The Soprano's seems more like it has more gratuitous violence in it so far. The shooting of the waiter in the first episode was really horrible. And that Feech La Manna character is about as nasty as they get.
I felt so awful when Uncle Ju got lost. It really got me upset.
"Deadwood" was very dark - and a bit hard for me to follow - that bit about the $14k or the $20k - I didn't get it. I really, really liked Wild Bill Hickock - good actor. And they're portraying Calamity Jane quite accurately from what I've read.
But what about all the "effing"? Did they really talk like that back then? They sound like they should be in da Hood, not in an 1870's Goldrush town.
I think they referred waaaay too much to Ray Abruzzo's character (Little Carmine) this week without him actually appearing in the episode...it's hard enough to keep up with all these guys by name alone.
I thought Steve Buscemi's character was kind of a walk-on role, until that scene in Ep2 where he tells Tony he's crowding him. I think we're going to see Blundetto snap before the end of the season and whack someone.
Robert Loggia as Feech LaManna is this year's Richie Aprile/Ralph Cifaretto. We should start a "how's he gonna be sent to sleep with the fishes" contest...
I know what you're saying HopeR and Zix... but I'm just gonna trust D Chase to bring it all together... that all of it will make sense in the end...
He usually has stuff happening for a reason, you know? To me it's fun trying to figure out what that reason is... and just when you think it's all about to come together as you thought... WHAM!... he takes you in a completely different direction... but it all makes sense...
HopeR, the article I read on Deadwood was really picking on the language as well... but the guy who's behind it (David Milch) said he did research for a year and every indication was that the language was "that bad"...
From HBO.com:
quote:"In March 1876, there was nothing. In June, there were 10,000 people there. That's a lot of people to move to Buffalo, let alone Indian Territory. It was not part of America. They were an outlaw community, and they knew it."
#1 - They're going to find out about Adrianna - Rosalie Aprile is going to figure it out. Adrianna is history by the end of the season.
-0R-
#2 - She'll continue to rat them out and the FBI will have enough on Tony and others to put them away forever at the end of season 6 - and that's how the show will end.
I'm betting on #1 though.
I don't get who this lady mobster is - Lorraine (?) - why has she never been around before? How does she fit in with Carmine and Johnny Sack?
Hope: Good point about Ade. I wonder if Christopher will have a big character defining moment and have to decide if he's going to be the one to kill her or not. (Long shot: he will, he'll kill her, and when the others are RICO-busted, he'll take over as head of the Jersey Mob.)
Deadwood... I don't care, I think the story would have been just as well-told if they'd left out 90% of the gratuitous language. Still, it was interesting enough for me to Season Pass it.
The 14,000-20,000 thing was a scam. If you'll recall, the "Larry" guy from "Newhart" was in cahoots with Swearengen the bartender. Swearengen sent "Larry" out in front of New York Sucker so he sees him (ostensibly a competing bidder for the claim). Drunk "owner" shows up, bartender and sucker "take advantage" of "Larry" having left to get "drunk owner" to set the price at $14k. "Larry" comes back in waving more cash around, making Sucker have to up the ante for the claim. "Owner" gives all the cash to bartender, who has the guy killed. It's obvious that bartender had his guys "salt" the worthless claim with a few gold nuggets (remember, bartender is also the town gold assayer) so Sucker will think it's worth a fortune. Just a big swindle, that's all.
Re:"..but the guy who's behind it (David Milch) said he did research for a year and every indication was that the language was "that bad"..."
I have a hard time believing that they cursed in the same manner in the 1870's as they do today. Like others here, I was REALLY put off by the language. Fact is, I couldn't watch the show with the volume up because of the kids in the house. And like Zix said, I think it was gratuitous language. HBO likes to use potty mouth even when it's not needed for context.
To top it all.. it wasn't even that good and I was expecting much better writing. Like Hope said.. the $20K and $14K didn't make sense. Why would Swearangen object to driving up the price?? I don't think I'm going to watch any more episodes. I hate it. The previews looked so promising.
Remember too that Sucker had mentioned the 20k letter of credit before the bidding was complete, so Owner already knew how high he could go. As for Swearengen, he's English, Owner was Irish, and as evidenced by the whole flap with the murderous hooker, Swearingen was a sadistic control-freak. Didn't he tell "Larry" before he sent him out of the saloon something about a set price anyway? (probably $16k, "Larry's" first bid.) Swearingen may have not anticipated Owner would jack up the bidding on his own volition. Since he would hate losing control, he'd be a jerk about even profiting from someone else's idea.
