You are preaching to the choir! :)--> It seems most every organization, be it religious, political, educational - whatever the ideals may have been in founding it eventually get lost in the need to perpetuate it.
This is timely too, given the season (Sukkot). Because observant Jews, and even many who are not so observant are currently eating and/or sleeping in huts made of branches and twigs for the next week to remind them of how people once lived, to remind them of how good they have it, to remind them God does not dwell in buildings but in people, etc.
"They gossip like snakes about the alcholic and the drug addict and placate the adulters. Why? "
I must ask though, why you have such a thing about adulterers. Don't get me wrong, I understand it is sin. So are many things and in a sense, gossip could be an equal sin to adultery because it doesn't just hurt the sinner, but the ones being gossiped about as well.
Should we not have mercy on the adulterer as well as the alcoholic or drug addict? Is there not a sickness there as well?
"But they ought to at least not tore them apart with there mouths and left the door open thru mercy. These folks can't handle hate from gossip, it destroys the hope they have left."
Agreed, we all need mercy at times and would do well to remember this before we open our mouths to gossip or condemn another.
"It makes them feel more righteous themselves. "
Again, agreed.
"Ok, so we are not under the law but grace. Thats fine, but it certainly speaks volumes to "taking heed how you build upon your own foundation." If you gotta have a building to meet in at least make sure you got the right one in your heart also."
Grace is no excuse. There are reasons people sin, as many reasons as their are sinners and sins. Those reasons need to be understood and handled compassionately, not with condemnation. For only then, can we extend mercy and healing.
I must ask though, why you have such a thing about adulterers. Don't get me wrong, I understand it is sin. So are many things and in a sense gossip could be an equal sin to adultery becuase it doesn't just hurt the sinner, but the ones being gossiped about as well.
It is my view ( and I believe OT and NT one as well), that adultery and covetousness are core issues when in existence make it impossible to grow in the knowledge of God and understand true holiness. One can reasonably argue, that alcholism and drug addict are parasites of the same. They can however exist exclusive of the other two. Certainly these folks need mercy as well. People however, understand the gravity of the matter, when distinctions are brought to there attention. By disallowing participation with the people of God, my arguement is this is more merciful and would draw there full attention to the matter. It is also my belief that other issues are more easily resolved by experience and therefore I think that is why N.T. doctrine wasnt forceful about the other matters.
your comment:
Should we not have mercy on the adulterer as well as the alcoholic or drug addict? Is there not a sckness there as well?
Certainly it is a sickness Abby. It is also a sickness that I think can only be purged with gravity. Love must be tough, no?
def:
your comment:
What's with adultery stuff? You get burned or something?
Just in the sense I have seen people preach while commiting adultery and I think that is the ultimate hypocracy.
In answer to your other comment on the other thread, I believe it to be more merciful to show them the door than the otherway around and thus show them the gravity of the situation. Adultery and fornication are not easily resolved issues def, the consequences of which with guilt can last a life time.
your comment:
But diddn't God tell David to build him a temple?
I think your right, forbiding buildings would be a bridge too far. The reference was to "altars" which are the place of sacrafice, enough said that it illustrated one should be careful on how the altar is handled.
"It is my view ( and I believe OT and NT one as well), that adultery and covetousness are core issues when in existence make it impossible to grow in the knowledge of God and understand true holiness."
I don't think it is ever impossible to grow in the knowledge of God if one has a desire too. But I agree adultery and covetousness are very difficult issues and hurtful actions.
"By disallowing participation with the people of God, my arguement is this is more merciful and would draw there full attention to the matter"
Well it would certainly draw attention to the matter, but I'm not certain it would be merciful. It could just put the person further into condemnation and make the matter worse. Didn't Jesus come to preach to the sinners? What did he say to the woman caught in adultery?
Really, each circumstance is different and needs to be viewed in light of the specifics.
"Love must be tough, no?"
Sometimes.
"Just in the sense I have seen people preach while commiting adultery and I think that is the ultimate hypocracy."
Ok, now this I agree with you on 100% and I'll tell you why. It is my bet that most people who commit adultery are extremely unhappy. Additionally, I would bet many of them also have a lot of self-esteem issues. Otherwise, either fix the marriage or get divorced so that at least you can live more honestly.
Why do I think people with self-esteem issues shouldn't preach? Because they are rejecting the love God has for them or they have never really come to understand it. If they can't understand it, how can they teach it?
