The Way of Abundance and Power (WAP) Class

[socks]

WAP questions, if anyone knows -

how many sessions?

how much did it cost?

how did it end, last session?

[Hope R.]

Socksy -

I think it costs $50. Oaksie - did grads get to take it for free the first time? I don't remember if I paid for it or not.

Other info:

- 12 Sessions - 3 weeks

- 2 hours per session

- Syllabus broken down into segments, not sessions - so there are 24 segments.

- Syllabus is almost word for word (except the screaming) and is 167 pages long and includes 3 appendices, one of them titled: "Not Ashamed of the Gospel of Christ: The Sin of Homosexuality".

Verse, context & used before, etc. are in segment 5.

Formed - made - created in segment 10.

Lesbian Eve is taught in segment 11.

The principle of believing is taught in segment 12.

Tongues happens in segment 20 - so that would be session 10.

Segment 24 - the last segment, is titled "Walking in Fellowship". Romans 1 is taught in detail in that last segment.

Hope this helps -

[Trefor Heywood]

I was spared the WAP thing too as it was introduced after I marked and avoided TWI.

I cannot help wondering, however, if VPW would still have chosen Craigipoos as his successor had he known that he would procede to supercede PFAL.

Somehow I doubt it.

[def59]

I am sooo glad i missed wap, piffle was boring enough.

[socks]

Thanks Hope! Sounds like it was a little easier on the rear with 2 hour sessions. 50 bucks, reasonable. Plus you get all that paper in the syllabus. ;)-->

So the "principle of believing", session 12. What was your take on that? I heard from someone way long time ago that the whole WAP class seemed to be more for someone who was already a grad of PFAL or someone who'd been in the ministry already, rather than a new off the street peep. Was that the idea of it, to reteach the grads?

I'm curious where the Way's gone with their teaching on believing to receive and all of that. I've been lightly studying the topic from different religious histories, trying to see where it comes in to play in doctrines. I ran in to "Kefer" (khefer, or Xeper) which has it's roots in Egyptian religions from what I can tell - "pagan". It's a word that means "to come into being" or "I have come into being" and is used to signify a moment or state where a person exercises their will to determine or control the future, using ritual, icons, symbols, etc. ("layman's" description). Some of the ideas reminded me a lot of what the Way incorporated into their teaching on believing - holding something you've prayed for in mind, visualizing it, repetitively praying for it, "using" the name of Jesus Christ, "operating" the power of God. I'm wondering if LCee continued in the believe-to-receive direction in his stuff or how he handled it...?

[frank123lol]

I remember we got a family deal I believe it was

25 a piece and 15 for the youngun.

One statement comes to mind from my rc was well

you will not be as exited this time as the first

time you took pfiffle as you are more mature

My youungun got nothing out of wap

None of it was useful In my mind always went back to pfiffle not wap

Craigers imho was way out of his league It should have been simple and not confrontational

I never tried to sell it to anyone

Hell you practically lie to people just to get them to fellowshi**

[WordWolf]

In case you were still wondering,

lcm's highest degree was a bachelor's degree in psychology.

Unless you count whatever he got from the way copse.

[dmiller]

lcm had a "BACHELOR" degree?? :D--> :D-->

[GrouchoMarxJr]

For some reason I thought his degree was in physical ed. I know that he was a second rate football player who ended up getting a lot of splinters on the bench. From what I've heard, he was a huge disapointment as an athlete.

So, if martindale was such a wizard at getting revelation, how come he didn't know that his "ministry" was about to hit the wall harder than Mr. Magoo playing Hai alai?

[WordWolf]

lcm himself bloviates about this in passing in the Tape of the Month:

"The Mark of Quality."

(God, in hindsight, tragically funny to have HIM address "quality"...)

He was talking about some venue where he had detractors in the audience,

and how clever he was in defusing them. (In his world, anyway.)

"Then they asked me, "Well, what qualifies you,academically, to be the

head of a 'research ministry'?" I said "nothing."

I laughed-I said "nothing."

I got a BACHELOR'S Degree. In PSYCHOLOGY.

Academically, that qualifies me for NOTHING...."

AFAIK, athletes need to have an outside major other than their sport.

I'm unsure if they took it easier on the team in their major, but I've

not seen him demonstrate even a Bachelor's level of understanding of

Psychology and the human condition. Then again, he never WAS known for his

brains or acumen, was he? I mean, his ONE pet project, Athletes of the

Spirit, was ripped off from a term in college, when he ran the local

chapter of the Fellowship for Christian Athletes, and from whoever wrote

"Stayin' Alive" (the movie, not the song.) After that, his claim to

originality was the wap crapola, which is about as great an achievement

as inventing dysentery.

======================================

BTW, it's "jai alai".

His ministry hit the wall harder than Mr Magoo playing jai alai.

And he was greasier than Zorro's hatband.

