Grounded in meticulous historical research and written with a reverential approach to Jesus’s life that focuses on his humanity,The Book of Longingsis an inspiring account of one woman’s bold struggle to realize the passion and potential inside her, while living in a time, place, and culture devised to silence her.
Raised in a wealthy family in Sepphoris with ties to the ruler of Galilee, Ana is rebellious and ambitious, a relentless seeker with a brilliant, curious mind and a daring spirit. She yearns for a pursuit worthy of her life, but finds no outlet for her considerable talents. Defying the expectations placed on women, she engages in furtive scholarly pursuits and writes secret narratives about neglected and silenced women. When she meets the eighteen-year-old Jesus, each is drawn to and enriched by the other’s spiritual and philosophical ideas. He becomes a floodgate for her intellect, but also the awakener of her heart.
Their marriage unfolds with love and conflict, humor and pathos in Nazareth, where Ana makes a home with Jesus, his brothers, James and Simon, and their mother, Mary. Here, Ana’s pent-up longings intensify amid the turbulent resistance to the Roman occupation of Israel, partially led by her charismatic adopted brother, Judas. She is sustained by her indomitable aunt Yaltha, who is searching for her long-lost daughter, as well as by other women, including her friend Tabitha, who is sold into slavery after she was raped, and Phasaelis, the shrewd wife of Herod Antipas. Ana’s impetuous streak occasionally invites danger. When one such foray forces her to flee Nazareth for her safety shortly before Jesus’s public ministry begins, she makes her way with Yaltha to Alexandria, where she eventually finds refuge and purpose in unexpected surroundings.
My review and the story tell us something about ourselves (some of us here on GSC, that is). Including Mike. (I'm not soliciting a conversation, especially with Mike. However, if he reads this, maybe he'll reflect on it.
I wrote this review of The Book of Longings:
I didn't realize until I was in an unhappy marriage that one of my deepest longings was to be heard. To be a voice. I started writing shortly thereafter. It has been more than 25 years since. But I digress.
ANA mattered. She lived an internally rich, variegated life. She was the wife of Jesus. She was (IS) a voice.
Sue Monk Kidd wrote a masterpiece. I hope you enjoy The Book of Longings as much as I did.
Perhaps the passage that struck me most was this:
"Years ago, after that day I came to your house, I wrote down your story on papyrus. I wrote about your ferocious spirit, how you stood in the street and cried out what happened to you and were silenced for it. I think every pain in this world wants to be witnessed, Tabitha. That's why you shouted about your rape on the street and it's why I wrote it down."
She stared at me unblinking, then pulled me to her and clung there.
Grounded in meticulous historical research and written with a reverential approach to Jesus’s life that focuses on his humanity,The Book of Longingsis an inspiring account of one woman’s bold struggle to realize the passion and potential inside her, while living in a time, place, and culture devised to silence her.
Raised in a wealthy family in Sepphoris with ties to the ruler of Galilee, Ana is rebellious and ambitious, a relentless seeker with a brilliant, curious mind and a daring spirit. She yearns for a pursuit worthy of her life, but finds no outlet for her considerable talents. Defying the expectations placed on women, she engages in furtive scholarly pursuits and writes secret narratives about neglected and silenced women. When she meets the eighteen-year-old Jesus, each is drawn to and enriched by the other’s spiritual and philosophical ideas. He becomes a floodgate for her intellect, but also the awakener of her heart.
Their marriage unfolds with love and conflict, humor and pathos in Nazareth, where Ana makes a home with Jesus, his brothers, James and Simon, and their mother, Mary. Here, Ana’s pent-up longings intensify amid the turbulent resistance to the Roman occupation of Israel, partially led by her charismatic adopted brother, Judas. She is sustained by her indomitable aunt Yaltha, who is searching for her long-lost daughter, as well as by other women, including her friend Tabitha, who is sold into slavery after she was raped, and Phasaelis, the shrewd wife of Herod Antipas. Ana’s impetuous streak occasionally invites danger. When one such foray forces her to flee Nazareth for her safety shortly before Jesus’s public ministry begins, she makes her way with Yaltha to Alexandria, where she eventually finds refuge and purpose in unexpected surroundings.
9 hours ago, Rocky said:
My review and the story tell us something about ourselves (some of us here on GSC, that is). Including Mike. (I'm not soliciting a conversation, especially with Mike. However, if he reads this, maybe he'll reflect on it.
I wrote this review of The Book of Longings:
I didn't realize until I was in an unhappy marriage that one of my deepest longings was to be heard. To be a voice. I started writing shortly thereafter. It has been more than 25 years since. But I digress.