At any rate, hopefully the language was just a buzz-generating ploy for the opening episode and it will slack off as the series progresses.
HopeR... I guess it doesn't matter about Lorraine anymore... I think we're going to hear more from Loggia since he already let drop that he'd been talking with Johnny Sack... and it looks like Tony's ready to play hardball with everyone... where was Uncle Jun tonight?
That episode was good. I could see Christopher doing exactly what he did, but I was still on the edge of my seat when they dragged him out to the boondocks and put a gun to his head!
I hope Tony and Carmela get back together--those two deserve each other. ;)-->
Took the words right out of my mouth, Zix (John's too!). It was just awful.
We were commenting that neither one of us has ever had a dream that long that we could remember!
I'm still wondering what the heck the purpose of that episode was all about. It was probably just the writers messing around because they didn't have enough substantial story line to fill the time slot.
Now "Deadwood" is getting very interesting. I'm finding that there are only two major characters who are doing the majority of cussing - Swearingen and Calamity Jane.
What if???? After last week's episode (before last night's "dream episode") for some reason I started thinking...
What if the way this all ends is that Tony is just a 'regular guy' who has all of these fantasies and what we've been watching all of these years is just 'fantasy'??? Think about it, mob guys DON'T go to psychiatrists, maybe the reason that all of the actors are the same ones you see in all of the mob movies is because that's part of his dreamworld... imagining himself in those situations and of course he'd use the actors he's seen in those movies...
What if it all turns out that he's a mental patient that's being treated by Dr Melfi (in reality) and everything we've been watching for the last few years is his 'fantasy world'????
hmmmm???? THAT would be a real kicker of an ending, he comes out of it all and it's kind of like 'The Wizard of Oz' where you again see all of these people from his mob life only they're all legitimate folks...
David Chase has taken us through a lot of unexpected things in the past... and now he's introducing Tony having trouble recognizing 'reality'... I wouldn't put it past him!
It kind of reminded me of the final episode of Season 2. (Or whichever one it was where Tony had the dream about Big P as a talking fish.) Big letdown and totally unnecessary to the plot.
Actually, the most effective dream sequence so far had to have been Dr. Melfi's earlier this season... :D-->
No way! The dream thing has been done before (remember "Dallas" and "Newhart"??). I'd hate to think that such good characters and story lines would come to such a benign ending.
The only thing I got out of the dream sequence is that Tony and Carmella are probably going to get back together.
Oh, wasn't the guy who played Finn's (sp?) dad a former bad cop from the first season - also now dead? And what the heck was Annette Bening doing there? She must be a fan or sumptin...
well HopeR... I didn't say I wanted it to be that way... it just started occuring do me last week... (then again I am insane)...
yep, he's the dirty cop that committed suicide by jumping off the bridge... all I can think about Annette Bening is that she was in "Bugsy" (aha! another mob movie!)...
ya never know! if it does happen... can't you see David Chase sitting there saying to himself "Gotcha again!"???
Not for a minute, Tommy - but I thought Christopher was going to do it. When I heard that she was getting picked up by Sylvio, I knew right then she was a goner.
I also knew she was going to be killed before the season was over because she's going to be in the "Friends" spin-off , "Joey". Never watched "Friends", don't think I'll watch that one either.
Oh - were you surprised that Tony and Carmella got back together? I wasn't.
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Nottawayfer
I can't wait!!!! The previews look intense!
Laughter is a tranquilizer with no side effects.
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Hope R.
HOORAY - and Six Feet Under in June!!!!
The previews do look intense - I hope Carmella socks it to Tony big time... but I'm not so sure...
Hope R. color>size>face>
... there's a star on the far horizon, rising bright in an azure sky,
for the rest of the time that you're given, why walk when you can fly?
Mary Chapin Carpentersize>color>
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Zixar
Early reviews say that the new 5th season finally delivers on the promise of the first two.
Oh, and Season 3 of The Shield starts Tuesday night on F/X...
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Tom Strange
well... what do you guys think of this season so far?
The new characters? the sub-plots?
And what about "Deadwood"? I liked it.
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Hope R.
The Soprano's seems more like it has more gratuitous violence in it so far. The shooting of the waiter in the first episode was really horrible. And that Feech La Manna character is about as nasty as they get.
I felt so awful when Uncle Ju got lost. It really got me upset.
