No doubt Just thinking ...absolutely no doubt about God`s mercy and grace...that was not my point at all...I meant taht it would be very difficult to live with yourself were one to fully comprehend the pain caused by heartless actions.
I doesn't matter to me how kind or gentle TWI becomes or how many apologies they make, or what class they sell this week or next - I would never return.
TWI's problems did not start when they became visibly harsh. They were there from the beginning. TWI was founded upon lies and deception and it is only by God's grace that any good came out of it in the first place.
I think it's just too far gone. At some point, it's probably better to just start over.
If they did want to start anew and for some reason wanted my advice:
1. All the top cronies should have to start by getting jobs of their own in the real world.
2. ON THEIR OWN TIME: The BOT and associated flunkies should have to catalog their own mistakes (like so many of us had to do) and begin writing apology letters.
3. They should put themselves on probation and go work in a soup kitchen or anything else in the community but not give ANY advice to anyone. Just give.
4. Give up any plans to ever be in charge of anyone else again. Just give and nothing else.
There was a time when all I wanted was to hear a few apologies.
Now, I would not accept the words.
Now, I would want those who did the damage (those in "leadership" positions) to do recompense...and notice I said "do", not "pay".
For the marriages that were broken, I would want those who worked the breaking to now be as the husband or wife that was lost. (No, I don't mean to go live with a person as a spouse, but I do mean to do the chores, provide the living...which includes things like medical insurance..., etc.)
For the children that were scarred beyond comprehension, I would want those who did the damage to now be the providers of what these now-grown children cannot provide for themselves.
For those college educations that were never had, I would want those who condemned and ridiculed until that dream was broken to now pay for the education and provide for the needs of the student until the education is completed.
For those careers that were lost, I would want those who demanded that service to twi was the more "godly" choice to now make any provision necessary to aid in the recuperation of that career.
I would want none of this done in close enough proximity to the victims to re-damage their lives in any way.
I would want all of this for every single victim.
Then, and only then, would I consider participating in twi again.
But if all of this were done, it wouldn't be twi anymore, would it?
I prefer to keep moving forward, not "going back" and not "returning" to anything related to TWI.
I've learned that TWI was founded on lies and other people's true research and hearts for God. I've also learned that there are a lot more people like that out there and that there are a lot more groups that are a lot better than TWI.
I was in a spiritual vacuum in TWI and I have missed out on so many great spiritual discoveries, re-awakenings and so much learning while I was in my TWI cocoon believing that there was nothing better out there.
There isn't one da*n thing they could do that would bring me back to that group. I do wish they would apologize and come clean with my ex so that he would see that I wasn't out of my mind and that he would start rebuilding the life TWI destroyed.
I'm not too good at big words like "conundrum" but I'll try. (thanks to www.dictionary.com) ;)-->
I think with GSpot we are moving forward. Recognizing where we made choices that caused us to get so involved and then abused by TWI. We also learn to see the things that influenced us as we were growing and how absolutely evil the group truly is (and always has been). We are also in positions to help people who are also leaving TWI and moving forward with their lives. To me, GSpot is a great place for assistance in moving on and moving up in life.
Going back to TWI or any formal religious group that tries to manipulate or control or judge my life would be like willingly turning myself into a concentration camp or having my doctor turn me into some vegetable state.
People who claim to have the corner market on the truth or who act like they know better than I do what's best for my life send up red flags and sign the alarms. TWI was founded on lies and to even consider going back to a false foundation with people who refuse to admit and apologize for their treachery would be spiritual (and probably physical) suicide, imo.
That's probably more than you wanted to know, but I hope it answers your question. I'm not judging anyone, just my personal opinion.
Nope, never, ever again will I go back to twi. They can apologize with all the heart of God and it could be a true apology, but I I have absolutely NO desire to ever associate with them again.
I still feel some amotions when I pass through the states that TWI has property. I think it is the Stockholm Syndrome for me.
