I never saw Rochelle after her bandages were removed from her head. From what I recall the cuts could have been mostly hidden by her hair. You see she had very thick, beautiful I might add, hair.
Actually though, the way she was treated, being thrown out of the Corps as she was, then the way she was treated immediately after, was enough to cause even the most stable person to become suicidal.
Her life's dream was dashed. The 11th Corps, for as much as anyone may (with good reason)hate TWI or the WC, was a special group of people. We bonded and became a "family," which Rochelle really longed for. Our Way Productions bands were really decent, TWI produced an album by "Called Out" titled "We're in This Thing Together" from a song of the same name that became our theme song for our Corps.
It was so very important to Rochelle to graduate with us. I'm sure JAL was just as callous w/her in telling, not asking, not accepting or considering her feedback about her leaving the Corps, as he was with me. Devastating.
JAL didn't ask me, he TOLD me in no uncertain terms, "You're going. Just tell us where you are gonn go." Just the way he notified people was in itself devastating. Little to no warning, "go see John - you're gone.
It had become like the "Green Mile" or "Dead Man Walking" whenever anyone was handed a note by a staffer in class. If the note was from JAL, and they ALWAYS were, You were gone. If your name was called during the announcements to go meet w/JAL, you were gone. Some would just disappear. We figured they ran into John in the hallway or coming across campus. Peole didn't even want to talk to him at lunch, he might say, "You're gone." outta the clear blue sky.
So. Being devastated by being forced to leave in a devastating way.... Add to that the BS (devastating, YOU are NOT ready...) reasoning for being kicked out... if any of us actually agreed with the reasoning we'd have left on our own.
So she lost that "family."
She lost her friend, Kevin, whom she liked, probably beyond the friendship level.
Driving accross country I'm sure the words to our theme song replayed in her head. I don't remember the whole song but here's part of it...
"Once an outsider, always an outsider, they said, and you believed them,...
No longer an outsider, you're a super winner,
Forever an insider....
(Chorus:)-->
We're in this thing together,
We're in it for keeps,
We're in this thing together,
With love we're complete.
We're in this thing together,
We're doin' it forever,
With love, we're complete."
THEN. When she gets to The Way of Indiana, the LC's basically tell her get out of here we don't care where you go, but you can't stay here.
She headed out driving mile after mile, foot after foot second after agonizing second ALONE, trying to get to her big brother. She was exhausted, stopped to rest, ALONE after having left her palce of belonging, a group whose very them song in life was "We're in this thing together, we're doin' it forever, with love we're coOOM-plete."
Her head was forever changed, she left a big piece of herself out in Tinnie that day of the crash. She was never the same after that piece of aluminum siding sheared part of her scalp off. She was in pain. I would not be surprised if she just went into the bathroom to get some water to take a pill & looked in the mirror at herself. Tired alone, rejected... and she had those pills.
She may have thought about how long the drive, alone was from Columbus to Connecticutt, and just couldn't bear to drive it, ALONE. Why should she? If she wasn't welcome in the 11th, she wasn't welcomed by the Limb/Region Coordinator of the HQ region.
Where would she be welcome? with her brother? Maybe but he was so far away... That damn song in her head.
No. We're NOT together, I'm not COMplete, I'm alone. Why go on - at - ALL.
The accident/injuries weakend her, mentally. She never should have been alone like that. What is MORE lonely than mile after mile after mile on the road by yourself?
Howard, I'm sorry I posted a reply to someone else on your thread, I just deleted it. Again I'm sorry. I was switching between threads poorly I guess. :(-->
I offered to rip Don's lips off and his tongue out of his mouth. She felt that if I made and issue out of it they would make things worse for her & us.
quote: one other thing (only scanned your last post, sowwy), we were/are all SPECIAL people, gifts, great gifts, precious gifts, god's gifts....
No apology necessary. Of course we're all special as individuals. No doubt. Too bad we all don't see ourselves as special as we are. If so we wouldn't put up with as much crap as we have.
However I was speaking as the group. I'd seen most of the Corps groups from one to 13. The 11th did have a "special" as in different in a good way, quality in that we were "closer" than most as a group. That was special, not necessarily "better."
quote: i don't deny anything about your lead group ever ever ever... but you're not different
mwah mwah mwah
I'm not following this.... Different than what?
quote: i do think the tongue thing is gross. bet you wouldn't stand for THAT TODAY
I didn't stand for it THEN, either. I stood for & with my WIFE. First of all there was nothing in my post that said I was OK w/ Don slipping my wife the tongue. In fact what I wrote was precisely opposite.
quote: The wife was PO'ed at Don W. she said he had slipped her the tongue and kissed her "way too wetly" ... "That wasn't no greet the brethren with a 'holy kiss." she said, "He was hittin' on me!" I couldn't GET her to come back to work, didn't really try. It was one of those impossible to prove things. She said she wasn't ready to go back to work, I said, "Cool."
I said: "The wife was PO'ed at Don W...she said, "He was hittin' on me!"... I... didn't really try to get her to come back to work.
