So basically what you're saying is that you can control/deal with the higher, spiritual cause (demons), with the lower, physical solution (medicine, therapy)?Wow! That's rich! Big Grin Gotta remember that one. NOW look at who's being absurd! Demons? Being driven away due to some pills? ... But hey, can't prove it, but we don't need to, do we, cuz all we have to do to get around that minor annoyance is call it 'spiritual'. ... Hmmmmm, seems kinda convenient to me. ... TOO convenient.
Absurd? Not at all. As I said earlier, spirits work partly by exacerbating pysical problems and circumstances. If you're at peace sitting at home watching the Hawks and the Heat, they've got nothing to work with. But if your wife walks in and starts yelling and screaming at you, you get anxious. Spirits can then intensify that anxiety and raise it to an ubearable level. The way many antidepressents work is simply by controlling the level of certain enzymes in the brain to prevent you from getting anxious in the first place. (SSRI's like Prozac and Lexapro work this way.
I have a friend who was put on an SSRI for manic depression. He said that when he was on it, you could have walked up to him and said, "Hey man, your house is on fire!" and he would have casually turned, looked at the burning house and said. "Huh. Guess I'll have to move." It puts the person very near an emotional flatline instead of the roller coaster they are accustomed to. If that is done with mediacation, the spirit has nothing to work with because the person doesn't get anxious in the first place.
The most common error people make regarding demons is giving them too much power. They can't just jump in someone and take over. They have to have a lot of help. Like fear, anxiety, anger, lust, frustration, loss, grief, etc.(I've experienced this by the way--not the screaming wife, the intensification of anxiety or stress.) Once when my wife-to-be and I were living in different cities, I just got to where I missed her so badly I could hardly stand it. I began to get so worked up, I didn't know what I was going to do. As my emotional state starting to spiral out of control, I became dimly aware that something unnatural was going on and I began to fear that I might literally lose my mind. So I simply said, "God I can't handle this." And immediately, the anxiety and stress disappeared like someone had blown it off of me. Is this proof that there was a spiritual attack going on? No. Is there proof that it wasn't? No. I offer it as an example of what I'm talking about. Spirits are like emotional parasites. They have to have something to feed off of. When we control the hormones that channel emotional engergy through the brain, they are cut off and neutralized.
Is that something that can be clinically proven? No, but it's something that can be known by experience. You can't clinically prove that love or faith exist, but they change people's lives just the same.
So, you have 2 children, and one comes home and says they have a wonderful relationship it just happens to be with someone of the same sex, would you accept it? Would you love their partner? My point is the same as the one I made with Galen, G-d loves us all, I will not debate what is in bible, it's there. My question is (and it's not just directed at you)
Will G-d still love someone even is they're gay?
I think we've already addressed this. Please see my response to your previous post.
quote:
I guess, i find it amusing that people think that someone would CHOOSE to be gay, what a good idea, i want to be set aside looked down apon, tortured and ridiculed..or should they say i'm going to deny my inner feelings.
Once again, you are responding to things I have not said. Not only that, you're ignoring what I have said. Admittedly I've said a lot, so maybe it's getting hard to keep track. What I have been saying is, many people don't conciously choose to be gay. They get coerced or hustled into it, either by spiritual pressure, seduction, drugs, alcohol, or all of the above. They fold under the pressure, either because of ignorance of what's going on or some other reason.
quote:
Jbarrax, yes there are homosexuals, (especially women) who have been hurt and mistreated, who fall back in to the comfort of a woman woman relationship, but the topic here is "teenage" homosexuality, and most teenagers(hopefully) haven't felt that pain.
That's not been my experience. The first girl I knew who did that was in high school. That was way back in 1978. She had a string of heartbreaks (one of which I'M sorry to say, was with me) and declared she was through with men and started pursuing girls. Based on what I'm seeing and hearing as a parent, today's adolescents are more likely to be involved in romantic relationships than ever, and at earlier ages. Middle school kids have intense infatuations, rommances, (some sexual), and breakups. Teenagers commit suicide because of bitter breakups. Switching sides would be a lot less drastic reaction than kissing a revolver.
quote:
As for me personally I do get uncomftorable around two men kissing, but i also get uncomftorable around any major public display of affection..
