let me tell ya I know of plenty of parents who do allow such, and then when the baby arives take it on as well .
happens everyday grandparents raising a second or thrid generation of kids that are very troubled and unstable. the "kids" never able to handle the responsibility . The welfare mindset and the drug abuse invading our culture is massive in many communities. and the other side is a possible total estrangement from your children or your grand children. it is a tough thing being a parent. up to about two years ago (Pataki changed the law )our govt. NY said it was legal for any 16 to live anywhere he/she wanted and parent had nothing to say about it!!!
hence idiot adults having nice crash pads for many of their childrens friends out of FEAR if they didnt allow it their own kids would be knocking on the next door and move in. very common and not in the poor inner city either Im talking upper crust america kids who parents didnt want to lose control . AND the parents are responsibile for the money if they get into trouble or run up bills till they are 18. sound unfair? IT WAS I fought for the law to change here. now it is 18. but we have alot of parents raising their kids kids here, or slap that teen on birth control and let him spend the night. Landlord will rent to whoever has the money, it is legal, and a horny or high teen has a place, at sixteen parents cant touch it. so some parents just allow (out of safety and concern they claim) it is easily done.
mj - those are some very valid questions you brought up at the end of your post. As someone who daily experiences raising a gay child, I can tell you, that it can be difficult.
When my daughter first came to me, I did cry, even in front of her. I didn't throw a fit, but I was not able to talk to her right away about it because so many things were going through my mind.
As the implications of what this meant started to slowly sink in over the next few days, I knew I had some serious spiritual and mental soul-searching to do. Especially with the still TWI mentality somewhat still afixed in my brain cells. The hatred of the homosexual that was experienced in LCM's tirades was still somewhat fresh in my mind.
I just didn't "accept it" like I would a phone call. Over the months we discussed several aspects of a gay lifestyle. Was it real or just a "fad". What types of discrimination are you expecting or not expecting? Would she be exposed to hate words or hate crimes and how would she handle all of that? The sexual act part was really quite secondary to all the other issues that surround this. A whole lot deeper than just sex!! God why is it always about sex when gays are brought up.....
Fast forward a few months and I asked myself honestly why I cried when she first told me....a real flood of compassion then engulfed my heart and the answer was so plain......I was crying for the hurt that I knew some days that she will suffer from the hands and mouths of a world that is still so immature when it comes to differences in people. All of a sudden I felt like I knew what it is like for people who are different in this society. She would be considered by others as a lower class of people.
As a mother that was very sad. So to say a parent just accepts this without any thought....is totally bogus (at least for me). I have spent months soul-searching this and it always comes back to the love and devotion to my child, to protect them no matter what. EVERY LINE OF THINKING THAT I WENT OVER CAME BACK TO THAT.
My kids where all virgins, untill they were adults. How do I know? I asked them. I kept them busy doing other stuff and I was a single parent they knew the danger of heart break involved in "love" and sex.
. . None of my children are homosexual, when my daughter was a young teen she hung out with a cross dresser black guy who was chubby who used to flip out her brother when he would show up at the door in her white I skirt.I did ask her to not share her clothes and to give it to him now thank you. WE laugh about it now. I do talk to them about when to have children, because of money and such.
it isnt my job to protect adults who can chose with their own mind what to do with their own life. In fact I will say it is impossible to protect our children from harm or heartbreak. Life is life we all face misfortune, as a parent I may be able to be a help in learning how to cope with what life brings sometimes, at the best but mostly it is just to care and love.
I taught my kids Sex is an ADULT choice a person who has need of "protection" or guidance , has no business playing in an area they can not cope without help. they are not ready if they need help with such an important and intimate and personal area of life. homo or hetro.
Do women understand what it’s like to be boys or men? Do men understand what it’s like to be girls or women? Not fully, but they sure can understand a lot. Single women can raise boys well and single men can raise girls well. It takes empathy and a willingness to reach beyond conventional gender roles.
