Kinda interesting.. the really good guys that were near the top either left or were ousted long, long ago. It took them a lot longer to find the good folks further down the tree and pressure them, or run them off.
I think the full time corps / conduit from hell thingy is the best thing they could have done. Sure didn't take long to see the organization for what it really was.
The conduit thing, oh yea. Donna said she didn't want to be a conduit for the adversary getting through to Craig while he was filming the new Advanced Class. They had huge pipelines that ran underground, geez!
So I'm snooping around twi's site and I run my mouse across the different menu options on either side of the poster. When it skims across "Terms, Conditions, and Privacy" the poster picture changes to a scroll. (all options have pictures to them) Hmm, I think to myself. This is terms and such for legal purposes right? So they liken the scrolls to legal terms then are they not? My goodness if they haven't defined their perception right there for you!
Scrolls=Legal
Listen up you folks still hanging on there. You can buy the lie, bury the truthful pain inside, do what you thought no one could ever do to you. You can take yourself into survival mode all fancied up with "sunday go to meeting" clothes. Walk the walk, talk the talk and be doing it from where you honestly believe you have to remain or you will die. It gets better, don't take a strangers word though. Just think of what you've read on this forum and consider it. We're not the crazy ones. You live amongst them, and it's okay that right now you don't believe me. I was there once myself.
House, they keep coming back. "We are a biblical research... ministry". Ptooie. It sounds so "professional" ya know. Kinda like saying, "yep, I still have a bible.." for about all that little phrase is worth.
You don't owe your life to the ministry that taught you the word. Think about how much you already knew before TWI. Think about how much of what they taught you is b.s. or just plain legalism.
Do "normal" churches ask you where you are financially? Do they check on your schedules and what you're doing, who you're doing it with and how long before you bring them to church? Do they ask if you paid cash for your house or if you're in debt? Do they care if you financecd a car? No! They're happy that you're taking care of yourself!
Do "normal" churches care if your family members go to a different church - or if they go at all?
"Normal" healthy organizations and churches lay it out there FOR FREE and let you make up your own mind. They don't even monitor your mind to see if you have. They are there for you IF YOU ASK FOR HELP - not HELPING YOU EVEN IF YOU DON'T WANT HELP. It's a big difference.
It's good to make your own decisions. It's good to question authority. It's good to be able to question authority. It's not good in TWI. Think about it.
Have you ever had so many rules, regulations and expected behavior and vocabulary restrictions in your whole life?? It's scary,but it is sooooooooo much better outside the pseudo walls of the false zion of TWI. Read the "my story" section of this site. Those are real live stories of deliverance, recovery and the truly more abundant life.
Oh yes, Belle- the vocabulary restrictions. Of course nothing in writing. I had fun with that one once. The old branch guy here, I forget what the context was, somebody scared about something. I used the word "spooked" on purpose. He almost turned white..
So many, many pages.. couldn't find it, but, what about "the more than abundant life"? Cripe, the meaning of that one seemed to flop around like a live fish out of water.
Sometimes it meant physical and financial abundance. When that failed, it really meant spiritually abundant. When that failed, it meant plento-o-humble and obedient.
House, they keep coming back. "We are a biblical research... ministry". Ptooie. It sounds so "professional" ya know. Kinda like saying, "yep, I still have a bible.." for about all that little phrase is worth.
But see that is where they can fool you. The basics were always their simple truths. If they changed those they'd have to change a whole explanation system below it. Sounds "right on" don't it? But the simple truths they slip into the non-printed material, those things done in informal meetings not to be recorded and distributed. It's those informal mandate meetings that can kill you.
You don't owe your life to the ministry that taught you the word. Think about how much you already knew before TWI. Think about how much of what they taught you is b.s. or just plain legalism.
I think it so arrogant of them to say we owe our life to them. Even if there was gain to our life during. I don't believe it appropriate to say you owe your life to a ministry. God was the one that placed them there for you, if in fact that was an answer for a brief/lengthy time. As much as I feel at times the gain wasn't worth the payment I know there was gain for my life. But I attribute it to God not them.