Duly noted. But, imho, there's an extra element of EWWWWWWW when you see two men kissing as opposed to seeing a man and woman kissing--at the same level of passion mind you. I think a mildly passionate liplock between a man and a woman at a cafe table would be much less irksome than the exact same kiss exchanged between two men. Of course that's unprovable, but I would bet you dollars to doughnuts if you got 500 people together and somehow scientifically measured their emotional discomfort, the male kiss would cause much higher levels of discomfort than the hetero smooch.
quote:
if i offended you i apologize, but as you said you enjoy a debate, i enjoy taking up arms for the underdog..
"would you? and since I'm writing Galen, what about you?"
Do you never get bored of reading the same thing posted over and over again?
It is my understanding that Our Heavenly Father loves everyone.
The Great Architect of the Universe desires people to worship and draw close to Him.
He has laid out those things which He sees as being 'good', and those things which He sees as being 'bad'. He would prefer us to do those things which are 'good'. They tend to draw us closer to Him, and to build a society which is over-all closer to Him. The 'good' things lead us toward healthier and wealthier lives.
I certainly dont understand all things that Our Creator does, I am merely a creation of His.
I do know that as a father myself I love my children:
and that my Spiritual Father says that He loves us too.
I want the best for my children, I want them to be their best, so that their future's can be the best they can possibly be.
Does that mean that each time they do something that I dont think wise that I should love them any less? No, I dont think so.
I am still here for them, to help them, to love them, to set them back on their feet again and wish them well.
I have certainly done many things in my life that were wrong, does that mean that the Ears of Heaven are forever closed to me? I dont think so.
How could I do any less, when this is the example that I see set before me?
The more sin that I do, certainly hurts I should imagine, but does it over-come my Sonship with my Heavenly Father? I dont think so. Whether I go through life and only kill a few men, or if I go on to kill a few more, will it ever really detract from My Hevenly Father's love?
But should I? Wouldn't I do far better, walking through life ever nearer and nearer to Him? Ever 'in tune' and listening to His gentle sweet voice. Offering me guidance and advice, who to minister to, and which lane to drive in, and which chorse to do first. Wouldn't living life striving to be closer to Him, be a better idea? I think so.
Now I am certainly a far worse father than He.
But I do see His example.
What could a child do, that would remove my seed from him? Nothing. He is always going to be my child.
Would I prefer that he get a good education, a solid career, and most of all a smart capable wife? Certainly.
But no matter what our children do in their lives, we will still love them.
"Jbarrax, yes there are homosexuals, (especially women) who have been hurt and mistreated, who fall back in to the comfort of a woman woman relationship, but the topic here is "teenage" homosexuality, and most teenagers(hopefully) haven't felt that pain."
LOL
It is interesting, our different perspectives here. See I have dealt with and ministered to so many men who have been hurt, mistreated and desserted by females. Often they it takes many years for them to climb back out of the debt, and they will continue paying [financially] for the remainder of their lives.
But I suppose that I could see your point of view as well, obviously having seen so many men that have been treated so, there must have been some female somewhere who was mistreated as well.
YOUR CHILD, comes home and announces this is it, the person i love the person who makes me happy... what will you do?
pray for that child to be "healed"? or accept them?
There are a LOT of things I would not "accept" from one of my children and announcing that he or she is in love with someone of the same gender is just one of them.
i have a neighbor, a single mom, like myself, who has dated over 50 men she met on the internet in the last 18 mos. I never asked how many she slept with, but I am confident the # is rather high...close to 50%.
I work at a non-profit and have at least four gay and lesbian co-workers. Of the four, 3 are in long term committed relationships (ten years or more) and one who is the choir director at his Lutheran church, single and not much into dating - like me. All four are all in their late 50s early 60s. Too bad you don't know them; remarkable people who live Godly lives by anyones standards and because of their age, no one would even consider their sexual orientation. Why? Because when you look at them you are not thinking about sex.
As an aside - I would trust any of them to babysit my kids. I wouldn't let married hetero men screaming about the sin of homosexuality and pounding their bibles anywhere near my children. That's the disguise of most predators.
With all do respect, your daughter will be dealing with these types of issues throughout her life. Teenagers in general whether they are overweight, or underweight, or look different in anyway go through this. You love your daughter and with that love tell it like it is. Honesty is really the only thing that will help her to understand. People will always have something to say about who she is, gay or not. She goes to church with you and is involved with a youth group, do they know she's gay? If her peers at church respected her then they would not make hurtful remarks about her or her theatre friends. There is no easy way to go with this. She will be discriminated against because that is society, christian or not. She needs to put her "tuff skins" on and be thankful she has a mother that stands by her.
