I definitely alienated my family, partly because I was so waybrained and partly because suggestion is tantamounto to a command.
My sister was a "copout" in a Geerite fellowship for awhile, my mom was just a plain copout.
My poor sister endured me ripping her a new arsehole regularly with my holier than thou attitude because she wasn't "lining up with the Word". She endured it because she knew I was following a complete lunatic, and she and my mom prayed for almost 10 years for me to get out. Gawd, was I such a darn lunatic too! They couldn't believe it when I called them to say I left. I've since apologized, but I still don't feel an apology does justice for what I did. I think where the H did I get off? Lordy!
I dumped my ex husband for copping out. Although that was a wise decision since he was a binge drug user. I couldn't hack his life-style, so I used twi as ane excuse to leave him. We had so many problems before and had counseling, but leadership never wanted to hear the dirt. They always said read "Heirs Together" in Volume 5. Whatever!!! That was the worse advice I was ever given!! It didn't help one iota! It was covering over the real lissues!! What dumbarses!! Once he left, then it was acceptable to leave him. -->
I am so sorry, that sounds like it would have been terribly painful to have gone through.
:-)
My parents divorced when I was 15. My mother had been meeting with the family lawyer for months, and my parents lived together right up to the day that my father was served the summons to appear at court. The judge was a family friend and an accountant had a list of all holdings and properties, the judge already had it all laid out how the division of property was going to be. It only needed my father's signature. My siblings were all very close to our mother and they immediately sided with her. I was the only child still living at home, and I assume that my mother and siblings had all discussed the divorce and were prepared for it. It was a surprise to my father and to myself. The divorce decreed that as a child I stay with my mother, and that my father pay child-support until I was an adult. I was the only sibling that really liked my father's parents and enjoyed visiting my grandparents. Our farm was sold, the money divided and my mother remarried immediately.
So by the time that I was in the Navy and got involved with The Way, I really did not have very good relations with my siblings. Then as today, I do make an effort to visit the family once every year or two. But my mother maintains a very high level of control over what they each are allowed to do in life. One year she decreed that all sons and son-in-laws should have vasectomies, and within a month; three of my brothers and my brother-in-law all had it done [not I]. My father was very hard hit by his divorce; he had thought that after 20 years of marriage everything was fine. Since then he has gone through wives, every year or two. Sometimes we only meet a given wife once, and the next time I meet him, he has a new wife.
My eldest sister [Judy] married a grape-farmer who soon became a deacon in our hometown Baptist church. We have enjoyed a few nice discussions with them, over the years about Biblical inerrancy.
Once Bonnie and I did speak with my father about our involvement with TWI. He was not receptive to it, As an adult, I have never been able to sit in his presence accept that within 5 or 10 minutes he becomes agitated and prone to physical violence. Over the past 20 years, he has written us numerous times threatening us, that if we did not straighten out our lives and become respectable, he would beat us, or kill us.
I still call him for Father's day, and for his birthday each year. He openly cusses at me, and tells me that I am worthless, etc. In 1985 when our first son was born, my father came to the hospital and became very threatening. We got a restraining order put against him at that time. Bonnie and I used to enjoy visiting my Paternal Grandparents. Once she wanted to talk to them about The Way, and our home fellowship. But my Grandfather cut her off, and explained that my father had already filled them in on our involvement with a "mind-altering satanic-cult" and that he had no intention of giving us any money to support it. We never had any intention of asking anyone for money, but I suppose such was a common tale among the churches and 'anti-way' propaganda. Otherwise we did have a fairly close relationship with my Paternal Grandparents. All the way up until both of their deaths in their late 90's.
My Maternal Grandparents openly were always polite with me as a child. As an adult I tried to visit them each year, they openly criticized me for not having a respectable career. [in their culture, anyone who wears a necktie or a suit is a crook. They lost their first farm in Oklahoma during the dust-bowl / Great Depression and they lost their second farm in California to Eminent Domain during the construction of Don Pedro Hydro-Electric Dam.]
Last summer we met with my father and his current wife. She is trying to 'make peace' in between us. During our discussion, it came out that my father strongly believes that Bonnie and I have been drug-abusers, apparently for many years he has 'confirmed' his belief that we were using heroin each time that we did something that he did not understand. He is still upset that I have never held a job, and how I could have gone so far through life and yet never become a 'responsible citizen'. My father and his new wife are members of their local Baptist church in Missouri and he teaches children’s Sunday school classes.
Bonnie has no surviving parents, both of her parents died of cancers within a year of each other, when she was 13. Her teen years were spent living with various cousins and she finally moved in with a girlfriend from school and lived there while attending high school. Bonnie does have an elder sister, who did take PFAL and had gone WOW. She left the WOW field and has never attended a twig since. This was all before I met Bonnie, in 1979. When Bonnie was already an Advanced Class grad.
I do try with my family.
I see them now, at least every couple years and we still are willing to pray with them, or share the Bible with them.
When Selina and I left TWI in-res. and arrived back in N.Z. her brother called her up and demanded she leave me.I guess they believed she could be manipulated more.
Anyway, she told him no,I was the father of her kids etc..
So he asked her to ask me if I hated him.( This is how cunning they think they are )
As soon as she asked me I knew that if I said "yes", he would quote some scripture about 'the love of God not being in me'( maybe that was word of wisdom ?)
Anyways, I said " Tell him I love him " at which point he apparently flew into a fit of a rage on the other end of the phone, hung up and we never heard from him again till years later when him and a karate kid walked into our home to assault me in front of my family !