I raised a daughter by myself. The sorts of intimate conversations women have with their daughters, I’ve had with mine. The sorts of things they do with their daughters, I've done with mine. The things they teach their daughters, I’ve taught mine. That often required that I learn or do things that I otherwise wouldn’t have, so I learned and did. It required that I explore and discuss feelings and interests that were foreign to me, so I explored and discussed.
I don’t see how that’s so different from what a heterosexual parent of a homosexual child or a homosexual parent of a heterosexual child would likely do.
Also, sexuality is much more than sex acts. People understand that about themselves. Why some people seem not to understand that about some others is beyond me.
Also, sexuality is much more than sex acts. People understand that about themselves. Why some people seem not to understand that about some others is beyond me.
Amen! And often isn't ever about sex at all. Just a syllable in the word.
Love comes into our lives so rarely. My brother loves his partner and his partner loves him, period. It's so obviouse to anyone who's spent any time with them and it is definately not about sex.
It's about companionship, it's about laughter, it's about communication, it's about enjoying life together and being willing to walk through the puke and poop of it every damn day.
but naturally, an ocean of rules evolved out of this newly recovered but ignorant people.
ignorant of their own lineage. ignorant even of the wisdom and spiritual understanding of their own patriarchs.
and most of the new rules were regarding strictly physical behaviour.
what else could they see at this time, right?
but some later started to realize that all those rules regarding physical behaviour were limited, contrary, and only really served to keep a lineage alive long enough to evolve beyond their own personal stone age. in other words, saving physical crude baby Israel from itself from becoming extinct.
like a training wheel, a temporary evolutionary control factor
i would dance in my underwear in the streets if i realized this too.
the next step for these people was to learn more effective rules. and to shed those training wheels. of course, that is gonna take a long time, relatively. i would also praise the future advent of this turning point, even though its obviously beyond my own physical lifetime.
and then ok, sure, Paul, after his enlightening, in the NT, warns against this man-on-man club, too. but he was no longer warning against the mere physical sexual aspect of it. but against the homosexuality of the soul. homosexuality of public policy. the homosexuality of business models. the homosexuality of our habits and desires. the homosexuality of religious thought and idealogy and behaviour.
because the soul drives the flesh, not the other way around. and so it can cause much more damage and suffering in both worlds.
and so what does homosexuality of the soul look like? (beside some Hellenic boy giving another a flower)
how can we rationally associate this homo-sexuality of Romans with murder, rape, kidnapping?
and what is this strange homosexuality that risks the health and safety and well-being of the world?
imo, it looks like war, oppression, tyranny, slavery, greed...duh
Kings of the earth, as prisoners of their own nature (and so forgiven)
because the masculine process is about competition and control, not cooperation and communion(both of which have their own wonderful place in each of us and in all of us...but only if if they learn how to dance).
if that single-minded half of the mind is allowed to dominate our society, our systems, our decisions and morals...it will rise high and fall hard. it knows not the art of cooperation and communion (except as a secondary thing)
and to make it worse, if women are forced to adopt this strictly competitive stance in order to ascend to power in society (see Condaleeza...lol), it truly does become an unnatural state of society. we lose the gift of Eve, yet again.
health suffers. healing suffers. economies suffer. children suffer. relationships suffer.
all those things the feminine is naturally gifted at.
this is the man-on-man club we are warned against infecting a civization = that strictly competitive behaviour as any sort of pinnacle virtue.
an eye on top of a pyramid, they depict it.
look around, btw...it doesn't work.
strict masculinity lauding itself as supreme...is very destructive.
when groups of men think they do not need "a women's ways"
all that silly emotion and caring and sharing...
and so they become like too many T Rex's on the prowl.
black and white vision, like a carnivore
it has never been good to give such a zealous patriarchy all the keys to all the coffers.
and note: feminine is not superior to masculine, but as we learned in eden, masculine is a cripple without her. she helps him meet that which he may never have met otherwise on his own.
