All of your posturing and sabre rattling here on GS concering this lawsuit is rather disconcerting. I think it's possible that it might come back on you an bite you.
quote:Hey, how about all these millions of companies and people, or are you really only interested in harrassing ex-members?
Have you sued all these other companies? If not why?
I will love to hear you explain this to a jury if you even get that far.I think the judge will throw your stupid lawsuit out on its ridiculous ear quite early. You are so toast....
Pat,
If you're going to ask questions, ask a hard one.
Google: 17,000,000 web pages containing "The Way." The VAST majority of those occurrences are in complete sentences that have nothing to do with Christianity. (ie, "We were at a strip club. The dancer was hot. I loved the way she picked up that bottle without using her hands). Nothing to do with The Way International, and your implication that all these folks should be sued for trademarki infringement is, well, stupid.
Why are they harassing a former member as opposed to any other church using the trademark "The Way?" That's easy: FORMER MEMBERS ARE THE ONLY ONES USING "THE WAY" TO DELIBERATELY INFRINGE ON THE WAY INTERNATIONAL'S TRADEMARK. Who are you to taunt them for not going after people who are NOT deliberately trying to infrigne on their trademark? If I had limited resources, I'd go after the people who were infringing on my trademark ON PURPOSE before I started going after anyone who happened to be doing it by accident.
Pat, you're doing this on purpose. I don't know if you'll win in court or if you'll lose, but as a general rule I consider cybersquatting to be low-level extortion. You're being a cybersquatter with a vendetta, and that won't serve you well in court.
Playing the *devil’s advocate* here, :D--> ;)-->
Let’s say that Socks owns and operates www.seamonkiesonmars.com and in the interest of bringing all those that hunger and thirst for *monkey* love to his site he registers all the .’s he can. But mean while the evil dark monkey finds out and slips in and registers www.amazingseamonkiesonmars.com to divert all searchers to his own anti-seamonkey site, because after all monkey love is a farce and socks runs a CULT!!!!!
Now the dark monkey behaves his monkey @$$ for a few years and finds that the seamonkies on Mars group is all at once operating some what unchallenged, or relatively quietly. Now since the dark monkey has made it his life’s work to expose the evil because after all he now has the truth, in his total black and white world, he decides to do something to rattle the poor little monkies habitat!
Rather than to contact the OLM socks, the dark monkey goes to an other anti-seamonkey site, his sister’s (www.flashmyboobies.com) and posts intent to sell the www.amazingseamonkiesonmars.com for a ridiculous price. He also has it posted that the possible use for this anti-monkey group could be to parody the real and only true household of seamonkies!
Now there are billions of sites the use seamonkey and related names, but there is only one dark monkey with proven intent to defame those amazing monkies and their true followers! There are related sites to prove the evil intent of OLM socks and his group, yet only one dark monkey with his site bashing those adorable little and amazing monkies!
As a side note, OLM socks has announced to the faithful remnant of Seamonkey Zion........
* we ain’t giving the evil dark monkey a red cent of your ABS!!!!!!!* A roar of applause filled the MOW auditorium!!!!!!!
Now I think if one looks at the whole history, track record and greed, perhaps OLM socks has more of a case than his opponent the dark monkey can see.........
Respectfully, I am not cybersquating. TWI didn't want the domain until years after I owned it and they found out.
The real issue is their claim that I infringed on their trademark "The Way". Their only evidence is an old webpage for the Path of Christ Ministry website when it was originally named The Way Of Christ Ministry.
I had it properly registered with the State of NH and had a trademark application that I backed out of during the waydale days.
All of you that have criticisms about what I am posting are missing the point. TWI has no valid complaint and are using the pretense of an alleged trademark infringement to find a way to harrass me, pure and simple.
Cybersquatting is taking a domain name that reasonably belongs to someone else. I don't know what the law is on this, but you look at me with a straight face and tell me that taking the name "thewayinternational.com" is not cybersquatting. Registering the name is prima facie evidence of cybersquatting. It doesn't have to be proven: it IS proof. Are you The Way International? No. Are they The Way International? Yes. Who should register the name? Well, you did.
Yeah, they're idiots for not registering it first (especially given Ex-TWI's advice. I agree with Oldiesman: this is your strongest legal defense). But that doesn't make your action any more noble. You attempt to sell it for $15,000 and you call that a fair price? Did it cost you $15,000 to acquire the name? To maintain it?