"Deadwood" was very dark - and a bit hard for me to follow - that bit about the $14k or the $20k - I didn't get it. I really, really liked Wild Bill Hickock - good actor. And they're portraying Calamity Jane quite accurately from what I've read.
But what about all the "effing"? Did they really talk like that back then? They sound like they should be in da Hood, not in an 1870's Goldrush town.
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Zixar
I think they referred waaaay too much to Ray Abruzzo's character (Little Carmine) this week without him actually appearing in the episode...it's hard enough to keep up with all these guys by name alone.
I thought Steve Buscemi's character was kind of a walk-on role, until that scene in Ep2 where he tells Tony he's crowding him. I think we're going to see Blundetto snap before the end of the season and whack someone.
Robert Loggia as Feech LaManna is this year's Richie Aprile/Ralph Cifaretto. We should start a "how's he gonna be sent to sleep with the fishes" contest...
Got Deadwood on TiVo...haven't seen it yet.
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Tom Strange
I know what you're saying HopeR and Zix... but I'm just gonna trust D Chase to bring it all together... that all of it will make sense in the end...
He usually has stuff happening for a reason, you know? To me it's fun trying to figure out what that reason is... and just when you think it's all about to come together as you thought... WHAM!... he takes you in a completely different direction... but it all makes sense...
HopeR, the article I read on Deadwood was really picking on the language as well... but the guy who's behind it (David Milch) said he did research for a year and every indication was that the language was "that bad"...
From HBO.com:
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Hope R.
Oh - and I have a prediction....
#1 - They're going to find out about Adrianna - Rosalie Aprile is going to figure it out. Adrianna is history by the end of the season.
-0R-
#2 - She'll continue to rat them out and the FBI will have enough on Tony and others to put them away forever at the end of season 6 - and that's how the show will end.
I'm betting on #1 though.
I don't get who this lady mobster is - Lorraine (?) - why has she never been around before? How does she fit in with Carmine and Johnny Sack?
I should go read the HBO site I guess...
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Zixar
Hope: Good point about Ade. I wonder if Christopher will have a big character defining moment and have to decide if he's going to be the one to kill her or not. (Long shot: he will, he'll kill her, and when the others are RICO-busted, he'll take over as head of the Jersey Mob.)
Deadwood... I don't care, I think the story would have been just as well-told if they'd left out 90% of the gratuitous language. Still, it was interesting enough for me to Season Pass it.
The 14,000-20,000 thing was a scam. If you'll recall, the "Larry" guy from "Newhart" was in cahoots with Swearengen the bartender. Swearengen sent "Larry" out in front of New York Sucker so he sees him (ostensibly a competing bidder for the claim). Drunk "owner" shows up, bartender and sucker "take advantage" of "Larry" having left to get "drunk owner" to set the price at $14k. "Larry" comes back in waving more cash around, making Sucker have to up the ante for the claim. "Owner" gives all the cash to bartender, who has the guy killed. It's obvious that bartender had his guys "salt" the worthless claim with a few gold nuggets (remember, bartender is also the town gold assayer) so Sucker will think it's worth a fortune. Just a big swindle, that's all.
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Sudo
Tom,
Re:"..but the guy who's behind it (David Milch) said he did research for a year and every indication was that the language was "that bad"..."
I have a hard time believing that they cursed in the same manner in the 1870's as they do today. Like others here, I was REALLY put off by the language. Fact is, I couldn't watch the show with the volume up because of the kids in the house. And like Zix said, I think it was gratuitous language. HBO likes to use potty mouth even when it's not needed for context.
To top it all.. it wasn't even that good and I was expecting much better writing. Like Hope said.. the $20K and $14K didn't make sense. Why would Swearangen object to driving up the price?? I don't think I'm going to watch any more episodes. I hate it. The previews looked so promising.
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Zixar
re 14k-20k:
Remember too that Sucker had mentioned the 20k letter of credit before the bidding was complete, so Owner already knew how high he could go. As for Swearengen, he's English, Owner was Irish, and as evidenced by the whole flap with the murderous hooker, Swearingen was a sadistic control-freak. Didn't he tell "Larry" before he sent him out of the saloon something about a set price anyway? (probably $16k, "Larry's" first bid.) Swearingen may have not anticipated Owner would jack up the bidding on his own volition. Since he would hate losing control, he'd be a jerk about even profiting from someone else's idea.
At any rate, hopefully the language was just a buzz-generating ploy for the opening episode and it will slack off as the series progresses.
