OM--you are a real peice of work....let me ask you something...Do you have ANY idea what the definition of the word compassion is??? what it implies??? You are doing a great impression of an arm-chair qb, all talk, no real involement or....compassion....
hey look,
hey look, hey look at yourself, you haven't changed either...
hey look,
Feel free to define what compassion is I'm sure you're an expert.
feelin' picked on, are we, OM?? maybe you might learn to keep foot out of mouth...
I have written NO dictionairies, bud...look up the word, do a word study, ask Mike, whatever... you do NOT evidence it with your "prove it! prove it!!" stance.....you wanna make it personal with me, go ahead...YOU DO NOT GET IT, never have, don't look like you ever will...
what has that got to do with anything, OM??? where have I "abused" you?? speak up, don't mumble, son....
complain to Paw about my abuse, why doncha???
I am not the one who needs to defend a bunch of moronic klowns--you, however, seem to feel that need... what did Jesus say about anyone harming the little ones, OM??? why don't you defend THAT??? I am not the one casting doubt on good people who suffered like you APPARENTLY cannot and WILL NOT comprende.......
Alfakat you're misrepresenting the positions I've taken on this thread. Then you bring in the past, other positions I've taken about other issues and try to apply those to this one. Let's please keep the issues clear.
Really??? oh, by all means, clarify away....if I have misrepresented you, here is your chance--clear it up for me.
I say you do NOT understand what has been presented here--that members of the BOT KNEW what was going on in Alaska, knew the history of the guy AND did NOTHING...
And I stated that it's possible the Wierwille's didn't know what was going on. VP was out of the loop, was sick at the time with his glass eye and other things and having all his letters screened. Also, I have been informed (from someone who was in a position to know) that Don Wierwille didn't know about Coolwaters incident either.
So I have expressed my doubt to part of Coolwaters story and have reasonable knowledge that what I believe is possible. You can doubt my story, or you can doubt Coolwaters story, you can believe both, or doubt both.
But one thing is certain: there is no definite proof what Coolwaters said about all the Trustees knowing everything that was happening.
There I've said it twice now. I hope I won't be asked about this again.
hey OM... did your personal informant relate whether DeanDon "knew" about the affair he (DeanDon) had for years???
... that's refreshing... these guys... sheesh!
OH YEAH... I forgot...
OM: Prove it. Please prove that veepee and deanie don didn't know about the Alaska stuff... c'mon son.
and I want "definite proof" and "someone who was in a position to know" aint gonna do it. I don't accept that from you. You don't accept it from anybody.
I'm on the outside, looking inside, what do I see? Much confusion, disillusion, all around me.
I can't prove it...this is a board of opinions and I said my statement was "possible". In contrast to other statements made that are taken AS GOSPEL...
By the way, do you believe everything you read on the internet, without question?
quote:Also, I have been informed (from someone who was in a position to know) that Don Wierwille didn't know about Coolwaters incident either.
This is the one I want the proof on. This is a definitive statement. Not conjecture, not speculation. That's OK dude, I was just making the same demand of you that you make of us. If you're not up to it, that's OK.
and you already know that I don't believe everything I read on the internet... but that's the difference between painting with a fine bristled paint brush and just pouring the bucket on the canvas isn't it?
A lot of the people here, we know personally, they're not "the internet"... but, like I said, make your statements.. you don't need to back them up...
Like I said, I was just demanding proof from you like you do of us. It doesn't mean your statement is right or wrong. (pay close attention here) That's where we're different, you and I, because when I say it, and don't supply whatever "proof" it is that you want, you take the position that it's wrong, it didn't happen, etc.
I'm on the outside, looking inside, what do I see? Much confusion, disillusion, all around me.
quote:This is the one I want the proof on. This is a definitive statement. Not conjecture, not speculation. That's OK dude, I was just making the same demand of you that you make of us. If you're not up to it, that's OK.
Tom, as I said before, I can't prove the statement I made. The person I referred to doesn't want to be involved. So you'll just have to make up your own mind whether it's right or wrong.
If you don't believe what I say, I will take no offense -- because everyone is entitled to their own opinion. However I wish some others would extend to me the same courtesy.
Rascal, I never called Coolwaters a liar. Please stop accusing me of calling someone a liar if I happen not to agree with all or part of their statements. You've done that more than once.