(and you should know by now, by "he" and "she," i am not talking about physical sexuality of the human body, but the forms of being that manifest it...those angels in heaven who do not need a wedding ceremony. ;)-->)
there seems, a lesson all men must learn to learn.
but a lesson most women mostly already intuitively get.
I have found the more hard lined you are, the more you think in black/white terms, the more opinionated you are...the less likely your children are going to open up to you. What kid wants to talk about their feelings, questions or any curiousity to a parent if they already know what the response will be? How many kids are going to question a belief system if the parent is going to use it against them?
"Boundaries" is a wonderful catch phrase that is often powerless. Kids are not bad, but they know how to get what they want out of a dysfunctional family system by working within that family system. I found, as a mom, my gut instinct was the right answer regardless what my bright, remarkable, sensitive, talented, successful child was saying...
What does that have to do with teenagers and gays? Well, statistics would show that Outofdafog cannot possibly be the only parent among us that has a gay child. The difference is she built a relationship that would allow her daughter to feel safe enough to come out. Some of you may also have children grappling with feelings and questions and fears...they would never approach you with, because they know in absolute terms how you feel...and they aren't safe...
I worry about the boy who had a harmless, innocent dream that happened to be homosexual in nature but is terrified to mention it to his parents because of they way his parents respond to gays. And he is left scared and confused. It would be so much easier if he had a mom or dad that could say it's normal, it doesn't mean anything...and it is not an issue because we love you (period)
Thanks Johniam..I like me quite a bit, despite what the responses have been..I'm amazed at much of this & I guess I'm judged by my words..just can't deny what I've experienced . The last "suggestion" by I think Sharon really threw me a bit...as If I'm some mean spirited SOB who has "driven" this poor man to his consistent "coldness" towards most of us...I agree with YOUR assessment..& hold to my own!! JJ
I'm not a parent MJ but if I was I know I would accept what the sexuality of my children was.
The most heterosexual parents on Earth cannot actually choose nor influence (though they naturally try to) what their child's sexuality will be.
That is why you have gay children of hetero parents and straight children of homo parents. Parents can influence tolerance and understanding of have the right to set boundaries during a child's minority. Their attitudes can have a profound effect, especially when making a child feel wanted and loved.
It is indeed different from sexual acts, but being able to accept that at some point these may happen and to accept the existence of a partner cna be a real challenge. When a son or daughter marries heterosexually I am sure the parents do not dwell upon the "wedding night" but on the grandchildren they wish to see follow. When it is a gay relationship they may feel cheated and denied out of being grandparents, especially when the gay child is an only child.
Some parents react extremely negatively and unlovingly, it may well be influenced by their religious belief also. What it says for that religious belief is certainly begging the question.
The difference is she built a relationship that would allow her daughter to feel safe enough to come out. Some of you may also have children grappling with feelings and questions and fears...they would never approach you with, because they know in absolute terms how you feel...and they aren't safe...
Kind and thoughtful for you to say........
Actually being the parent of a gay child gives me access to alot of information in the gay happenings at the schools. I know who is gay, who is not, whose parents know, whose parents don't know, some just the mom knows and they could never tell their dad, some just the dad knows and they could never tell their mom's.....some because of religious belief, some because they tell me their parents are racist "archie bunker types" who cannot handle it, some of the parents are very accepting, some think their parents will throw them out of the house. Then you "throw" all the step-parents beliefs into it. You really don't know what kids are talking about out there until you "really start listening" to them. Not just hearing what you want to hear.
And the number who claim to be bi-sexual (now that's a whole 'nother story in itself......
But a homosexual parent of a homosexual child would not be all that concerned about having a grand child. I mean they are and they do ya know? and many homosexual have children today so I would think that wouldnt be a concern as much today.
Of course most would have to accept what ever our children do as ADULTS unless we want to sever ties which happens in many families for many different reason.
As far as religion if a parent really feels that strongly about how much their children "sin" effects their own life( I do not get it) the the relationship may not be build on much and worth forgetting about when your grown anyways.