Look, as far as the law of the U.S. is concerned, I don't know if you're right or wrong. Good luck. But in my humble opinion, as far as right and wrong is concerned, you're cybersquatting, you're not The Way International, and you're being a pest. I don't like TWI any more than you do, but watching you guys go at it is going to be very much like watching an arm wrestling contest at a leper colony.
You have so many morally and ethically legitimate ways to get at them. You really do. This particular method of yours, again in MY opinion and mine only, absolutely cheapens and morally invalidates your other efforts.
John told me that people who had registered movie star's names had to give them up (juliaroberts.com). I don't know whether or not they got fined or paid for them.
When a new mall opened close to here, everyone was calling it "Citrus Park Mall". Someone I met had bought that domain name before they broke ground in anticipation of it being worth something once the mall was built. Well, the name of the mall was "Citrus Park Town Center" and guess what their website was called? Not citrusparkmall.com! So these people were stuck with it and eventually let it go.
Someone close to me was checking out the registered domain name site and came across theway.com. This was a while ago - I think in '96 or '97, when TWI was still paranoid about the internet. Well, my friend found out that this domain name was owned by someone in England and they were selling it for $4,000. He told our LC, B** M about it. I don't know whether or not they cared about it then, but they own it now. I don't know whether they bullied the person in England who owned it or simply paid him for it. If I had to guess, I'd say that they paid him something.
IMO ALERT! I think the reason they're hassling Pat is because he's a former follower. If someone else owned it, like this person in England, they probably would have purchased it. Maybe not for 4k - maybe they would have negotiated a deal for less. The attorney's fees are surely going to cost them more than they would have paid Pat for it. I think this is a grudge match - plain and simple. Since they can't go after him for content because of the 1st Amendment, they're going after him for the copyright stuff. IMO IMO IMO!!!!
Rafael: Again, the domain name sale was after TWI demanded I give it to them or else, and was a joke to those that knew what I was doing.
The sale for $15,000 which everyone wants to talk about as being so "dishonest" is something almost everyone would have done if TWI wanted something you had.
Knowing someone who despises you wants something you have, wouldn't you sell it to them for what you could get out of it?
By the way, I gave it to a friend for $1 who wanted it. The transfer was in the works.
The real reason for the lawsuit in my opinion, and please notice apparent coincidence of TWI's timing, is right after my posting the evidentiary hearings.
TWI was looking for any way to try to back me down from posting more by filing this lawsuit to try to make me be afraid of doing more because I've been sued.
quote:The sale for $15,000 which everyone wants to talk about as being so "dishonest" is something almost everyone would have done if TWI wanted something you had.
Knowing someone who despises you wants something you have, wouldn't you sell it to them for what you could get out of it?
No, Pat. I wouldn't. That's what makes us different, I guess. I wouldn't have TWI take me to court just to rub their faces in the fact that they didn't take sound advice. You may have the legal right to do so: I'm not disputing that. But Christian to Christian, I'm not with you on this one.
as far as representing yourself, go for it. I've represented myself 5 times and won everytime, all you have to do is homework in the law library. the reason law school takes so long is because you have to learn about all kinds of law, not just the law pertaining to one law battle.
just be HONEST, and prepared, judges love that. only go by what the law says, not what you feel it 'should' say. as soon as you start talking about what you think it should say, you've lost your case.
as far as the name The Way, why hasen't TWI sued the catholic church for using the name The Way on their bibles? because they know they can't win.
PJ, why are they going after you? you're their thorn and they want to 'take you out'.
at the mini, you are bring to light the kind of people they are and will always be unless they can see 'The Way'. haha
Rafael: I'm sorry I misjudged you. I figured you'd be with anyone who stood up to TWI. They didn't ask me for the domain name in a civil manner, they demanded it with threats. I choose not to let them push me around anymore.
This lawsuit is not about the domain name anyway. It is about alleged trademark infringement and TWI's imagined soverign right to "The Way" (Jesus Christ) as the only true representatives of his....
Pat, TWI is not wrong in this case. Give them their name back. Ask for the money you invested in acquiring the domain name. That's all you're entitled to.
