Limbo. According to Roman Catholicism it's the place where unbaptized infants go, and some say the just who lived before Christ. I heard that it actually is a level of Hell, but with no punishment. No punishment but missing out on the Beatific Vision. It was that way for centuries until Ratzinger discontinued it in the 90s. Many traditional Catholics don't consider him a valid pope, but that's another story. Now is limbo as being a level of hell, just another way of saying "the grave", "soul sleep" until the great general judgment? I believe we will find out!
Mmmmmph
Where do priests and bishops and popes who force children into sodomitic sessions go?
I'm just stunned and so disheartened. You wrote, "I remember one very ominous teaching in the way corps." vp didn't pull any punches with you guys. You got it full blast. Does anyone know if it was this bad earlier on in the 6th Corps?
Yes I think it was. Maybe that's why so many were removed that first year, myself included. Too afraid to leave? I was. Too afraid to accept this wasn't really for you, but afraid that something bad would happen if you left on your own. I was. No matter... Craig made the decision for many he simply let many of us go. (for various reasons). Now after that I stayed a few years more but nowhere near the level of 'corps commitment' or 'loyalty to the corporation' as some may say.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I'm glad I got in, and I'm glad I got out.
From where I was in my life when I got in, that was an improvement. Getting out of twi is always an improvement.
As for after, God is not that small that He can only be reached with twi or even ex-twi. Learning not to freak out over differences in doctrine helped a lot.
oh, how romantic - two posters passing in cyberspace
ok that was another attempt to be funny - not coming on to you...just thought you needed a little more friendly support...like any charity case...
"oh my God he won't stop !!!!! where's a moderator when you need one?"
love and peace
T-Bone
Cute post T-Bone. Normally I your sense of humor. I wrote a little while back about how your post on page 18 cracked me up. I was just a little slow on the uptake on the poster girl joke - actually, I think a snail would have been faster at getting it.
Limbo. According to Roman Catholicism it's the place where unbaptized infants go, and some say the just who lived before Christ. I heard that it actually is a level of Hell, but with no punishment. No punishment but missing out on the Beatific Vision. It was that way for centuries until Ratzinger discontinued it in the 90s. Many traditional Catholics don't consider him a valid pope, but that's another story. Now is limbo as being a level of hell, just another way of saying "the grave", "soul sleep" until the great general judgment? I believe we will find out!
Don't make it sound like it was considered completely sound doctrine until the day before Ratzinger/Benedict OFFICIALLY discontinued it. He made official what was already thought long before that.
George Carlin was under the impression it was gone long before that. In his album "Class Clown" in 1972, he addressed that very thing. (No, he was factually incorrect, but he got the idea from what people thought at the time was official doctrine.)
"Limbo was where they sent unbaptized babies. The thinking was, it wasn't their fault. Can't see God if you're not baptized, whip ém into Limbo! What was Limbo like? *odd sounds* *odd voice* 'Wel-come to Limbo.' They've since cancelled Limbo. Apparently, when they purged a couple of saints, they called off Limbo as well. I hope they promoted everyone, you know, and didn't just cut them off into space."
I think the audio is on YT somewhere if you're curious. (Don't hotlink it unless you want YT to delete the file.)
Limbo. According to Roman Catholicism it's the place where unbaptized infants go, and some say the just who lived before Christ. I heard that it actually is a level of Hell, but with no punishment. No punishment but missing out on the Beatific Vision. It was that way for centuries until Ratzinger discontinued it in the 90s. Many traditional Catholics don't consider him a valid pope, but that's another story. Now is limbo as being a level of hell, just another way of saying "the grave", "soul sleep" until the great general judgment? I believe we will find out!
Speaking of hell - I remember our priest saying, “let us pray for the souls in hell”. Made me think God was a real meanie for putting them there – so we’re asking Him to cut them some slack...conflict resolution
4 hours ago, WordWolf said:
That Special Hell, along with people who talk in movie theaters.