(since she was gone from work for the almost 2 years on maternity leave. The "tongue slip" thing HAD to be before she was pregnant - - add nine months to the 21 months)
Look at the statement in its context.
"...when I got the boot...They may have thought I had "gotten over" on them concerning my salary....they weren't getting any production from the $$ allocated to her (my wife)....I didn't have any problem with the whole thing....
...Even though it was impossible for her to prove what DW did, I didn't have a problem with her getting paid by them from 12 to 14THOUSand DOOLLars per year to do NOTHING for them. Since SHE said she was uncomfortable going back to work.
I couldn't get her to come back to work because THEY were asking "when is she coming back" and I DIDN'T try to get her to come back. I was oK with using their own policy to accomplish for HER what it would be impossible for a lawyer to prove. She got paid approximately $39.000.00 for ONE single slip of a Trustee tongue.
It was the same as settling a lawsuit against DW & TWI for that amount w/ no attorney fee. No waiting, no embarrasing testimony in court.
I did that on her word ALONE. NO proof, no "you're weak," no, "But He's a TRUSTEE, are you sure you didn't slip HIM - - YOUR tongue? After all you did feel the tongues together."
NO. I didn't do any of that. I when she said she wanted togo on maternity leave, I said, "Cool, according to this policy, you don't ever have to go back to work.
I think they MAY have fired me over that.
"I didn't have any problem with the whole thing."
Just tryin to be clear. I ain't mad at you Excie. I just think you can spare me you biting comments a little. When you scan MY posts, you're not gonna see me excusing THEM. They still smart a little even after "sowwy."
I fought them tooth & nail til they threw me out. :P-->
i don't get the salary thing... if a trustee (or anyone) french kisses your wife, you should kick the livng .... out of him even if she says you shouldn't
you got fired for whatever reason . me too .
and the thing i said about your corps.... it's true. you were no closer than anybody else. what i mean is, we all feel that way, either as a corps group, wow group, or an abused husband and wife
ps. i think a joke is the same where you come from and where i come from. i was joking when i responded. you're projecting just like every single one of us
Hey, HCW or any others who may want your L.E.A.D. story in a PDF document (without any comments), I took the liberty. Click here to download it. In this format you can share it on any computer or email it to others.
I stayed in New Knoxville firstly because I owned a home (with a mortgage). NK is a wonderful little town that TWI does not, nor has it ever defined. NK school is one of the BEST schools in the State of Ohio. It hovers between & 1 and top five.
Also. Do you live on a wooded (30 mature trees) acre in the country? $330/mo mortgage? My neighbors would call and leave messages like, "...You know that heavy wind we had to day? It blew your back door open, I walked over & closed it fer ya. Just wanted you to know..." Lester, who owned the farm across the street would bring his tractor out & plow my 85ft two lane driveway when it snowed real heavy. Stuff like that.
I used to have & my ex-sister-in-law still has season tickets to the NKHS basketball games. Right at halfcourt, three rows up. She's moved to CT now. I use her ticket when I go see Jasmine cheer. Last week at a game a local guy, who I forget his name turned around & patted me on the leg w/ congrats @ Jaz's school accomplishments. (did I tell you she's beautiful too? :)--> Slap me I'm a proud Papa)
NK is a really nic e place to live, virtually no crime ( they had a murder about, umm, ten years ago?) nice people, family atmosphere in a real Andy Griffith kinda way. Its charming. A four year old got shot in Dayton yesterday. My last house was robbed three times in two months... I'm sure you catch my drift.
Yes. Generally one camn make more money in bigger cities. I worked in Dayton and drove 65 miles one way 5+ days/wk. I've worked for AT&T, US Army Space Command, SATCOM (satellite comunications division) US Air Force from Dayton to name a few.
Had money, lost money, now I'm working & will eventually get back $$ as a partner in our ne Ad agency. This area is also with 1 day's drive of 90% od every major metro area in the country.
My brother the actor, who lives in NYC with his Emmy Award winning wife used to try to get me to move to one of the coasts, for the same reasons, mo $$$$$$ and higher competition level. The hustle, the bustle the whole thing, which I really love and thrive on....
At he beginning of the divorce, My Jazzy could hardly stand to go away to be w/Mommy. I mentioned once to her when some company was wanting me to move. "Daddy is thinking about moving?" Her little face broke up like glass shattering.
I said, "Well you don't have to worry about that. You Daddy will NEVER leave you." I've sacrificed, especially slogging through months on unemployment compensation having Companies tell me, "I wish we COULD hire you. But you'll cost too much, you're overqualified."
"Then I could surely perform in the position, right?" I'd say. They'd smile &shake my hand & hire somebody else. I used to think that Jasmine would be better off if I were to go somewhere and make ONE MIIlion DOOOLLars (pinky) and have Mo money , Mo money, MO money.!! to give her & buy all the stuff.
I'm now convinced that a BIG part of why she's done so well in life so far is that told & showed her "Your Daddy will NEVER leave you."
That's the real, central reason I stayed in NK, to stay near my daughter.
