Yeah, Oldies.. you can drive! Of course "better" is a relative term. Better than what? Oh yeah.. the new classes. Must be "better" than the old wineskins.. somebodies gotta pay for that little investment. "Unlike our old horse poop, we now make sure it is well cooked."
sky, he would be welcome, but they would ever so lovingly "correct" his vocabulary with the biggest smile on their face. If he gives enough money and/or signs up for the new class, then he may get away with calling it "twig" for at least a few weeks.
I also spoke with an innie very briefly recently who said that I had no idea how nice things were in "this day and time". If they're still speaking with loaded language and using "this day and time" - then they really haven't changed. They just painted the outside of that whited sepulchre again and hope no one notices the stench.
So, is this a new policy for twi?...or just some limb coordinator shooting off his mouth?
It would be a dramatic reversal for twi to welcome back all the former M&A folks. I mean, what about all the "devil spirits" that they would bring back with them? What this "limb coordinator" fails to realize is that a lot of us were not booted out...we walked away on our own. If they seriously want people to return, they MUST admit to ALL of the evil, the mistakes, the abuses and everything else. Of course, once they do THAT, nobody will want to return.
So, is this a new policy for twi?...or just some limb coordinator shooting off his mouth?
It would be a dramatic reversal for twi to welcome back all the former M&A folks. I mean, what about all the "devil spirits" that they would bring back with them? What this "limb coordinator" fails to realize is that a lot of us were not booted out...we walked away on our own. If they seriously want people to return, they MUST admit to ALL of the evil, the mistakes, the abuses and everything else. Of course, once they do THAT, nobody will want to return.
Yeah.......what this "limb coordinator" fails to realize is many mark/avoid people came face-to-face with a situation or a twi leader and, when confronted with this, TOOK A STAND AGAINST LCM AND TWI'S EVIL AND WALKED AWAY.
IMO.....this "limb coordinator" is a maverick and is off the beaten path of twi's policies. Because.....imo, the bod know that MANY OF US took a righteous stand and were black-listed. And, they know....if we were invited back into the fold, that it would only be a matter of time before another confrontation escalated and it could get ugly.
Twi's bod wants its followers to keep their distance from many of us who lcm black-listed. They know it. We know it.
quote:they MUST admit to ALL of the evil, the mistakes, the abuses and everything else.
It will never happen. End of story. Why? Because they have continuously misunderstood and consequently mis-applied "biblical authority". TWI still thinks of authority pretty much in the same manner the world thinks of it - that is, "How high can you get someone to jump whenever you bark"! (Still remember that PFAL illustration - the private doesn't ask how high to jump, he just jumps!) As long as they continue to hold to this belief it will never happen. Of course to the world that kind of authority is very impressive, but it just doesn't work; biblically speaking.
A true man of God is someone who has set himself and put himself under the authority of another. They are not a tyrant or a dictator barking out commands. You know the routine, just getting people to jump every time whenever they happen to bark. That is exactly what TWI expected from it's people and unfortunately, they still expect it from people. But that thinking was wrong and it still is wrong. The story of the Roman centurian in Luke 7:8 clarifies what true authority is about.
Luke 7:8
"For I also am a man set under authority, having under me soldiers, and I say unto one, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant Do this, and he doeth it."
That is simple enough to understand as everyone has a "boss" they must answer to. If you don't carry out the wishes of your boss you won't be in that position very long. Even your boss has a "boss" they must ultimately answer to. If your boss doesn't carry out whatever the "head-hancho" says, then they'll be the next one in the unemployment line right along with you.
Even though the Roman centurian was "the boss" in this case and he was in a position to issue commands to soldiers and they were also expected to carry them out, this Roman centurian was still under someone else's authority. That is easily seen by his remark ... "For I also am a man set under authority ...". This Roman centurian may have even been the "head-hancho", but at least he recognized he was still under someone else's authority. Under authority being the keyword here. He was not a dictator or a tyrant -- just barking out whatever commands he wanted to put on the soldiers that happened to be under him in this record.
Even if your the 'head-hancho' or the top-dog in your church you're still under someone's authority - the authority of God Almighty! If you don't carry out the wishes of God Almighty then you won't be in that position very long. Although God is very patient and tolerant with all of us, if you continuously fail to carry out His wishes you'll be removed from that position in the church sooner or later. I've seen it happen over and over in many church's before and not just TWI alone.