ANA mattered. She lived an internally rich, variegated life. She was the wife of Jesus. She was (IS) a voice.
Sue Monk Kidd wrote a masterpiece. I hope you enjoy The Book of Longings as much as I did.
Perhaps the passage that struck me most was this:
"Years ago, after that day I came to your house, I wrote down your story on papyrus. I wrote about your ferocious spirit, how you stood in the street and cried out what happened to you and were silenced for it. I think every pain in this world wants to be witnessed, Tabitha. That's why you shouted about your rape on the street and it's why I wrote it down."
She stared at me unblinking, then pulled me to her and clung there.
Rocky, thanks for the recommendation and what you shared! You always bring great ‘thought-food’ to the table! You touch on some relevant subtopics and tangents too:
Genuine relationships vs contrived ones in the social dynamics of a cult
Developing a life-transforming relationship with Jesus Christ instead of being encased in the concrete ideology of a dead idol (wierwille).
Becoming self-aware. Your actual-self (YOUR preferences, goals, desires, talents, etc.) vs your adaptive-self (what you think and do to survive in a cult). Being true to yourself.
it boils down to arguments to defend wierwille / PFAL are based on a priori - a presumption that wierwille was chosen and guided by God to teach “The Word” as it had not been known since the first century.
Something I find idiotic and idolatrous!
~ ~ ~ ~
My arguments against such undeserved veneration of wierwille’s anti-Christian ideology are grounded - NOT in reverence for wierwille and his works -
but
on quantitative and qualitative empirical evidence of wierwille’s words and deeds - a potpourri of twisted Scripture, hypocrisies, despicable behavior, the testimony of those he abused, exploited and sexually molested.
~ ~ ~ ~
A theory is an explanation of the relationship in a set of observations.
The observations should provide evidence for the theory.
Solid evidence supports a theory in the way that legs support a table or columns support the roof of a building.
The overwhelmingly contradictory, illogical, incoherent, unbiblical and deviant characteristics of wierwille’s doctrine and behavior leave the a priori of him being chosen and guided by God without a leg to stand on.
To argue that wierwille was the real deal - chosen by God to teach “The Word” to the modern world is to say that God is a senile old coot who forgot what Jesus Christ accomplished...and the Old Codger of the Empyrean Domain must have also forgotten that Jesus Christ is supposed to be what doctrine, theory and practice revolve around...the Most Holy Long-in-the-Tooth must have lost track of the truth - for He had wierwille say "The Word takes the place of the absent Christ"...
It’s a shame the Transcendent Old Geezer has gone soft on the 10 commandments - cuz He directed wierwille to say "as long as you love God and neighbor you can do as you full well please".
Must be Alzheimer’s of the Divine Mind for Him to forget He’s omnipotent and now has to submit to “the law of believing “
once - in the late 60s there was a ‘disturbancein the force’ when the Ancient of Days Cantankerous Creator of the Cosmos had His sacred afternoon nap zzzZZZ ZZZ interrupted by a pseudo-Christian cult-leader shouting something about Jesus Christ coming back as Lord of Lords, King of kings, as God Almighty. The Omniscient Geriatric Prime Mover had to confer with the rest of the divine council at The Metaphysical Assisted Living for Supernatural Beings to determine if wierwille was talking about Him or His Son. Statement to be issued at some future day and time and hour and minute and second and millisecond as it already was were and has have or had been. Who is The Logos? Who's on first? Who is the first? Who's that knocking at my door? To whom is this post written?
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Not saying I'm a prophet or anything but I have it on pretty good authority there's a new year coming.
And for that reason, I say to all Grease Spotters , have a Happy New Year
Edited by T-Bone revision of the first magnitude of attitude
To this day the reason The Way International continues with the 'whitewash program' - is to conceal the unpleasant fact that it is STILL a pseudo-Christian organization…NOT based on the person and authority of the Lord Jesus Christ - but on the challenging counterfeit, wierwille!
50 years ago, if you would have asked me “how would you like to learn about God and the Bible by following a hypocritical unabashed plagiarist delusional megalomaniac malignant narcissist money-grubbing chain-smoking drunkard misogynistic sexual predator who will exploit you until you’re all used up?”
I probably would have responded by saying “no thanks, if that’s what God and the Bible are all about, I’ll look elsewhere.”
~ ~ ~ ~
There’s a time coming when all those who have misled others will have to answer for their crimes:
At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who, then, is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”
2 He called a little child to him and placed the child among them. 3 And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 And whoever welcomes one such child in my name welcomes me.
6 “If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea. 7 Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to stumble! Such things must come, but woe to the person through whom they come!
