Exactly juan...that cold sick feeling...realising that we weren`t allowed to have friends or activities...everything had to be viewed as an access to new people for the class...I felt devious...dirty
I remember feeling like a kid in high school again having to sell oranges door to door....only not having nearly so good a product..
If someone wasn`t involved or interested in twi...we were not to waste our time with them...not allowed to have them in our lives...that included family and life long friends...
Pets too...I was blasted...a top of the lungs ..screaming full blown face melting confrontation because I cared for the damaged sick animals from the pet shop that I worked at instead of having the vet put them down....my room ...in a house that I paid the rent....just a parakeet or two and a hamster...Gawd what a sinner.
But hey...how was THAT going to help me move the word...My horses...ditto...they simply took time and resources away from moving the word...
*Pius Pimp* describes EXACTLY how I felt once embarked upon the path of service to God....
Whats wierd is...I didn`t link the bleakness of the picture with it being wrong...just deeply discouraged that THIS was what God required of me for the rest of my life...it never dawned on me that it wasn`t necessary.
Oh OH...what about the way corpes chalet...alla the private donations...thousands of free hours of donated time and labor invested by corpes because they were told that itt would be a place for them to stay when they visited hq????
The contributers NEVER got to set foot in it...
upon completion it was immediatly seized and converted into a *private* residence...grrrrr
How about the locals around the root lacations...who spent one weekend a month on improving the campuses...free labor...because they were *our* property...they belonged to *us* the believer...our abs bought it...so we were told... it was our free labor...the way corpes labor that fixed those places up and made them habitable...only to here that twi sells em for pittance and pockets the cash....
quote:We weren't witnessing our faith in God, no, not at all -- We were selling TWI product.
One of the things I never quite understood is why some folks feel that getting folks signed up for PFAL was an evil scam. What's evil about wanting folks to have the same knowledge of the bible you have? We thought PFAL was a great class that would help them, which was why we wanted folks signed up. Folks who didn't think it was a great class, acted differently.
*We* did at first oldies...and then it got to be a push to have a *newbie* in every class...
If you DIDN`T have a new student...you were yelled at...*What the heck is wrong with your believing*? *Where did you Blow it*? *If you don`t have a new person in this class...you are a bump on the log spiritually*...you are no good to God*....all crap that I heard on various occasions....your spirituality rested DIRECTLY on how many students you provided....and after the class was run......it was started all over again......
Yeah...just LOVED turning folks on to THAT crap oldies.
Are you referring to your experiences in the Way Corps?
The Way Corps people that I was involved with in New York didn't treat me like garbage, like your describing. Again I guess I was involved in a different ministry than you were.
Or perhaps different time periods. I have very little experiential knowledge of TWI-2.
Oldies...I was involved in the same ministry, as you well know...from 79 through the early 90s...the stuff I listed happened as early as 1980...is that twi ONE enough for you?
The garbage started from the time I was a lowley twiggy throughtout tc...app corpes spouse corpes..in other words...at all levels of my involvement.
It wasn`t all corpes I met...many truly WERE wonderfull, caring Godly people...(my husband was one_) so I have NO doubt that you might have had caring compassionate leadership in your experience....that does NOT however mean that was the norm for the rest of the country... ugliness happened with enough consistancy with different individuals throughout my time involved that shows the idiocy not to be just isolated incidences....or administrations.
The worst of the corpes nazi`s, the ones that thought screaming and bullying into submition were acceptable forms of coersion...in my experience were (some of) the ones trained under vpw in the late 70s.
Oldies, here's a fine example of being scammed into hawking PFAL....
I was involved in a play that was written and directed by an apprentice Corps lady. Shortly before we were to perform it for the public, we were told we would go into the audience right at the end of the last scene, green cards in hand. There was NO mention made of this little addition to the final scene, until it was really too late to back out without causing a problem to the production. (I have no idea if it was the Corps person's idea to do this, or someone else's.)
It was embarrassing -- I had invited my employer and her husband to the event!
