Type (A) ??? Would it matter? How would THAT have any bearing on how the *word* was used to control WHATEVER personality I happen to have been??
For your information...I have been trying to TELL you that *I* wasn`t allowed the luxury of having any particular personality type...if it wasn`t explicitly laid out in proverbs concerning the virtuous woman....my leaders generally TOLD me what/how/when I was allowed to think .
How does MY personality type have anything to do with the *word* being used to force us to do twi/leaders whims? .... Could it be that in now pointing a finger at my *type* you are employing yet another means of redirecting the focus from the actual culprits and situations being discussed?
all the time people tell me their troubles and even though i haven't experienced the same, i say something like "gosh, i'm sorry that happened to you, i'm sorry you're hurt"
i was thinking about something where the word was used to control people or at least make them feel like total crap
two different girlfriends of mine worked switchboard. i don't want to get into detail detail, but if wierwille called, and they could not find whoever he needed right away, ohmygod
one of them disconnected him by accident once. wierwille wanted her thrown out of the corps immediately. he said she was spiritually asleep at the switch and on and on and on....
she had no business being there.... dah dah dah.... matter of life and death and all kinds of crazy s.hit
My heart broke for you all who have suffered through TWI control and manipulation...I am truly sorry for what you have gone through.
Did TWI use its perverted doctrines to control/manipulate?
Most certainly.
Think about it. If you want that is. Think about their slogans and how their one (or two liners) contained a whole doctrine/teaching on what they wanted us to DO.
Put God first equates anything that could stop you from giving your all, financially, emotionally, mentally, physically, and every othe 'lly'....missing family weddings, getting rid of family or friends, jobs, careers, homes, jobs, pets...you name it.
And I know many women in TWI who were married and had a comittment to go into the Corps or back into it residence who got pregnant and were counseled to abort because it's
THE WORD THE WORD THE WORD THE WORD!! The word was what ever your leader told you it was.
It's spiritual--don't question it, just acknowledge it's over you head and do what leadership tells you to do. No if's and's or but's just march ye little soldier.
The Word of God is the Will of God and the only people who knew that and understands it are TWI so we will translate it for you and tell you what to do or think. Updated version..The Word Is. Yeah, makes great sense.
Someone else mentioned already but that verse from Duetoronomy...about paying our vows...heard it in WOW training to the point afterwards we all bleated the greatest blah blah is for WOW's to pay their vows...translated, even though your WOW brother will hit you and keep coping a feel off you and your lousy bugger of a area coordinator lets him stay on the field...damn it...the devil gonna get you sister if you don't stay out the field and take that crap (not seeing the forest-trees prevented me from seeing the devil 'already' got me.
Then how about all that devil, greasespot crap? What did those slogans insinuate???
Control? Hell yes. Dang, they tried to make us outright petried of EVEN thinking about doing anything different than what they wanted done.
quote: I know now, though it has taken me a while to figure it out beyond a doubt, my ex would have been abusive in or out of TWI. That he was abusive is his fault. That they exacerbated the problem and prevented him from getting help (worldly counsellors not being believers and all) is TWI's fault.
I also know now, I allowed it to happen. I played a role in the "dance". However, I would never have played the role as well or as long, if my heart had not been so invested in God. I believed what they taught was God's instruction to us. I put up with it because I thought I was doing "The Word". This is very much TWI's fault, because they are the ones who taught me that.
I also would have never stayed with my abusive husbands as long as I did were it not for that nagging feeling that God would bless me if I just got it right.... When I finally realized that I WAS believing, I WAS doing it right, and it WASN'T working, I got out!
Okay, funny story here. First ex and I were "assigned" to AZ, to be near a guy who was supposed to help him. That guy left the field after just a few months -- so much for the "heavy revvy" on our assignment! Hubby was still drinking, still abusing, I hadn't had a decent night's sleep in days, so I went to leadership for help.
LC's wife takes one look at me and says, "Well, if you'd wash your hair and make yourself look nice, he'd want to come home to you." Ohhh, so his lifetime of alcohol abuse (long before he met me) can be cured with a little Head and Shoulders!!!! Silly me for not seeing the error of MY ways.
Even my drinking husband, when he was sober, was the first to say she was stupid to think that my flat hair had anything to do with his problems.
Note to Oldies: Please understand, I was raised to be pretty independent. My parents insisted I attend college, I was never raised to feel that I was inferior as a girl. Yet I was momentarily flummoxed by the LC wife's statement. I should have told her where to stuff it, in love of course! But I wanted to be a good child of God, and I had been fed stuff about "submit to your husband" and then I would be blessed. The "miserable comforter" was an older Corps, a rev LC's wife. I'll admit, it didn't take long to reject her statement as bunk, but imagine if I wasn't so independent, or if the suggestion was more plausible....
That is terrible ex...I heard of stuff like that happening .... did you ever hear from the other girl? How awfull she must have felt having the mog declair her to be worthless....some never recovered once declared *spiritual* waste by the powers that be.
How about the face meltings that we meekly sat and accepted? I am talking about the insane screaming spit flying two inches from your face rantings.......behavior that is not acceptable anywhere else...
We sat and TOOK it meekly because we had been taught that the *word* demanded it of one who wanted to grow....that if we didn`t we would be hard hearted...not meek ...if we retaliated in any way it only proved their point that we were *posessed*.
Those were horrible..... but I sat and let them do it....because I loved God and thought that was what he wanted.
Geeze after one screaming session I remember that I actualy THANKED the lc for loving me enough to set me straight....sigh.........geeze how freakin controlled is THAT??
Any other situation n we wouldda either ripped their heads off or had em arrested.
We sat and TOOK it meekly because we had been taught that the *word* demanded it of one who wanted to grow....that if we didn`t we would be hard hearted...not meek ...
Oh GEEZE shaz.... your HAIR?? I so understand what you are talking about....trying to make him happy enough to want to be *nice*
I had been trying to apply the ministry formula for wives for years...I totally understand your frustration...I like you had a drunken at time abusive spouse....the shame of never being good enough was terrible...I had no self esteem...it never dawned on me that ALL of lifes problems were NOT my fault....
Shoot nothing was ever good enough... No matter how hard I tried...I finally realised that either God didn`t work or the stupid standard of the *word* that I had been taught was wrong...I put up with that crap because I was taught by my leaders that God demanded this of me....would *bless* me for following and submitting to the spouse...that kids would be *blessed* as long as they *obeyed* daddy...
Well it was all a lie...it wasn`t untill i got damn rebellious and took a stand that life changed for the better.
The LAST thing an alcoholic needs is a meek little doormat pleading with them to act a little nicer.... .
[This message was edited by rascal on January 17, 2004 at 0:04.]
Rascal, I hear ya loud and clear. You had your own experiences, just as I and everyone else in here did. Some of us were abused mentally,sexually etc. and some only one or the other. But it WAS OUR experience. and we have every right to be mad as hell. I was mentally abused by leaders from branch all the way up to and including Loy. AND I TOOK IT.
To be fair I also had some very loving leaders but by the mid 80's they were almost extinct. And even some of the good one's went bad, I think because they also were abused by thier leaders.
I wanted to leave TWI 5 years before we actually did it, because I foolishly thought my husband would leave me if I left and he was/is such a good person I would rather take thier crap than loose my hubby. What I didn't know was that he was thinking the same thing but we failed to communicate it to each other.
It took our son running away from home to escape BC's abuse to get us to the point to leave, especially they blamed us for his running away, and of course lock box had all but dissapered by then and everyone knew what happened the next day.
well we decided the night of the inquisition (thats what I call it)when we were blamed for everything from ww1 to the presant, we left twi that night and went looking for our son so he could come back home and feel safe.
I also was abused by a BC we once had, it was physical abuse, nothing to write home about but he grabbed my arm and shoved me up against the fridge and told me to sit down when I just went to get a drink of water to keep from coughing all night er session in our own house. My hubby never laid a hand on me and neither did my dad so I was ashamed thinking how bad I was to be manhandled. I never told anyone about this incident beaczuse I thought I had it coming for some reason? I finally told my hubby a couple of years ago and he said if I had told him when it happened we would have left immediatly. He and My son's were so mad that they didn't get the chance to deck this guy that it was by then almost laughable, but I now wish I would have spoken out, I would have loved to see that. HEE HEE
This is only part of my story, but it is MY STORY. and it happened to me.
