In context, this is referring to a teaching from a deceptive person and not a teaching from a true follower of Jesus Christ. Yes, we can learn from each other as long as we are truthful.
See?
Teaching.
Why is the word "teaching" used except in reverence to vpw?
Why are Christians deciding the Bible is The Word when there is a more sensible alternative? Why choose this?
Why is this never discussed in The Way?
Good questions. I suspect that alternatives require deeper thought, perception and awareness. Contemplation is incongruent with rubbing in by repetition.
The Bible as the Word is the gloved hand. A three-fingered glove perfectly fitting a cartoon mouse.
It's in the collaterals. The Blue Book, I think. Or maybe the Green Book. I probably should have paid better attention.
Images of Jesus were not common and frowned upon . . Although one was in the auditorium where he all in deep thought.
Images of the Bible and dove were more common.
I remember items like he's "the word made flesh" . . . But it's more like the word existed and then Jesus came along and perfectly believed . . ."THE word". That kinda makes him a brown noser for God.
Images of Jesus were not common and frowned upon . . Although one was in the auditorium where he all in deep thought.
Images of the Bible and dove were more common.
I remember items like he's "the word made flesh" . . . But it's more like the word existed and then Jesus came along and perfectly believed . . ."THE word". That kinda makes him a brown noser for God.
A curiously Aryan Jesus was rendered on velvet, framed and hung conspicuously on the wall of the set during the filming of original PFAL.
A curiously Aryan Jesus was rendered on velvet, framed and hung conspicuously on the wall of the set during the filming of original PFAL.
Anyway, who wants to look at a bastard Jew?
That why he was sent away? 30 or 33 years on Earth and he's a one trick pony. Got his foot voluntarily handed to him, and then got replaced by the Greatness of God’s Word.
That's Wayworld, right?
If Gawd would do that to his only begotten, how quickly would he get over you?
Mike said: Isee it as THE new administration, and so do others who have come back to PFAL. The return of Christ is intimately connected with the Christ in us returning to this Word.
So, The Word is PFAL.
That settles it. Gloves and doves. Diamonds and ducks.
Why is the word "teaching" used except in reverence to vpw?
It sounds like you may be a fan of VPW as THE TEACHER like he spoke in PFAL. However, I have ALWAYS seen, even when I was part of TWI, that VPW was one of the teachers, but NOT the only or primary teacher. Yes, I KNEW even when I was with TWI that VPW sometimes taught the true word of God, for example with his book "Are the Dead Alive Now?", but other times did NOT teach the true word of God, for example an audio teaching that I listened to in the late 1970s where VPW agreed with the Roman Catholic church with what he described as a hierarchy of leadership. In addition, he may have also agreed with the Pope as the Vicar of Christ as it relates to the Roman Catholic Church. Also VPW may have seen with other wording also as a type of Vicar of Christ for TWI.
Have a good day, but I now have limited time to waste.
It sounds like you may be a fan of VPW as THE TEACHER like he spoke in PFAL. However, I have ALWAYS seen, even when I was part of TWI, that VPW was one of the teachers, but NOT the only or primary teacher. Yes, I KNEW even when I was with TWI that VPW sometimes taught the true word of God, for example with his book "Are the Dead Alive Now?", but other times did NOT teach the true word of God, for example an audio teaching that I listened to in the late 1970s where VPW agreed with the Roman Catholic church with what he described as a hierarchy of leadership.
Have a good day, but I now have limited time to waste.
Hi Mark,
I noticed you didn't capitalize word of God. We've been exploring what the Word of God could be in this thread? What is the difference between the word and the Word? Any thoughts?
Any thoughts on who the only or primary teacher could be?
I noticed you didn't capitalize word of God. We've been exploring what the Word of God could be in this thread? What is the difference between the word and the Word? Any thoughts?
Any thoughts on who the only or primary teacher could be?
At least I capitalized God. There is NO need to also capitalize "word" in almost all usages of "word of God". Using my very good software program for bible study. The New International Version and New King James Version have only ONE usage of "Word of God" as read in Revelation 19:13. This simply refers to Jesus Christ in a figurative way as our savior with him tasting death for our salvation.