The credibility ofwierwille’s legacy relies on the supposed 1942 ‘promise of God’ assigning wierwille the task of ‘accurizing’ the works of others. Imagine God giving wierwille the green light to plagiarize the works of others and furthermore God would help him tie it altogether and fit with the Bible perfectly – resulting in him teaching us “The Word” like it hasn’t been known since the 1st century.
Reviewing wierwille’s works in a normal frame of mind some 37 years after forsaking a cultic-mindset, I find wierwille’s collaterals to be a discombobulated hot mess – the manifesto of a very delusional man.
The incongruity of the whole 1942 promise should be alarming to any Christian…any serious student of the Bible!
Why do I say that?
Well…think about it…doesn’t it seem odd…out of character…even creepy and strange that a Holy benevolent God, biblically famous for His justice, faithfulness, righteousness, omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, sovereignty, etc., would choose wierwille for some special earth-shattering assignment that would have a profound impact on the future of Christianity.
Even if wierwille was clean as a whistle in 1942 and had no ill will – God’s choice of him in 1942 would suggest a number of disturbing-faith-shattering ideas – such as the following – and please note these are just a FEWof the many aberrant alternate possibilities in the spacetime continuum if the 1942 promise/God speaking audibly to wierwille really happened:
1.God doesn’t know the future – that wierwille would develop into a misogynistic pathological liar, malignant narcissist, sexual predator, a thieving flagrant plagiarist, megalomaniac, money-grubbing, chain-smoking, drunkard, abusive, calloused and delusional cult-leader.
2.God does know the future – He knew that wierwille would develop into a misogynistic pathological liar, malignant narcissist, sexual predator, a thieving flagrant plagiarist, megalomaniac, money-grubbing, chain-smoking, drunkard, abusive, calloused and delusional cult-leader – and God was okay with that...The 10 commandmentssuggestions are optional.
3.True Christianity was lost after the 1st century until a misogynistic pathological liar, malignant narcissist, sexual predator, a thieving flagrant plagiarist, megalomaniac, money-grubbing, chain-smoking, drunkard, abusive, calloused and delusional cult-leader like wierwille came along to get Christianity back on track.
4.What Jesus Christ did way back when was important – but that was then – and this is now “The Word takes the place of the absent Christ.”...if you can't comprehend that - just stick around - keep reading the collaterals, because what wierwille SAID is moreimportant now.
5. God doesn’t care about the harm and pain wierwille caused...and God doesn't care about the shame wierwille brought to the name of Jesus Christ...and God doesn’t even care about the pain you have – the main thing is that we parrot wierwille’s pious platitudes…it’s the ABCs of Christianity: Always Be reading the Collaterals.
6. There really were 4 crucified with Jesus Christ.
7. The Bible really does interpret itself.
~ ~ ~ ~
When one removes the footing of wierwille’s authority and his logical fallacies/eclectic interpolations and his twisting of Scripture, wierwille’s dubious doctrines are de-feeted.
The subterfuge of wierwille’s collateralsis a pretentious connection to reality. They are designed to keep one in mental busywork – it keeps one intellectually and emotionally occupied…and since most of it is nonsense and wishful thinking, there develops a repetitive cycle of frustration and a renewed commitment to making it work... 'rinse and repeat'…it’s predictable...monotonous…a repetition of thought processes and actions…that is not true Christianity! It is the way a harmful and controlling pseudo-Christian cult keeps stringing followers along.
Reviewing wierwille’s works in a normal frame of mind some 37 years after forsaking a cultic-mindset, I find wierwille’s collaterals to be a discombobulated hot mess – the manifesto of a very delusional man.
That one and a half line statement says quite a lot all by itself.
My memory says Wayfers don't self identify as Christians. I seem to remember that word being thought of with a negative connotation.
Quickly looking at theway.org site, it's a Biblical ministry. Christian isn't mentioned. Maybe I missed it.
During WayD we gave out the website to those we witnessed to. I remember one call with one polite but firm gentleman who looked at the website and realized The Way did not share his views on Christ and no thank you.
We were Believing Believers of the Standing Follower in the HouseHold of the Remnant qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifying qualifier of previous qualifier.
Grounded in meticulous historical research and written with a reverential approach to Jesus’s life that focuses on his humanity,The Book of Longingsis an inspiring account of one woman’s bold struggle to realize the passion and potential inside her, while living in a time, place, and culture devised to silence her.
The Book of Longings is a very readable, very intriguing book. Time I had a re-read.
Quickly looking at theway.org site, it's a Biblical ministry. Christian isn't mentioned. Maybe I missed it.
