TWI Conspiracy Theory

[Mister P-Mosh]

As any good conspiracy theory, this is just taking a few facts and combining them in such a way to guess at something unproveable. I don't actually have enough information to believe this to be true, but there are a few things that were not right about TWI in a way that I haven't really seen addressed here.

The basic idea is that the upper echelons of TWI could have possibly been a secret pagan group, covered up by the Christian aspects of it. Sort of how the conspiracy theory of the Freemasons being a cover for the Illuminati works.

1) The Horn of Plenty - Every meeting, we passed around a big phallic symbol that originated in ancient Greece. Depending on which story is earlier, it either came from Zeus pulling the horn off of a goat, or it came from Hercules pulling it off of an opponent who transformed himself into a bull. In any case, it represents fertility and abundance. That can be made obvious, as it's effectively a symbol of a penis that is "fruitful."

2) The Way Symbol - The seal or symbol of the way is a giant tree on top of the Earth. This is clearly a reference to Yggdrasil, the Norse "World Tree".

3) Sexual Enlightenment - The top people in TWI abused people sexually, using scripture as an excuse. The idea of having sex as a religious experience is much older than Christianity, and we are all familiar with the ancient Roman orgies. If TWI leadership used scripture to try to justify having sex with other people, perhaps they may have really believed that it was a religious experience. In either case, forcing people against their will or tricking them into it is rape.

4) Speaking In Tongues - This could be used for chanting, and TWI's way of teaching it is similar to that of the Oracles.

I would list more, but I have to go now. Keep in mind that I am just posting this as possibilities, not something that I really think is what happened. I just want to see what everyone else thinks.

[Ham]

I don't know.. but just a thought of seeing rosie wearing one of those red or black hooded robes, prancing around the cauldron and throwing a little salt peter in the fire might be pretty convincing.

[Ham]

I dunno.. it would probably go more like this: "donna, have harv throw some more saltpeter in the fire."

[Ham]

Seriously, you may have a real valid point there. with the code of silence, and the real strange doctrines that were embraced only (or mostly) by "the inner circle", anything is possible.

[Nottawayfer]

I don't know about conspiracy theories.

I think Rozilla has Harve, Jean-Yves, and the rest of the upper echelon (Prez Cab and Reg Coord) fooled as to what her (and Donna's) real motives and intents for twi actually are. Obviously the woman is an ice queen who has no real heart. She tries to keep up with the charade that her heart is to continue VPW's wishes, but it's all a corporation for her. The rest of the pawns just follow along because they don't think there's anywhere else to go.

For VPW, it was HIS show. He hoodwinked a lot of people in the hippy days which would serve him in more way than one. Mass people which would bring in money, and mass young girls which would serve his lusts. He got his brother to back him up so that he could get the young chicks too. And he got Howard to back him up. Howard is a pervert with a simple mind. (He once told me that he kept his boots shiny so that he could use them to look up the girls' dresses. -->) He got his share of the girls, so he backed up the MOG because it served his purposed too. He was VPs stooge who did the dirty work.

[engine]

I don't think there was any "conspiracy."

None of them were that smart...ya know?

They became corrupted by power.

[Ham]

Ha ha ha.. Johnny, in other circles I think it is called "red herring".

[Technobyte]

:)--> :D--> :)--> LMAO Johnny!!!

Very imaginative!!! :D-->:D-->:D-->

Technobyte

[Nomad888]

Interesting twist Mr P-Mosh. TWI (allegedly) trying to paganize Christianity?

Didn't some Roman Emporer (Constantine?) do that already?

Even with Jonny's explanation, it sounds more theory than conspiracy to me. :D-->

My 2 cents...

Nomad888

[socks]

quote:

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When held up, these three fingers look like a "W", or, a "dubyw". Hmmm...

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And I wonder what our favorite political dynasty was doing at the time, you know... Bush?

There's a connection there. I just know it.

[Mister P-Mosh]

quote:

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Originally posted by Nomad888:

Didn't some Roman Emporer (Constantine?) do that already?

Even with Jonny's explanation, it sounds more theory than conspiracy to me. :D-->

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You are thinking of the Council of Nicea(sp?) in 325 which TWI talks about a lot when discussing the date that Jesus was voted on being a god rather than a person. Some other things they did were removing parts of the bible that didn't suit their new standards, set Christmas as December 25 (I think this happened then), and a few other things. It was essentially the bringing about of modern Christianity, which is still practiced today and is nothing like what the original Christians practiced as far as I can tell.