Quote
Revelation 19:13
13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. (NIV)
There are 40 other usages of "word of God" in the New International Version through out the bible and every other usage has "word of God" with "word" that is not capitalized. Using the New King James Version there are 47 other usages of "word of God" that also do not have "word" capitalized. Again the only usage in the bible that has "Word of God" refers to Jesus Christ in a figurative way as our savior.
Quote
Revelation 19:13-14
13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. (NKJV)
Yes, we could have many people that teach about different needed subjects. Regarding the word of God. Jesus Christ in his earthly life was often called "Teacher", by other people. However, other people can also be called "teacher", for example Moses in Matthew 22:24.
Quote
Matthew 22:24
24 saying: "Teacher, Moses said that if a man dies, having no children, his brother shall marry his wife and raise up offspring for his brother. (NKJV)
As one of the example of teachers.
Quote
1 Corinthians 12:28
28 And God hath set some in the church, first (proton) apostles,
secondarily (deuteros) prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. (KJV)
At least I capitalized God. There is NO need to also capitalize "word" in almost all usages of "word of God". Using my very good software program for bible study. The New International Version and New King James Version have only ONE usage of "Word of God" as read in Revelation 19:13. This simply refers to Jesus Christ in a figurative way as our savior with him tasting death for our salvation.
There are 40 other usages of "word of God" in the New International Version through out the bible and every other usage has "word of God" with "word" that is not capitalized. Using the New King James Version there are 47 other usages of "word of God" that also do not have "word" capitalized. Again the only usage in the bible that has "Word of God" refers to Jesus Christ in a figurative way as our savior.
Yes, we could have many people that teach about different needed subjects. Regarding the word of God. Jesus Christ in his earthly life was often called "Teacher", by other people. However, other people can also be called "teacher", for example Moses in Matthew 22:24.
Great. Thanks. Fascinating. What are those 7 instances in the NKJV that are not in the NIV?
Back in my TWI-daze, I would have taken offense if some “rank unbeliever” was being critical about anything in the Bible. But since I joined Grease Spot, I’ve come to appreciate the perspective of others. If memory serves – wierwille had a term “faith-blasters” – I don’t remember the context in which he said it, but I think I had a latent fear of “faith-blasters” when I first came to Grease Spot.
Ah, the faith blasters. One of the most blatant examples of plagiarism in the TWI canon. The hilarious thing is that outside of the context of this particular teaching, you never really heard Wierwille talking about faith blasters.
The faith blasters first pop up in the Q&A section of JE Stiles' book "The Gift of the Holy Spirit," in which he posts a Q about Christians receiving false tongues or a false spirit when seeking God's gift. Stiles wrot
"When people ask that question, we know that they have somewhere come in contact with one of the "faith blasters" who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Not to be confused with Wierwille's Q&A on the same topic in Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, when he answers the same question with: "When I am asked that question, I know that person has come into contact with those whom I term 'faith blasters,' who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Ah, the faith blasters. One of the most blatant examples of plagiarism in the TWI canon. The hilarious thing is that outside of the context of this particular teaching, you never really heard Wierwille talking about faith blasters.
The faith blasters first pop up in the Q&A section of JE Stiles' book "The Gift of the Holy Spirit," in which he posts a Q about Christians receiving false tongues or a false spirit when seeking God's gift. Stiles wrot
"When people ask that question, we know that they have somewhere come in contact with one of the "faith blasters" who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Not to be confused with Wierwille's Q&A on the same topic in Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, when he answers the same question with: "When I am asked that question, I know that person has come into contact with those whom I term 'faith blasters,' who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Gotta love them faith blasters.
The most obvious things about that being plagiarism- besides comparing them side-by-side.....
A) Outside of this sentence plagiarizing Stiles, vpw NEVER used the phrase "faith-blasters." He never used that term.
