Forgiveness

[Ham]

That is what happened in the sixties, wasn't it..  I had a few interesting experiences in the early seventies.  I don't mind sharing.  Some jackass put about fifty hits of acid in the pipe and at least mentioned that we were going to trip after the smoke.. and yes, a lot of it survives the burning process.

About ten minutes later it hit..

we walked about a mile and a half along the most beautiful landscape to the local burger king for a meal.  It seemed to be about 10,000 years.

I met two of the worst bullies I dealt with in school at the restaurant..  this was after high school graduation.

They frigging begged for forgiveness.  Humbly.  they did not notice my dilated eyes..  I am seeing  eternity flashing before my eyes.. heh

Compare their actions to eternity?  No Big Deal.  In terms of god and the universe..  I said.. no big deal.  You're off the hook as far as I am concerned..  I'm nothing here..

 

I feel the same today.

 

Maybe forgiveness needs some help along the way.. I dunno.

 

 

[Ham]

This kind of experience is a roll of cosmic dice.. sometimes it does not work out in the way that one particularly would like..

 

professionally of course it's probably cost me a few Million..  but that is Not exactly a Big Deal.  Life owes me nothing.  How about you?

[Ham]

The lack of debt works both ways..

 

heh.

[Stayed Too Long]

On 9/5/2023 at 6:22 AM, chockfull said:

This is at best a partial statement that conveys none of the details surrounding the related verses.

Jesus 70x7 statement is in the context of the person committing the wrong asking for forgiveness, evidencing remorse, but falling short.  

Wrongly dividing scripture and reaching a conclusion where a victim should be blamed but a perpetrator should be excused is about the worst example of Christianity I can think of.  It shows worse than any other religion I can think of who would hold perpetrators accountable.

 

Maybe you can get me on the right track and rightly divide scripture for me about forgiveness, and show me how I have wrongly divided the word of truth? 

[chockfull]

6 minutes ago, Stayed Too Long said:

Maybe you can get me on the right track and rightly divide scripture for me about forgiveness, and show me how I have wrongly divided the word of truth? 

I’ll pass.

[Stayed Too Long]

On 9/5/2023 at 7:19 AM, So_crates said:

Why would someone come onto a place where Way victims congregate and start talking about forgiving?

In a previous post I wrote how other people had to forgive their wrong doers, and only then could they move on with their lives. That is why I started talking about forgiveness.

Do you think we haven't forgiven all the evil The Way brought?

Some may have and some may have not. If they have forgiven, according to the article I quoted, they have a better chance of moving on with their lives.

There's forgiving, then there's warning others. If someone mugged me in certain place I could forgive the mugger. However, I would also warn other to stay away from the place were the mugging occurred.

 

[Stayed Too Long]

On 9/5/2023 at 5:29 PM, chockfull said:

You mean because I actually read the verses related to the topic as opposed to just buying your one-line mandate about forgiveness?  And ask detailed questions?

Also, you’re an @sshat who comes on a forum and tells victims what they need to be doing according to you as opposed to what they are currently doing.  That is called victim blaming you dense jackfoot.  You’re blaming them for their current state because according to you His Highness they haven’t forgiven their abuser so they aren’t delivered.

The fact that you don’t care what God thinks by your own mouth means you are a disingenuous jackfoot troll for baiting all of us in this conversation.

 

 

An @sshat, dense jackfoot, & disingenuous jackfoot troll, eh? 
No where has “His Highness” attempted to victim blame. I merely said that another person had said they had to forgive their wrong doers before they were able to move on with their life. If you don’t deem it necessary to forgive those who have wronged you, I have no qualm with that. 
Just because I don’t care what god thinks doesn’t mean I can’t read what he has said and put it in print. 

[So_crates]

33 minutes ago, Stayed Too Long said:

In a previous post I wrote how other people had to forgive their wrong doers, and only then could they move on with their lives. That is why I started talking about forgiveness

I think many of us here have done a brilliant job of moving on with our lives. We've succeed not because of, but in spite of the Way.

33 minutes ago, Stayed Too Long said:

 

Some may have and some may have not. If they have forgiven, according to the article I quoted, they have a better chance of moving on with their lives.

We've moved on, we're in it won't happen again mode.

Methinks thou protests too much. What haven't you forgiven and is stopping you from moving on with your life?

[Stayed Too Long]

On 9/5/2023 at 9:14 PM, chockfull said:

I can forgive Stayed.  Well within my capabilities.  Has he asked for forgiveness?  Sounds to me more like a lecture hit and run.  We get quite a lot of those on this site actually.  Lecture hit and runs.  Is he of a mentally impaired or unaware state where he “knows not what he does”?  
Let me make this clear….I have not asked for your forgiveness because I have done nothing to seek your forgivemess. “A lecture hit and run?” I have never avoided any responses directed at me. Fire away! 
Apparently, because I do not agree with you and your God, I might be mentally impaired or in an unaware state? Does that follow anyone who doesn’t fall in line with your belief’s might be mentally impaired also?