I can listen to my children and not encourage behaviours that I consider bad for my child and I can make known my opposition concerning certain behaviours and beliefs system in other words educate my children, that is a parents job. Today education on homosexuality needs to begin young and Yes I clearly teach my kids it is wrong and not to be accepted as a behaviour. Then if they are exposed or influenced I know as well. It is important to me as a parent and I dare say alot of parents today. I do not teach hate but I do not teach tolerence when it comes to personal body boundaries I taught my kids to respect their bodies from a very young age to to never allow anyone to disrespect their body. it belongs to them GOD gave it to them to take care of. They were never confused about what their body meant to them or who's responsibility it is to make sure it is ok.
the use of our bodies as instruments our thoughts concerning SEX are formed at a very young age. and to spare a big tirade I will say NO I do not believe anyone is "born" homosexual, but I think it can happen at a young enough age where the teen may not remember when the desire or thoughts began and that is about the same as "being born with this idea" but somewhere along the lines he knew he felt different from the rest. Parents need to be aware very aware of what a child is thinking and doing from a very young age and address any confusion imediately.
Gays are the ones who choose their own destiny not God. God basically has nothing to do with what perversions they or others prefer. God's abomination is more towards Christians who engage in that practice than non-believing gays.
On the other hand, God is the only one who can judge them on it, it is not up to us to be prejudice towards them. People who seek sin, probably are trying to hide their own sinful nature. I may condemn the 'act' but should take a close look at myself before I point a finger. One truth is that to God, sin is sin.
Gays are the ones who choose their own destiny not God. God basically has nothing to do with what perversions they or others prefer.
The problem there is that if God made them, then he designed them specifically to be gay. If he exists, then he has complete control unless men are more powerful than he is. So either you have a weak deity that is not actually all-powerful, or he is evil and wanted to make people bad intentionally.
Yes, Krys, I think some teens and adults explore it simply out of curiosity. I knew a group of kids in the early 80's who were all practicing homosexual sex. Most of them are now heterosexuals.
I think their homosexuality was a phase brought on in part by curiosity and in part to be counter culture.
I think this bi-sexual thing could be a phase. In the world of teenagers, it's hard to know what might be the lastest fad. I guess because I just can't believe that there would be that many bi-sexuals kids. Or maybe I just am communicating only with that group, it just seems to be a high number. -->
There are people who go "through a phase" during their development and who will "grow out of it" in time.
There are others who do not and yet later in life discover another aspect of their sexuality that they were not aware of earlier.
But for others again it is a spectrum - as Kinsey discovered with some who can "swing either way" and some that can under certain circumstances.
I suspect that the claimed "cures" occur largely under those who come under the bisexual part of the spectrum.
Religion tend to like to see everything in black and white and will therefore paint it as such. But condemnations and threats of the wrath of God are counter productive and a threat to human rights and human freedoms.
quote: Opponents blame a minority of conservative voices for imposing their views on the majority of parents across the county — and the nation.
"The thing that concerns us is there is a situation where there is widespread support across the country for accurate, age-appropriate health education," said Eliza Byard (search), deputy director for the Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network (GLSEN).
"It seems that a small number of dissenters in Montgomery County had access to the levers of power to disrupt the process that was initiated by a citizens' advisory committee," Byard said, arguing that the "small number" succeeded in overturning the majority's desires. "It does seem … some very basic underpinnings of our American pluralism is at stake."
Umm, this "widespread support" was also supposed to have elected Kerry, but didn't. The homo agenda is the true minority trying to impose its views on the rest of us.
