Again Jesus Christ and God were protecting followers of Jesus Christ by blinding Saul who again was wanting to religiously capture followers of Jesus Christ and find a reason to have them murdered like Saul did with Stephen. Perhaps, you can think about it this way. If a person was trying to capture and find a reason to have you murdered, would you at least call the police? I wonder if you would also pray to God? Using logic followers of Jesus Christ knew how to pray to God for protection. Historically in the first century followers of Jesus Christ did not have the help of a protective government. Therefore they needed help from God. Jesus Christ in his earthly life saw the hatred in Israel and the Roman empire and knew that there would be destruction in the capital city of Israel soon. Historically in 70 AD the capital city of Israel or Jerusalem was at least partially destroyed by the Roman empire. Sorry, but I am not blaming God or Jesus Christ for this destruction. It came because humans are not puppets on a string with God controlling everything that people do or want to do.
God & Jesus were not doing a good job of protecting - what about Stephen? What about all the Christians that were harmed and killed by Saul before he was converted? What about all the Christian martyrs from then up to and including present day?
Boy oh boy! You folks seem to be (I peeked above) really into having Saul blinded by God. I always thought the devil did that, and was trying to kill him, but God was able to protect his life, like with Job. God's will was for him to see, so He made immediate provisions to heal Saul's blindness.
Mike, read the scriptures in Acts chapter 9 that clearly show
Then he was healed of his blindness when he became a follower of Jesus Christ.
That's complicated timing, because of the 3 passages in Acts that have to be harmonized.
First, though, please give me that timing with some more detail.
You wrote: "...Saul was blinded before he tried to have more followers of Jesus Christ murdered."
That's the part I always saw as the devil being right there, on the Road to Damascus prepping Saul for his plan when he got there, and BOOM! The devil's plan was interrupted, and he was aware of what was happening! Saul was his main man, you know. This was his high priority in the spiritual war. Seeing and hearing a conversation like the others there, he freaks and tries to kill Saul. Anything but allow Saul talk to the Savior.
You wrote: "Then he was healed of his blindness when he became a follower of Jesus Christ."
Oh yes! I remember that much better than the above. That was just my mental image as I would read. But this second quote from you is ....<cue the orchestra>... IN THE CLASS! Da Da Da Daaaaaaah! This is the part where God gets to have His will happen in full for Paul's starting out as a Christian.
So, is there some kind of "idiom of permission" in there that God blinded him?
Or is it you assume the devil must be out of the picture, and by the TIMING you say proves that God did it? I think I saw you were the advocating that. Forgive me if I'm wrong. But more than one was.
I know lots of people who think that " IF it happens, then it MUST be God's will." That is a standard, common attitude on the streets and in the churches. Of course, that formula doesn't work too well for when sin happens. LoL But I usually don't challenge that when thy say "If it happens, then it MUST be God's will," because they are too far gone to tinker with that Postulate.
9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.
10 And I said, What shall I do, Lord? And the Lord said unto me, Arise, and go into Damascus; and there it shall be told thee of all things which are appointed for thee to do.
11 And when I could not see for the glory of that light, being led by the hand of them that were with me, I came into Damascus.
13 At midday, O king, I saw in the way
a light from heaven, above the brightness
of the sun, shining round about me and
them which journeyed with me. 14 And when we were all fallen to the
earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me,
and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul,
Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
15 And I said, Who art thou, Lord?
And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.
16 But rise, and stand upon thy feet:
for I have appeared unto thee for this
purpose, to make thee a minister and a
witness both of these things which thou
hast seen, and of those things in the
which I will appear unto thee;
17 Delivering thee from the people,
and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I
send thee,
18 To open their eyes, ...
Again it says the others saw the light.
But they didn't get blinded.
I think they didn't speak the language Paul heard.
Did I remember that right?
It also mentioned that the others had fear, in the earlier 2nd Acts passage, above.
Look for it wherever these other "find" games are sold
Don't you remember that a cloud, in Acts 1, actually HID the ascending Jesus from their sight.