One more scam: signing up for "Recognized Corps," meaning we would have a 2-year training program, then not have to commit the rest of our lives to Corps assignments. Then being told after we graduated that "Doctor didn't really want to have a Recognized program," and have someone try to give me a Corps evaluation and require me to attend all Corps functions.
Excath...I edited it out myself. Even though I didn't use their names, my description of the events were too "detailed" ...I didn't want to embarrass some really fine people that were victimized by twi. I reconsidered after thinking about it and edited it out.
But not to worry, I've got a "million" of em... ;)-->
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
I entered the 10th corps after committing to a FOUR year program. This was quite clear going in. apprentice year, 2 years in residence, and one year "on the field"...That's what I signed up for, nothing more. That was the freakin' agreement that THEY drafted in writing!
First year in residence, about 6 months into the year, lcm announces at a "closed" meeting that the committment we made was for a LIFETIME! If we didn't understand that, we were not spiritual enough.
As I walked out of that meeting, I was mumbling to myself..."bull...., I only signed up for 4 years"...I felt that they had lied to me. I also felt that I was the only one who felt that way. Everybody else seemed to be grinnin'.
Taking assigments after corps graduation was optional...that also was in writing. Suddenly I felt very betrayed by twi...I knew for the first time that I wasn't gonna be stickin' around these folks much longer...
I guess we all had particular "points" at which we began realizing things were not right. I clearly saw how we were being manipulated...the seeds of discontent grew.
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
yeah, funny how doing a program got twisted into a fulltime volunteer slave position for life.
Thanks for your kindness Groucho. You da man, even if you did cop out on your lifetime corpse commitment. LOL
I loved being told I needed to take time off work and spend quality time with God, and oh yes, while I was at it, come up and help a branch coordinator fix up a cabin he found in the mountains that he was figuring on squatting in, in hopes nobody would notice. Oh yeah, I am in construction. Funny that the tire salesman guy wasn't told the same thing.
~HAPe4me
A candle loses nothing of its light by lighting another candle.
I got in just at the end of TWI-1 and it seemed very entrenched at that point. Can't speak for times before that.
My impression is classes have always been TWI's main revenue stream. With very few people in TWI-2 holding high-income jobs and numbers dwindling, it would seem that would be even more true.
Telling the apprentice 6th Way Corps that when they graduated they would have a bonafide, recognized bachelor's degree from The Way College of Emporia which would be an accredited institution.
Then later in our first year in residence, when they told us that The Way Corps was for training TWIG LEADERS.
When I signed up for The Way Corps, TWI represented to me that I would be training for upper leadership responsibilities that I had not yet held, and that when I graduated, I would hold an accredited degree.
TWI misrepresented The Way Corps program specifically to those of us who went into the 6th Corps, revealing only AFTER we were already in residence, that we would NOT have a recognized accredited degree, and that they were training us to be twig leaders.
And speaking of misrepresentation, with all due respect to the Cafe management, I have way more than 75 posts and did not "register" June 13 2002. I crossed over from WayDale. Whenvever that was. Whatever.
[This message was edited by Catcup on March 07, 2004 at 13:20.]
The counting of the posts is from when the "new" GreaseSpot replaced the old one at EZBoard. Pretty much the first time you posted on the new board is when you "registered".
It doesn't matter if we turn to dust...guess I'll see you dancin' in the ruins tonight
If your event was in Phoenix, circa 1983-ish, then we probably do know each other. Forgive me in advance if the name doesn't ring a bell -- it was a long time ago. But drop me a line, on Private Topics or email.
Nope, wasn't the one. It wasn't long after that though. Maybe it was one of current the hot ideas that leadership had come up with to "move the Word?" ;-)
Quite possibly, JT. The girl was Apprentice Corps at the time, then went in-res. I heard there was some interest in what she had done with her play, and that it had been performed by others since.
LOL, I just had a couple of JW's come to my door to witness, with that combination of embarrassment and religious determination in their smiles and voices. How well I know the feeling from days past!