That's a sweet story about you and Jasmine, HCW. How proud I know you are of her, and how happy she must be that Daddy didn't leave her to chase after bucks. Money's a fleeting thing anyway, not lasting like the love between a dad and his daughter.
I loved New Knoxville, too. When I left HQ, I was glad, but when I drove out of NK, I cried. I made such great friends among the people in town.
My landlord used to come by while I was at work and leave tomatoes and other veggies in my fridge. My closest friend when I was on staff was a guy who grew up in NK, and I still stay in touch with him occasionally. Aside from a few people who automatically wrote anyone off who was from twi, most were warm and kind, and I love living in such a small town. I still miss it, believe it or not.
quote: quote:I didn't have any problem with the whole thing.
how 'bout the tongue thing ?
I don't see the joke in that.
I do appreciate your intent to communicate though.
I'm also more than a little sensitive to "women's issues." The nature of a question like that suggests that it could possibly be true, hence the question .
Would it communicate better to say that pointed questions do have 'points'? Even mine. Sometimes the point of a question or statement pokes and "hurts" a little, especially if it points to an area that is sensitive in a person. Obviously a prick in a sensitive area feels like a slash of stab would elsewhere.
I took the time to be clear, for clariy's sake in general, an attempt to allow whomever to see more clearly where I'm coming from. It was mmore that than a defense.
You're certainly entitled to you opinion on the closeness thing. I was writing about what folks told me about us 11th, not just what we felt. We 11th feel we were the best damn group EVER to don the grape sweatsuit :)-->
;)--> . Thats my story & I'm sticking to it ;)--> !!!
No. If you wife tells you directly don't do that. You don't do it BECAUSE SHE SAID not to period. Hupotasso (greek for submit) goes BOTH ways. If more guys got that we'd have a lot more MEN and a lot less problems & a LOT less divorces, etc.
If wifeepoo says, "Don't kick the bastard's foot, honey." and you Kick the dang outta the bastard anyway. Three things are accomplished.
#1. You feed your OWN testosterone driven EGO.
#2. You do kick some very deserving foot.
#3. YOU TEACH YOU WIFE THAT YOU CANNOT BE TRUSTED WITH HER HEART.
The .... bastard has already hurt your wife once, who are you to kick HER when she's down???
By kicking foot against your wife's will, you allow the .... BASTARD power to fracture your realtionship with your wife. You become HIS puppet and do the same thing to her he was trying to do, HURT her.
You excie, would have told me to kick the bastard's teeth in and I would have been happy to do it.
BUT. THAT particular jerk would have certainly had me jailed, should I have shoved his tongue down his throat with my foot. That would then get me out of the picture... so he could have an opertunity to rape the wife.
I hit 'em where it hurt most, in their wallets.
The prescribed LEGAL end to that particular molestation would have been a civil suit. No jury or court wold incarcerate a person for a "kiss too far" when said kiss was NOT completely unwelcome. (there was the "holy kiss cultural piece in TWI, right?) It was legally her word against his, a legal stalemate; imopssible for her to prove he did anything.
SO. She never wanted to go back to work for the bastard because of what he did. Although the policy said, "whenever" what they meant was "within a reasonable amount of time," usually about 3 mo, max. They allowed things like playpens in offices & they provided childcare for all ages for free. There was "no reason" she couldn't have returned to work in a matter of weeks. The stated intent of the policy was not to pressure women to work. They left it open ended so that if a particular family had issues, concerning either/or mom or child they didn't have to feel like they MUST come back after, say six weeks.
I saw the maternity leave policy as a way to get her paid without working for it. A lawsuit would have paid some $$ for pain & suffering should one prevail. She wouldn't have to work to earn the settlement. Some settlementsa are paid as annuities, over time. He getting her salary w/out working was no different to me than getting a settlement. Money is money. She did never work there again after that. But she got paid for about three years.
Yes Linda. Our entire society is set up so that men leave their children in favor of bucks.
That sends such a hugely negative message to them,
"My Daddy cares more about money than he cares about me."
Oh yes it DOES. Little kids will take the money you give them & the stuff it buys and appear happy cause little kids think they want stuff. Older kids & young adults would tell how they would trade it all instantly.
Other posters have mentioned on here that members of the BOT couldn't keep a civil tongue in their heads when kissing the ladies. I was a recipient of the lizard kiss also, from Howard Allen. At the time, naive me thought he just didn't know how to kiss! But I steered clear of greeting the BOT at the Rock after that.
When my first husband was kicked off of staff for drinking, I was kicked off, too. I agree, hiring was a package deal. More like two bodies for the price of one. TWI -- God's worst-managed company!
Yeah I got one of those 'lizard' kisses once by someone from staff. It was right in front of his wife too. She said to him afterwards that he shouldn't do that to me because I wouldn't understand....huh? Now I do!!!!!
