Rico is definitely a company man. He's got the TWI line down pat and has had so much practice that he can spout it off without batting an eye. He probably sleeps well at night too.
I can't find the thread, but someone posted that they had heard John R*ynolds laughing about them making the donation and that it was "sizeable". Wonder if it costs the same as paying to be the pick of the week?
George... the last time I saw Robin she'd been completely transformed into a "Mrs. Rev. So-and-So"... the lame dress, the badly-done makeup and frumpy hair style. (this was about 5 years ago at HQ). Sorry.
Pity. But I suppose it had to be, or she wouldn't still be there.
While going through my boxes looking for my summer shorts (I still can't find those things) I happened to come accross the set of notes someone was kind enough to give me on twi's presentation on debt. It is way too long to type and I am not too computer literate, but if anyone wants a copy of what I was given, I'd be happy to mail it to them. Just email me at napkinlady@yahoo.com. Waygb are welcome also but must provide a self addressed stamped envelope.
In general: twice the disclaimer (blatant lie to those of us who lived it) of "We do not have a policy that mandates what people do with their personal finances..." is in there.
The definition for debt that they give is "to have in one's account unsatisfied financial or moral obligations"
Then they go on and on about debt referring to it as meaning to owe or be under obligation.
There is a big difference between owing and an unsatisfied financial obligation. If you have a financial obligation it is either satisfied (up to date in payments) or unsatisfied (late in payments). If they want satisfied to mean paid in full and unsatisfied to mean not paid in full, there is no need to qualify the word obligation at all. Once an obligation is fulfilled it is NO LONGER AN OBLIGATION. It is not a satisfied obligation, it is no longer an obligation. The car I paid off in 1972 is not a satisfied obligation. It is NO LONGER an obligation at all. The car I am paying for now is a satisfied obligation. The VW credit company is satisfied with how I am meeting my obligation to them. Once it is paid off, they send me the title and consider me no longer obliged.
Funny how a biblical research teaching can completely lose grasp of the English language! But that is twi.
Hey Napkinlady - how so you send a self addressed, stamped envelope by Email? I have a few packages I need to mail, Is there a way to send them Email?
Getting back on topic, Back in the late 80's I worked as an Investment Banker for a few years. If debt was handled as TWI thinks it should be our economy would probably be a little worse than your average third world nation. Over 99.999% of the American public carries a debt load equal to or exceeding 7 months of personal earned income.
Remember the Way Credit Union? I remember they used to make loans available to believers. I once was going to refinance a car through them but the savings wasn't worth the hassle.
I just had to post one more thing from the notes. According to this teaching, Gal 5:3 talks about man being a debtor to do the whole law.
In these notes it says, "By using the word 'debt' in the book of Galations here, the lack of financial needs to fulfill a debt and the bondage that results, is likened unto a lack of spiritual needs to fulfill the Law. People don't - it took JC - one with perfect blood. God's only begotten son is the only one who ever had the means to fulfill the debt and the bondage that results from debt of the Law."
So I guess JC would not have been able to take the advanced class because until he fulfilled all the law, he was in debt under their definition. Since "Being debt free is among the qualification for the participation in the adanced class, coordination of a household fellowship and other rolls of service and leadership." I guess he was just S O L. But there is hope for Jesus, cause they do go on to say in their disclaimer that "the fact that a person has not yet fulfilled the requirements for a particular class or a particular level of service is not a negative assessment of their life." So they are not looking down on Jesus Christ while he is in debt and once Jesus Christ died and fulfilled all the debt of the law, he could then run a fellowship cause then he was no longer in debt.
What poppycock! The truth of the Word is Galations 5:3. If you want to go back to the law, then you are obligated to do all the law! Is being obligated a bad thing? NO! NO NO a thousand times in the Bible it is clear that it is not a bad thing. Being obligated and not doing it is the problem. JC had no problem with God while he was obligated to do the law, because GOD was satisfied with how JC was paying off that obligation one step at a time!
Ok, I am done now. Thank for letting me vent. They make me so mad at how they twist and pervert the Bible for their own twisted and perverted agendas!
If I remember correctly they start with your premise and definition and then quickly get so far away from that definition that you can't even track with him and by the time he's done you've already forgotten what the definition was and are so confused that the typical TWIt just keeps it in the "I don't get it, but it's what they say" department.
Over 99.999% of the American public carries a debt load equal to or exceeding 7 months of personal earned income.
