Mabe Garth but immediatly after each of our posts we were both taken to task. We were the only ones that had a other opinion. Every one else that agreed gets a Good Post Nice Job (MY words) approach. Lets just say due to the facts it looks highly suspicious.
Reread what Wordwolf said as a clear indicator as to why this implication of 'it looks highly suspicious' falls flat. Ie., it isn't enough that its simply you and jonny vs 'the rest of us'. It takes more.
It takes careful reading as to why people post like we post. Why 'the rest of us' doesn't seem to grasp why you view Harry Potter as spiriatually dangerous, and then use insinuating comments about those who are into Harry Potter, and yes, I agree with Wordwolf, they are there.
Simple numbers alone don't tell the whole story.
P.S., and even Wordwolf didn't totally disagree with you re: Harry Potter. Or didn't you catch that?
I don't care to drag Raf into this and you are right later on after more posts he did have a different view but directly following that post that was not his impression at least it appears that way. That aside
I don't generally try to tell posters what they are saying when they post. I figure it is their words they should know what they were saying. But If I did have a question, you could ask maybe. Not assume. I could assume that in your last post you called me a name but you did not. Does that make it so? I say no. Even in a court the testimony of a person is considered true I think they call the rest hearsay.
Quote WordWolf:
It seems obvious to me that you refuse to see the slant in what you posted,
And it is obvious that you wish to slant it to see things your way to me.
And for the record I never invoked child molestion. Someone posted that somehow the books were ok because it taught children to read. My example was that if I gave them a book about child molestation they would be livid and rightly so. The point! just because something may have some reading benefit does not make it a healthy read or a unhealthy one either. It is not a point to value or disvalue a book with.
By the way this same point came up in the article that Raf posted later on. I guess someone else made the same conclusion. I suppose its ok as long as I don't make the point.
------------------------------------------------
Quote: I am not persuaded by the most common argument I hear in favor of Harry Potter: "At least children are reading. Anything that gets my child to read must be good." Would parents say this if the Harry Potter books had clearly objectionable content, like scenes that glorified teenage drug abuse? I hope not. As good as it is for children to read, we parents must make sure that what they are reading is good for their souls.
By the way I also saw a show discussing The book. The same argument came up there. They pointed out another thing. Yes they are reading but they are reading Harry Potter it is not like it has spurred a wave of interest in other books.
Quote WordWolf:I hope nobody's relying on your ability to communicate PRECISELY what you mean.
Gee I never seem to have a problem with other people just HP lovers here. By the way I would never post them but judging by my emails other people reached the same conclusion that I did. Unfortunatly they did not care to post and be BBQ'd.
It takes careful reading as to why people post like we post. Why 'the rest of us' doesn't seem to grasp why you view Harry Potter as spiriatually dangerous, and then use insinuating comments about those who are into Harry Potter, and yes, I agree with Wordwolf, they are there.
_________________________________________________
Exactly Garth
You don't like the fact that I think differently than you guys do about a book or spiritual matters in general and that I have a opinion that frankly sounds to Wayish to you so you must squash it. My other comments came after Belle fired the first shot. As she said treat people as you like to be treated.
If you notice I did not respond to reikilady that way even though I did not agree with all of her views. Why??? because she did not come out the gate at me she made her points with class. lesson to be learned maybe?
Dove you are being obtuse, whether it is deliberate or not I don`t know.
Either way, it is dissapointing.
JohnnyL, your unbending stand doesn`t anger anybody, it is your insults and derision that you insist on employing while doing so that is found to be offensive.
Both of you play the same silly game....insult, degrade, maligne others and THEN cry *foul*, beat your chests and pretend to be persecuted .....all the while proudly wearing your martyrs robes .....
Go ahead n slap each other on the back, hi fiving for the spiritual bu tt kicking that you think you have just administered.
Be all impressed with your spiritual selves...as it is probable that you are the only ones who who will be..... you have both lost a lot of credibility with your posturing and insults.
It is day 5 on the island I survived another night but I may be in big trouble. I need that immunity necklace really bad but I can't wear that thing it looks like a Voodoo spirit.
That aside I don't generally try to tell posters what they are saying when they post.