A judge and jury may get you more, but that doesn't make you right.
out of its hole. Each time that happens perhaps people can get a glimpse of just how twisted that horror show is. Over time it might help
to fill out the picture for those curious about the organziation. Like roaches TWI tends to run from the light of day so I do find it useful for them to be engaged outside of their turf.
Thanks! I am glad someone has finally caught on to my intentions. "Gee, you're making money on the domain yada yada". I have never made a dime off of my website ex-cultworld, ever.
In the court, TWI will have to answer my questions, and I intend to put them up for all to see. If you thought the evidentiary hearings were revealing, that's just the salad before the steak.
The only petition TWI has at all, that should Pat lose the case, the only consequence is that Pat would only have to release the domain name. TWI cannot sue Pat for any substantial amount of money unless they can prove beyond all shadows of every doubt that Pat in fact made a substantial profit as a result of the domain name.
I agree with Hope, TWI is blowing a lot more money with legal fees than to just pay Pat what he wants to get that domain name. I don't think $15,000 is unreasonable, seeing TWI bilked millions out of people. I'm only sorry I didn't think of it first :D-->
I don't understand why Pat shouldn't make money off the sale.
If you inherit something (at no cost to you) and sell it, is it wrong? Should you have given it away?
The area I live was useless desert and many, many years ago, a guy bought it. Everyone said he was crazy. The guy is a bazillionaire now. Should he have just sold it for what he paid for it?
For all intents and purposes, when Pat bought the site, twi was so against the internet. I think he made a pretty shrewd business investment.
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word wolf:
The moves of consequence have not been revealed, not to worry. And no gloating, just the facts and how out of touch TWI is with reality...
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Goey
Pat,
All of your posturing and sabre rattling here on GS concering this lawsuit is rather disconcerting. I think it's possible that it might come back on you an bite you.
Be careful.
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Raf
Pat,
If you're going to ask questions, ask a hard one.
Google: 17,000,000 web pages containing "The Way." The VAST majority of those occurrences are in complete sentences that have nothing to do with Christianity. (ie, "We were at a strip club. The dancer was hot. I loved the way she picked up that bottle without using her hands). Nothing to do with The Way International, and your implication that all these folks should be sued for trademarki infringement is, well, stupid.
Why are they harassing a former member as opposed to any other church using the trademark "The Way?" That's easy: FORMER MEMBERS ARE THE ONLY ONES USING "THE WAY" TO DELIBERATELY INFRINGE ON THE WAY INTERNATIONAL'S TRADEMARK. Who are you to taunt them for not going after people who are NOT deliberately trying to infrigne on their trademark? If I had limited resources, I'd go after the people who were infringing on my trademark ON PURPOSE before I started going after anyone who happened to be doing it by accident.
Pat, you're doing this on purpose. I don't know if you'll win in court or if you'll lose, but as a general rule I consider cybersquatting to be low-level extortion. You're being a cybersquatter with a vendetta, and that won't serve you well in court.
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Grizzy
Playing the *devil’s advocate* here,
:D--> 
;)--> 
Let’s say that Socks owns and operates www.seamonkiesonmars.com and in the interest of bringing all those that hunger and thirst for *monkey* love to his site he registers all the .’s he can. But mean while the evil dark monkey finds out and slips in and registers www.amazingseamonkiesonmars.com to divert all searchers to his own anti-seamonkey site, because after all monkey love is a farce and socks runs a CULT!!!!!
Now the dark monkey behaves his monkey @$$ for a few years and finds that the seamonkies on Mars group is all at once operating some what unchallenged, or relatively quietly. Now since the dark monkey has made it his life’s work to expose the evil because after all he now has the truth, in his total black and white world, he decides to do something to rattle the poor little monkies habitat!
Rather than to contact the OLM socks, the dark monkey goes to an other anti-seamonkey site, his sister’s (www.flashmyboobies.com) and posts intent to sell the www.amazingseamonkiesonmars.com for a ridiculous price. He also has it posted that the possible use for this anti-monkey group could be to parody the real and only true household of seamonkies!
Now there are billions of sites the use seamonkey and related names, but there is only one dark monkey with proven intent to defame those amazing monkies and their true followers! There are related sites to prove the evil intent of OLM socks and his group, yet only one dark monkey with his site bashing those adorable little and amazing monkies!