Dovey....proud owner of two low riders...Dovey's Doxies......
Not only did "leadership" use "The Word" to attempt to control (often succeeding), but in marriages, they would tell each spouse different things.
Very seldom would anyone who was counselling my ex-wife and I talk to us together. When they did, it was different than what they told each of us separately.
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice...but in practice there is
That is so insane......I remember when the *standard* was to never talk to either spouse alone.
Guys ........ what those supposed authorities did to you wonderfull people is criminal.
It is really strange how they tried to bust up SOME marriages...and yet they required that others remain in abusive marriages.
Dove, I am glad that you and your spouse had the resiliancy to withstand the pressures.
Sadly Oak, yours is but one of many marriages that I know of that collapsed as a direct result of pressure by leadership leaning on one spouse or the other.... councelling one spouse that the other wasn`t *spiritual* enough* or wasn`t doing the *word* to their satisfaction.
I know some who felt they had no choice...again it was presented as a choice between their spouse or God your spiritual duty verses your senses feelings....
Who the he ll WERE these guys to destroy families???
Let`s see so far we have instances of the *standard* of the *word* being *USED* to....
Break up marriages...
justify abusive spouses/leaders
force us to endure unacceptable actions....
assure compliance with insane standards...
force abortions...
extract money from those struggeling and presenting it to those who squandered it...
throw children out of the home......
to force folks to sell homes against their better judgement...
hide criminal activity
prevent us from going to college...
ignore responsibilities to family...
What about that??? How many stories have we heard about elderly ailing parents that we ignored because we were too busy honoring our commitments...some never got the chance to make it up...
I remember one friend who when heard of a parents serious illness and possible imminent death....being told not to leave the wow field...that God would honor her promise....she was counceled that she needed to stay on the wow field ...God would honor her believing that would be the way for her to help her mother...and so against her better judgement she stayed...convinced by leaders that if she left .... satan would win and probably kill her parent any way...she never got to say goodbye to that mother who died asking for her...not understanding why her daughter couldn`t come...:-(
Some things can`t be fixed.
[This message was edited by rascal on January 17, 2004 at 19:46.]
quote: Oaks, had the statement been "I complied through fear", it would have been saying that that person, speaking for herself, complied through fear. By saying "we", it infers that all of us, every one of us, not just that person, complied through fear. That statement does not apply to me, at least not to any great extent, which was why I spoke up.
Perhaps if folks would just relay their own experiences and not speak for others, we'd all understand each other better? I don't need folks to try to psycho-analyze what I experienced...I know myself what I experienced.
Oldies, I think I know where you are coming from. Saying "we" without defining who "we" are does seem to imply that Rascal is trying to apply her experience...as she says of being controlled in the name of the Word...to everyone.
In forming my interpretation, I think I have read enough posts from Rascal and others to feel safe in assuming that she was not trying to do that. There are others who have given record of some bad experiences, and I think she had them in mind when she used "we" instead of "I". It is very frustrating to be told that your experience is wrong...that it didn't happen. Therefore, I can see why you made this point. It just takes some effort sometimes to mentally put yourself in someone else's position and perhaps understand what they are saying.
Now, about choosing to be a victim, I assume the phrase in the JAL quote you used referred to choosing to let what happened to someone control their life. I mean, it couldnt mean choosing to be hurt, right, when Rascal and some others had no choice in what happened to them. Unless, of course, you have good reason to deny what they testified to happened to them. Or unless you accept that it happened, but are suggesting that they pretend it didn't happen. That is different than acknowledging that it did happen but not letting it ruin your life.
While I can't guarantee this, I have evidence gathered over the last four or so years on GS and Waydale that Rascal is not letting her bad experiences ruin or control her life. With all the running around and work needed to co-run a large family (and I know something about that) there is no way someone could be controlled by the experiences she has testified to and have things go as well as, to the extent I know, that they are going.
Perhaps these things are being talked about so that others, such as you and me, may know more. For example, having been yanked out of TWI in 1979 is one big reason I did not either experience or see some of these things. And no matter what anyone says about the root causes or early existence of any wrongs, there is no denying that there were big changes in day to day TWI life over the years.
Putting yourself mentally in someone else's position, which you can do while maintaining the integrity of your own experiences, always helps understanding. You are right; it sounded from that "we" alone like she was trying to paint her experiences as she describes them as everyone else's, including yours. However, a little effort in checking things out and doing what I mentioned above will work wonders. Then I suspect you would not be calling the reson for her testimony type A behaviour. Not that this by itself is the worst accusation in the world, but you are using it as your reason that she is either not telling the truth or is grossly exagerating due to "victim mentality"
Yes, the people who give testimonies also give their own interpretations of the reasons for the wrongs, which I do not always agree with. But there is nothing wrong with giving such interpretation, especially if the wrongs happend to them. I just prefer to read and seek out the testimony part, as I have tried to do for the last several years. I was bugged to no end by someone's judgement when someone told me I would have to accept their second hand account of some wrongs since if I didn't believe that, I probably wouldn't believe the personal testimony even if I had it. But I am still not going to reject someone's actual personal testimony...or what it means.
This is my first public post in over 3 months, and who knows how long it will be before the next...so if a further response is really wanted try PT or e-mail (smile092850@hotmail.com ).
Well...Good Morning *yawn*...5 pages of Sunday morning reading...it was long...and I skimmed the last 2 pages...
Rascal...I applaud the healing space you're in right now...YOU GO GIRL!!!!! ...and say it all...and say it over and over and over again, until it all gets outta ya' ;)--> ...and then say it again!!!
In my area, when I saw something "off the word" and confronted it to the leaders I was slammed...not only privately, but a few times my name was called out in limb meetings as having "too much pride"...blah...(my profession was a teacher and a counselor at the time, and I tended to see things pretty sanely).
They humiliated me whenever they could.
When I was apprentice corps (and I chose to go into the corps to help these twi leadership people), I lived with a very very strong single "woman of god". She was a tyrannt...I loved her...and I hated her...but, I learned from her.
One of the things she said I will never forget that saved me in twi was that I needed to learn the Word inside and out...for when leadership came at me with wrong accusations...to spew out a verse to their attack...and also for my own validation and peace of mine that I was right.
I set out that day memorizing all I could.
It helped me alot...and I did alot of fighting for alot of people. Perhaps it made me too strong...and too intolerant of what I saw crap happening in twi...because I eventually walked away.
Presently, I try and live my life using principles in the word...and surprisingly, there are people out in the world milling around that try to walk this way too.
It's not as much of a fight.
I see alot of men manipulating and controlling their wives...it's not just a twi thing...it's pretty distasteful to me.
I had alot of fun in twi until I left...and being in a college area, I didn't see much of the incidences that you all are talking about here...but...I do see how this could have happened...I was floored when I read Karl's book...I had no idea!!!
That approach was used by many: knowing enough of the bible to be able to counter attacks with really-truly-honest-to-God scripture. It even worked for a while.
In time the abusive leaders got wise to that and started accusing us of using the Word deceitfully, and leaning heavily on the "obey the leaders no matter what" interpretation of certain verses.
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice...but in practice there is
(((Rascal))) So good to see you and read your posts hun.
To any who read my posts, I must confess I am a chicken poop. Seriously. I have read every abuse or hurt story here, my heart has gone out to people, and yet all I have done is allude to my own experiences but never the full story. Unfortunately (like many others) there is more than one 'story', but it is the one that caused most damage to my life at the time and for the years following.
Why have I held back? Because in sharing the story that has hurt a person, the person relives all the feelings that they felt then. Then it is doubly aggravated by going public with it. Seriously. It is a hard thing to do, very hard and I have always admired those who have come forward and spoke up and cringed when someone has attacked the truth of their words and belittled them.
That stinks when that happens. But you know what? It doesn't matter if nothing bad has happened to you or anything bad to the point of what some people have experienced. It doesn't change what has happened to those who have suffered and it doesn't change what happened or didn't happen to you.