B) That phrase doesn't fit vpw's schema. As Raf has pointed out before, vpw, had he used that expression at all, would have named those people "BELIEVING-blasters", as fit his deprecation of the term "faith" in general other than the phrase "faith of Jesus Christ".
Which reminded me of the Cantina scene in Star Wars: A New Hope…At about the 2:09 mark you can hear someone in the background (maybe the bartender) yelling “no blasters!” when Obi Wan comes to the defense of Luke against a troublemaker:
Ah, the faith blasters. One of the most blatant examples of plagiarism in the TWI canon. The hilarious thing is that outside of the context of this particular teaching, you never really heard Wierwille talking about faith blasters.
The faith blasters first pop up in the Q&A section of JE Stiles' book "The Gift of the Holy Spirit," in which he posts a Q about Christians receiving false tongues or a false spirit when seeking God's gift. Stiles wrot
"When people ask that question, we know that they have somewhere come in contact with one of the "faith blasters" who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Not to be confused with Wierwille's Q&A on the same topic in Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, when he answers the same question with: "When I am asked that question, I know that person has come into contact with those whom I term 'faith blasters,' who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Gotta love them faith blasters.
4 hours ago, WordWolf said:
The most obvious things about that being plagiarism- besides comparing them side-by-side.....
A) Outside of this sentence plagiarizing Stiles, vpw NEVER used the phrase "faith-blasters." He never used that term.
B) That phrase doesn't fit vpw's schema. As Raf has pointed out before, vpw, had he used that expression at all, would have named those people "BELIEVING-blasters", as fit his deprecation of the term "faith" in general other than the phrase "faith of Jesus Christ".
My memory could be faulty that I heard wierwille say it in PFAL – but I found the term “faith blasters” in my Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, a 1983 seventh edition ( the “original” copy of plagiarized material that I had received into manischewitz - I’ll drink to that ...when I first took PFAL in 1974 it had gotten so beat up – beaten by devils I guess…just kidding…I felt it was necessary to purchase a new one in early 80s) on page 217 under the chapter Some Questions Answered it reads:
8. Is it possible for a Christian to receive false tongues or a false spirit when believing for the holy spirit?
The answer is a loud and clear no. As a matter of fact, speaking in tongues is the only manifestation which basically Satan cannot counterfeit. When I am asked that question, I know that person has come into contact with those whom I term “faith blasters”, who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture.”
End of excerpt
~ ~ ~ ~
It is ironic that wierwille ridicule “ “faith blasters”, who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture” when that was the essence of his ministry – making statements which have no foundation in Scripture! WHERE oh WHERE does it say in the Bible that “speaking in tongues is the only manifestation which basically Satan cannot counterfeit”?
...I don’t know about you – but after I left TWI this has been another great study project – in my opinion wierwille butchers up the Greek syntax in I Corinthians 12, 13, and 14 , he ignores Paul distinguishing between the genuine speaking in tongues (plural) and the gibberish counterfeit of pagan ecstatic speech, speaking in a tongue (singular)…for as much as wierwille encouraged followers to speak in tongues while at the same time discouraging prayer in our understanding – I now tend to think it was just another mind-numbing tactic to suppress critical thinking – besides depriving Christians of the wonderful life-changing, character-shaping, communing-with-God aspects of prayer in our understanding. Reflecting back on the “PERCEIVED NEEDS” of taking PFAL, TIP class, Advanced Class, conducting excellor’s sessions / practice sessions…whatever in order to fill a sense of accomplishment – was just an incredible waste of time and effort…how come we don't find training sessions in the Bible?
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Raf
My plan is working perfectly... Just kidding. I strongly recommend each of you exercise prayer for guidance and wisdom as you explore these issues, because in my experience the observations you'r
T-Bone
Thanks, Raf – great post! The essence of your post should be part of a preface for Grease Spotters to read before posting in doctrinal. For want of a better way to put it – for me atheist
T-Bone
I’m inclined to think the context stresses the importance of the Holy Spirit’s teaching…I also think wierwille-ideology gave intuition a bad name… and in this day and age we also have the convenie
Bolshevik
Being so common I'm assuming vpw coined the phrase.