The two of them walked through the door,started yelling, threatening,thumping me on the chest,I fell over backwards.I believe they wanted me to retaliate so Karate Kid could finish me off(must be that word of wisdom thingy again !)
One of My kids had actually phoned the police and they turned up very quickly and slapped a two year trespass notice on them.
What caused this ? I had smiled and said hello to a lady in their fellowship in a shopping mall a couple of days previously as I walked past !
They had told their ladies that if I were to do anything like that for them to start screaming RAPE,RAPE.
Kind of ironic isn't it.Maybe I should write a book, but GSC is doing a much better job!!
It probably sounds like I'm making some of this up, but I assure you I am not !!
Perhaps we should describe family as either 'earthly' or 'spiritually'! Yes I gave up my real family, after all I felt more, ahem, love from my spiritual family.
The worst is when you go WOW, especially local, because my WOW family would suddenly show up if I was invited for a Sunday dinner and such from my real family. Other times we had no where to live I get invited to my real family and my WOW idiots feel we have to stay together. My WOW family lacked hygienic skills and had BO that lingered long after they left.
So yeah, my relationship changed dramatically because of a cult, and things have never been the same!
"The two of them walked through the door,started yelling, threatening,thumping me on the chest,I fell over backwards.I believe they wanted me to retaliate so Karate Kid could finish me off(must be that word of wisdom thingy again !) One of My kids had actually phoned the police and they turned up very quickly and slapped a two year trespass notice on them."
You are to be complemented for your cool handling of the situation. Many others would have been tricked into reacting offensively [which was obviously their intent].
By the time I joined TWI, I was in graduate school over 100 miles from my family; and after getting my degree I moved another 1000 miles away, so there was never any interaction between my family and any TWI leadership. My fellowship with TWI was a little tough, since they were all RC's; but they all repected my desire to serve God.
My family was always welcome to visit, and I was always welcome there.
dysfunctional? lol no we are just honest. a chunk of people with issues trying to get along and care the best we can .
I watch two girls at work , and hear how hard they work at making sure the house home and family and car and dog is perfect.
Im talking about how he got caught by the cops with no insurance on the carand they are shocked and gasp with the shame of it for me! and then they go On about the good college boy in public, he likes church functions when he is home they give him two hundred a week for spending money (nice of him hmm?): but break down in private talks with tears about how their son may have had some drinks one night as he is in the hospital with an overdose in handcuffs... oh mY! (the thugs must have forced him to do it ya know!) in the new car with insurance no less oh my! (said in a wisper with only the chosen ears to hear!)
What some present to the world as the way a family is and what we are is sometimes two very different groups!! haha
we are honest in a small town we have to be always in your face about the time ya did that . But some live in the illusion of perfection it just always seemed to much work to impress others to me.
how do people scream I hate you and shut the F up! and still break light speed to be there when the same person gets hurt or needs help ?
we are all insane.. but we love one another very much.. so we function just fine.
I do not know how to be perfect. it looks difficlt and stressful to me.
Honestly, sometimes when they go on about how life is with no problems present themself out loud in reality I do wonder how the hell I ended up with such a group of cowboys, geeks, freaks and whores lol then I look at my own life and think of all the times they stood with me in my stink, and say thank God for what I got . AMEN?
I didn't give them up nor was it suggested. However, I stupidly gave up so much of my time that they never saw me. That got fixed when I left TWI though. Life is wonderful again and my family and I talk all the time. :)-->
Belle, the way you and your husband were manipulated by way leadership made me cry...especailly the part about your husband's Grandmother & Mother... I thought as followers of Jesus Christ, we were to be examples... what a waste of precious time.
Shellon, God bless your wonderful family... you have something special. So glad they waited for you :)-->
Galen~ you and your wife sound like some very precious people... your Mother on the other hand sounds a bit scarey... & your Dad a Sunday School Teacher, YIKES! He thought you guys were using Heroin? Insane!
Allan~ maybe I should re-read... is your Brother-in-law still with the Way? Is he trying to protect a Way Fellowship? The violence is insane... I applaud you too for knowing not to use physical violence in your situation with the Karate Kid... sounds like Brother-in-law has a few screws loose!
Yes, I did give up on and cut my family out of my life. Communication from my end stopped with them.
Three Nephews, all toddlers at the time, never knew their only Aunt on their Dad's side.
Looking back, my parents were determined type of folks. Shortly after becoming involved in TWI, I went WOW to Hawaii. (didn't request it, and only had $400...Michael S*ith...did you have something to do with that?)
My Mom wrote a letter EVERY week, and sent a care package every month! She kept all correspondence light & happy, telling me about the everyday things her and my dad were doing...
She would call now & then...and ask a few questions... I'm sure I was fairly rude to her~ that unbeliever who had the chance and didn't take it!
Sometimes she'd include things in the package for the other three in our 'family' there --> NOW THAT WAS A DISFUCTIONAL FAMILY~ THE WOW FAMILY!
After the WOW year, we went to the ROA for our pinning... I stopped at home for a short visit to pick up some things they had kept for me there... get my car... and my parents offered to PAY for my car's shipping to Hawaii~
They just kept on giving & loving & speaking positive things.
Years later when we left TWI, I found out that my Mom had read several books and took classes on how to deal with children in a cult~ what to do and say, and what NOT to do. This was suggested to her from her Lutheran Pastor :)-->
Even though I had felt incredibly bad about how I treated my family, when I apologized, they all said, no big deal, it's okay~ we love you!