Have you ever served on a jury? Jurors get to hear conflicting testimony, and it's up to them to decide what they want to believe, and what they don't. This board is a lot like that. We decide for ourselves what we want to believe based upon varied experiences.
Stop calling ME an accuser...YOU were the one that said there were some parts of cool waters story that YOU didn`t agree with...YOU!
I want you to tell me which part of cool waters story, in YOUR opinion are not true....
What part? that her kids were molested by leaders?? that they intimidated her? broke into her home? tried to stop her from reporting ? that they tried to prevent her from leaving? That vpw wrote her a letter? that lcm wrote her a letter? that Donna wrote her a letter? that these SAME leaders had been placed in her area in a place of authority BY twi AFTER it was discovered they were pedophiles???
which part of cw`s post EXACTLY do you disagree with oldies??
If you say what they post isn`true...than you are calling cw a liar ...plain and simple.
I understand EXACTLY how this board works....
I am also aware of your methods of trying to discredit posters.....for some reason in order to make twi look good.
Ummm WHAT was the topic again???? Oh yeah .... kids being abused in twi........it happened...twi wasn`t a nice place for kids.
My statements stand, OM--you don't want reality to intrude on your memories--if YOU think I lack compassion for saying that, you go right ahead and think that...no skin off my knee... your position regarding your time in twi is crystal-clear after your time on here, the old GS and Waydale--yes, I remember you from there even if you did change your handle. Your "story" is the same....
Okay let me put some facts on the table; And a warning this will be a long post
1 CoolWaters and I go back a long way--Our Famiies LIVED TOGETHER--What she says about Pediophiles and and Adultry and all the depravity in The Alaska TWI of the 1980's IS THE TRUTH
2) My children were sexually molested by OUR TC repeatedly--too teriffied to speak of it until they were adults --still reaping the pain and shame--the tears shed in the last 6 years have been hard and bitter as truth comes to light in my and my children's lives
3) the TC in question was finally arrested for molestation outside of TWI and Convicted. He was sentenced to 50 years he served THREE, and then was welcomed back by TWI leadership with OPEN ARMS. You don't think there was some string pulling there?? the ONLY way he could have gotten out so soon was if someone vouched for him and guarenteed that they would be responsible for him. TWI s problem was the regular Joe Belivers didn't want this person anywhere near their children.
4) TWI sent he and his wife back to Ohio--sent them to live with a TC and his family--sent my ex there too. Then everything hit the fan--Turns out that the new TC's had a family in their TWIG (no surprise there LOL) that had a son--Suddenly this family quit TWI and turned their backs on a many year friendship much to astonishment of the TC.
I've communicated with that TC over the years--He is a good person who truly tried to do God's work. Imagine his Shock, Horror, Astonsishment when He found out that his Houseguest (forced on him by TWI Leadership) was in fact the TC who had molested that couples son many years before. TWI leadership had convinced those parents that they shouldn't go to the authorities that he would be handled internally and appropriate punishment would be meted out.
5) the punishment Meted out was he was sent to Alaska, no civil authorities were ever told, THe USAF was not told AND HE WAS GIVEN A NEW TWIG IN ALASKA!!!!!!!!!!!
6) he was arrested in 1987 IN 1994 he and his wife were dropped from ACTIVE Corps Status. He has NEVER been Marked and Avoided
So for all those of you out there who have warm fuzzy thoughts about TWI let me make something really clear
VICTOR PAUL WIERWILLE KNEW AND CONDONED
LOY CRAIG MARTINDALE KNOWS AND CONDONED
DONNA MARTINDALE KNOWS AND CONDONED
ROSALIE RIVENBARK KNOWS AND CONDONED
HARVY PLATIG KNOWS AND CONDONED
GOT THE PICTURE!!!!!!!
And if you don't believe me print this post off and take it to "leadership" see what they say--It should be interesting--
tell them Maureen Dilley of Anchorage sends her complements
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Catcup
I, too am new to this particular thread. I spent several hours this morning looking through it. While I was never a part of any "initiation" ceremony (tongue in cheek or otherwise) that Evan describ
oldiesman
hey look,
hey look, hey look at yourself, you haven't changed either...
hey look,
Feel free to define what compassion is I'm sure you're an expert.
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alfakat
TS--- a misty one?? with Babs singin the title tune?
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Tom Strange
"a misty one"... Aflakcat! that makes me think of BEER! Get over here!
I'm on the outside, looking inside, what do I see? Much confusion, disillusion, all around me.