What they used to call 'demon possession' is now known as schizophrenia, paranoia, and various other kinds of mental illnesses, that can be treated with medication, rather than 'driving the demons out'.
I ain't arguing that the meds help, but giving *an old dog*, a new name doesn't change the situation.
Meds mask the problem, and control it -- they do not cure, or alleviate it. A schizoprenic with no psycotropic meds is a scary proposition for even the most expereienced in the field, and when *said* experienced folks run across a situation like this -- *demon possessed* is the first thing that runs through the mind.
Now -- sorry for the de-rail -- back to the "gay teen-ager" thread.
Even nature has shown that animals are bisexual. I have a neutered cat that keeps trying to hump the other male. I have nothing to prove to anyone.
What? A male cat humps another cat and this is "proof" of homosexuality? I have a dog that used to hump my youngest child's leg until we made him stop. What would that be? It's bestiality if a human wants to have sex with an animal, so if an animal wants to have sex with a human...? Doggylingus? As a teenager I used to hump the air machine at the bowling alley to the delight of some of my friends. That would be...ductrophelia? Coming in shorts and quarts, kids.
I didn't say anything was proof of homsexuality johniam. As a matter of fact I stated that neither side has any rock-clad proof of their position earlier in a post.
From things I have read and seen, in the animal world there does appear to be bi-sexual behavior. Just an observation to include in this thread. Didn't say anything about beastiality (or however you spell it)though.
I would say that God making Adam and Eve is rock-clad proof.
If it was in God's plan for humans to be bisexual, not being a big deal what gender one has sex with, wouldn't he have formed humans that way? Going both ways? Seems that'd be logical and proof that bisexuality was planned.
Well sure oldies, if that is what one believes, but not everybody believes that. That is still not proof - some people just think that is a story in a book. Because some believe in evolution etc etc etc.
No one side can prove their beliefs as being the right beliefs.
"I am not pontificating about homosexuality one way or the other but I remember reading just the other day that Jesus hung out with harlots, tax collectors, winebibbers (my kind of people)and sinners of every stripe. I never remember reading that he shunned or scorned any of them but he was disgusted, sickened and had plenty to say about hard, unloving, legalistic religious people. They might be reminded as the Pharisees were by Jesus, the harlots, sinners (and gays) enter the kingdom before you."
I think the whole “natural-unnatural” thing is silly. What animals do neither validates nor invalidates what people do. The “if it had been in God’s plan for people to ___, He’d have formed them ___” line of reasoning is silly too. God didn’t give me long, hard, flat feet. Does that mean that I shouldn’t ski? There are lots of things humans do that they couldn’t do without man-made devices. Homosexuality requires no such devices. How is it less “natural” than brewing a cup of coffee, posting on the Internet, or driving to work?
Earlier today, I picked my mother up from the hospital. Those people did all sorts of unnatural things to her while she was there, and they do even more unnatural things to other people on a regular basis. In our society, we not only approve of such unnatural behavior, we liberally fund it.
If God wants to be "silly", then this is fine with me. I think He may have been being sorta silly when he invented giraffes, hippopotamuses and platypusses, or the neat little mating dance that whooping cranes do :)-->
The Bible condemns a lot of nasty behaviors and says that Christians should not commit them.
And anyone who practices (indulges) them will not see heaven.
So your child comes to and says they are gay. According to some, we should welcome them and find out who they are having sex with and welcome them into our homes.
First, maybe you would want to ask your child why they feel this way, why they want to act out in this way and how old is their partner.
In my state it is a crime to have sex with anyone under 16.
Second, ask yourself what you say if your child was having sex with an adult? Would this change your view of their "lifestyle"?
Or what would you say if they said they were seducing/raping younger children.
And what kind of gay person are they planning on being? There are many types and not all live healthy lifestyles — nor do they want to.
Are you knowledgeable enough about gay sex practices to counsel them about the consequences?
Will you ask your child to be celibate until they are an adult? How will/would you enforce it.
Would you deny them access to pornography or homoerotic literature so they can better express themselves?
Now fill in some of these questions with drugs, alcohol, gossip, stealing, lying, cheating, and see what answers you get.
I think the whole “natural-unnatural” thing is silly.