Absolutely right, and it had never occurred to me until now. It's always described itself as a "Biblical research, teaching and fellowship ministry." Never a "Christian research, teaching and fellowship ministry."
Mind you: it's no good at research, Biblical, Christian, or otherwise; no good at teaching, though it is good at indoctrination and bullying; not good at fellowship, being so exclusive and manipulative.
My memory says Wayfers don't self identify as Christians. I seem to remember that word being thought of with a negative connotation.
Quickly looking at theway.org site, it's a Biblical ministry. Christian isn't mentioned. Maybe I missed it.
During WayD we gave out the website to those we witnessed to. I remember one call with one polite but firm gentleman who looked at the website and realized The Way did not share his views on Christ and no thank you.
We were Believing Believers of the Standing Follower in the HouseHold of the Remnant qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifying qualifier of previous qualifier.
4 hours ago, Nathan_Jr said:
My memory and text messages say the same.
My FC said TWI/PFAL/VPW is not a religion. He said he did not consider himself a Christian nor self identify as religious.
I asked, "What is religion?"
He answered, "Man made."
** I rest my case.
46 minutes ago, Twinky said:
Absolutely right, and it had never occurred to me until now. It's always described itself as a "Biblical research, teaching and fellowship ministry." Never a "Christian research, teaching and fellowship ministry."
Mind you: it's no good at research, Biblical, Christian, or otherwise; no good at teaching, though it is good at indoctrination and bullying; not good at fellowship, being so exclusive and manipulative.
My memory says Wayfers don't self identify as Christians. I seem to remember that word being thought of with a negative connotation.
Quickly looking at theway.org site, it's a Biblical ministry. Christian isn't mentioned. Maybe I missed it.
During WayD we gave out the website to those we witnessed to. I remember one call with one polite but firm gentleman who looked at the website and realized The Way did not share his views on Christ and no thank you.
We were Believing Believers of the Standing Follower in the HouseHold of the Remnant qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifying qualifier of previous qualifier.
Wow I’m remembering this now. Yes there is an internal buzz about how “Christian” is a derogatory term given by the persecutors. Because they talked about the “Christ in” stuff they were ridiculed with the name.
So they prefer the term “believers”. There is a whole slew of other jargon attached to the Way that is similar.
It produces an egotistical derision and looking down upon other Christians and established an internal cult name that true “believers” latch onto.
So “believers” would never spend any time on that “vomit fest” Greasespot because they are too busy “moving the Word Over the World”.
Putting the Stepford in. Taking the Christian out.
One of the first steps in a cults dominance in a persons life is establishing a secret inner knowledge that folks outside the cult don’t have.
You see the cult idols are very jealous idols. They can tolerate no other names or ideas among them.
Wow I’m remembering this now. Yes there is an internal buzz about how “Christian” is a derogatory term given by the persecutors. Because they talked about the “Christ in” stuff they were ridiculed with the name.
So they prefer the term “believers”. There is a whole slew of other jargon attached to the Way that is similar.
It produces an egotistical derision and looking down upon other Christians and established an internal cult name that true “believers” latch onto.
So “believers” would never spend any time on that “vomit fest” Greasespot because they are too busy “moving the Word Over the World”.
Putting the Stepford in. Taking the Christian out.
Very interesting points...the hypocrisy is glaring cause they clamor about Christ in you constantly , as if that's some kind of power lever to be unleashed to bring stuff to a person and that's called abundance...fake.
Absolutely right, and it had never occurred to me until now. It's always described itself as a "Biblical research, teaching and fellowship ministry." Never a "Christian research, teaching and fellowship ministry."
Mind you: it's no good at research, Biblical, Christian, or otherwise; no good at teaching, though it is good at indoctrination and bullying; not good at fellowship, being so exclusive and manipulative.
Yes you are 100 percent right.
An organization with an identity crisis. What they say they stand for is a lie and hidden to gain power over people.
A Biblical research ministry that accepts no other organizations input even on a common goal, that doesn’t use normally accepted publishing standards or channels, that meets in homes, and is very evangelical.
They suck at research, the teachings are vanilla, and with leaders consistently shuffling bodies through “placements” and shunning people there is no genuine fellowship either. Just a cult identity bond which disappears the instant you choose a different Christian org.
But they clamor about Christ in you constantly , as if that's some kind of power lever to be unleashed to bring stuff to a person and that's called abundance...fake.
Fake cult is fake. VP crying tears and performing with antics on camera about “Christ in you the hope of glory”. But daily practice makes “Christian” a dirty word and prefers a cult substitute “believer”
It reminds me of Christian Grey Poupon mustard.
