Maybe I haven't been specific enough on the parallel thing. Evidently no one has a clue what I mean, and I guess all the time of their stay at TWI they never looked into this item.
When you have an old fashioned scale to weigh things, it looks a little like a child's see-saw. You then put the thing to be weighed on the Right seat of the see-saw, and its weight pushed the see-saw down on that side all the way to the ground.
So now the see-saw is at an angle where the Right seat is at 4 o'clock, and the Left seat is at 10 o'clock.
Then you put a small weight on the Left seat and watch what happens. If nothing happens then you put a little more weight on the Left seat. Eventually there will be enough weight on the Left seat to push that seat down and the Right seat up.
When you get just the right amount of weight on the Left seat, the see saw will balance, with the Left seat at 9 o'clock and the Right seat at 3 o'clock.
The weight on the Left seat EQUALS the unknown weight on the Right seat. The two weights are BALANCED, and the see-saw is PARALLEL to the ground.
This is what VPW was doing with his arms: positioning them to illustrate this. One arm represented the level ground, and the other arm represented the balanced scale weighing the needs on one side and the wants on the other side.
His arms were parallel, representing the needs and wants being parallel to the ground or balanced.
*/*/*
Now I have questions.
Where WERE your heads when you took the class?
Where WERE your heads when you entered the Corps and re-studied this stuff?
Why did you not ever question "parallel" long ago?
I think this is, once again, indicative of how poorly you all understood the class you now hate and criticize in nearly complete befuddlement on issue after issue.
Hate makes people stupid.
Its fun watching you invent your own religous theology out of thin air to keep your bronzed idol propped up.
These are valid assessments from me.
If you want to see insults look at what is directed at me all the time here.
But hate makes people stupid, so you may not be able to do this.
Dueces, Im off to get parallel with my mattress and see if I cant balance the remote in my hand as I send parallel waves through thin air so i can select my desired channel...now thats needs and wants parallel. I need to go lay on my behind and I want to watch some TV...deuces mr wizard!
Like so many of victor's pithy stories, the need/want fable doesn't deliver the lesson desired or perceived. MOREOVER, it makes little sense to clear minds upon honest, unbiased examination. Victor's general unpreparedness, histrionics and propensity for word salad are to blame. Combine all this with his arrogant expectation of a dull-minded, captive, committed and exhausted audience and you get... well, you know...
I have already provided an accurate and honest examination of the transcript from Mike. It really should be settled, but in case it's not, here's a brief summary:
Parallel fits, as I've explained. Victor mimed balance on set, but balance doesn't work in the fable as told. A need for shelter far, FAR outweighs a whimsical, materialistic want for red drapes. That scale is devilishly unbalanced. HOWEVER, drapes and shelter... seeeee?? Parallel. Lined up. It just fits. Geometry!
And probability. Statistics. You're more likely to get the drapes you want while in the process of fulfilling the need for shelter because the need and want go together like snowballs and Pete. Likewise, if you need transportation, you should line up your want for a car with that need. Bingo!
Isn't that wonderful? That there is how you work a word!
Maybe I haven't been specific enough on the parallel thing. Evidently no one has a clue what I mean, and I guess all the time of their stay at TWI they never looked into this item.
When you have an old fashioned scale to weigh things, it looks a little like a child's see-saw. You then put the thing to be weighed on the Right seat of the see-saw, and its weight pushed the see-saw down on that side all the way to the ground.
So now the see-saw is at an angle where the Right seat is at 4 o'clock, and the Left seat is at 10 o'clock.
Then you put a small weight on the Left seat and watch what happens. If nothing happens then you put a little more weight on the Left seat. Eventually there will be enough weight on the Left seat to push that seat down and the Right seat up.
When you get just the right amount of weight on the Left seat, the see saw will balance, with the Left seat at 9 o'clock and the Right seat at 3 o'clock.
The weight on the Left seat EQUALS the unknown weight on the Right seat. The two weights are BALANCED, and the see-saw is PARALLEL to the ground.
This is what VPW was doing with his arms: positioning them to illustrate this. One arm represented the level ground, and the other arm represented the balanced scale weighing the needs on one side and the wants on the other side.
His arms were parallel, representing the needs and wants being parallel to the ground or balanced.
*/*/*
Now I have questions.