I am new to all this and I hope I am doing this right but HCW it is great to see you on here. I am 11th WC or was or what ever we are calling ourselves now. I was one of the youngest in the 11 WC, same age as Rochelle (we turned 20 in the first months there) and we were very good friends. We lived on the same floor our first block inresidence second floor Uncle Harry. I would walk by her all perky saying "HI" and she always had some glum thing to say back. I made her my personal project to figure out what made her click and why God chose her to be in the WC. We became very dear and precious friends. One day when I was working in the sewing room she worked next door (I can't remember what was next door now...housecleaning?) any way she came in and kneeled down next to me and began to quietly telling me why I was a great person and why she loved me so much. It was so heartfelt and meaningful and she would NOT let me laugh it off and make light of it. It was something she just really believed I needed to hear and was determined to make me hear it and believe it. When she was done I left the room and went to the bathroom and cried my eyes out. I had never been loved so verbally might I say. She was a diamond in the rough. She was a great woman and worth the effort to know and couldn't help but love once you did know her. She was honest and caring and appreciated LOVE. She was a sponge for it. I have had my suspicions through the years that her and Dr. Wierwille might have had a "special" relationship because she was always invited to the coach when he came to the campus. I have know proof because Rochelle was far to loyal to run her mouth about that. I do think that also contributed to her demise though.
She lived at the Weirwill home while at HQ and from what I knew she was Mrs. Weirwille's "project" to nurse her back to health. Al, her brother an ordained clergy who Rochelle idolized but yet I don't know how close they really were. I don't think Al was there for her either but I don't know that forsure.
I was at Gunnison when the accident happen along with another very good friend of Rochelle's Jill Ann. When we were going through for Block change on our way to HQ Jill and I stopped in to see Rochelle in her room. She was all bandaged but made herself smile and be pleasant for us. She was such a cuddle bug. She wanted Jill and I right next to her she loved to be hugged and to hug people...touchy feely Rochelle. She just could not get enough love and you couldn't help but just flood her with it.
The slice on her skull was a HUGE C. It went from her temple area up toward the crown of her head and back toward the ear loab on right side of her head. I always said that any where else on her body BUT her head she would have healed and survived. I think she could have lost a limb. Been paralized and she would have dealt with it but because it being her head and all the trouble she had controlling it with out pain but she was in pain 24/7.
I knew she had grown up with constant thoughts of suicide and at the beginning of our last year inresidence even before the accident she was very disappointed in herself concerning her interm year and her wow brother.
After the holidays Rochelle went to HQ and Jill Ann and I went to Emporia. I found out about Rochelle commiting suicide the night before Howard Allen announced it to the Corps at Breakfast because my Corps sister who knew I was good friends with Rochelle pulled me aside and told me she had heard it on the radio. I was cut to the bone. I was so mad at HQ that they did not handle this before the media.
I got with Jill Ann on the way to breakfast and told her I needed to eat breakfast with her because I figured Howard would announce it or else I was told he was going to. I let Howard tell Jill and then I swooped her up and we went out the backdoor of the dinning room and we cried together for quite awhile.
I struggled for quite a while with the "What if's". I was mad at myself that I didn't stay in better contact with her through this horrible time for her. I was just so sure she had the best attention. I never understood why they would just "let her go".
Thank you so much Howard for reliving all this. I did not know any specifics of the accident. I never pushed for details from anyone because I knew what a painful experience it was. I knew Don Juan and loved him so. I felt bad for the pain he endured too. I wonder how he is now. I never knew you were this involved in the accident. Thank you for putting the dots together for me.
I will keep good thoughts, energy, prayers what ever positives I can send your way to your healing in this. Hopefully this has been a very healing experience in sharing this.
Thank you for letting me share about a great diamond of a friend in my life that I still miss. So many of the 11th WC were and are that for me. I will hold them so dear in my heart. We did a lot of growing up together.
I do not miss TWI I miss all my brothers and sisters that have been scattered through out the world and hurt so badly that we can't even barely communicate with each other because of the pain we associate with the time we shared with each other. What a tragedy.
I hope I did all this right for Rochelle so everyone can know my dear friend better. Thank you again Howard.
PS formally PW...we sat in the amen corner together I was the Wolfe behind you and not Lisa. lol : )
quote:Originally posted by Sunesis:
Yes, let's agree to disagree. Some people will see it one way, some others. No sense arguing over it.
Instead I am very "blessed" that HCW has chosen to share his story with us and lay out the truth of what happened.
For those of us who knew Rochelle, let's not forget the purpose of this thread was to memorialize her and others who were hurt in this terrible accident - to pay homage to a dear sister who eventually did not make it. And, I think we can see the far reaching consequences of it in the people's lives who were there.
I would like to again thank HCW for his courage in stepping up to share this with all of us, not just a few trusted friends.
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HCW
As far as standing up, talking back. People did that a lot, especially after POP. People got "mad as hell, and we're not gonna take it anymore!" Of my personal pet peeves was the whole money thing. T
HAPe4me
I never participated in it, but I always thought it sounded like "Outward Bound", which has been measurably more successful in achieving it's participant's goals.