Sure you do. Everyone does. I cannot know what you mean, because I am not you. I can only tell you what you say. That's why we clarify things all the time; people misunderstand what we mean because what we say doesn't necessarily come out the way we intend.
Dove you are being obtuse, whether it is deliberate or not I don`t know.
Either way, it is dissapointing.
JohnnyL, your unbending stand doesn`t anger anybody, it is your insults and derision that you insist on employing while doing so that is found to be offensive.
Both of you play the same silly game....insult, degrade, maligne others and THEN cry *foul*, beat your chests and pretend to be persecuted .....all the while proudly wearing your martyrs robes .....
Go ahead n slap each other on the back, hi fiving for the spiritual bu tt kicking that you think you have just administered.
Be all impressed with your spiritual selves...as it is probable that you are the only ones who who will be..... you have both lost a lot of credibility with your posturing and insults.
Yes Rascal I am disapointed also.
That you continue to put words in my mouth that I do not say.
That you insult me while criticizing me for doing the same to you.
That you are intent on making me a martyr which I never claimed or asked to be.
That you assume things about me that you don't know to be true at all.
Todays Assumptions:
Both of you play the same silly game....insult, degrade, maligne others and THEN cry *foul*, beat your chests and pretend to be persecuted .....all the while proudly wearing your martyrs robes .....
Go ahead n slap each other on the back, hi fiving for the spiritual bu tt kicking that you think you have just administered.
________________________________________________
No high fiveing going on here. No butt kicking either. Also no being impressed with myself You are assuming these things. And by the way they ARE insulting.
Just defending my point of view which has been nothing but under attack in some 6 pages and 133 posts. This is America (Cowgirl excluded) and if I choose to live MY life according to biblical values and make some choices by them I suppose I have that right. Some think I speak poorly I'm sorry. but it is the only way I know to communicate. In the end it is the best I can do. I have no fight with you ,just want to endever to live the way I feel I should be. I'm sure I fail miserably at times I'm glad there is grace and forgiviness for me when I do. God is sure good to us.
(*post edited for poor writing thanks Linda for bring it to my attention so nicely)
That aside I don't generally try to tell posters what they are saying when they post.
Sure you do. Everyone does. I cannot know what you mean, because I am not you. I can only tell you what you say. That's why we clarify things all the time; people misunderstand what we mean because what we say doesn't necessarily come out the way we intend.
OK, Raf But you can ask I think you did that with me a few posts ie: Did you mean this or that. Not assume and post some translation. (However sometimes people do in humor.) And if they tell me what the mean then I except it they should know.
OK, Raf But you can ask I think you did that with me a few posts ie: Did you mean this or that. Not assume and post some translation. (However sometimes people do in humor.)
I did ask. I was more insulted by your clarification than by your original comment. And that's okay. There's no rule that says you have to make me happy, and I don't think any less of you for our disagreement. I don't think you're upholding a Biblical standard, but you think you are. Now that that's out of the way, I kind of dropped out of the discussion several pages ago.
Why, thank you White Dove! I'd love to chime in some more, but, it is 0623, and I have to go to work by 0700, and so, I gotta go. Thanks for the thread though, and may every one of you have a wonderful Saturday! I hope the sun is shining brightly for you!
Cool I was just trying to respond to your post today. It was not my intention to insult you but if you say thats the case I except that as your words Sorry.
You took a polite conversation and made it ugly Dove. You are not behaving in the kind and respectfull manner that had heretofor earned respect and made your pov worthey of consideration.....
No problem, Continue to administer your litle spiritual spanking to all of us sub standard believers... pat yourself on the back for being an oh so superior christian....
Nope I stated my view of a book and someone came after me for it. Thats ok by the way to be expected people have different views just not start out of the gate insulting me.
---------------------------------------------
No problem, Continue to administer your litle spiritual spanking to all of us sub standard believers... pat yourself on the back for being an oh so superior christian....
No, you didn't say outright anyone here is not spiritually vigilant or is "un-Christian" or whatever. But don't you see that you inferred those things?