[Tom Strange]

so... TWI changed "the original sin" from masturbation by Eve (then Adam) to lesbianism by Eve (with Adam watching I presume)?

How did "they" justify this?

[Nottawayfer]

I remember martinpuke saying he studied psychology. I don't know if he actually graduated because he was witnessed to while he was in college.

I remember people being charged at least $100 for WAP. I remember the family deal too, but not the cost.

[JustThinking]

WAP was either written for old grads or just done by someone who didn't think it through very well. There are references to PFAL material such as greek translations but no explanation of the background. It was common to have new students asking for explanations of numerous points. "Is he reading from a Greek Bible? Is he Greek?" Poor folks! He just started introducing Greek and Hebrew words as if everyone knew why.

My take: it was just terrible. Disorganized and poorly done. It also seemed as if they had to do a lot of editing to make it flow even a little. Disjointed camera angles, interrupted sentences, etc. At least VPW had done his class a bunch of times before filming it. LCM seemed like he was winging it at least part of the time. Or maybe he had a script and just kept going off on tangents?

Regardless of your view of VPW, at least he had practiced.

[Tumbleweed Kid]

WAP, That's why I got dropped.

Funny, I sat through a live class and the branch coordinator could not bring himself to read the final hour.

In PFAL Dr. built you up,

In WAP Craig tears you down in the last hour.

IN PFAL we learned about how Paul went to Jerusalem and

in the WAP Class we ceased, saying the will of the lord be done.

In 1991 or 1992 Craig taught that the devil had to be a good looking man, ask anyone in Family 17 or 18 that was at duckie island that was awake through the teaching. Three years later the devil was a good looking woman.

Then there is the WAP abortion teaching where we clearly have the words "Die so that they Die" when we are speaking about death, and mischief, when we might be speaking about a miscarriage.

WAP talks about figures of speech but never defines them, WaP talks about orientalism, but also never defines them. Supplemental teaching had to be sent out in order to help new people adjust to the rightly divided word.

Do you think people with WAP only, could pass the old Advanced Class pre test? Even if you dropped the PFAL test?

Soo much error in WAP!

[krys]

We could not offer WAP to brandy new people.

They had to be "faithful" to fellowship and I think they had to be ABSing too. They would have been used to lcm's screaming from the mandatory sns.

There was only 1 thing that I thought was rather well done - that was leading any who needed it into tongues. Instead of everybody focussing on them, and causing embarrassment...the newbies were scattered around the room with grads around them to encourage. Nobody got singled out...nobody had to stand up and feel like he was weird. Also - I think it was done in the 4th meeting.

I never took a class with newbies, however, I was out before that. There were several classes put together in my branch...and existing members were assigned into the first, second or third.

I lost track of how many times I sat through piffle, but I do recall WAP was shorter meetings and there was usually no time when you sat for more than 1 1/4 hour...so it was more comfortable physically - and the exhaustion factor was minimized. Even so...I was "jangeled" inside at the conclusion of every single meeting and it took me a very long time to understand why - - it was all, or nearly all disjointed garbage and much of it didn't fit with what we had already been taught - either in sequence, or content. I had almost 20 years in...and my brains were scrambled.

[Digitalis]

Dmiller said on page 1: Hope R -- I do not believe in the millions and millions theory. Nor do I believe in what you are saying is in the WAP class (though I have never taken it).

DMiller if you have never taken the class why do you not believe HopeR (who has taken the class) and what she is sharing with us. Well let me confirm just for you, that what she is sharing is the truth, it was in the WAP class.

.......

Does anyone remember the Floating Giant Ice Cubes in Space? Let me tell ya that will surely get you saved ha ha ha.

The class for newbies was originally $100. If you were one of LCMs advance class grad you got a break.

I took this class twice. Once with all the Adv.Class Grads and the 1/2 off special and once with brand new students.

One of our new students got diahrea after the class and never returned. We lost two more students at our first showing for new people.

This class was definately for LCM he was the main feature, with all of his sports equipment and analagies, his screaming telling you to get the He!! out, his scientific knowledge.

His scientific knowledge, we had the deep, giant icecubes in space, the womb of water in which the universe is in, the giants or dinasours that walked the face of the earth, we had Peleg defined as quake which started the continental drift and much more...

The section with Adam and Eve and the Debbil was so confusing. Eve had sex with the Debbil inconcretion as a female and asked Adam to join them. It was a freaken orgy? a threesome? The fruit was the debbil as a female? who knows what he was saying.

Shoot, now I have to go grab my syllabi for more info.

Digi

[Digitalis]

24 Segments in WAP Foundational

12 Segments in WAP Intermediate

Some areas held these two classes as an all in one deal.

If I recall correctly we held/took the foundational class over 2 weekends and the intermediate over one weekend.

"Big bang theory"-- was explained by LCM, Big bang of course was Lucifer.

