Speaking in Tongues

[Goey]

quote:

So Goey..whats wrong with just coming out and saying I'm a JW or Mormon etc..

Becasue I am none of the things you presume me to be.

quote:

At least lurkers can see and read your posts on topics like s.i.t. KNOWING what religion you have come from/gone back to etc..."

It is you that wants to know and attach the labels. And I doubt that you are actually concerned with "lurker's" at all, except possibly to disuade them from considering ideas that differ from your own, or from using/developing their own critical thinking abilities.

quote:

"... I just wonder what else (some) of you are 'hiding' ??

Alan, I suspect that you are fairly uneducated in theology, hermeneutics and human communication (among other things). My guess is that you are stuck in VPW's and PFAL's kindergarten version of theology and that you are caught up in the doctrine of "spiritual suspicion" like someone with a bad case of MOG Syndrome.

To make an assumption that I am either a Mormon or Jehovah's witness based upon one or 2 posts concerning SIT, is telltale of a lack theological education and of exposure to the real Christian and religious world beyond TWI and VPW's (or similar) teachings. Maybe it's time for you to come out of your cave and learn a little something beyond what you were taught in PFAL, TWI, The Way Corps, etc ...

To demand that I or anyone else spell out our religious affilliations and beliefs because of your paranoid suspicions and subsequent desire to "unmask" folks, speaks loudly as to your your own spiritual condition.

What would be the benefit if I did what you ask? So that presumptious and unlearned folks could prejudge me before they ever read what I wrote. No thanks.

Alan, have you ever heard of the term, 'critical thinking'? You would do well to look it up and try practicing it a bit. It may be difficult for you at first because it requires intellectual vigour and intellectual honesty; things that you seem a bit challenged with at this point. It also requires objectivity and the honest desire to understand what folks are actually trying to communicate.

It also means that you will have to let go of your current terroristic style of communication and learn to discuss ideas that oppose your own - without getting emotional, overly defensive or attacking folks, or trying to put absurd and eroneous labels on them. You must also be open to the possibility that you could be wrong on some things that you have held to for years. Some folks can't seem to stomach that, and prefer instead to dodge, ignore and deny anything that challenges their current beliefs. I hope you are not one of those, but I wonder.

Why should I answer your irrelevant question about my past or present religious affiliations when you have not answered one of my questions or addressed any of the points I have made in my posts? All you seem to is dodge, ignore and attack.

When you become more civilized in your postings and show a desire to use some critical thinking skills with a bit of compassion, you will find it much more rewarding here - both to yourself and to others.

But honestly Alan, if I were to be half as presumptious as you are, I would presume you not to be a Christian at all, except that you said you were. You words and behavior contradict your own label of "Christian".

Alan, if you wish further dialog, you can address the points I have made in this post. Show me where I am wrong or faulty in my reasoning. But be nice.

If you can't do that and only want to dodge, attack and accuse, then please just shut the hell up. --- OK ?

[Ham]

Hello. My name is Ham. I am:

Baptist: 5%

R.C. 2%

Jewish: 8%

Lutheran: 8%

Spiritualist: 2%

Follower of EW Bullinger: 20%

Charismatic: 5%

Way offshoot devotee: 10%

Unitarian Universalist: 20%

Non-denominational and misc: 20%

Hope that helps. Of course, this is all subject to change without notice.

[Ham]

And no, it isn't because of multiple personalities or anything- at least that I am aware of.

[oldiesman]

2% Spiritualist?

I just knew that trapped door was open somewhere. :D-->

[Ham]

Yep- only two percent. But that two percent! You wouldn't believe me if I told you..

[Ham]

Maybe I should have categorized it as "unexplainable"..

[mstar1]

Thanks for the informative stuff Bramble, One point I would like to add---

quote:

Also, most who follow a goddess only belief system(not god/goddess as in Wicca)or are involved with Feminist Spirituality (womyn, wombin is often how they spell women) call themselves witches.

My girlfriend is heavily involved in Feminist Spirituality but is called "christian clergy"....study of the feminine forms of spirituality does not necessarily make one a non christian

[Bramble]

Very true, mstar1. I know that woman pastor of a mainline denom in my area is into feminist theology etc. I went to her Mother's Day service. Very interesting sermon. We sang "Faith of our Mothers."

[Belle]

Why even El Craig Martinpuke himself believed in the feminine side of God. Don't you remember him going on and on about the Shekinah Glory of God in one of the classes? Sorry can't remember which one.

I asked Moneyhands what it was and he didn't know and basically didn't care. I looked it up. It refers to the Feminine side/characteristics of God. I believe it's covered in the Companion Bible but I can't remember where. LOL! Craig getting all excited about the Shekinah /Femininity of God....

[oldiesman]

Four Score and seven years ago...

our Mothers brought forth upon this continent

a New Nation

conceived in

oh never mind..

It's the Weekend! ! ! ! ! !

[Ham]

Woo hoo, heh heh heh.

Sorry..

[Allan]

"Satanists actually have a 'differn't' view of Satan than Christians do" !!

ROTFLMAO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Allan]

Sorry..that quote was from Bramble (page 8)

[LG]

Allan, you seem to revel in proclaiming your ignorance. I doubt that you know much about the many different Christian views or thoughts about Satan, much less non-Christian ones.

[Bramble]

Allan, if you are going to quote me, then do so. THAT WAS NOT A QUOTE FROM MY POST.

YOU ARE A LIAR.