If taking a stand against Harry Potter books is being spiritually vigilant, then logically, your inferrence is that liking them is being spiritually asleep. Don't you see that? That's why people have been insulted.
As for being kind and respectful, there have been lapses in that on both sides of this argument. But, WhiteDove, don't you also see that comments like "...thats why there is grace and forgiviness for those who still believe in that" are highly insulting?
Heck, I'm a little insulted and I've never even read a doggone HP book, because it sounds like you're assuming that those of us who have disagreed with you don't believe in those things anymore.
I don't know any other way to say it. I was speaking for me and me alone what I thought I need to do to. No one else! I don't see the books as a benefit to my life. Period.
----------------------------------------------- But, WhiteDove, don't you also see that comments like "...thats why there is grace and forgiviness for those who still believe in that" are highly insulting?
Ok I plead guilty to poor writing. The truth is as I was typing I was trying to think through my words. I knew they would be micro analyzed so I was trying to be careful. I added the end (for those who still believe in that) because I thought sure that some who were not Christian would be offended. I was trying to respect their beliefs if they did not believe in those things. On reconsidering The truth is from God's point of view they are available no matter what we believe I suppose. I'll reedit my post. Thanks
I don't share WD's beliefs, but I was thinking about what I might say if I did, and I think I'd have as hard a time expressing my thoughts without offending people as he seems to be having. I'm not offended, but I'm not a Christian. So I have a question for Christians who are offended by WhiteDove's comments. If you shared his beliefs, how could you express them without offending Christians who don't share those beliefs? I don't think you could.
With that folks I think I may be done. Sorry if I did not get to answer your posts. But it appears that in doing so it only becomes worse so perhaps being a slow typist is a blessing in my case. If you were offended by my clumsy writing,I am truly Sorry! it was not my intention. If you believe nothing else please know that I in all honesty was/am trying to do my best to live acording to my beliefs of the Bible. I may see you all again someday. Love WhiteDove....
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WhiteDove
Mabe Garth but immediatly after each of our posts we were both taken to task. We were the only ones that had a other opinion. Every one else that agreed gets a Good Post Nice Job (MY words) approach. Lets just say due to the facts it looks highly suspicious.
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GarthP2000
Whitedove,
Reread what Wordwolf said as a clear indicator as to why this implication of 'it looks highly suspicious' falls flat. Ie., it isn't enough that its simply you and jonny vs 'the rest of us'. It takes more.
It takes careful reading as to why people post like we post. Why 'the rest of us' doesn't seem to grasp why you view Harry Potter as spiriatually dangerous, and then use insinuating comments about those who are into Harry Potter, and yes, I agree with Wordwolf, they are there.
Simple numbers alone don't tell the whole story.
P.S., and even Wordwolf didn't totally disagree with you re: Harry Potter. Or didn't you catch that?
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WhiteDove
WordWolf
I don't care to drag Raf into this and you are right later on after more posts he did have a different view but directly following that post that was not his impression at least it appears that way. That aside
I don't generally try to tell posters what they are saying when they post. I figure it is their words they should know what they were saying. But If I did have a question, you could ask maybe. Not assume. I could assume that in your last post you called me a name but you did not. Does that make it so? I say no. Even in a court the testimony of a person is considered true I think they call the rest hearsay.
Quote WordWolf:
It seems obvious to me that you refuse to see the slant in what you posted,
And it is obvious that you wish to slant it to see things your way to me.
And for the record I never invoked child molestion. Someone posted that somehow the books were ok because it taught children to read. My example was that if I gave them a book about child molestation they would be livid and rightly so. The point! just because something may have some reading benefit does not make it a healthy read or a unhealthy one either. It is not a point to value or disvalue a book with.
By the way this same point came up in the article that Raf posted later on. I guess someone else made the same conclusion. I suppose its ok as long as I don't make the point.
------------------------------------------------
Quote: I am not persuaded by the most common argument I hear in favor of Harry Potter: "At least children are reading. Anything that gets my child to read must be good." Would parents say this if the Harry Potter books had clearly objectionable content, like scenes that glorified teenage drug abuse? I hope not. As good as it is for children to read, we parents must make sure that what they are reading is good for their souls.
http://www.fuller.edu/news/pubs/tnn/2003_October/3.html
________________________________________________
By the way I also saw a show discussing The book. The same argument came up there. They pointed out another thing. Yes they are reading but they are reading Harry Potter it is not like it has spurred a wave of interest in other books.