In 1995 the WC was told to go full time ministry. They were given a list of things to do - be completely debt free, etc. (I don't know the whole details because I wasn't WC). Some friends of ours did the whole nine yards and went to ROA 95 with the full expectation of being full time staff, having quit their jobs, being debt free (with help from us) and having to the best of their knowledge and ability fulfilled all of the requirements down to the last jot and tittle. Then, after they were given their assignment, LCM suddenly got revelation that they were not spiritual enough and dropped them from the WC, sending them back to the city where they'd lived in disgrace.
Another couple in Western WA owned a house which they were commanded of course to sell. They had a contract on their house but were to close after the ROA. They too were dropped and villified.
This was four good people. The anal orifice who ran the area where we lived was of course in good graces and stayed, along with his best buddy who did not sell his house but figured out how to pay for it quicker.
My feeling was a lot of the WC were scammed with that move, along with those of us to whom the survivors ranted about not having enough money and not being able to buy Starbucks or nice cosmetics, etc. Not of course that all did, but the ones we were serving under had a fit when money got tight.
Just my opinion.
WG
[This message was edited by Watered Garden on March 09, 2004 at 9:42.]
[This message was edited by Watered Garden on March 09, 2004 at 11:01.]
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rascal
Exactly juan...that cold sick feeling...realising that we weren`t allowed to have friends or activities...everything had to be viewed as an access to new people for the class...I felt devious...dirty
I remember feeling like a kid in high school again having to sell oranges door to door....only not having nearly so good a product..
If someone wasn`t involved or interested in twi...we were not to waste our time with them...not allowed to have them in our lives...that included family and life long friends...
Pets too...I was blasted...a top of the lungs ..screaming full blown face melting confrontation because I cared for the damaged sick animals from the pet shop that I worked at instead of having the vet put them down....my room ...in a house that I paid the rent....just a parakeet or two and a hamster...Gawd what a sinner.
But hey...how was THAT going to help me move the word...My horses...ditto...they simply took time and resources away from moving the word...
*Pius Pimp* describes EXACTLY how I felt once embarked upon the path of service to God....
Whats wierd is...I didn`t link the bleakness of the picture with it being wrong...just deeply discouraged that THIS was what God required of me for the rest of my life...it never dawned on me that it wasn`t necessary.
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rascal
Oh OH...what about the way corpes chalet...alla the private donations...thousands of free hours of donated time and labor invested by corpes because they were told that itt would be a place for them to stay when they visited hq????
The contributers NEVER got to set foot in it...
upon completion it was immediatly seized and converted into a *private* residence...grrrrr
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rascal
How about the locals around the root lacations...who spent one weekend a month on improving the campuses...free labor...because they were *our* property...they belonged to *us* the believer...our abs bought it...so we were told... it was our free labor...the way corpes labor that fixed those places up and made them habitable...only to here that twi sells em for pittance and pockets the cash....
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oldiesman
One of the things I never quite understood is why some folks feel that getting folks signed up for PFAL was an evil scam. What's evil about wanting folks to have the same knowledge of the bible you have? We thought PFAL was a great class that would help them, which was why we wanted folks signed up. Folks who didn't think it was a great class, acted differently.
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rascal
*We* did at first oldies...and then it got to be a push to have a *newbie* in every class...
If you DIDN`T have a new student...you were yelled at...*What the heck is wrong with your believing*? *Where did you Blow it*? *If you don`t have a new person in this class...you are a bump on the log spiritually*...you are no good to God*....all crap that I heard on various occasions....your spirituality rested DIRECTLY on how many students you provided....and after the class was run......it was started all over again......
Yeah...just LOVED turning folks on to THAT crap oldies.
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oldiesman
Are you referring to your experiences in the Way Corps?
The Way Corps people that I was involved with in New York didn't treat me like garbage, like your describing. Again I guess I was involved in a different ministry than you were.