Wonder if there’s an annex for people who snore in movie theaters. Went to see Bladerunner 2049 – before the film started there was this guy near us explaining the original one to his date. I thought this was going to be an issue during the movie. But for the duration of the movie, he snored really loud. I didn’t think the movie was that boring.
Don't make it sound like it was considered completely sound doctrine until the day before Ratzinger/Benedict OFFICIALLY discontinued it. He made official what was already thought long before that.
George Carlin was under the impression it was gone long before that. In his album "Class Clown" in 1972, he addressed that very thing. (No, he was factually incorrect, but he got the idea from what people thought at the time was official doctrine.)
"Limbo was where they sent unbaptized babies. The thinking was, it wasn't their fault. Can't see God if you're not baptized, whip ém into Limbo! What was Limbo like? *odd sounds* *odd voice* 'Wel-come to Limbo.' They've since cancelled Limbo. Apparently, when they purged a couple of saints, they called off Limbo as well. I hope they promoted everyone, you know, and didn't just cut them off into space."
I think the audio is on YT somewhere if you're curious. (Don't hotlink it unless you want YT to delete the file.)
The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. Traditional Catholics pride themselves on tradition and age-old concepts so why would this concept be any different. George Carlin said there is no God. If he said there is no heaven, hell, limbo, etc. should we believe him. He is very funny and a gifted entertainer; but is it wise for a believer to take serious spiritual advice from an unbeliever?
Its really interesting to consider WHY wierwille wanted people to be loyal to him. Im sure money was at the root of his demand for loyalty...I mean...wouldnt want those dollars escaping his grasp...
A short time ago, 2021 somewhere, I prayed and meditated several time about joining a church, possibly taking in a few sessions up at CFF, or perhaps starting my own thing....at the end of that time of meditation I realized that the book of Acts shows us Jesus was vitally involved in their lives on an individual level. So...I prayed and basically told the Lord that I didnt want anything with my name on it, or a 501-c3 chartered in my name...I told him that I would do whatever he needed but I wouldn't lead anyone to myself, but instead I would point the way to Jesus Christ. Ive been really at peace ever since. So, I really dont get the whole loyalty thing...loyalty to wierwille, loyalty to craig...who needs these bozos.
Obsession with having power, pride (the need to have an adoring following) or a desire to have grads fellowship together so they could become rooted and grounded (or indoctrinated) in what he taught in pfal, could have been other reasons for wanting loyalty. I don't know if vp gave himself the title of "the man of God for all times" (not sure if the "for all times" are the exact words), but he certainly didn't stop people from saying and believing it.
I can see how your decision on how to help people would bring you peace. It makes me peaceful when reading about it.
The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. Traditional Catholics pride themselves on tradition and age-old concepts so why would this concept be any different. George Carlin said there is no God. If he said there is no heaven, hell, limbo, etc. should we believe him. He is very funny and a gifted entertainer; but is it wise for a believer to take serious spiritual advice from an unbeliever?
There are some people who believe that the Roman Catholic church has some traditions and concepts that are not rooted in scripture. A good starting point for evaluating spiritual advice might be, "does scripture matter?" Oh my goodness, then you have to ask, "what is scripture?"
I haven't seen the concept of limbo in what I believe to be scripture. For now I think of of it more as a dance you do trying to get under a stick.
Yes I think it was. Maybe that's why so many were removed that first year, myself included. Too afraid to leave? I was. Too afraid to accept this wasn't really for you, but afraid that something bad would happen if you left on your own. I was. No matter... Craig made the decision for many he simply let many of us go. (for various reasons). Now after that I stayed a few years more but nowhere near the level of 'corps commitment' or 'loyalty to the corporation' as some may say.
I hope he did it "in private" and without speaking lies or pushing fear when he told others in the corps about why so many were no longer in the program.