”Are you a Christian? Pardon me and pass the Grey Poupon”
My memory says Wayfers don't self identify as Christians. I seem to remember that word being thought of with a negative connotation.
Quickly looking at theway.org site, it's a Biblical ministry. Christian isn't mentioned. Maybe I missed it.
During WayD we gave out the website to those we witnessed to. I remember one call with one polite but firm gentleman who looked at the website and realized The Way did not share his views on Christ and no thank you.
We were Believing Believers of the Standing Follower in the HouseHold of the Remnant qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifying qualifier of previous qualifier.
vpw claimed that "Christian" was a corruption of "Christ-in", and that Christians were originally called that because they talked about Christ-in. As always, he was wrong. The man never studied Church history, he studied how to give sermons. In hindsight, it was ridiculous to trust him on anything of substance- Bible languages, Church history..... vpw claimed the early Christians in Acts were called "followers of The Way", with Jesus Christ being "The Way." Naturally, they're into their congregation being called their "FOLLOWERS" and herding them like sheep....and fleecing them like sheep.
Wow I’m remembering this now. Yes there is an internal buzz about how “Christian” is a derogatory term given by the persecutors. Because they talked about the “Christ in” stuff they were ridiculed with the name.
So they prefer the term “believers”. There is a whole slew of other jargon attached to the Way that is similar.
It produces an egotistical derision and looking down upon other Christians and established an internal cult name that true “believers” latch onto.
So “believers” would never spend any time on that “vomit fest” Greasespot because they are too busy “moving the Word Over the World”.
Putting the Stepford in. Taking the Christian out.
One of the first steps in a cults dominance in a persons life is establishing a secret inner knowledge that folks outside the cult don’t have.
You see the cult idols are very jealous idols. They can tolerate no other names or ideas among them.
Were any facts given by vp to support this assertion that “Christian” is a derogatory term given by the persecutors. Because they talked about the “Christ in” stuff they were ridiculed with the name."?
According to Acts 11:26, "and when he (Barnabas) had found him (Saul), he brought him to Antioch. And so it came to pass that for a whole year they met with the church and taught a great number of people. And the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch." The word "Christian" has been used respectfully for centuries as a name for those who love and follow Christ. So even if there was a grain of truth behind what vp said, he could easily have chosen to continue honoring the name instead.
His real reason for doing what he did had nothing to do with the origin of the name. I believe his intent was to derogate the name himself for self-serving, cult-like purposes like the ones chockfull shared above.
Recommended Posts
Top Posters In This Topic
13
29
11
15
Popular Days
Jan 9
25
Jan 20
14
Dec 24
9
Dec 31
9
Top Posters In This Topic
Rocky 13 posts
T-Bone 29 posts
Bolshevik 11 posts
chockfull 15 posts
Popular Days
Jan 9 2023
25 posts
Jan 20 2023
14 posts
Dec 24 2022
9 posts
Dec 31 2022
9 posts
Popular Posts
Bolshevik
My memory says Wayfers don't self identify as Christians. I seem to remember that word being thought of with a negative connotation. Quickly looking at theway.org site, it's a Biblical ministry.
Bolshevik
In my experience, The Way and its followers did not focus on why Muslims, atheists, agnostics, Buddhists, or why they think most other religions were wrong. They were mentioned sometimes. They m
Nathan_Jr
My memory and text messages say the same. My FC said TWI/PFAL/VPW is not a religion. He said he did not consider himself a Christian nor self identify as religious. I asked, "What is religio
Nathan_Jr
Just curious. Have you read James Tabor's The Jesus Dynasty?
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/545867.The_Jesus_Dynasty?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=u7ilh5XQ0a&rank=3
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
No - I haven't ...sounds interesting though...may have to check it out...I'm up to my old ways of reading a several books at a time
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
Here's another one (kind of) about Jesus... https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/52698452-the-book-of-longings I read this in 2020. Goodreads describes it:
Grounded in meticulous historical research and written with a reverential approach to Jesus’s life that focuses on his humanity, The Book of Longings is an inspiring account of one woman’s bold struggle to realize the passion and potential inside her, while living in a time, place, and culture devised to silence her.
Raised in a wealthy family in Sepphoris with ties to the ruler of Galilee, Ana is rebellious and ambitious, a relentless seeker with a brilliant, curious mind and a daring spirit. She yearns for a pursuit worthy of her life, but finds no outlet for her considerable talents. Defying the expectations placed on women, she engages in furtive scholarly pursuits and writes secret narratives about neglected and silenced women. When she meets the eighteen-year-old Jesus, each is drawn to and enriched by the other’s spiritual and philosophical ideas. He becomes a floodgate for her intellect, but also the awakener of her heart.
