How do they propose to get people to come back? Are they sending out invitation letters? Will such letters begin with a humble and heartfelt apology for past treatment of the addressee (and his/her family)?
For the record............some of us have been exposing all the wrongdoings of twi since 1999, since Waydale. Sheeesh.
Bob Moneyhands isn't some "revival expert"........he probably plagiarized his stuff from GreaseSpot Cafe.
We've been talking about this stuff for 18 years......BEFORE that March 2017 letter was drafted. And, we know that Rosalie got copies of GSC threads dropped on her desk weekly. So, they did nothing......UNTIL TWI IS SPIRALING THE DRAIN.
How do they propose to get people to come back? Are they sending out invitation letters? Will such letters begin with a humble and heartfelt apology for past treatment of the addressee (and his/her family)?
No?
Tough, then. Bye.
Twinky.......I seriously doubt that they will send out invitation letters.
Have you ever noticed that twi DOES NOT like to put things in writing? Written information puts them at a disadvantage. Documenting things in writing is taboo. Even their *mark-and-avoid* policy is NOT in written form. Plus, they wouldn't want something to be posted on GSC....would they?
According to someone I trust for reliable information......twi is starting to reach out and solicit/summon ex-corps grads to come back. Apparently, there is a growing demand for Limb coordinators. Huge swaths of states do NOT have adequate or no leadership. Seems that few are willing to take on the task and challenge of running a state.
5 hours ago, skyrider said:
Have you ever noticed that twi DOES NOT like to put things in writing? Written information puts them at a disadvantage. Documenting things in writing is taboo. Even their *mark-and-avoid* policy is NOT in written form. Plus, they wouldn't want something to be posted on GSC....would they?
You know, this would be an opportune time to return to TWI, become a Limb coordinator and announce your presence with authority - - imagine this: “I’m going to make a few necessary changes around here. First off, every Monday will be opposite day. Everyone is required to say the opposite of what you actually mean and do things opposite of how they’re normally done.” (pauses for a moment – shuffles around the 3 by 5 index cards of talking points…then pulls out the AT-A-Glance QuickNotes Weekly/Monthly Planner from his briefcase…finds paperclip marking the page of today…eyebrows go up…sniffs…purses lips and says) “well what-a-you-know – today is Monday – okay cool. You can rely on me to never talk about any dirty little secrets of The Way International and I will even put that in writing.”
For the record............some of us have been exposing all the wrongdoings of twi since 1999, since Waydale. Sheeesh.
Bob Moneyhands isn't some "revival expert"........he probably plagiarized his stuff from GreaseSpot Cafe.
We've been talking about this stuff for 18 years......BEFORE that March 2017 letter was drafted. And, we know that Rosalie got copies of GSC threads dropped on her desk weekly. So, they did nothing......UNTIL TWI IS SPIRALING THE DRAIN.
Twi is run by evil Pharisees. Stay away !!!!!
It's funny how nobody wants to mention the GSC, but everybody reads it and know everybody else reads it.
-JAL advertised to us and commented to us, but refused to mention us BY NAME or to officially tell his people to post his correspondence to here. Also, when he deleted his letters to twi from his website, we reprinted them here. They reappeared on his website shortly thereafter.
-When twi announced they were kicking Mrs Wierwille out of her home and putting her in a nursing home, the announcement arrived here and the outrage began. twi INSISTED their reply be allowed to be posted here.
-Rosa-lie has had a staffer print out threads from here for her to read as hard-copies, which is rather inefficient.
-When Bob wrote about "what's wrong with twi?", the answers could have come straight from GSC posts- and all or some of them almost certainly did so.
How do they propose to get people to come back? Are they sending out invitation letters? Will such letters begin with a humble and heartfelt apology for past treatment of the addressee (and his/her family)?
No?
Tough, then. Bye.
I'm just curious-
does anyone else wonder if the twi cadre is so clueless, so out-of-touch with reality that they think their escapees are just waiting for an excuse to come running back to twi?
does anyone else wonder if the twi cadre is so clueless, so out-of-touch with reality that they think their escapees are just waiting for an excuse to come running back to twi?
