After having so much trouble getting Michael to finish his paper pushing I had a friend of mine who does evaluations on how children work best she discovered that Michael is what she called a vocal learner rather than a paper pusher (he hated writing and had trouble putting things on paper but if allowed to vocalize his work instead of all that writing he was very smart but if he had to write things down he didn't do well. He had trouble even doing his work nevermind finishing it.
He was then tested at school at my request and alot of bit*hing I finally got them to do it and they were amazed at how smart he was when allowed to vocalize his work. BUT according to them "they don't do things that way" even if it helps the child so he was caught between a rock and a hard place. In the 5th grade we put him in a wonderful Baptist private school that allowed him to vocalize and and his grades went way up. Unfortunatley after 2 years we found that we could no longer afford to pay them anymore so had to put him back in the public schools and the junior high he went to to was right in the middle of a real bad area and he went downhill from there until as I said before he quit going to school, and now after getting his GED he is graduating from college tomorrow and boy are we proud of him.
I guess I know what CW is talking about when she said kids have different ways of learning. He is now a computor architeck and draftsman and already has a good paying job. something like $20-22 bucks an hour to start and is in the process of buying a home and planning his marriage.
Sometimes we just have to let them learn in thier own way even tho we may not like it, it work for him and his older brother John. Love ya Abi and it sounds like you got a good handle on it.
quote: Is there a time coming sooner than next hear in grade 1 where reading groups are formed according to ability? If so, his boredom and lack of work will probably dissapear when that happenes and he has a reasonable challenge there.
Yay Krys!! Was thinking the same thing. :)--> What cha think Abigail?? Could they give him extra material to read, once he gets all the stickers on his assigned work?? Might give him the incentive to "push the paper" a little faster, if he knew he could get extra things to read out of it.
I spent some time with his teacher yesterday, helping her prep for the upcoming weeks and we talked some more. Jacob is reading at a level nine, no one else in the class is above a level three. I love the idea of putting him with kids who are at the same ability level. I think I will ask if there is anyway he can go next door to the first grade classroom, just for reading.
His teacher is as much at a loss over how to help him as I am. And she agrees, the paperwork really isn't that important this year, her concern is that it will be much more important next year. I still think, even in first grade, getting that upset about paperwork is silly as long as the kids are learning. I'm also not really willing to get too worried about next year until it gets here. My focus right now is simply to get through this year with Jacob viewing school as a positive experience and not a negative one.
When my boy was in second grade every one in the class was on meds EXEPT my boy.
There was a girl that the principle had to wrestle to the ground because she was thowing furniture, yea she was carrying a big one... ;)-->
My son was freaked out.
This was his second time around as a second grader, We had him repeat second grade because the teacher in first grade said he was not paying attention, he was doing his own thing.
we had him tested for ADD ADHD etc. etc...
We thought that by holding him back a grade, he could "catch up". HA HA
I fed him organic vegetarian food, and gave him herbs to help him concentrate.
He is 16 now and still has the same problem..
Oh well,
I tried,
I tried real hard to be a good mother and give him the best food,(I made his lunch every day healthy vegetarian stuff), the best education, he just doesn't want it.
He wants to do what HE WANTS to do.
So I would not worry.
Looking back, I waisted WAY TOO MUCH time in schools, talking to teachers, talking to councelors, talking to principals, talking to Deans, going to conferences, trying to help my son, having the teachers send notes home, having a journal about his homework, to no avial. Nothing I or the school system did, helped. It was a big waiste of time.
Las year, my son had the WONDERFUL opportunity to attend Las Vegas Academy of Arts and Music.
You have to audition to be in this school.
You can't get in just because the school system is required to have a certain amount of minorities. IT is a Magnet school with certain requirements.. You have to PROOVE yourself.
He was accepted because he happened to have the required grade point average after 8th grade, and at the audition they saw that he had talent.
Because he chose to not do his homework, and his grade point average was off, (he had much more important, fun things to do), he was not able to return, and now he is in a Ghetto school that locks them in. :(-->
:(-->
His choice completely.
(We are thinking of moving to a small red-neck town to get him away from the Ghetto sitaution and get us away from the big city, so he will not have the negative influences of ths icky school)
If he wants to pay attention he will, if not he won't.
There is nothing you can do.
If you give him drugs he will comply, and do exaclty as he is told. Like a good robot. :o-->
But I did not want to bail my son out that way.
Kids that take those drugs, (ritalin etc), have difficulty later in life KEEPING and MAINTAINING relationships, for one, and have other difficulties in life, because they did not have to learn to comply the normal way, the drug made them into a compliant robot.
And then of course you have the instances like Columbine where the kids were on drugs cause Mommy and Daddy have no clue as to what their kids are doing, so they did what they wanted.. and killed 13 people.
