Not seeing an overall positive effect? Are you exaggerating? Or are you talking just about yourself?
Like Soylent Green, Grease Spot Café is made of people– so it’s NOT one voice – but manyvoices – INDIVIDUALS expressing feelings, observations, anecdotes, therapies, etc., - speaking just for myself - it’s done me a lot of good.
For a couple of reasons I disagree with your similar evaluation of TWI and Grease Spot Café. For one thing when a cult-survivor conveys they have the same unreasonably suspicious or mistrustful attitude toward Grease Spot as they do toward TWI, I tend to think they might need to regain confidence in their own cognitive skills.
And the other thing is the difference in agenda - - TWI and Grease Spot are a million miles apart. TWI’s publicly stated agenda on their website looks benign – but underneath the façade are the programs and groupthink dynamics to indoctrinate followers.
Grease Spot’s purpose is to provide a platform for individuals to tell the other side of that cult – there is no censorship – so there’s a mixed bag of input from each Grease Spotter. There might be a gazillion little agendas if you add up why people read and post here.
One of the things I like to do is offer little tidbits of ideas and resources to pique the interest and curiosity of TWI-followers – maybe something will draw them out of that rigid and enslaving mindset...as I said before, that desire to escapemust come from within the person.
I read a fascinating bookChanging Minds: The Art and Science of Changing Our Own and Other Peoples Minds by Howard Gardner . What intrigued me was the author explaining the inner workings of how folks change their minds – this goes much deeper than analyzing external factors like brainwashing, sales gimmicks or browbeating. Gardner talks about these ‘levers’ in our minds - like different research and analysis departments – that an idea must go through and get vetted. When I say vetted - does it pass the smell test? The young and naive do not have well-developed cognitive skills, so they're more likely to fall for scams.
The book even has a chapter that gets into the conversion of Paul on the road to Damascus…I read this book AFTER I left TWI, but it helped me understand how TWI was so successful at indoctrinating me. It was by the finesse and sometimes brute force of their manipulative tactics – that they could either sweet talk their way or bully their way through the various mental research and analysis departments.
TWI is indiscriminate like a bomb – it doesn’t care about the lives it destroys. The people of Grease Spot have helped – and continue to help others survive that 'bomb'.
There's a lot here I don't disagree with you on T-Bone. I don't think all the good things are dependent on GSC or the internet. All can be accomplished without the internet.
The Way International is people. Face to face.
GSC is not people. There are people interacting with screens. Screens are not people. The discussion of voices is interesting. Are we really individuals on the internet? Are we really ourselves when minds are interfaced with machines?
I think a lot of what's described on these boards are about times before the existence of the internet. Since the rise of the internet, cults and their derivatives haven't gone away, simply changed. You can imagine things may have been different if the internet existed in this form in the 60s, but VPW I can guess would have adapted as well.
(I'll revisit this to add more - you touched on a lot)
I suspect nothing. I don't know. What do they do to ex-JWs? What do they do to ex-Scientologists?
What do you think they would do?
Shunning is something everyone does, I think. Most people only need hear TWI leaders did gawd knows what to shun a follower who had nothing to do with it. Simple numbers game. Human nature. Rational precaution.
Lots of people here don't give their real names, reasons could be TWI is reading, or strangers outside TWI are reading. TWI is ultimately the lesser danger. (It's dying and we are familiar with them).
Your post is unclear. To say that "GSC seeks to harm indiscriminately" is false.
What a broad brush you use.
GSC is not a living being. Not in the sense a cat or a human being is. It's information that is a double edged sword. Focusing on the positive does not mean the negative ceases to exist.
Asking questions, free from censorship..... is EMPOWERING.
When the mind is free from twi-censorship.... questions flow freely. In my opinion, one begins to realize how many more questions he/she has pent up inside the crevices of this "renewed mind." LOL. A healthy mind is a questioning mind.
Did wierwille and company really think that we would "stay on the pfal-farm" a lifetime.... repeating its mantra as an invocation to this mythical, pfal-god? How insane is THAT? Only a narcissist could ever imagine concluding such a scenario for his followers. Same goes for all of their "advanced" study classes. Most all of these classes have been redone or tweaked over the years and "The Way Tree" class was completely discarded. Thank you Johnnie Townsend for that class... NOT. As so many posters have said.... such drumbeating of repetition is insanity.