It is good if someone didn't have a bad experience but that doesn't alleviate or changed the damage done. It doesn't balance out or justify the existence of TWI or any other organization that has the same results among people.
To me, the thinking SHOULD BE is that it should have NEVER happen to one person nevertheless a myriad of people and if understood correctly, the causes and people responsible should have be removed so that it never happened again. This goes for TWI, the Roman Catholic Church and any other religious front that house and protected those that abused.
Attacking people's memories and the accuracy of it is a form of self denial. It is also a cop out. No one can tell another what they really remember or don't remember. That is a bunch of hoooowha. It is a self serving blanket statement to remain in a state of bliss, ignorant to the plight of others and exactly what someone is involved with.
It is my contention, that abuse, any kind of abuse, sexual, mental, emotionally or physically does NOT happen in a vacuum, it takes all kinds of players and a belief system that not only promotes it but protects the predator. It consists of the predators, those who support the predator(s) and help to cover their actions, those who join in with the predator, the victims who can be shamed and threatened to remain silent or diposed of and those who honestly don't know what is going on and help form the normal appearance of the group/family and those who choose to remain ignorant even after being told of the alleged abuse.
****
It was the end of my WOW year 1981. I had signed up for the WOW VET program in Knoxville Tenn which city was going to house the World's Fair.
Something bad happened to me the night before the morning we left for the ROA for our WOW homecoming and I am not saying what. Got to the ROA in a bad state of mind because of it.
Anyway, it was hard finding jobs and housing in Knoxville. Most landlords wanted their houses kept open until the crowds arrived for the Fair because they could charge mega amounts of money for rent. We were also put up in a house bascially outside the city where walking was impossible to get anywhere and cars were needed. One family did not have ONE single car between them which made house and job hunting hard but you know...if you believe, you received so when my family and I pulled away from the group home where we stayed having just signed a rental contract, I watched the family with no car take to the lawn chairs to sleep outside, because they didn't believe....so they could not sleep in doors until they got place to rent. I felt bad and scared, knowing we had just lucked out that day and if we hadn't signed for a rental, we would be sleeping outside or in the one car we had. I guess sleeping outside is supposed to help one's believing..doesn't matter if a person has asthma (like me) and the night air can set off an attack or that it was a stoopid decision to put a family together in an area that needed at least one car.....no it was them and their unbelief....
My WOW VET family consisted of two males and two females including myself. The leader was a corps grad, the other lady was pretty cool but then there was something seriously wrong with the other guy. I was still early twenties and knew something was wrong...we all did, but you know you just can't come out and say it...confession yeilds telling it the way it is and that wasn't permitted...
Anyway, to let you know why I say there was something wrong..he couldn't hold a normal conversation about every day life, he never ever mentioned the "WORD" and he seemed incapable of doing every day responsibilities that a person does w/o thinking about without a lot of guidance and would say often, in public..."I feel like an airplane."
Seriously, that may sound funny, but as a young adult it was embarrassing and scary,not having the knowledge or pratical life experience to handle such a situation. If it happened today, I would probably say..."That's nice dear, just don't take off on me."
But in TWI, appearances was everything. When I was going to witness to a guy in the grocery store with whom I was having a conversation, this WOW VET brother of mine came up and very weirdly said he felt like an airplane. The guy I was speaking to said something like, "That's nice" and walked away. During a WOW VET meeting in our house, this bro of mine walked into the room, banged his head on the wall and announced that he was an airplane. The look on the other WOW VET faces were priceless as it showed what they really thought.
In addition to this, the guy liked to play dumb. He acted like he had no idea what he was doing. Some reading this may say, "Well, Mandii, maybe he didn't." Then what the hell was he doing on the field, how the heck did he slip by WOW and WOW VET counseling, not once but twice????? hmmmmm?????????????????? Why in God's name would TWI allow someone so unstable to be put out on the field, where there is much stress with other young adults who are not equipped to handle such matters?
So anyway, this bro of mine had a hand problem. He was always and always copping a feel from me. As long as my back was turned, this rotten, dirty sneaky bastard would sneak up behind me and either grab my butt or reach around and grab my breast, oftentimes both. If I was cooking, gathering laundry, cleaning or otherwise engaged in an activity, this bastard would do his thing.
Say something and he stated he felt like an airplane (too bad he wasn't hijacked to Cuba) or that he just wanted to get along with me and understand me. The slicky slimey bastard knew what he was doing and knew how to get away with it.
No. It wasn't my imagination. Everyone saw it. My coordinator said if it was him doing it, he was sure I wouldn't mind!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was speechless...Yeah every woman is a whore...buddy coord. bro of mine. Are You reading this? Recognize yourself or me? Let me say one thing NOW that I didn't say then. ***** YOU. Thank You.
My WOW VET sister was cool. She told me she didn't know how I could stand the pressure of worrying about this nutjob sneaking up behind me and touching me at his own pleasure. She said she was sure she couldn't bear up under it. I had gone to locking my bedroom door and bathroom door to remain safe from this idiot. Of course I got scolded and chided for being fearful for locking the doors, but locking them I continued to do so.
My WOW VET sister took a leader role and helped me to bring it to the wife of the corps guy who ran the area. My sister verified and validated my story. Bless her big heart and may God bless her where ever she is now. The wife spoke to the husband and the corps husband called the house and spoke with the coordinator of my family. Of course I heard about it in a family meeting about opening the can of worms.
In any dysfunctional set up...silence is paramount and for some reason (which is obvious) there is MORE shame put on the person who talks and exposes the dirty little secrets than than the amount of shame place on the person doing the wrong. Being told to put up with crap and abuse and remain silent to that the ministry be not blamed is just a controling mechanism to keep the dysfunction going, no matter which way you slice the cake, pie or pizza.
In all fairness, I do believe the guy running the area came over and did a little talk about how to properly treat his sisters in Christ but for those that 'know and see', you're just gonna love the final edict (tongue in cheek) which was...I needed to learn how to love and this nutjob on the field with me needed to be loved.
How's that for manipulation? Yeah...the problem was he needed love and I needed to learn how to love, give...I didn't know how to give. I gave up a good job in a banking institution to go WOW and then turned around and dedicated two more years of my life to this stinking WOW VET program, was not getting enough food, (seriously) but I didn't know how to love and give which made this moron have roman hands and fingers.
Okay.
You see, this guy was a pathological liar in addition to having many problems which caused him to function lower than a teenager's level. He was NOT mentally retarded. He told everyone that he was in Viet Nam and that he had suffered battle fatigue syndrome and when he returned home, his whole family turned on him and placed him in a mental institution. He ran away from that mental institution and got witnessed to and believers ever since have put him up and let him live with them so that he could get his life together with the "WORD."
They even let him do PFAL promos with this story...how great TWI is, how PFAL helped his battle syndrome and I just kept my mouth closed knowing he was a big, fat, juicy liar playing them for all he could get from them. LOL, afterall, he just needed to be "loved."
Well, it is very hard to have a non functioning adult around all the time, especially when one isn't trained for dealing with such. This bro of mine would scream out in the night and my family coordinator would go running to my bro's bedroom and cast out the spirits that were holding the guy down in his bed unable to move. Tensions grew and grew a lot.
One day my family coordinator and sis brought home a hitch hiker who stayed the night. A few minutes around my nutjob bro, the hitch hiker guy took me aside and warned me that this bro of mine was a nutjob about to explode, that he was a time bomb. I boo hooed him not because I didn't believe him but because you know...give no offense to the ministry.
I got very sick on the field. I had a bad case of bronchitis. I was able to stay in one Saturday day and evening because I was ill. My family coordinator from what I remember was riding the bro hard...I can't really say it was unjustified, but how much can one take? My family coord. and my sis went out witnessng for the night and left the bro to do the grocery shopping and wouldn't let bro beg out with any excuses why he was incapable of doing it. A WOW from my previous WOW year who had also gone WOW VET came to visit me...already this was Oct.
My bro came home from the grocery store bytching and moaning cause he had to do it all by himself. He was angry with the family coord. but decided to take it out on me. What a shock. I was sitting on the floor wheezing and coughing, along with my friend cause we didn't have any furniture. I tried to ignore my bro..downplay it and he wouldn't stop. I told him that he was angry with the coord. and not me...and that he should take it to him and deal with him...and not take it out on me.