He didn't just get smaller and smaller, and hazier and hazier. They could still see him well and were getting stiff necks in the process! Then zip, into a cloud, and GONE! Absent! Ohhhhhh Noooooooooooo! This is terrible!
Ohh, but SUDDEN COMFORT !
Two angels PROMISE he's coming back!
Meanwhile you apostles got work to do, so stop gazing into heaven. (my paraphrase)
Has anyone noticed how many times the word "heaven "is in there?
9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Kinda interesting.
Is this in the hated wierwille curricula?
Thanks, Mike, for that direct answer: Primarily Paul's epistles.
Please answer my follow up question.
"What about all those scrolls of the Septuagint that Paul was so adamant Timothy retrieve? Those were Old Testament scrolls. Paul taught from those scriptures. Any time "scripture" is mentioned in any epistles the meaning is individual and collected writings that would eventually be known as the Hebrew Bible. Is the Hebrew Bible the word?"
Best I know, Jesus quoted from the Septuagint, so that is important.
Paul quoted from the OT, and his attitude clearly was that it was the Word of God.
Do I win a new car if I get the answer right?
Tick tock tick tock..BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Yes!
Oh, no! Is Hebrew a trick word here?
I'm ok with waiting for what the judges say.
*/*/*/*
Now can you tell me why you are so sure of the data you wrote and I quoted above?
I'll take that over a new car. I can't afford the taxes.
God & Jesus were not doing a good job of protecting - what about Stephen? What about all the Christians that were harmed and killed by Saul before he was converted? What about all the Christian martyrs from then up to and including present day?
Followers of Jesus Christ who were unfairly in their lives, especially followers of Christ who were murdered for no crime. God will make up for this in the 1,000 year period with the resurrection of the just or the gathering together. Simply different authors express this differently. For example, Luke in Acts 24:15, Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 and 1 Corinthians chapter 15, and John in Revelation chapter 20, who often wrote figuratively.
Quote
Revelation 20:4
4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (NIV)
And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,
2 And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.
3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:
4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest:
I still get surprised when I run into people who don't get why Saul addressed Jesus that way, and what he meant by that. It's very simple. Really. Check a dictionary for a refresher on what "lord" means.
Saul was traveling, and suddenly he saw a bright light hit him from the sky, and a voice accompanied it. "Saul, why do you persecute me?" Saul got up from the ground, and addressed the voice and light that came from the sky. "Who are you, lord?"
Was Saul addressing him as God? Hardly- he had no idea whom he was addressing- otherwise he wouldn't open with "WHO ARE YOU?" He was addressing this complete stranger with respect. Our modern addresses might have said, "Who are you, Sir?" Saul addressed this being with deference and respect. Why? The man was knocked off his feet and landed on his @$$ by a being who showed up as a bright light and a voice from heaven. (I'd be shocked if the voice wasn't pretty loud, too.)
Saul wasn't addressing him as God Almighty, The Savior, or anything else like that. "I don't know who you are, but I'm addressing you as 'sir' because you showed up, blew me off my feet, and surrounded me with a bright light and a voice. You're definitely more powerful than me and have more authority, whoever or whatever you are."
So, "lord" here wasn't referring to God, and wasn't referring to Saul pledging his loyal allegiance to this mysterious person. Saul's loyalty wasn't that shallow. He didn't automatically switch his allegiance to this voice. But he gave his undivided attention and deference. Later, he DID switch his allegiance to Jesus, but only after finding out who was speaking to him, having more information from other Christians, and time to deliberate.
Scripture isn't completely mute on Christ the man in his now glorified state - a man who has been changed from flesh and bones/blood to a life quickening spirit. Obviously, John is receiving a vision and that vision is showing him things from a heavenly perspective. I know mike likes to imagine a lowly Jesus still walking around in sandals, a tunic, and a copy of Pflap under his arm...but as usual - scripture disagrees with mike and I cant wait to hear how hes gonna exlain this away...oh wait...wrong dispensation....revelation doesn't apply .....WRONG!
Mike - there's no future trying to tell God what he can and can't do. We simply don't know that Jesus Christ wasn't changed AFTER the ascension into what is described here in Revelation 1.
Oh - is please note his countenance was as the sun shineth in strength and in Acts 9 they say a really bright light...coincidence?
