Did you remove any recent posts lately? There's one I'm looking for which had a video and now I'm thinking I'm having a senior's moment that I even saw it.
This is a recent event that has to do with why I started this thread.
Shortly after the Christian woman I wrote about previously said she would continue praying for my grandson’s health, he had a drastic improvement. He was consistently much happier and was having only the occasional minor seizure. I immediately had to deal with the idea that God (who I no longer believed existed) was answering her prayers.
Although there was also a small change made to his medication, previous changes (and there were many of them) had resulted in only a temporary improvement or none at all. So, there was no way of knowing for sure if this change was causing what was happening.
The relief from seeing him this new way felt wonderful and we were all truly thankful. As a Christian, I would have had no doubt that this was coming from a loving and caring God. As an atheist though, I obviously had my doubts, but I couldn’t outright dismiss the possibility.
The consideration to “give God the glory” was tempting mostly because of how thankful I was and previously, I had always given that thanksgiving to God. However, I eventually realized that my reaction was indeed a nostalgic feeling based on those from the past which I now know were never based on factual evidence and that the things I had learned over the past few months about the many problems with God’s morality and the authenticity of the bible still remained real and rational.
Since then, my grandson continues to have some bad seizures but they are much fewer and farther in between than what they had been for so long and for this present reality, I’m most thankful.
Harari does NOT get political. He's a historian. I was not asked for clarification about any potential political post I may have made.
It simply disappeared without comment.
While public policy decisions WILL need to be made regarding regulation of AI, and done soon, the only possible political implication was whether or not humanity would allow for AI to build further generations of AI that would/could reduce our capacity for self-determination.
Harari does NOT get political. He's a historian. I was not asked for clarification about any potential political post I may have made.
It simply disappeared without comment.
While public policy decisions WILL need to be made regarding regulation of AI, and done soon, the only possible political implication was whether or not humanity would allow for AI to build further generations of AI that would/could reduce our capacity for self-determination.
I noticed yesterday for the first time that when I googled a question, AI was the first response.
I tried to limit mod action to posts that either WERE political or responded to posts that were political. There were some that responded to a response to a response... i tried to keep anything that lost all trace of politics.
IF a post had some politics but not all, the whole post went.
I didn't vet the video for political content. The title told me it probably wasn't, so i restored it on request.
Not claiming to have exercised this responsibility perfectly. But if i were being strict i could have stopped the thread at the first mention of Butler, PA.
I tried to limit mod action to posts that either WERE political or responded to posts that were political. There were some that responded to a response to a response... i tried to keep anything that lost all trace of politics.
IF a post had some politics but not all, the whole post went.
I didn't vet the video for political content. The title told me it probably wasn't, so i restored it on request.
Not claiming to have exercised this responsibility perfectly. But if i were being strict i could have stopped the thread at the first mention of Butler, PA.
Again, Yuval Noah Harari isn't a politician. Isn't a pundit. Isn't a journalist. He's an historian. His latest book is Nexus and it's about the history of INFORMATION NETWORKS. He HAS called attention to the urgency figuring out how to deal with the implication and ramifications of AI. Rightly so.
That I mentioned the urgency for guardrails to be established for development of AI is a universal concern.
Get over yourself, Raf. Not everything that people actually SHOULD pay attention to is politics.
Again, Yuval Noah Harari isn't a politician. Isn't a pundit. Isn't a journalist. He's an historian. His latest book is Nexus and it's about the history of INFORMATION NETWORKS. He HAS called attention to the urgency figuring out how to deal with the implication and ramifications of AI. Rightly so.
That I mentioned the urgency for guardrails to be established for development of AI is a universal concern.
Get over yourself, Raf. Not everything that people actually SHOULD pay attention to is politics.
If you feel the need to "VET" something I post as political, freakin' ask me for clarification.
I saw the politics and winced in anticipation of moderation. After my last coaching, I studied to make myself approved, a greaser unashamed, accurately avoiding politics while handling Lamsa's bullshonta translation with parody and satire by typing with my thumbs and believing in my heart, "mmmmph."
I suppose I didn't study hard enough - in the Elizabethan sense, that is.
Edited by Nathan_Jr It's debatable, but no one hates orange more than I.
Again, Yuval Noah Harari isn't a politician. Isn't a pundit. Isn't a journalist. He's an historian. His latest book is Nexus and it's about the history of INFORMATION NETWORKS. He HAS called attention to the urgency figuring out how to deal with the implication and ramifications of AI. Rightly so.
That I mentioned the urgency for guardrails to be established for development of AI is a universal concern.
Get over yourself, Raf. Not everything that people actually SHOULD pay attention to is politics.
Just as an aside Rocky, how does this relate to the topic of this thread.