Well, it stands to reason that if the concept of homosexuality being un-natural comes from God, and was being quoted as something God has said, and what He thinks of this lifestyle, than to say that the concept which came from God is "silly", that that is to say that "God is silly", for He said a "silly thing".
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Jbarrax
Thanks LG. I'll take a look.
Garth.
Absurd? Not at all. As I said earlier, spirits work partly by exacerbating pysical problems and circumstances. If you're at peace sitting at home watching the Hawks and the Heat, they've got nothing to work with. But if your wife walks in and starts yelling and screaming at you, you get anxious. Spirits can then intensify that anxiety and raise it to an ubearable level. The way many antidepressents work is simply by controlling the level of certain enzymes in the brain to prevent you from getting anxious in the first place. (SSRI's like Prozac and Lexapro work this way.
I have a friend who was put on an SSRI for manic depression. He said that when he was on it, you could have walked up to him and said, "Hey man, your house is on fire!" and he would have casually turned, looked at the burning house and said. "Huh. Guess I'll have to move." It puts the person very near an emotional flatline instead of the roller coaster they are accustomed to. If that is done with mediacation, the spirit has nothing to work with because the person doesn't get anxious in the first place.
The most common error people make regarding demons is giving them too much power. They can't just jump in someone and take over. They have to have a lot of help. Like fear, anxiety, anger, lust, frustration, loss, grief, etc.(I've experienced this by the way--not the screaming wife, the intensification of anxiety or stress.) Once when my wife-to-be and I were living in different cities, I just got to where I missed her so badly I could hardly stand it. I began to get so worked up, I didn't know what I was going to do. As my emotional state starting to spiral out of control, I became dimly aware that something unnatural was going on and I began to fear that I might literally lose my mind. So I simply said, "God I can't handle this." And immediately, the anxiety and stress disappeared like someone had blown it off of me. Is this proof that there was a spiritual attack going on? No. Is there proof that it wasn't? No. I offer it as an example of what I'm talking about. Spirits are like emotional parasites. They have to have something to feed off of. When we control the hormones that channel emotional engergy through the brain, they are cut off and neutralized.
Is that something that can be clinically proven? No, but it's something that can be known by experience. You can't clinically prove that love or faith exist, but they change people's lives just the same.
Peace
JerryB
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Jbarrax
I think we've already addressed this. Please see my response to your previous post.
Once again, you are responding to things I have not said. Not only that, you're ignoring what I have said. Admittedly I've said a lot, so maybe it's getting hard to keep track. What I have been saying is, many people don't conciously choose to be gay. They get coerced or hustled into it, either by spiritual pressure, seduction, drugs, alcohol, or all of the above. They fold under the pressure, either because of ignorance of what's going on or some other reason.
That's not been my experience. The first girl I knew who did that was in high school. That was way back in 1978. She had a string of heartbreaks (one of which I'M sorry to say, was with me) and declared she was through with men and started pursuing girls. Based on what I'm seeing and hearing as a parent, today's adolescents are more likely to be involved in romantic relationships than ever, and at earlier ages. Middle school kids have intense infatuations, rommances, (some sexual), and breakups. Teenagers commit suicide because of bitter breakups. Switching sides would be a lot less drastic reaction than kissing a revolver. Duly noted. But, imho, there's an extra element of EWWWWWWW when you see two men kissing as opposed to seeing a man and woman kissing--at the same level of passion mind you. I think a mildly passionate liplock between a man and a woman at a cafe table would be much less irksome than the exact same kiss exchanged between two men. Of course that's unprovable, but I would bet you dollars to doughnuts if you got 500 people together and somehow scientifically measured their emotional discomfort, the male kiss would cause much higher levels of discomfort than the hetero smooch. None taken Sharon.Peace
JerryB
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Galen
sharon:
"would you? and since I'm writing Galen, what about you?"
Do you never get bored of reading the same thing posted over and over again?
It is my understanding that Our Heavenly Father loves everyone.
The Great Architect of the Universe desires people to worship and draw close to Him.
He has laid out those things which He sees as being 'good', and those things which He sees as being 'bad'. He would prefer us to do those things which are 'good'. They tend to draw us closer to Him, and to build a society which is over-all closer to Him. The 'good' things lead us toward healthier and wealthier lives.
I certainly dont understand all things that Our Creator does, I am merely a creation of His.