Where WERE your heads when you took the class?
Where WERE your heads when you entered the Corps and re-studied this stuff?
Why did you not ever question "parallel" long ago?
I think this is, once again, indicative of how poorly you all understood the class you now hate and criticize in nearly complete befuddlement on issue after issue.
Hate makes people stupid.
Needing essential shelter is out of balance with wanting red drapes. Red drapes are WAY lighter than essential shelter.
I'm doing my best to handle responses and I pretty well handled my backlog. However, there was one comment that repeatedly slipped through my nets, but it was stuck in my memory, so I finally found it.
I had written the following:
On 4/28/2023 at 2:29 PM, Mike said:
God does the hard part in supplying what is said. We do simple, trivial, mechanical, fleshh actions, and God designed the human body with this S.I.T. stuff in mind, and He wanted to make it as easy as possible, so "no one gets missed."
Once again, your writings are unmistakably stupid!
according to youbut really - - I’m tempted to think it might be some turd of an idea you probably found up wierwille’s a$$- - let’s break that nonsense down:
Mike said:God does the hard part in supplying what is said.
What a gross misrepresentation of true worship…If God supplies the words then you’re saying God is a puppeteer .
1Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked, 2“Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don’t wash their hands before they eat!”
3Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? 4For God said, ‘Honor your father and mother’ and ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ 5But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is ‘devoted to God,’ 6they are not to ‘honor their father or mother’ with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. 7You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:
wierwille’s idea - - and apparently yours also, is that true worship is the fakery he taught in PFAL. You move your lips, tongue, mouth, etc., but do not think of the words. Expect God to supply the words. How utterly stupid for wierwille to teach that – and you’re doubly stupid for regurgitating it here. Where does the person’s heart fit in??????? Look at Matthew 15:8 - These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me…any 2-bit plagiarist, drunkard, thief pathological liar and sexual predator can honor God wit their lips – wierwille did that most of the time.
. And in light of you taking FOREVERto read a book that presents your idol wierwille in an unfavorable light and the fact that you don’t like to read anything but collaterals I recommend you skip ahead to, that I feel is a section that SHOULD be important to you pages 117 to 120. It’s the part where Kristen – working in housekeeping relates an incident when she placed a welcome letter on wierwille’s pillow in the Coachman Suite at Rome City – the note said she would “do anything to make his time more blessed here”.
The following night, after the evening teaching, wierwille called Kristen to his suite. He has a glass of Drambuie in one hand and a cigarette in the other – he sits very relaxed – he had taken off his suit coat and tie, the top button of his white shirt was undone, and his shoes were kicked off. He asks her to sit on the bed and they exchange some polite small talk. He then asks her if she really meant what she said in the little welcome note. “Of course,” she says.
Then wierwille says “Well, there is one thing you can do for me. I’d like you to take off your clothes. I’d like to show you how to really make love to a man. You know what I’m talking about. You’re of age. Don’t you want me to show you how to have intercourse? How to make love to a man of God!”
In the book Kristen says “This is tantamount to a father soliciting sex from his daughter. The betrayal is unthinkable.” Trying to delay or avert wierwille’s advances, Kristen tried asking him how such an act is consistent with The Word. wierwille explains that all things are pure to the pure…it’s a matter of keeping our minds renewed and centered on God…a man of God needs many women to satisfy his overwhelming needs.
There is nothing titillating when Kristen describes wierwille sexually molesting her. It’s like reading a police report of a daughter being raped by her own father…the first time I read this part my heart ached in sympathy for Kristen and there was utter revulsion over wierwille’s betrayal…after wierwille molested her, he says to her “It’s the lockbox, honey. You have to keep this in the lockbox of your soul. Many of God’s people wouldn’t understand what we’ve just done.”
After you read Kristen’s book “Losing The Way”, feel free to come back to Grease Spot and discuss anything that was too cerebral for you. Besides myself, I’m sure there’s other Grease Spotters here who have been through way corps training and can easily explain the tale of two wierwilles to you – there’s the one who taught the PFAL class - and then there’s the one who lived the life of a predator’s dream…it’s good to be the king.
Jesus’ words in Matthew 15:8 , These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
Mike, get your head out of wierwille’sa$$ !