Additionally, they are more likely to hurt other people in an attempt to put a bandaid on their own problems.
Covetousness may very well fall in the same category. If one is at peace with one's self, loves themselves and understand the love God has for them, there is little need to covet.
Alcohol and drug addtion, pretty much the same deal. Most of the time these problems mask or are symptoms of deeper ones.
People who suffer these things need mercy even more than the rest. They need love as well. And yes, sometimes that love can hurt. But the sting is less if there is understanding and compession with that "tough love".
"By disallowing participation with the people of God,"
Here, I am assuming you mean in a church setting. I cannot comment on that too much. I know what the scriptures say in black and white, but I'm not sure there aren't layers there which have not been understood yet. For myself, I do not have nor do I wish to have the authority to "disallow someone from participating with the people of God". I only pick and chose who I allow in my own life.
I guess we would just have to agree to disagree on that one. Without consequence, without indicating the seriousness of the matter, I simply see it as an issue that can creep into and infect others as well. How it is people come to real genuine repentance for such things is easier attained when the crossbar is high. You cannot create an environment which facilitates such actions and expect people to succeed. But I think thats just a difference you and I have Abby, on what constitutes mercy.
With respect to Jesus views, Israel had the law. They knew it was serious. We have grace, we have certain men who have turned this into this type of lasciviousness. One could argue that Jesus view was even more severe than the law, for the law permitted divorce for many matters, Jesus permitted it only for the cause of fornication. Of course this brings in a entirely different topic matter, for at times the law seems more permissive than Christ was. I think rightfully so, for the new covenant is a living body given for us, which the law could never provide.
The other thing it this Abby. If fornicators and adulters do not inherit the Kingdom of God and we his people are his temple what wrong with showing these people their inheritance which is in a different house than God's? They wont be in his house anyway if they continune in this, so why make them think that they can? In my view that is simply deluding people.
"Without consequence, without indicating the seriousness of the matter, I simply see it as an issue that can creep into and infect others as well"
I think most people already understand it is a serious matter and it is wrong. Which is again, why I say adultery, like drug or alcohol addiction is a symptom of a deeper problem.
"You cannot create an environment which facilitates such actions and expect people to succeed. "
Agreed. However, I don't think shunning people helps them succeed either.
"think rightfully so, for the new covenant is a living body given for us, which the law could never provide."
I see all of God's Word as a living body, including the law.
"If fornicators and adulters do not inherit the Kingdom of God and we his people are his temple what wrong with showing these people their inheritance which is in a different house than God's? They wont be in his house anyway if they continune in this, so why make them think that they can? In my view that is simply deluding people."
I do not decide who inhertis the Kingdom of God and think it is dangerous for any man to judge such things. That is God's place, not mine. If you study the Bible, especially the O.T., you will see that God may not change, but he does negotiate with mankind, he does understand our frame, and he loves us in spite of that. So who am I to say who will or won't be in His house?
Mostly I don't even care to dwell on such thoughts. My focus is not on who is or is not "saved". I believe we are all God's children and God will find ways to teach us what he wants us to understand.
"I guess we would just have to agree to disagree on that one"
This could well be the case. No hard feelings, Sky, I just believe differently about this subject than you do. Such is life. :)-->
And of course for me, it was the one topic (but not only there were others) that told me that something was wrong in TWI from the get go. Others who were there a lenghty time, have assured me that this same attitude did not prevail in their particular fellowship. But even the absence of discussion about (sin in the flesh) and no discussion of the cross was quite a signal. To what degree individuals in TWI suffered in this area, I know not. Neither is it an issue that most would discuss openly. Sufficient to say that there are some, if not many, that crossed the line and that in itself was a pollution of the Word of God. I am not going to digress from the point either Abby, because doing so would indicate to them that a better way from God himself in their own vernacular was "not available." Clearly it was.
"it was the one topic (but not only there were others) that told me that something was wrong in TWI from the get go. Others who were there a lenghty time, have assured me that this same attitude did not prevail in their particular fellowship."
I had no idea what was going on regarding adultery in TWI until shortly before I left. It was one, but far from the only one, of the reasons I left.
That being said, I think LCM had no business leading TWI, but again his adultery is not the sole reason I believe that.
"But even the absence of discussion about (sin in the flesh) and no discussion of the cross was quite a signal. "
Perhaps you had an advantage there in that I knew almost nothing of Christianity outside of TWI and what I did know if it made little sense to me.