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mj412
Sharon
let me tell ya I know of plenty of parents who do allow such, and then when the baby arives take it on as well .
happens everyday grandparents raising a second or thrid generation of kids that are very troubled and unstable. the "kids" never able to handle the responsibility . The welfare mindset and the drug abuse invading our culture is massive in many communities. and the other side is a possible total estrangement from your children or your grand children. it is a tough thing being a parent. up to about two years ago (Pataki changed the law )our govt. NY said it was legal for any 16 to live anywhere he/she wanted and parent had nothing to say about it!!!
hence idiot adults having nice crash pads for many of their childrens friends out of FEAR if they didnt allow it their own kids would be knocking on the next door and move in. very common and not in the poor inner city either Im talking upper crust america kids who parents didnt want to lose control . AND the parents are responsibile for the money if they get into trouble or run up bills till they are 18. sound unfair? IT WAS I fought for the law to change here. now it is 18. but we have alot of parents raising their kids kids here, or slap that teen on birth control and let him spend the night. Landlord will rent to whoever has the money, it is legal, and a horny or high teen has a place, at sixteen parents cant touch it. so some parents just allow (out of safety and concern they claim) it is easily done.
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outofdafog
mj - those are some very valid questions you brought up at the end of your post. As someone who daily experiences raising a gay child, I can tell you, that it can be difficult.
When my daughter first came to me, I did cry, even in front of her. I didn't throw a fit, but I was not able to talk to her right away about it because so many things were going through my mind.
As the implications of what this meant started to slowly sink in over the next few days, I knew I had some serious spiritual and mental soul-searching to do. Especially with the still TWI mentality somewhat still afixed in my brain cells. The hatred of the homosexual that was experienced in LCM's tirades was still somewhat fresh in my mind.
I just didn't "accept it" like I would a phone call. Over the months we discussed several aspects of a gay lifestyle. Was it real or just a "fad". What types of discrimination are you expecting or not expecting? Would she be exposed to hate words or hate crimes and how would she handle all of that? The sexual act part was really quite secondary to all the other issues that surround this. A whole lot deeper than just sex!! God why is it always about sex when gays are brought up.....
Fast forward a few months and I asked myself honestly why I cried when she first told me....a real flood of compassion then engulfed my heart and the answer was so plain......I was crying for the hurt that I knew some days that she will suffer from the hands and mouths of a world that is still so immature when it comes to differences in people. All of a sudden I felt like I knew what it is like for people who are different in this society. She would be considered by others as a lower class of people.
As a mother that was very sad. So to say a parent just accepts this without any thought....is totally bogus (at least for me). I have spent months soul-searching this and it always comes back to the love and devotion to my child, to protect them no matter what. EVERY LINE OF THINKING THAT I WENT OVER CAME BACK TO THAT.
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excathedra
your precious daughter is very very fortunate foggie, and i know you are too, to have her. happy mom's day
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outofdafog
awww excie.......you are gonna make me cry.
love you....
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mj412
My kids where all virgins, untill they were adults. How do I know? I asked them. I kept them busy doing other stuff and I was a single parent they knew the danger of heart break involved in "love" and sex.
. . None of my children are homosexual, when my daughter was a young teen she hung out with a cross dresser black guy who was chubby who used to flip out her brother when he would show up at the door in her white I skirt.I did ask her to not share her clothes and to give it to him now thank you. WE laugh about it now. I do talk to them about when to have children, because of money and such.
it isnt my job to protect adults who can chose with their own mind what to do with their own life. In fact I will say it is impossible to protect our children from harm or heartbreak. Life is life we all face misfortune, as a parent I may be able to be a help in learning how to cope with what life brings sometimes, at the best but mostly it is just to care and love.
I taught my kids Sex is an ADULT choice a person who has need of "protection" or guidance , has no business playing in an area they can not cope without help. they are not ready if they need help with such an important and intimate and personal area of life. homo or hetro.
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LG
Do women understand what it’s like to be boys or men? Do men understand what it’s like to be girls or women? Not fully, but they sure can understand a lot. Single women can raise boys well and single men can raise girls well. It takes empathy and a willingness to reach beyond conventional gender roles.
I raised a daughter by myself. The sorts of intimate conversations women have with their daughters, I’ve had with mine. The sorts of things they do with their daughters, I've done with mine. The things they teach their daughters, I’ve taught mine. That often required that I learn or do things that I otherwise wouldn’t have, so I learned and did. It required that I explore and discuss feelings and interests that were foreign to me, so I explored and discussed.