10 hours ago, Mike said:
Then T-Bone asked about it this way:
On 4/28/2023 at 5:58 PM, T-Bone said:
and you know that how?
I was very impressed when Jesus said his Father was actively seeking people who would be willing to shmooze with him with true worship, which means spiritual worship as opposed to natural senses worship.
Schmooze = talk with someone in a lively and friendly way, typically in order to impress or manipulate them...Mike, you ought to be ashamed at your poor choice of words.
10 hours ago, Mike said:
The Father YEARNED for us to SIT !!!
Where does it say that in the Bible?
10 hours ago, Mike said:
Of course he designed our body and soul to be able to do this easily, if we had a trusting willing heart! How could He not do that ???
heart - ahhh there it is again - if we had a trusting and willing heart. Do you mean a trusting and will heart like Kristen had toward wierwille? You can't mean wierwille had a willing heart to obey the Word of God. He was a repeat offender sexual predator. He was an unabashed plagiarist. He talked the walk ("they honor me with their lips") but he didn't walk the talk ("but their hearts are far from me")
10 hours ago, Mike said:
God would not give us a stone (or something worthless) when we want to do what He SEEKS, which is SIT.
He would not give us a scorpion (something diabolical) when we want to do what He SEEKS, which is SIT.
He would not design us a body and soul that are ill prepared when we want to do what He SEEKS, which is SIT.
THAT is how I know that.
Your references about God not giving us something bad are the exact same references wierwille used in RTHST, by which he asserted believers do not have to worry about receiving a counterfeit. That’s ironic. wierwille knew how to fake tongues and in PFAL he encourages students to disengage their mind and use the body parts of speech mechanics to speak gibberish.
So, you must mean you interpret Jesus’ words as a reference to SIT because wierwille SAID SO.
You know nothing except what was up wierwille's a$$.
Maybe I haven't been specific enough on the parallel thing. Evidently no one has a clue what I mean, and I guess all the time of their stay at TWI they never looked into this item.
When you have an old fashioned scale to weigh things, it looks a little like a child's see-saw. You then put the thing to be weighed on the Right seat of the see-saw, and its weight pushed the see-saw down on that side all the way to the ground.
So now the see-saw is at an angle where the Right seat is at 4 o'clock, and the Left seat is at 10 o'clock.
Then you put a small weight on the Left seat and watch what happens. If nothing happens then you put a little more weight on the Left seat. Eventually there will be enough weight on the Left seat to push that seat down and the Right seat up.
When you get just the right amount of weight on the Left seat, the see saw will balance, with the Left seat at 9 o'clock and the Right seat at 3 o'clock.
The weight on the Left seat EQUALS the unknown weight on the Right seat. The two weights are BALANCED, and the see-saw is PARALLEL to the ground.
This is what VPW was doing with his arms: positioning them to illustrate this. One arm represented the level ground, and the other arm represented the balanced scale weighing the needs on one side and the wants on the other side.
His arms were parallel, representing the needs and wants being parallel to the ground or balanced.
*/*/*
Now I have questions.
Where WERE your heads when you took the class?
Where WERE your heads when you entered the Corps and re-studied this stuff?
Why did you not ever question "parallel" long ago?
I think this is, once again, indicative of how poorly you all understood the class you now hate and criticize in nearly complete befuddlement on issue after issue.
Hate makes people stupid.
So you are making up a new interpretation of “needs and wants parallel” from PFAL?
And it is “needs and wants are balanced and parallel to the ground”?
And this is represented by some hand motion of Wierwille in the class?
You are getting farther and farther from reality. And your ego is inflated to the sky and beyond.
You seem to hate all of the people with a different viewpoint than yours.
I guess by your own self diagnosis that is the cause of your stupidity.
Parallel or balanced. Whatever. Pick one. It doesn't matter. The story and the "teaching" are trash.
HOWEVER, if anyone still needs further explanation, I can offer it in one of my three glossolalias. But you will have to do your own interpretation. I'm not gonna baby anyone anymore!
(For enlightened teachings on being content with what you have and extinguishing desire, read the Stoics.)
I think this is, once again, indicative of how poorly you all understood the class you now hate and criticize in nearly complete befuddlement on issue after issue
I think this goes back to the teacher of the class. Once again, communication was his responsibility and it's not our job to guess what he means. Especially, when he's using archaic terms no one understands but him. Parallel, indeed.