Obsession with having power, pride (the need to have an adoring following) or a desire to have grads fellowship together so they could become rooted and grounded (or indoctrinated) in what he taught in pfal, could have been other reasons for wanting loyalty. I don't know if vp gave himself the title of "the man of God for all times" (not sure if the "for all times" are the exact words), but he certainly didn't stop people from saying and believing it.
I can see how your decision on how to help people would bring you peace. It makes me peaceful when reading about it.
If i remember right it was "the man of God for our day, time, and hour!"
There are some people who believe that the Roman Catholic church has some traditions and concepts that are not rooted in scripture. A good starting point for evaluating spiritual advice might be, "does scripture matter?" Oh my goodness, then you have to ask, "what is scripture?"
I haven't seen the concept of limbo in what I believe to be scripture. For now I think of of it more as a dance you do trying to get under a stick.
Yeah, I could never get very far with that. Amazing though how low some people could go.
Read "how to play the game threads" and the first few posts of any thread, and the last page or so, to get the rules, general play, and where we're at now. You can choose to join any thread, all of them, or none of them, or join one and then just stop posting on it, as you see fit. The only catch is that play is on "the honor system" - we agree not to cheat. (Explanations are on the threads.)
we all mean well and want to help – and it’s easy to feel overwhelmed with the good vibes and advice from well-wishers…so I’m just saying go at your own pace…don’t feel like you have to report back to anyone or give a progress report
Morning T-Bone,
Thank you very much for all you wrote (and the others as well). I'll take you up on the above advice. My heart still feels heavy, so it looks like it's going to take some time to work through all this. I will still reply on other issues of topic as I still enjoy reading the posts.
That mental agitation you expressed likely comes from unrealistic expectations and outright lies foisted on us by TWI, that somehow people are perfect once they "renew their minds". Thats all religous garbage that gets mixed in with the law of believing. So TWI creates a false reality with people playing their roles in fantasy land. Give yourself time and just learn to enjoy the process. You are here at this juncture because you want to be closer to the Lord...and you are drawing nearer and he is drawing nearer to you. I would say you are on the right path.
Oh----avoid offshoots like the plague. I made that mistake when I first left TWI.
1 Thessalonians 5:21
“Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.”
Thanks for your whole post OldSkool. It was nice of you to let me know it was coming after you got home from work. Concerning the above portion of it, I have questions around the renewing your mind which I'd like to bring up at another time.
I do want to be closer to Jesus and GSC is helping big time with this.
About the offshoots, sorry, but I've already been there and done that with 3 of them (Living Hope, The Living Truth and Spirit and Truth). One of them now teaches we are no longer saved if we make the decision to deny our faith in Christ and walk away from God. Their statement of belief says, "Faith implies obedience (James 2:14-26). If Jesus is our Lord, then we must obey. We are required to maintain faith unto the end (Hebrews 3; 6; 10) in order to enter the Kingdom." In other words, we are required to maintain obedience unto the end..." One shared some "political" views in an interview about his ministry which I thought was wrong for a minister to do (imo). About another one, I find their REV bible useful at times so I refer to it along with other versions.
1 Thessalonians 5:21
“Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.” Great verse. It would be so helpful to know, understand and believe this verse before getting swept up and pulled under by twi's early love bombing and indoctrination into pfal.
Don't make it sound like it was considered completely sound doctrine until the day before Ratzinger/Benedict OFFICIALLY discontinued it. He made official what was already thought long before that.
George Carlin was under the impression it was gone long before that. In his album "Class Clown" in 1972, he addressed that very thing. (No, he was factually incorrect, but he got the idea from what people thought at the time was official doctrine.)
"Limbo was where they sent unbaptized babies. The thinking was, it wasn't their fault. Can't see God if you're not baptized, whip ém into Limbo! What was Limbo like? *odd sounds* *odd voice* 'Wel-come to Limbo.' They've since cancelled Limbo. Apparently, when they purged a couple of saints, they called off Limbo as well. I hope they promoted everyone, you know, and didn't just cut them off into space."