If this is actually a fact (and not a "factoid"), I find it horrifying.
It would mean that there are only 2800 Americans with a debt load less than SEVEN MONTHS of income!!!! Boy, talk about the few, the proud! Even accounting for mortgages, this CAN'T be true.
The goal of the anti-debt stance has always been to keep a large mobile sales force for TWI ready to go anywhere at anytime.
If you have a mortgage you can't pick up and move. If you are paying off car notes or education loans then you need steady employment and cannot afford to take jobs at McDonalds or a gas station because Way leaders have asked you to move for the 3rd time in a year.
This is the same reason they didn't like people going off to college. It was competition for the WOW and Corps programs. Its not like they hated education its just that they saw people going to college as a lost salesperson for TWI.
TWI has never wanted people to settle in - they want you to be able to go on the road at a moments notice and you couldn't do that if you were tied down to a given locale. They knew this so they tried to come up with a "biblical" teaching to keep you free of long term financial obligations (except to TWI). How convenient for the Way management that this means you could easily be relocated...
But its an old organization that is populated by old people who have an old message that doesn't mean squat to the youth of today. Who wants to be like 50 or 60 years old and relocating to some new city because someone asked you to ? And who would allow themselves to be put through that at age 50 ? Only a Wayfer...
I now have the notes on this, but they're long and it's month end, quarter end and top management meeting time, so it'll be a little while before I can post the notes. :)--> But I'll try to get it done soon.
But its an old organization that is populated by old people who have an old message that doesn't mean squat to the youth of today. Who wants to be like 50 or 60 years old and relocating to some new city because someone asked you to ? And who would allow themselves to be put through that at age 50 ? Only a Wayfer...
Who? A wayfer over 50 with no savings or career, that's who. It wouldn't surprise me if some felt stuck because TWI is their only support mechanism. Living on "Unwelfare." :)-->
Hmmm... just might patent that term. ;)--> "Unwelfare."
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Belle
Rico is definitely a company man. He's got the TWI line down pat and has had so much practice that he can spout it off without batting an eye. He probably sleeps well at night too.
Pity.
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Ham
Yep. Three or more helpings of shinola a day can have a real effect on some people..
I think a nice term would be "tainted". He's ingested so much of it, even his eyes must be brown by now..
Nothing like looking at a brown-colored world.
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Ham
Doesn't even need brown colored glasses.
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Tumbleweed Kid
So they bribed their way out of the cult listing?
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WordWolf
They would probably say the organization re-evaluated their listing after
communicating with them and seeing they were legit.
They would probably prefer to leave out the 'hefty donation' part.
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Belle
I can't find the thread, but someone posted that they had heard John R*ynolds laughing about them making the donation and that it was "sizeable". Wonder if it costs the same as paying to be the pick of the week?
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DaddyHoundog
Tw Kid - check this link out
R Magnelli~TWI and The CULT Awareness Network
We who left after the Martindale v. Allen were still in at this time.
sheesh...
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GeorgeStGeorge
Pity. But I suppose it had to be, or she wouldn't still be there.
George
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napkinlady
While going through my boxes looking for my summer shorts (I still can't find those things) I happened to come accross the set of notes someone was kind enough to give me on twi's presentation on debt. It is way too long to type and I am not too computer literate, but if anyone wants a copy of what I was given, I'd be happy to mail it to them. Just email me at napkinlady@yahoo.com. Waygb are welcome also but must provide a self addressed stamped envelope.
In general: twice the disclaimer (blatant lie to those of us who lived it) of "We do not have a policy that mandates what people do with their personal finances..." is in there.
The definition for debt that they give is "to have in one's account unsatisfied financial or moral obligations"
Then they go on and on about debt referring to it as meaning to owe or be under obligation.
There is a big difference between owing and an unsatisfied financial obligation. If you have a financial obligation it is either satisfied (up to date in payments) or unsatisfied (late in payments). If they want satisfied to mean paid in full and unsatisfied to mean not paid in full, there is no need to qualify the word obligation at all. Once an obligation is fulfilled it is NO LONGER AN OBLIGATION. It is not a satisfied obligation, it is no longer an obligation. The car I paid off in 1972 is not a satisfied obligation. It is NO LONGER an obligation at all. The car I am paying for now is a satisfied obligation. The VW credit company is satisfied with how I am meeting my obligation to them. Once it is paid off, they send me the title and consider me no longer obliged.