Edited by RockyTheir marriage unfolds with love and conflict, humor and pathos in Nazareth, where Ana makes a home with Jesus, his brothers, James and Simon, and their mother, Mary. Here, Ana’s pent-up longings intensify amid the turbulent resistance to the Roman occupation of Israel, partially led by her charismatic adopted brother, Judas. She is sustained by her indomitable aunt Yaltha, who is searching for her long-lost daughter, as well as by other women, including her friend Tabitha, who is sold into slavery after she was raped, and Phasaelis, the shrewd wife of Herod Antipas. Ana’s impetuous streak occasionally invites danger. When one such foray forces her to flee Nazareth for her safety shortly before Jesus’s public ministry begins, she makes her way with Yaltha to Alexandria, where she eventually finds refuge and purpose in unexpected surroundings.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
My review and the story tell us something about ourselves (some of us here on GSC, that is). Including Mike. (I'm not soliciting a conversation, especially with Mike. However, if he reads this, maybe he'll reflect on it.
I wrote this review of The Book of Longings:
I didn't realize until I was in an unhappy marriage that one of my deepest longings was to be heard. To be a voice. I started writing shortly thereafter. It has been more than 25 years since. But I digress.
ANA mattered. She lived an internally rich, variegated life. She was the wife of Jesus. She was (IS) a voice.
Sue Monk Kidd wrote a masterpiece. I hope you enjoy The Book of Longings as much as I did.
Perhaps the passage that struck me most was this:
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Nathan_Jr
I get it. I really do.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
Rocky, thanks for the recommendation and what you shared! You always bring great ‘thought-food’ to the table! You touch on some relevant subtopics and tangents too:
Genuine relationships vs contrived ones in the social dynamics of a cult
Developing a life-transforming relationship with Jesus Christ instead of being encased in the concrete ideology of a dead idol (wierwille).
Becoming self-aware. Your actual-self (YOUR preferences, goals, desires, talents, etc.) vs your adaptive-self (what you think and do to survive in a cult). Being true to yourself.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
A very important anthology which hopefully will grow as time goes by.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
Negotiations over the absurd are a waste of time.
it boils down to arguments to defend wierwille / PFAL are based on a priori - a presumption that wierwille was chosen and guided by God to teach “The Word” as it had not been known since the first century.
Something I find idiotic and idolatrous!
~ ~ ~ ~
My arguments against such undeserved veneration of wierwille’s anti-Christian ideology are grounded - NOT in reverence for wierwille and his works -
but
on quantitative and qualitative empirical evidence of wierwille’s words and deeds - a potpourri of twisted Scripture, hypocrisies, despicable behavior, the testimony of those he abused, exploited and sexually molested.
~ ~ ~ ~
A theory is an explanation of the relationship in a set of observations.
The observations should provide evidence for the theory.
Solid evidence supports a theory in the way that legs support a table or columns support the roof of a building.
The overwhelmingly contradictory, illogical, incoherent, unbiblical and deviant characteristics of wierwille’s doctrine and behavior leave the a priori of him being chosen and guided by God without a leg to stand on.
To argue that wierwille was the real deal - chosen by God to teach “The Word” to the modern world is to say that God is a senile old coot who forgot what Jesus Christ accomplished...and the Old Codger of the Empyrean Domain must have also forgotten that Jesus Christ is supposed to be what doctrine, theory and practice revolve around...the Most Holy Long-in-the-Tooth must have lost track of the truth - for He had wierwille say "The Word takes the place of the absent Christ"...
It’s a shame the Transcendent Old Geezer has gone soft on the 10 commandments - cuz He directed wierwille to say "as long as you love God and neighbor you can do as you full well please".
Must be Alzheimer’s of the Divine Mind for Him to forget He’s omnipotent and now has to submit to “the law of believing “
once - in the late 60s there was a ‘disturbance in the force’ when the Ancient of Days Cantankerous Creator of the Cosmos had His sacred afternoon nap zzzZZZ
ZZZ interrupted by a pseudo-Christian cult-leader shouting something about Jesus Christ coming back as Lord of Lords, King of kings, as God Almighty. The Omniscient Geriatric Prime Mover had to confer with the rest of the divine council at The Metaphysical Assisted Living for Supernatural Beings to determine if wierwille was talking about Him or His Son. Statement to be issued at some future day and time and hour and minute and second and millisecond as it already was were and has have or had been. Who is The Logos? Who's on first? Who is the first? Who's that knocking at my door? To whom is this post written?