Do "normal" churches ask you where you are financially? Do they check on your schedules and what you're doing, who you're doing it with and how long before you bring them to church? Do they ask if you paid cash for your house or if you're in debt? Do they care if you financecd a car? No! They're happy that you're taking care of yourself!
Normal churches don't think they were hired to run your life though. They give you standards and doctrines they expect you to withhold, but they don't come sit with you and ask you how and why you're doing this and that. They assume "you the adult" already know how to do that stuff, they're to supply the spiritual.
Do "normal" churches care if your family members go to a different church - or if they go at all?
On this one I have seen some have an opinion but nothing like twi, not even the same atmosphere.
"Normal" healthy organizations and churches lay it out there FOR FREE and let you make up your own mind. They don't even monitor your mind to see if you have. They are there for you IF YOU ASK FOR HELP - not HELPING YOU EVEN IF YOU DON'T WANT HELP. It's a big difference.
That say's it!
It's good to make your own decisions. It's good to question authority. It's good to be able to question authority. It's not good in TWI. Think about it.
Have you ever had so many rules, regulations and expected behavior and vocabulary restrictions in your whole life?? It's scary,but it is sooooooooo much better outside the pseudo walls of the false zion of TWI. Read the "my story" section of this site. Those are real live stories of deliverance, recovery and the truly more abundant life.
We are to be like our example before us, Jesus Christ. Yet our Father placed safety nets for our frailties. He knew we'd muck it up and never get some of it. His example was one of questioning wasn't it? Seems a good one to practice.
Without question Belle, we've the stories to tell!
So many, many pages.. couldn't find it, but, what about "the more than abundant life"? Cripe, the meaning of that one seemed to flop around like a live fish out of water.
Sometimes it meant physical and financial abundance. When that failed, it really meant spiritually abundant. When that failed, it meant plento-o-humble and obedient.
I failed to find anything specific in the PFAL book so moved onto Craig's classes. There was something that caught my eye while looking for his explanation of the WAP class. But first, yes it did have abundance having categories for physically/mentally/spiritually.
In the foundational class The Way quickly referred to Proverbs 16:17 thus keeping it tied to the highway set by Jesus Christ. Then in the intermediate class for The Way it quickly refers to our lord and savior, Jesus Christ. But in the advanced class listen to the full definition for The Way and see how it left out completely THE WAY, and it adds enough wiggle room for them to have a sequel (oh wrong industry).
The Way—This is the route, the path to this abundance and power; it's the avenue to victory, the boulevard, artery, thruway, passage, access, and the course to the detailed doctrine and practice whereby God makes available to us this life more than abundantly.
WordWolf, I recall that but didn't find it on quick perusal. If you'd like I can do further work, but to be frank, I'd prefer to look thru Craig's classes for gems to bring here.
Here's one I noted while searching for his "5 senses" stuff, and found it to be prophetic of sorts.
Quote from "foundational" class:
Religion is never logical; it's only ritualistic. It's for people that don't want to think. God gave us a brain to think and study to show ourselves approved unto God and to allow this Word to dwell in us richly. So you make up your mind.
Something else kind of interesting from "intermediate" class:
The choice for mankind:
Discipline yourself to the old nature-the ways of the wilderness, the spirits that speak from the ground;
Or
Discipline yourself to the highway of the upright, of the righteousness-the sanctified walk-the way of abundance and power. This is true discipleship.
Closed with: If we make the right choice, that truth shall make us free.
This one I just had to throw in for the heck of it also from "intermediate" class:
Work this, live this, control your thinking and your tongue (I Corn 13). Line your behavior up appropriately. If we love God, we obey the Word in our attitude one to another and our attitude toward the ruling ministries in the Body.
Going back to the "advanced" class now to see if anything of interest, as well as, see if any detail from him on the "5 senses" thing. Not sure when I'll be back, it's a thick syllabus and I'm snooping while doing something else.
quote:Religion is never logical; it's only ritualistic. It's for people that don't want to think. God gave us a brain to think and study to show ourselves approved unto God and to allow this Word to dwell in us richly. So you make up your mind.
He has the audacity to make that statement????!!!!???? He, who is a specialist at brainwashing people to not think for themselves? He, who micromanaged an entire ministry to its destruction with minute-by-minute schedules and penny-by-penny financial statements for its followers? How dare he talk about "thinking"?
quote:Discipline yourself to the highway of the upright, of the righteousness-the sanctified walk-the way of abundance and power. This is true discipleship.