I do know that as a father myself I love my children:
and that my Spiritual Father says that He loves us too.
I want the best for my children, I want them to be their best, so that their future's can be the best they can possibly be.
Does that mean that each time they do something that I dont think wise that I should love them any less? No, I dont think so.
I am still here for them, to help them, to love them, to set them back on their feet again and wish them well.
I have certainly done many things in my life that were wrong, does that mean that the Ears of Heaven are forever closed to me? I dont think so.
How could I do any less, when this is the example that I see set before me?
The more sin that I do, certainly hurts I should imagine, but does it over-come my Sonship with my Heavenly Father? I dont think so. Whether I go through life and only kill a few men, or if I go on to kill a few more, will it ever really detract from My Hevenly Father's love?
But should I? Wouldn't I do far better, walking through life ever nearer and nearer to Him? Ever 'in tune' and listening to His gentle sweet voice. Offering me guidance and advice, who to minister to, and which lane to drive in, and which chorse to do first. Wouldn't living life striving to be closer to Him, be a better idea? I think so.
Now I am certainly a far worse father than He.
But I do see His example.
What could a child do, that would remove my seed from him? Nothing. He is always going to be my child.
Would I prefer that he get a good education, a solid career, and most of all a smart capable wife? Certainly.
But no matter what our children do in their lives, we will still love them.
"Jbarrax, yes there are homosexuals, (especially women) who have been hurt and mistreated, who fall back in to the comfort of a woman woman relationship, but the topic here is "teenage" homosexuality, and most teenagers(hopefully) haven't felt that pain."
LOL
It is interesting, our different perspectives here. See I have dealt with and ministered to so many men who have been hurt, mistreated and desserted by females. Often they it takes many years for them to climb back out of the debt, and they will continue paying [financially] for the remainder of their lives.
But I suppose that I could see your point of view as well, obviously having seen so many men that have been treated so, there must have been some female somewhere who was mistreated as well.
:-)
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Jbarrax
There are a LOT of things I would not "accept" from one of my children and announcing that he or she is in love with someone of the same gender is just one of them.
Peace
JerryB
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sharon
so if your child came home and said that they were gay, there out a here..wow, that's rough.
I have 3 sons, there are things that i to would not accept, them loving someone isin't one of those things.
i mean no disrepect (and remember you've got that apology)
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karmicdebt
i have a neighbor, a single mom, like myself, who has dated over 50 men she met on the internet in the last 18 mos. I never asked how many she slept with, but I am confident the # is rather high...close to 50%.
I work at a non-profit and have at least four gay and lesbian co-workers. Of the four, 3 are in long term committed relationships (ten years or more) and one who is the choir director at his Lutheran church, single and not much into dating - like me. All four are all in their late 50s early 60s. Too bad you don't know them; remarkable people who live Godly lives by anyones standards and because of their age, no one would even consider their sexual orientation. Why? Because when you look at them you are not thinking about sex.
As an aside - I would trust any of them to babysit my kids. I wouldn't let married hetero men screaming about the sin of homosexuality and pounding their bibles anywhere near my children. That's the disguise of most predators.
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Lilly
ex10
With all do respect, your daughter will be dealing with these types of issues throughout her life. Teenagers in general whether they are overweight, or underweight, or look different in anyway go through this. You love your daughter and with that love tell it like it is. Honesty is really the only thing that will help her to understand. People will always have something to say about who she is, gay or not. She goes to church with you and is involved with a youth group, do they know she's gay? If her peers at church respected her then they would not make hurtful remarks about her or her theatre friends. There is no easy way to go with this. She will be discriminated against because that is society, christian or not. She needs to put her "tuff skins" on and be thankful she has a mother that stands by her.
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dmiller
I ain't arguing that the meds help, but giving *an old dog*, a new name doesn't change the situation.
Meds mask the problem, and control it -- they do not cure, or alleviate it. A schizoprenic with no psycotropic meds is a scary proposition for even the most expereienced in the field, and when *said* experienced folks run across a situation like this -- *demon possessed* is the first thing that runs through the mind.
Now -- sorry for the de-rail -- back to the "gay teen-ager" thread.
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johniam
What? A male cat humps another cat and this is "proof" of homosexuality? I have a dog that used to hump my youngest child's leg until we made him stop. What would that be? It's bestiality if a human wants to have sex with an animal, so if an animal wants to have sex with a human...? Doggylingus? As a teenager I used to hump the air machine at the bowling alley to the delight of some of my friends. That would be...ductrophelia? Coming in shorts and quarts, kids.