My mom is from Germany~ old fashioned, set in her ways (somewhat), but sought councel on the matter of her daughter... even though she had to learn and practice 'new' behavior and thinking, she did whatever it took and believed when she asked God to get me OUT, that He would NOT fail her.
I never cut my family out of my life because of twi, except for once -- and that happened as a wow. While living in Indiana, I would always go see the folks, do family get-togethers, etc., and have time for both them and twi at the same time. (twi-1 was a lot less restrictive about that stuff -- imo).
Moved to Minnesota in 1978, went wow, and my brother got married that wow year in June of '79. I was told I would be *leaving the field* if I went to his wedding, so being a *good wafer* -- I did not go. :(--> Ironically enough -- it was NOT considered *leaving the field* to go to AC '79.
They were pretty ticked at me for a few years, and I swore I would never do anything like that again. It's all water under the bridge now, but it wasn't a whole lot fun back then. Their attitude softened towards me, once I finally realized the cult status of twi -- and told them I was sorry I let an outfit like that get in between us as a family.
I made the mistake of marrying someone from a different part of the country (I'm from Maine, he was from Alabama). He was much more the "disciple" than I was - willing to go wherever leadership "suggested". A couple of times we had made plans to move to New England, but he would get "revelation" that we shouldn't go. Once it happened THE DAY BEFORE WE WERE TO MOVE! We had sold lock-stock-and-barrel, quit our jobs, made all of our arrangements - and he changed his mind. It was a real mind *****, you know.
We would go to Maine to visit my folks about once a year. Since my husband had trouble keeping a job, it was difficult for me to go home to visit any more than that.
To further complicate things, my husband was really into the "present truth" to the degree where he totally alienated one of my brothers, who is homosexual (but not open about it), and really upset my mother. He lost his temper with my mother during this incident - he was one of those people who HAD to be RIGHT about something - even if he proved his point all the WRONG ways... This drove a huge wedge between me, my husband, and my family.
When my father was dying I did get a call from the Limb Coordinator who basically TOLD me to go to my father to be with him. My dad had had an aneurism and lost over 75% of his blood. His vascular surgeon told us that Dad had a 2% chance of survival. I flew home the following day, stayed in Maine for 3 weeks -- my dad recovered enough to go home, and I returned to AL. My dad was a very strong man!
My dad ended up with an infection from the operation I regret not staying in ME to take care of him after he went home, but there's nothing I can do about that now. He lived at home for another 12 weeks, when I got another call that he was dying. Again, I had support from the Limb Coordinator to go home. I flew back to Maine to be with my dad. The doctors said he had only 3 to 5 days to live - he lived another 3 weeks! I was there with him at the hospital every day. My dad's last words to me were, "I love you." I can't imagine what my life would be like if I was not there to hear that. He passed away about 20 mins after that. I was also able to be there for my mother and to help make the final arrangements after he passed away.
Fast forward six years....
That same Limb Coordinator from AL was relocated to MA, where I happened to be living. Shortly after he moved there I found myself in a meeting with all the WC in the state of MA (all 5 of them - LOL!). I was confronted for several petty things, among them - going to visit my widowed mother in the next state too often (even though I filled out all the right forms!) (She was like an hour and a half away - and I had to get "permission" - and I was nearly 30 years old! GOOD GRIEF!)
I didn't stop visiting her - I just skipped out of town when I knew there were WC meetings. No one knew and no one asked. (Ask me no questions and I'll tell you no lies!)
When my husband and I were kicked off staff (because he was 'sniffed out' for being homo - the irony!) it was not believers who were there for us. We were basically kicked out to fend for ourselves in a city we didn't know. We had no housing, jobs, a car - nothing! We had sold everything to go on staff. The Household was not made available to us for anything - even though I knew severel people could have helped us out. My husband was m&a'ed, and I left him.
After everything that happened, my family took me in with no questions asked - and I was still standing with TWI (yeah, I'm thick sometimes...). I know that my husband ended up needing to lean on his family for help - his family, by the way, was some of the nicest, most loving people I ever met in my life. I miss them, even now, but know that contact with them would be painful (I don't think he ever told them why we split and don't feel it's my place to tell them....)
So, I didn't totally give up my family. I made some choices that weren't the best for a real close relationship with them at times, but I can't be a Monday-morning quarterback about it now. I'm just glad that they didn't totally give up on me!
Wayfer Not! – Isn’t it funny how all those people with copped out attitudes acted more patient, loving and kind than our self-righteous selves? Thank God they are better people than we were. :)--> I also feel like my apologies aren’t enough, but just feeling the love from them and seeing my family’s faces when we’re together tells me that they don’t care if they never got an apology, they’re just glad to have me back. I’m sure your family feels the same way! :D-->
Galen – It was painful and I feel more sorry for my ex now that he’s really got no one in his corner 100% unconditionally (that he will talk to). My mom realized I was in a tough spot with her trying to protect her without having to endure the wrath of my ex. Mama’s very tenderhearted and to have to be middle man and then to tell his family that my ex wouldn’t accept any of their communication broke her heart.
They say divorce is worse than dealing with a death. A surprise divorce must have been shocking and then to still be living at home and dependent on your parents with all that turmoil…..I just can’t imagine it. It’s hard to believe that they aren’t busting with pride for all that you have accomplished and all the great things that you and Bonnie do for people. *shaking head* All I can think is that you got the best of both sets of genes and learned how “not” to live from them. I think you’re pretty darn special, if you didn’t already know that. ;)-->
Allan – You have a beautiful family, btw! Those girls are knock-outs! And all the men are very handsome! ;)--> You have my utmost respect for standing up to those idiots trying to intimidate you and Selina. My ex would just cower when they attacked us. He would stare at the floor and not say a word when he had already agreed with me. As soon as they started talking, I was invisible and after it was over I was an infidel and contentious woman. Selina has a great strong husband!
signals – Funny how they start sticking to you like velcro when they realize they can get something out of you, isn’t it? Sunday dinner – good. Pity they didn’t come over to use the shower instead.