I don’t see how that’s so different from what a heterosexual parent of a homosexual child or a homosexual parent of a heterosexual child would likely do.
Also, sexuality is much more than sex acts. People understand that about themselves. Why some people seem not to understand that about some others is beyond me.
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Shellon
Amen! And often isn't ever about sex at all. Just a syllable in the word.
Love comes into our lives so rarely. My brother loves his partner and his partner loves him, period. It's so obviouse to anyone who's spent any time with them and it is definately not about sex.
It's about companionship, it's about laughter, it's about communication, it's about enjoying life together and being willing to walk through the puke and poop of it every damn day.
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sirguessalot
my 2 cents on the subject...
in the OT, there were originally only 10 rules.
but naturally, an ocean of rules evolved out of this newly recovered but ignorant people.
ignorant of their own lineage. ignorant even of the wisdom and spiritual understanding of their own patriarchs.
and most of the new rules were regarding strictly physical behaviour.
what else could they see at this time, right?
but some later started to realize that all those rules regarding physical behaviour were limited, contrary, and only really served to keep a lineage alive long enough to evolve beyond their own personal stone age. in other words, saving physical crude baby Israel from itself from becoming extinct.
like a training wheel, a temporary evolutionary control factor
i would dance in my underwear in the streets if i realized this too.
the next step for these people was to learn more effective rules. and to shed those training wheels. of course, that is gonna take a long time, relatively. i would also praise the future advent of this turning point, even though its obviously beyond my own physical lifetime.
and then ok, sure, Paul, after his enlightening, in the NT, warns against this man-on-man club, too. but he was no longer warning against the mere physical sexual aspect of it. but against the homosexuality of the soul. homosexuality of public policy. the homosexuality of business models. the homosexuality of our habits and desires. the homosexuality of religious thought and idealogy and behaviour.
because the soul drives the flesh, not the other way around. and so it can cause much more damage and suffering in both worlds.
and so what does homosexuality of the soul look like? (beside some Hellenic boy giving another a flower)
how can we rationally associate this homo-sexuality of Romans with murder, rape, kidnapping?
and what is this strange homosexuality that risks the health and safety and well-being of the world?
imo, it looks like war, oppression, tyranny, slavery, greed...duh
Kings of the earth, as prisoners of their own nature (and so forgiven)
because the masculine process is about competition and control, not cooperation and communion(both of which have their own wonderful place in each of us and in all of us...but only if if they learn how to dance).
if that single-minded half of the mind is allowed to dominate our society, our systems, our decisions and morals...it will rise high and fall hard. it knows not the art of cooperation and communion (except as a secondary thing)
and to make it worse, if women are forced to adopt this strictly competitive stance in order to ascend to power in society (see Condaleeza...lol), it truly does become an unnatural state of society. we lose the gift of Eve, yet again.
health suffers. healing suffers. economies suffer. children suffer. relationships suffer.
all those things the feminine is naturally gifted at.
this is the man-on-man club we are warned against infecting a civization = that strictly competitive behaviour as any sort of pinnacle virtue.
an eye on top of a pyramid, they depict it.
look around, btw...it doesn't work.
strict masculinity lauding itself as supreme...is very destructive.
when groups of men think they do not need "a women's ways"
all that silly emotion and caring and sharing...
and so they become like too many T Rex's on the prowl.
black and white vision, like a carnivore
it has never been good to give such a zealous patriarchy all the keys to all the coffers.
and note: feminine is not superior to masculine, but as we learned in eden, masculine is a cripple without her. she helps him meet that which he may never have met otherwise on his own.
(and you should know by now, by "he" and "she," i am not talking about physical sexuality of the human body, but the forms of being that manifest it...those angels in heaven who do not need a wedding ceremony.
;)-->)
there seems, a lesson all men must learn to learn.
but a lesson most women mostly already intuitively get.
thanks for listening
blessings and peace
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karmicdebt
I have found the more hard lined you are, the more you think in black/white terms, the more opinionated you are...the less likely your children are going to open up to you. What kid wants to talk about their feelings, questions or any curiousity to a parent if they already know what the response will be? How many kids are going to question a belief system if the parent is going to use it against them?