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Hope R.
I'm going to give "Deadwood" one more try. I grew to like "Carnivale" - but I'm not sure I can sink my teeth into this one.
Was that really "Larry"? The one with the brother Darryl and the other brother Darryl? I'll have to look more closely next time.
I think Christopher will either get killed with Adriana or rat out everyone and they'll both go into the Witness protection program.
Didn't David Milch produce or write for "Hill Street Blues"? Or was it "NYPD Blue"? Or was it just for a bunch of Steven Bochco shows...
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Zixar
Yep. William Sanderson played "Larry" on Newhart.
Not sure on David Milch. The name sounds familiar, but I can't place him right off the top of my head.
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Tom Strange
HopeR... I guess it doesn't matter about Lorraine anymore... I think we're going to hear more from Loggia since he already let drop that he'd been talking with Johnny Sack... and it looks like Tony's ready to play hardball with everyone... where was Uncle Jun tonight?
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Hope R.
It was so good on Sunday night that I watched it again on Monday! The Tony/Adrianna story line was a real surprise - I never expected that one!
Do you think Tony & Carmela will get back together again? I do...
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Zixar
That episode was good. I could see Christopher doing exactly what he did, but I was still on the edge of my seat when they dragged him out to the boondocks and put a gun to his head!
I hope Tony and Carmela get back together--those two deserve each other.
;)-->
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Zixar
Was it just me, or was the 20-minute dream sequence in last night's episode the low point of the entire series to date?
What a waste of time!
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Hope R.
Took the words right out of my mouth, Zix (John's too!). It was just awful.
We were commenting that neither one of us has ever had a dream that long that we could remember!
I'm still wondering what the heck the purpose of that episode was all about. It was probably just the writers messing around because they didn't have enough substantial story line to fill the time slot.
Now "Deadwood" is getting very interesting. I'm finding that there are only two major characters who are doing the majority of cussing - Swearingen and Calamity Jane.
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Tom Strange
What if???? After last week's episode (before last night's "dream episode") for some reason I started thinking...
What if the way this all ends is that Tony is just a 'regular guy' who has all of these fantasies and what we've been watching all of these years is just 'fantasy'??? Think about it, mob guys DON'T go to psychiatrists, maybe the reason that all of the actors are the same ones you see in all of the mob movies is because that's part of his dreamworld... imagining himself in those situations and of course he'd use the actors he's seen in those movies...
What if it all turns out that he's a mental patient that's being treated by Dr Melfi (in reality) and everything we've been watching for the last few years is his 'fantasy world'????
hmmmm???? THAT would be a real kicker of an ending, he comes out of it all and it's kind of like 'The Wizard of Oz' where you again see all of these people from his mob life only they're all legitimate folks...
David Chase has taken us through a lot of unexpected things in the past... and now he's introducing Tony having trouble recognizing 'reality'... I wouldn't put it past him!
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Zixar
It kind of reminded me of the final episode of Season 2. (Or whichever one it was where Tony had the dream about Big P as a talking fish.) Big letdown and totally unnecessary to the plot.
Actually, the most effective dream sequence so far had to have been Dr. Melfi's earlier this season...
:D-->
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Hope R.
TommyStrangelove -
No way! The dream thing has been done before (remember "Dallas" and "Newhart"??). I'd hate to think that such good characters and story lines would come to such a benign ending.
The only thing I got out of the dream sequence is that Tony and Carmella are probably going to get back together.
Oh, wasn't the guy who played Finn's (sp?) dad a former bad cop from the first season - also now dead? And what the heck was Annette Bening doing there? She must be a fan or sumptin...
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Tom Strange
well HopeR... I didn't say I wanted it to be that way... it just started occuring do me last week... (then again I am insane)...
yep, he's the dirty cop that committed suicide by jumping off the bridge... all I can think about Annette Bening is that she was in "Bugsy" (aha! another mob movie!)...
ya never know! if it does happen... can't you see David Chase sitting there saying to himself "Gotcha again!"???
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Tom Strange
was there any doubt in anyone's mind that they'd "do it" to her?
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Hope R.
Not for a minute, Tommy - but I thought Christopher was going to do it. When I heard that she was getting picked up by Sylvio, I knew right then she was a goner.
I also knew she was going to be killed before the season was over because she's going to be in the "Friends" spin-off , "Joey". Never watched "Friends", don't think I'll watch that one either.
Oh - were you surprised that Tony and Carmella got back together? I wasn't.
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