He came flying into the living room. He towered over me while I was sitting on the floor and yelled if I was going to shut up with my 'negatives.' I was confused and said so. He yelled it again. I am not one to back down from a fight, usually when challenged like that, so I said no. He raised his hand and hit me in the face, hard (but not hard enough to leave a mark) with his hand and a brown paper bag from the groceries. I immediately jumped to my feet (dont laugh...okay you can laugh at me) and started to rebuke him in the name of Jesus Christ. Man, you should have seen the way this lunatic eye's gleamed with hatred for me.
The sucker pushed me halfway across the room. I was surprised at his strength. My friend, bless her heart as well (no offense, but the women out on the field with me seemed to have more honesty and integrity and guts than the men out there with us) jumped up inbetween us and faced him to protect me. I immediately sprang to the phone and called the area leadership and bro got on the phone and started with his vunerable puppy dog act of "I try to understand Mandii." I sat down and prayed and asked God what was going to happen and asked Him to be honest with me. I couldn't live that this anymore. The answer I got was that nothing would be done about my bro, he would get away with it. At the time I believed it was God answering me. It just could have been my own gut instincts since I knew this guy should never have been out there on the field in the first place, should not have gotten off so easily about his constantly misplaced hands...
Nothing was done. Even though we sat through WOW training and VF announced at the training that to raise your hands or hit a WOW brother or sister would mean you were automatically expelled, nothing was done about this guy.
I was told that he really didn't hit me. I said just because a bag was inbetween me and his hand does NOT mean he didn't hit me. I saw the look in his eyes..the bum pushed me across the room, his intent was to HURT me and if he did it once, he will do it again.
Well I was told to get over it and learn to love.
I called my old branch leader from where I started out, he called the area leader, and the same diagnosis. I needed to grow in love. But heck I was trying. I was trying NOT to break my comittment, idiot that I was. I wanted to be switched to a different family so I could stay and feel SAFE. NO deal.. hadda grow in love.
They knew I was planning to leave. They told me I would die if I left the field. They told me, more than one leader, that the devil would kill me. See, greasespot isn't a new theory or doctrine..it's been around forever, just under different words. They said the devil would be waiting for me if I left to knock me off. My family coord. told me it was devil spirits telling me to leave. I reasoned why would I need a devil spirit to tell me this situation sucked to high heaven when I could figure that out by myself.
As much as the dying threat scared me and it really did, I reasoned that being in 'the right place with my heart totally in the wrong place, I would die anyway cause the devil would still be able to get me anyway." So I figured I would go home to my parents who LOVED me and had food and die surrounded by real love. My only problem was how to get home with no money.
I asked several friends from Long Island to provide me with the means. No one wanted to touch a person breaking a comittment with a ten foot pole so I decided to hitch hike. And one Saturday morning, with the barest of things..I set out knowing I had to head North.
I will make this part short. Once out on the road, by myself hitch hiking, I would call my WOW sister from VA where we were assigned the previous year every night and tell her where I was. The agreement was if that I didn't check in with her the next night, she would call my family and the police so that with my last location, they would know where to look for my body at least.
Nice, huh? God's word, god's greatness, god's ministry.
Now for those who want to complain about hitch hiking alone, I had NO choice. My TWI friends wouldn't help me, I called religious organizations in Tenn to help me, they wouldn't but wanted to know the name of the group I was running from and I wouldn't tell them..ministry be not blamed you know.
And if I asked my parents for money then moved back in with them, they would insist I give up the Way altogether and I couldn't let that happen...always faithful even when not faithful according to TWI standards..makes me wanna vomit...
So I hitch hiked..got a ride as soon as I hit the expressway by a trucker...rode through Tenn. Kentucky and into Ind and Ill...okay it was north but not east ....rode through Ohio a few times going back and forth..hey I was tired, scared, afraid I was possessed....and then one time I had to flee a truck, because something happened in the middle of the night in a truck stop that was just a pull over rest stop, no lights. This was like the second day on the road and I had let myself go to sleep..stupid me...fled across a dark highway..coudln't believe how dark it was...
Well anyway in Ohio....an elderly lady and her husband put me in touch with an organization called FISH. They bought me a bus ticket to Dayton and then I had to find a ride to the airport as they also let me call my sister who wired me a ticket there and who also promised mum was the word until I flew into Laguardia then bring me home to my mother and father.
Once I got to the bus terminal in Dayton, I walked a bit to a Stouffer's hotel. I recalled my branch coord. and he tried to buy me a room there but back in 1981 they didn't do things like that. I needed a ride to Dayton the next morning and didn't have enough for a taxi...the hotel employees were treating me like crap and a bunch of twenty somethings went through the lobby,looked at me..and said..."Hey Tom, there's your girlfriend." Yeah, so funny I forgot to laugh.
Anyway, standing again by the phones, a bunch of guys looking like doctors were talking about riding to the airport in the morning. I got my guts together and approached them saying all I wanted to do was to go home and the only thing preventing me from doing so was a ride to the airport and I would wait around as I had no place to go and no money if they would just give me a ride.
I must have been a sight.
The man told me to wait here and the next thing I knew, one of the employees came over to me, nice as pie this time, brought me to the kitchen to give me food and then I was offered a ride to the airport that night.
I made it home.
Once home I was scared beyond words, afraid I was going to die, feeling all of the world's condemnation of me for breaking a comittment, not being able to love enough.
I was also comtemplating suicide. I called the area leader in Long Island who was there for me. He told me that that dying crap, the devil is going to kill me was just a last ditched effort to make me stay on the field. I had a hard time believing that as why would a MOG lie about God???????????? Silly me.
Out of protocol, I had to call a certain leader at HQ....to whom I also cried, " I don't want to die." He asked me how I got home and I told him I hitched hike from Tenn to Ohio then got a plane ticket....he responded that if I was not dead yet, I shouldn't worry about it. The conversation with him turned out to be cool. If it wasn't for him and the area leader then in Long Island, I think I would have done myself in....I was hurting THAT BAD. I was THAT confused...
I made light of the road trip here, but it was no picnic...I had nightmares about it for months, being stranded, looking for the next 'safe' ride...the fear...running from one truck in the middle of the night...other truckers calling the police when I made it on foot on the interstate to another truck stop, when found crying in the bathroom.
And you know...TWI, even in its heyday, there was always someone who knew someone who knew someone. Well I found out that my 'bro' knew someone from his area that moved to my area. So I called her and told her all about what had happened with this guy. And she told me what I expected all along. This 'bro' of mine was never in Viet Nam. He had been in and out of mental institutions all his life. As a matter of fact, she said that one of the top leadership of TWI told the beiievers in their area to quit harboring the guy and supporting him....he couldn't survive on his own and had to live with people to care for him.
And some how this idiot made it out onto the WOW field and then the WOW Vet program.
But all he needed was love..that would solve his problems..all I needed was to learn how to love...would solve all his stinking mental problems.
Yes, TWI used the word to control us and keep us in fear if necessary and used it to belittle us to blame the problems that arose on us...not because of their poor decisions or anything else. Because they were never to be blamed.
I forgot to add that out of protocol, I had to call the area leader back in Tenn. Again, I swear before God, he told me that my family wasn't the problem, IT WAS ME.
And for those who wondered, I sent money to that family to cover the costs my leaving gave them the first month. When the money for the deposit and all was return, something I had chipped in for, and had bought the bedding for us girls, none of my share was returned to me.
For years afterwards I walked away secretly condeming myself over this. It is hard to convey that to someone....and it is hard to post this as I felt the shame all over again...this is not something I think about often...usually rarely....but still, it's a battle to realize that the shame goes to those who treated lives so callously and not on those who were used and abused and mistreated.
[This message was edited by Mandii on January 19, 2004 at 11:08.]
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rascal
Type (A) ??? Would it matter? How would THAT have any bearing on how the *word* was used to control WHATEVER personality I happen to have been??
For your information...I have been trying to TELL you that *I* wasn`t allowed the luxury of having any particular personality type...if it wasn`t explicitly laid out in proverbs concerning the virtuous woman....my leaders generally TOLD me what/how/when I was allowed to think .