LCM too.  Knew him personally.  He has never asked for my forgiveness for anything.  Right now he is teaching new interpretations of books of the Bible to an imaginary internet audience and none of those teachings seem to carry any awareness of being wrong or changing.  His own daughter has posted on here concerned about his ongoing influence.

I mean sure I’ve got my version of Jesus blanket forgiveness for those who are unaware of their evil impact.  
Care to share your version of Jesus’ blanket forgiveness? Are you sure it is a right dividing of the word of truth?

Do these two examples fit the bill?

Where does the verse in Romans about not taking vengeance because vengeance is the Lords fit in?  If the Lord always forgave everyone and required everyone else to then what would He have to take vengeance on?

This whole topic and the wrong dividing of scripture around it by the cult TWI has kept more people in bondage and whitewashed more evil by leaders than any other I know.

Quiet a statement! 
 

 

[Stayed Too Long]

8 minutes ago, So_crates said:

I think many of us here have done a brilliant job of moving on with our lives. We've succeed not because of, but in spite of the Way.

We've moved on, we're in it won't happen again mode.

Methinks thou protests too much. What haven't you forgiven and is stopping you from moving on with your life?

I have not questioned if you have forgiven anyone. If you have, or haven’t, that is fine with me. Move on with your life, or don’t move on with your life, that is completely up to you. 
I merely stated that a person had written in an article, and said they had to forgive their wrong doer before they could move on with their life. 
If that might help anyone in a similar situation, then wonderful. If the advise is not applicable to anyone in a similar situation, that is wonderful.

[chockfull]

42 minutes ago, Stayed Too Long said:

An @sshat, dense jackfoot, & disingenuous jackfoot troll, eh? 
No where has “His Highness” attempted to victim blame. I merely said that another person had said they had to forgive their wrong doers before they were able to move on with their life. If you don’t deem it necessary to forgive those who have wronged you, I have no qualm with that. 
Just because I don’t care what god thinks doesn’t mean I can’t read what he has said and put it in print. 

What it does mean is that you are still trolling up disingenuous arguments that have nothing to do with your beliefs.  To me that distracts from people like the one on the Reddit article that really want to recover from TWI.

And yes your beliefs have everything to do with what you can and can’t read.  

[chockfull]

1 hour ago, Stayed Too Long said:

Maybe you can get me on the right track and rightly divide scripture for me about forgiveness, and show me how I have wrongly divided the word of truth? 

Trolloolllolloolllolloooollllllolioo

Every man is right in his own eyes.

Edited September 26, 2023 by chockfull

[Stayed Too Long]

3 minutes ago, chockfull said:

What it does mean is that you are still trolling up disingenuous arguments that have nothing to do with your beliefs.  To me that distracts from people like the one on the Reddit article that really want to recover from TWI.

And yes your beliefs have everything to do with what you can and can’t read.  
This dense jackfoot statement really gets a chuckle out of me! Oops, I forgot to throw in how @sshat it sounds, also.

 

[chockfull]

17 minutes ago, Stayed Too Long said:

I have not questioned if you have forgiven anyone. If you have, or haven’t, that is fine with me. Move on with your life, or don’t move on with your life, that is completely up to you. 
I merely stated that a person had written in an article, and said they had to forgive their wrong doer before they could move on with their life. 
If that might help anyone in a similar situation, then wonderful. If the advise is not applicable to anyone in a similar situation, that is wonderful.

This answer is disengeneous.  You are drumming up arguments here not “merely stating” an article quote.  

[chockfull]

2 minutes ago, Stayed Too Long said:

 

You’re easily entertained.  Wait until the real autocorrect power kicks in.  

[Stayed Too Long]

2 hours ago, chockfull said:

You’re easily entertained.  Wait until the real autocorrect power kicks in.  

 

 

When logic and good sense fail, all that is left is playing their ace in the hole….Judgement Day. “You just wait, someday you will stand before God and He will punish you for not agreeing with me. Waa Waaa Waaaa”

[chockfull]

32 minutes ago, Stayed Too Long said:

 

 

When logic and good sense fail, all that is left is playing their ace in the hole….Judgement Day. “You just wait, someday you will stand before God and He will punish you for not agreeing with me. Waa Waaa Waaaa”

Actually I meant the quote was literally autocorrected.

But please carry on with your inner dialogue.

[Rocky]

34 minutes ago, chockfull said:

Actually I meant the quote was literally autocorrected.

But please carry on with your inner dialogue.

 I wish each of you a lifetime of happiness, joy, and healing. 