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outofdafog
I didn't say anything was proof of homsexuality johniam. As a matter of fact I stated that neither side has any rock-clad proof of their position earlier in a post.
From things I have read and seen, in the animal world there does appear to be bi-sexual behavior. Just an observation to include in this thread. Didn't say anything about beastiality (or however you spell it)though.
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oldiesman
I would say that God making Adam and Eve is rock-clad proof.
If it was in God's plan for humans to be bisexual, not being a big deal what gender one has sex with, wouldn't he have formed humans that way? Going both ways? Seems that'd be logical and proof that bisexuality was planned.
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outofdafog
Well sure oldies, if that is what one believes, but not everybody believes that. That is still not proof - some people just think that is a story in a book. Because some believe in evolution etc etc etc.
No one side can prove their beliefs as being the right beliefs.
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CM
extremist type thinking, pride, ego, lusts,
all stand in the road to a better understanding
oenophiles post was enlightening-
"I am not pontificating about homosexuality one way or the other but I remember reading just the other day that Jesus hung out with harlots, tax collectors, winebibbers (my kind of people)and sinners of every stripe. I never remember reading that he shunned or scorned any of them but he was disgusted, sickened and had plenty to say about hard, unloving, legalistic religious people. They might be reminded as the Pharisees were by Jesus, the harlots, sinners (and gays) enter the kingdom before you."
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LG
I think the whole “natural-unnatural” thing is silly. What animals do neither validates nor invalidates what people do. The “if it had been in God’s plan for people to ___, He’d have formed them ___” line of reasoning is silly too. God didn’t give me long, hard, flat feet. Does that mean that I shouldn’t ski? There are lots of things humans do that they couldn’t do without man-made devices. Homosexuality requires no such devices. How is it less “natural” than brewing a cup of coffee, posting on the Internet, or driving to work?
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LG
Earlier today, I picked my mother up from the hospital. Those people did all sorts of unnatural things to her while she was there, and they do even more unnatural things to other people on a regular basis. In our society, we not only approve of such unnatural behavior, we liberally fund it.
How perverse is that?
;)-->
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J0nny Ling0
Ok, so G_d is silly...
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karmicdebt
Does the thought of God being silly cause you discomfort?
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LG
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J0nny Ling0
If God wants to be "silly", then this is fine with me. I think He may have been being sorta silly when he invented giraffes, hippopotamuses and platypusses, or the neat little mating dance that whooping cranes do
:)-->
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def59
The Bible condemns a lot of nasty behaviors and says that Christians should not commit them.
And anyone who practices (indulges) them will not see heaven.
So your child comes to and says they are gay. According to some, we should welcome them and find out who they are having sex with and welcome them into our homes.
First, maybe you would want to ask your child why they feel this way, why they want to act out in this way and how old is their partner.
In my state it is a crime to have sex with anyone under 16.
Second, ask yourself what you say if your child was having sex with an adult? Would this change your view of their "lifestyle"?
Or what would you say if they said they were seducing/raping younger children.
And what kind of gay person are they planning on being? There are many types and not all live healthy lifestyles — nor do they want to.
Are you knowledgeable enough about gay sex practices to counsel them about the consequences?
Will you ask your child to be celibate until they are an adult? How will/would you enforce it.
Would you deny them access to pornography or homoerotic literature so they can better express themselves?
Now fill in some of these questions with drugs, alcohol, gossip, stealing, lying, cheating, and see what answers you get.
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def59
As for what Jesus did and didn't say and who he hung out with.
Remember, he came to heal the sick, find the lost and judge the hypocrites, but he NEVER condoned sin.
If he did encounter a homosexual, he would never have said that it was all right. The God who gave the law to Moses called it an abomination.
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oldiesman
I like giraffes.
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J0nny Ling0
Me too..
And Oldies, You always doo that!
How'd you git them Jraffs on yer post like that?!
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J0nny Ling0
LG
You said;
Well, it stands to reason that if the concept of homosexuality being un-natural comes from God, and was being quoted as something God has said, and what He thinks of this lifestyle, than to say that the concept which came from God is "silly", that that is to say that "God is silly", for He said a "silly thing".
This getting really, well, silly!
:)-->
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