quote: I'd like to think the best and that ANYONE there can turn to God's love.
Anyone can. Till then, it helps to be armed. (Figuratively speaking) It worked for Daniel, Moses, Abraham, Joshua, the 12 apostles, some that Jesus sent, and John Wayne.
You wrote: "Just like walking away from the "the true Household of God" is "walking away from God", right Mike?"
No! My whole point is that the supposed "true" household leadership ignored Dr's final instructions and a whole string of instructions for ten years prior.
Others here just recently, like HCW and shazdancer and TheEvan, have agreed with the accurate parts of the POP that most leadership distanced themselves from Dr long before he died.
The evidence is overwhelming that their claim to power is false. Their fear is in this being seen by the people.
I'd like to think the best and that ANYONE there can turn to God's love. It's as simple as opening a book and reading with meekness. He can save to the uttermost.
You know,
if anyone ELSE said this,
they'd mean the BIBLE.
Any new readers of yours would have no idea that you've rejected the Bible
and refer to a book "by" vpw, cobbled together by cutting and pasting
works from BG Leonard, JE Stiles, and EW Bullinger.
By "He can save to the uttermost", you DID mean GOD ALMIGHTY, right?
I wanted to make absolutely sure you didn't mean someone else....
We were talking about the web page, I believe. I'm clueless about web page "stuff."
quote: Registering does not require you to reveal your real name. However, it would reveal your IP address (I'm not sure posting when you are not registered doesn't likewise reveal your IP addy). It doesn't take too much to track down who the INSP is registered to, once you have an IP address.
Does this mean the WayGB can tell the names of anyone who has visited the site?
Sorry Mike, but your own words, "True authority to speak comes only from loyalty to God," indict Wierwille himself as not having the authority to speak for God.
We were talking about the web page, I believe. I'm clueless about web page "stuff."
quote: Registering does not require you to reveal your real name. However, it would reveal your IP address (I'm not sure posting when you are not registered doesn't likewise reveal your IP addy). It doesn't take too much to track down who the INSP is registered to, once you have an IP address.
Does this mean the WayGB can tell the names of anyone who has visited the site?
JT
No, it doesn't. When you connect to the internet, you are assigned an ip address from a pool of addresses. You get a new ip address each time you connect. You CAN ask for what is called a static ip address, in which case, your ip address is always the same. Even with a static ip address though, the only thing they could trace you back to is the server at your isp. To get your name and any personal information, they would have to request the isp to go through thier records and determine who was assigned that ip address at a specific time, and most isp's will not do that without a court order.
Been reading your posts about my website for the young people currently fellowshipping with The Way International.
Someone mentioned the fact that the adult and kids sections were not seperate. That's a fact and I probably should do something about it. We haven't had the situation where I need to really seperate them before.
Don't be surprised if some parts of the website go "underconstruction" for awhile.
(snip)
I think announcements of problems are premature,
since he SAID he was going to make some changes, and
that would temporarily block access for a time.
(It's also possible there's a problem, but I won't think
there's a real problem, unless the site comes back
Great, yet another thread infected by smikeol trying to promulgate his sewage.
Yophoto, please hurry and get your site back up so smikeol can post there some more for people that appreciate the gunk that's coming out of his pie hole - or some other hole.
You wrote: "Even with a static ip address though, the only thing they could trace you back to is the server at your isp. To get your name and any personal information, they would have to request the isp to go through thier records and determine who was assigned that ip address at a specific time, and most isp's will not do that without a court order."
If it's the case that "your isp" is not a national one, but a small local one, then that could be enough information to reveal identity. The flock is so small and spread out, that city ID could get pretty close to personal ID.
Correct me if I'm wrong about this: a static isp address comes with DSL, cable, and what else?
A dial-up brings in a new isp address every time a connection is made.
Safest ID protection: national ISP with dial-up conection.
He said the site would be taken down to work on some things on the website. Take him at his word, folks. He has proven himself to be upfront and honest.
I happen to think that if the BOD pulled the plug on the site he would post that as well, but without placing blame on the people from here who have posted on there.
Mike, I'm pretty sure your posts are just as long, bombastic and annoying over there as they are over here. Please get your own website and save these webmasters from having to pay for your bandwidth. I promise, I'll send people that way who are interested in worshipping veepeepee and his plagarized works. It's really a courtesy thing as opposed to who suggested it thing. ;)-->
And I think (there's been a LOT of activity lately) Abigail gave the same advice.