Quote
10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
12 And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;
13 And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.
14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;
15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.
16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.
17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:
18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.
Again it says the others saw the light.
But they didn't get blinded.
But it doesn’t say that
Paul said the light was shining on him and those with him but there’s Nothing to indicate the others dared to look into the blinding light like Paul did
perhaps the others looked away or shielded their eyes
I actually learned how to play in upstate New York at summer camp! It's such a simple game of pure leisure. Lawn bowling. Its origins can be traced back to Ancient Rome.
I always had this romantic fantasy of old Italian men playing bocce while drinking wine from juice cups. I tried my best to live that out in my twenties and thirties.
BUT, today it's a metaphor for something else entirely.
I never played when I was in NYC. A close friend of mine turned me on to bocce here in Cincinnatl. There's some people around here in the competitive bar scene (darts, bocce, pool) that really get into bocce. Fun stuff...Im not very good at it but enjoyed the times ive played.
Yeah -- wierwille and his lackluster "research" --- everything was the debil with him....I think wierwille was more infatauated with the debil and totally missed out on the glorofied Christ. Afterall, wasn't the hallmark for immature believers, carnal Chritians, only going as far as Jesus and his crucifixion?
Don't you remember that a cloud, in Acts 1, actually HID the ascending Jesus from their sight.
He didn't just get smaller and smaller, and hazier and hazier. They could still see him well and were getting stiff necks in the process! Then zip, into a cloud, and GONE! Absent! Ohhhhhh Noooooooooooo! This is terrible!
Ohh, but SUDDEN COMFORT !
Two angels PROMISE he's coming back!
Meanwhile you apostles got work to do, so stop gazing into heaven. (my paraphrase)
Has anyone noticed how many times the word "heaven "is in there?
9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Kinda interesting.
Is this in the hated wierwille curricula?
Why don't you want to see that God and Jesus were PROTECTING followers of Jesus Christ so that Saul could not see to get more people MURDERED like Saul did with Stephen before Saul became a follower of Jesus Christ and a very good New Testament teacher? You have logic, but please use logic now.
I can understand why you make the inference and you may be correct. But the simple fact is scripture doesn't explicitly say, therefore I refrain from making the same inference. I don't even think it's a matter of your right and im wrong and vice versa. I just refrain from inferring much of anything that isn't clearly written. There's plenty of allusions in scripture where we are basically left to speculate in great anticipation of our hope.
Followers of Jesus Christ who were unfairly in their lives, especially followers of Christ who were murdered for no crime. God will make up for this in the 1,000 year period with the resurrection of the just or the gathering together. Simply different authors express this differently. For example, Luke in Acts 24:15, Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 and 1 Corinthians chapter 15, and John in Revelation chapter 20, who often wrote figuratively.
But none of those authors expressed it the way YOU did
you're lumping your interpretation in with their narrative…YOU weren’t there
So, is there some kind of "idiom of permission" in there that God blinded him?
Oh yeah - that reminds me - I noticed on the official idiom of permission thread that YOU kept asking about - you never said much after I shared the significance of ancient ideas and concepts from the cultural background study Bible.
It seems like you bring stuff up for your own amusement to see how much of a distraction you can cause
That's complicated timing, because of the 3 passages in Acts that have to be harmonized.
First, though, please give me that timing with some more detail.
You wrote: "...Saul was blinded before he tried to have more followers of Jesus Christ murdered."
That's the part I always saw as the devil being right there, on the Road to Damascus prepping Saul for his plan when he got there, and BOOM! The devil's plan was interrupted, and he was aware of what was happening! Saul was his main man, you know. This was his high priority in the spiritual war. Seeing and hearing a conversation like the others there, he freaks and tries to kill Saul. Anything but allow Saul talk to the Savior.
You wrote: "Then he was healed of his blindness when he became a follower of Jesus Christ."
Oh yes! I remember that much better than the above. That was just my mental image as I would read. But this second quote from you is ....<cue the orchestra>... IN THE CLASS! Da Da Da Daaaaaaah! This is the part where God gets to have His will happen in full for Paul's starting out as a Christian.