Some question wierwille/twi only to a certain point.... and then stop. That's NOT empowering, that's not freedom. They are STILL tethered to certain aspects of twi's conditioning. It doesn't matter if they exit twi or not.... they are still way-brained by indoctrination.
Asking questions, free from censorship..... is EMPOWERING.
Try it. You'll like it.
I am not connecting anything you say here to GSC. Perhaps many matters are being conflated with GSC? "free from censorship" - these things existed before the internet?
What did the internet bring into being that wasn't there before?
I fundamentally disagree, maybe numerous people in TWI did not see the dangers until the internet, but plenty of people outside of TWI prior to the internet did see them.
Shunning is something everyone does, I think. Most people only need hear TWI leaders did gawd knows what to shun a follower who had nothing to do with it. Simple numbers game. Human nature. Rational precaution.
Lots of people here don't give their real names, reasons could be TWI is reading, or strangers outside TWI are reading. TWI is ultimately the lesser danger. (It's dying and we are familiar with them).
Shunning. Ok, fair. But who is doing the shunning? Who is responsible?
I never met a more divisive group of human beings prone to shunning literally everyone but their own insular group than the VPW-following family into which I married. That relationship was the most devastatingly destructive I have ever known.
I wish I had followed my instincts in the beginning. I wish had understood NPD. I wish I had known GSC.
GSC is not a living being. Not in the sense a cat or a human being is. It's information that is a double edged sword. Focusing on the positive does not mean the negative ceases to exist.
What IS GSC according to your construct?
BTW, you said, "The Way International is people." TWI is NOT people. TWI is a formal ORGANIZATION or ENTITY organized by laws of Ohio and/or federal government.
There's a lot here I don't disagree with you on T-Bone. I don't think all the good things are dependent on GSC or the internet. All can be accomplished without the internet.
Take away technology and it will take you a lot longer to accomplish some things.
5 hours ago, Bolshevik said:
The Way International is people. Face to face.
Technically a corporation – an entity registered under a state’s operating laws. It has a corporate body of officers – people with official titles of responsibility. I assume they occasionally meet face-to-face. Followers of TWI are organized around a hierarchy power structure – those at the top of the pyramid – the big dawgz - oversee those below mostly by trickle-down-directives – - maybe some face-to-face – - probably more by phone, emails and seances “speak oh great and wise wierwille”. Finally, we get down to the peon / Twig level, that’s probablymostly face-to-face and where money is collected in abundant sharing and class fees and sent to headquarters for the big dawgz to divey up.
5 hours ago, Bolshevik said:
GSC is not people. There are people interacting with screens. Screens are not people. The discussion of voices is interesting. Are we really individuals on the internet? Are we really ourselves when minds are interfaced with machines?
Technically Grease Spot Café is a human/technology combination. How do I know these other people that I’m interacting with on the internet are really who they say they are? How does anyone on Grease Spot know what I’m really like? To be honest - I’m not that well-spoken – I use the internet / word processor / thesaurus to find a suitable synonym or clear definition. But I know this much – when I draft a reply and post it on Grease Spot – it is exactly how little old human me on a dinky laptop at home drafted it. Nothing has changed. Moral of the story – trust no one and just believe in yourself.
5 hours ago, Bolshevik said:
I think a lot of what's described on these boards are about times before the existence of the internet. Since the rise of the internet, cults and their derivatives haven't gone away, simply changed. You can imagine things may have been different if the internet existed in this form in the 60s, but VPW I can guess would have adapted as well.
(I'll revisit this to add more - you touched on a lot)
Technology is a double-edged sword. Some folks are attracted to the dark side of the force.
Technically Grease Spot Café is a human/technology combination. How do I know these other people that I’m interacting with on the internet are really who they say they are? How does anyone on Grease Spot know what I’m really like? To be honest - I’m not that well-spoken – I use the internet / word processor / thesaurus to find a suitable synonym or clear definition. But I know this much – when I draft a reply and post it on Grease Spot – it is exactly how little old human me on a dinky laptop at home drafted it. Nothing has changed. Moral of the story – trust no one and just believe in yourself.
