, I don't know if anything I did might help you, but I DO know that God can and will help you just like He has me and thousands more who are now free to worship him as the loving, all-powerful, good God that He really is! (TWI's God is a very small god that is always overpowered by devil spirit influence. Worshipping him has lead to the downfall of many many people many of whom are still in or hiding out in Toledo).
All the best to you and your hubby.
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bliss
Napkinlady,
Thank you for your words. A friend of mine who has been"out" for 2 years now, shared a similar story, she got down on her knees(which she never did,) and prayed "what is YOUR will Lord"?- I cryed when she told me, because it expressed the thing that I have been missing for so long..A real heart cry to be close to God, and for some reason (many actually) it was lost. All the mandates, rules, confronting, ritual, no inspiration, borrrrrrrrrrrrrring teachings, led me to this breaking point. Being still officially (unofficially) in, I see what they are trying to do....but it is like perfumed poop, it is still poop! ( good idea by the way to put the "bad guys" in the epistles) I will do it and help my hubby through it.
bliss
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Belle
Napkinlady has helped SOOOOOOO MANY PEOPLE with her words of wisdom, experiences and research - particularly her awesome study on debt!!
She and her family are living the truly more abundant life now and serve as an inspiring example of how wonderful life can be when we put God back where He belongs in our life.
"A real heart cry to be close to God...." I hope many more in TWI re-cry that heart cry and listen to Him instead of TWI, cause He surely will come through for them. Glad to have you here, Bliss.
:)-->
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napkinlady
Wow, thanks Belle. And Bliss all the best to you. Just one more thing on what I did. The neatest thing about it was that when I left I didn't have the doubt and fear that so many other's had cause I knew without a shadow of a doubt that I was doing what God wanted me to do. And that even if I had screwed up and wasn't doing, God would pull a talking-foot- Balaam kind of thing to stop me because I was truly trying to do His will completely. So sure was I that when in fact a region coordinator called me and asked me not to leave, my answer was easy. I told him that I had asked God what to do and He had told me to leave, but I would be happy to ask God again and see if He had changed His mind.
Anyway, the blessings that have abounded are too many to even mention since we left. Besides they are nothing compared to what God has in store for you.
Belle,
I was SO happy to read your happy day post! Truly outside of twi is where the abundant life is nowadays!
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think fish
my advise? you've already crossed the rubicon.
save yourself and stop thinking you can save others, including family.
christianity is a crutch.
do yourself a favor, throw away the crutch and stand on your own two feet.
you're already starting to heal yourself.
sooner or later it will come out that you've been 'snooping'where should'nt have been.
you've eaten the apple and can no longer go back to the garden bliss. accept it.
if there is a god,
it doesent reward,
it doesent punish.
it just is and doesent care. so do what you want. just watch your back, no one else will.
just my opinion.
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LornaDoone
Bliss I have enjoyed reading about you. As for nothing out there. The church (you and your husband) would be out there, finally doing what God will work in your heart. As for work etc., you and your husband will be blessed beyond your wildest dreams. God has a plan for you, as members in particular.
By the way I love Joel Osteen & his wife Victoria, they just seem to love life & his new book Your Best Life Now is available for 14.99, it's this years best seller. Not that I would advocate following them but at least hubby would see that others do share & live the Word. He is a trinitarian but maybe God will get him beyond that one day.
Since leaving I have found so many hungry people on the internet who have received deliverance from learning the things we have been taught, ie Jesus Christ is Not God (I knew this from the Jehovah's Witnesses before coming to the Way), The Dead are Dead. So there is a ministry there for you, it's your ministry.
I too have an innie there & would love to have you e-mail me as I have some questions. I am very concerned because I thought they were headed for an Exodus but now I'm not sure. Thank you for sharing, now I know that more people are waking up to the boredom of the teachings. You will have a great chance to do those teachings you have held in your hearts when you leave.
As far as leaving, you could just tell them you want to go WOW or whatever they call it now & just go. When you get there don't give them any phone numbers or communicate.
As far as your friends, you could prepare a short & sweet note informing them of your decision & why. (sort of pulling them out of the fire) then they make up their own minds. Sure glad you are here.
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Lavender
Bliss, this mirrors what we (from a different cult) go through in coming to grips with learning we did not have the truth, and in attempting to remove ourselves from the organization that we once believed to be from God, but is in fact all based on lies and the control of others.
Amazing, yet understandable how it would be almost identical. Love and best wishes to you as you work it all out. I've been working on it for about 2 years now, and have had to put my life literally on hold while I decide what is most important to me and what I'm willing to lose and what I want to gain.
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bliss
Thanks all for your very insightful and kind words. It is nice to know we are not alone, yet we have to face this on the inside, the fight with ourselves and what we really believe. I am starting to clean the slate, so to speak, but hubby is still just finding out all that really went down and is having a very hard time sorting all out....
He believes it, with the people anyway, doctrinally, he's not going for it....not yet.
I am giving him crumbs to nibble, not to overwhelm him. He hasn't read this thread yet, just waiting for the right time. Any suggestions?
bliss
:(-->
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Belle
Maybe check out the "Problems with the Blue Book" or the errors in PFAL threads. Start pointing those out to him a little at a time and see how he feels.
You could order the pamphlet from John Juedes site that shows the plagarism of vee pee side by side with the originals. It's like a whopping $2.
I think, too, J B*rr*x has a site that's got the WayDale discussions on PFAL posted and those really opened my eyes! Raf has done an excellent job as well!
Something that I had in the works before the divorce decree came down was a planned meeting with some of the upper-ups who have left TWI that my ex respected a great deal. I was going to fly them into town to tell him the true story of why they left as opposed to why craig, the moneyhands and other leaders had said they left. I also was working on an outline to show him the doctrinal errors of what TWI teaches. Since he wouldn't listen to me, I was hoping that these more educated, well versed, once respected individuals would be able to get him to see how twisted the TWI doctrine is.
This is an idea I put together based on what I read in Steve Hassan's "Freedom of Mind" book. Also, appeal to your husband's "authentic self". What were his interests before TWI or before getting dead serious about TWI? Non-TWI friends? Non-TWI related hobbies? Encourage those, remind him of those and support any thing he wants to do unrelated to TWI.
Hopefully that helps. Those were things I did and I did notice a little bit of a change, but he had quit loving me when he realized I was no longer interested in being the perfect Stepford TWI wife, so much of what I did accomplished nothing.
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TheHighWay
Bliss, at this point it sounds like you are doing the right things. I would only add that I think you are right not to overwhelm your husband with too much, too soon. If twi has been his support system for a long period of time, and you overwhelm him, his instinct will be to "run and hide" within his support system. It's just human nature. You want to coax him out, not scare him back in.
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