So, is there some kind of "idiom of permission" in there that God blinded him?
Or is it you assume the devil must be out of the picture, and by the TIMING you say proves that God did it? I think I saw you were the advocating that. Forgive me if I'm wrong. But more than one was.
I know lots of people who think that " IF it happens, then it MUST be God's will." That is a standard, common attitude on the streets and in the churches. Of course, that formula doesn't work too well for when sin happens. LoL But I usually don't challenge that when thy say "If it happens, then it MUST be God's will," because they are too far gone to tinker with that Postulate.
Ever notice how much wierwille was fascinated with devil spirits…perhaps an unhealthy fascination…
…and wierwille always seemed to talk up how much power and influence the devil has - almost as if he has way more power and influence than God
God & Jesus were not doing a good job of protecting - what about Stephen? What about all the Christians that were harmed and killed by Saul before he was converted? What about all the Christian martyrs from then up to and including present day?
That's the paradox... why God and Jesus protects and saves in some cases, heals in some cases, and in other cases, does not? I think there's so much we don't know but I believe some day we will! I think some of the questions may be answered in Hebrews 11 -- Douay-Rheims Bible, Hebrews Chapter 11 (drbo.org)
I noticed too that in Hebrews 11 Christ is referred to as being 'invisible'.
that's the paradox... why God and Jesus protects and saves in some cases, heals in some cases, and in other cases, does not? I think there's so much we don't know but I believe some day we will! I think some of the questions may be answered in Hebrews 11 -- Douay-Rheims Bible, Hebrews Chapter 11 (drbo.org)
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OldSkool
First off, Biblically speaking, Christ has never been absent...that doctrine does not come close to occuring anywhere in the Bible. Yet the way international teaches the word of God takes the place of
Bolshevik
Mike's apparent anger toward Christ and emphasis on obedience . . . that's Wayworld . . . that's the annihilation of the individual
waysider
Soooo...He used ONE verse from the Amplified Bible, HALF a chapter from the New English Bible and required PFAL '77 students to get some version from the 1800's that has a name so unremarkable you can
Posted Images
T-Bone
God & Jesus were not doing a good job of protecting - what about Stephen? What about all the Christians that were harmed and killed by Saul before he was converted? What about all the Christian martyrs from then up to and including present day?
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T-Bone
Man that is so 33 CE…you have been gone awhile
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Mike
That's complicated timing, because of the 3 passages in Acts that have to be harmonized.
First, though, please give me that timing with some more detail.
You wrote: "...Saul was blinded before he tried to have more followers of Jesus Christ murdered."
That's the part I always saw as the devil being right there, on the Road to Damascus prepping Saul for his plan when he got there, and BOOM! The devil's plan was interrupted, and he was aware of what was happening! Saul was his main man, you know. This was his high priority in the spiritual war. Seeing and hearing a conversation like the others there, he freaks and tries to kill Saul. Anything but allow Saul talk to the Savior.
You wrote: "Then he was healed of his blindness when he became a follower of Jesus Christ."
Oh yes! I remember that much better than the above. That was just my mental image as I would read. But this second quote from you is ....<cue the orchestra>... IN THE CLASS! Da Da Da Daaaaaaah! This is the part where God gets to have His will happen in full for Paul's starting out as a Christian.
So, is there some kind of "idiom of permission" in there that God blinded him?
Or is it you assume the devil must be out of the picture, and by the TIMING you say proves that God did it? I think I saw you were the advocating that. Forgive me if I'm wrong. But more than one was.
I know lots of people who think that " IF it happens, then it MUST be God's will." That is a standard, common attitude on the streets and in the churches. Of course, that formula doesn't work too well for when sin happens. LoL But I usually don't challenge that when thy say "If it happens, then it MUST be God's will," because they are too far gone to tinker with that Postulate.
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Mike
I just did. I didn't see any "idiom of permission" there at all?
Is there one in the other two do you think?
Don't go away; I'll be right back.
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Mike
Acts 22:19-11
9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.
10 And I said, What shall I do, Lord? And the Lord said unto me, Arise, and go into Damascus; and there it shall be told thee of all things which are appointed for thee to do.