If you want signs of paganism, I'd bet that at least 99% of Christian beliefs are ripped off from other religions. It's pretty shocking.

[Nomad888]

It also wouldn't be the first time that TWI ripped off someone else's doctrine w/o recognition of the source, while claiming to teach something as it hasn't been taught since the first 100 years, or somethin' like that.

My 2 cents...

Nomad888

[excathedra]

well i didn't read your whole bit jonny because it's just too long, and i get the feeling it's supposed to be funny

but since it mentions vic and booze and sex, it's about as funny as nothing

it degrades people like me, in my humble opinion

just can't take things lightly that destroyed my friggin life for a while there, bubba

[excathedra]

quote:

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Why, they laughed and laughed over this one, because, as they slugged down more Drambui, Vic said that not only does the "O" shaped lips indicate a secret desire to request or offer oral sex

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oh yeah there's the part that's like true

[excathedra]

yeah i'll bet

did you happen to catch anything else i said

[excathedra]

oh shut up

[markomalley]

FWIW, TWI taught a vastly over-simplified and somewhat inaccurate account of the First Council of Nicea. The council was called as a result of the heresy of Arius. It re-affirmed the already-existing doctrine of the Trinity and formulated the Nicene Creed. (Of course, we all know that conceptually, the Trinity has been in existence since the writing of the Gospel of Matthew and Pauls letters to the Romans and to the Galatians, and it is alluded to from the earliest writings of the Church Fathers -- Clement of Rome, Justin Martyr, Igantius of Antioch and Polycarp. However, the first documented explicit use of the word itself comes from Tertullian and Origen at around the beginning of the second century). The point is not to provide and exigesis on the Trinity but to point out that the thought that the concept originated with the First Nicene Council is completely false.

The council also set the formula for setting the date for Easter (the first Sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox). This council did not set the date for Christmas. That date floated around quite a bit. The origins of the 25 December date may have originated with Tertullian back in the second century AD, but there was not one council that went and set the date.

The other issue dealt with by the First Nicene Council was the schism of Meletius of Lycopolis, which had its origins earlier in the century, from somewhere around 303 to 306 AD.

Oh, btw, P-Mosh, if you are interested in learning how the first century Christians lived, I would refer you to a document called The Didache. It has been dated to between AD 80 and AD 90.

[excathedra]

quote:

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One of the most secret of hand signs was the extended index, middle, and "next to the pinky finger" fingers-palm forward-, which is actually the ancient Norse and Celtic symbol for "let's have sex with young women!" "Let's rape, pillage, and plunder!" When held up, these three fingers look like a "W", or, a "dubyw". Hmmm...

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okay jonny here's another quote of yours.... let's rape, pillage and plunder !!!!!!!! you're so funny !!!!! guess what ? i have a great sense of humor..... i can even have one when it comes to weewillie

but not when it comes to YOUR idea of what's funny because it's not funny. you did not experience it. let me know how funny you think it is that he shoved young girls' faces down and told them it was the will god

i'm sorry you're ....ing me off

you're like a 14 year old brother who is yuck yuck funny, but guess what, you're not 14 anymore

sorry i am not lightening up for you

'scuse me

[excathedra]

maybe you're an .... hole

[vickles]

Jonny, some people come here for different reasons. I don't think you or anyone else has a right to tell someone not to come in here.

That is very offensive in itself!!!

I too found your story to be rather offensive.

[excathedra]

grow up, jonny

try anyway

maybe put yourself in other people's shoes

okay ?

thanks

[vickles]

jonny, your apologies seem to have a backhanded way of doing it. By apologizing but yet putting the other person down first...it must make you feel real good, huh?

[GrouchoMarxJr]

OK...I read what Lingo posted...I understand why some were offended but I really don't think it was Lingo's INTENTION to offend anyone. His "story" was loaded with tongue in cheek sarcasm ans such...and I took his apologies to be sincere. Cut him slack why dontcha...

[vickles]

jonny, I really don't know where you get off calling us bitches....not nice!!!!!

[vickles]

quote:

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Originally posted by Jonny Lingo:

Thank you Hairy. And Hairy, and the rest of youz, I realize that you and I many times are on the other side of the fence, but I thank you. I know that I initially started out my apology almost as a "rebuttal", but, I changed in mid stream as I realized that an apology was warrented. I really do wish Excathedra deliverance from the past that still has a hold on her. And so, again, with no strings attached, I apologize...

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deliverance?????? guffaw...who are you to think that someone needs it?????? Gosh, jonny, that is such a put down of someone...makes ya feel real good, don't it?