"God. I am not going to digress from the point either Abby, because doing so would indicate to them that a better way from God himself in their own vernacular was "not available." Clearly it was."
Agreed. There is always a better way. However, sometimes we get lost along the way, while trying to find it or have gotten lost before we even begin looking.
Perhaps you had an advantage there in that I knew almost nothing of Christianity outside of TWI and what I did know if it made little sense to me.
I can't say my Lutheran Catechism was of any benefit. Some people I knew in the Assemblies however were, who warned me about TWI. But even way back then, there were publications calling TWI a cult, which I think ought to have raised everyones eyebrow. I agree with you Abby, that our backgrounds may have made us all a little different in respect to how we viewed TWI. I am not sure, however, that we dont all have a barometer inside us that senses when something isn't quite right. My experience with the Independent Assemblies tho, was much the same, in that that particular group also thought they were the one stop, do it all, know better than everyone else theology. Interestingly to you, was that we had 2 Jewish gals who were converts there, one of whom in midstream went back to New York, re-converted to Judiasm and we never heard from her again.
TWI had a lot of Jewish converts as well. I always wondered what they thought when LCM would go on his rants about the Holocaust being fake and the 13th Tribe stuff. I know, even though I was never raised a practicing Jew, I found it very offensive. I had family who survived concentration camps.
I agree also, that we have a barometer inside us that senses when something isn't quite right, I think that is God too. But sometimes, we aren't hearing, and other times we are afraid to trust that barometer. This was one of my huge problems. Prior to my involvement with TWI, I spent a lot of time drunk or on drugs and did things I was very ashamed of. By the time I got to TWI and tried to straighten up, I no longer trusted my own judgment. So, I trusted the leaders in TWI more than I trusted myself.
I was looking for forgiveness from God and I found a sense of it there. But it still took me many years to work through those things I had done and come to forgive myself. By then, I was very indoctrinated in their teachings and very attached to the people. I was also married to someone who was very committed to TWI.
To this day, I believe those people who I initially began fellowshipping with were wonderful. They were not "tapped into headquarters" and they were not legalistic. They were simply loving people who wanted to share what they learned and teach us how to understand the Bible.
Then everything changed very suddenly. Over the span of maybe two months, everyone in charge was removed and sent elsewhere and all new leadership came in. I knew there was something wrong and spoke up about it quite a bit.
Not too long afterward, I decided to leave. However, I was pressured and intimidated into staying. I stayed five more years before I finally got to the point where I no longer cared about the consequences of leaving.
I never really did learn to trust myself again until a year or so after I left TWI and my ex-husband. It was only by truly going out in the world on my own and learning to accept my imperfections and mistakes, as well as my successes that I learned to trust myself and God again.
But I'll tell you, I will never forget those mistakes I made in my youth. For that reason, I will also not judge the mistakes of others. I know where I have come from and what I have done, I am no better than the next guy, be the next guy an adulterer, drunk, coveter (or however you would say that) or whatever other label one might have for sin or a sinner.
I may chose to limit or eliminate my contact with someone because their actions are harmful to me or my family, but even in that, I won't judge them harshly.
God bless yah for your efforts Abby, sounds like you have had a tough road.
Someday I think we will understand it more fully. :)-->
your comment: I always wondered what they thought when LCM would go on his rants about the Holocaust being fake and the 13th Tribe stuff.
I never knew how extensive anti-Semitism was in our country until I attended a Big Ten School.
I was in a class one day and a guy on the right made a sick comment about my hair. I didn't take it that badly but it was kind of sarcastic. Later that day, the guy who was sitting on the other side of me approached me in the cafeteria and wanted to talk. He explained to me this guy had insulted me because he was a Jew and therefore thought he was better than me. He pointed out to me several woman sitting in the caferia that he "knew were Jews" because of the way they dressed. I remember thinking after he left what he was saying was way in excess to what I had experienced. One of the gals I was sitting with one day, and I explained to her she should be careful, there were people who actually didnt like her(because of her ethnic background). (I guess i was trying to warn her of this guy) I think she took it offensively.
No rougher than many and far easier than quiet a few as well. :)--> I was just explaining my perspective, which is basically "who am I to judge another?"
Antisemitism, racism, anti-Christian, people who want to find a reason to hate always will.
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Abigail
Sky,
You are preaching to the choir!
:)--> It seems most every organization, be it religious, political, educational - whatever the ideals may have been in founding it eventually get lost in the need to perpetuate it.