"Boundaries" is a wonderful catch phrase that is often powerless. Kids are not bad, but they know how to get what they want out of a dysfunctional family system by working within that family system. I found, as a mom, my gut instinct was the right answer regardless what my bright, remarkable, sensitive, talented, successful child was saying...
What does that have to do with teenagers and gays? Well, statistics would show that Outofdafog cannot possibly be the only parent among us that has a gay child. The difference is she built a relationship that would allow her daughter to feel safe enough to come out. Some of you may also have children grappling with feelings and questions and fears...they would never approach you with, because they know in absolute terms how you feel...and they aren't safe...
I worry about the boy who had a harmless, innocent dream that happened to be homosexual in nature but is terrified to mention it to his parents because of they way his parents respond to gays. And he is left scared and confused. It would be so much easier if he had a mom or dad that could say it's normal, it doesn't mean anything...and it is not an issue because we love you (period)
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excathedra
ohmygosh such wonderful thoughts and wisdom in these pages
thanks
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Second James
Thanks Johniam..I like me quite a bit, despite what the responses have been..I'm amazed at much of this & I guess I'm judged by my words..just can't deny what I've experienced . The last "suggestion" by I think Sharon really threw me a bit...as If I'm some mean spirited SOB who has "driven" this poor man to his consistent "coldness" towards most of us...I agree with YOUR assessment..& hold to my own!! JJ
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Trefor Heywood
I'm not a parent MJ but if I was I know I would accept what the sexuality of my children was.
The most heterosexual parents on Earth cannot actually choose nor influence (though they naturally try to) what their child's sexuality will be.
That is why you have gay children of hetero parents and straight children of homo parents. Parents can influence tolerance and understanding of have the right to set boundaries during a child's minority. Their attitudes can have a profound effect, especially when making a child feel wanted and loved.
It is indeed different from sexual acts, but being able to accept that at some point these may happen and to accept the existence of a partner cna be a real challenge. When a son or daughter marries heterosexually I am sure the parents do not dwell upon the "wedding night" but on the grandchildren they wish to see follow. When it is a gay relationship they may feel cheated and denied out of being grandparents, especially when the gay child is an only child.
Some parents react extremely negatively and unlovingly, it may well be influenced by their religious belief also. What it says for that religious belief is certainly begging the question.
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outofdafog
Kind and thoughtful for you to say........
Actually being the parent of a gay child gives me access to alot of information in the gay happenings at the schools. I know who is gay, who is not, whose parents know, whose parents don't know, some just the mom knows and they could never tell their dad, some just the dad knows and they could never tell their mom's.....some because of religious belief, some because they tell me their parents are racist "archie bunker types" who cannot handle it, some of the parents are very accepting, some think their parents will throw them out of the house. Then you "throw" all the step-parents beliefs into it. You really don't know what kids are talking about out there until you "really start listening" to them. Not just hearing what you want to hear.
And the number who claim to be bi-sexual (now that's a whole 'nother story in itself......
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mj412
Thanks Trefor,
But a homosexual parent of a homosexual child would not be all that concerned about having a grand child. I mean they are and they do ya know? and many homosexual have children today so I would think that wouldnt be a concern as much today.
Of course most would have to accept what ever our children do as ADULTS unless we want to sever ties which happens in many families for many different reason.
As far as religion if a parent really feels that strongly about how much their children "sin" effects their own life( I do not get it) the the relationship may not be build on much and worth forgetting about when your grown anyways.
