TWI 3 & 4

[Hope R.]

(This is going to be long)...

I just re-read the TWI 1, 2 and 3 thread over for the first time in a few years and was totally blown away by the insight from some of the “old-timers” who posted there.

Many of you who post and read GS got out of TWI sometime before or during that 3 year transitional period between 1986 (CG’s reading of POP), until 1989 (LCM out of the “fog). Most of you didn’t hang around for LCM’s reign of terror.

I’ve had various discussions with people who stuck around and those who got out earlier – and I’ve come to the conclusion that those of you who got out in the 80’s really have no idea of how bad TWI 3 became. I’m not saying “my fish is bigger than your fish” at all. I’m just saying that if you weren’t there, you can’t know (sort of like when we try to explain things to NBW people – they can get an idea, but no way can they understand what we’ve been through).

I think some people tend to forget that LCM was the leader of TWI for 15+ years – more time than most of us had under VPW’s Mogship. Much of the discussion on GS is regarding VP – his teachings, his plagiarism, his sexual misconduct and more.

But what about Craig? Those people who are still in today were basically told that everything from TWI 1 was an “old wineskin” and that LCM’s teachings were the “present truth”. No one that I know of at HQ’s has stated otherwise. They still follow his teachings in classes and books. His name may be unspoken, but his words aren’t.

When I was still involved and started looking on the internet, the stuff I saw about TWI was either old stories about the Corps’ gun training in Emporia or stuff about VP’s plagiarism. To me, it was ancient history. None of it really surprised me – people had been telling those stories for years. I knew things in TWI were awful and getting worse and I just wanted some kind of validation – to hear it from another source. I wanted insight on what was happening in the present – things like Paul A. had in the Waydale documents section.

I believe we still have a “job” to do in exposing the evils of the more recent years of TWI 3 (LCM) and 4(RFR), especially to those who may be reading who are still in. (Harve? Mr. Linder? Gary?). I’m not saying that the topics about the early days are irrelevant – just that lately we’ve pretty much become a TWI 1 discussion forum.

I would like to ask anyone to share the experiences they had in TWI 3 & 4 on this thread.

I borrowed the outline of Oakspear’s post on the TWI 1,2 & 3 thread for chronology – but added some lenghtly details (apologies to Oaksie!)

---

TWI 2

1985- VP dies

Leaders start questioning LCM’s ability to lead

One year later – Geer reads POP and all hell breaks loose.

Geer gets control of the BOT

Martindale goes into his “fog years”

Between 1986 & 1989 – 4/5ths of the leadership leaves, many form off-shoots.

TWI 2 ends with CG running rampant on LCM and the BOT.

---

TWI 3 (IMO this is where all the garbage started gurgling to the surface, sorta like a bad septic tank!)

1989 – 17th Corps graduates – LCM teaches Galatians to them, which will become to be known as the “Leaders Tapes” and later the “Galatians Tapes”. There, he gives his interpretation of what happened with CG and uses the term “fog years” for the first time referring to the 3 year period Geer was the puppetmaster. He discredits JAL, Geer and others who walked away from TWI. Sets himself up as the MOG once more.

1989-1990 – All Corps and AC Grads on the field listen to the tapes.

The 90’s are declared the “Decade of Victory” – the word “prevailing” is saturated into the TWI vocabulary.

1990/91 – LCM goes out on the field to different areas to teach the “Acts Weekends” and show everyone that he’s back in charge.

1992 – 50th Anniversary – LCM teaches an “Advanced Class Special on Discerning of Spirits” at HQ’s. Later that year, his new “Defeating the Adversary” class comes out and replaces VP’s old “Dealing with the Adversary” class.

The theme for that year is “Rise to the Word, Expand to the World”. The Household starts being stressed as the only place for spiritual growth.

quote:

---

“Spiritual growth, or rise, has to take place in the household of God; and it cannot happen anywhere else.” (Nov/Dec 1992 Way Magazine, LCM’s opening article).

---

1993 – The Homosexual Witch hunt begins! The May/June issue of the Way Magazine’s cover reads “WHAT DOES THE WORD SAY?”. The main articles were:

• Not Ashamed of the Gospel: The Sin of Homosexuality, by L.Craig Martindale

• On Homosexuality: Common Questions/Uncommon Answers, by Keith W. Jackson

• To All K.T. Lunds in the Gunnison Valley (Article reprint from the Gunnision Country Times) by Ed Horney

Even the letters section contains letters that all pertain to the evils of homosexuality – mostly letters about AIDS and the “don’t ask, don’t tell” military policy.