This is timely too, given the season (Sukkot). Because observant Jews, and even many who are not so observant are currently eating and/or sleeping in huts made of branches and twigs for the next week to remind them of how people once lived, to remind them of how good they have it, to remind them God does not dwell in buildings but in people, etc.
"They gossip like snakes about the alcholic and the drug addict and placate the adulters. Why? "
I must ask though, why you have such a thing about adulterers. Don't get me wrong, I understand it is sin. So are many things and in a sense, gossip could be an equal sin to adultery because it doesn't just hurt the sinner, but the ones being gossiped about as well.
Should we not have mercy on the adulterer as well as the alcoholic or drug addict? Is there not a sickness there as well?
"But they ought to at least not tore them apart with there mouths and left the door open thru mercy. These folks can't handle hate from gossip, it destroys the hope they have left."
Agreed, we all need mercy at times and would do well to remember this before we open our mouths to gossip or condemn another.
"It makes them feel more righteous themselves. "
Again, agreed.
"Ok, so we are not under the law but grace. Thats fine, but it certainly speaks volumes to "taking heed how you build upon your own foundation." If you gotta have a building to meet in at least make sure you got the right one in your heart also."
Grace is no excuse. There are reasons people sin, as many reasons as their are sinners and sins. Those reasons need to be understood and handled compassionately, not with condemnation. For only then, can we extend mercy and healing.
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def59
But diddn't God tell David to build him a temple?
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Abigail
Yes He did. And He told him How. And it was destroyed.
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sky4it
Abby and Def:
Abby your comment:
I must ask though, why you have such a thing about adulterers. Don't get me wrong, I understand it is sin. So are many things and in a sense gossip could be an equal sin to adultery becuase it doesn't just hurt the sinner, but the ones being gossiped about as well.
It is my view ( and I believe OT and NT one as well), that adultery and covetousness are core issues when in existence make it impossible to grow in the knowledge of God and understand true holiness. One can reasonably argue, that alcholism and drug addict are parasites of the same. They can however exist exclusive of the other two. Certainly these folks need mercy as well. People however, understand the gravity of the matter, when distinctions are brought to there attention. By disallowing participation with the people of God, my arguement is this is more merciful and would draw there full attention to the matter. It is also my belief that other issues are more easily resolved by experience and therefore I think that is why N.T. doctrine wasnt forceful about the other matters.
your comment:
Should we not have mercy on the adulterer as well as the alcoholic or drug addict? Is there not a sckness there as well?
Certainly it is a sickness Abby. It is also a sickness that I think can only be purged with gravity. Love must be tough, no?
def:
your comment:
What's with adultery stuff? You get burned or something?
Just in the sense I have seen people preach while commiting adultery and I think that is the ultimate hypocracy.
In answer to your other comment on the other thread, I believe it to be more merciful to show them the door than the otherway around and thus show them the gravity of the situation. Adultery and fornication are not easily resolved issues def, the consequences of which with guilt can last a life time.
your comment:
But diddn't God tell David to build him a temple?
I think your right, forbiding buildings would be a bridge too far. The reference was to "altars" which are the place of sacrafice, enough said that it illustrated one should be careful on how the altar is handled.
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Abigail
Sky,
"It is my view ( and I believe OT and NT one as well), that adultery and covetousness are core issues when in existence make it impossible to grow in the knowledge of God and understand true holiness."
I don't think it is ever impossible to grow in the knowledge of God if one has a desire too. But I agree adultery and covetousness are very difficult issues and hurtful actions.
"By disallowing participation with the people of God, my arguement is this is more merciful and would draw there full attention to the matter"
Well it would certainly draw attention to the matter, but I'm not certain it would be merciful. It could just put the person further into condemnation and make the matter worse. Didn't Jesus come to preach to the sinners? What did he say to the woman caught in adultery?
Really, each circumstance is different and needs to be viewed in light of the specifics.
"Love must be tough, no?"
Sometimes.
"Just in the sense I have seen people preach while commiting adultery and I think that is the ultimate hypocracy."
Ok, now this I agree with you on 100% and I'll tell you why. It is my bet that most people who commit adultery are extremely unhappy. Additionally, I would bet many of them also have a lot of self-esteem issues. Otherwise, either fix the marriage or get divorced so that at least you can live more honestly.
Why do I think people with self-esteem issues shouldn't preach? Because they are rejecting the love God has for them or they have never really come to understand it. If they can't understand it, how can they teach it?