Here below is an example of needs low, and wants high; need and want not balanced.
James 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
Right. I can get behind this verse. "Ask amiss" = ask with impure motives.
But there is nothing about needs. It's not about the weight of the want, but the purity of motive behind the want. Good verse. Good teaching. Accurate. But doesn't fit the balance or the parallel of the FERD story.
Plus, victor said your motives won't matter unless you beleeeve they will. He probably just crossed out this verse in his wide margin Bible.
At what point do those who engage with the world's foremost authority recognize they are wasting their time and energy thinking they're doing anything other than spinning their wheels or tilting at windmills? Selah.
At what point do those who engage with the world's foremost authority recognize they are wasting their time and energy thinking they're doing anything other than spinning their wheels or tilting at windmills? Selah.
VPW said it in the BRC basement that day in 1982, just before PFAL'77. I was there with at least 100 other people.
Here’s what gets me.
In 1968 PFAL, wierwille gives this overly dramatic story of preaching on the abuse of alcohol. After the sermon, an alcoholic approaches wierwille and complains he came to church that day to find a way out of alcoholism. wierwille’s preaching only pushed him deeper into it. wierwille swears off ever giving another negative sermon on the abuse of alcohol ever again.
I attended PFAL ’77, and wierwille’s ‘performance’ was so bad and it was for multiple reasons – but one reason that comes to mind is that he was drunk – on stage – for much of his ‘teaching’ time…so maybe he never gave another sermon on the abuse of alcohol - but evidently, he mastered it - - his life became a living sermon on the abuse of alcohol…remember kids ya gotta know what’s available, know how to receive it, know what to do with it after you’ve got it, blah dee blah blah.
On 5/2/2023 at 8:39 PM, Mike said:
VPW was God's spokesman at the time.
Wouldn’t that be the ultimate-cosmic-mind-fvck if that were true ?!?!
Think what that would mean.
How many thousands of TWI-followers…TWI-clergy…left during that massive exodus in 1986 – many left even before that – the timing isn’t the thing to look at – think about whythey left – not when. think of how many had a strong sense of disillusionmentderived from the failure of wierwille / Craig / TWI / the way corps program and all the other programs to fulfill declared goals. Think of how many saw inconsistenciesbetween the actions of wierwille and Craig and the ideals they supposedly represented. If I had to simplify and sum up why I left in 1986 that would be it.
…Now…
What if Mike’s statement is true? “VPW was God's spokesman at the time”
I joined TWI in 74 because I thought wierwille was the real deal.
I left in 86 because I realized he was a phony.
Now here I am in 2023 and Mike is saying God was in on the con too.
Well $hit. The Bible doesn’t make sense anymore.
My faith is based on nothing.
I’ve been coming to Grease Spot Café for some 17 years - arguing with wierwille-worshipping-goofballs over how hypocritical wierwille was – and come to find out from one of these goofballs that God is deceitful too.
$hit.
I feel like an idiot.
I'm thinking there must not be a benevolent righteous deity around who could kick this lying God’s a$$ - otherwise the more powerful divine being who I assume would have a bigger budget would have done it already.
Why didn’t wierwille tell me about this in PFAL?
Why did I waste 12 years of my life serving a phony God.
This is very embarrassing.
I wonder how many other Grease Spotters know this.
Maybe I’ll see what those conspiracy theories websites and UFO websites got to say.
That is because you are unwilling to rise up to see that VPW could have been like a Solomon or a David who had sin and when they were in sin they were bad spokesmen, and when they walked with God they were good spokesmen.
EVERY SINGLE ONE of God's spokesmen blew it in one way or another and God still worked with them when they would listen and obey.
You can thank God He still works with you in spite of you loving SOMETHING more than Him on multiple occasions.
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chockfull
I believe that the real deal is possible and the path toward it is to address and correct all the doctrinal and practical error introduced by VPs box top doctorate research. isolation from other
chockfull
The Corps is a necessary cult element providing free labor at the expense of volunteers lives. Any imagery like the Marines promotes extremist behavior. No other Christian seminary or school use
Nathan_Jr
"Teaching" Romans to the Corps, Q&A: LCM: How much does your behavior that people do not see influence your example to them? VPW: It doesn't, unless you believe it will. LCM: You u
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OldSkool
Its fun watching you invent your own religous theology out of thin air to keep your bronzed idol propped up.