GeorgeStGeorge – Glad you didn’t have to handle the same things that some did, George. Your family sounds absolutely wonderful and loving.
Oakspear –
quote:
I didn't give them up, but I sure ticked them off
LOL! All I can say, Oak, is LOL!! And, AMEN! from the choir!
JustThinking – TWI was good at keeping us too busy to even think, much less take care of everyday chores and stay in touch with family and non-TWI friends. (Well, non-TWI friends weren’t really allowed, were they?) I talk to my family more than I did BEFORE TWI now that I’m out and realize how precious they are to my life.
SafariVista – It IS irritating and very depressing to think about. Especially for people for whom it’s too late to make amends with some of their family. Your parents sound like wonderful, loving people! Persistent and definitely doing all the right things. Thank God for awesome parents who never give up on us!! Those nephews probably think they have the coolest aunt from their Dad’s side now! :D-->
Those WOW and WD families sound like they were more dysfunctional than the most dysfunctional “earthly” families sometimes. I’m so glad I missed that part of the TWI experience!
dmiller – It’s a shame you missed your brother’s wedding. Those pictures and memories can’t be replaced. Knowing your loving heart, it probably hurt you as bad as it did them for you to not be there. Is that an incident that helped you to start seeing TWI for what it was?
I’ve got Smith, Brown, Jones and Williams in my blood…. (Yep, I’m about as plain as they come) I’m sure you can imagine the family reunion schedule I have with names like that! Once I got engaged to be married any and all trips were verbotten. We spent all our money and vacation days on TWI functions. We didn’t even go home for Christmas. With my ex not speaking with his family, it’s not like we were splitting time between families. Thankfully my family came down to see us when we didn’t come up there. I won’t be missing anymore family reunions unless I’m on my deathbed. In fact, I’ll be in Mexico in July for one rip-roaring time with my Smith cousins! :D-->
Trefor Heywood – I have the feeling you’ve always been rebellious and not a wee bit sorry about it! :D--> I wish you were closer so we could get into some trouble together.
ChasUFarley – I would never miss acknowledging one of my favorite posters!! You KNOW, too, that I can’t resist commenting on my southern neighbors. (You do know that Mississippi’s motto is, “At least we’re not Alabama”, don’t you?):D-->
My ex was also much more of a “disciple” than I was. We were seriously contemplating going WD just a few months after our wedding. Part of me is so glad we didn’t go, but part of me thinks that might have been just what I needed to have seen the light. I can’t imagine being in your shoes on any of those occasions. If there was a “We’re not worthy” smilie, I’d insert it here! No job, no belongings, no support….one more than one occasion?!?!?! You totally have my respect and admiration!! I think I’d be a stark-raving lunatic after that.
I remember, too, those arguments which were really “scolding sessions” with my family. The ex doing the “scolding” or me repeating what he insisted I say. I hated every minute of it and it just made my family more scared to be around us not knowing what the next thing was that would set him/me off.
I’m so glad you got to be with your dad! Pity that limb coordinator had become a mini-lcm by the time he got to MA. Amazing how much some of the people changed, isn’t it? The coolest, kindest people became absolute monsters. The ones who realized this and didn’t like it are the ones who left…..so what’s left at TWI? Monsters! And they aren’t just under the bed…
Some lesbian at hq also accused my ex of being a homo. She was supposedly “cured” but eventually lived in rosie’s house and later ran off with her lesbian lover. I recently spent some time with a couple who was in the wc training with my ex and they told me some of the most horrible things that my ex went through when he was in the training program. Broke my heart to hear it. He’s such an obedient guy and he was so abused by those people. I just can’t imagine going through what he went through, much less what you had to go through.
((((((CHAS))))) You’re one tough cookie!! Thanks for sharing with us. :)-->
btw I might be in your neck of the woods in July. ;)-->
Perhaps I am just a wee bit rebellious Belle in that I do question what seem to be arbitrary positions that cannot be satisfactorily explained.
It might get me into trouble occasionally but God gave me a brain to use and free agency. I loved my family and for something really important like this was prepared to bend the rules. It's sad that nothing short of death and funerals was considered enough. It's also interesting that no action was taken against me, didn't even get reamed out about it. Had they tried it I would simply have gotten out all the sooner.
Good for you, Trefor, for not allowing TWI to come between you and your family! I'd like to say that I would have done the same thing, but I'm really not sure. I was pretty controlled by my ex and he was a wuss when it came to going against any suggestion from leadership.
Trouble? I'm sure we could find something to get into. ;)-->
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Nottawayfer
I definitely alienated my family, partly because I was so waybrained and partly because suggestion is tantamounto to a command.
My sister was a "copout" in a Geerite fellowship for awhile, my mom was just a plain copout.
My poor sister endured me ripping her a new arsehole regularly with my holier than thou attitude because she wasn't "lining up with the Word". She endured it because she knew I was following a complete lunatic, and she and my mom prayed for almost 10 years for me to get out. Gawd, was I such a darn lunatic too! They couldn't believe it when I called them to say I left. I've since apologized, but I still don't feel an apology does justice for what I did. I think where the H did I get off? Lordy!