So_crates
Yes, but then there's the counter teaching: If you obey the MOG, God will bless you. So what do you do when the MOG orders you to act recklessly? Rhetorical question. SoCrates
HCW
Johnny,
I never saw Rochelle after her bandages were removed from her head. From what I recall the cuts could have been mostly hidden by her hair. You see she had very thick, beautiful I might add, hair.
Actually though, the way she was treated, being thrown out of the Corps as she was, then the way she was treated immediately after, was enough to cause even the most stable person to become suicidal.
Her life's dream was dashed. The 11th Corps, for as much as anyone may (with good reason)hate TWI or the WC, was a special group of people. We bonded and became a "family," which Rochelle really longed for. Our Way Productions bands were really decent, TWI produced an album by "Called Out" titled "We're in This Thing Together" from a song of the same name that became our theme song for our Corps.
It was so very important to Rochelle to graduate with us. I'm sure JAL was just as callous w/her in telling, not asking, not accepting or considering her feedback about her leaving the Corps, as he was with me. Devastating.
JAL didn't ask me, he TOLD me in no uncertain terms, "You're going. Just tell us where you are gonn go." Just the way he notified people was in itself devastating. Little to no warning, "go see John - you're gone.
It had become like the "Green Mile" or "Dead Man Walking" whenever anyone was handed a note by a staffer in class. If the note was from JAL, and they ALWAYS were, You were gone. If your name was called during the announcements to go meet w/JAL, you were gone. Some would just disappear. We figured they ran into John in the hallway or coming across campus. Peole didn't even want to talk to him at lunch, he might say, "You're gone." outta the clear blue sky.
So. Being devastated by being forced to leave in a devastating way.... Add to that the BS (devastating, YOU are NOT ready...) reasoning for being kicked out... if any of us actually agreed with the reasoning we'd have left on our own.
So she lost that "family."
She lost her friend, Kevin, whom she liked, probably beyond the friendship level.
Driving accross country I'm sure the words to our theme song replayed in her head. I don't remember the whole song but here's part of it...
"Once an outsider, always an outsider, they said, and you believed them,...
No longer an outsider, you're a super winner,
Forever an insider....
(Chorus
:)-->
We're in this thing together,
We're in it for keeps,
We're in this thing together,
With love we're complete.
We're in this thing together,
We're doin' it forever,
With love, we're complete."
THEN. When she gets to The Way of Indiana, the LC's basically tell her get out of here we don't care where you go, but you can't stay here.
She headed out driving mile after mile, foot after foot second after agonizing second ALONE, trying to get to her big brother. She was exhausted, stopped to rest, ALONE after having left her palce of belonging, a group whose very them song in life was "We're in this thing together, we're doin' it forever, with love we're coOOM-plete."
Her head was forever changed, she left a big piece of herself out in Tinnie that day of the crash. She was never the same after that piece of aluminum siding sheared part of her scalp off. She was in pain. I would not be surprised if she just went into the bathroom to get some water to take a pill & looked in the mirror at herself. Tired alone, rejected... and she had those pills.
She may have thought about how long the drive, alone was from Columbus to Connecticutt, and just couldn't bear to drive it, ALONE. Why should she? If she wasn't welcome in the 11th, she wasn't welcomed by the Limb/Region Coordinator of the HQ region.
Where would she be welcome? with her brother? Maybe but he was so far away... That damn song in her head.
No. We're NOT together, I'm not COMplete, I'm alone. Why go on - at - ALL.
The accident/injuries weakend her, mentally. She never should have been alone like that. What is MORE lonely than mile after mile after mile on the road by yourself?
That's my take on it.
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houseisarockin
Howard, I'm sorry I posted a reply to someone else on your thread, I just deleted it. Again I'm sorry. I was switching between threads poorly I guess.
:(-->
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HCW
Down Girl, down!
:)-->
I offered to rip Don's lips off and his tongue out of his mouth. She felt that if I made and issue out of it they would make things worse for her & us.
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houseisarockin
Thank you for that post on Rochelle. It leaves you speechless.
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excathedra
i'll give you down girl, down
;)-->
actually i understand the mentality
:)-->
**
one other thing (only scanned your last post, sowwy), we were/are all SPECIAL people, gifts, great gifts, precious gifts, god's gifts....
i don't deny anything about your lead group ever ever ever... but you're not different
mwah mwah mwah
i do think the tongue thing is gross. bet you wouldn't stand for THAT TODAY
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HCW
Yeah. Its called a JOKE where I come from.
No apology necessary. Of course we're all special as individuals. No doubt. Too bad we all don't see ourselves as special as we are. If so we wouldn't put up with as much crap as we have.
However I was speaking as the group. I'd seen most of the Corps groups from one to 13. The 11th did have a "special" as in different in a good way, quality in that we were "closer" than most as a group. That was special, not necessarily "better."
I'm not following this.... Different than what?
I didn't stand for it THEN, either. I stood for & with my WIFE. First of all there was nothing in my post that said I was OK w/ Don slipping my wife the tongue. In fact what I wrote was precisely opposite.
I said: "The wife was PO'ed at Don W...she said, "He was hittin' on me!"... I... didn't really try to get her to come back to work.