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Mike
These are valid assessments from me.
If you want to see insults look at what is directed at me all the time here.
But hate makes people stupid, so you may not be able to do this.
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OldSkool
Dueces, Im off to get parallel with my mattress and see if I cant balance the remote in my hand as I send parallel waves through thin air so i can select my desired channel...now thats needs and wants parallel. I need to go lay on my behind and I want to watch some TV...deuces mr wizard!
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Mike
I got this weight scale explanation in the 1970s.
It was taught to me by a smart grad not in the Corps.
Why did you not find this parallel thing long ago?
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waysider
Was his body language in the collaterals?
Incidentally, as you probably already know, he wasn't really a Dr.
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OldSkool
Because words have meaning which makes it utter bullshonta
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waysider
What makes you think this obvious discrepancy hasn't been discussed already, ad infinitum?
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OldSkool
He probably strarted the thread.
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waysider
You can go all the way back to the very early days of GSC (20 years ago) and see people discussing this exact error.
But, hey, I guess some people just weren't paying attention.
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Nathan_Jr
Like so many of victor's pithy stories, the need/want fable doesn't deliver the lesson desired or perceived. MOREOVER, it makes little sense to clear minds upon honest, unbiased examination. Victor's general unpreparedness, histrionics and propensity for word salad are to blame. Combine all this with his arrogant expectation of a dull-minded, captive, committed and exhausted audience and you get... well, you know...
I have already provided an accurate and honest examination of the transcript from Mike. It really should be settled, but in case it's not, here's a brief summary:
Parallel fits, as I've explained. Victor mimed balance on set, but balance doesn't work in the fable as told. A need for shelter far, FAR outweighs a whimsical, materialistic want for red drapes. That scale is devilishly unbalanced. HOWEVER, drapes and shelter... seeeee?? Parallel. Lined up. It just fits. Geometry!
And probability. Statistics. You're more likely to get the drapes you want while in the process of fulfilling the need for shelter because the need and want go together like snowballs and Pete. Likewise, if you need transportation, you should line up your want for a car with that need. Bingo!
Isn't that wonderful? That there is how you work a word!
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Nathan_Jr
Needing essential shelter is out of balance with wanting red drapes. Red drapes are WAY lighter than essential shelter.
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T-Bone
Once again, your writings are unmistakably stupid!
according to you but really - - I’m tempted to think it might be some turd of an idea you probably found up wierwille’s a$$ - - let’s break that nonsense down:
Mike said: God does the hard part in supplying what is said.
What a gross misrepresentation of true worship…If God supplies the words then you’re saying God is a puppeteer .
1Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don’t wash their hands before they eat!”
3 Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God said, ‘Honor your father and mother’ and ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ 5 But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is ‘devoted to God,’ 6 they are not to ‘honor their father or mother’ with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. 7 You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:
8 “ ‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
9 They worship me in vain;
their teachings are merely human rules.’ ”
Matthew 15 NIV
wierwille’s idea - - and apparently yours also, is that true worship is the fakery he taught in PFAL. You move your lips, tongue, mouth, etc., but do not think of the words. Expect God to supply the words. How utterly stupid for wierwille to teach that – and you’re doubly stupid for regurgitating it here. Where does the person’s heart fit in??????? Look at Matthew 15:8 - These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me…any 2-bit plagiarist, drunkard, thief pathological liar and sexual predator can honor God wit their lips – wierwille did that most of the time.
Mike if you EVER get to finish reading Undertow you ought to suck it up and read Losing the Way: A Memoir of Spiritual Longing, Manipulation, Abuse, and Escape: Skedgell, Kristen: 9780972002196: Amazon.com: Books
. And in light of you taking FOREVER to read a book that presents your idol wierwille in an unfavorable light and the fact that you don’t like to read anything but collaterals I recommend you
skip ahead to, that I feel is a section that SHOULD be important to you pages 117 to 120. It’s the part where Kristen – working in housekeeping relates an incident when she placed a welcome letter on wierwille’s pillow in the Coachman Suite at Rome City – the note said she would “do anything to make his time more blessed here”.