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alfakat
feelin' picked on, are we, OM?? maybe you might learn to keep foot out of mouth...
I have written NO dictionairies, bud...look up the word, do a word study, ask Mike, whatever... you do NOT evidence it with your "prove it! prove it!!" stance.....you wanna make it personal with me, go ahead...YOU DO NOT GET IT, never have, don't look like you ever will...
go ahead, prove me wrong....
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oldiesman
You're certainly the epitome of compassion.
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alfakat
what has that got to do with anything, OM??? where have I "abused" you?? speak up, don't mumble, son....
complain to Paw about my abuse, why doncha???
I am not the one who needs to defend a bunch of moronic klowns--you, however, seem to feel that need... what did Jesus say about anyone harming the little ones, OM??? why don't you defend THAT??? I am not the one casting doubt on good people who suffered like you APPARENTLY cannot and WILL NOT comprende.......
compassion, my AS*!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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oldiesman
Alfakat you're misrepresenting the positions I've taken on this thread. Then you bring in the past, other positions I've taken about other issues and try to apply those to this one. Let's please keep the issues clear.
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alfakat
Really??? oh, by all means, clarify away....if I have misrepresented you, here is your chance--clear it up for me.
I say you do NOT understand what has been presented here--that members of the BOT KNEW what was going on in Alaska, knew the history of the guy AND did NOTHING...
ok, your turn.....
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oldiesman
And I stated that it's possible the Wierwille's didn't know what was going on. VP was out of the loop, was sick at the time with his glass eye and other things and having all his letters screened. Also, I have been informed (from someone who was in a position to know) that Don Wierwille didn't know about Coolwaters incident either.
So I have expressed my doubt to part of Coolwaters story and have reasonable knowledge that what I believe is possible. You can doubt my story, or you can doubt Coolwaters story, you can believe both, or doubt both.
But one thing is certain: there is no definite proof what Coolwaters said about all the Trustees knowing everything that was happening.
There I've said it twice now. I hope I won't be asked about this again.
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Tom Strange
hey OM... did your personal informant relate whether DeanDon "knew" about the affair he (DeanDon) had for years???
... that's refreshing... these guys... sheesh!
OH YEAH... I forgot...
OM: Prove it. Please prove that veepee and deanie don didn't know about the Alaska stuff... c'mon son.
and I want "definite proof" and "someone who was in a position to know" aint gonna do it. I don't accept that from you. You don't accept it from anybody.
I'm on the outside, looking inside, what do I see? Much confusion, disillusion, all around me.
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oldiesman
Tom,
I can't prove it...this is a board of opinions and I said my statement was "possible". In contrast to other statements made that are taken AS GOSPEL...
By the way, do you believe everything you read on the internet, without question?
Didn't think so.
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Tom Strange
OM said:
This is the one I want the proof on. This is a definitive statement. Not conjecture, not speculation. That's OK dude, I was just making the same demand of you that you make of us. If you're not up to it, that's OK.and you already know that I don't believe everything I read on the internet... but that's the difference between painting with a fine bristled paint brush and just pouring the bucket on the canvas isn't it?
A lot of the people here, we know personally, they're not "the internet"... but, like I said, make your statements.. you don't need to back them up...
Like I said, I was just demanding proof from you like you do of us. It doesn't mean your statement is right or wrong. (pay close attention here) That's where we're different, you and I, because when I say it, and don't supply whatever "proof" it is that you want, you take the position that it's wrong, it didn't happen, etc.
I'm on the outside, looking inside, what do I see? Much confusion, disillusion, all around me.
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rascal
Just WHAT part of cool waters story do you doubt oldies???
On just exactly WHICH point are you declaring her a liar?
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oldiesman
Tom, as I said before, I can't prove the statement I made. The person I referred to doesn't want to be involved. So you'll just have to make up your own mind whether it's right or wrong.
If you don't believe what I say, I will take no offense -- because everyone is entitled to their own opinion. However I wish some others would extend to me the same courtesy.
Rascal, I never called Coolwaters a liar. Please stop accusing me of calling someone a liar if I happen not to agree with all or part of their statements. You've done that more than once.
Have you ever served on a jury? Jurors get to hear conflicting testimony, and it's up to them to decide what they want to believe, and what they don't. This board is a lot like that. We decide for ourselves what we want to believe based upon varied experiences.