I can listen to my children and not encourage behaviours that I consider bad for my child and I can make known my opposition concerning certain behaviours and beliefs system in other words educate my children, that is a parents job. Today education on homosexuality needs to begin young and Yes I clearly teach my kids it is wrong and not to be accepted as a behaviour. Then if they are exposed or influenced I know as well. It is important to me as a parent and I dare say alot of parents today. I do not teach hate but I do not teach tolerence when it comes to personal body boundaries I taught my kids to respect their bodies from a very young age to to never allow anyone to disrespect their body. it belongs to them GOD gave it to them to take care of. They were never confused about what their body meant to them or who's responsibility it is to make sure it is ok.
the use of our bodies as instruments our thoughts concerning SEX are formed at a very young age. and to spare a big tirade I will say NO I do not believe anyone is "born" homosexual, but I think it can happen at a young enough age where the teen may not remember when the desire or thoughts began and that is about the same as "being born with this idea" but somewhere along the lines he knew he felt different from the rest. Parents need to be aware very aware of what a child is thinking and doing from a very young age and address any confusion imediately.
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signals
Gays are the ones who choose their own destiny not God. God basically has nothing to do with what perversions they or others prefer. God's abomination is more towards Christians who engage in that practice than non-believing gays.
On the other hand, God is the only one who can judge them on it, it is not up to us to be prejudice towards them. People who seek sin, probably are trying to hide their own sinful nature. I may condemn the 'act' but should take a close look at myself before I point a finger. One truth is that to God, sin is sin.
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krys
Do you think some teens try on their sexuality? Could some try homo- or hetero- to see what it's like?
For some - could it be a "phase"?
I'm asking because I really want to know. This is not a philosophical or rhetorical question.
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Mister P-Mosh
The problem there is that if God made them, then he designed them specifically to be gay. If he exists, then he has complete control unless men are more powerful than he is. So either you have a weak deity that is not actually all-powerful, or he is evil and wanted to make people bad intentionally.
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Abigail
Yes, Krys, I think some teens and adults explore it simply out of curiosity. I knew a group of kids in the early 80's who were all practicing homosexual sex. Most of them are now heterosexuals.
I think their homosexuality was a phase brought on in part by curiosity and in part to be counter culture.
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outofdafog
I think this bi-sexual thing could be a phase. In the world of teenagers, it's hard to know what might be the lastest fad. I guess because I just can't believe that there would be that many bi-sexuals kids. Or maybe I just am communicating only with that group, it just seems to be a high number.
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outofdafog
nonetheless.....here is an interesting article...
www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,155867,00.html
Just because you are the captain of the boat, doesn't mean that you are the smartest, it just means that you are the one with the boat.
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Trefor Heywood
There are people who go "through a phase" during their development and who will "grow out of it" in time.
There are others who do not and yet later in life discover another aspect of their sexuality that they were not aware of earlier.
But for others again it is a spectrum - as Kinsey discovered with some who can "swing either way" and some that can under certain circumstances.
I suspect that the claimed "cures" occur largely under those who come under the bisexual part of the spectrum.
Religion tend to like to see everything in black and white and will therefore paint it as such. But condemnations and threats of the wrath of God are counter productive and a threat to human rights and human freedoms.
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CM
got it all figured out huh trefor
sounds like the same things others say
on the other side of the fence
same attitude
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johniam
quote: Opponents blame a minority of conservative voices for imposing their views on the majority of parents across the county — and the nation.
"The thing that concerns us is there is a situation where there is widespread support across the country for accurate, age-appropriate health education," said Eliza Byard (search), deputy director for the Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network (GLSEN).
"It seems that a small number of dissenters in Montgomery County had access to the levers of power to disrupt the process that was initiated by a citizens' advisory committee," Byard said, arguing that the "small number" succeeded in overturning the majority's desires. "It does seem … some very basic underpinnings of our American pluralism is at stake."
Umm, this "widespread support" was also supposed to have elected Kerry, but didn't. The homo agenda is the true minority trying to impose its views on the rest of us.
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CM
This thread was started to find out where God's love is. If God is love then why....
And turned into a war one side against the other.
Answers remain in the dark. Darkness doesn't blind people, light does.
Look past the human element to find the Love you may be looking for.
God's love goes beyond what you can see.
And to love a homosexual has alluded most.
We have seen on this thread a parents love for their children no matter what.
How much bigger is God's love then this?
And what can it do for us?
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