What statements does anyone recall where Way bigshots have invoked the devil's name to intimidate you or others?
Remember, they'll remind you that you're more than a conqueror, but one wrong step, you little nippers, and you're "greasespots." Isn't that how they framed it?
They were loathe to "glorify" the devil, but quick to name-drop - a distinction without a difference if you ask me. (Ask me, go ahead.)
Thats much of what they did is glorify the devil and his power, all those classes and teachings with attributes of devil spirits, were nothing but exercises in overblown egos, that did nothing to help people but to hinder them into making them feel that they were overmatchedand subject to devils if they didn't walk the straight and narrow as defined by them..
A manipulative tool to keep followers close in, incestuous in their beliefs and actions, and dependant on those who thought they were in the know...
heres a quote I picked up from your link that reminds me of way 'leadership'
quote:
Witchcraft: Wanting to be a spiritual "mover and shaker" without submitting to God. Witchcraft is rebellion coupled with a desire to "stay in the game", to be a spiritual player.
In their desires to be some high falutin somebody that they werent they became pawns and ministers of darkness
A couple of weeks before I left twi, I sat down with the "ordained clergyman" in my area and had a long talk with him...I expressed my concerns as to where Martindale was "off the word" and my idea that if twi and the bible were at odds, it was better to stick with the bible...He agreed that Martindale was wrong but he thought it was better to stick with twi, even though they were wrong...
I "resigned" from the ministry, shook his hand and left...As I walked out his door, he said "love ya bro..."
The next day, this same "ordained clergyman" told the entire branch that I was devil possessed and to have no contact with me! He couldn't say it to my face...but he said it plenty behind my back...of course, that only reinforced my decision and convinced me even more that my decision was the right one.
The next day, this same "ordained clergyman" told the entire branch that I was devil possessed and to have no contact with me! He couldn't say it to my face...but he said it plenty behind my back...
Clearly "character" was not a prerequiste to ordination. I wonder what was...
I remember being "taught" that the more "Word" you learned, the more you were therefore responsible for, and the more consequences you would reap if you "copped-out." In other words, the "bigger" you were ("spiritually"), the harder you'd fall.
Yep, Martindale exactly taught that.
During the Advanced Class Spayshull on Discerning of Spirits in 1992, I believe, Martindale made public what he had taught The Way Corps privately for years. And that is, if a fully mature believer who has been "entrusted" with the deepest truths of God's Word "forsakes" the ministry that "saved his life," he works as effectively for the devil, old lucifer hisself, as if he were actually born again of the wrong seed.
Yep, Criag claimed all those folks who walked out on him during the "fog years" and afterwards, were getting personal attention from old Beelzebub himself, just as if they were his own children.
No instructions anymore from those so-called "five star generals." Nope, these "turncoats" and "traitors against God Almighty" had forsaken their personal relationship with the true God, for a personal relationship with Lucifer himself. Not those little devil spurts, but the big honcho, top dog.
Fear of the devil, fear of the most powerful of devils, and the most unthinkable consequences, to keep all the good little waybots in line. Keep the corpse from running out on him.
See, there's just no safety outside The Way. We were repeatedly taught that even if you want to leave, if you do, you're trading your relationship with God for a personal relationship with the Devil. Those who "knew the most" or had been entrusted with the most, or had been around the longest, had the most to lose. They were the ones in the most urgent peril if they even thought about setting foot outside "the household."
That was Martindales justification btw, for announcing to said class his fervent desire for God to give him revelation that specific people would just physically drop dead at his command-- "turning them over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh."
I wonder if this "only game in town" perceived monopoly contributed, just slightly, to the profound arrogance of Wierwille and his brood of moglings?
I see it as a chicken-and-egg thing. Did the arrogance lead to only-game-in-town or did the ultimate belief of only-game-in-town lead to arrogance? Coulda gone either way. But yes, definitely related *and* passed down to us underlings.
I don't know, but personally I think that many folk still in deVey bought the fear hype they tried to shove down our throats, especially the "there's no place else to go" line. I've run into a number of innies in my area & you can almost see a glimmer of hope in their eyes, that maybe they might find something of substance besides the rote, numbimg bull2#1t twi serves...but it quickly gets quashed when the Pavlovian conditioning kicks in.
Jim,
Character has NEVER figured in derVay "clergy".
I was villified as the evil, pozest husband who led his poor Advanced Class grad (whatever that meant) wife away from the prevailing household of the yada yada...but NEVER to my face.
I did, however, have a FC ask me to forgive him 'cause he was only doing what leader2#!t told him to. Other than that, they're all slugs.
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satori001
Okay... so...