The following night, after the evening teaching, wierwille called Kristen to his suite. He has a glass of Drambuie in one hand and a cigarette in the other – he sits very relaxed – he had taken off his suit coat and tie, the top button of his white shirt was undone, and his shoes were kicked off. He asks her to sit on the bed and they exchange some polite small talk. He then asks her if she really meant what she said in the little welcome note. “Of course,” she says.
Then wierwille says “Well, there is one thing you can do for me. I’d like you to take off your clothes. I’d like to show you how to really make love to a man. You know what I’m talking about. You’re of age. Don’t you want me to show you how to have intercourse? How to make love to a man of God!”
In the book Kristen says “This is tantamount to a father soliciting sex from his daughter. The betrayal is unthinkable.” Trying to delay or avert wierwille’s advances, Kristen tried asking him how such an act is consistent with The Word. wierwille explains that all things are pure to the pure…it’s a matter of keeping our minds renewed and centered on God…a man of God needs many women to satisfy his overwhelming needs.
There is nothing titillating when Kristen describes wierwille sexually molesting her. It’s like reading a police report of a daughter being raped by her own father…the first time I read this part my heart ached in sympathy for Kristen and there was utter revulsion over wierwille’s betrayal…after wierwille molested her, he says to her “It’s the lockbox, honey. You have to keep this in the lockbox of your soul. Many of God’s people wouldn’t understand what we’ve just done.”
After you read Kristen’s book “Losing The Way”, feel free to come back to Grease Spot and discuss anything that was too cerebral for you. Besides myself, I’m sure there’s other Grease Spotters here who have been through way corps training and can easily explain the tale of two wierwilles to you – there’s the one who taught the PFAL class - and then there’s the one who lived the life of a predator’s dream…it’s good to be the king.
Grease Spotters can find this book explained to Mike on another thread > my post Friday Jan. 7th 2022 Plagiarism on the road to success
Mike, did you notice the part in bold red?
Do you know what that reminds me of?
Jesus’ words in Matthew 15:8 , These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
Mike, get your head out of wierwille’s a$$ !
Schmooze = talk with someone in a lively and friendly way, typically in order to impress or manipulate them...Mike, you ought to be ashamed at your poor choice of words.
Where does it say that in the Bible?
heart - ahhh there it is again - if we had a trusting and willing heart. Do you mean a trusting and will heart like Kristen had toward wierwille? You can't mean wierwille had a willing heart to obey the Word of God. He was a repeat offender sexual predator. He was an unabashed plagiarist. He talked the walk ("they honor me with their lips") but he didn't walk the talk ("but their hearts are far from me")
Your references about God not giving us something bad are the exact same references wierwille used in RTHST, by which he asserted believers do not have to worry about receiving a counterfeit. That’s ironic. wierwille knew how to fake tongues and in PFAL he encourages students to disengage their mind and use the body parts of speech mechanics to speak gibberish.
So, you must mean you interpret Jesus’ words as a reference to SIT because wierwille SAID SO.
You know nothing except what was up wierwille's a$$.
Edited by T-Bonecorrected hyperlink
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T-Bone
Right here is the heart of Mike's belief system.
Mike is obviously a wierwille-worshipper.
Idolatry - Wikipedia
idolatry = the religious worship of idols. excessive or blind adoration, reverence, devotion.
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chockfull
So you are making up a new interpretation of “needs and wants parallel” from PFAL?
And it is “needs and wants are balanced and parallel to the ground”?
And this is represented by some hand motion of Wierwille in the class?
You are getting farther and farther from reality. And your ego is inflated to the sky and beyond.
You seem to hate all of the people with a different viewpoint than yours.
I guess by your own self diagnosis that is the cause of your stupidity.
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Nathan_Jr
Parallel or balanced. Whatever. Pick one. It doesn't matter. The story and the "teaching" are trash.
HOWEVER, if anyone still needs further explanation, I can offer it in one of my three glossolalias. But you will have to do your own interpretation. I'm not gonna baby anyone anymore!
Edited by Nathan_Jr(For enlightened teachings on being content with what you have and extinguishing desire, read the Stoics.)
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Nathan_Jr
Joseph was an entrepreneur? Is it written? Or is it a hunch?