I tried to limit mod action to posts that either WERE political or responded to posts that were political. There were some that responded to a response to a response... i tried to keep anything that lost all trace of politics.
IF a post had some politics but not all, the whole post went.
I didn't vet the video for political content. The title told me it probably wasn't, so i restored it on request.
Not claiming to have exercised this responsibility perfectly. But if i were being strict i could have stopped the thread at the first mention of Butler, PA.
I appreciate that you were not strict Raf because the issue was not to discuss political views but to discuss what evidence someone has to claim god had anything to do with an incident that involved a politician and a fireman.
It's all a bunch of guesswork made necessary because a hidden god won't show up and speak for himself.
I heard today this great quote from Christopher Hitchens - "It’s called faith because it’s not knowledge.”
Non-believers are not just disagreeing with them but with their God.
I get a sense that you do believe in a God that exists, otherwise why all the disagreement? And therein lies the great sin, thinking that we are smarter than, more moral than, more just than, more reasonable than, more loving than God himself who doesn't always reveal why things happened the way they did and also allows ungodly things to happen. And yet Jesus amazingly overcame the greatest injustice of all.
I get a sense that you do believe in a God that exists, otherwise why all the disagreement? And therein lies the great sin, thinking that we are smarter than, more moral than, more just than, more reasonable than, more loving than God himself who doesn't always reveal why things happened the way they did and also allows ungodly things to happen. And yet Jesus amazingly overcame the greatest injustice of all.
I get where you are coming from because I was there too - for over 5 decades. What "greatest injustice" are you referring to?
I get a sense that you do believe in a God that exists, otherwise why all the disagreement? And therein lies the great sin, thinking that we are smarter than, more moral than, more just than, more reasonable than, more loving than God himself who doesn't always reveal why things happened the way they did and also allows ungodly things to happen. And yet Jesus amazingly overcame the greatest injustice of all.
I’m going to go ahead and assume that the “greatest injustice of all” is the story of Adam and Eve since it introduced the concept of sin into the world. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong.
If taken as being true, it simply shows one man was capable of undoing God’s perfect creation which, imo, makes God pretty inept. If taken to be a myth that teaches some moral lesson, that’s cool, but it is devoid of a god’s authority and authorship.
Concerning your "great sin" reference, below is part of my post from my "Sin and the Need for Perfect Love" thread.
On 9/19/2024 at 2:41 PM, Charity said:
Continuing then with both the topic of “beleefs” and this “Sin and the Need for Perfect Love” thread, the doctrine of sin - from its origin in Genesis to the need for Jesus’ life, death and resurrection to today’s Christianity - is a major beleef for which there is no evidence. It is also a harmful beleef in many ways.
On the other hand, behavioral science studies human actions through observation, experimentation, and the testing of theories against the evidence obtained. It includes the fields of neurology, sociology, social and cultural anthropology, psychology, and behavioral aspects of biology, economics, geography, law, psychiatry, and political science.
The ancient explanation of negative and positive human behavior boiled down to a simplistic beleef in mythical and/or mystical gods whose histories can be researched.
Today’s multi-disciplined understanding of negative and positive human behavior is complex and much can be learned from reading up on them. They are helpful in many ways.
I agree with your first part. Can you say more about your last sentence. I don't think this god (if he exists) is either.
Thanks,
If you claim to be morally superior and have the power to prevent a wicked act like child rape, but you allow it to happen, are you morally superior?
If you have the power to permit something, then you have the power to prevent it. To permit wickedness when you have the power to prevent it is, well, wickedness itself
Again, Yuval Noah Harari isn't a politician. Isn't a pundit. Isn't a journalist. He's an historian. His latest book is Nexus and it's about the history of INFORMATION NETWORKS. He HAS called attention to the urgency figuring out how to deal with the implication and ramifications of AI. Rightly so.
That I mentioned the urgency for guardrails to be established for development of AI is a universal concern.
Get over yourself, Raf. Not everything that people actually SHOULD pay attention to is politics.
No, that us NOT rationalization.
It's moderating a board where no politics is a rule. So when someone brings up politics, we need to decide how to respond. In the past, political posts have been deleted. No warning.
What happened here was, political posts went up. People replied. Others replied to the replies. Dome of the replies to replies to replies were political and some were not.
Some of these non-political replies make no sense unless you know the political post it was replying to.
Everyone misstepped on this one. Maybe I misstepped when I didn't delete the first mention of Butler.
The point Charity tried to illustrate was that it's ___ to say God spared someone in a certain situation when someone else in the same situation was not spared. Unfortunately she chose an example steeped in politics. And that opened the door to Oldiesman responding with an implication that God's favor is on a particular politician.
And THAT opens the door to a conversation about whether God intervened in Butler and, if he did, whether He did so because of politics.
That got shut down.