I dumped my ex husband for copping out. Although that was a wise decision since he was a binge drug user. I couldn't hack his life-style, so I used twi as ane excuse to leave him. We had so many problems before and had counseling, but leadership never wanted to hear the dirt. They always said read "Heirs Together" in Volume 5. Whatever!!! That was the worse advice I was ever given!! It didn't help one iota! It was covering over the real lissues!! What dumbarses!! Once he left, then it was acceptable to leave him.
-->
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Galen
Belle-
I am so sorry, that sounds like it would have been terribly painful to have gone through.
:-)
My parents divorced when I was 15. My mother had been meeting with the family lawyer for months, and my parents lived together right up to the day that my father was served the summons to appear at court. The judge was a family friend and an accountant had a list of all holdings and properties, the judge already had it all laid out how the division of property was going to be. It only needed my father's signature. My siblings were all very close to our mother and they immediately sided with her. I was the only child still living at home, and I assume that my mother and siblings had all discussed the divorce and were prepared for it. It was a surprise to my father and to myself. The divorce decreed that as a child I stay with my mother, and that my father pay child-support until I was an adult. I was the only sibling that really liked my father's parents and enjoyed visiting my grandparents. Our farm was sold, the money divided and my mother remarried immediately.
So by the time that I was in the Navy and got involved with The Way, I really did not have very good relations with my siblings. Then as today, I do make an effort to visit the family once every year or two. But my mother maintains a very high level of control over what they each are allowed to do in life. One year she decreed that all sons and son-in-laws should have vasectomies, and within a month; three of my brothers and my brother-in-law all had it done [not I]. My father was very hard hit by his divorce; he had thought that after 20 years of marriage everything was fine. Since then he has gone through wives, every year or two. Sometimes we only meet a given wife once, and the next time I meet him, he has a new wife.
My eldest sister [Judy] married a grape-farmer who soon became a deacon in our hometown Baptist church. We have enjoyed a few nice discussions with them, over the years about Biblical inerrancy.
Once Bonnie and I did speak with my father about our involvement with TWI. He was not receptive to it, As an adult, I have never been able to sit in his presence accept that within 5 or 10 minutes he becomes agitated and prone to physical violence. Over the past 20 years, he has written us numerous times threatening us, that if we did not straighten out our lives and become respectable, he would beat us, or kill us.
I still call him for Father's day, and for his birthday each year. He openly cusses at me, and tells me that I am worthless, etc. In 1985 when our first son was born, my father came to the hospital and became very threatening. We got a restraining order put against him at that time. Bonnie and I used to enjoy visiting my Paternal Grandparents. Once she wanted to talk to them about The Way, and our home fellowship. But my Grandfather cut her off, and explained that my father had already filled them in on our involvement with a "mind-altering satanic-cult" and that he had no intention of giving us any money to support it. We never had any intention of asking anyone for money, but I suppose such was a common tale among the churches and 'anti-way' propaganda. Otherwise we did have a fairly close relationship with my Paternal Grandparents. All the way up until both of their deaths in their late 90's.
My Maternal Grandparents openly were always polite with me as a child. As an adult I tried to visit them each year, they openly criticized me for not having a respectable career. [in their culture, anyone who wears a necktie or a suit is a crook. They lost their first farm in Oklahoma during the dust-bowl / Great Depression and they lost their second farm in California to Eminent Domain during the construction of Don Pedro Hydro-Electric Dam.]
Last summer we met with my father and his current wife. She is trying to 'make peace' in between us. During our discussion, it came out that my father strongly believes that Bonnie and I have been drug-abusers, apparently for many years he has 'confirmed' his belief that we were using heroin each time that we did something that he did not understand. He is still upset that I have never held a job, and how I could have gone so far through life and yet never become a 'responsible citizen'. My father and his new wife are members of their local Baptist church in Missouri and he teaches children’s Sunday school classes.
Bonnie has no surviving parents, both of her parents died of cancers within a year of each other, when she was 13. Her teen years were spent living with various cousins and she finally moved in with a girlfriend from school and lived there while attending high school. Bonnie does have an elder sister, who did take PFAL and had gone WOW. She left the WOW field and has never attended a twig since. This was all before I met Bonnie, in 1979. When Bonnie was already an Advanced Class grad.
I do try with my family.
I see them now, at least every couple years and we still are willing to pray with them, or share the Bible with them.
:-)
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Allan
When Selina and I left TWI in-res. and arrived back in N.Z. her brother called her up and demanded she leave me.I guess they believed she could be manipulated more.
Anyway, she told him no,I was the father of her kids etc..
So he asked her to ask me if I hated him.( This is how cunning they think they are )
As soon as she asked me I knew that if I said "yes", he would quote some scripture about 'the love of God not being in me'( maybe that was word of wisdom ?)
Anyways, I said " Tell him I love him " at which point he apparently flew into a fit of a rage on the other end of the phone, hung up and we never heard from him again till years later when him and a karate kid walked into our home to assault me in front of my family !
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Galen
Sounds like the better question would be:
How many of us come from 'functional' families verses 'non-functional' families?
and to what degree was TWI involved with that family's dis-function?
Mine was perfectly dis-functional long before I got involved with TWI, and no WC or any other believer ever had any contact with them.
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hiway29
that's quite a 'cliff hanger' Allan-what happened when the 'karate kid' showed up?
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Allan
The two of them walked through the door,started yelling, threatening,thumping me on the chest,I fell over backwards.I believe they wanted me to retaliate so Karate Kid could finish me off(must be that word of wisdom thingy again !)