I think the audio is on YT somewhere if you're curious. (Don't hotlink it unless you want YT to delete the file.) "
----------------------------------------
Oldiesman:
"The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. Traditional Catholics pride themselves on tradition and age-old concepts so why would this concept be any different. George Carlin said there is no God. If he said there is no heaven, hell, limbo, etc. should we believe him. He is very funny and a gifted entertainer; but is it wise for a believer to take serious spiritual advice from an unbeliever?"
---------------------------------
I suppose it was too much to hope the old "I'll find something you didn't say, claim you said it, and object to it" Oldiesman was gone for good.....
I quoted Carlin, and said that my point was "(No, he was factually incorrect, but he got the idea from what people thought at the time was official doctrine.)" As a stand-up comedian, his job involved observing the culture around him and composing comedy. So, I quoted him to point out people thought this concept was deprecated long before Ratzinger/Benedict. As of 1972, that was in the air. That was the sole point. I also said outright that he was FACTUALLY INCORRECT. So, to skip my one point to focus on points I didn't make is, at least, silly.
The other problem is your claim about the history of Limbo. You said
"The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. "
"The concept of limbo probably developed in Europe in the Middle Ages but was never defined as a church dogma, and reference to it was omitted from the official catechism of the church that was issued in 1992."
I'm not interested in splitting hairs over the titles the RCC gives everything. However, the RCC never made Limbo a church dogma. That sounds to me like the opposite of saying it was considered "sound doctrine." Otherwise, there would have been encyclicals and everything affirming it. Since 1543 (the Council of Trent), there's been debate as to specifics of Limbo- which were not settled with a Papal decree- unless you count 2007's de-facto calling it off. For that matter, whatever led up to 1992 pretty much decided that the doctrine was kaput. So, again, as of the 1970s, some people thought it had already been called-off.
If you feel the need to continue this fruitless diversion, please go to Doctrinal and start a new thread.
There are some people who believe that the Roman Catholic church has some traditions and concepts that are not rooted in scripture. A good starting point for evaluating spiritual advice might be, "does scripture matter?" Oh my goodness, then you have to ask, "what is scripture?"
I haven't seen the concept of limbo in what I believe to be scripture. For now I think of of it more as a dance you do trying to get under a stick.
Steven Wright had a friend who spent all Summer practicing that dance, and now he can go under a carpet.
The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. Traditional Catholics pride themselves on tradition and age-old concepts so why would this concept be any different. George Carlin said there is no God. If he said there is no heaven, hell, limbo, etc. should we believe him. He is very funny and a gifted entertainer; but is it wise for a believer to take serious spiritual advice from an unbeliever?
Probably not.
It is also not wise to take advice from talking donkeys. But don’t tell Balaam that lol.
George Carlin did a good job calling out an inconsistency with humor. If you look at him from one angle he does look like a talking donkey. But funny not inspired.
Don’t know about limbo babies. Maybe God does a bookstore story time with them twice a day. What do you think?
"Faith implies obedience (James 2:14-26). If Jesus is our Lord, then we must obey. We are required to maintain faith unto the end (Hebrews 3; 6; 10) in order to enter the Kingdom." In other words, we are required to maintain obedience unto the end..."
Does faith imply obedience? Find out for yourself.
I’m not finished thinking about this asserted claim, but I’m inclined, at this moment, to suspect some theological maneuvering.
I think the more important implication is a subtle, sinister one: faith implies obedience - obedience to the clergy.
How will you learn, unless you are taught? And who will teach you? A man of God, of course! How will you know he is a man of God? He himself will say so of himself.
I hope he did it "in private" and without speaking lies or pushing fear when he told others in the corps about why so many were no longer in the program.
Apparently there was much spiritual chaos, at least a little too much for Craig to handle, so he gathered all everyone on campus (even the college kids) to meet up in the Ermal Owens Sunshine Room and he dismissed everyone in the 6th corps. This was Sunday, March 7, 1976. Then he said that anybody who wanted to re-commit themselves to the corps program can do so. I think he may have passed around a clipboard but I don't remember now. But I do remember that I wanted to recommit myself but earlier in the day, Craig personally dismissed me in his office, so his offer to the whole corps didn't apply to me. Then I found out later that a sizable number of people didn't recommit themselves... so that was how that all happened.