Additionally, they are more likely to hurt other people in an attempt to put a bandaid on their own problems.
Covetousness may very well fall in the same category. If one is at peace with one's self, loves themselves and understand the love God has for them, there is little need to covet.
Alcohol and drug addtion, pretty much the same deal. Most of the time these problems mask or are symptoms of deeper ones.
People who suffer these things need mercy even more than the rest. They need love as well. And yes, sometimes that love can hurt. But the sting is less if there is understanding and compession with that "tough love".
"By disallowing participation with the people of God,"
Here, I am assuming you mean in a church setting. I cannot comment on that too much. I know what the scriptures say in black and white, but I'm not sure there aren't layers there which have not been understood yet. For myself, I do not have nor do I wish to have the authority to "disallow someone from participating with the people of God". I only pick and chose who I allow in my own life.
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sky4it
Abby:
I guess we would just have to agree to disagree on that one. Without consequence, without indicating the seriousness of the matter, I simply see it as an issue that can creep into and infect others as well. How it is people come to real genuine repentance for such things is easier attained when the crossbar is high. You cannot create an environment which facilitates such actions and expect people to succeed. But I think thats just a difference you and I have Abby, on what constitutes mercy.
With respect to Jesus views, Israel had the law. They knew it was serious. We have grace, we have certain men who have turned this into this type of lasciviousness. One could argue that Jesus view was even more severe than the law, for the law permitted divorce for many matters, Jesus permitted it only for the cause of fornication. Of course this brings in a entirely different topic matter, for at times the law seems more permissive than Christ was. I think rightfully so, for the new covenant is a living body given for us, which the law could never provide.
The other thing it this Abby. If fornicators and adulters do not inherit the Kingdom of God and we his people are his temple what wrong with showing these people their inheritance which is in a different house than God's? They wont be in his house anyway if they continune in this, so why make them think that they can? In my view that is simply deluding people.
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Abigail
"Without consequence, without indicating the seriousness of the matter, I simply see it as an issue that can creep into and infect others as well"
I think most people already understand it is a serious matter and it is wrong. Which is again, why I say adultery, like drug or alcohol addiction is a symptom of a deeper problem.
"You cannot create an environment which facilitates such actions and expect people to succeed. "
Agreed. However, I don't think shunning people helps them succeed either.
"think rightfully so, for the new covenant is a living body given for us, which the law could never provide."
I see all of God's Word as a living body, including the law.
"If fornicators and adulters do not inherit the Kingdom of God and we his people are his temple what wrong with showing these people their inheritance which is in a different house than God's? They wont be in his house anyway if they continune in this, so why make them think that they can? In my view that is simply deluding people."
I do not decide who inhertis the Kingdom of God and think it is dangerous for any man to judge such things. That is God's place, not mine. If you study the Bible, especially the O.T., you will see that God may not change, but he does negotiate with mankind, he does understand our frame, and he loves us in spite of that. So who am I to say who will or won't be in His house?
Mostly I don't even care to dwell on such thoughts. My focus is not on who is or is not "saved". I believe we are all God's children and God will find ways to teach us what he wants us to understand.
"I guess we would just have to agree to disagree on that one"
This could well be the case. No hard feelings, Sky, I just believe differently about this subject than you do. Such is life.
:)-->
Peace
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sky4it
Abby:
And of course for me, it was the one topic (but not only there were others) that told me that something was wrong in TWI from the get go. Others who were there a lenghty time, have assured me that this same attitude did not prevail in their particular fellowship. But even the absence of discussion about (sin in the flesh) and no discussion of the cross was quite a signal. To what degree individuals in TWI suffered in this area, I know not. Neither is it an issue that most would discuss openly. Sufficient to say that there are some, if not many, that crossed the line and that in itself was a pollution of the Word of God. I am not going to digress from the point either Abby, because doing so would indicate to them that a better way from God himself in their own vernacular was "not available." Clearly it was.
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Abigail
"it was the one topic (but not only there were others) that told me that something was wrong in TWI from the get go. Others who were there a lenghty time, have assured me that this same attitude did not prevail in their particular fellowship."
I had no idea what was going on regarding adultery in TWI until shortly before I left. It was one, but far from the only one, of the reasons I left.
That being said, I think LCM had no business leading TWI, but again his adultery is not the sole reason I believe that.
"But even the absence of discussion about (sin in the flesh) and no discussion of the cross was quite a signal. "
Perhaps you had an advantage there in that I knew almost nothing of Christianity outside of TWI and what I did know if it made little sense to me.