One of My kids had actually phoned the police and they turned up very quickly and slapped a two year trespass notice on them.
What caused this ? I had smiled and said hello to a lady in their fellowship in a shopping mall a couple of days previously as I walked past !
They had told their ladies that if I were to do anything like that for them to start screaming RAPE,RAPE.
Kind of ironic isn't it.Maybe I should write a book, but GSC is doing a much better job!!
It probably sounds like I'm making some of this up, but I assure you I am not !!
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signals
Perhaps we should describe family as either 'earthly' or 'spiritually'! Yes I gave up my real family, after all I felt more, ahem, love from my spiritual family.
The worst is when you go WOW, especially local, because my WOW family would suddenly show up if I was invited for a Sunday dinner and such from my real family. Other times we had no where to live I get invited to my real family and my WOW idiots feel we have to stay together. My WOW family lacked hygienic skills and had BO that lingered long after they left.
So yeah, my relationship changed dramatically because of a cult, and things have never been the same!
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Galen
Allan:
"The two of them walked through the door,started yelling, threatening,thumping me on the chest,I fell over backwards.I believe they wanted me to retaliate so Karate Kid could finish me off(must be that word of wisdom thingy again !) One of My kids had actually phoned the police and they turned up very quickly and slapped a two year trespass notice on them."
You are to be complemented for your cool handling of the situation. Many others would have been tricked into reacting offensively [which was obviously their intent].
Good for you.
:-)
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GeorgeStGeorge
By the time I joined TWI, I was in graduate school over 100 miles from my family; and after getting my degree I moved another 1000 miles away, so there was never any interaction between my family and any TWI leadership. My fellowship with TWI was a little tough, since they were all RC's; but they all repected my desire to serve God.
My family was always welcome to visit, and I was always welcome there.
George
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Oakspear
I didn't give them up, but I sure ticked them off
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mj412
cant blame the way this time.
dysfunctional? lol no we are just honest. a chunk of people with issues trying to get along and care the best we can .
I watch two girls at work , and hear how hard they work at making sure the house home and family and car and dog is perfect.
Im talking about how he got caught by the cops with no insurance on the carand they are shocked and gasp with the shame of it for me! and then they go On about the good college boy in public, he likes church functions when he is home they give him two hundred a week for spending money (nice of him hmm?): but break down in private talks with tears about how their son may have had some drinks one night as he is in the hospital with an overdose in handcuffs... oh mY! (the thugs must have forced him to do it ya know!) in the new car with insurance no less oh my! (said in a wisper with only the chosen ears to hear!)
What some present to the world as the way a family is and what we are is sometimes two very different groups!! haha
we are honest in a small town we have to be always in your face about the time ya did that . But some live in the illusion of perfection it just always seemed to much work to impress others to me.
how do people scream I hate you and shut the F up! and still break light speed to be there when the same person gets hurt or needs help ?
we are all insane.. but we love one another very much.. so we function just fine.
I do not know how to be perfect. it looks difficlt and stressful to me.
Honestly, sometimes when they go on about how life is with no problems present themself out loud in reality I do wonder how the hell I ended up with such a group of cowboys, geeks, freaks and whores lol then I look at my own life and think of all the times they stood with me in my stink, and say thank God for what I got . AMEN?
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JustThinking
I didn't give them up nor was it suggested. However, I stupidly gave up so much of my time that they never saw me. That got fixed when I left TWI though. Life is wonderful again and my family and I talk all the time.
:)-->
JT
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SafariVista
This is an irritating subject~
Belle, the way you and your husband were manipulated by way leadership made me cry...especailly the part about your husband's Grandmother & Mother... I thought as followers of Jesus Christ, we were to be examples... what a waste of precious time.
Shellon, God bless your wonderful family... you have something special. So glad they waited for you
:)-->
Galen~ you and your wife sound like some very precious people... your Mother on the other hand sounds a bit scarey... & your Dad a Sunday School Teacher, YIKES! He thought you guys were using Heroin? Insane!
Allan~ maybe I should re-read... is your Brother-in-law still with the Way? Is he trying to protect a Way Fellowship? The violence is insane... I applaud you too for knowing not to use physical violence in your situation with the Karate Kid... sounds like Brother-in-law has a few screws loose!
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SafariVista
I didn't answer the question...
Yes, I did give up on and cut my family out of my life. Communication from my end stopped with them.
Three Nephews, all toddlers at the time, never knew their only Aunt on their Dad's side.
Looking back, my parents were determined type of folks. Shortly after becoming involved in TWI, I went WOW to Hawaii. (didn't request it, and only had $400...Michael S*ith...did you have something to do with that?)
My Mom wrote a letter EVERY week, and sent a care package every month! She kept all correspondence light & happy, telling me about the everyday things her and my dad were doing...
She would call now & then...and ask a few questions... I'm sure I was fairly rude to her~ that unbeliever who had the chance and didn't take it!
Sometimes she'd include things in the package for the other three in our 'family' there
--> NOW THAT WAS A DISFUCTIONAL FAMILY~ THE WOW FAMILY!
After the WOW year, we went to the ROA for our pinning... I stopped at home for a short visit to pick up some things they had kept for me there... get my car... and my parents offered to PAY for my car's shipping to Hawaii~
They just kept on giving & loving & speaking positive things.
Years later when we left TWI, I found out that my Mom had read several books and took classes on how to deal with children in a cult~ what to do and say, and what NOT to do. This was suggested to her from her Lutheran Pastor
:)-->
Even though I had felt incredibly bad about how I treated my family, when I apologized, they all said, no big deal, it's okay~ we love you!