11 And when I could not see for the glory of that light, being led by the hand of them that were with me, I came into Damascus.
*/*/*/*/*
That's a lot of light there.
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Mike
Acts 26:13-20
13 At midday, O king, I saw in the way
a light from heaven, above the brightness
of the sun, shining round about me and
them which journeyed with me.
14 And when we were all fallen to the
earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me,
and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul,
Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard
for thee to kick against the pricks.
15 And I said, Who art thou, Lord?
And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.
16 But rise, and stand upon thy feet:
for I have appeared unto thee for this
purpose, to make thee a minister and a
witness both of these things which thou
hast seen, and of those things in the
which I will appear unto thee;
17 Delivering thee from the people,
and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I
send thee,
18 To open their eyes, ...
Again it says the others saw the light.
But they didn't get blinded.
I think they didn't speak the language Paul heard.
Did I remember that right?
It also mentioned that the others had fear, in the earlier 2nd Acts passage, above.
Just thinking out loud.
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Mike
Don't you remember that a cloud, in Acts 1, actually HID the ascending Jesus from their sight.
He didn't just get smaller and smaller, and hazier and hazier. They could still see him well and were getting stiff necks in the process! Then zip, into a cloud, and GONE! Absent! Ohhhhhh Noooooooooooo! This is terrible!
Ohh, but SUDDEN COMFORT !
Two angels PROMISE he's coming back!
Meanwhile you apostles got work to do, so stop gazing into heaven. (my paraphrase)
Has anyone noticed how many times the word "heaven "is in there?
9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Kinda interesting.
Is this in the hated wierwille curricula?
This is my solo research, like the canon.
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Mike
"What about all those scrolls of the Septuagint that Paul was so adamant Timothy retrieve? Those were Old Testament scrolls. Paul taught from those scriptures. Any time "scripture" is mentioned in any epistles the meaning is individual and collected writings that would eventually be known as the Hebrew Bible. Is the Hebrew Bible the word?"
Best I know, Jesus quoted from the Septuagint, so that is important.
Paul quoted from the OT, and his attitude clearly was that it was the Word of God.
Do I win a new car if I get the answer right?
Tick tock tick tock..BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Yes!
Oh, no! Is Hebrew a trick word here?
I'm ok with waiting for what the judges say.
*/*/*/*
Now can you tell me why you are so sure of the data you wrote and I quoted above?
I'll take that over a new car. I can't afford the taxes.
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Mike
Ok. I did.
Now can you answer my quick question?
Is it necessary for Jesus Christ to be present to bless us ?
or equivalently:
Would being absent mean that Jesus Christ cannot bless us?
By "bless" I mean a catch-all for all the scripture depicts him doing.
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Mark Sanguinetti
Followers of Jesus Christ who were unfairly in their lives, especially followers of Christ who were murdered for no crime. God will make up for this in the 1,000 year period with the resurrection of the just or the gathering together. Simply different authors express this differently. For example, Luke in Acts 24:15, Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 and 1 Corinthians chapter 15, and John in Revelation chapter 20, who often wrote figuratively.
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WordWolf
Acts 9 KJV
And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,
2 And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.
3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:
4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest:
--------------------------------------------------
I still get surprised when I run into people who don't get why Saul addressed Jesus that way, and what he meant by that. It's very simple. Really. Check a dictionary for a refresher on what "lord" means.
Saul was traveling, and suddenly he saw a bright light hit him from the sky, and a voice accompanied it. "Saul, why do you persecute me?" Saul got up from the ground, and addressed the voice and light that came from the sky. "Who are you, lord?"
Was Saul addressing him as God? Hardly- he had no idea whom he was addressing- otherwise he wouldn't open with "WHO ARE YOU?" He was addressing this complete stranger with respect. Our modern addresses might have said, "Who are you, Sir?" Saul addressed this being with deference and respect. Why? The man was knocked off his feet and landed on his @$$ by a being who showed up as a bright light and a voice from heaven. (I'd be shocked if the voice wasn't pretty loud, too.)