Colombine ws NOT the only school that had a murders, where the kid was on drugs that the DR. prescribed. :(-->
For ADD or ADHD..
Had I had the money at that time (first grade, when we saw that he was not doing anything he was supposed to be doing like the rest of the kids), I would have put him in Montesorri, that would have been great for him.
We checked the Montessori school out and saw that this would be wonderful for our boy. :)-->
He would have been able to grow at his level in each subject. I really feel he would be different today, but who knows....
But only well-off people get the luxury of having their child in Montessori.
We were extremely poor in Fla, it was a very bad scene for us.
If we had the money then, that we have now, we would have had him in.
They wanted $300 a month and that was soo far over what we had, that it was sadly unavailble to us.
I truly truly regret that we could not afford to have him in that system. :(-->
If you can afford to take him to a Montissori school go for it!!
Val - I had my children in a Montessori school, but it closed at the end of last year. Additionally, while both my children certainly learned more in the Montessori setting, my oldest son had a lot of behavioral problems. This year, in a traditional setting, my oldest son is doing great. Whether that is due to the structure of the traditional setting or simply because of his medication and the fact that he is a year older, I don't know.
But it is because my oldest is doing so well that I am not ready to just move my kids to a new school. First I will exhaust the options available within the school they now attend. If that doesn't work then I will have to look at other schools.
Now, regarding this . . . .
"If you give him drugs he will comply, and do exaclty as he is told. Like a good robot.
But I did not want to bail my son out that way.
With all due respect, some kids truly do need the assistance of medication. My oldest son takes Strattera and it has had an amazing impact on him. Prior to taking this medication he could not sit in a chair through a fifteen minute meal. Additionally, he couldn't read because he couldn't focus on the words on the page. Now he can sit through a meal and is reading above his age level.
He is NOT a good robot or a zombie. I have taken great care to monitor his dosage levels to make sure that doesn't happen. He is still plenty energetic and has lots and lots of spunk. The medication did not change his personality - trust me he is no more compliant now than he was prior to taking medication. He is simply better able to control his impulses and focus.
However, my youngest son is not hyperactive in the least little bit. I do not believe he needs medication, he simply needs the proper challenge for his ability and some time to mature enough to handle the boredom of pushing paper. Also, I suspect with the weather being cold and the kids being kept indoors more - he needs an outlet to burn off some of the energey all five year old boys have.
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wyteduv58
After having so much trouble getting Michael to finish his paper pushing I had a friend of mine who does evaluations on how children work best she discovered that Michael is what she called a vocal learner rather than a paper pusher (he hated writing and had trouble putting things on paper but if allowed to vocalize his work instead of all that writing he was very smart but if he had to write things down he didn't do well. He had trouble even doing his work nevermind finishing it.
He was then tested at school at my request and alot of bit*hing I finally got them to do it and they were amazed at how smart he was when allowed to vocalize his work. BUT according to them "they don't do things that way" even if it helps the child so he was caught between a rock and a hard place. In the 5th grade we put him in a wonderful Baptist private school that allowed him to vocalize and and his grades went way up. Unfortunatley after 2 years we found that we could no longer afford to pay them anymore so had to put him back in the public schools and the junior high he went to to was right in the middle of a real bad area and he went downhill from there until as I said before he quit going to school, and now after getting his GED he is graduating from college tomorrow and boy are we proud of him.
I guess I know what CW is talking about when she said kids have different ways of learning. He is now a computor architeck and draftsman and already has a good paying job. something like $20-22 bucks an hour to start and is in the process of buying a home and planning his marriage.
Sometimes we just have to let them learn in thier own way even tho we may not like it, it work for him and his older brother John. Love ya Abi and it sounds like you got a good handle on it.
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excathedra
congratulations Michael !!!!!! and to his wonderful parents too !!!!!!!
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dmiller
Yay Krys!! Was thinking the same thing.
:)--> What cha think Abigail?? Could they give him extra material to read, once he gets all the stickers on his assigned work?? Might give him the incentive to "push the paper" a little faster, if he knew he could get extra things to read out of it.
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Abigail
I spent some time with his teacher yesterday, helping her prep for the upcoming weeks and we talked some more. Jacob is reading at a level nine, no one else in the class is above a level three. I love the idea of putting him with kids who are at the same ability level. I think I will ask if there is anyway he can go next door to the first grade classroom, just for reading.
His teacher is as much at a loss over how to help him as I am. And she agrees, the paperwork really isn't that important this year, her concern is that it will be much more important next year. I still think, even in first grade, getting that upset about paperwork is silly as long as the kids are learning. I'm also not really willing to get too worried about next year until it gets here. My focus right now is simply to get through this year with Jacob viewing school as a positive experience and not a negative one.