I just sent a letter to the area leader here, and one to Harve Platig about us and them coming back to PFAL and mastering the books.
Many months ago I had a very pleasant talk with Harve on the telephone, congratulating him for his communications breakthrough in sending an open letter to Pawtucket.
While few here were happy with the contents of that letter, most must admit it was a breakthrough.
I think they are TRYING to change, but that's very difficult for a large organization.
Oldiesman, I'm with you. I will fear not, and report back what I hear from them.
problem is, i think just about any one of us here are now more qualified to teach innies about freedoms than they can teach us. and, of course, that would most likely not be on the menu.
It may be a shot in the dark, but, If I were a younger staffer, or considering going in corps/vey disciple.. a logical conclusion would be: In twenty or thirty years I am going to be one of these people posting here about the BS I had to put up with. Consider the crap they did to ordinary folk like me, not corps, not staff- all I wanted was to go to "twig", learn the bible, have fun.
What chance do you think you will have as the years go on? If the organization even lasts that long- you will be viewed not as an asset. Health care costs (or even the possibility of health care costs- we all get old sooner or later) will make you more of a liability than you are worth to them. A lot of folks here waited, hoping things would get better; and they sure did not.
Holy cow! They even cut their financial ties from their biggest supporter. Of course "good" reasons were given. But was what was done "good" or "best"?
I could never go back. Sometimes I wondered if I would be interested in just doing a walk around HQ and if that would be interesting, but as I thought it through, I realized that I could never do that.
I could probably stop through Emporia and walk the campus there, just for the sake of nostalgia, for I did have some great times there, but never HQ at NK. Besides, an old friend of mine from my old neighborhood and sixth grade days is the vice president of The Way now, and that would be weird...
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oldiesman
I'd go and check out what's happening. Fear not!
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vickles
Yeah, shell, I think I would want to play..
:D-->
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Steve!
The sad thing is that there are a lot of people that *would* and *will* go back.
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Ham
Sounds typical. No apologies or explanations for what happened. Just "come back, the water is a little warmer now.."
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oldiesman
Hey let's go to Twig. Anybody need a ride?
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GarthP2000
Dude! Get some help! *Quickly*!!
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JustThinking
No thanks OM. I got taken for a ride enough during my time in TWI.
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Ham
Yeah, Oldies.. you can drive! Of course "better" is a relative term. Better than what? Oh yeah.. the new classes. Must be "better" than the old wineskins.. somebodies gotta pay for that little investment. "Unlike our old horse poop, we now make sure it is well cooked."
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sadie
Oldies, are you referring to a ride in the car or a "ride" at the twig?
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skyrider
Oldies, if you still refer to their home fellowships as "twig".......you're NOT welcome.
They hold to the present truth and shun "old wineskins."
You will be red-flagged and interrogated.
:D-->
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Belle
sky, he would be welcome, but they would ever so lovingly "correct" his vocabulary with the biggest smile on their face. If he gives enough money and/or signs up for the new class, then he may get away with calling it "twig" for at least a few weeks.
I also spoke with an innie very briefly recently who said that I had no idea how nice things were in "this day and time". If they're still speaking with loaded language and using "this day and time" - then they really haven't changed. They just painted the outside of that whited sepulchre again and hope no one notices the stench.
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GrouchoMarxJr
So, is this a new policy for twi?...or just some limb coordinator shooting off his mouth?
It would be a dramatic reversal for twi to welcome back all the former M&A folks. I mean, what about all the "devil spirits" that they would bring back with them? What this "limb coordinator" fails to realize is that a lot of us were not booted out...we walked away on our own. If they seriously want people to return, they MUST admit to ALL of the evil, the mistakes, the abuses and everything else. Of course, once they do THAT, nobody will want to return.
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Oakspear
I'm still waiting for an apology
:D-->
Hey, I'm in the phone book!
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skyrider
Yeah.......what this "limb coordinator" fails to realize is many mark/avoid people came face-to-face with a situation or a twi leader and, when confronted with this, TOOK A STAND AGAINST LCM AND TWI'S EVIL AND WALKED AWAY.
IMO.....this "limb coordinator" is a maverick and is off the beaten path of twi's policies. Because.....imo, the bod know that MANY OF US took a righteous stand and were black-listed. And, they know....if we were invited back into the fold, that it would only be a matter of time before another confrontation escalated and it could get ugly.
Twi's bod wants its followers to keep their distance from many of us who lcm black-listed. They know it. We know it.