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So_crates
I think this goes back to the teacher of the class. Once again, communication was his responsibility and it's not our job to guess what he means. Especially, when he's using archaic terms no one understands but him. Parallel, indeed.
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Nathan_Jr
Right. I can get behind this verse. "Ask amiss" = ask with impure motives.
But there is nothing about needs. It's not about the weight of the want, but the purity of motive behind the want. Good verse. Good teaching. Accurate. But doesn't fit the balance or the parallel of the FERD story.
Plus, victor said your motives won't matter unless you beleeeve they will. He probably just crossed out this verse in his wide margin Bible.
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Rocky
At what point do those who engage with the world's foremost authority recognize they are wasting their time and energy thinking they're doing anything other than spinning their wheels or tilting at windmills? Selah.
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Charity
Oh, but there's the viewing audience to consider
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WordWolf
BTW, Mike imagines there's a big audience of readers out there who are all in accord with Mike, and not, say, spectating a fantastic car wreck.
IF such a thing were true, Mike would be doing this (imaginary) crowd a disservice by only allowing them to read his posts on the GSC.
Mike would set up his own board where they could read unadulterated Mike and cheer him on and so on. Then he could focus his time and effort on THEM.
That he spends the time here instead says a lot. (Mainly, that there's no "them" trying to become Mike's disciples.)
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T-Bone
Here’s what gets me.
In 1968 PFAL, wierwille gives this overly dramatic story of preaching on the abuse of alcohol. After the sermon, an alcoholic approaches wierwille and complains he came to church that day to find a way out of alcoholism. wierwille’s preaching only pushed him deeper into it. wierwille swears off ever giving another negative sermon on the abuse of alcohol ever again.
I attended PFAL ’77, and wierwille’s ‘performance’ was so bad and it was for multiple reasons – but one reason that comes to mind is that he was drunk – on stage – for much of his ‘teaching’ time…so maybe he never gave another sermon on the abuse of alcohol - but evidently, he mastered it - - his life became a living sermon on the abuse of alcohol…remember kids ya gotta know what’s available, know how to receive it, know what to do with it after you’ve got it, blah dee blah blah.
Wouldn’t that be the ultimate-cosmic-mind-fvck if that were true ?!?!
Think what that would mean.
How many thousands of TWI-followers…TWI-clergy…left during that massive exodus in 1986 – many left even before that – the timing isn’t the thing to look at – think about why they left – not when. think of how many had a strong sense of disillusionment derived from the failure of wierwille / Craig / TWI / the way corps program and all the other programs to fulfill declared goals. Think of how many saw inconsistencies between the actions of wierwille and Craig and the ideals they supposedly represented. If I had to simplify and sum up why I left in 1986 that would be it.
…Now…
What if Mike’s statement is true? “VPW was God's spokesman at the time”
I joined TWI in 74 because I thought wierwille was the real deal.
I left in 86 because I realized he was a phony.
Now here I am in 2023 and Mike is saying God was in on the con too.
Well $hit. The Bible doesn’t make sense anymore.
My faith is based on nothing.
I’ve been coming to Grease Spot Café for some 17 years - arguing with wierwille-worshipping-goofballs over how hypocritical wierwille was – and come to find out from one of these goofballs that God is deceitful too.
$hit.
I feel like an idiot.
I'm thinking there must not be a benevolent righteous deity around who could kick this lying God’s a$$ - otherwise the more powerful divine being who I assume would have a bigger budget would have done it already.
Why didn’t wierwille tell me about this in PFAL?
Why did I waste 12 years of my life serving a phony God.
This is very embarrassing.
I wonder how many other Grease Spotters know this.
Maybe I’ll see what those conspiracy theories websites and UFO websites got to say.
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Rocky
The imaginary or imagined viewing audience?
Oh, and btw, on the subject of no one can go farther than they are led...
The ONE who follows the CULT LEADER...
And then there's what the late Gail Sheehy wrote in her excellent book on leadership, Pathfinders...
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Mike
That is because you are unwilling to rise up to see that VPW could have been like a Solomon or a David who had sin and when they were in sin they were bad spokesmen, and when they walked with God they were good spokesmen.
EVERY SINGLE ONE of God's spokesmen blew it in one way or another and God still worked with them when they would listen and obey.
You can thank God He still works with you in spite of you loving SOMETHING more than Him on multiple occasions.
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