My long posts there set the stage for what I know the BOD needs to come to grips with if they are going to have the strength, wisdom, and understanding to deal with the many other issues.
There has been twenty years of accumulated error, both there and everywhere that grads are. It takes a lot to even start unraveling all that error.
I'm most sensitive to the demands of JB, the website owner, but I have also heard the three voices over here.
I now agree, after much thought and additional consultation, that I ought to cool it on the long posts and see how things develop there in a dialog fashion. The stage is set there for resonable dialog.
In other words: OK!
So, what do you think of HCW's long posts? I like them a lot.
Thanks, Mike. There's better ways to communicate with the BOD and other specific people you want to share your knowledge with than hijacking someone else's website. :)-->
I like reading about HCW's experiences, but I also think he has rose-colored glasses with blinders on the side and he refuses to see the severity of the evil in the TWIts that he so loved. (I also think he may be oldiesman or johniam posting under another handle. ;)--> )
Mr. Hammeroni, I doubt that is the case. John Brown is actually doing us a favor, in a sense. He is dividing the message board so we may more freely converse without risk of posting information which might have a negative effect on the kids who go there. I think this is a gracious and wise decision.
The youths who post there are innocent, regardless of what you may think of the adults. Most have little say in their participation with the ministry, and even those who may desire to voice discontent risk family relations if they were to leave or question things too heavily.
Mike,
I do not recall make any suggestion that you cease or even trim your posts at the Family Tables. On the contrary I think it is a great place for your message, as you are more likely to find people who are interested in it and you are more likely to get an informed response.
However, in all honesty, it is easier to digest if you break it up into bite sized chunks.
You wrote: "This is not good. How can we compete when there are pictures of young girls in Hooters t-shirts on that site? __ Wait I think this is good maybe, because all the preachers and teachers here can now go there."
What pictures? Where? Got link?
Seth, did I know you from Long Island ten thousand years or so ago? I knew a Seth there, but the last name had faded in my ... --> er... ahem ... my YOUTHFUL memory.
I'm the other Seth, I think you are thinking of the Seth that was on staff at HQ. I'm also not the Seth that is the subject of "Seth speaks" nor am I the Seth of Egyptian mythology that was the God of the Nile. Oh, I'm also not the Seth who is a famous Cello player, and last but not least I'm not the Seth that makes all those clocks.
Abigail, that was the real reason I did not post anything there. I try to leave "da kids" out of it. Still feel sorry for them. I honestly could not think of anything civil to post, so I refrained from doing so.
Probably wouldn't do any more good than to get someone mad, think they were reading the rantings of a lunatic.. that's what I would have thought twenty five years ago.
I know for a fact that HCW isn't Oldies or Mike. He's a real, live person; we used to be on staff together. He's not blinded to the bad things that happened in twi, not by a long shot. He's simply expressing his firsthand observations and perceptions.
I wish HCW well in his efforts to share his viewpoint. Around here, it ain't easy to say, "Yes, there were bad things...really bad things...that went on in twi, and there were good things...really good things." To do so, one runs the risk of being called a "vp worshiper," "vp apologist," "waybrained" and any number of similar things.
I find criticisms of/observations about VPW, LCM, et al that come from people who knew them to be far more enlightening than the many criticisms that come from people who didn't know them or who never even laid eyes on them but are just passing on what they heard.
Sorry, Linda, perhaps I should have put a smilie face on that. I know he isn't any of them, it was meant to be a joke as they are notorious for excusing vpw's exploitation, abuse and rape of women as being acceptable and/or the women's fault and an acceptable behavior since "he brought us the word".
I really enjoy reading about other people's experiences, but when they start justifying and excusing the rampant evil and deception it plsses me off. I wasn't there and vp was long gone by the time I got involved, so it is especially interesting to me and I was fine with his posts until he laid the blame at the feet of those poor GIRLS that vp took advantage of.
If you look back, I even stuck up for him when he was merely communicating his observations of DEW from his own perspective. I don't know if it's the truth about how DEW felt or not and it doesn't matter because he was only relaying what he saw and observed and it was interesting to read about it.