TWI saved my life at a time when I wanted to end it becauses of hoplessness and helplessess. So I am Thankful for that. BUT there was a time to leave and grow up and I didn't. I was to dependent on them.
Soooo.....I'v grown up and no thank you. It had it's place in my life and moving on and continued growing is my journey.
There's only Ohio and Colorado, now. And the property in Gunnison isn't even in TWIt's name - it's in the name of the former Den of Thieves, er, I mean, Board of Rustees. I mean Board of Dictators, er, Directors - loyboy "the forehead" martinpuke, rozilla rivenbarf, and harve "the hitman" platig. Or was it john "john" reynolds?
It would not be profitable for most to put themselves back under that thumb. One of the great benefits to the break-up of twi is that many people got the opportunity to function without being oppressed or controlled by those "above" them.
There are literally hundreds of ministries which are off-shoots. There are a dozen or so foundational classes and half a dozen intermediate and advanced classes. To me I think of it like a dandelion going to seed. The seeds have floated off everywhere and have sprouted independently. Wherever they are not controlling and are genuinely trying to help people, the sprouts are flourishing.
Without the break-up of twi, thousands of people who still believe would never have been able to grow to become who they are now. (Notwithstanding the growing pains...)
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rascal
No doubt Just thinking ...absolutely no doubt about God`s mercy and grace...that was not my point at all...I meant taht it would be very difficult to live with yourself were one to fully comprehend the pain caused by heartless actions.
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Goey
I doesn't matter to me how kind or gentle TWI becomes or how many apologies they make, or what class they sell this week or next - I would never return.
TWI's problems did not start when they became visibly harsh. They were there from the beginning. TWI was founded upon lies and deception and it is only by God's grace that any good came out of it in the first place.
Return - Never
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JustThinking
I think it's just too far gone. At some point, it's probably better to just start over.
If they did want to start anew and for some reason wanted my advice:
1. All the top cronies should have to start by getting jobs of their own in the real world.
2. ON THEIR OWN TIME: The BOT and associated flunkies should have to catalog their own mistakes (like so many of us had to do) and begin writing apology letters.
3. They should put themselves on probation and go work in a soup kitchen or anything else in the community but not give ANY advice to anyone. Just give.
4. Give up any plans to ever be in charge of anyone else again. Just give and nothing else.
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CoolWaters
There was a time when all I wanted was to hear a few apologies.
Now, I would not accept the words.
Now, I would want those who did the damage (those in "leadership" positions) to do recompense...and notice I said "do", not "pay".
For the marriages that were broken, I would want those who worked the breaking to now be as the husband or wife that was lost. (No, I don't mean to go live with a person as a spouse, but I do mean to do the chores, provide the living...which includes things like medical insurance..., etc.)
For the children that were scarred beyond comprehension, I would want those who did the damage to now be the providers of what these now-grown children cannot provide for themselves.
For those college educations that were never had, I would want those who condemned and ridiculed until that dream was broken to now pay for the education and provide for the needs of the student until the education is completed.
For those careers that were lost, I would want those who demanded that service to twi was the more "godly" choice to now make any provision necessary to aid in the recuperation of that career.
I would want none of this done in close enough proximity to the victims to re-damage their lives in any way.
I would want all of this for every single victim.
Then, and only then, would I consider participating in twi again.
But if all of this were done, it wouldn't be twi anymore, would it?
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JustThinking
CW quote:
"But if all of this were done, it wouldn't be twi anymore, would it?"
IMO, you just said it all.
JT
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Ham
I think the question should be rephrased: "would you go back into the mouth of a lion if it promises to not bite you this time?"
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JustThinking
Mr H,
One minor edit:
"would you go back into the mouth of a lion if it promises to not bite the other limb off? (But we'll keep the one in our mouth)"
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Steve!
Would I go back? Only if they put me on the board of trustees/directors and gave me a 7 figure salary.
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rascal
Steve...there are some things that are just too darned low down for one to do for money....lol
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Steve!
I dunno, rascal, it depends on how much money.
An old guy in a very fancy car stops on the street next to a beautiful woman and asks, "If I gave you $1 million, would you have sex with me?"