Quote WordWolf:I hope nobody's relying on your ability to communicate PRECISELY what you mean.
Gee I never seem to have a problem with other people just HP lovers here. By the way I would never post them but judging by my emails other people reached the same conclusion that I did. Unfortunatly they did not care to post and be BBQ'd.
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WhiteDove
Quote:Garth:
It takes careful reading as to why people post like we post. Why 'the rest of us' doesn't seem to grasp why you view Harry Potter as spiriatually dangerous, and then use insinuating comments about those who are into Harry Potter, and yes, I agree with Wordwolf, they are there.
_________________________________________________
Exactly Garth
You don't like the fact that I think differently than you guys do about a book or spiritual matters in general and that I have a opinion that frankly sounds to Wayish to you so you must squash it. My other comments came after Belle fired the first shot. As she said treat people as you like to be treated.
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WhiteDove
If you notice I did not respond to reikilady that way even though I did not agree with all of her views. Why??? because she did not come out the gate at me she made her points with class. lesson to be learned maybe?
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rascal
Dove you are being obtuse, whether it is deliberate or not I don`t know.
Either way, it is dissapointing.
JohnnyL, your unbending stand doesn`t anger anybody, it is your insults and derision that you insist on employing while doing so that is found to be offensive.
Both of you play the same silly game....insult, degrade, maligne others and THEN cry *foul*, beat your chests and pretend to be persecuted .....all the while proudly wearing your martyrs robes .....
Go ahead n slap each other on the back, hi fiving for the spiritual bu tt kicking that you think you have just administered.
Be all impressed with your spiritual selves...as it is probable that you are the only ones who who will be..... you have both lost a lot of credibility with your posturing and insults.
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WhiteDove
Well Cowgirl
-->
It is day 5 on the island I survived another night but I may be in big trouble. I need that immunity necklace really bad but I can't wear that thing it looks like a Voodoo spirit.
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Raf
Sure you do. Everyone does. I cannot know what you mean, because I am not you. I can only tell you what you say. That's why we clarify things all the time; people misunderstand what we mean because what we say doesn't necessarily come out the way we intend.
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Cowgirl
WhiteDove, don't drag me into this, I have nothing to do with this thread and I have no comment to make.
Cowgirl
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fortunateone
The Harry Potter "Spirit Fest" is just what we learned in PFAL from VPW.......
every person is God hungry.
Which god does Harry Potter worship?
Harry Potter is just another splitter group cult.
Get out of the Harry Potter cult now.
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WhiteDove
Yes Rascal I am disapointed also.
That you continue to put words in my mouth that I do not say.
That you insult me while criticizing me for doing the same to you.
That you are intent on making me a martyr which I never claimed or asked to be.
That you assume things about me that you don't know to be true at all.
Todays Assumptions:
Both of you play the same silly game....insult, degrade, maligne others and THEN cry *foul*, beat your chests and pretend to be persecuted .....all the while proudly wearing your martyrs robes .....
Go ahead n slap each other on the back, hi fiving for the spiritual bu tt kicking that you think you have just administered.
________________________________________________
No high fiveing going on here. No butt kicking either. Also no being impressed with myself You are assuming these things. And by the way they ARE insulting.
Just defending my point of view which has been nothing but under attack in some 6 pages and 133 posts. This is America (Cowgirl excluded) and if I choose to live MY life according to biblical values and make some choices by them I suppose I have that right. Some think I speak poorly I'm sorry. but it is the only way I know to communicate. In the end it is the best I can do. I have no fight with you ,just want to endever to live the way I feel I should be. I'm sure I fail miserably at times I'm glad there is grace and forgiviness for me when I do. God is sure good to us.
(*post edited for poor writing thanks Linda for bring it to my attention so nicely)
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WhiteDove
OK, Raf But you can ask I think you did that with me a few posts ie: Did you mean this or that. Not assume and post some translation. (However sometimes people do in humor.) And if they tell me what the mean then I except it they should know.