Or perhaps different time periods. I have very little experiential knowledge of TWI-2.
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rascal
Oldies...I was involved in the same ministry, as you well know...from 79 through the early 90s...the stuff I listed happened as early as 1980...is that twi ONE enough for you?
The garbage started from the time I was a lowley twiggy throughtout tc...app corpes spouse corpes..in other words...at all levels of my involvement.
It wasn`t all corpes I met...many truly WERE wonderfull, caring Godly people...(my husband was one_) so I have NO doubt that you might have had caring compassionate leadership in your experience....that does NOT however mean that was the norm for the rest of the country... ugliness happened with enough consistancy with different individuals throughout my time involved that shows the idiocy not to be just isolated incidences....or administrations.
The worst of the corpes nazi`s, the ones that thought screaming and bullying into submition were acceptable forms of coersion...in my experience were (some of) the ones trained under vpw in the late 70s.
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excathedra
groucho, i liked your opening post. i can't remember if you used names, maybe that's why it's gone
but i wanted you to know it was oh so typical
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Sasquatch
Hey PR, great to see you again. Just a side note, thank you once again for all of the hard work you do to expose TWI and the other various cults.
God bless ya brother!
Sasquatch
p.s. Not to derail but hows the potential class action suit coming along? Is this still in the works?
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shazdancer
Oldies, here's a fine example of being scammed into hawking PFAL....
I was involved in a play that was written and directed by an apprentice Corps lady. Shortly before we were to perform it for the public, we were told we would go into the audience right at the end of the last scene, green cards in hand. There was NO mention made of this little addition to the final scene, until it was really too late to back out without causing a problem to the production. (I have no idea if it was the Corps person's idea to do this, or someone else's.)
It was embarrassing -- I had invited my employer and her husband to the event!
One more scam: signing up for "Recognized Corps," meaning we would have a 2-year training program, then not have to commit the rest of our lives to Corps assignments. Then being told after we graduated that "Doctor didn't really want to have a Recognized program," and have someone try to give me a Corps evaluation and require me to attend all Corps functions.
Regards,
Shaz
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Groucho
Excath...I edited it out myself. Even though I didn't use their names, my description of the events were too "detailed" ...I didn't want to embarrass some really fine people that were victimized by twi. I reconsidered after thinking about it and edited it out.
But not to worry, I've got a "million" of em...
;)-->
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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Groucho
Here's one that really stuck in my craw:
I entered the 10th corps after committing to a FOUR year program. This was quite clear going in. apprentice year, 2 years in residence, and one year "on the field"...That's what I signed up for, nothing more. That was the freakin' agreement that THEY drafted in writing!
First year in residence, about 6 months into the year, lcm announces at a "closed" meeting that the committment we made was for a LIFETIME! If we didn't understand that, we were not spiritual enough.
As I walked out of that meeting, I was mumbling to myself..."bull...., I only signed up for 4 years"...I felt that they had lied to me. I also felt that I was the only one who felt that way. Everybody else seemed to be grinnin'.
Taking assigments after corps graduation was optional...that also was in writing. Suddenly I felt very betrayed by twi...I knew for the first time that I wasn't gonna be stickin' around these folks much longer...
I guess we all had particular "points" at which we began realizing things were not right. I clearly saw how we were being manipulated...the seeds of discontent grew.
"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"
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HAPe4me
yeah, funny how doing a program got twisted into a fulltime volunteer slave position for life.
Thanks for your kindness Groucho. You da man, even if you did cop out on your lifetime corpse commitment. LOL
I loved being told I needed to take time off work and spend quality time with God, and oh yes, while I was at it, come up and help a branch coordinator fix up a cabin he found in the mountains that he was figuring on squatting in, in hopes nobody would notice. Oh yeah, I am in construction. Funny that the tire salesman guy wasn't told the same thing.
~HAPe4me
A candle loses nothing of its light by lighting another candle.
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JustThinking
Hey Shaz,
Could be coincidence but I was involved in something VERY similar. Maybe we know each other? I had coworkers too and it was very embarrassing.