Recommended Posts
Top Posters In This Topic
18
74
18
61
Popular Days
Jan 18
40
Jan 17
33
Feb 19
26
Feb 18
25
Top Posters In This Topic
Belle 18 posts
Mike 74 posts
JustThinking 18 posts
Ham 61 posts
Popular Days
Jan 18 2005
40 posts
Jan 17 2005
33 posts
Feb 19 2005
26 posts
Feb 18 2005
25 posts
JustThinking
Mike:
Anyone can. Till then, it helps to be armed. (Figuratively speaking) It worked for Daniel, Moses, Abraham, Joshua, the 12 apostles, some that Jesus sent, and John Wayne.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mike
CC,
You wrote: "Just like walking away from the "the true Household of God" is "walking away from God", right Mike?"
No! My whole point is that the supposed "true" household leadership ignored Dr's final instructions and a whole string of instructions for ten years prior.
Others here just recently, like HCW and shazdancer and TheEvan, have agreed with the accurate parts of the POP that most leadership distanced themselves from Dr long before he died.
The evidence is overwhelming that their claim to power is false. Their fear is in this being seen by the people.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Cherished Child
Mike, "the people" don't even really remember Dr. anymore, nor do they worship him any longer.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mike
His name is on many of the books they read.
All the older people remember him.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
You know,
if anyone ELSE said this,
they'd mean the BIBLE.
Any new readers of yours would have no idea that you've rejected the Bible
and refer to a book "by" vpw, cobbled together by cutting and pasting
works from BG Leonard, JE Stiles, and EW Bullinger.
By "He can save to the uttermost", you DID mean GOD ALMIGHTY, right?
I wanted to make absolutely sure you didn't mean someone else....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
"Betraying Dr's revelations is betraying God."
Hey, Tom, if you're reading this thread, here's another one for your
summary....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
JustThinking
So... back to the thread.
We were talking about the web page, I believe. I'm clueless about web page "stuff."
Does this mean the WayGB can tell the names of anyone who has visited the site?
JT
Link to comment
Share on other sites
shazdancer
Sorry Mike, but your own words, "True authority to speak comes only from loyalty to God," indict Wierwille himself as not having the authority to speak for God.
Shaz
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bob
Well, you guys did it now. The site has been taken down:
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bluzeman
No, it doesn't. When you connect to the internet, you are assigned an ip address from a pool of addresses. You get a new ip address each time you connect. You CAN ask for what is called a static ip address, in which case, your ip address is always the same. Even with a static ip address though, the only thing they could trace you back to is the server at your isp. To get your name and any personal information, they would have to request the isp to go through thier records and determine who was assigned that ip address at a specific time, and most isp's will not do that without a court order.
Rick
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
I think announcements of problems are premature,
since he SAID he was going to make some changes, and
that would temporarily block access for a time.
(It's also possible there's a problem, but I won't think
there's a real problem, unless the site comes back
completely rewritten,
or is offline for a month or something.)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Steve!
Great, yet another thread infected by smikeol trying to promulgate his sewage.
Yophoto, please hurry and get your site back up so smikeol can post there some more for people that appreciate the gunk that's coming out of his pie hole - or some other hole.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mike
Bluzeman,
You wrote: "Even with a static ip address though, the only thing they could trace you back to is the server at your isp. To get your name and any personal information, they would have to request the isp to go through thier records and determine who was assigned that ip address at a specific time, and most isp's will not do that without a court order."
If it's the case that "your isp" is not a national one, but a small local one, then that could be enough information to reveal identity. The flock is so small and spread out, that city ID could get pretty close to personal ID.
Correct me if I'm wrong about this: a static isp address comes with DSL, cable, and what else?
A dial-up brings in a new isp address every time a connection is made.
Safest ID protection: national ISP with dial-up conection.
Edited by MikeLink to comment
Share on other sites
Belle
He said the site would be taken down to work on some things on the website. Take him at his word, folks. He has proven himself to be upfront and honest.
I happen to think that if the BOD pulled the plug on the site he would post that as well, but without placing blame on the people from here who have posted on there.
Mike, I'm pretty sure your posts are just as long, bombastic and annoying over there as they are over here. Please get your own website and save these webmasters from having to pay for your bandwidth. I promise, I'll send people that way who are interested in worshipping veepeepee and his plagarized works. It's really a courtesy thing as opposed to who suggested it thing.