Quick comment. Limbo sounds better than purgatory. I've heard that the need for baby baptism because of "the original sin" was to keep people in the Roman Catholic church.
I don't think RC baptism is any different from any other Christian groups' water baptism and I hear that RC church recognizes water baptism from other Christian groups. All I ever thought water baptism was was to cleanse the soul (clean slate) from original sin.
There are some people who believe that the Roman Catholic church has some traditions and concepts that are not rooted in scripture. A good starting point for evaluating spiritual advice might be, "does scripture matter?" Oh my goodness, then you have to ask, "what is scripture?"
I haven't seen the concept of limbo in what I believe to be scripture. For now I think of of it more as a dance you do trying to get under a stick.
When I took their RCIA course a couple of years ago, they told me right off the bat that the RC church doesn't always go by scripture. That's not to say they do not revere it, they do. Their missals are full of scriptures. But they account for other phenomena as well. So I took that to mean that there are truths in this universe that are not written in scripture and I have to say that now I do believe that is the case.
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OldSkool
First off, Biblically speaking, Christ has never been absent...that doctrine does not come close to occuring anywhere in the Bible. Yet the way international teaches the word of God takes the place of
Bolshevik
Mike's apparent anger toward Christ and emphasis on obedience . . . that's Wayworld . . . that's the annihilation of the individual
waysider
Soooo...He used ONE verse from the Amplified Bible, HALF a chapter from the New English Bible and required PFAL '77 students to get some version from the 1800's that has a name so unremarkable you can
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Nathan_Jr
Mmmmmph
Where do priests and bishops and popes who force children into sodomitic sessions go?
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oldiesman
Yes I think it was. Maybe that's why so many were removed that first year, myself included. Too afraid to leave? I was. Too afraid to accept this wasn't really for you, but afraid that something bad would happen if you left on your own. I was. No matter... Craig made the decision for many he simply let many of us go. (for various reasons). Now after that I stayed a few years more but nowhere near the level of 'corps commitment' or 'loyalty to the corporation' as some may say.
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oldiesman
Totally agree with all of this ! Thank you.
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Charity
Cute post T-Bone. Normally I
your sense of humor. I wrote a little while back about how your post on page 18 cracked me up. I was just a little slow on the uptake on the poster girl joke - actually, I think a snail would have been faster at getting it.
love and peace back to you
Charity
A merry heart is good medicine
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WordWolf
Don't make it sound like it was considered completely sound doctrine until the day before Ratzinger/Benedict OFFICIALLY discontinued it. He made official what was already thought long before that.
George Carlin was under the impression it was gone long before that. In his album "Class Clown" in 1972, he addressed that very thing. (No, he was factually incorrect, but he got the idea from what people thought at the time was official doctrine.)
"Limbo was where they sent unbaptized babies. The thinking was, it wasn't their fault. Can't see God if you're not baptized, whip ém into Limbo! What was Limbo like? *odd sounds* *odd voice* 'Wel-come to Limbo.' They've since cancelled Limbo. Apparently, when they purged a couple of saints, they called off Limbo as well. I hope they promoted everyone, you know, and didn't just cut them off into space."
I think the audio is on YT somewhere if you're curious. (Don't hotlink it unless you want YT to delete the file.)
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WordWolf
That Special Hell, along with people who talk in movie theaters.
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Nathan_Jr
These wretched, depraved humans occupy the #3 spot among the top ten most wicked people in our day and time.
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T-Bone
Speaking of hell - I remember our priest saying, “let us pray for the souls in hell”. Made me think God was a real meanie for putting them there – so we’re asking Him to cut them some slack...conflict resolution
Wonder if there’s an annex for people who snore in movie theaters. Went to see Bladerunner 2049 – before the film started there was this guy near us explaining the original one to his date. I thought this was going to be an issue during the movie. But for the duration of the movie, he snored really loud. I didn’t think the movie was that boring.