I certainly don't think any of them are, but hey, I've been away from them for more than 30 years, so what do I know? OTOH, I think what our friend Bolshevik posted about "hoovering" has plenty of merit. IF any of them, especially those who escaped with the R and R gang have any regrets about leaving, they could be SUCKED right back into the cult.
If some of them have not established much of an alternative social network, or found a way to make a living, they could be vulnerable.
A growing demand for limb coordinators. Riiiiiiiiiiggggggghhhhhhhhhhtttttt.
There's a growing demand for a new wine skin. From scriptures. This would include new leadership that didn't stand by for decades abusing people at what they want us to believe was Rosalies request? So sure. Step down from the bod lofty positions, implement an elected leadership body without lifetime appointed positions like the r and r crowd suggested.
Then we might believe you.
But step right back in to the abusive cycles run in the same system with the same people doing the same things, all to perpetuate teaching a stolen class and sending all the money in to New Hicksville Ohio the spiritual center of the universe lol
I bet I could close my eyes and throw a dart at a map of my city, pick a church on the corner closest to where it lands, go connect with the Christians there, and have a less abusive time.
Seems that few are willing to take on the task and challenge of running a state.
Are there even TWI limbs that have a significant number of active people these days? I seriously doubt it. I left not too long after you did (2001) and there were already a number of "limbs" that were more than one state. My state of Nebraska was one of them. First we were "overseen" by the Limb Coordinator of South Dakota, then we we got handed off to the Kansas City Branch Coordinator. Before that, our "branch" was two anemic twigs. I can't imagine it got better in the last 20 years. I have no doubt that the paperwork and micro-managing from HQ will be just as onerous if running a busy Limb with dozens of twigs and heathy branches or a ghost limb with some scattered "believers".
does anyone else wonder if the twi cadre is so clueless, so out-of-touch with reality that they think their escapees are just waiting for an excuse to come running back to twi?
There's a certain amount of "believing their own b-s" that causes some TWI top dogs to be out of touch. Wierwille, in my opinion, knew he was running a long con; Martindale, on the other hand, believed it. He really believed that he was the MOGFOT. Even people who didn't buy the scam that either of them was ordained by God to "teach the Word", there was still the belief that TWI was where "The Word" was being taught, the doctrine is fine, if only we can "get back to The Word" in our practices it will all come together. I would guess that any Way Corp grads who left did it for a good reason and have landed on their feet somewhere, in a church, or an offshoot, or happily living a secular life with little thought given to religion. But a segment of TWI still buys into the "grease spot by midnight" line.
This is a quote from the hoovering article Bolsh listed. Key points are they are like a Hoover vacuum trying to suck you up and they consider you dirt.
"
A narcissist craves attention, validation, appreciation, and/or ego-boosting. It’s an addiction and they might need a lot of sources to fulfill their needs. A narcissist could thus beshort of narcissistic supplyand decide to try to lure you back in. They might sense you’re still vulnerable to them and try to manipulate you into re-engaging.
When in contact or in a relationship with you they will drain your energy by trying to get their unending needs fulfilled. They simply like to have control over you. They don’t care about your feelings or needs but are merely focused on fulfilling their own needs."
So with the Way reaching out to ex Corps grads again are they reaching out on a basis of the grads needs? Or is this another example of focusing on fulfilling their own needs once again of lack of leadership? Why do they have lack of leadership? Not because the wrong people were in charge. Because it is a cult system. This is why 95% of the leadership body they trained left them. Because the entire thing is a narcissistic sham, and they NEVER intend to care about the leaf in the twig so to speak. They don't know how to think or speak in terms of other people's interests. Their conscience is seared.
I mean will the Pope tear down St Peters Basilica? Will the elders stop making them wear fish hats? About then is when we can expect the Ways customs to change also.
"A narcissist craves attention, validation, appreciation, and/or ego-boosting. It’s an addiction and they might need a lot of sources to fulfill their needs. A narcissist could thus beshort of narcissistic supplyand decide to try to lure you back in. They might sense you’re still vulnerable to them and try to manipulate you into re-engaging."
~~~~~~~~
Speaking of narcissists....... I find it interesting that some long-past Region/State coordinators and Corps coordinators ( Sann, Sailer and Strezpek) have been giving teachings to the R & R group.