How does MY personality type have anything to do with the *word* being used to force us to do twi/leaders whims? .... Could it be that in now pointing a finger at my *type* you are employing yet another means of redirecting the focus from the actual culprits and situations being discussed?
Seems to becoming a pattern oldies.
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oldiesman
Have a nice weekend, everyone.
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Tom Strange
you too ancientdude...
... I've been here and I've been there and I've been in between...
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excathedra
goodgod what's so hard about all this ?
all the time people tell me their troubles and even though i haven't experienced the same, i say something like "gosh, i'm sorry that happened to you, i'm sorry you're hurt"
maybe i just don't get it
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excathedra
i was thinking about something where the word was used to control people or at least make them feel like total crap
two different girlfriends of mine worked switchboard. i don't want to get into detail detail, but if wierwille called, and they could not find whoever he needed right away, ohmygod
one of them disconnected him by accident once. wierwille wanted her thrown out of the corps immediately. he said she was spiritually asleep at the switch and on and on and on....
she had no business being there.... dah dah dah.... matter of life and death and all kinds of crazy s.hit
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Mandii
My heart broke for you all who have suffered through TWI control and manipulation...I am truly sorry for what you have gone through.
Did TWI use its perverted doctrines to control/manipulate?
Most certainly.
Think about it. If you want that is. Think about their slogans and how their one (or two liners) contained a whole doctrine/teaching on what they wanted us to DO.
Put God first equates anything that could stop you from giving your all, financially, emotionally, mentally, physically, and every othe 'lly'....missing family weddings, getting rid of family or friends, jobs, careers, homes, jobs, pets...you name it.
And I know many women in TWI who were married and had a comittment to go into the Corps or back into it residence who got pregnant and were counseled to abort because it's
THE WORD THE WORD THE WORD THE WORD!! The word was what ever your leader told you it was.
It's spiritual--don't question it, just acknowledge it's over you head and do what leadership tells you to do. No if's and's or but's just march ye little soldier.
The Word of God is the Will of God and the only people who knew that and understands it are TWI so we will translate it for you and tell you what to do or think. Updated version..The Word Is. Yeah, makes great sense.
Someone else mentioned already but that verse from Duetoronomy...about paying our vows...heard it in WOW training to the point afterwards we all bleated the greatest blah blah is for WOW's to pay their vows...translated, even though your WOW brother will hit you and keep coping a feel off you and your lousy bugger of a area coordinator lets him stay on the field...damn it...the devil gonna get you sister if you don't stay out the field and take that crap (not seeing the forest-trees prevented me from seeing the devil 'already' got me.
Then how about all that devil, greasespot crap? What did those slogans insinuate???
Control? Hell yes. Dang, they tried to make us outright petried of EVEN thinking about doing anything different than what they wanted done.
Can anyone think of a few others?
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excathedra
oh yeah i can think of more than a few others
just don't know if i can think about it right now, because of the hurt
and guess what !!!!!! i'm not talking about the motorcoach
i'm talking about other leaders and other situations where i myself and others were broken down to the point of being "nothings"
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shazdancer
Thanks, dear Abi, for this:
I also would have never stayed with my abusive husbands as long as I did were it not for that nagging feeling that God would bless me if I just got it right.... When I finally realized that I WAS believing, I WAS doing it right, and it WASN'T working, I got out!Okay, funny story here. First ex and I were "assigned" to AZ, to be near a guy who was supposed to help him. That guy left the field after just a few months -- so much for the "heavy revvy" on our assignment! Hubby was still drinking, still abusing, I hadn't had a decent night's sleep in days, so I went to leadership for help.
LC's wife takes one look at me and says, "Well, if you'd wash your hair and make yourself look nice, he'd want to come home to you." Ohhh, so his lifetime of alcohol abuse (long before he met me) can be cured with a little Head and Shoulders!!!! Silly me for not seeing the error of MY ways.
Even my drinking husband, when he was sober, was the first to say she was stupid to think that my flat hair had anything to do with his problems.
Note to Oldies: Please understand, I was raised to be pretty independent. My parents insisted I attend college, I was never raised to feel that I was inferior as a girl. Yet I was momentarily flummoxed by the LC wife's statement. I should have told her where to stuff it, in love of course! But I wanted to be a good child of God, and I had been fed stuff about "submit to your husband" and then I would be blessed. The "miserable comforter" was an older Corps, a rev LC's wife. I'll admit, it didn't take long to reject her statement as bunk, but imagine if I wasn't so independent, or if the suggestion was more plausible....
Regards,
Shaz
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rascal
Hey mandii...great to see you girl!
That is terrible ex...I heard of stuff like that happening .... did you ever hear from the other girl? How awfull she must have felt having the mog declair her to be worthless....some never recovered once declared *spiritual* waste by the powers that be.
How about the face meltings that we meekly sat and accepted? I am talking about the insane screaming spit flying two inches from your face rantings.......behavior that is not acceptable anywhere else...
We sat and TOOK it meekly because we had been taught that the *word* demanded it of one who wanted to grow....that if we didn`t we would be hard hearted...not meek ...if we retaliated in any way it only proved their point that we were *posessed*.
Those were horrible..... but I sat and let them do it....because I loved God and thought that was what he wanted.
Geeze after one screaming session I remember that I actualy THANKED the lc for loving me enough to set me straight....sigh.........geeze how freakin controlled is THAT??
Any other situation n we wouldda either ripped their heads off or had em arrested.
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ItsStillTheWord
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ItsStillTheWord
[boldface empasis mine]
Yeah, it worked.
:D-->
(My statement is not directed at you Rascal!)
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rascal
Oh GEEZE shaz.... your HAIR?? I so understand what you are talking about....trying to make him happy enough to want to be *nice*
I had been trying to apply the ministry formula for wives for years...I totally understand your frustration...I like you had a drunken at time abusive spouse....the shame of never being good enough was terrible...I had no self esteem...it never dawned on me that ALL of lifes problems were NOT my fault....
Shoot nothing was ever good enough... No matter how hard I tried...I finally realised that either God didn`t work or the stupid standard of the *word* that I had been taught was wrong...I put up with that crap because I was taught by my leaders that God demanded this of me....would *bless* me for following and submitting to the spouse...that kids would be *blessed* as long as they *obeyed* daddy...
Well it was all a lie...it wasn`t untill i got damn rebellious and took a stand that life changed for the better.
The LAST thing an alcoholic needs is a meek little doormat pleading with them to act a little nicer.... .
[This message was edited by rascal on January 17, 2004 at 0:04.]
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wyteduv58
Rascal, I hear ya loud and clear. You had your own experiences, just as I and everyone else in here did. Some of us were abused mentally,sexually etc. and some only one or the other. But it WAS OUR experience. and we have every right to be mad as hell. I was mentally abused by leaders from branch all the way up to and including Loy. AND I TOOK IT.
To be fair I also had some very loving leaders but by the mid 80's they were almost extinct. And even some of the good one's went bad, I think because they also were abused by thier leaders.
I wanted to leave TWI 5 years before we actually did it, because I foolishly thought my husband would leave me if I left and he was/is such a good person I would rather take thier crap than loose my hubby. What I didn't know was that he was thinking the same thing but we failed to communicate it to each other.
It took our son running away from home to escape BC's abuse to get us to the point to leave, especially they blamed us for his running away, and of course lock box had all but dissapered by then and everyone knew what happened the next day.
well we decided the night of the inquisition (thats what I call it)when we were blamed for everything from ww1 to the presant, we left twi that night and went looking for our son so he could come back home and feel safe.
I also was abused by a BC we once had, it was physical abuse, nothing to write home about but he grabbed my arm and shoved me up against the fridge and told me to sit down when I just went to get a drink of water to keep from coughing all night er session in our own house. My hubby never laid a hand on me and neither did my dad so I was ashamed thinking how bad I was to be manhandled. I never told anyone about this incident beaczuse I thought I had it coming for some reason? I finally told my hubby a couple of years ago and he said if I had told him when it happened we would have left immediatly. He and My son's were so mad that they didn't get the chance to deck this guy that it was by then almost laughable, but I now wish I would have spoken out, I would have loved to see that. HEE HEE
This is only part of my story, but it is MY STORY. and it happened to me.