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oldiesman
The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. Traditional Catholics pride themselves on tradition and age-old concepts so why would this concept be any different. George Carlin said there is no God. If he said there is no heaven, hell, limbo, etc. should we believe him. He is very funny and a gifted entertainer; but is it wise for a believer to take serious spiritual advice from an unbeliever?
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Charity
Obsession with having power, pride (the need to have an adoring following) or a desire to have grads fellowship together so they could become rooted and grounded (or indoctrinated) in what he taught in pfal, could have been other reasons for wanting loyalty. I don't know if vp gave himself the title of "the man of God for all times" (not sure if the "for all times" are the exact words), but he certainly didn't stop people from saying and believing it.
I can see how your decision on how to help people would bring you peace. It makes me peaceful when reading about it.
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fredgrant
There are some people who believe that the Roman Catholic church has some traditions and concepts that are not rooted in scripture. A good starting point for evaluating spiritual advice might be, "does scripture matter?" Oh my goodness, then you have to ask, "what is scripture?"
I haven't seen the concept of limbo in what I believe to be scripture. For now I think of of it more as a dance you do trying to get under a stick.
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Charity
I hope he did it "in private" and without speaking lies or pushing fear when he told others in the corps about why so many were no longer in the program.
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fredgrant
If i remember right it was "the man of God for our day, time, and hour!"
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Charity
Yeah, I could never get very far with that. Amazing though how low some people could go.
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Charity
You guys are more fun than a barrel of monkeys!
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Charity
Morning T-Bone,
Thank you very much for all you wrote (and the others as well). I'll take you up on the above advice. My heart still feels heavy, so it looks like it's going to take some time to work through all this. I will still reply on other issues of topic as I still enjoy reading the posts.
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Charity
Thanks for your whole post OldSkool. It was nice of you to let me know it was coming after you got home from work. Concerning the above portion of it, I have questions around the renewing your mind which I'd like to bring up at another time.
I do want to be closer to Jesus and GSC is helping big time with this.
About the offshoots, sorry, but I've already been there and done that with 3 of them (Living Hope, The Living Truth and Spirit and Truth). One of them now teaches we are no longer saved if we make the decision to deny our faith in Christ and walk away from God. Their statement of belief says, "Faith implies obedience (James 2:14-26). If Jesus is our Lord, then we must obey. We are required to maintain faith unto the end (Hebrews 3; 6; 10) in order to enter the Kingdom." In other words, we are required to maintain obedience unto the end..." One shared some "political" views in an interview about his ministry which I thought was wrong for a minister to do (imo). About another one, I find their REV bible useful at times so I refer to it along with other versions.
1 Thessalonians 5:21
“Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.” Great verse. It would be so helpful to know, understand and believe this verse before getting swept up and pulled under by twi's early love bombing and indoctrination into pfal.
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WordWolf
WordWolf:
"
Don't make it sound like it was considered completely sound doctrine until the day before Ratzinger/Benedict OFFICIALLY discontinued it. He made official what was already thought long before that.
George Carlin was under the impression it was gone long before that. In his album "Class Clown" in 1972, he addressed that very thing. (No, he was factually incorrect, but he got the idea from what people thought at the time was official doctrine.)
"Limbo was where they sent unbaptized babies. The thinking was, it wasn't their fault. Can't see God if you're not baptized, whip ém into Limbo! What was Limbo like? *odd sounds* *odd voice* 'Wel-come to Limbo.' They've since cancelled Limbo. Apparently, when they purged a couple of saints, they called off Limbo as well. I hope they promoted everyone, you know, and didn't just cut them off into space."
