Anyone remember Victor Wierwille ranting about the Declaration of INTERdependence?

[Rocky]

I remember. Of course, it was "evil." His pronouncements thereof were not based on any exegesis on the merits of the content of said document. Inclusion of the expression "New World Order" apparently flipped a switch in his mind, in his rhetoric, and in our minds to automatically and robotically dismiss the concepts altogether.

Right now, I'm not discussion the political merits of or against the concept. Just that it became an issue in the mid-1970s and just like many other things, Victor ranted dismissively.

Declaration of Interdependence.  Much of the actual document paralleled the Declaration of Independence, but added wording about responsibility, rather than limiting it to a selfish point of view.

Quote

 

IN THE COURSE OF HISTORY the threat of extinction confronts mankind, it is necessary for the people of The United States to declare their interdependence with the people of all nations and to embrace those principles and build those institutions which will enable mankind to survive and civilization to flourish.

TWO CENTURIES AGO our forefathers brought forth a new nation; now we must join with others to bring forth a new world order. On this historic occasion it is proper that the American people should reaffirm those principles on which the United States of America was founded, acknowledge the new crises which confront them, accept the new obligations which history imposes upon them, and set forth the causes which impel them to affirm before all peoples their commitment to a Declaration of Interdependence.

WE HOLD THESE TRUTHS TO BE SELF-EVIDENT: that all men are created equal; that the inequalities and injustices which afflict so much of the human race are the product of history and society, not of God and nature; that people everywhere are entitled to the blessings of life and liberty, peace and security and the realization of their full potential’; that they have an inescapable moral obligation to preserve those rights for posterity; and that to achieve these ends all the peoples and nations of the globe should acknowledge their interdependence and join together to dedicate their minds and their hearts to the solution of those problems which threaten their survival.

 

Of course, in the ensuing 45+ years since, we HAVE learned that there ARE genuine problems/challenges that increasingly risk survival of humanity. 

Let's please limit discussion to historical issues and analysis of what Victor said and did. Otherwise, this may end up not being a viable discussion topic for this forum. Thanks.

[oldiesman]

There was "None Dare Call It Conspiracy" in the TWI bookstore.   And I remember TWI campaigning against "The Newstates Constitution" in 1976 which was all about gutting our U.S. Constitution in favor of that one.    So TWI definitely was in favor of retaining our U.S. Constitution.

[Twinky]

I know nothing about this, but I do recall LCM ranting on about the EU (Economic Union, formerly the EEC - European Economic Community) and how bad it was for different countries to join together in a "union."  For a start, it's none of his doggone business.  For another, isn't the US just that - a union of lots of different States, some very much larger than some EU countries, so as to make one "union" to pursue joint goals?

The fact is, none of us stands alone.  We aren't "independent" or anyone - we're all "interdependent" and we need to remember that, and treat other people and other nations accordingly.  

[chockfull]

Would this be Advanced Class material?  Where we learn about spiritual adultery, become devil spirit zoologists, and truly immerse into conspiracy theory?

[Rocky]

11 hours ago, chockfull said:

Would this be Advanced Class material?  Where we learn about spiritual adultery, become devil spirit zoologists, and truly immerse into conspiracy theory?

I don't recall for sure, but that could be the case.

[frank123lol]

Anytime ya have a different atitude it gets deleted?

 

[WordWolf]

POLITICS is not permitted on the GSC.  The GSC is NOT about politics. 

Funny you should bring this up exactly today.

When 9-11 happened, many people felt the need to express how they felt at the moment.  Over time, allowing people to keep talking on that and related subjects- and gradually less-relevant subjects-  led to political discussions that poisoned the atmosphere of the board.  The staff spent more time on the handful of political posters in 1 forum than they did with hundreds of other posters all along the board.   People who wouldn't moderate themselves were moderated by others=  and responded by lashing out at the staff like immature toddlers.   It was a stressful, thankless, NEEDLESS job.

Eventually, the choices were-  remove the political forum and political posts,  or

remove the entire GSC.

The GSC was never about politics and does not need to be so.  So, politics was deleted. There's lots of places online to post on politics, and there's only one GSC.  

If you really can't control yourself, you can always find some other board of ex-GSC and go complain how unfair things are that there's actual moderation here.  You would hardly be the first to do that, nor the last.

[Rocky]

1 hour ago, WordWolf said:

POLITICS is not permitted on the GSC.  The GSC is NOT about politics. 

Funny you should bring this up exactly today.

When 9-11 happened, many people felt the need to express how they felt at the moment.  Over time, allowing people to keep talking on that and related subjects- and gradually less-relevant subjects-  led to political discussions that poisoned the atmosphere of the board.  The staff spent more time on the handful of political posters in 1 forum than they did with hundreds of other posters all along the board.   People who wouldn't moderate themselves were moderated by others=  and responded by lashing out at the staff like immature toddlers.   It was a stressful, thankless, NEEDLESS job.

Eventually, the choices were-  remove the political forum and political posts,  or

remove the entire GSC.

The GSC was never about politics and does not need to be so.  So, politics was deleted. There's lots of places online to post on politics, and there's only one GSC.  

If you really can't control yourself, you can always find some other board of ex-GSC and go complain how unfair things are that there's actual moderation here.  You would hardly be the first to do that, nor the last.

Clear and precise. Well-stated.

[Modgellan]

And an accurate representation.

[frank123lol]

7 hours ago, WordWolf said:

POLITICS is not permitted on the GSC.  The GSC is NOT about politics. 

Funny you should bring this up exactly today.

When 9-11 happened, many people felt the need to express how they felt at the moment.  Over time, allowing people to keep talking on that and related subjects- and gradually less-relevant subjects-  led to political discussions that poisoned the atmosphere of the board.  The staff spent more time on the handful of political posters in 1 forum than they did with hundreds of other posters all along the board.   People who wouldn't moderate themselves were moderated by others=  and responded by lashing out at the staff like immature toddlers.   It was a stressful, thankless, NEEDLESS job.

Eventually, the choices were-  remove the political forum and political posts,  or

remove the entire GSC.

The GSC was never about politics and does not need to be so.  So, politics was deleted. There's lots of places online to post on politics, and there's only one GSC.  

If you really can't control yourself, you can always find some other board of ex-GSC and go complain how unfair things are that there's actual moderation here.  You would hardly be the first to do that, nor the last.

Well stated? Someone agreed with interdependance I did not.The darn thread should be deleted then.

[Rocky]

38 minutes ago, frank123lol said:

Well stated? Someone agreed with interdependance I did not. The darn thread should be deleted then.

Except that it's about actual history of TWI. Not a discussion of politics.

My question to you is, do you recall Wierwille ranting about the concept, or do you not? Not whether you approve of the notion of interdependence or even agree with it.

 

[frank123lol]

As you said it is politics so i would assume it ends here and now

 

[WordWolf]

Since the question is still "do you recall wierwille ranting about the concept".  I'll answer.

It was all before my time.  I can recount what other posters quoted, or I can recount what vpw said on tapes that I heard later.  On this particular subject, I didn't hear about it on any tapes, as best as I can remember.   I know there were a LOT of things vpw got from his dedicated Liberty Lobby phone connection and their books- all of which he tried to pass off later as revelation.  So, I'm sure I know where he got his opinions on the subject, and where he claimed he got it. 

For that matter, since lcm came out with similar rantings, his most likely sources were the exact same ones ("the Pope has an aircraft carrier and is going to take over countries and force them into Catholicism", and so on. NO, I'm NOT exaggerating.)

Around the US' bicentennial in general (1976), it's amazing how many people suddenly were in fear of someone taking over the US from within, effective as of some time in 1976.