What statements does anyone recall where Way bigshots have invoked the devil's name to intimidate you or others?
Remember, they'll remind you that you're more than a conqueror, but one wrong step, you little nippers, and you're "greasespots." Isn't that how they framed it?
They were loathe to "glorify" the devil, but quick to name-drop - a distinction without a difference if you ask me. (Ask me, go ahead.)
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mstar1
Thats much of what they did is glorify the devil and his power, all those classes and teachings with attributes of devil spirits, were nothing but exercises in overblown egos, that did nothing to help people but to hinder them into making them feel that they were overmatchedand subject to devils if they didn't walk the straight and narrow as defined by them..
A manipulative tool to keep followers close in, incestuous in their beliefs and actions, and dependant on those who thought they were in the know...
heres a quote I picked up from your link that reminds me of way 'leadership'
In their desires to be some high falutin somebody that they werent they became pawns and ministers of darkness
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GrouchoMarxJr
A couple of weeks before I left twi, I sat down with the "ordained clergyman" in my area and had a long talk with him...I expressed my concerns as to where Martindale was "off the word" and my idea that if twi and the bible were at odds, it was better to stick with the bible...He agreed that Martindale was wrong but he thought it was better to stick with twi, even though they were wrong...
I "resigned" from the ministry, shook his hand and left...As I walked out his door, he said "love ya bro..."
The next day, this same "ordained clergyman" told the entire branch that I was devil possessed and to have no contact with me! He couldn't say it to my face...but he said it plenty behind my back...of course, that only reinforced my decision and convinced me even more that my decision was the right one.
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Jim
Clearly "character" was not a prerequiste to ordination. I wonder what was...
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Catcup
Satori said:
I remember being "taught" that the more "Word" you learned, the more you were therefore responsible for, and the more consequences you would reap if you "copped-out." In other words, the "bigger" you were ("spiritually"), the harder you'd fall.
Yep, Martindale exactly taught that.
During the Advanced Class Spayshull on Discerning of Spirits in 1992, I believe, Martindale made public what he had taught The Way Corps privately for years. And that is, if a fully mature believer who has been "entrusted" with the deepest truths of God's Word "forsakes" the ministry that "saved his life," he works as effectively for the devil, old lucifer hisself, as if he were actually born again of the wrong seed.
Yep, Criag claimed all those folks who walked out on him during the "fog years" and afterwards, were getting personal attention from old Beelzebub himself, just as if they were his own children.
No instructions anymore from those so-called "five star generals." Nope, these "turncoats" and "traitors against God Almighty" had forsaken their personal relationship with the true God, for a personal relationship with Lucifer himself. Not those little devil spurts, but the big honcho, top dog.
Fear of the devil, fear of the most powerful of devils, and the most unthinkable consequences, to keep all the good little waybots in line. Keep the corpse from running out on him.
See, there's just no safety outside The Way. We were repeatedly taught that even if you want to leave, if you do, you're trading your relationship with God for a personal relationship with the Devil. Those who "knew the most" or had been entrusted with the most, or had been around the longest, had the most to lose. They were the ones in the most urgent peril if they even thought about setting foot outside "the household."
Welcome to the Hotel California...
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Catcup
That was Martindales justification btw, for announcing to said class his fervent desire for God to give him revelation that specific people would just physically drop dead at his command-- "turning them over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh."
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houseisarockin
Perfect!
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GrouchoMarxJr
"You can stab him with your steely knife, but you just can't kill the beast"...
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satori001
I wonder if this "only game in town" perceived monopoly contributed, just slightly, to the profound arrogance of Wierwille and his brood of moglings?
"I gotcha eternal life and you'd begrudge me a little sanctified and justified T&A?"
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Jim
I see it as a chicken-and-egg thing. Did the arrogance lead to only-game-in-town or did the ultimate belief of only-game-in-town lead to arrogance? Coulda gone either way. But yes, definitely related *and* passed down to us underlings.
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Weout1200
I don't know, but personally I think that many folk still in deVey bought the fear hype they tried to shove down our throats, especially the "there's no place else to go" line. I've run into a number of innies in my area & you can almost see a glimmer of hope in their eyes, that maybe they might find something of substance besides the rote, numbimg bull2#1t twi serves...but it quickly gets quashed when the Pavlovian conditioning kicks in.
Jim,
Character has NEVER figured in derVay "clergy".
I was villified as the evil, pozest husband who led his poor Advanced Class grad (whatever that meant) wife away from the prevailing household of the yada yada...but NEVER to my face.
I did, however, have a FC ask me to forgive him 'cause he was only doing what leader2#!t told him to. Other than that, they're all slugs.
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