Also in 1993 – LCM records his new “Advanced Class on Power for Abundant Living”

1993 Anniversary Theme “The Way of Holiness: Walk Ye In It!”

(Note: The WOW Program and the ROA are still taking place and being promoted in the Way Magazine every year PFAL is still being run.)

July 1994: War Declared on homosexuals with the Way Corps. Letter from Martindale to the Way Corps announcing a witch hunt for any homosexuals within the ranks. This letter features very explicit descriptions of homosexual sex acts and bestiality. Martindale sets the stage for an inquisition-like purge within The Way where a mere "genuine spiritual suspicion" is enough to bring someone in for interrogation. This purge led to hundreds being thrown out of The Way.

"You should be thankful you're not in the Old Testament times, because there are some of us who would gladly execute you." - L. Craig Martindale "War Declared" from Waydale Docs - Adobe PDF format

Theme for the ROA “God’s Call To Abundance”

This is the Rock of Ages that LCM announced he was suspending the WOW program because of homosexuality.

quote:

---

“During WOW training at the Rock we discovered a number of homosexuals preparing to go out with our WOW’s; all of these were hiding and covering their spiritual contamination and devilish practices. From reports since the Rock, we estimate that the homosexual infiltration in the group was as high as 10 percent..”

“Several months before the Rock of Ages ’94, the Father worked in and with us to expose homosexual spirits infiltrating our fellowships. We are continuing to root out these influences…”

(From the Way Magazine / November-December 1994, “Our Times Insight”, by L.Craig Martindale)

---

This was also the year that all Corps who were married to non-Corps were dropped as well as those who were considered “unproductive” About 400 people were dropped at that time.

He addresses the debt problem in the Corps. Basically says get out of debt or get dropped. Waydale Documents letter (adobe.pdf file)

1995 – the new Foundational and Intermediate classes on The Way of Abundance and Power are recorded.

Theme for 1995 ROA – Living Sanctified. Outreach Group 1 of the Way Disciples were send to 14 cities in the US and one in Canada. Tom and Barbara Lally are the coordinators of the program.

That Rock of Ages was a class titled: “Living Sanctified”. It was not in the usual ROA format, but instead was like an Advanced Class format with teachings in the morning, household fellowships in the afternoon and another evening teaching. It is to be the last Rock of Ages.

This is time when the term “The Household” is used of the TWI faithful and the term “Family of God” is demeaned.

quote:

---

"Everyone who is born again is a member of the family of God, but only those who faithfully walk on the word are in the household of God. There are many blessings which abound to a household believer that are not available to someone who is in the family but not living God’s Word.”

“One of the great joys of being in the household is to appreciate the heart and ability with which our fellow believers operate the Word of God…..

On the other hand, we have no obligation to honor or respect family members who no longer stand with the household. Since they do not continue steadfastly in the apostles doctrine (Acts 2:42) they have forfeited the mutual respect and honor that could be theirs (Acts 2:43).”

“Honor in the Household: by Steve Longley, The Way Magazine/ Nov-Dec 1995

---

This is also the year that he plants the seeds for the “Owe No Man Anything” teachings.

May 1995 – LCM announces that The Way Corps are to be made full time staff as of September 1, 1995

Some reasons:

quote:

---

“Homosexuals basically run the federal government”

“The Pope desperately desires and craves the Roman Catholic domination fo the world by the year 2000.”

(from "The Prevailing Word Report" - The Way Mag., Jan/Feb 1996)

---

Anniversary 1996 – Donald E. Wierwille steps down and Rosalie F. Rivenbark is chosen to serve as the new VP.

------More to Come ------

Edited March 22, 2004 by Guest

[Oakspear]

Hope:

No apologies needed sister! Great job expanding and explaining the chronology.

In my opinion, one of the resons that GS has become more of a TWI-1 site is the Wierwille fans who post here. Some are enthusiastic cheerleaders for Wierwille. The focus on Wierwille's abuses are a reaction to the elevation of Wierwille and a pining for the good old days.

In the early days of Grease Spot, I recall more focus on Martindale, Rivenbark et al. There wasn't much argument there. While there are folks who take the position of "The Way, right or wrong", there wasn't a crowd of people sticking up for Martindale or his wannabes. A great number of ex-wayfers left TWI in the late 80's due to Martindale's demand for allegience (the so-called loyalty oath) and saw in LCM someone who ruined TWI. Many others left in the 90's after being abused by Martindale and his stooges. People in both of those exoduses (exodi?) had no trouble seeing what a b*sta*rd LCM was; some even looked fondly at TWI-1, since there was unquestionably a contrast.