Dovey....proud owner of two low riders...Dovey's Doxies......
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Zixar
rascal: It appears I'm the one who should be apologizing for disappointing you. It was I who misread, not you.
Extremely sorry,
Zix
The Secret Signature of the Day has been cancelled by the HTML Police.
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Oakspear
Not only did "leadership" use "The Word" to attempt to control (often succeeding), but in marriages, they would tell each spouse different things.
Very seldom would anyone who was counselling my ex-wife and I talk to us together. When they did, it was different than what they told each of us separately.
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice...but in practice there is
Oakspear
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wyteduv58
Oak, They sure tried to get my hubby to leave me. Thank God he beleives in our committment to each other.
We will be married 26 years in March.
Dovey....proud owner of two low riders...Dovey's Doxies......
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rascal
That is so insane......I remember when the *standard* was to never talk to either spouse alone.
Guys ........ what those supposed authorities did to you wonderfull people is criminal.
It is really strange how they tried to bust up SOME marriages...and yet they required that others remain in abusive marriages.
Dove, I am glad that you and your spouse had the resiliancy to withstand the pressures.
Sadly Oak, yours is but one of many marriages that I know of that collapsed as a direct result of pressure by leadership leaning on one spouse or the other.... councelling one spouse that the other wasn`t *spiritual* enough* or wasn`t doing the *word* to their satisfaction.
I know some who felt they had no choice...again it was presented as a choice between their spouse or God your spiritual duty verses your senses feelings....
Who the he ll WERE these guys to destroy families???
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rascal
(((((((Zix))))))
:)-->
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rascal
Let`s see so far we have instances of the *standard* of the *word* being *USED* to....
Break up marriages...
justify abusive spouses/leaders
force us to endure unacceptable actions....
assure compliance with insane standards...
force abortions...
extract money from those struggeling and presenting it to those who squandered it...
throw children out of the home......
to force folks to sell homes against their better judgement...
hide criminal activity
prevent us from going to college...
ignore responsibilities to family...
What about that??? How many stories have we heard about elderly ailing parents that we ignored because we were too busy honoring our commitments...some never got the chance to make it up...
I remember one friend who when heard of a parents serious illness and possible imminent death....being told not to leave the wow field...that God would honor her promise....she was counceled that she needed to stay on the wow field ...God would honor her believing that would be the way for her to help her mother...and so against her better judgement she stayed...convinced by leaders that if she left .... satan would win and probably kill her parent any way...she never got to say goodbye to that mother who died asking for her...not understanding why her daughter couldn`t come...:-(
Some things can`t be fixed.
[This message was edited by rascal on January 17, 2004 at 19:46.]
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Lifted Up
Oldies, I think I know where you are coming from. Saying "we" without defining who "we" are does seem to imply that Rascal is trying to apply her experience...as she says of being controlled in the name of the Word...to everyone.
In forming my interpretation, I think I have read enough posts from Rascal and others to feel safe in assuming that she was not trying to do that. There are others who have given record of some bad experiences, and I think she had them in mind when she used "we" instead of "I". It is very frustrating to be told that your experience is wrong...that it didn't happen. Therefore, I can see why you made this point. It just takes some effort sometimes to mentally put yourself in someone else's position and perhaps understand what they are saying.
Now, about choosing to be a victim, I assume the phrase in the JAL quote you used referred to choosing to let what happened to someone control their life. I mean, it couldnt mean choosing to be hurt, right, when Rascal and some others had no choice in what happened to them. Unless, of course, you have good reason to deny what they testified to happened to them. Or unless you accept that it happened, but are suggesting that they pretend it didn't happen. That is different than acknowledging that it did happen but not letting it ruin your life.
While I can't guarantee this, I have evidence gathered over the last four or so years on GS and Waydale that Rascal is not letting her bad experiences ruin or control her life. With all the running around and work needed to co-run a large family (and I know something about that) there is no way someone could be controlled by the experiences she has testified to and have things go as well as, to the extent I know, that they are going.
Perhaps these things are being talked about so that others, such as you and me, may know more. For example, having been yanked out of TWI in 1979 is one big reason I did not either experience or see some of these things. And no matter what anyone says about the root causes or early existence of any wrongs, there is no denying that there were big changes in day to day TWI life over the years.
Putting yourself mentally in someone else's position, which you can do while maintaining the integrity of your own experiences, always helps understanding. You are right; it sounded from that "we" alone like she was trying to paint her experiences as she describes them as everyone else's, including yours. However, a little effort in checking things out and doing what I mentioned above will work wonders. Then I suspect you would not be calling the reson for her testimony type A behaviour. Not that this by itself is the worst accusation in the world, but you are using it as your reason that she is either not telling the truth or is grossly exagerating due to "victim mentality"
Yes, the people who give testimonies also give their own interpretations of the reasons for the wrongs, which I do not always agree with. But there is nothing wrong with giving such interpretation, especially if the wrongs happend to them. I just prefer to read and seek out the testimony part, as I have tried to do for the last several years. I was bugged to no end by someone's judgement when someone told me I would have to accept their second hand account of some wrongs since if I didn't believe that, I probably wouldn't believe the personal testimony even if I had it. But I am still not going to reject someone's actual personal testimony...or what it means.
This is my first public post in over 3 months, and who knows how long it will be before the next...so if a further response is really wanted try PT or e-mail (smile092850@hotmail.com ).
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Wacky Funster
Well...Good Morning *yawn*...5 pages of Sunday morning reading...it was long...and I skimmed the last 2 pages...
Rascal...I applaud the healing space you're in right now...YOU GO GIRL!!!!!
...and say it all...and say it over and over and over again, until it all gets outta ya' 
;)--> ...and then say it again!!!
In my area, when I saw something "off the word" and confronted it to the leaders I was slammed...not only privately, but a few times my name was called out in limb meetings as having "too much pride"...blah...(my profession was a teacher and a counselor at the time, and I tended to see things pretty sanely).
They humiliated me whenever they could.
When I was apprentice corps (and I chose to go into the corps to help these twi leadership people), I lived with a very very strong single "woman of god". She was a tyrannt...I loved her...and I hated her...but, I learned from her.
One of the things she said I will never forget that saved me in twi was that I needed to learn the Word inside and out...for when leadership came at me with wrong accusations...to spew out a verse to their attack...and also for my own validation and peace of mine that I was right.
I set out that day memorizing all I could.
It helped me alot...and I did alot of fighting for alot of people. Perhaps it made me too strong...and too intolerant of what I saw crap happening in twi...because I eventually walked away.
Presently, I try and live my life using principles in the word...and surprisingly, there are people out in the world milling around that try to walk this way too.
It's not as much of a fight.
I see alot of men manipulating and controlling their wives...it's not just a twi thing...it's pretty distasteful to me.
I had alot of fun in twi until I left...and being in a college area, I didn't see much of the incidences that you all are talking about here...but...I do see how this could have happened...I was floored when I read Karl's book...I had no idea!!!
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Oakspear
Wacky:
That approach was used by many: knowing enough of the bible to be able to counter attacks with really-truly-honest-to-God scripture. It even worked for a while.
In time the abusive leaders got wise to that and started accusing us of using the Word deceitfully, and leaning heavily on the "obey the leaders no matter what" interpretation of certain verses.
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice...but in practice there is
Oakspear
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Wacky Funster
Oaks...I think that's about the moment I left twi...
obeying leadership mindlessly is not in my make-up...must be the free spirit in me...
...my folks had trouble too
;)-->.
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Mandii
(((Rascal))) So good to see you and read your posts hun.
To any who read my posts, I must confess I am a chicken poop. Seriously. I have read every abuse or hurt story here, my heart has gone out to people, and yet all I have done is allude to my own experiences but never the full story. Unfortunately (like many others) there is more than one 'story', but it is the one that caused most damage to my life at the time and for the years following.
Why have I held back? Because in sharing the story that has hurt a person, the person relives all the feelings that they felt then. Then it is doubly aggravated by going public with it. Seriously. It is a hard thing to do, very hard and I have always admired those who have come forward and spoke up and cringed when someone has attacked the truth of their words and belittled them.