As a side note, OLM socks has announced to the faithful remnant of Seamonkey Zion........
* we ain’t giving the evil dark monkey a red cent of your ABS!!!!!!!* A roar of applause filled the MOW auditorium!!!!!!!
Now I think if one looks at the whole history, track record and greed, perhaps OLM socks has more of a case than his opponent the dark monkey can see.........
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pjroberge
Rafael:
Respectfully, I am not cybersquating. TWI didn't want the domain until years after I owned it and they found out.
The real issue is their claim that I infringed on their trademark "The Way". Their only evidence is an old webpage for the Path of Christ Ministry website when it was originally named The Way Of Christ Ministry.
I had it properly registered with the State of NH and had a trademark application that I backed out of during the waydale days.
All of you that have criticisms about what I am posting are missing the point. TWI has no valid complaint and are using the pretense of an alleged trademark infringement to find a way to harrass me, pure and simple.
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LG
Grizzy, I'm shocked at your ignorance! It's the MOU (Monkeys over the Universe) auditorium.
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Raf
Not so simple at all, Pat.
Cybersquatting is taking a domain name that reasonably belongs to someone else. I don't know what the law is on this, but you look at me with a straight face and tell me that taking the name "thewayinternational.com" is not cybersquatting. Registering the name is prima facie evidence of cybersquatting. It doesn't have to be proven: it IS proof. Are you The Way International? No. Are they The Way International? Yes. Who should register the name? Well, you did.
Yeah, they're idiots for not registering it first (especially given Ex-TWI's advice. I agree with Oldiesman: this is your strongest legal defense). But that doesn't make your action any more noble. You attempt to sell it for $15,000 and you call that a fair price? Did it cost you $15,000 to acquire the name? To maintain it?
Look, as far as the law of the U.S. is concerned, I don't know if you're right or wrong. Good luck. But in my humble opinion, as far as right and wrong is concerned, you're cybersquatting, you're not The Way International, and you're being a pest. I don't like TWI any more than you do, but watching you guys go at it is going to be very much like watching an arm wrestling contest at a leper colony.
You have so many morally and ethically legitimate ways to get at them. You really do. This particular method of yours, again in MY opinion and mine only, absolutely cheapens and morally invalidates your other efforts.
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Hope R.
John told me that people who had registered movie star's names had to give them up (juliaroberts.com). I don't know whether or not they got fined or paid for them.
When a new mall opened close to here, everyone was calling it "Citrus Park Mall". Someone I met had bought that domain name before they broke ground in anticipation of it being worth something once the mall was built. Well, the name of the mall was "Citrus Park Town Center" and guess what their website was called? Not citrusparkmall.com! So these people were stuck with it and eventually let it go.
Someone close to me was checking out the registered domain name site and came across theway.com. This was a while ago - I think in '96 or '97, when TWI was still paranoid about the internet. Well, my friend found out that this domain name was owned by someone in England and they were selling it for $4,000. He told our LC, B** M about it. I don't know whether or not they cared about it then, but they own it now. I don't know whether they bullied the person in England who owned it or simply paid him for it. If I had to guess, I'd say that they paid him something.
IMO ALERT! I think the reason they're hassling Pat is because he's a former follower. If someone else owned it, like this person in England, they probably would have purchased it. Maybe not for 4k - maybe they would have negotiated a deal for less. The attorney's fees are surely going to cost them more than they would have paid Pat for it. I think this is a grudge match - plain and simple. Since they can't go after him for content because of the 1st Amendment, they're going after him for the copyright stuff. IMO IMO IMO!!!!
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pjroberge
Rafael: Again, the domain name sale was after TWI demanded I give it to them or else, and was a joke to those that knew what I was doing.
The sale for $15,000 which everyone wants to talk about as being so "dishonest" is something almost everyone would have done if TWI wanted something you had.
Knowing someone who despises you wants something you have, wouldn't you sell it to them for what you could get out of it?
By the way, I gave it to a friend for $1 who wanted it. The transfer was in the works.
The real reason for the lawsuit in my opinion, and please notice apparent coincidence of TWI's timing, is right after my posting the evidentiary hearings.
TWI was looking for any way to try to back me down from posting more by filing this lawsuit to try to make me be afraid of doing more because I've been sued.