Funny how a biblical research teaching can completely lose grasp of the English language! But that is twi.
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Out There
Hey Napkinlady - how so you send a self addressed, stamped envelope by Email? I have a few packages I need to mail, Is there a way to send them Email?
Getting back on topic, Back in the late 80's I worked as an Investment Banker for a few years. If debt was handled as TWI thinks it should be our economy would probably be a little worse than your average third world nation. Over 99.999% of the American public carries a debt load equal to or exceeding 7 months of personal earned income.
Remember the Way Credit Union? I remember they used to make loans available to believers. I once was going to refinance a car through them but the savings wasn't worth the hassle.
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napkinlady
Sorry,
I just had to post one more thing from the notes. According to this teaching, Gal 5:3 talks about man being a debtor to do the whole law.
In these notes it says, "By using the word 'debt' in the book of Galations here, the lack of financial needs to fulfill a debt and the bondage that results, is likened unto a lack of spiritual needs to fulfill the Law. People don't - it took JC - one with perfect blood. God's only begotten son is the only one who ever had the means to fulfill the debt and the bondage that results from debt of the Law."
So I guess JC would not have been able to take the advanced class because until he fulfilled all the law, he was in debt under their definition. Since "Being debt free is among the qualification for the participation in the adanced class, coordination of a household fellowship and other rolls of service and leadership." I guess he was just S O L. But there is hope for Jesus, cause they do go on to say in their disclaimer that "the fact that a person has not yet fulfilled the requirements for a particular class or a particular level of service is not a negative assessment of their life." So they are not looking down on Jesus Christ while he is in debt and once Jesus Christ died and fulfilled all the debt of the law, he could then run a fellowship cause then he was no longer in debt.
What poppycock! The truth of the Word is Galations 5:3. If you want to go back to the law, then you are obligated to do all the law! Is being obligated a bad thing? NO! NO NO a thousand times in the Bible it is clear that it is not a bad thing. Being obligated and not doing it is the problem. JC had no problem with God while he was obligated to do the law, because GOD was satisfied with how JC was paying off that obligation one step at a time!
Ok, I am done now. Thank for letting me vent. They make me so mad at how they twist and pervert the Bible for their own twisted and perverted agendas!
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napkinlady
Out There,
I figure they can twist and manipulate it somehow to suit their purposes!
lol
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Belle
Napkinlady,
If I remember correctly they start with your premise and definition and then quickly get so far away from that definition that you can't even track with him and by the time he's done you've already forgotten what the definition was and are so confused that the typical TWIt just keeps it in the "I don't get it, but it's what they say" department.
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napkinlady
That is it exactly!
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GeorgeStGeorge
If this is actually a fact (and not a "factoid"), I find it horrifying.
It would mean that there are only 2800 Americans with a debt load less than SEVEN MONTHS of income!!!! Boy, talk about the few, the proud! Even accounting for mortgages, this CAN'T be true.
George
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diazbro
The goal of the anti-debt stance has always been to keep a large mobile sales force for TWI ready to go anywhere at anytime.
If you have a mortgage you can't pick up and move. If you are paying off car notes or education loans then you need steady employment and cannot afford to take jobs at McDonalds or a gas station because Way leaders have asked you to move for the 3rd time in a year.
This is the same reason they didn't like people going off to college. It was competition for the WOW and Corps programs. Its not like they hated education its just that they saw people going to college as a lost salesperson for TWI.
TWI has never wanted people to settle in - they want you to be able to go on the road at a moments notice and you couldn't do that if you were tied down to a given locale. They knew this so they tried to come up with a "biblical" teaching to keep you free of long term financial obligations (except to TWI). How convenient for the Way management that this means you could easily be relocated...
But its an old organization that is populated by old people who have an old message that doesn't mean squat to the youth of today. Who wants to be like 50 or 60 years old and relocating to some new city because someone asked you to ? And who would allow themselves to be put through that at age 50 ? Only a Wayfer...
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Belle
I now have the notes on this, but they're long and it's month end, quarter end and top management meeting time, so it'll be a little while before I can post the notes.
:)--> But I'll try to get it done soon.
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JustThinking
Who? A wayfer over 50 with no savings or career, that's who. It wouldn't surprise me if some felt stuck because TWI is their only support mechanism. Living on "Unwelfare."
:)-->
Hmmm... just might patent that term.
;)--> "Unwelfare."
JT
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Belle
Hey, JT! Have you checked your privates lately?
;)-->
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