That stinks when that happens. But you know what? It doesn't matter if nothing bad has happened to you or anything bad to the point of what some people have experienced. It doesn't change what has happened to those who have suffered and it doesn't change what happened or didn't happen to you.
It is good if someone didn't have a bad experience but that doesn't alleviate or changed the damage done. It doesn't balance out or justify the existence of TWI or any other organization that has the same results among people.
To me, the thinking SHOULD BE is that it should have NEVER happen to one person nevertheless a myriad of people and if understood correctly, the causes and people responsible should have be removed so that it never happened again. This goes for TWI, the Roman Catholic Church and any other religious front that house and protected those that abused.
Attacking people's memories and the accuracy of it is a form of self denial. It is also a cop out. No one can tell another what they really remember or don't remember. That is a bunch of hoooowha. It is a self serving blanket statement to remain in a state of bliss, ignorant to the plight of others and exactly what someone is involved with.
It is my contention, that abuse, any kind of abuse, sexual, mental, emotionally or physically does NOT happen in a vacuum, it takes all kinds of players and a belief system that not only promotes it but protects the predator. It consists of the predators, those who support the predator(s) and help to cover their actions, those who join in with the predator, the victims who can be shamed and threatened to remain silent or diposed of and those who honestly don't know what is going on and help form the normal appearance of the group/family and those who choose to remain ignorant even after being told of the alleged abuse.
****
It was the end of my WOW year 1981. I had signed up for the WOW VET program in Knoxville Tenn which city was going to house the World's Fair.
Something bad happened to me the night before the morning we left for the ROA for our WOW homecoming and I am not saying what. Got to the ROA in a bad state of mind because of it.
Anyway, it was hard finding jobs and housing in Knoxville. Most landlords wanted their houses kept open until the crowds arrived for the Fair because they could charge mega amounts of money for rent. We were also put up in a house bascially outside the city where walking was impossible to get anywhere and cars were needed. One family did not have ONE single car between them which made house and job hunting hard but you know...if you believe, you received so when my family and I pulled away from the group home where we stayed having just signed a rental contract, I watched the family with no car take to the lawn chairs to sleep outside, because they didn't believe....so they could not sleep in doors until they got place to rent. I felt bad and scared, knowing we had just lucked out that day and if we hadn't signed for a rental, we would be sleeping outside or in the one car we had. I guess sleeping outside is supposed to help one's believing..doesn't matter if a person has asthma (like me) and the night air can set off an attack or that it was a stoopid decision to put a family together in an area that needed at least one car.....no it was them and their unbelief....
My WOW VET family consisted of two males and two females including myself. The leader was a corps grad, the other lady was pretty cool but then there was something seriously wrong with the other guy. I was still early twenties and knew something was wrong...we all did, but you know you just can't come out and say it...confession yeilds telling it the way it is and that wasn't permitted...
Anyway, to let you know why I say there was something wrong..he couldn't hold a normal conversation about every day life, he never ever mentioned the "WORD" and he seemed incapable of doing every day responsibilities that a person does w/o thinking about without a lot of guidance and would say often, in public..."I feel like an airplane."
Seriously, that may sound funny, but as a young adult it was embarrassing and scary,not having the knowledge or pratical life experience to handle such a situation. If it happened today, I would probably say..."That's nice dear, just don't take off on me."
But in TWI, appearances was everything. When I was going to witness to a guy in the grocery store with whom I was having a conversation, this WOW VET brother of mine came up and very weirdly said he felt like an airplane. The guy I was speaking to said something like, "That's nice" and walked away. During a WOW VET meeting in our house, this bro of mine walked into the room, banged his head on the wall and announced that he was an airplane. The look on the other WOW VET faces were priceless as it showed what they really thought.
In addition to this, the guy liked to play dumb. He acted like he had no idea what he was doing. Some reading this may say, "Well, Mandii, maybe he didn't." Then what the hell was he doing on the field, how the heck did he slip by WOW and WOW VET counseling, not once but twice????? hmmmmm?????????????????? Why in God's name would TWI allow someone so unstable to be put out on the field, where there is much stress with other young adults who are not equipped to handle such matters?
So anyway, this bro of mine had a hand problem. He was always and always copping a feel from me. As long as my back was turned, this rotten, dirty sneaky bastard would sneak up behind me and either grab my butt or reach around and grab my breast, oftentimes both. If I was cooking, gathering laundry, cleaning or otherwise engaged in an activity, this bastard would do his thing.
Say something and he stated he felt like an airplane (too bad he wasn't hijacked to Cuba) or that he just wanted to get along with me and understand me. The slicky slimey bastard knew what he was doing and knew how to get away with it.
No. It wasn't my imagination. Everyone saw it. My coordinator said if it was him doing it, he was sure I wouldn't mind!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was speechless...Yeah every woman is a whore...buddy coord. bro of mine. Are You reading this? Recognize yourself or me? Let me say one thing NOW that I didn't say then. ***** YOU. Thank You.
My WOW VET sister was cool. She told me she didn't know how I could stand the pressure of worrying about this nutjob sneaking up behind me and touching me at his own pleasure. She said she was sure she couldn't bear up under it. I had gone to locking my bedroom door and bathroom door to remain safe from this idiot. Of course I got scolded and chided for being fearful for locking the doors, but locking them I continued to do so.
My WOW VET sister took a leader role and helped me to bring it to the wife of the corps guy who ran the area. My sister verified and validated my story. Bless her big heart and may God bless her where ever she is now. The wife spoke to the husband and the corps husband called the house and spoke with the coordinator of my family. Of course I heard about it in a family meeting about opening the can of worms.
In any dysfunctional set up...silence is paramount and for some reason (which is obvious) there is MORE shame put on the person who talks and exposes the dirty little secrets than than the amount of shame place on the person doing the wrong. Being told to put up with crap and abuse and remain silent to that the ministry be not blamed is just a controling mechanism to keep the dysfunction going, no matter which way you slice the cake, pie or pizza.
In all fairness, I do believe the guy running the area came over and did a little talk about how to properly treat his sisters in Christ but for those that 'know and see', you're just gonna love the final edict (tongue in cheek) which was...I needed to learn how to love and this nutjob on the field with me needed to be loved.
How's that for manipulation? Yeah...the problem was he needed love and I needed to learn how to love, give...I didn't know how to give. I gave up a good job in a banking institution to go WOW and then turned around and dedicated two more years of my life to this stinking WOW VET program, was not getting enough food, (seriously) but I didn't know how to love and give which made this moron have roman hands and fingers.
Okay.
You see, this guy was a pathological liar in addition to having many problems which caused him to function lower than a teenager's level. He was NOT mentally retarded. He told everyone that he was in Viet Nam and that he had suffered battle fatigue syndrome and when he returned home, his whole family turned on him and placed him in a mental institution. He ran away from that mental institution and got witnessed to and believers ever since have put him up and let him live with them so that he could get his life together with the "WORD."
They even let him do PFAL promos with this story...how great TWI is, how PFAL helped his battle syndrome and I just kept my mouth closed knowing he was a big, fat, juicy liar playing them for all he could get from them. LOL, afterall, he just needed to be "loved."
Well, it is very hard to have a non functioning adult around all the time, especially when one isn't trained for dealing with such. This bro of mine would scream out in the night and my family coordinator would go running to my bro's bedroom and cast out the spirits that were holding the guy down in his bed unable to move. Tensions grew and grew a lot.
One day my family coordinator and sis brought home a hitch hiker who stayed the night. A few minutes around my nutjob bro, the hitch hiker guy took me aside and warned me that this bro of mine was a nutjob about to explode, that he was a time bomb. I boo hooed him not because I didn't believe him but because you know...give no offense to the ministry.
I got very sick on the field. I had a bad case of bronchitis. I was able to stay in one Saturday day and evening because I was ill. My family coordinator from what I remember was riding the bro hard...I can't really say it was unjustified, but how much can one take? My family coord. and my sis went out witnessng for the night and left the bro to do the grocery shopping and wouldn't let bro beg out with any excuses why he was incapable of doing it. A WOW from my previous WOW year who had also gone WOW VET came to visit me...already this was Oct.