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WhiteDove
Naw, I know you don't just a little morning humor for you.
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Raf
I did ask. I was more insulted by your clarification than by your original comment. And that's okay. There's no rule that says you have to make me happy, and I don't think any less of you for our disagreement. I don't think you're upholding a Biblical standard, but you think you are. Now that that's out of the way, I kind of dropped out of the discussion several pages ago.
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J0nny Ling0
Why, thank you White Dove! I'd love to chime in some more, but, it is 0623, and I have to go to work by 0700, and so, I gotta go. Thanks for the thread though, and may every one of you have a wonderful Saturday! I hope the sun is shining brightly for you!
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WhiteDove
Cool I was just trying to respond to your post today. It was not my intention to insult you but if you say thats the case I except that as your words Sorry.
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rascal
You took a polite conversation and made it ugly Dove. You are not behaving in the kind and respectfull manner that had heretofor earned respect and made your pov worthey of consideration.....
No problem, Continue to administer your litle spiritual spanking to all of us sub standard believers... pat yourself on the back for being an oh so superior christian....
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WhiteDove
Nope I stated my view of a book and someone came after me for it. Thats ok by the way to be expected people have different views just not start out of the gate insulting me.
---------------------------------------------
No problem, Continue to administer your litle spiritual spanking to all of us sub standard believers... pat yourself on the back for being an oh so superior christian....
________________________________________________
Not my words yours!
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Linda Z
WhiteDove, please consider something I say.
No, you didn't say outright anyone here is not spiritually vigilant or is "un-Christian" or whatever. But don't you see that you inferred those things?
If taking a stand against Harry Potter books is being spiritually vigilant, then logically, your inferrence is that liking them is being spiritually asleep. Don't you see that? That's why people have been insulted.
As for being kind and respectful, there have been lapses in that on both sides of this argument. But, WhiteDove, don't you also see that comments like "...thats why there is grace and forgiviness for those who still believe in that" are highly insulting?
Heck, I'm a little insulted and I've never even read a doggone HP book, because it sounds like you're assuming that those of us who have disagreed with you don't believe in those things anymore.
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WhiteDove
Linda
I don't know any other way to say it. I was speaking for me and me alone what I thought I need to do to. No one else! I don't see the books as a benefit to my life. Period.
----------------------------------------------- But, WhiteDove, don't you also see that comments like "...thats why there is grace and forgiviness for those who still believe in that" are highly insulting?
Ok I plead guilty to poor writing. The truth is as I was typing I was trying to think through my words. I knew they would be micro analyzed so I was trying to be careful. I added the end (for those who still believe in that) because I thought sure that some who were not Christian would be offended. I was trying to respect their beliefs if they did not believe in those things. On reconsidering The truth is from God's point of view they are available no matter what we believe I suppose. I'll reedit my post. Thanks
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LG
I don't share WD's beliefs, but I was thinking about what I might say if I did, and I think I'd have as hard a time expressing my thoughts without offending people as he seems to be having. I'm not offended, but I'm not a Christian. So I have a question for Christians who are offended by WhiteDove's comments. If you shared his beliefs, how could you express them without offending Christians who don't share those beliefs? I don't think you could.
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WhiteDove
With that folks I think I may be done. Sorry if I did not get to answer your posts. But it appears that in doing so it only becomes worse so perhaps being a slow typist is a blessing in my case. If you were offended by my clumsy writing,I am truly Sorry! it was not my intention. If you believe nothing else please know that I in all honesty was/am trying to do my best to live acording to my beliefs of the Bible. I may see you all again someday. Love WhiteDove....
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coolchef1248 @adelphia.net
dove i asked you pages ago if you had read the hp books and did not recieve a reply
i cannot and will not hold predudice against you because you dont like potter
please do not hold it against us,who enjoy it i maybe spritualy napping but not asleep
please take this in the spirit in which it is written i think it no more dvilish than aol
:D-->
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GarthP2000
AOL? AO-Hell??
Now *that* is the true beginning of that long, steep road to H-E-double hockey sticks!!
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