"God. I am not going to digress from the point either Abby, because doing so would indicate to them that a better way from God himself in their own vernacular was "not available." Clearly it was."
Agreed. There is always a better way. However, sometimes we get lost along the way, while trying to find it or have gotten lost before we even begin looking.
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sky4it
Abby:
Perhaps you had an advantage there in that I knew almost nothing of Christianity outside of TWI and what I did know if it made little sense to me.
I can't say my Lutheran Catechism was of any benefit. Some people I knew in the Assemblies however were, who warned me about TWI. But even way back then, there were publications calling TWI a cult, which I think ought to have raised everyones eyebrow. I agree with you Abby, that our backgrounds may have made us all a little different in respect to how we viewed TWI. I am not sure, however, that we dont all have a barometer inside us that senses when something isn't quite right. My experience with the Independent Assemblies tho, was much the same, in that that particular group also thought they were the one stop, do it all, know better than everyone else theology. Interestingly to you, was that we had 2 Jewish gals who were converts there, one of whom in midstream went back to New York, re-converted to Judiasm and we never heard from her again.
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Abigail
Sky,
TWI had a lot of Jewish converts as well. I always wondered what they thought when LCM would go on his rants about the Holocaust being fake and the 13th Tribe stuff. I know, even though I was never raised a practicing Jew, I found it very offensive. I had family who survived concentration camps.
I agree also, that we have a barometer inside us that senses when something isn't quite right, I think that is God too. But sometimes, we aren't hearing, and other times we are afraid to trust that barometer. This was one of my huge problems. Prior to my involvement with TWI, I spent a lot of time drunk or on drugs and did things I was very ashamed of. By the time I got to TWI and tried to straighten up, I no longer trusted my own judgment. So, I trusted the leaders in TWI more than I trusted myself.
I was looking for forgiveness from God and I found a sense of it there. But it still took me many years to work through those things I had done and come to forgive myself. By then, I was very indoctrinated in their teachings and very attached to the people. I was also married to someone who was very committed to TWI.
To this day, I believe those people who I initially began fellowshipping with were wonderful. They were not "tapped into headquarters" and they were not legalistic. They were simply loving people who wanted to share what they learned and teach us how to understand the Bible.
Then everything changed very suddenly. Over the span of maybe two months, everyone in charge was removed and sent elsewhere and all new leadership came in. I knew there was something wrong and spoke up about it quite a bit.
Not too long afterward, I decided to leave. However, I was pressured and intimidated into staying. I stayed five more years before I finally got to the point where I no longer cared about the consequences of leaving.
I never really did learn to trust myself again until a year or so after I left TWI and my ex-husband. It was only by truly going out in the world on my own and learning to accept my imperfections and mistakes, as well as my successes that I learned to trust myself and God again.
But I'll tell you, I will never forget those mistakes I made in my youth. For that reason, I will also not judge the mistakes of others. I know where I have come from and what I have done, I am no better than the next guy, be the next guy an adulterer, drunk, coveter (or however you would say that) or whatever other label one might have for sin or a sinner.
I may chose to limit or eliminate my contact with someone because their actions are harmful to me or my family, but even in that, I won't judge them harshly.
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sky4it
God bless yah for your efforts Abby, sounds like you have had a tough road.
Someday I think we will understand it more fully.
:)-->
your comment: I always wondered what they thought when LCM would go on his rants about the Holocaust being fake and the 13th Tribe stuff.
I never knew how extensive anti-Semitism was in our country until I attended a Big Ten School.
I was in a class one day and a guy on the right made a sick comment about my hair. I didn't take it that badly but it was kind of sarcastic. Later that day, the guy who was sitting on the other side of me approached me in the cafeteria and wanted to talk. He explained to me this guy had insulted me because he was a Jew and therefore thought he was better than me. He pointed out to me several woman sitting in the caferia that he "knew were Jews" because of the way they dressed. I remember thinking after he left what he was saying was way in excess to what I had experienced. One of the gals I was sitting with one day, and I explained to her she should be careful, there were people who actually didnt like her(because of her ethnic background). (I guess i was trying to warn her of this guy) I think she took it offensively.
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Abigail
"Abby, sounds like you have had a tough road."
No rougher than many and far easier than quiet a few as well.
:)--> I was just explaining my perspective, which is basically "who am I to judge another?"
Antisemitism, racism, anti-Christian, people who want to find a reason to hate always will.
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