The TWI 1, 2, 3 Thread brought out that the bad stuff didn't originate with The Great Forehead, but showed how he learned much at VP's knee. Some of the folks who posted had left in disgust in The Seventies, the supposed golden age when the MOG led revelation and God's grace, and left because they saw that things were rotten even back then.

After those brief introductory remarks...

...Good idea for a thread Hope!

[A la prochaine]

Oaksie,

"The Great Forehead" .... LMAO

Edited March 22, 2004 by Guest

[Oakspear]

Whatever number TWI you want to call it, the nineties were insane.

There was a big difference in my observation between what went on before and after Rock of Ages 1993.

• Way Corps were specifically being trained to detect and eliminate weakness. We got an interim 22nd Corps guy as a WOW leader in 92-93 and a newly graduated 21st guy as branch coordinator in August 93. Both of these guys seemed intent on weeding out the weak
• There became more of an emphasis on being "disciples" rather than "saints" or "believers", implying that more of a committment was required for the "Joe Believers".
• The obsession with homosexuals "infiltrating" was paranoia if I ever saw it
• Suggestions became a thing of the past and "directives" from leaders the norm
• Interference at every level: from budgets to schedules to marriage
• Screaming as a teaching method

More later :D-->

[Catcup]

Hope,

Thanks for giving this chronology. Unless people lived under LCM's totalitarian regime, they have no idea what it was like to have people invading their homes, their finanaces, their families, their personal lives, and ripping apart their marriages in the name of "living sanctified."

That catchphrase justified more persecution among TWI followers than any other single idea promulgated by a pervert at the helm of the organization.

Under that banner, marriages were assaulted and individual lives were destroyed both figuratively, and literally. More fear and malignant hate was openly thundered from that pulpit by Craig Martindale at that time than at any other time in TWIs history.

What people desperately need to realize is that although the man who originated these pogroms is now no longer at HQ, his policies, procedures, and teachings are still in place and still followed, indicating that nothing has changed in that organization other than the masks of evil.

Edited March 22, 2004 by Guest

[JustThinking]

I have recent experience with TWI and can concur with Catcup. Although I wonder how much is his direct influence or them just no having any other product to push. TWI has always been about selling classes. When PFAL was dropped but the new classes weren't out yet, there was almost NO new people around. It was like the borg in Star Trek walking around looking for the mother ship. You have people who equate outreach with with a signed card. Anything done for the person is only to lead to a signature and check. Sadly, TWI views the CONCLUSION of outreach as that point.

SO.... this is yet another new TWI in that they have a class and no MOG.

I - Mog then a class

II - New Mog, old class then new class

III - No MOG, old new class

IV - No MOG, doing new classes

I put the last one in as I understand TWI

is redoing LCM and VPW's family/sex class. Believing Disciple's Standard of Ruling your Family and Leading your Wife. (Just kidding!) I don't know what it's called. There IS supposed to be a new class though. Has anyonne been in it or heard about it?

[herbiejuan]

One thing is sure, they love running classes.

We had the pleasure of having two trunk leaders and the head of international outreach as our RC, our LC and sometimes our BC as well (I think a few had the misfortune as having them as their TC's as well, but they can tell that story should they chose).

I saw (and still do) a direct correlation between these *leaders* assholiness and the amount of time spent at hq. It seems the more one had been holed up in lalaland the less interested in reality they became and the more preposterous their doctines became. I'm beginning to wonder if someone isn't spiking the water there...

In anycase poop runs downhill and now it's all settled at the bottom where rosie n crew are standing and they don't have a clue,

[JustThinking]

HJ,

I feel for you.

When we got a RC that was fresh from the Poppy fields of O-hi-O, his big thing was outreach. He wanted to know how many new people came each week and wanted it in the newsletter. (Whatever it's called now) Turns out if was often "0." Ha! No problem. We count instead how many contacts were made. Low single digits for an entire state! Woops. Ok, let's count how many people we talked to throughout the day. Gee, that makes an impressive enough number to put in a newsletter. So, it was done.

From the outside, one would think that this bonehead had turned a sleepy group into "HOT BIBLE MOVERS!" Truth is, he just found ways to cook the books. Kind of like Enron. When you're spirituality is measured by how bold your language is versus what you actually deliver, it's no surprise that fantasy prevails.