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Bolshevik
See?
Teaching.
Why is the word "teaching" used except in reverence to vpw?
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Bolshevik
This idea that Jesus is The Word is new to me.
Why are Christians deciding the Bible is The Word when there is a more sensible alternative? Why choose this?
Why is this never discussed in The Way?
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Nathan_Jr
Good questions. I suspect that alternatives require deeper thought, perception and awareness. Contemplation is incongruent with rubbing in by repetition.
The Bible as the Word is the gloved hand. A three-fingered glove perfectly fitting a cartoon mouse.
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waysider
It's in the collaterals. The Blue Book, I think. Or maybe the Green Book. I probably should have paid better attention.
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Bolshevik
Images of Jesus were not common and frowned upon . . Although one was in the auditorium where he all in deep thought.
Images of the Bible and dove were more common.
I remember items like he's "the word made flesh" . . . But it's more like the word existed and then Jesus came along and perfectly believed . . ."THE word". That kinda makes him a brown noser for God.
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Nathan_Jr
A curiously Aryan Jesus was rendered on velvet, framed and hung conspicuously on the wall of the set during the filming of original PFAL.
Anyway, who wants to look at a bastard Jew?
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Bolshevik
That why he was sent away? 30 or 33 years on Earth and he's a one trick pony. Got his foot voluntarily handed to him, and then got replaced by the Greatness of God’s Word.
That's Wayworld, right?
If Gawd would do that to his only begotten, how quickly would he get over you?
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Nathan_Jr
Mike said: I see it as THE new administration, and so do others who have come back to PFAL. The return of Christ is intimately connected with the Christ in us returning to this Word.
So, The Word is PFAL.
That settles it. Gloves and doves. Diamonds and ducks.
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Mark Sanguinetti
It sounds like you may be a fan of VPW as THE TEACHER like he spoke in PFAL. However, I have ALWAYS seen, even when I was part of TWI, that VPW was one of the teachers, but NOT the only or primary teacher. Yes, I KNEW even when I was with TWI that VPW sometimes taught the true word of God, for example with his book "Are the Dead Alive Now?", but other times did NOT teach the true word of God, for example an audio teaching that I listened to in the late 1970s where VPW agreed with the Roman Catholic church with what he described as a hierarchy of leadership. In addition, he may have also agreed with the Pope as the Vicar of Christ as it relates to the Roman Catholic Church. Also VPW may have seen with other wording also as a type of Vicar of Christ for TWI.
Have a good day, but I now have limited time to waste.
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Nathan_Jr
Hi Mark,
I noticed you didn't capitalize word of God. We've been exploring what the Word of God could be in this thread? What is the difference between the word and the Word? Any thoughts?
Any thoughts on who the only or primary teacher could be?
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Bolshevik
Wayworld had it's vocabulary. Cult-speak. Way-speak.
Believing, spiritual, The Word, were some overused words. Teaching is another word. The Teacher is a good point.
The Word is the jargon to be concerned about here. Seems it means not what it means.
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Mark Sanguinetti
At least I capitalized God. There is NO need to also capitalize "word" in almost all usages of "word of God". Using my very good software program for bible study. The New International Version and New King James Version have only ONE usage of "Word of God" as read in Revelation 19:13. This simply refers to Jesus Christ in a figurative way as our savior with him tasting death for our salvation.
There are 40 other usages of "word of God" in the New International Version through out the bible and every other usage has "word of God" with "word" that is not capitalized. Using the New King James Version there are 47 other usages of "word of God" that also do not have "word" capitalized. Again the only usage in the bible that has "Word of God" refers to Jesus Christ in a figurative way as our savior.
Yes, we could have many people that teach about different needed subjects. Regarding the word of God. Jesus Christ in his earthly life was often called "Teacher", by other people. However, other people can also be called "teacher", for example Moses in Matthew 22:24.
As one of the example of teachers.
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Nathan_Jr
Great. Thanks. Fascinating. What are those 7 instances in the NKJV that are not in the NIV?