This "limb coordinator" is simply a stooge.
That's the way I see it.
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What The Hay
It will never happen. End of story. Why? Because they have continuously misunderstood and consequently mis-applied "biblical authority". TWI still thinks of authority pretty much in the same manner the world thinks of it - that is, "How high can you get someone to jump whenever you bark"! (Still remember that PFAL illustration - the private doesn't ask how high to jump, he just jumps!) As long as they continue to hold to this belief it will never happen. Of course to the world that kind of authority is very impressive, but it just doesn't work; biblically speaking.
A true man of God is someone who has set himself and put himself under the authority of another. They are not a tyrant or a dictator barking out commands. You know the routine, just getting people to jump every time whenever they happen to bark. That is exactly what TWI expected from it's people and unfortunately, they still expect it from people. But that thinking was wrong and it still is wrong. The story of the Roman centurian in Luke 7:8 clarifies what true authority is about.
Luke 7:8
"For I also am a man set under authority, having under me soldiers, and I say unto one, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant Do this, and he doeth it."
That is simple enough to understand as everyone has a "boss" they must answer to. If you don't carry out the wishes of your boss you won't be in that position very long. Even your boss has a "boss" they must ultimately answer to. If your boss doesn't carry out whatever the "head-hancho" says, then they'll be the next one in the unemployment line right along with you.
Even though the Roman centurian was "the boss" in this case and he was in a position to issue commands to soldiers and they were also expected to carry them out, this Roman centurian was still under someone else's authority. That is easily seen by his remark ... "For I also am a man set under authority ...". This Roman centurian may have even been the "head-hancho", but at least he recognized he was still under someone else's authority. Under authority being the keyword here. He was not a dictator or a tyrant -- just barking out whatever commands he wanted to put on the soldiers that happened to be under him in this record.
Even if your the 'head-hancho' or the top-dog in your church you're still under someone's authority - the authority of God Almighty! If you don't carry out the wishes of God Almighty then you won't be in that position very long. Although God is very patient and tolerant with all of us, if you continuously fail to carry out His wishes you'll be removed from that position in the church sooner or later. I've seen it happen over and over in many church's before and not just TWI alone.
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Mike
I just sent a letter to the area leader here, and one to Harve Platig about us and them coming back to PFAL and mastering the books.
Many months ago I had a very pleasant talk with Harve on the telephone, congratulating him for his communications breakthrough in sending an open letter to Pawtucket.
While few here were happy with the contents of that letter, most must admit it was a breakthrough.
I think they are TRYING to change, but that's very difficult for a large organization.
Oldiesman, I'm with you. I will fear not, and report back what I hear from them.
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Ham
Hopefully it's not just another "leak" for the WAYGB..
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Belle
Pretty pathetic the steps they will go to in order to "expose" someone for being "evil", isn't it? Ironic, I think.
They used illegal means to find out something I did. But that's a story for another day.
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sirguessalot
problem is, i think just about any one of us here are now more qualified to teach innies about freedoms than they can teach us. and, of course, that would most likely not be on the menu.
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excathedra
if there are innies here reading and you are miserable, confused, etc., i've been there, please take heart and stand up for yourselves
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Ham
It may be a shot in the dark, but, If I were a younger staffer, or considering going in corps/vey disciple.. a logical conclusion would be: In twenty or thirty years I am going to be one of these people posting here about the BS I had to put up with. Consider the crap they did to ordinary folk like me, not corps, not staff- all I wanted was to go to "twig", learn the bible, have fun.
What chance do you think you will have as the years go on? If the organization even lasts that long- you will be viewed not as an asset. Health care costs (or even the possibility of health care costs- we all get old sooner or later) will make you more of a liability than you are worth to them. A lot of folks here waited, hoping things would get better; and they sure did not.
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Ham
Holy cow! They even cut their financial ties from their biggest supporter. Of course "good" reasons were given. But was what was done "good" or "best"?
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J0nny Ling0
I could never go back. Sometimes I wondered if I would be interested in just doing a walk around HQ and if that would be interesting, but as I thought it through, I realized that I could never do that.
I could probably stop through Emporia and walk the campus there, just for the sake of nostalgia, for I did have some great times there, but never HQ at NK. Besides, an old friend of mine from my old neighborhood and sixth grade days is the vice president of The Way now, and that would be weird...
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Jim
I'm with you Jonny. I'd like to see the inside and backstage of the auditorium at HQ, but that's about it.
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