She said, "Sure!"
He said, "How about for $300?"
She said, "What do you think I am, a prostitute?"
He said, "We've already established that fact, now we're haggling as to price!"
7 figures, for a couple of years, I muck with the system as much as I want, it's all good.
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Belle
I prefer to keep moving forward, not "going back" and not "returning" to anything related to TWI.
I've learned that TWI was founded on lies and other people's true research and hearts for God. I've also learned that there are a lot more people like that out there and that there are a lot more groups that are a lot better than TWI.
I was in a spiritual vacuum in TWI and I have missed out on so many great spiritual discoveries, re-awakenings and so much learning while I was in my TWI cocoon believing that there was nothing better out there.
There isn't one da*n thing they could do that would bring me back to that group. I do wish they would apologize and come clean with my ex so that he would see that I wasn't out of my mind and that he would start rebuilding the life TWI destroyed.
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TheSongRemainsTheSame
Belle
posted September 08, 2004 14:27
"I prefer to keep moving forward, not "going back" and not "returning" to anything related to TWI"
Belle, quite a conundrum of thought. GSC is totally related to TWI. Help me on this one eh...
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Belle
I'm not too good at big words like "conundrum" but I'll try. (thanks to www.dictionary.com)
;)-->
I think with GSpot we are moving forward. Recognizing where we made choices that caused us to get so involved and then abused by TWI. We also learn to see the things that influenced us as we were growing and how absolutely evil the group truly is (and always has been). We are also in positions to help people who are also leaving TWI and moving forward with their lives. To me, GSpot is a great place for assistance in moving on and moving up in life.
Going back to TWI or any formal religious group that tries to manipulate or control or judge my life would be like willingly turning myself into a concentration camp or having my doctor turn me into some vegetable state.
People who claim to have the corner market on the truth or who act like they know better than I do what's best for my life send up red flags and sign the alarms. TWI was founded on lies and to even consider going back to a false foundation with people who refuse to admit and apologize for their treachery would be spiritual (and probably physical) suicide, imo.
That's probably more than you wanted to know, but I hope it answers your question. I'm not judging anyone, just my personal opinion.
Song, check your private messages.
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Nottawayfer
Nope, never, ever again will I go back to twi. They can apologize with all the heart of God and it could be a true apology, but I I have absolutely NO desire to ever associate with them again.
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JustThinking
Wayfer Not!,
It's a good thing or else we'd have to start calling you "Wayfer Maybe?" ;-)
JT
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imbus
I still feel some amotions when I pass through the states that TWI has property. I think it is the Stockholm Syndrome for me.
TWI saved my life at a time when I wanted to end it becauses of hoplessness and helplessess. So I am Thankful for that. BUT there was a time to leave and grow up and I didn't. I was to dependent on them.
Soooo.....I'v grown up and no thank you. It had it's place in my life and moving on and continued growing is my journey.
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Steve!
"some of the states"?
There's only Ohio and Colorado, now. And the property in Gunnison isn't even in TWIt's name - it's in the name of the former Den of Thieves, er, I mean, Board of Rustees. I mean Board of Dictators, er, Directors - loyboy "the forehead" martinpuke, rozilla rivenbarf, and harve "the hitman" platig. Or was it john "john" reynolds?
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Research Geek
It would not be profitable for most to put themselves back under that thumb. One of the great benefits to the break-up of twi is that many people got the opportunity to function without being oppressed or controlled by those "above" them.
There are literally hundreds of ministries which are off-shoots. There are a dozen or so foundational classes and half a dozen intermediate and advanced classes. To me I think of it like a dandelion going to seed. The seeds have floated off everywhere and have sprouted independently. Wherever they are not controlling and are genuinely trying to help people, the sprouts are flourishing.
Without the break-up of twi, thousands of people who still believe would never have been able to grow to become who they are now. (Notwithstanding the growing pains...)
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TheSongRemainsTheSame
or just maybe a sword of Dam·o·cles
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