Hey, wait, that's it! The Land of the Prevailing Fantasy! The new theme for '05! What do you think? It fits for any TWI. Now if I only got a set of Ginsu knives...

[JustThinking]

"I believe we still have a “job” to do in exposing the evils of the more recent years of TWI 3 (LCM) and 4(RFR), especially to those who may be reading who are still in. (Harve? Mr. Linder? Gary?). I’m not saying that the topics about the early days are irrelevant – just that lately we’ve pretty much become a TWI 1 discussion forum."

Taking so much and giving nothing. Literally. Tapes are paid items. Classes too. Ministers who

work full time jobs so they can't spend much time with others. (Although, at times, that's not so bad)

Allowing a psycho to rant and rave at students as young as 12 years old.

Creating (yes, I CAN use that word!) mistrust among friends by having them fill out 3x5 cards on each other. (Vee have vays of making you spiritual...)

Redefining success every time to make themselves look good. Even when the most stalwart of followers could see that nothing had happened.

Taking the twisting of scriptures to a whole new level. Not just bizarre interpretations but just saying your opinion without even quoting a verse. (Happens a lot in newer classes)

Gee, should I keep going...?

[Sunesis]

Hope, great chronology for us who did not experience TWI 2, 3 and 4. Looking forward to the rest.

When I first started reading trancechat and Waydale I could not believe what it had turned into years later. This is great learning for those of us who weren't there.

Looking forward to the rest of the chronology.

[oldiesman]

quote:

---

This was also the year (1994) that all Corps who were married to non-Corps were dropped as well as those who were onsidered “unproductive” About 400 people were dropped at that time.

---

I see this as a very big injustice by LCM & Co. Does anyone know/care to opine what would motivate him to do this? As if some Corps folks weren't snobby enough...

[Tom Strange]

HopeR, thanks for the info... I knew I should've stayed in longer! I missed so much!

sadly though... this info isn't surprising... I think I'm gonna paste that post into Word and save it for a chat with my peeps... (know what I mean?)...

thanks again

[JustThinking]

Oldies,

I believe cost played a big role. They just couldn't afford all of those people being full time. Even the ones who did make it to payroll nirvana had to get by on almost nothing. Pets, cable television and many other typical items were banned.

It was sad to see this corps kids in our area being told no more dog, no more cable, etc. Not that cable is that important to God but for a 12-year old...

[engine]

Feel bad for you guys...glad you're out,

and glad I bailed in '86......

I'll leave this thread to those who were there.

rob

[oldiesman]

quote:

---

posted March 22, 2004 11:29

Oldies,

I believe cost played a big role. They just couldn't afford all of those people being full time. Even the ones who did make it to payroll nirvana had to get by on almost nothing. Pets, cable television and many other typical items were banned. ... It was sad to see this corps kids in our area being told no more dog, no more cable, etc. Not that cable is that important to God but for a 12-year old...

---

JustThinking, thanks for the info. That would explain the folks at hq, but what about those out in the field. Someone very close to me, out on the field, got dismissed from the Corps for marrying a non-corps spouse.

Another person close to me got hassled for owning a cat.

Gee, what a great way to encourage more love in the household! NOT!

[JustThinking]

Oldies,

Dittos for field people. I didn't have much exposure to HQ folks but the corps in our area went into immediate yard sale mode.

Others were dropped when they showed up at ROA that year. One couple in our area were told they were no longer "corps material." What does that mean? Who knows. That was about it too. Quit their jobs, etc. and came back with NOTHING. No job, no plan. Just dropped. They ended up leaving TWI only to go back later. They even called me to try to get me to come back! They had actually rationalized somehow that it was THEIR fault and asked the BOT for forgiveness. sigh...

LCM used to say that people run to slavery. There's a whole bunch of people like this working to prove him right apparently.

JT

[Goey]

I bailed in 82/83 ... Made a fairly quiet exit.

One of the main reasons I left then was because it was getting too legalistic and controling for me -- and that was in 82. I only saw it getting worse and not better. I never liked Craig, so when he got the mantle (skunk pelt) I said adios.

I stayed in fairly close contact with my brothers who remained in until Craig's "loyalty letter" whenever that was. So I saw a bit of what was going on up until then.