Discuss God's views on politics anywhere but here. We shut down politics YEARS ago.
The only question that remains is how much of the thread to retain and how much to delete because of politics.
I am so sowwy if i huwt yo feewings in trying to make a reasonable determination of what to keep instead of deleting everything that followed oldiesman's post as responses to politics. Which I would have been completely within the board's right to do.
Get over myself? Hold up a mirror when you say that.
It's moderating a board where no politics is a rule. So when someone brings up politics, we need to decide how to respond. In the past, political posts have been deleted. No warning.
What happened here was, political posts went up. People replied. Others replied to the replies. Dome of the replies to replies to replies were political and some were not.
Some of these non-political replies make no sense unless you know the political post it was replying to.
Everyone misstepped on this one. Maybe I misstepped when I didn't delete the first mention of Butler.
The point Charity tried to illustrate was that it's ___ to say God spared someone in a certain situation when someone else in the same situation was not spared. Unfortunately she chose an example steeped in politics. And that opened the door to Oldiesman responding with an implication that God's favor is on a particular politician.
And THAT opens the door to a conversation about whether God intervened in Butler and, if he did, whether He did so because of politics.
That got shut down.
Discuss God's views on politics anywhere but here. We shut down politics YEARS ago.
The only question that remains is how much of the thread to retain and how much to delete because of politics.
I am so sowwy if i huwt yo feewings in trying to make a reasonable determination of what to keep instead of deleting everything that followed oldiesman's post as responses to politics. Which I would have been completely within the board's right to do.
Get over myself? Hold up a mirror when you say that.
YES, it was a rationalization. You didn't hurt my feelings. You can't make a "reasonable determination" about my posts/comments without actually knowing what said comments are.
Recommended Posts
Top Posters In This Topic
77
47
92
214
Popular Days
May 18
36
May 13
28
Nov 13
24
May 16
24
Top Posters In This Topic
Raf 77 posts
Rocky 47 posts
Nathan_Jr 92 posts
Charity 214 posts
Popular Days
May 18 2024
36 posts
May 13 2024
28 posts
Nov 13 2024
24 posts
May 16 2024
24 posts
Popular Posts
waysider
Yeah, see. That kinda leaves us between a rock and a hard place. We were either following the teachings of a man with devil spirits or he was wrong about what he taught. That means he could have been
Raf
I consider myself humanist as well. Since there is no hierarchy in humanism, no one really gets to define it. This website gathers various definitions that permit us to ascertain some kind of co
Nathan_Jr
I don't know if they accept the science or not, but I suspect it doesn't matter to them either way because of the new earth. If anything, I could see them pointing to climate change as evidence of the
Posted Images
Charity
Finally, a use for that emoji! You're quite witty to think of it!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
modcat5
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
That be the one. Thanks!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
This is a recent event that has to do with why I started this thread.
Shortly after the Christian woman I wrote about previously said she would continue praying for my grandson’s health, he had a drastic improvement. He was consistently much happier and was having only the occasional minor seizure. I immediately had to deal with the idea that God (who I no longer believed existed) was answering her prayers.
Although there was also a small change made to his medication, previous changes (and there were many of them) had resulted in only a temporary improvement or none at all. So, there was no way of knowing for sure if this change was causing what was happening.
The relief from seeing him this new way felt wonderful and we were all truly thankful. As a Christian, I would have had no doubt that this was coming from a loving and caring God. As an atheist though, I obviously had my doubts, but I couldn’t outright dismiss the possibility.
The consideration to “give God the glory” was tempting mostly because of how thankful I was and previously, I had always given that thanksgiving to God. However, I eventually realized that my reaction was indeed a nostalgic feeling based on those from the past which I now know were never based on factual evidence and that the things I had learned over the past few months about the many problems with God’s morality and the authenticity of the bible still remained real and rational.
Since then, my grandson continues to have some bad seizures but they are much fewer and farther in between than what they had been for so long and for this present reality, I’m most thankful.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
Harari does NOT get political. He's a historian. I was not asked for clarification about any potential political post I may have made.
It simply disappeared without comment.
While public policy decisions WILL need to be made regarding regulation of AI, and done soon, the only possible political implication was whether or not humanity would allow for AI to build further generations of AI that would/could reduce our capacity for self-determination.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
I noticed yesterday for the first time that when I googled a question, AI was the first response.
Edited by CharityLink to comment
Share on other sites
Raf
I tried to limit mod action to posts that either WERE political or responded to posts that were political. There were some that responded to a response to a response... i tried to keep anything that lost all trace of politics.
IF a post had some politics but not all, the whole post went.
I didn't vet the video for political content. The title told me it probably wasn't, so i restored it on request.
Not claiming to have exercised this responsibility perfectly. But if i were being strict i could have stopped the thread at the first mention of Butler, PA.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
Isn't that what's called rationalization?