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Not saying I'm a prophet or anything but I have it on pretty good authority there's a new year coming.
And for that reason, I say to all Grease Spotters , have a Happy New Year
Edited by T-Bonerevision of the first magnitude of attitude
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
To this day the reason The Way International continues with the 'whitewash program' - is to conceal the unpleasant fact that it is STILL a pseudo-Christian organization…NOT based on the person and authority of the Lord Jesus Christ - but on the challenging counterfeit, wierwille!
50 years ago, if you would have asked me “how would you like to learn about God and the Bible by following a hypocritical unabashed plagiarist delusional megalomaniac malignant narcissist money-grubbing chain-smoking drunkard misogynistic sexual predator who will exploit you until you’re all used up?”
I probably would have responded by saying “no thanks, if that’s what God and the Bible are all about, I’ll look elsewhere.”
~ ~ ~ ~
There’s a time coming when all those who have misled others will have to answer for their crimes:
At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who, then, is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”
2 He called a little child to him and placed the child among them. 3 And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 And whoever welcomes one such child in my name welcomes me.
6 “If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea. 7 Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to stumble! Such things must come, but woe to the person through whom they come!
Matthew 18
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
The credibility of wierwille’s legacy relies on the supposed 1942 ‘promise of God’ assigning wierwille the task of ‘accurizing’ the works of others. Imagine God giving wierwille the green light to plagiarize the works of others and furthermore God would help him tie it altogether and fit with the Bible perfectly – resulting in him teaching us “The Word” like it hasn’t been known since the 1st century.
Reviewing wierwille’s works in a normal frame of mind some 37 years after forsaking a cultic-mindset, I find wierwille’s collaterals to be a discombobulated hot mess – the manifesto of a very delusional man.
The incongruity of the whole 1942 promise should be alarming to any Christian…any serious student of the Bible!
Why do I say that?
Well…think about it…doesn’t it seem odd…out of character…even creepy and strange that a Holy benevolent God, biblically famous for His justice, faithfulness, righteousness, omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, sovereignty, etc., would choose wierwille for some special earth-shattering assignment that would have a profound impact on the future of Christianity.
Even if wierwille was clean as a whistle in 1942 and had no ill will – God’s choice of him in 1942 would suggest a number of disturbing-faith-shattering ideas – such as the following – and please note these are just a FEW of the many aberrant alternate possibilities in the spacetime continuum if the 1942 promise/God speaking audibly to wierwille really happened:
1. God doesn’t know the future – that wierwille would develop into a misogynistic pathological liar, malignant narcissist, sexual predator, a thieving flagrant plagiarist, megalomaniac, money-grubbing, chain-smoking, drunkard, abusive, calloused and delusional cult-leader.
2.God does know the future – He knew that wierwille would develop into a misogynistic pathological liar, malignant narcissist, sexual predator, a thieving flagrant plagiarist, megalomaniac, money-grubbing, chain-smoking, drunkard, abusive, calloused and delusional cult-leader – and God was okay with that...The 10
commandmentssuggestions are optional.3.True Christianity was lost after the 1st century until a misogynistic pathological liar, malignant narcissist, sexual predator, a thieving flagrant plagiarist, megalomaniac, money-grubbing, chain-smoking, drunkard, abusive, calloused and delusional cult-leader like wierwille came along to get Christianity back on track.
4.What Jesus Christ did way back when was important – but that was then – and this is now “The Word takes the place of the absent Christ.”...if you can't comprehend that - just stick around - keep reading the collaterals, because what wierwille SAID is more important now.
5. God doesn’t care about the harm and pain wierwille caused...and God doesn't care about the shame wierwille brought to the name of Jesus Christ...and God doesn’t even care about the pain you have – the main thing is that we parrot wierwille’s pious platitudes…it’s the ABCs of Christianity: Always Be reading the Collaterals.
6. There really were 4 crucified with Jesus Christ.
7. The Bible really does interpret itself.
~ ~ ~ ~
When one removes the footing of wierwille’s authority and his logical fallacies/eclectic interpolations and his twisting of Scripture, wierwille’s dubious doctrines are de-feeted.
The subterfuge of wierwille’s collaterals is a pretentious connection to reality. They are designed to keep one in mental busywork – it keeps one intellectually and emotionally occupied…and since most of it is nonsense and wishful thinking, there develops a repetitive cycle of frustration and a renewed commitment to making it work... 'rinse and repeat'…it’s predictable...monotonous…a repetition of thought processes and actions…that is not true Christianity! It is the way a harmful and controlling pseudo-Christian cult keeps stringing followers along.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
That one and a half line statement says quite a lot all by itself.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bolshevik
My memory says Wayfers don't self identify as Christians. I seem to remember that word being thought of with a negative connotation.