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valerie52
I also will highly suggest you say NO to drugs.
When my boy was in second grade every one in the class was on meds EXEPT my boy.
There was a girl that the principle had to wrestle to the ground because she was thowing furniture, yea she was carrying a big one...
;)-->
My son was freaked out.
This was his second time around as a second grader, We had him repeat second grade because the teacher in first grade said he was not paying attention, he was doing his own thing.
we had him tested for ADD ADHD etc. etc...
We thought that by holding him back a grade, he could "catch up". HA HA
I fed him organic vegetarian food, and gave him herbs to help him concentrate.
He is 16 now and still has the same problem..
Oh well,
I tried,
I tried real hard to be a good mother and give him the best food,(I made his lunch every day healthy vegetarian stuff), the best education, he just doesn't want it.
He wants to do what HE WANTS to do.
So I would not worry.
Looking back, I waisted WAY TOO MUCH time in schools, talking to teachers, talking to councelors, talking to principals, talking to Deans, going to conferences, trying to help my son, having the teachers send notes home, having a journal about his homework, to no avial. Nothing I or the school system did, helped. It was a big waiste of time.
Las year, my son had the WONDERFUL opportunity to attend Las Vegas Academy of Arts and Music.
You have to audition to be in this school.
You can't get in just because the school system is required to have a certain amount of minorities. IT is a Magnet school with certain requirements.. You have to PROOVE yourself.
He was accepted because he happened to have the required grade point average after 8th grade, and at the audition they saw that he had talent.
Because he chose to not do his homework, and his grade point average was off, (he had much more important, fun things to do), he was not able to return, and now he is in a Ghetto school that locks them in.
:(-->
His choice completely.
(We are thinking of moving to a small red-neck town to get him away from the Ghetto sitaution and get us away from the big city, so he will not have the negative influences of ths icky school)
If he wants to pay attention he will, if not he won't.
There is nothing you can do.
If you give him drugs he will comply, and do exaclty as he is told. Like a good robot.
:o-->
But I did not want to bail my son out that way.
Kids that take those drugs, (ritalin etc), have difficulty later in life KEEPING and MAINTAINING relationships, for one, and have other difficulties in life, because they did not have to learn to comply the normal way, the drug made them into a compliant robot.
And then of course you have the instances like Columbine where the kids were on drugs cause Mommy and Daddy have no clue as to what their kids are doing, so they did what they wanted.. and killed 13 people.
Colombine ws NOT the only school that had a murders, where the kid was on drugs that the DR. prescribed.
:(-->
For ADD or ADHD..
Had I had the money at that time (first grade, when we saw that he was not doing anything he was supposed to be doing like the rest of the kids), I would have put him in Montesorri, that would have been great for him.
We checked the Montessori school out and saw that this would be wonderful for our boy.
:)-->
He would have been able to grow at his level in each subject. I really feel he would be different today, but who knows....
But only well-off people get the luxury of having their child in Montessori.
We were extremely poor in Fla, it was a very bad scene for us.
If we had the money then, that we have now, we would have had him in.
They wanted $300 a month and that was soo far over what we had, that it was sadly unavailble to us.
I truly truly regret that we could not afford to have him in that system.
:(-->
If you can afford to take him to a Montissori school go for it!!
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Abigail
Val - I had my children in a Montessori school, but it closed at the end of last year. Additionally, while both my children certainly learned more in the Montessori setting, my oldest son had a lot of behavioral problems. This year, in a traditional setting, my oldest son is doing great. Whether that is due to the structure of the traditional setting or simply because of his medication and the fact that he is a year older, I don't know.
But it is because my oldest is doing so well that I am not ready to just move my kids to a new school. First I will exhaust the options available within the school they now attend. If that doesn't work then I will have to look at other schools.
Now, regarding this . . . .
"If you give him drugs he will comply, and do exaclty as he is told. Like a good robot.
But I did not want to bail my son out that way.
With all due respect, some kids truly do need the assistance of medication. My oldest son takes Strattera and it has had an amazing impact on him. Prior to taking this medication he could not sit in a chair through a fifteen minute meal. Additionally, he couldn't read because he couldn't focus on the words on the page. Now he can sit through a meal and is reading above his age level.
He is NOT a good robot or a zombie. I have taken great care to monitor his dosage levels to make sure that doesn't happen. He is still plenty energetic and has lots and lots of spunk. The medication did not change his personality - trust me he is no more compliant now than he was prior to taking medication. He is simply better able to control his impulses and focus.
However, my youngest son is not hyperactive in the least little bit. I do not believe he needs medication, he simply needs the proper challenge for his ability and some time to mature enough to handle the boredom of pushing paper. Also, I suspect with the weather being cold and the kids being kept indoors more - he needs an outlet to burn off some of the energey all five year old boys have.
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