My mom is from Germany~ old fashioned, set in her ways (somewhat), but sought councel on the matter of her daughter... even though she had to learn and practice 'new' behavior and thinking, she did whatever it took and believed when she asked God to get me OUT, that He would NOT fail her.
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dmiller
I never cut my family out of my life because of twi, except for once -- and that happened as a wow. While living in Indiana, I would always go see the folks, do family get-togethers, etc., and have time for both them and twi at the same time. (twi-1 was a lot less restrictive about that stuff -- imo).
Moved to Minnesota in 1978, went wow, and my brother got married that wow year in June of '79. I was told I would be *leaving the field* if I went to his wedding, so being a *good wafer* -- I did not go.
:(--> Ironically enough -- it was NOT considered *leaving the field* to go to AC '79. 
They were pretty ticked at me for a few years, and I swore I would never do anything like that again. It's all water under the bridge now, but it wasn't a whole lot fun back then. Their attitude softened towards me, once I finally realized the cult status of twi -- and told them I was sorry I let an outfit like that get in between us as a family.
David
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Trefor Heywood
I "left the field" to go to my brother's wedding and never got told off for it.
I was not sorry I did then and obviously am even less sorry now!
:D-->
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ChasUFarley
I made the mistake of marrying someone from a different part of the country (I'm from Maine, he was from Alabama). He was much more the "disciple" than I was - willing to go wherever leadership "suggested". A couple of times we had made plans to move to New England, but he would get "revelation" that we shouldn't go. Once it happened THE DAY BEFORE WE WERE TO MOVE! We had sold lock-stock-and-barrel, quit our jobs, made all of our arrangements - and he changed his mind. It was a real mind *****, you know.
We would go to Maine to visit my folks about once a year. Since my husband had trouble keeping a job, it was difficult for me to go home to visit any more than that.
To further complicate things, my husband was really into the "present truth" to the degree where he totally alienated one of my brothers, who is homosexual (but not open about it), and really upset my mother. He lost his temper with my mother during this incident - he was one of those people who HAD to be RIGHT about something - even if he proved his point all the WRONG ways... This drove a huge wedge between me, my husband, and my family.
When my father was dying I did get a call from the Limb Coordinator who basically TOLD me to go to my father to be with him. My dad had had an aneurism and lost over 75% of his blood. His vascular surgeon told us that Dad had a 2% chance of survival. I flew home the following day, stayed in Maine for 3 weeks -- my dad recovered enough to go home, and I returned to AL. My dad was a very strong man!
My dad ended up with an infection from the operation I regret not staying in ME to take care of him after he went home, but there's nothing I can do about that now. He lived at home for another 12 weeks, when I got another call that he was dying. Again, I had support from the Limb Coordinator to go home. I flew back to Maine to be with my dad. The doctors said he had only 3 to 5 days to live - he lived another 3 weeks! I was there with him at the hospital every day. My dad's last words to me were, "I love you." I can't imagine what my life would be like if I was not there to hear that. He passed away about 20 mins after that. I was also able to be there for my mother and to help make the final arrangements after he passed away.
Fast forward six years....
That same Limb Coordinator from AL was relocated to MA, where I happened to be living. Shortly after he moved there I found myself in a meeting with all the WC in the state of MA (all 5 of them - LOL!). I was confronted for several petty things, among them - going to visit my widowed mother in the next state too often (even though I filled out all the right forms!) (She was like an hour and a half away - and I had to get "permission" - and I was nearly 30 years old! GOOD GRIEF!)
I didn't stop visiting her - I just skipped out of town when I knew there were WC meetings. No one knew and no one asked. (Ask me no questions and I'll tell you no lies!)
When my husband and I were kicked off staff (because he was 'sniffed out' for being homo - the irony!) it was not believers who were there for us. We were basically kicked out to fend for ourselves in a city we didn't know. We had no housing, jobs, a car - nothing! We had sold everything to go on staff. The Household was not made available to us for anything - even though I knew severel people could have helped us out. My husband was m&a'ed, and I left him.
After everything that happened, my family took me in with no questions asked - and I was still standing with TWI (yeah, I'm thick sometimes...). I know that my husband ended up needing to lean on his family for help - his family, by the way, was some of the nicest, most loving people I ever met in my life. I miss them, even now, but know that contact with them would be painful (I don't think he ever told them why we split and don't feel it's my place to tell them....)
So, I didn't totally give up my family. I made some choices that weren't the best for a real close relationship with them at times, but I can't be a Monday-morning quarterback about it now. I'm just glad that they didn't totally give up on me!
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Belle
Wayfer Not! – Isn’t it funny how all those people with copped out attitudes acted more patient, loving and kind than our self-righteous selves? Thank God they are better people than we were.
:)--> I also feel like my apologies aren’t enough, but just feeling the love from them and seeing my family’s faces when we’re together tells me that they don’t care if they never got an apology, they’re just glad to have me back. I’m sure your family feels the same way! 
:D-->
Galen – It was painful and I feel more sorry for my ex now that he’s really got no one in his corner 100% unconditionally (that he will talk to). My mom realized I was in a tough spot with her trying to protect her without having to endure the wrath of my ex. Mama’s very tenderhearted and to have to be middle man and then to tell his family that my ex wouldn’t accept any of their communication broke her heart.