Again, Yuval Noah Harari isn't a politician. Isn't a pundit. Isn't a journalist. He's an historian. His latest book is Nexus and it's about the history of INFORMATION NETWORKS. He HAS called attention to the urgency figuring out how to deal with the implication and ramifications of AI. Rightly so.
That I mentioned the urgency for guardrails to be established for development of AI is a universal concern.
Get over yourself, Raf. Not everything that people actually SHOULD pay attention to is politics.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
If you feel the need to "VET" something I post as political, freakin' ask me for clarification.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Nathan_Jr
Wow.
I saw the politics and winced in anticipation of moderation. After my last coaching, I studied to make myself approved, a greaser unashamed, accurately avoiding politics while handling Lamsa's bullshonta translation with parody and satire by typing with my thumbs and believing in my heart, "mmmmph."
I suppose I didn't study hard enough - in the Elizabethan sense, that is.
Edited by Nathan_JrIt's debatable, but no one hates orange more than I.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
Just as an aside Rocky, how does this relate to the topic of this thread.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
I appreciate that you were not strict Raf because the issue was not to discuss political views but to discuss what evidence someone has to claim god had anything to do with an incident that involved a politician and a fireman.
It's all a bunch of guesswork made necessary because a hidden god won't show up and speak for himself.
I heard today this great quote from Christopher Hitchens - "It’s called faith because it’s not knowledge.”
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oldiesman
I get a sense that you do believe in a God that exists, otherwise why all the disagreement? And therein lies the great sin, thinking that we are smarter than, more moral than, more just than, more reasonable than, more loving than God himself who doesn't always reveal why things happened the way they did and also allows ungodly things to happen. And yet Jesus amazingly overcame the greatest injustice of all.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
I get where you are coming from because I was there too - for over 5 decades. What "greatest injustice" are you referring to?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
I’m going to go ahead and assume that the “greatest injustice of all” is the story of Adam and Eve since it introduced the concept of sin into the world. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong.
If taken as being true, it simply shows one man was capable of undoing God’s perfect creation which, imo, makes God pretty inept. If taken to be a myth that teaches some moral lesson, that’s cool, but it is devoid of a god’s authority and authorship.
Concerning your "great sin" reference, below is part of my post from my "Sin and the Need for Perfect Love" thread.
Edited by CharityLink to comment
Share on other sites
Nathan_Jr
This god as described can't be both more moral and amoral simultaneously. To borrow a phrase from that charlatan: it's a glove that doesn't fit.
Either this god is perfectly moral or all powerful. Can't be both.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
I agree with your first part. Can you say more about your last sentence. I don't think this god (if he exists) is either.
Thanks,
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Nathan_Jr
If you claim to be morally superior and have the power to prevent a wicked act like child rape, but you allow it to happen, are you morally superior?
If you have the power to permit something, then you have the power to prevent it. To permit wickedness when you have the power to prevent it is, well, wickedness itself
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
Deconversion will become massively more rampant as AI advances.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
At least from the mortal human perspective.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
The first half hour so far has been interesting. Thanks for sharing it Rocky.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
modcat5
No, that us NOT rationalization.
It's moderating a board where no politics is a rule. So when someone brings up politics, we need to decide how to respond. In the past, political posts have been deleted. No warning.
What happened here was, political posts went up. People replied. Others replied to the replies. Dome of the replies to replies to replies were political and some were not.
Some of these non-political replies make no sense unless you know the political post it was replying to.
Everyone misstepped on this one. Maybe I misstepped when I didn't delete the first mention of Butler.
The point Charity tried to illustrate was that it's ___ to say God spared someone in a certain situation when someone else in the same situation was not spared. Unfortunately she chose an example steeped in politics. And that opened the door to Oldiesman responding with an implication that God's favor is on a particular politician.
And THAT opens the door to a conversation about whether God intervened in Butler and, if he did, whether He did so because of politics.
That got shut down.
Discuss God's views on politics anywhere but here. We shut down politics YEARS ago.
The only question that remains is how much of the thread to retain and how much to delete because of politics.
I am so sowwy if i huwt yo feewings in trying to make a reasonable determination of what to keep instead of deleting everything that followed oldiesman's post as responses to politics. Which I would have been completely within the board's right to do.
Get over myself? Hold up a mirror when you say that.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
YES, it was a rationalization. You didn't hurt my feelings. You can't make a "reasonable determination" about my posts/comments without actually knowing what said comments are.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
modcat5
Ok, i'm done arguing.
Do not post politics.
Do not post in response to a post about politics.
If i need to err on the side of scorched earth to be consistent I will do so.
I would much rather try to apply some reason, but if that's going to result in accusations of needing to get over myself, screw it.
Thanks
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.