JT
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JustThinking
Oldies,
I got in just at the end of TWI-1 and it seemed very entrenched at that point. Can't speak for times before that.
My impression is classes have always been TWI's main revenue stream. With very few people in TWI-2 holding high-income jobs and numbers dwindling, it would seem that would be even more true.
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Catcup
TWI scams:
Telling the apprentice 6th Way Corps that when they graduated they would have a bonafide, recognized bachelor's degree from The Way College of Emporia which would be an accredited institution.
Then later in our first year in residence, when they told us that The Way Corps was for training TWIG LEADERS.
When I signed up for The Way Corps, TWI represented to me that I would be training for upper leadership responsibilities that I had not yet held, and that when I graduated, I would hold an accredited degree.
TWI misrepresented The Way Corps program specifically to those of us who went into the 6th Corps, revealing only AFTER we were already in residence, that we would NOT have a recognized accredited degree, and that they were training us to be twig leaders.
And speaking of misrepresentation, with all due respect to the Cafe management, I have way more than 75 posts and did not "register" June 13 2002. I crossed over from WayDale. Whenvever that was. Whatever.
[This message was edited by Catcup on March 07, 2004 at 13:20.]
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Oakspear
The counting of the posts is from when the "new" GreaseSpot replaced the old one at EZBoard. Pretty much the first time you posted on the new board is when you "registered".
It doesn't matter if we turn to dust...guess I'll see you dancin' in the ruins tonight
Oakspear
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excathedra
scammie
we witness to someone they love us to death then we shove the green card in their face and they get turned off
they have itching ears
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Catcup
Thanks Oaks. Wondered why that was.
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shazdancer
Hi JT,
If your event was in Phoenix, circa 1983-ish, then we probably do know each other. Forgive me in advance if the name doesn't ring a bell -- it was a long time ago. But drop me a line, on Private Topics or email.
Shaz
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JustThinking
Shaz,
Nope, wasn't the one. It wasn't long after that though. Maybe it was one of current the hot ideas that leadership had come up with to "move the Word?" ;-)
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shazdancer
Quite possibly, JT. The girl was Apprentice Corps at the time, then went in-res. I heard there was some interest in what she had done with her play, and that it had been performed by others since.
LOL, I just had a couple of JW's come to my door to witness, with that combination of embarrassment and religious determination in their smiles and voices. How well I know the feeling from days past!
Regards,
Shaz
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Tom Strange
myseestorEx said:
Dangit! I always get those out of their proper order! Thanks sis, for reminding me of the 'proper' "Way"She's the kind of a girl that makes the "News of the World" Yes you could say she was attractively built.
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Watered Garden
In 1995 the WC was told to go full time ministry. They were given a list of things to do - be completely debt free, etc. (I don't know the whole details because I wasn't WC). Some friends of ours did the whole nine yards and went to ROA 95 with the full expectation of being full time staff, having quit their jobs, being debt free (with help from us) and having to the best of their knowledge and ability fulfilled all of the requirements down to the last jot and tittle. Then, after they were given their assignment, LCM suddenly got revelation that they were not spiritual enough and dropped them from the WC, sending them back to the city where they'd lived in disgrace.
Another couple in Western WA owned a house which they were commanded of course to sell. They had a contract on their house but were to close after the ROA. They too were dropped and villified.
This was four good people. The anal orifice who ran the area where we lived was of course in good graces and stayed, along with his best buddy who did not sell his house but figured out how to pay for it quicker.
My feeling was a lot of the WC were scammed with that move, along with those of us to whom the survivors ranted about not having enough money and not being able to buy Starbucks or nice cosmetics, etc. Not of course that all did, but the ones we were serving under had a fit when money got tight.
Just my opinion.
WG
[This message was edited by Watered Garden on March 09, 2004 at 9:42.]
[This message was edited by Watered Garden on March 09, 2004 at 11:01.]
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