I think the audio is on YT somewhere if you're curious. (Don't hotlink it unless you want YT to delete the file.) "
----------------------------------------
Oldiesman:
"The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. Traditional Catholics pride themselves on tradition and age-old concepts so why would this concept be any different. George Carlin said there is no God. If he said there is no heaven, hell, limbo, etc. should we believe him. He is very funny and a gifted entertainer; but is it wise for a believer to take serious spiritual advice from an unbeliever?"
---------------------------------
I suppose it was too much to hope the old "I'll find something you didn't say, claim you said it, and object to it" Oldiesman was gone for good.....
I quoted Carlin, and said that my point was "(No, he was factually incorrect, but he got the idea from what people thought at the time was official doctrine.)" As a stand-up comedian, his job involved observing the culture around him and composing comedy. So, I quoted him to point out people thought this concept was deprecated long before Ratzinger/Benedict. As of 1972, that was in the air. That was the sole point. I also said outright that he was FACTUALLY INCORRECT. So, to skip my one point to focus on points I didn't make is, at least, silly.
The other problem is your claim about the history of Limbo. You said
"The very fact that it was sound doctrine for centuries leads me to think that we in this century can be wrong and not centuries before. "
I'll quote the Encyclopedia Brittanica.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/limbo-Roman-Catholic-theology
"The concept of limbo probably developed in Europe in the Middle Ages but was never defined as a church dogma, and reference to it was omitted from the official catechism of the church that was issued in 1992."
I'm not interested in splitting hairs over the titles the RCC gives everything. However, the RCC never made Limbo a church dogma. That sounds to me like the opposite of saying it was considered "sound doctrine." Otherwise, there would have been encyclicals and everything affirming it. Since 1543 (the Council of Trent), there's been debate as to specifics of Limbo- which were not settled with a Papal decree- unless you count 2007's de-facto calling it off. For that matter, whatever led up to 1992 pretty much decided that the doctrine was kaput. So, again, as of the 1970s, some people thought it had already been called-off.
If you feel the need to continue this fruitless diversion, please go to Doctrinal and start a new thread.
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WordWolf
Steven Wright had a friend who spent all Summer practicing that dance, and now he can go under a carpet.
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chockfull
Probably not.
It is also not wise to take advice from talking donkeys. But don’t tell Balaam that lol.
George Carlin did a good job calling out an inconsistency with humor. If you look at him from one angle he does look like a talking donkey. But funny not inspired.
Don’t know about limbo babies. Maybe God does a bookstore story time with them twice a day. What do you think?
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Nathan_Jr
Does faith imply obedience? Find out for yourself.
I’m not finished thinking about this asserted claim, but I’m inclined, at this moment, to suspect some theological maneuvering.
I think the more important implication is a subtle, sinister one: faith implies obedience - obedience to the clergy.
How will you learn, unless you are taught? And who will teach you? A man of God, of course! How will you know he is a man of God? He himself will say so of himself.
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oldiesman
Apparently there was much spiritual chaos, at least a little too much for Craig to handle, so he gathered all everyone on campus (even the college kids) to meet up in the Ermal Owens Sunshine Room and he dismissed everyone in the 6th corps. This was Sunday, March 7, 1976. Then he said that anybody who wanted to re-commit themselves to the corps program can do so. I think he may have passed around a clipboard but I don't remember now. But I do remember that I wanted to recommit myself but earlier in the day, Craig personally dismissed me in his office, so his offer to the whole corps didn't apply to me. Then I found out later that a sizable number of people didn't recommit themselves... so that was how that all happened.
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oldiesman
I don't think RC baptism is any different from any other Christian groups' water baptism and I hear that RC church recognizes water baptism from other Christian groups. All I ever thought water baptism was was to cleanse the soul (clean slate) from original sin.
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oldiesman
When I took their RCIA course a couple of years ago, they told me right off the bat that the RC church doesn't always go by scripture. That's not to say they do not revere it, they do. Their missals are full of scriptures. But they account for other phenomena as well. So I took that to mean that there are truths in this universe that are not written in scripture and I have to say that now I do believe that is the case.
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