They say divorce is worse than dealing with a death. A surprise divorce must have been shocking and then to still be living at home and dependent on your parents with all that turmoil…..I just can’t imagine it. It’s hard to believe that they aren’t busting with pride for all that you have accomplished and all the great things that you and Bonnie do for people. *shaking head* All I can think is that you got the best of both sets of genes and learned how “not” to live from them. I think you’re pretty darn special, if you didn’t already know that.
;)-->
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Belle
Allan – You have a beautiful family, btw! Those girls are knock-outs! And all the men are very handsome!
;)--> You have my utmost respect for standing up to those idiots trying to intimidate you and Selina. My ex would just cower when they attacked us. He would stare at the floor and not say a word when he had already agreed with me. As soon as they started talking, I was invisible and after it was over I was an infidel and contentious woman. Selina has a great strong husband!
signals – Funny how they start sticking to you like velcro when they realize they can get something out of you, isn’t it? Sunday dinner – good. Pity they didn’t come over to use the shower instead.
GeorgeStGeorge – Glad you didn’t have to handle the same things that some did, George. Your family sounds absolutely wonderful and loving.
Oakspear –
LOL! All I can say, Oak, is LOL!! And, AMEN! from the choir!
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Belle
JustThinking – TWI was good at keeping us too busy to even think, much less take care of everyday chores and stay in touch with family and non-TWI friends. (Well, non-TWI friends weren’t really allowed, were they?) I talk to my family more than I did BEFORE TWI now that I’m out and realize how precious they are to my life.
SafariVista – It IS irritating and very depressing to think about. Especially for people for whom it’s too late to make amends with some of their family. Your parents sound like wonderful, loving people! Persistent and definitely doing all the right things. Thank God for awesome parents who never give up on us!! Those nephews probably think they have the coolest aunt from their Dad’s side now!
:D-->
Those WOW and WD families sound like they were more dysfunctional than the most dysfunctional “earthly” families sometimes. I’m so glad I missed that part of the TWI experience!
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ChasUFarley
Hey! Whadda 'bout me?! :-)
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Belle
dmiller – It’s a shame you missed your brother’s wedding. Those pictures and memories can’t be replaced. Knowing your loving heart, it probably hurt you as bad as it did them for you to not be there. Is that an incident that helped you to start seeing TWI for what it was?
I’ve got Smith, Brown, Jones and Williams in my blood…. (Yep, I’m about as plain as they come) I’m sure you can imagine the family reunion schedule I have with names like that! Once I got engaged to be married any and all trips were verbotten. We spent all our money and vacation days on TWI functions. We didn’t even go home for Christmas. With my ex not speaking with his family, it’s not like we were splitting time between families. Thankfully my family came down to see us when we didn’t come up there. I won’t be missing anymore family reunions unless I’m on my deathbed. In fact, I’ll be in Mexico in July for one rip-roaring time with my Smith cousins!
:D-->
Trefor Heywood – I have the feeling you’ve always been rebellious and not a wee bit sorry about it!
:D--> I wish you were closer so we could get into some trouble together.
ChasUFarley – I would never miss acknowledging one of my favorite posters!! You KNOW, too, that I can’t resist commenting on my southern neighbors. (You do know that Mississippi’s motto is, “At least we’re not Alabama”, don’t you?)
:D-->
My ex was also much more of a “disciple” than I was. We were seriously contemplating going WD just a few months after our wedding. Part of me is so glad we didn’t go, but part of me thinks that might have been just what I needed to have seen the light. I can’t imagine being in your shoes on any of those occasions. If there was a “We’re not worthy” smilie, I’d insert it here! No job, no belongings, no support….one more than one occasion?!?!?! You totally have my respect and admiration!! I think I’d be a stark-raving lunatic after that.
I remember, too, those arguments which were really “scolding sessions” with my family. The ex doing the “scolding” or me repeating what he insisted I say. I hated every minute of it and it just made my family more scared to be around us not knowing what the next thing was that would set him/me off.
I’m so glad you got to be with your dad! Pity that limb coordinator had become a mini-lcm by the time he got to MA. Amazing how much some of the people changed, isn’t it? The coolest, kindest people became absolute monsters. The ones who realized this and didn’t like it are the ones who left…..so what’s left at TWI? Monsters! And they aren’t just under the bed…
Some lesbian at hq also accused my ex of being a homo. She was supposedly “cured” but eventually lived in rosie’s house and later ran off with her lesbian lover. I recently spent some time with a couple who was in the wc training with my ex and they told me some of the most horrible things that my ex went through when he was in the training program. Broke my heart to hear it. He’s such an obedient guy and he was so abused by those people. I just can’t imagine going through what he went through, much less what you had to go through.
((((((CHAS))))) You’re one tough cookie!! Thanks for sharing with us.
:)-->
btw I might be in your neck of the woods in July.
;)-->
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Trefor Heywood
Perhaps I am just a wee bit rebellious Belle in that I do question what seem to be arbitrary positions that cannot be satisfactorily explained.
It might get me into trouble occasionally but God gave me a brain to use and free agency. I loved my family and for something really important like this was prepared to bend the rules. It's sad that nothing short of death and funerals was considered enough. It's also interesting that no action was taken against me, didn't even get reamed out about it. Had they tried it I would simply have gotten out all the sooner.
What kind of trouble did you have in mind?
;)-->
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Belle
Good for you, Trefor, for not allowing TWI to come between you and your family! I'd like to say that I would have done the same thing, but I'm really not sure. I was pretty controlled by my ex and he was a wuss when it came to going against any suggestion from leadership.
Trouble? I'm sure we could find something to get into.
;)-->
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