But, as far as actual personal experience in TWI after Craig took over, I have none at all. The worse things that happend to me while I as in TWI(1) was married Clergy trying to get in my then fiancee's pants (78) and getting raked over the coals and humilliated in public for not ABSing enough (80 or 81). That and just certain leaders (all Corps Grads) being very pushy and meddlesome.

I really feel for you folks who stayed and endured the 90's and beyond. But I will bug out of this thread and let those who had actual experinece in TWI 2, 3, & 4 share their experience and insight.

Goey

Edited March 22, 2004 by Guest

[oldiesman]

If I may, one point in defense of Craig's letter of 1989 (the famous Loyalty Oath letter) was that it was directed to Way employees and not everybody in the Way. I remember at this time there were numerous people on the fence and those still salaried by TWI who were against them (the Geerites). There were reports of folks still on TWI payroll sending ABS to Geer. And so I didn't think that Craig's letter was all that bad because it drew the line. Of course, it gave folks who were on the fence ample excuses to leave. But I think it's what happened after that with all the legalism that was really bad.

Edited March 22, 2004 by Guest

[insurgent]

The reason was also given that marriages among wc and non-wc were "unequally yoked" spiritually. Thereby elevating the caste system within twi. They could, if they chose, PAY to go back through the wc training program together thereby elevating the bank account of twi even more.

Somewhere between 1995-1997 was when it became verbotten to use words like "luck", "create"," bet", "fortunate", "Christmas", "Easter" and others. After listening to lcm rant about the pagan origins of the months of the year I feared we were going to start our own vocabulary and be forbidden to speak of February and Wednesday in front of wayfers.

People who didn't want to attend every meeting were considered of lower status in twi because they weren't putting "spiritual goals first".

People who were sick were "off the word" somewhere. If it was chronic or a serious matter people were scared to mention it to anyone in twi and people were afraid to talk to them or show them love and kindness because they knew that they were weak people to have something bad happen to them.

[Hope R.]

Oldies - in the Waydale Documents section on the Main GS site, there are a bunch of Adobe.pdf letters from LCM to the Corps and/or Staff, including the loyalty letter.

The letter regarding Corps spouses is here: Corps Spouse Letter - adobe.pdf

I've been using all my 90's way rags, the letters from the documents section, some other letters I have saved and my memory to put this together. I'll finish later...

Thanks to everyone who is contributing - please let everyone hear your stories about the last decade of TWI.

[Hope R.]

Oldies - yes, that letter was directed to Corps who were on WayPay - BUT ALL THE CORPS RECEIVED IT! Think he was trying to put a bit of pressure on everyone???

[Goey]

Oldies,

My brother called me when he got his "loyalty letter" and read it to me. My first thought was what a bunch of B.S.

LCM was asking folks not for loyalty to God or to the Word, but rather to him personally. Anyone that replied that they would be loyal to Craig as long as he stood on the Word was summarily dismissed. Which is what what happened to my brother. He was told he could no longer run classes or lead a Twig and was was told to return all TWI material to HQ.

My brother was neither on Staff nor was he Corps, yet he got the letter.

Yes, Craig's letter drew a line - between loyalty to one screwed up ministy (his) and another screwed up ministry (Geer's). I see nothing good about the letter.

The letter, as I read it, was the antethesis of 1 Cor 3 as he demmanded people to make a carnal choice between what *man* to follow.

Even if paid Staff and Clergy were donating to Geer, it was none of Craig's business where a person decides to give money that they have earned. It is their money to give as they see fit. An employer has no right to tell an employee were to spend their income.

Oops, sorry, I said I would bug out didn't I?

Goey

[JustThinking]

All,

Do I remember this correctly:

LCM changed the salt covenant the corps took from one with God to one with him?

[excathedra]

i don't know JT

**

*leaders* assholiness

herbie ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

[herbiejuan]

I was still around (the first go round) during the pop/loyalty letter stage but all I can remember was a lot of confusion, my tc, wayne tried to keep everything under wraps and even suggested that if we worked together we could *rise in the ranks* to a most elevated leaderdang position if we *played our cards right* (his words...and boy did that ever put a SERIOUS smudge on his integrity in my eyes).

His next door neighbor (and landlord) was a staunch supporter of Geer and would show up unexpectedly and launch into an almost hysterical tirade on the evils of twi and how God told ol vic to write this letter to geer and that craig had better do this or something bad was going to happen etc..., frankly I thought everyone involved was nuts and began to seriously consider leaving which I did shortly.

Only to return a few years later after being well assured twi had changed...

Yeah it changed alright...

Edited March 22, 2004 by Guest