(since she was gone from work for the almost 2 years on maternity leave. The "tongue slip" thing HAD to be before she was pregnant - - add nine months to the 21 months)
Look at the statement in its context.
"...when I got the boot...They may have thought I had "gotten over" on them concerning my salary....they weren't getting any production from the $$ allocated to her (my wife)....I didn't have any problem with the whole thing....
...Even though it was impossible for her to prove what DW did, I didn't have a problem with her getting paid by them from 12 to 14THOUSand DOOLLars per year to do NOTHING for them. Since SHE said she was uncomfortable going back to work.
I couldn't get her to come back to work because THEY were asking "when is she coming back" and I DIDN'T try to get her to come back. I was oK with using their own policy to accomplish for HER what it would be impossible for a lawyer to prove. She got paid approximately $39.000.00 for ONE single slip of a Trustee tongue.
It was the same as settling a lawsuit against DW & TWI for that amount w/ no attorney fee. No waiting, no embarrasing testimony in court.
I did that on her word ALONE. NO proof, no "you're weak," no, "But He's a TRUSTEE, are you sure you didn't slip HIM - - YOUR tongue? After all you did feel the tongues together."
NO. I didn't do any of that. I when she said she wanted togo on maternity leave, I said, "Cool, according to this policy, you don't ever have to go back to work.
I think they MAY have fired me over that.
"I didn't have any problem with the whole thing."
Just tryin to be clear. I ain't mad at you Excie. I just think you can spare me you biting comments a little.
When you scan MY posts, you're not gonna see me excusing THEM. They still smart a little even after "sowwy."
I fought them tooth & nail til they threw me out.
:P-->
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excathedra
wait a minute. i was not biting you anywhere. i gotta go back and look and see where we are not communicating
and i appreciate your closeness as a corps, but i still beg to differ as yours being unique
and the dean don tongue, whatever, it's a gross trigger for me
now i'll go read more and see where i messed up
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excathedra
i don't get the salary thing... if a trustee (or anyone) french kisses your wife, you should kick the livng .... out of him even if she says you shouldn't
you got fired for whatever reason . me too .
and the thing i said about your corps.... it's true. you were no closer than anybody else. what i mean is, we all feel that way, either as a corps group, wow group, or an abused husband and wife
see what i mean ?
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excathedra
ps. i think a joke is the same where you come from and where i come from. i was joking when i responded. you're projecting just like every single one of us
we are human
uniquely so, thank god
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igotout
Hey, HCW or any others who may want your L.E.A.D. story in a PDF document (without any comments), I took the liberty. Click here to download it. In this format you can share it on any computer or email it to others.
LEAD ACCIDENT STORY
Thanks,
John R.
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HCW
Waterbuffalo;
I stayed in New Knoxville firstly because I owned a home (with a mortgage). NK is a wonderful little town that TWI does not, nor has it ever defined. NK school is one of the BEST schools in the State of Ohio. It hovers between & 1 and top five.
Also. Do you live on a wooded (30 mature trees) acre in the country? $330/mo mortgage? My neighbors would call and leave messages like, "...You know that heavy wind we had to day? It blew your back door open, I walked over & closed it fer ya. Just wanted you to know..." Lester, who owned the farm across the street would bring his tractor out & plow my 85ft two lane driveway when it snowed real heavy. Stuff like that.
I used to have & my ex-sister-in-law still has season tickets to the NKHS basketball games. Right at halfcourt, three rows up. She's moved to CT now. I use her ticket when I go see Jasmine cheer. Last week at a game a local guy, who I forget his name turned around & patted me on the leg w/ congrats @ Jaz's school accomplishments. (did I tell you she's beautiful too?
:)--> Slap me I'm a proud Papa)
NK is a really nic e place to live, virtually no crime ( they had a murder about, umm, ten years ago?) nice people, family atmosphere in a real Andy Griffith kinda way. Its charming. A four year old got shot in Dayton yesterday. My last house was robbed three times in two months... I'm sure you catch my drift.
Yes. Generally one camn make more money in bigger cities. I worked in Dayton and drove 65 miles one way 5+ days/wk. I've worked for AT&T, US Army Space Command, SATCOM (satellite comunications division) US Air Force from Dayton to name a few.
Had money, lost money, now I'm working & will eventually get back $$ as a partner in our ne Ad agency. This area is also with 1 day's drive of 90% od every major metro area in the country.
My brother the actor, who lives in NYC with his Emmy Award winning wife used to try to get me to move to one of the coasts, for the same reasons, mo $$$$$$ and higher competition level. The hustle, the bustle the whole thing, which I really love and thrive on....
At he beginning of the divorce, My Jazzy could hardly stand to go away to be w/Mommy. I mentioned once to her when some company was wanting me to move. "Daddy is thinking about moving?" Her little face broke up like glass shattering.
I said, "Well you don't have to worry about that. You Daddy will NEVER leave you." I've sacrificed, especially slogging through months on unemployment compensation having Companies tell me, "I wish we COULD hire you. But you'll cost too much, you're overqualified."