Actual cut and pasted quote:

I don't know any actual satanists, nor do they hang out on the type of pagan forums I hang out on...but my understanding is that their definition of satan differs greatly from the Christian definition.I would have to study up on it and don't have the time or interest.

End Quote

IF you have any integrity, ALLAN, you will apologise and change your post.

I'm not holding my breath.

[WordWolf]

Allan,

was it your intention to unite all the posters by having them all agree

that you're an idiot?

You're looking like the kind of guy who gets hate-mail from the Amish.

[Belle]

quote:

You're looking like the kind of guy who gets hate-mail from the Amish.

LOL! LOL! LOL!! I'd almost trade Mike for him any day of the week and at least some of the other more annoying posters to me have some redeeming qualities.

It does indeed look like he's succeeded in uniting us, but do we have to send him a thank you note? If we don't, please don't tell my Mama. :)-->

[Ham]

Alan,

I think a lot of the trouble is trying to understand an infinitely diversified God with archaic, primitive beliefs.

We do not believe in the same God our ancestors believed in. That's just plain impossible.

They often had a God that made little earth the center of the universe.

Our God made the sun the center, at least of, OUR little part of the universe.

Even in the natural sciences like Physics and astronomy, we are only beginning to learn what we DON'T know.

Oh , by the way, I still believe God's redemption of mankind through Jesus Christ has TREMENDOUS value. Just- what in the WORLD are you doing with it?

Sitting like another religious bump on the log?

quote:

Satanists actually have a 'differn't' view of Satan than Christians do

Laugh as you may about this.. you have no idea what the "enemy" believes. How in the world do you possibly think you are going to reach them???

[Ham]

I dunno.. maybe you just don't care.

I'd rather not think that of anybody.

[Goey]

Alan,

You may not be aware of how quoting works. When you quote someone using the quote feature, or even when you use quotation marks, the content must be exactly as it was originally written.

Paraphrasing what sonmeone wrote, and then saying it is a quote, will get you a F in high school English composition and may get you booted out of college.

While it may not have been your intention, what you did is considered intellectually dishonest since it does not accurately re-state what was the person actually wrote. Paraphrasing can alter the meaning and is a form of "private interpretatin" (using terms that you may understand.)

Here is a tutorial about quoting.

If you have a shred of honesty in you, you should edit or delete your post.

[Tom Strange]

Goey said to Allan:

quote:

If you have a shred of honesty in you, you should edit or delete your post.

...it's pretty obvious to me he doesn't and won't... I could be wrong, but he's holding pretty true the the old "troll" form methinks...

[Goey]

Let's give him a chance shall we?. It may be futile, but what the heck.

If he doesn't come around, then we can all use the ignore feature.

Wait, we don't have an ignore feature here ... silly me !

[Oakspear]

quote:

Oak -- Well -- I'll tell ya ------------

I believe in it whole-heartedly. I do it daily, and since I don't go to any sort of fellowship (these days), it is my one connection with the God I believe in (I respect your decision to not believe in Him), and because of that I don't have to put up with the doctrinal junk that most churches promote these days.

Meebe most in twi faked it. I dunno -- could be. I never did, and as a matter of fact -- in exceller (sp?) sessions in the intermediate class, I was always called on to *do the duty* so the newbies could see how it was done.

Now -- I'm not tooting my own horn here, but I will say that it is a very real and viable entity that (while transcending logic), is much more than just a spiritual placebo meant to placate those who have no real life on their own.

Docvic did his best to put the boundaries, and blinders on it -- and certainly some bought into that arguement. The ones that did so were the *used car salesmen* who would try to sell you a lemon, and proclaim it to be a tasty strawberry instead.

And fyi --- I NEVER HAVE TO GET IN THE SPIRIT to start SIT'ing.

Believe it or not, it is second nature with me, and if ya wanna know the truth -- I rarely pray with my understanding any more -- it is always in tongues. I feel I am understood better that way.

Now -- I know you are agnostic at best, and I am not belittling you for that by any means. I'm taking what I quoted from you with a grain of salt, cause I know you make exceptions to the ideas you espouse, as do I.

Take care, just my pov, David

That was a great example of civilly disagreeing.

dmiller and I seldom agree on any doctrinal issues, but we always treat each other with respect.

Get a clue Al!

[dmiller]

Oak,thanks for that assessment of my post. I can always count on you to be honest. :)-->

I do have a story to tell, if anyone care's to listen. I was in several church groups, before I landed in twi. One group was a little Weslyan church that I got introduced to by the Jesus Freak outfit I was hanging out with at the time, back in the early 70's.

I'll never forget this --- there was one old man there, who confided to me and a few others of our Jesus Freak group, that he had always wanted to speak in tongues, but he:

DID-NOT-HAVE-THE-GIFT!!!

It was a very sad day for me to finally learn that it was not a gift, and not be able to relate this to him, since by then he had passed on. Here was a man who wanted to do something from the bible, yet felt incapable (for whatever reason).

The moral of this story is --- there are folks that want to know, and the theological crap that is propounded by main stream denominations (these days) just isn't cutting the mustard, nor does it make sense.

Folks are left wondering, in doubt, feeling *unworthy*, you name it.

If I get in a biblical discussion with anyone, I let them have both barrels. That's cause I never know if it's like that older guy who always wanted to speak in tongues, but never did, since he thought it to be a gift, and he thought he was an unworthy recipient.

[dmiller]

Our time on earth is short -- live large!!