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Raf
No, Pat. I wouldn't. That's what makes us different, I guess. I wouldn't have TWI take me to court just to rub their faces in the fact that they didn't take sound advice. You may have the legal right to do so: I'm not disputing that. But Christian to Christian, I'm not with you on this one.
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papajohn
as far as representing yourself, go for it. I've represented myself 5 times and won everytime, all you have to do is homework in the law library. the reason law school takes so long is because you have to learn about all kinds of law, not just the law pertaining to one law battle.
just be HONEST, and prepared, judges love that. only go by what the law says, not what you feel it 'should' say. as soon as you start talking about what you think it should say, you've lost your case.
as far as the name The Way, why hasen't TWI sued the catholic church for using the name The Way on their bibles? because they know they can't win.
PJ, why are they going after you? you're their thorn and they want to 'take you out'.
at the mini, you are bring to light the kind of people they are and will always be unless they can see 'The Way'. haha
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papajohn
P.S.
some site names have sold for way more than $15,000.00.
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pjroberge
Rafael: I'm sorry I misjudged you. I figured you'd be with anyone who stood up to TWI. They didn't ask me for the domain name in a civil manner, they demanded it with threats. I choose not to let them push me around anymore.
This lawsuit is not about the domain name anyway. It is about alleged trademark infringement and TWI's imagined soverign right to "The Way" (Jesus Christ) as the only true representatives of his....
PS: Thanks papa john. Nice see someone support me
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Raf
I'm with anyone who stands up to TWI when they're wrong.
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pjroberge
Rafael: Thanks. I knew you just misunderstood what was happening.
:)-->
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Raf
Pat, TWI is not wrong in this case. Give them their name back. Ask for the money you invested in acquiring the domain name. That's all you're entitled to.
A judge and jury may get you more, but that doesn't make you right.
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George Aar
Anyone else find themselves rooting for TWI in this case?
It just gets curiouser and curiouser...
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pjroberge
Rafael: I left you a private topic
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diazbro
I don't know the legal intracacies of this
situation but I certainly believe Pat when
he says that TWI tried to bully him out of
the domian. Thats their style and as most
people here know they possess a sense of
entitlment that would make Donald Trump seem
humble.
Let the courts decide if its cybersquatting
but I don't think its a deal breaker for
anyone and a court process would force TWI
out of its hole. Each time that happens perhaps people can get a glimpse of just how twisted that horror show is. Over time it might help
to fill out the picture for those curious about the organziation. Like roaches TWI tends to run from the light of day so I do find it useful for them to be engaged outside of their turf.
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pjroberge
diazbro:
Thanks! I am glad someone has finally caught on to my intentions. "Gee, you're making money on the domain yada yada". I have never made a dime off of my website ex-cultworld, ever.
In the court, TWI will have to answer my questions, and I intend to put them up for all to see. If you thought the evidentiary hearings were revealing, that's just the salad before the steak.
PS: did you enter the lawsuit contest?
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Oakspear
Oh I get it Pjroberge...we're supposed to check our opinions and good sense at the door when an ex-wayfer gets tangled up with TWI.
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Grizzy
Long Gone,
We were both wrong!!!!
It is the PMS auditorium! The Prevailing Monkies of the Sea!!!!! That’s what happens when a group goes from a king to a queen.....
:P-->
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CKnapp3
Well, here's my thought on the matter:
The only petition TWI has at all, that should Pat lose the case, the only consequence is that Pat would only have to release the domain name. TWI cannot sue Pat for any substantial amount of money unless they can prove beyond all shadows of every doubt that Pat in fact made a substantial profit as a result of the domain name.
I agree with Hope, TWI is blowing a lot more money with legal fees than to just pay Pat what he wants to get that domain name. I don't think $15,000 is unreasonable, seeing TWI bilked millions out of people. I'm only sorry I didn't think of it first
:D-->
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LuckyGirl
I don't understand why Pat shouldn't make money off the sale.
If you inherit something (at no cost to you) and sell it, is it wrong? Should you have given it away?
The area I live was useless desert and many, many years ago, a guy bought it. Everyone said he was crazy. The guy is a bazillionaire now. Should he have just sold it for what he paid for it?
For all intents and purposes, when Pat bought the site, twi was so against the internet. I think he made a pretty shrewd business investment.
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