"Then I could surely perform in the position, right?" I'd say. They'd smile &shake my hand & hire somebody else. I used to think that Jasmine would be better off if I were to go somewhere and make ONE MIIlion DOOOLLars (pinky) and have Mo money , Mo money, MO money.!! to give her & buy all the stuff.
I'm now convinced that a BIG part of why she's done so well in life so far is that told & showed her "Your Daddy will NEVER leave you."
That's the real, central reason I stayed in NK, to stay near my daughter.
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HCW
Thanks John. I'm pulling it down tonite.
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Linda Z
That's a sweet story about you and Jasmine, HCW. How proud I know you are of her, and how happy she must be that Daddy didn't leave her to chase after bucks. Money's a fleeting thing anyway, not lasting like the love between a dad and his daughter.
I loved New Knoxville, too. When I left HQ, I was glad, but when I drove out of NK, I cried. I made such great friends among the people in town.
My landlord used to come by while I was at work and leave tomatoes and other veggies in my fridge. My closest friend when I was on staff was a guy who grew up in NK, and I still stay in touch with him occasionally. Aside from a few people who automatically wrote anyone off who was from twi, most were warm and kind, and I love living in such a small town. I still miss it, believe it or not.
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HCW
I'm sorry excie, but
I don't see the joke in that.
I do appreciate your intent to communicate though.
I'm also more than a little sensitive to "women's issues." The nature of a question like that suggests that it could possibly be true, hence the question .
Would it communicate better to say that pointed questions do have 'points'? Even mine. Sometimes the point of a question or statement pokes and "hurts" a little, especially if it points to an area that is sensitive in a person. Obviously a prick in a sensitive area feels like a slash of stab would elsewhere.
I took the time to be clear, for clariy's sake in general, an attempt to allow whomever to see more clearly where I'm coming from. It was mmore that than a defense.
You're certainly entitled to you opinion on the closeness thing. I was writing about what folks told me about us 11th, not just what we felt. We 11th feel we were the best damn group EVER to don the grape sweatsuit
:)-->
No. If you wife tells you directly don't do that. You don't do it BECAUSE SHE SAID not to period. Hupotasso (greek for submit) goes BOTH ways. If more guys got that we'd have a lot more MEN and a lot less problems & a LOT less divorces, etc.
If wifeepoo says, "Don't kick the bastard's foot, honey." and you Kick the dang outta the bastard anyway. Three things are accomplished.
#1. You feed your OWN testosterone driven EGO.
#2. You do kick some very deserving foot.
#3. YOU TEACH YOU WIFE THAT YOU CANNOT BE TRUSTED WITH HER HEART.
The .... bastard has already hurt your wife once, who are you to kick HER when she's down???
By kicking foot against your wife's will, you allow the .... BASTARD power to fracture your realtionship with your wife. You become HIS puppet and do the same thing to her he was trying to do, HURT her.
You excie, would have told me to kick the bastard's teeth in and I would have been happy to do it.
BUT. THAT particular jerk would have certainly had me jailed, should I have shoved his tongue down his throat with my foot. That would then get me out of the picture... so he could have an opertunity to rape the wife.
I hit 'em where it hurt most, in their wallets.
The prescribed LEGAL end to that particular molestation would have been a civil suit. No jury or court wold incarcerate a person for a "kiss too far" when said kiss was NOT completely unwelcome. (there was the "holy kiss cultural piece in TWI, right?) It was legally her word against his, a legal stalemate; imopssible for her to prove he did anything.
SO. She never wanted to go back to work for the bastard because of what he did. Although the policy said, "whenever" what they meant was "within a reasonable amount of time," usually about 3 mo, max. They allowed things like playpens in offices & they provided childcare for all ages for free. There was "no reason" she couldn't have returned to work in a matter of weeks. The stated intent of the policy was not to pressure women to work. They left it open ended so that if a particular family had issues, concerning either/or mom or child they didn't have to feel like they MUST come back after, say six weeks.
I saw the maternity leave policy as a way to get her paid without working for it. A lawsuit would have paid some $$ for pain & suffering should one prevail. She wouldn't have to work to earn the settlement. Some settlementsa are paid as annuities, over time. He getting her salary w/out working was no different to me than getting a settlement. Money is money. She did never work there again after that. But she got paid for about three years.
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HCW
Yes Linda. Our entire society is set up so that men leave their children in favor of bucks.
That sends such a hugely negative message to them,
"My Daddy cares more about money than he cares about me."
Oh yes it DOES. Little kids will take the money you give them & the stuff it buys and appear happy cause little kids think they want stuff. Older kids & young adults would tell how they would trade it all instantly.
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HCW
I dunno shell you tell me....
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Jim
Now you've lost me... What do you mean?
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Shellon
Ok Howard
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shazdancer
Once more on the tongue-lashing, HCW...
Other posters have mentioned on here that members of the BOT couldn't keep a civil tongue in their heads when kissing the ladies. I was a recipient of the lizard kiss also, from Howard Allen. At the time, naive me thought he just didn't know how to kiss! But I steered clear of greeting the BOT at the Rock after that.