Quickly looking at theway.org site, it's a Biblical ministry. Christian isn't mentioned. Maybe I missed it.
During WayD we gave out the website to those we witnessed to. I remember one call with one polite but firm gentleman who looked at the website and realized The Way did not share his views on Christ and no thank you.
We were Believing Believers of the Standing Follower in the HouseHold of the Remnant qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifier qualifying qualifier of previous qualifier.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Nathan_Jr
My memory and text messages say the same.
My FC said TWI/PFAL/VPW is not a religion. He said he did not consider himself a Christian nor self identify as religious.
I asked, "What is religion?"
He answered, "Man made."
** I rest my case.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Twinky
The Book of Longings is a very readable, very intriguing book. Time I had a re-read.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
OldSkool
Guess Mr DippyDoo FC didnt consider wierwille a man?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Twinky
Absolutely right, and it had never occurred to me until now. It's always described itself as a "Biblical research, teaching and fellowship ministry." Never a "Christian research, teaching and fellowship ministry."
Mind you: it's no good at research, Biblical, Christian, or otherwise; no good at teaching, though it is good at indoctrination and bullying; not good at fellowship, being so exclusive and manipulative.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
holy crap!!!
I mean unholy crap - how did I miss that ?!?!?!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
chockfull
Wow I’m remembering this now. Yes there is an internal buzz about how “Christian” is a derogatory term given by the persecutors. Because they talked about the “Christ in” stuff they were ridiculed with the name.
So they prefer the term “believers”. There is a whole slew of other jargon attached to the Way that is similar.
It produces an egotistical derision and looking down upon other Christians and established an internal cult name that true “believers” latch onto.
So “believers” would never spend any time on that “vomit fest” Greasespot because they are too busy “moving the Word Over the World”.
Putting the Stepford in. Taking the Christian out.
One of the first steps in a cults dominance in a persons life is establishing a secret inner knowledge that folks outside the cult don’t have.
You see the cult idols are very jealous idols. They can tolerate no other names or ideas among them.
Edited by chockfullLink to comment
Share on other sites
OldSkool
Very interesting points...the hypocrisy is glaring cause they clamor about Christ in you constantly , as if that's some kind of power lever to be unleashed to bring stuff to a person and that's called abundance...fake.
Edited by OldSkoolLink to comment
Share on other sites
chockfull
Yes you are 100 percent right.
An organization with an identity crisis. What they say they stand for is a lie and hidden to gain power over people.
A Biblical research ministry that accepts no other organizations input even on a common goal, that doesn’t use normally accepted publishing standards or channels, that meets in homes, and is very evangelical.
They suck at research, the teachings are vanilla, and with leaders consistently shuffling bodies through “placements” and shunning people there is no genuine fellowship either. Just a cult identity bond which disappears the instant you choose a different Christian org.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
chockfull
Fake cult is fake. VP crying tears and performing with antics on camera about “Christ in you the hope of glory”. But daily practice makes “Christian” a dirty word and prefers a cult substitute “believer”
It reminds me of Christian Grey Poupon mustard.
”Are you a Christian? Pardon me and pass the Grey Poupon”
Edited by chockfullLink to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
So, then...poop-on Christianity?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
vpw claimed that "Christian" was a corruption of "Christ-in", and that Christians were originally called that because they talked about Christ-in. As always, he was wrong. The man never studied Church history, he studied how to give sermons. In hindsight, it was ridiculous to trust him on anything of substance- Bible languages, Church history..... vpw claimed the early Christians in Acts were called "followers of The Way", with Jesus Christ being "The Way." Naturally, they're into their congregation being called their "FOLLOWERS" and herding them like sheep....and fleecing them like sheep.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Charity
Were any facts given by vp to support this assertion that “Christian” is a derogatory term given by the persecutors. Because they talked about the “Christ in” stuff they were ridiculed with the name."?
According to Acts 11:26, "and when he (Barnabas) had found him (Saul), he brought him to Antioch. And so it came to pass that for a whole year they met with the church and taught a great number of people. And the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch." The word "Christian" has been used respectfully for centuries as a name for those who love and follow Christ. So even if there was a grain of truth behind what vp said, he could easily have chosen to continue honoring the name instead.
His real reason for doing what he did had nothing to do with the origin of the name. I believe his intent was to derogate the name himself for self-serving, cult-like purposes like the ones chockfull shared above.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.