Saul wasn't addressing him as God Almighty, The Savior, or anything else like that. "I don't know who you are, but I'm addressing you as 'sir' because you showed up, blew me off my feet, and surrounded me with a bright light and a voice. You're definitely more powerful than me and have more authority, whoever or whatever you are."
So, "lord" here wasn't referring to God, and wasn't referring to Saul pledging his loyal allegiance to this mysterious person. Saul's loyalty wasn't that shallow. He didn't automatically switch his allegiance to this voice. But he gave his undivided attention and deference. Later, he DID switch his allegiance to Jesus, but only after finding out who was speaking to him, having more information from other Christians, and time to deliberate.
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OldSkool
ROFLMAO!! I missed this somehow. Good one.
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OldSkool
Scripture isn't completely mute on Christ the man in his now glorified state - a man who has been changed from flesh and bones/blood to a life quickening spirit. Obviously, John is receiving a vision and that vision is showing him things from a heavenly perspective. I know mike likes to imagine a lowly Jesus still walking around in sandals, a tunic, and a copy of Pflap under his arm...but as usual - scripture disagrees with mike and I cant wait to hear how hes gonna exlain this away...oh wait...wrong dispensation....revelation doesn't apply .....WRONG!
Mike - there's no future trying to tell God what he can and can't do. We simply don't know that Jesus Christ wasn't changed AFTER the ascension into what is described here in Revelation 1.
Oh - is please note his countenance was as the sun shineth in strength and in Acts 9 they say a really bright light...coincidence?
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T-Bone
But it doesn’t say that
Paul said the light was shining on him and those with him but there’s Nothing to indicate the others dared to look into the blinding light like Paul did
perhaps the others looked away or shielded their eyes
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OldSkool
I never played when I was in NYC. A close friend of mine turned me on to bocce here in Cincinnatl. There's some people around here in the competitive bar scene (darts, bocce, pool) that really get into bocce. Fun stuff...Im not very good at it but enjoyed the times ive played.
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OldSkool
Yeah -- wierwille and his lackluster "research" --- everything was the debil with him....I think wierwille was more infatauated with the debil and totally missed out on the glorofied Christ. Afterall, wasn't the hallmark for immature believers, carnal Chritians, only going as far as Jesus and his crucifixion?
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T-Bone
Jesus also said the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
And the Lord was working WITH his followers
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OldSkool
I can understand why you make the inference and you may be correct. But the simple fact is scripture doesn't explicitly say, therefore I refrain from making the same inference. I don't even think it's a matter of your right and im wrong and vice versa. I just refrain from inferring much of anything that isn't clearly written. There's plenty of allusions in scripture where we are basically left to speculate in great anticipation of our hope.
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T-Bone
But none of those authors expressed it the way YOU did
you're lumping your interpretation in with their narrative…YOU weren’t there
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T-Bone
Eph. 1:3 God has ALREADY BLESSED us with ALL spiritual blessings in Christ Jesus
who could ask for anything more?
maybe a certain cult-leader would who liked to push his more than abundant life materialistic beeswax
Edited by T-BoneTypos and hippos
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T-Bone
Oh yeah - that reminds me - I noticed on the official idiom of permission thread that YOU kept asking about - you never said much after I shared the significance of ancient ideas and concepts from the cultural background study Bible.
It seems like you bring stuff up for your own amusement to see how much of a distraction you can cause
Edited by T-BoneAncient typos = same old $hit
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T-Bone
Ever notice how much wierwille was fascinated with devil spirits…perhaps an unhealthy fascination…
…and wierwille always seemed to talk up how much power and influence the devil has - almost as if he has way more power and influence than God
must be something wrong with his scale of values.
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oldiesman
That's the paradox... why God and Jesus protects and saves in some cases, heals in some cases, and in other cases, does not? I think there's so much we don't know but I believe some day we will! I think some of the questions may be answered in Hebrews 11 -- Douay-Rheims Bible, Hebrews Chapter 11 (drbo.org)
I noticed too that in Hebrews 11 Christ is referred to as being 'invisible'.
Ah ha, we found another synonym for 'absent'.
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T-Bone
Oldiesman, great answer to my questions!
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