When my first husband was kicked off of staff for drinking, I was kicked off, too. I agree, hiring was a package deal. More like two bodies for the price of one. TWI -- God's worst-managed company!
Regards,
Shaz
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excathedra
thank you for the reply howard
**
there's a really wonderful poster here named nknative. she's never been a wayfer.
oh and howard, i think your corps was so fabulous because of your elders
;)-->
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excathedra
what is your actor sister-in-law's name ?
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vickles
Yeah I got one of those 'lizard' kisses once by someone from staff. It was right in front of his wife too. She said to him afterwards that he shouldn't do that to me because I wouldn't understand....huh? Now I do!!!!!
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satori001
Yeah, talk about misinterpretation of tongues.
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ps
I am new to all this and I hope I am doing this right but HCW it is great to see you on here. I am 11th WC or was or what ever we are calling ourselves now. I was one of the youngest in the 11 WC, same age as Rochelle (we turned 20 in the first months there) and we were very good friends. We lived on the same floor our first block inresidence second floor Uncle Harry. I would walk by her all perky saying "HI" and she always had some glum thing to say back. I made her my personal project to figure out what made her click and why God chose her to be in the WC. We became very dear and precious friends. One day when I was working in the sewing room she worked next door (I can't remember what was next door now...housecleaning?) any way she came in and kneeled down next to me and began to quietly telling me why I was a great person and why she loved me so much. It was so heartfelt and meaningful and she would NOT let me laugh it off and make light of it. It was something she just really believed I needed to hear and was determined to make me hear it and believe it. When she was done I left the room and went to the bathroom and cried my eyes out. I had never been loved so verbally might I say. She was a diamond in the rough. She was a great woman and worth the effort to know and couldn't help but love once you did know her. She was honest and caring and appreciated LOVE. She was a sponge for it. I have had my suspicions through the years that her and Dr. Wierwille might have had a "special" relationship because she was always invited to the coach when he came to the campus. I have know proof because Rochelle was far to loyal to run her mouth about that. I do think that also contributed to her demise though.
She lived at the Weirwill home while at HQ and from what I knew she was Mrs. Weirwille's "project" to nurse her back to health. Al, her brother an ordained clergy who Rochelle idolized but yet I don't know how close they really were. I don't think Al was there for her either but I don't know that forsure.
I was at Gunnison when the accident happen along with another very good friend of Rochelle's Jill Ann. When we were going through for Block change on our way to HQ Jill and I stopped in to see Rochelle in her room. She was all bandaged but made herself smile and be pleasant for us. She was such a cuddle bug. She wanted Jill and I right next to her she loved to be hugged and to hug people...touchy feely Rochelle. She just could not get enough love and you couldn't help but just flood her with it.
The slice on her skull was a HUGE C. It went from her temple area up toward the crown of her head and back toward the ear loab on right side of her head. I always said that any where else on her body BUT her head she would have healed and survived. I think she could have lost a limb. Been paralized and she would have dealt with it but because it being her head and all the trouble she had controlling it with out pain but she was in pain 24/7.
I knew she had grown up with constant thoughts of suicide and at the beginning of our last year inresidence even before the accident she was very disappointed in herself concerning her interm year and her wow brother.
After the holidays Rochelle went to HQ and Jill Ann and I went to Emporia. I found out about Rochelle commiting suicide the night before Howard Allen announced it to the Corps at Breakfast because my Corps sister who knew I was good friends with Rochelle pulled me aside and told me she had heard it on the radio. I was cut to the bone. I was so mad at HQ that they did not handle this before the media.
I got with Jill Ann on the way to breakfast and told her I needed to eat breakfast with her because I figured Howard would announce it or else I was told he was going to. I let Howard tell Jill and then I swooped her up and we went out the backdoor of the dinning room and we cried together for quite awhile.
I struggled for quite a while with the "What if's". I was mad at myself that I didn't stay in better contact with her through this horrible time for her. I was just so sure she had the best attention. I never understood why they would just "let her go".
Thank you so much Howard for reliving all this. I did not know any specifics of the accident. I never pushed for details from anyone because I knew what a painful experience it was. I knew Don Juan and loved him so. I felt bad for the pain he endured too. I wonder how he is now. I never knew you were this involved in the accident. Thank you for putting the dots together for me.
I will keep good thoughts, energy, prayers what ever positives I can send your way to your healing in this. Hopefully this has been a very healing experience in sharing this.
Thank you for letting me share about a great diamond of a friend in my life that I still miss. So many of the 11th WC were and are that for me. I will hold them so dear in my heart. We did a lot of growing up together.
I do not miss TWI I miss all my brothers and sisters that have been scattered through out the world and hurt so badly that we can't even barely communicate with each other because of the pain we associate with the time we shared with each other. What a tragedy.
I hope I did all this right for Rochelle so everyone can know my dear friend better. Thank you again Howard.
PS formally PW...we sat in the amen corner together I was the Wolfe behind you and not Lisa. lol : )
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