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Mark Sanguinetti
I at least found six: 1 Samuel 9:27, Luke 4:4, Luke 8:21, Acts 13:44, Hebrews 11:3, and 2 Peter 3:5
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Raf
Ah, the faith blasters. One of the most blatant examples of plagiarism in the TWI canon. The hilarious thing is that outside of the context of this particular teaching, you never really heard Wierwille talking about faith blasters.
The faith blasters first pop up in the Q&A section of JE Stiles' book "The Gift of the Holy Spirit," in which he posts a Q about Christians receiving false tongues or a false spirit when seeking God's gift. Stiles wrot
"When people ask that question, we know that they have somewhere come in contact with one of the "faith blasters" who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Not to be confused with Wierwille's Q&A on the same topic in Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, when he answers the same question with: "When I am asked that question, I know that person has come into contact with those whom I term 'faith blasters,' who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture."
Gotta love them faith blasters.
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Bolshevik
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WordWolf
The most obvious things about that being plagiarism- besides comparing them side-by-side.....
A) Outside of this sentence plagiarizing Stiles, vpw NEVER used the phrase "faith-blasters." He never used that term.
B) That phrase doesn't fit vpw's schema. As Raf has pointed out before, vpw, had he used that expression at all, would have named those people "BELIEVING-blasters", as fit his deprecation of the term "faith" in general other than the phrase "faith of Jesus Christ".
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T-Bone
I like the way you think!
Which reminded me of the Cantina scene in Star Wars: A New Hope…At about the 2:09 mark you can hear someone in the background (maybe the bartender) yelling “no blasters!” when Obi Wan comes to the defense of Luke against a troublemaker:
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T-Bone
My memory could be faulty that I heard wierwille say it in PFAL – but I found the term “faith blasters” in my Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, a 1983 seventh edition ( the “original” copy of plagiarized material that I had received into manischewitz - I’ll drink to that
...when I first took PFAL in 1974 it had gotten so beat up – beaten by devils I guess…just kidding…I felt it was necessary to purchase a new one in early 80s) on page 217 under the chapter Some Questions Answered it reads:
8. Is it possible for a Christian to receive false tongues or a false spirit when believing for the holy spirit?
The answer is a loud and clear no. As a matter of fact, speaking in tongues is the only manifestation which basically Satan cannot counterfeit. When I am asked that question, I know that person has come into contact with those whom I term “faith blasters”, who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture.”
End of excerpt
~ ~ ~ ~
It is ironic that wierwille ridicule “ “faith blasters”, who go about making statements which have no foundation in Scripture” when that was the essence of his ministry – making statements which have no foundation in Scripture! WHERE oh WHERE does it say in the Bible that “speaking in tongues is the only manifestation which basically Satan cannot counterfeit”?
Matter of fact I also disagree with wierwille’s “pronouncement” because I think there IS a reference to counterfeit tongues in I Corinthians 14 – on another thread I got into that – see here > the 2nd wave of returning to PFAL my post on wierwille’s fourfold insidious recipe of PFAL under point #3 spiritualism – the tenth paragraph down – I said:
...I don’t know about you – but after I left TWI this has been another great study project – in my opinion wierwille butchers up the Greek syntax in I Corinthians 12, 13, and 14 , he ignores Paul distinguishing between the genuine speaking in tongues (plural) and the gibberish counterfeit of pagan ecstatic speech, speaking in a tongue (singular)…for as much as wierwille encouraged followers to speak in tongues while at the same time discouraging prayer in our understanding – I now tend to think it was just another mind-numbing tactic to suppress critical thinking – besides depriving Christians of the wonderful life-changing, character-shaping, communing-with-God aspects of prayer in our understanding. Reflecting back on the “PERCEIVED NEEDS” of taking PFAL, TIP class, Advanced Class, conducting excellor’s sessions / practice sessions…whatever in order to fill a sense of accomplishment – was just an incredible waste of time and effort…how come we don't find training sessions in the Bible?
that's all for now folks
Loshonta and out
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