[OldSkool]

There is literally no place in scripture that requires anybody to forgive so the person who was wronged can move on in life...thats utter BS. We shoudnt harbor bitterness or take vengance into our own hands, but forgiveness is given to the one who comitted the offence(s) after they repent and ask for it. Obviously, we can intercede and ask for forgiveness for someone else the same way Christ did with the malefactor or where Christ spoke of those who crucified him saying forgive them for they know not what they do.

Offshoots, and I mean all of them. Offshoots of the way international have a VESTED interest in requiring victims forgive predator victor paul wierwille, et al., because how else can they keep people roped in, giving them money so they can have cushy little jobs at the local home church office?

Jesus himself taught:

Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

[Stayed Too Long]

10 hours ago, OldSkool said:

There is literally no place in scripture that requires anybody to forgive so the person who was wronged can move on in life...thats utter BS.

Glad we agree on that OldSkool. If you heard such nonsense it probably might have been on another forum or post.

We shoudnt harbor bitterness or take vengance into our own hands, but forgiveness is given to the one who comitted the offence(s) after they repent and ask for it. Obviously, we can intercede and ask for forgiveness for someone else the same way Christ did with the malefactor or where Christ spoke of those who crucified him saying forgive them for they know not what they do.

Offshoots, and I mean all of them. Offshoots of the way international have a VESTED interest in requiring victims forgive predator victor paul wierwille,

I didn’t realize the offshoots thought VPW did anything wrong that would to require forgiveness. They believe each is carrying on the same word of God taught by the good doctor.

et al., because how else can they keep people roped in, giving them money so they can have cushy little jobs at the local home church office?

Jesus himself taught:

Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

 

[chockfull]

Hmmm.  The “utter BS” that OS was referring to pretty much was started by Stayed who held a different position earlier that God did require forgiveness on the part of the wronged.

Now he has flipped the script.

To me that is clear evidence of either a complete change of heart or of the fact that Stayed is deliberately trolling topics he has no belief in.

[OldSkool]

11 hours ago, Stayed Too Long said:

I didn’t realize the offshoots thought VPW did anything wrong that would to require forgiveness. They believe each is carrying on the same word of God taught by the good doctor.

The offshoots know dang good and well that victor Paul wierwille had issues as long as train smoke. They knowingly suppress this information on a false pretense of requiring forgiveness from victims when nobody has stepped up to ask forgiveness and make amends. They all do it. Cff, stfi, tltf, etc. It's just as bad as doing the deed because truth is suppressed in favor of an idolatrous lie.

[Nathan_Jr]

12 minutes ago, OldSkool said:

stepped up to ask forgiveness and make amends

This is such an important step when done from the heart. Asking for forgiveness and honestly attempting to make amends is liberating, even if forgiveness is not granted and amends are not possible. 

[Rocky]

8 hours ago, chockfull said:

Now he has flipped the script.

To me that is clear evidence of either a complete change of heart or of the fact that Stayed is deliberately trolling topics he has no belief in.

Are you asking STL for clarification???? Are you sure those are the only two possibilities?

Edited September 28, 2023 by Rocky

[Charity]

On 9/27/2023 at 2:51 PM, OldSkool said:

There is literally no place in scripture that requires anybody to forgive so the person who was wronged can move on in life...thats utter BS. We shoudnt harbor bitterness or take vengance into our own hands, but forgiveness is given to the one who comitted the offence(s) after they repent and ask for it. Obviously, we can intercede and ask for forgiveness for someone else the same way Christ did with the malefactor or where Christ spoke of those who crucified him saying forgive them for they know not what they do.

Offshoots, and I mean all of them. Offshoots of the way international have a VESTED interest in requiring victims forgive predator victor paul wierwille, et al., because how else can they keep people roped in, giving them money so they can have cushy little jobs at the local home church office?

Jesus himself taught:

Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

 

5 hours ago, OldSkool said:

The offshoots know dang good and well that victor Paul wierwille had issues as long as train smoke. They knowingly suppress this information on a false pretense of requiring forgiveness from victims when nobody has stepped up to ask forgiveness and make amends. They all do it. Cff, stfi, tltf, etc. It's just as bad as doing the deed because truth is suppressed in favor of an idolatrous lie.

Thank you for calling out those in twi who put the responsibility of forgiveness on the victim when the offender has never repented and asked for it.   

1 John 1:9 clearly says confession of sin is a requirement for God's forgiveness, so why would that requirement be removed for us when dealing with those who have sinned against us. 

I think this parable in Matthew 18 shows this along with other truths as well, and I was wondering what others think about this example Jesus gave of forgiveness.

23Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants. 24And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents. 25But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. 26The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 27Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt. 28But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest. 29And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 30And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt. 31So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done. 32Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me: 33Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee? 34And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him. 35So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.

 

Edited September 28, 2023 by Charity