Again, who the h3ll does he think he is making that kind of statement???? He sure could talk the talk, but we all know how well he walked the walk. What hypocricy!!! One of the most arrogant, closed-minded, ignorant people in our time has the unmitigated b*lls to make that kind of a statement to his followers? The man who antethesized humility and meekness? Talk about chutzpah! Again, who in the h3ll did he think he was?
Seeing this kind of garbage makes me SOOOOOOOOO glad that I got out before all of that junk got started, you wouldn't believe! I am so disgusted even reading that crap, I can't even imagine my physical revulsion if I had to sit through it.
And if you liked those you'll love these little ditties I just came across:
Because we're in a household and I'm interested in growing and developing myself and, in doing so, the better I get at my skills, the more I can bless you, and that inspires others to do their best, then I get my need supplied according to the long-suit believing of others.
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Ham
Kinda interesting.. the really good guys that were near the top either left or were ousted long, long ago. It took them a lot longer to find the good folks further down the tree and pressure them, or run them off.
I think the full time corps / conduit from hell thingy is the best thing they could have done. Sure didn't take long to see the organization for what it really was.
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houseisarockin
The conduit thing, oh yea. Donna said she didn't want to be a conduit for the adversary getting through to Craig while he was filming the new Advanced Class. They had huge pipelines that ran underground, geez!
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houseisarockin
So I'm snooping around twi's site and I run my mouse across the different menu options on either side of the poster. When it skims across "Terms, Conditions, and Privacy" the poster picture changes to a scroll. (all options have pictures to them) Hmm, I think to myself. This is terms and such for legal purposes right? So they liken the scrolls to legal terms then are they not? My goodness if they haven't defined their perception right there for you!
Scrolls=Legal
Listen up you folks still hanging on there. You can buy the lie, bury the truthful pain inside, do what you thought no one could ever do to you. You can take yourself into survival mode all fancied up with "sunday go to meeting" clothes. Walk the walk, talk the talk and be doing it from where you honestly believe you have to remain or you will die. It gets better, don't take a strangers word though. Just think of what you've read on this forum and consider it. We're not the crazy ones. You live amongst them, and it's okay that right now you don't believe me. I was there once myself.
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Ham
House, they keep coming back. "We are a biblical research... ministry". Ptooie. It sounds so "professional" ya know. Kinda like saying, "yep, I still have a bible.." for about all that little phrase is worth.
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Belle
You don't owe your life to the ministry that taught you the word. Think about how much you already knew before TWI. Think about how much of what they taught you is b.s. or just plain legalism.
Do "normal" churches ask you where you are financially? Do they check on your schedules and what you're doing, who you're doing it with and how long before you bring them to church? Do they ask if you paid cash for your house or if you're in debt? Do they care if you financecd a car? No! They're happy that you're taking care of yourself!
Do "normal" churches care if your family members go to a different church - or if they go at all?
"Normal" healthy organizations and churches lay it out there FOR FREE and let you make up your own mind. They don't even monitor your mind to see if you have. They are there for you IF YOU ASK FOR HELP - not HELPING YOU EVEN IF YOU DON'T WANT HELP. It's a big difference.
It's good to make your own decisions. It's good to question authority. It's good to be able to question authority. It's not good in TWI. Think about it.
Have you ever had so many rules, regulations and expected behavior and vocabulary restrictions in your whole life?? It's scary,but it is sooooooooo much better outside the pseudo walls of the false zion of TWI. Read the "my story" section of this site. Those are real live stories of deliverance, recovery and the truly more abundant life.
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Ham
Oh yes, Belle- the vocabulary restrictions. Of course nothing in writing. I had fun with that one once. The old branch guy here, I forget what the context was, somebody scared about something. I used the word "spooked" on purpose. He almost turned white..
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Ham
So many, many pages.. couldn't find it, but, what about "the more than abundant life"? Cripe, the meaning of that one seemed to flop around like a live fish out of water.
Sometimes it meant physical and financial abundance. When that failed, it really meant spiritually abundant. When that failed, it meant plento-o-humble and obedient.