My bro came home from the grocery store bytching and moaning cause he had to do it all by himself. He was angry with the family coord. but decided to take it out on me. What a shock. I was sitting on the floor wheezing and coughing, along with my friend cause we didn't have any furniture. I tried to ignore my bro..downplay it and he wouldn't stop. I told him that he was angry with the coord. and not me...and that he should take it to him and deal with him...and not take it out on me.
He came flying into the living room. He towered over me while I was sitting on the floor and yelled if I was going to shut up with my 'negatives.' I was confused and said so. He yelled it again. I am not one to back down from a fight, usually when challenged like that, so I said no. He raised his hand and hit me in the face, hard (but not hard enough to leave a mark) with his hand and a brown paper bag from the groceries. I immediately jumped to my feet (dont laugh...okay you can laugh at me) and started to rebuke him in the name of Jesus Christ. Man, you should have seen the way this lunatic eye's gleamed with hatred for me.
The sucker pushed me halfway across the room. I was surprised at his strength. My friend, bless her heart as well (no offense, but the women out on the field with me seemed to have more honesty and integrity and guts than the men out there with us) jumped up inbetween us and faced him to protect me. I immediately sprang to the phone and called the area leadership and bro got on the phone and started with his vunerable puppy dog act of "I try to understand Mandii." I sat down and prayed and asked God what was going to happen and asked Him to be honest with me. I couldn't live that this anymore. The answer I got was that nothing would be done about my bro, he would get away with it. At the time I believed it was God answering me. It just could have been my own gut instincts since I knew this guy should never have been out there on the field in the first place, should not have gotten off so easily about his constantly misplaced hands...
Nothing was done. Even though we sat through WOW training and VF announced at the training that to raise your hands or hit a WOW brother or sister would mean you were automatically expelled, nothing was done about this guy.
I was told that he really didn't hit me. I said just because a bag was inbetween me and his hand does NOT mean he didn't hit me. I saw the look in his eyes..the bum pushed me across the room, his intent was to HURT me and if he did it once, he will do it again.
Well I was told to get over it and learn to love.
I called my old branch leader from where I started out, he called the area leader, and the same diagnosis. I needed to grow in love. But heck I was trying. I was trying NOT to break my comittment, idiot that I was. I wanted to be switched to a different family so I could stay and feel SAFE. NO deal.. hadda grow in love.
They knew I was planning to leave. They told me I would die if I left the field. They told me, more than one leader, that the devil would kill me. See, greasespot isn't a new theory or doctrine..it's been around forever, just under different words. They said the devil would be waiting for me if I left to knock me off. My family coord. told me it was devil spirits telling me to leave. I reasoned why would I need a devil spirit to tell me this situation sucked to high heaven when I could figure that out by myself.
As much as the dying threat scared me and it really did, I reasoned that being in 'the right place with my heart totally in the wrong place, I would die anyway cause the devil would still be able to get me anyway." So I figured I would go home to my parents who LOVED me and had food and die surrounded by real love. My only problem was how to get home with no money.
I asked several friends from Long Island to provide me with the means. No one wanted to touch a person breaking a comittment with a ten foot pole so I decided to hitch hike. And one Saturday morning, with the barest of things..I set out knowing I had to head North.
I will make this part short. Once out on the road, by myself hitch hiking, I would call my WOW sister from VA where we were assigned the previous year every night and tell her where I was. The agreement was if that I didn't check in with her the next night, she would call my family and the police so that with my last location, they would know where to look for my body at least.
Nice, huh? God's word, god's greatness, god's ministry.
Now for those who want to complain about hitch hiking alone, I had NO choice. My TWI friends wouldn't help me, I called religious organizations in Tenn to help me, they wouldn't but wanted to know the name of the group I was running from and I wouldn't tell them..ministry be not blamed you know.
And if I asked my parents for money then moved back in with them, they would insist I give up the Way altogether and I couldn't let that happen...always faithful even when not faithful according to TWI standards..makes me wanna vomit...
So I hitch hiked..got a ride as soon as I hit the expressway by a trucker...rode through Tenn. Kentucky and into Ind and Ill...okay it was north but not east ....rode through Ohio a few times going back and forth..hey I was tired, scared, afraid I was possessed....and then one time I had to flee a truck, because something happened in the middle of the night in a truck stop that was just a pull over rest stop, no lights. This was like the second day on the road and I had let myself go to sleep..stupid me...fled across a dark highway..coudln't believe how dark it was...
Well anyway in Ohio....an elderly lady and her husband put me in touch with an organization called FISH. They bought me a bus ticket to Dayton and then I had to find a ride to the airport as they also let me call my sister who wired me a ticket there and who also promised mum was the word until I flew into Laguardia then bring me home to my mother and father.
Once I got to the bus terminal in Dayton, I walked a bit to a Stouffer's hotel. I recalled my branch coord. and he tried to buy me a room there but back in 1981 they didn't do things like that. I needed a ride to Dayton the next morning and didn't have enough for a taxi...the hotel employees were treating me like crap and a bunch of twenty somethings went through the lobby,looked at me..and said..."Hey Tom, there's your girlfriend." Yeah, so funny I forgot to laugh.
Anyway, standing again by the phones, a bunch of guys looking like doctors were talking about riding to the airport in the morning. I got my guts together and approached them saying all I wanted to do was to go home and the only thing preventing me from doing so was a ride to the airport and I would wait around as I had no place to go and no money if they would just give me a ride.
I must have been a sight.
The man told me to wait here and the next thing I knew, one of the employees came over to me, nice as pie this time, brought me to the kitchen to give me food and then I was offered a ride to the airport that night.
I made it home.
Once home I was scared beyond words, afraid I was going to die, feeling all of the world's condemnation of me for breaking a comittment, not being able to love enough.
I was also comtemplating suicide. I called the area leader in Long Island who was there for me. He told me that that dying crap, the devil is going to kill me was just a last ditched effort to make me stay on the field. I had a hard time believing that as why would a MOG lie about God???????????? Silly me.
Out of protocol, I had to call a certain leader at HQ....to whom I also cried, " I don't want to die." He asked me how I got home and I told him I hitched hike from Tenn to Ohio then got a plane ticket....he responded that if I was not dead yet, I shouldn't worry about it. The conversation with him turned out to be cool. If it wasn't for him and the area leader then in Long Island, I think I would have done myself in....I was hurting THAT BAD. I was THAT confused...
I made light of the road trip here, but it was no picnic...I had nightmares about it for months, being stranded, looking for the next 'safe' ride...the fear...running from one truck in the middle of the night...other truckers calling the police when I made it on foot on the interstate to another truck stop, when found crying in the bathroom.
And you know...TWI, even in its heyday, there was always someone who knew someone who knew someone. Well I found out that my 'bro' knew someone from his area that moved to my area. So I called her and told her all about what had happened with this guy. And she told me what I expected all along. This 'bro' of mine was never in Viet Nam. He had been in and out of mental institutions all his life. As a matter of fact, she said that one of the top leadership of TWI told the beiievers in their area to quit harboring the guy and supporting him....he couldn't survive on his own and had to live with people to care for him.
And some how this idiot made it out onto the WOW field and then the WOW Vet program.
But all he needed was love..that would solve his problems..all I needed was to learn how to love...would solve all his stinking mental problems.
Yes, TWI used the word to control us and keep us in fear if necessary and used it to belittle us to blame the problems that arose on us...not because of their poor decisions or anything else. Because they were never to be blamed.
I forgot to add that out of protocol, I had to call the area leader back in Tenn. Again, I swear before God, he told me that my family wasn't the problem, IT WAS ME.
And for those who wondered, I sent money to that family to cover the costs my leaving gave them the first month. When the money for the deposit and all was return, something I had chipped in for, and had bought the bedding for us girls, none of my share was returned to me.
For years afterwards I walked away secretly condeming myself over this. It is hard to convey that to someone....and it is hard to post this as I felt the shame all over again...this is not something I think about often...usually rarely....but still, it's a battle to realize that the shame goes to those who treated lives so callously and not on those who were used and abused and mistreated.
[This message was edited by Mandii on January 19, 2004 at 11:08.]
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