The universe is in a solution of salt water, in what LCM described as the womb. Of course this is where the water poured out in the days of Noah. This is also where the Giant Ice Cubes are according to WAP.

There was also the section on Egypt and the pyramids and how the true word of God is hidden in the Sphinx. true or not true?

Digi

Edited April 13, 2004 by Digitalis

[JustThinking]

HaHaHaHaHa...

The sphinx. Craig acted as if his teaching on it was the first time it was ever heard. The "oohs" and "ahhhs" from the die-hard grads could be heard around the room. It's in Bullinger's book "Witness of the Stars" for crying out loud! I showed it to the class coordinator. He couldn't change the subject fast enough. :-)

[ckeer]

Hope R's original post on this thread got me thinking about the continents dividing very rapidly so I crunched some numbers and thought I'd share them along with another explanation that may or maynot be valid.

I realise that God is God and he can do anything but that it seems that he usualy works within the order of his creation rather than arbitrarely changing it.

First this is an idea of what would happen if the continents were to move rapidly.

The San Andreas fault is estimated to be 29 million years old and to have traveled about 340 miles.

The largetst measured movement at one time was about 20 feet (the 1906 San Francisco quake Magnitude 8.25)

The average movement works out to be about three quarters of an inch per year.

To give an idea of what would have been going on if the lands were dividing at an average rate of one mile per year: this would be about 84,480 times faster than the San Andreas fault moves.

In 20 foot lurches, that would be about 264 magnitude 8.25 quakes a year up and down the west coast of what is now north and south america and the east coast of asia and africa.

Since this would be pushing one plate above another that would produce a lot of volcanic activity and Tsunamis as well.

Another explanation that would be less disruptive and violent if the level of the oceans were to rise. Thinking back to the flood, When Mount Arrat was exposed as the waters receded and exposed dry land where did all that water go? Cloud cover over the earth could cause the temperature to drop, particularly at the north and south poles. This could have caused the rains up there to fall as snow building ice caps. If that continued at the poles, there could have been glaciers there that lowered the oceans to allow the ark to strike land. This may have continued till there was a combination of land and ice bridge that effectively united all the continents.

Then about a hundred years later the ice caps partly melted raising the sea level to about where they are today. Dividing the continets.

I left TWI after WAP came out but was not deeemed faithful enough to take it. Now I am realived that I did not have to endure it.

[Radar OReilly]

The wap class....UGGG. The whole thing was a colossal waste of time, money and energy.

dmiller....honest, you simply can't fathom how much garbage it contained. Digi and Just Thinking, I am lmao about his segment on the Sphinx..JT, I had the same conversation with the class coordinator when I first took it.

Tom Strange, how did they "float" the eve/lesbian doctrine? Grab your hat cause this is gonna shake you: LCM had on the class set a copy of a famous renaissance painting depicting the serpent coming on to eve. Do any of you remember the name/painter of that? He opened by saying that it had been COMMON knowledge (or some such drivel) even back in hundreds of years ago.

Geeze, just thinking about all this garbage makes me feel like an idiot for sitting through each segment...MORE THAN ONCE.

ROR

[def59]

Funny

for vpw, the fruit of the tree was masturbation and it appears for lcm it was lesbian sex

what does that leave for R*s*e?

[diazbro]

I was gone before WAP became the class du jour

so I never took it. But I still heard something

pretty disturbing - basically that ,upon completion of the class, students

were required to submit a letter of thanks to

LCM. Was this true ?

[Hope R.]

diazbro - it was suggested that all the students write a note to ^rev-er-end-^mar-tin-dale to thank him so much for the wonderful prevailing truth taught in the Way of Abundance and Power class that enables us to truly be disciples so we can cross over the bridge to the promised land of the prevailing word in the household and be valient for the truth. (ego stroke... ego stroke... ego stroke...)

Honestly though, I wonder if he suggested to the class instructors that those letters be written, or did the on-the-field gestapo come up with that one? I may sound dumb, but LCM might not have known it was a suggestion, which, according to him and the MOG before him, is tantamount to an order! Maybe the brown-nosers were having a contest to see who could send in the most "bless" notes after each class.

If it was his idea, then he obviously didn't get it. Didn't he realize that no one was going to criticize him or his teachings in a negative manner? Didn't he understand that people were being forced to write those notes to keep in the good graces of whomever their leaders were? Is he really that dumb?(rhetorical - no need to answer).

[insurgent]

Hope, they STILL make people write letters about what "blessed them". It just makes me sick, but I do have my wayspeak down pretty good. I can write a paragraph that sounds awesome and not say one da** thing.

[Bramble]

On the thank you letters--a bunch of people in my fellowship had to rewrite our letters. Not gushy enough?? We had to be 'more specific' about the changes WAP made in our lives.

I spent the whole class kind of stunned and couldn't remember what was taught once a segment was over. Yikes, I had to drag out my sylabus.