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Share on other sites
houseisarockin
But see that is where they can fool you. The basics were always their simple truths. If they changed those they'd have to change a whole explanation system below it. Sounds "right on" don't it? But the simple truths they slip into the non-printed material, those things done in informal meetings not to be recorded and distributed. It's those informal mandate meetings that can kill you.
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houseisarockin
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houseisarockin
I failed to find anything specific in the PFAL book so moved onto Craig's classes. There was something that caught my eye while looking for his explanation of the WAP class. But first, yes it did have abundance having categories for physically/mentally/spiritually.
In the foundational class The Way quickly referred to Proverbs 16:17 thus keeping it tied to the highway set by Jesus Christ. Then in the intermediate class for The Way it quickly refers to our lord and savior, Jesus Christ. But in the advanced class listen to the full definition for The Way and see how it left out completely THE WAY, and it adds enough wiggle room for them to have a sequel (oh wrong industry).
The Way—This is the route, the path to this abundance and power; it's the avenue to victory, the boulevard, artery, thruway, passage, access, and the course to the detailed doctrine and practice whereby God makes available to us this life more than abundantly.
© TWI
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WordWolf
Early in the Orange Book,
vpw made it clear that he SAW (5-senses) UNBELIEVERS
manifesting an "abundant life".
Therefore, he was NOT speaking of SPIRITUAL abundance.
I can dig the page and exact quote out if you need it.
(Raf, among others, has pointed this out more than once.)
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houseisarockin
WordWolf, I recall that but didn't find it on quick perusal. If you'd like I can do further work, but to be frank, I'd prefer to look thru Craig's classes for gems to bring here.
Here's one I noted while searching for his "5 senses" stuff, and found it to be prophetic of sorts.
Quote from "foundational" class:
Religion is never logical; it's only ritualistic. It's for people that don't want to think. God gave us a brain to think and study to show ourselves approved unto God and to allow this Word to dwell in us richly. So you make up your mind.
Something else kind of interesting from "intermediate" class:
The choice for mankind:
Discipline yourself to the old nature-the ways of the wilderness, the spirits that speak from the ground;
Or
Discipline yourself to the highway of the upright, of the righteousness-the sanctified walk-the way of abundance and power. This is true discipleship.
Closed with: If we make the right choice, that truth shall make us free.
This one I just had to throw in for the heck of it also from "intermediate" class:
Work this, live this, control your thinking and your tongue (I Corn 13). Line your behavior up appropriately. If we love God, we obey the Word in our attitude one to another and our attitude toward the ruling ministries in the Body.
Going back to the "advanced" class now to see if anything of interest, as well as, see if any detail from him on the "5 senses" thing. Not sure when I'll be back, it's a thick syllabus and I'm snooping while doing something else.
© TWI
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markomalley
This is so ironic as to be nauseating.
He has the audacity to make that statement????!!!!???? He, who is a specialist at brainwashing people to not think for themselves? He, who micromanaged an entire ministry to its destruction with minute-by-minute schedules and penny-by-penny financial statements for its followers? How dare he talk about "thinking"?
Again, who the h3ll does he think he is making that kind of statement???? He sure could talk the talk, but we all know how well he walked the walk. What hypocricy!!! One of the most arrogant, closed-minded, ignorant people in our time has the unmitigated b*lls to make that kind of a statement to his followers? The man who antethesized humility and meekness? Talk about chutzpah! Again, who in the h3ll did he think he was?
Seeing this kind of garbage makes me SOOOOOOOOO glad that I got out before all of that junk got started, you wouldn't believe! I am so disgusted even reading that crap, I can't even imagine my physical revulsion if I had to sit through it.
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houseisarockin
Mark, don't hold back please.
:D-->
And if you liked those you'll love these little ditties I just came across:
Because we're in a household and I'm interested in growing and developing myself and, in doing so, the better I get at my skills, the more I can bless you, and that inspires others to do their best, then I get my need supplied according to the long-suit believing of others.
Are you ready to advance on chaos and the dark?
I'm here to show you how!
© TWI
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houseisarockin
I'll post more later, all I can stand of looking at this material for now.
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