;)-->
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mike
Belle,
I hear you.
I heard igotout.
And I think (there's been a LOT of activity lately) Abigail gave the same advice.
My long posts there set the stage for what I know the BOD needs to come to grips with if they are going to have the strength, wisdom, and understanding to deal with the many other issues.
There has been twenty years of accumulated error, both there and everywhere that grads are. It takes a lot to even start unraveling all that error.
I'm most sensitive to the demands of JB, the website owner, but I have also heard the three voices over here.
I now agree, after much thought and additional consultation, that I ought to cool it on the long posts and see how things develop there in a dialog fashion. The stage is set there for resonable dialog.
In other words: OK!
So, what do you think of HCW's long posts? I like them a lot.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Belle
Thanks, Mike. There's better ways to communicate with the BOD and other specific people you want to share your knowledge with than hijacking someone else's website.
:)-->
I like reading about HCW's experiences, but I also think he has rose-colored glasses with blinders on the side and he refuses to see the severity of the evil in the TWIts that he so loved. (I also think he may be oldiesman or johniam posting under another handle.
;)--> )
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
Makes me think they may have pulled the plug while they are busy "researching" for answers to some of the questions that were posed- heh heh.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Abigail
Mr. Hammeroni, I doubt that is the case. John Brown is actually doing us a favor, in a sense. He is dividing the message board so we may more freely converse without risk of posting information which might have a negative effect on the kids who go there. I think this is a gracious and wise decision.
The youths who post there are innocent, regardless of what you may think of the adults. Most have little say in their participation with the ministry, and even those who may desire to voice discontent risk family relations if they were to leave or question things too heavily.
Mike,
I do not recall make any suggestion that you cease or even trim your posts at the Family Tables. On the contrary I think it is a great place for your message, as you are more likely to find people who are interested in it and you are more likely to get an informed response.
However, in all honesty, it is easier to digest if you break it up into bite sized chunks.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Seth R.
I'm the other Seth, I think you are thinking of the Seth that was on staff at HQ. I'm also not the Seth that is the subject of "Seth speaks" nor am I the Seth of Egyptian mythology that was the God of the Nile. Oh, I'm also not the Seth who is a famous Cello player, and last but not least I'm not the Seth that makes all those clocks.
Thank you and good day sir!
Seth
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
Abigail, that was the real reason I did not post anything there. I try to leave "da kids" out of it. Still feel sorry for them. I honestly could not think of anything civil to post, so I refrained from doing so.
Probably wouldn't do any more good than to get someone mad, think they were reading the rantings of a lunatic.. that's what I would have thought twenty five years ago.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
pawtucket
YoPhoto,
I would like to talk to you about a trade. You take Mike for 3 posters of your choosing.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
heh heh heh heh.. priceless!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Linda Z
Belle, lest suspicion run too rampant here:
I know for a fact that HCW isn't Oldies or Mike. He's a real, live person; we used to be on staff together. He's not blinded to the bad things that happened in twi, not by a long shot. He's simply expressing his firsthand observations and perceptions.
I wish HCW well in his efforts to share his viewpoint. Around here, it ain't easy to say, "Yes, there were bad things...really bad things...that went on in twi, and there were good things...really good things." To do so, one runs the risk of being called a "vp worshiper," "vp apologist," "waybrained" and any number of similar things.
I find criticisms of/observations about VPW, LCM, et al that come from people who knew them to be far more enlightening than the many criticisms that come from people who didn't know them or who never even laid eyes on them but are just passing on what they heard.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Belle
Sorry, Linda, perhaps I should have put a smilie face on that. I know he isn't any of them, it was meant to be a joke as they are notorious for excusing vpw's exploitation, abuse and rape of women as being acceptable and/or the women's fault and an acceptable behavior since "he brought us the word".
I really enjoy reading about other people's experiences, but when they start justifying and excusing the rampant evil and deception it plsses me off. I wasn't there and vp was long gone by the time I got involved, so it is especially interesting to me and I was fine with his posts until he laid the blame at the feet of those poor GIRLS that vp took advantage of.
If you look back, I even stuck up for him when he was merely communicating his observations of DEW from his own perspective. I don't know if it's the truth about how DEW felt or not and it doesn't matter because he was only relaying what he saw and observed and it was interesting to read about it.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.