Makes one wonder these days whether or to what extent ChatGPT will take over the world... or at least internet forums.
I spoke with my 12 and 10 year old grandkids this evening and they know about AI and ChatGPT... maybe more than I do.
Recommended Posts
Bolshevik
There's a lot here I don't disagree with you on T-Bone. I don't think all the good things are dependent on GSC or the internet. All can be accomplished without the internet.
The Way International is people. Face to face.
GSC is not people. There are people interacting with screens. Screens are not people. The discussion of voices is interesting. Are we really individuals on the internet? Are we really ourselves when minds are interfaced with machines?
I think a lot of what's described on these boards are about times before the existence of the internet. Since the rise of the internet, cults and their derivatives haven't gone away, simply changed. You can imagine things may have been different if the internet existed in this form in the 60s, but VPW I can guess would have adapted as well.
(I'll revisit this to add more - you touched on a lot)
Edited by BolshevikLink to comment
Share on other sites
Bolshevik
Shunning is something everyone does, I think. Most people only need hear TWI leaders did gawd knows what to shun a follower who had nothing to do with it. Simple numbers game. Human nature. Rational precaution.
Lots of people here don't give their real names, reasons could be TWI is reading, or strangers outside TWI are reading. TWI is ultimately the lesser danger. (It's dying and we are familiar with them).
Edited by BolshevikLink to comment
Share on other sites
Bolshevik
GSC is not a living being. Not in the sense a cat or a human being is. It's information that is a double edged sword. Focusing on the positive does not mean the negative ceases to exist.
Edited by BolshevikLink to comment
Share on other sites
Bolshevik
I am not connecting anything you say here to GSC. Perhaps many matters are being conflated with GSC? "free from censorship" - these things existed before the internet?
What did the internet bring into being that wasn't there before?
I fundamentally disagree, maybe numerous people in TWI did not see the dangers until the internet, but plenty of people outside of TWI prior to the internet did see them.
Edited by BolshevikLink to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
Easy access to anonymity.
The flip side is it also brought easy access to exposure.
The balance isn't always equitable.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Nathan_Jr
Shunning. Ok, fair. But who is doing the shunning? Who is responsible?
I never met a more divisive group of human beings prone to shunning literally everyone but their own insular group than the VPW-following family into which I married. That relationship was the most devastatingly destructive I have ever known.
I wish I had followed my instincts in the beginning. I wish had understood NPD. I wish I had known GSC.
Edited by Nathan_JrGloved grammar
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
What IS GSC according to your construct?
BTW, you said, "The Way International is people." TWI is NOT people. TWI is a formal ORGANIZATION or ENTITY organized by laws of Ohio and/or federal government.
Edited by RockyLink to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
Take away technology and it will take you a lot longer to accomplish some things.
Technically a corporation – an entity registered under a state’s operating laws. It has a corporate body of officers – people with official titles of responsibility. I assume they occasionally meet face-to-face. Followers of TWI are organized around a hierarchy power structure – those at the top of the pyramid – the big dawgz - oversee those below mostly by trickle-down-directives – - maybe some face-to-face – - probably more by phone, emails and seances “speak oh great and wise wierwille”. Finally, we get down to the peon / Twig level, that’s probably mostly face-to-face and where money is collected in abundant sharing and class fees and sent to headquarters for the big dawgz to divey up.
Technically Grease Spot Café is a human/technology combination. How do I know these other people that I’m interacting with on the internet are really who they say they are? How does anyone on Grease Spot know what I’m really like? To be honest - I’m not that well-spoken – I use the internet / word processor / thesaurus to find a suitable synonym or clear definition. But I know this much – when I draft a reply and post it on Grease Spot – it is exactly how little old human me on a dinky laptop at home drafted it. Nothing has changed. Moral of the story – trust no one and just believe in yourself.
Technology is a double-edged sword. Some folks are attracted to the dark side of the force.
Edited by T-BoneClarity
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
Makes one wonder these days whether or to what extent ChatGPT will take over the world... or at least internet forums.
I spoke with my 12 and 10 year old grandkids this evening and they know about AI and ChatGPT... maybe more than I do.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Twinky
You make a good point, Rocky.
In fact, there could be some pretty odd conversations between different Chat programs. Would they "realise"?
Edited by TwinkyLink to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.