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rascal
Stop calling ME an accuser...YOU were the one that said there were some parts of cool waters story that YOU didn`t agree with...YOU!
I want you to tell me which part of cool waters story, in YOUR opinion are not true....
What part? that her kids were molested by leaders?? that they intimidated her? broke into her home? tried to stop her from reporting ? that they tried to prevent her from leaving? That vpw wrote her a letter? that lcm wrote her a letter? that Donna wrote her a letter? that these SAME leaders had been placed in her area in a place of authority BY twi AFTER it was discovered they were pedophiles???
which part of cw`s post EXACTLY do you disagree with oldies??
If you say what they post isn`true...than you are calling cw a liar ...plain and simple.
I understand EXACTLY how this board works....
I am also aware of your methods of trying to discredit posters.....for some reason in order to make twi look good.
Ummm WHAT was the topic again???? Oh yeah .... kids being abused in twi........it happened...twi wasn`t a nice place for kids.
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oldiesman
This is part of the Greasespot experience.
If I say something nice about TWI, someone may discredit what I say, to make TWI look bad.
Same method. It's all part of the experience.
Perhaps we should move onto some new business.
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rascal
Not till you take care of this business....WHAT part of cws post is a lie?
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CoolWaters
rascal, I think he's dismissed everyone on this thread.
אַאַאַאַאַאַאַאַאַאַאַאַאַ
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alfakat
you noticed that, too, didja, CW????
My statements stand, OM--you don't want reality to intrude on your memories--if YOU think I lack compassion for saying that, you go right ahead and think that...no skin off my knee... your position regarding your time in twi is crystal-clear after your time on here, the old GS and Waydale--yes, I remember you from there even if you did change your handle. Your "story" is the same....
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excathedra
(((((hi alfie)))))
♥
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Tom Strange
what's it all about?
I'm on the outside, looking inside, what do I see? Much confusion, disillusion, all around me.
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CoolWaters
Bumping up.
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templelady
Okay let me put some facts on the table; And a warning this will be a long post
1 CoolWaters and I go back a long way--Our Famiies LIVED TOGETHER--What she says about Pediophiles and and Adultry and all the depravity in The Alaska TWI of the 1980's IS THE TRUTH
2) My children were sexually molested by OUR TC repeatedly--too teriffied to speak of it until they were adults --still reaping the pain and shame--the tears shed in the last 6 years have been hard and bitter as truth comes to light in my and my children's lives
3) the TC in question was finally arrested for molestation outside of TWI and Convicted. He was sentenced to 50 years he served THREE, and then was welcomed back by TWI leadership with OPEN ARMS. You don't think there was some string pulling there?? the ONLY way he could have gotten out so soon was if someone vouched for him and guarenteed that they would be responsible for him. TWI s problem was the regular Joe Belivers didn't want this person anywhere near their children.
4) TWI sent he and his wife back to Ohio--sent them to live with a TC and his family--sent my ex there too. Then everything hit the fan--Turns out that the new TC's had a family in their TWIG (no surprise there LOL) that had a son--Suddenly this family quit TWI and turned their backs on a many year friendship much to astonishment of the TC.
I've communicated with that TC over the years--He is a good person who truly tried to do God's work. Imagine his Shock, Horror, Astonsishment when He found out that his Houseguest (forced on him by TWI Leadership) was in fact the TC who had molested that couples son many years before. TWI leadership had convinced those parents that they shouldn't go to the authorities that he would be handled internally and appropriate punishment would be meted out.
5) the punishment Meted out was he was sent to Alaska, no civil authorities were ever told, THe USAF was not told AND HE WAS GIVEN A NEW TWIG IN ALASKA!!!!!!!!!!!
6) he was arrested in 1987 IN 1994 he and his wife were dropped from ACTIVE Corps Status. He has NEVER been Marked and Avoided
So for all those of you out there who have warm fuzzy thoughts about TWI let me make something really clear
VICTOR PAUL WIERWILLE KNEW AND CONDONED
LOY CRAIG MARTINDALE KNOWS AND CONDONED
DONNA MARTINDALE KNOWS AND CONDONED
ROSALIE RIVENBARK KNOWS AND CONDONED
HARVY PLATIG KNOWS AND CONDONED
GOT THE PICTURE!!!!!!!
And if you don't believe me print this post off and take it to "leadership" see what they say--It should be interesting--
tell them Maureen Dilley of Anchorage sends her complements
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CoolWaters
Bump.
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