The whole sham is more about these guys getting validation and attention for standing in front of people and "teaching." If you want to get a glimpse of what you are missing (LOL LOL)......even in splinter groups........R & R Group.
The whole thing is so bland. If this is "revival"............NO THANKS.
22Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know...
35God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ...
37Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 38Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. 40And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. 41Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Now that's "revival." Bold preaching of the message, of Jesus Christ, so convincingly that 3000 people were converted there and then.
Do you know what? That sort of thing still happens. In Africa, specifically I know in Burundi (Simon, a missionary from our church goes there a lot and tells great stories of the people there). Simon is passionate, enthusiastic, boundless in energy and vision, an evangelist of some high order. Not only does he do this in Africa - he travels the cities in the UK preaching the gospel in the streets.
Okay, we aren't all evangelists. But we do our best.
Does R&R even know what a real evangelist is?? Have they any passion for the lord Jesus Christ? Has any of them encountered him, away from the printed page?
Does TWI know what a real evangelist is?? Have they any passion for the lord Jesus Christ? Has any of them encountered him, away from the printed page? >> Now you know I'm joking, right? !! << I did know one real "TWI" evangelist, likely some of you here know him too - and they crushed him into nothing, destroyed his family - wife was a petite blonde, "just the type" for certain people.
On 10/17/2021 at 9:50 PM, skyrider said:
twi is starting to reach out and solicit/summon ex-corps grads to come back
How about TWI "reaching out" to repair some of its horrendous damage to various individuals and families? Starting with paying, no strings attached, for genuine, qualified counsellors and therapists to help heal some of the wounds?
Twi won't even admit to wrongdoing......let alone, apologize for anything? Even when there was blatant negligence and mistakes like the LEAD accident.....twi did everything to whitewash the incident. That's one of their cornerstones.....NO ACCOUNTABILITY.
And, the splinter groups elevate wierwille at every turn. It's all "business as usual"......except different label (R&R, and others) on the packaging.
Twi won't even admit to wrongdoing......let alone, apologize for anything? Even when there was blatant negligence and mistakes like the LEAD accident.....twi did everything to whitewash the incident. That's one of their cornerstones.....NO ACCOUNTABILITY.
And,the splinter groups elevate wierwille at every turn. It's all "business as usual"......except different label (R&R, and others) on the packaging.
What does that tell you?
“business as usual” yeah - it’s like the splinter groups are holding a perpetual wake for their beloved idol – and for some reason a bizarre revision of the last line in the “One Man Awake” poem came to mind: Folks at the wake with dollar signs in their eyes multiplies
“business as usual” yeah - it’s like the splinter groups are holding a perpetual wake for their beloved idol – and for some reason a bizarre revision of the last line in the “One Man Awake” poem came to mind: Folks at the wake with dollar signs in their eyes multiplies
Most of these guys are 65-74 years old........moneyhands, fort, slavit, sann, sailer, strezpek, etc....... and how many of them were corps coordinators? I think horney and magnelli are a bit younger, but still......were embedded in that "corps coordinator groupthink ilk." Of course, they have NO MARKETABLE SKILLS except *snake-oil salesmen"..... so there's that.
These guys moved their snake-oil booth across the street and put a different label on their shingle..... so THEY could run the business, and pocket the money, as they desired. How gullible do people have to be to not see this??????
Most of these guys are 65-74 years old........moneyhands, fort, slavit, sann, sailer, strezpek, etc....... and how many of them were corps coordinators? I think horney and magnelli are a bit younger, but still......were embedded in that "corps coordinator groupthink ilk." Of course, they have NO MARKETABLE SKILLS except *snake-oil salesmen"..... so there's that.
These guys moved their snake-oil booth across the street and put a different label on their shingle..... so THEY could run the business, and pocket the money, as they desired. How gullible do people have to be to not see this??????
Snake oil from a brood of vipers - well, it is a family business…the sales slogan could be “you never know when you’ll run into a squeaky snake”.
Most of these guys are 65-74 years old........moneyhands, fort, slavit, sann, sailer, strezpek, etc....... and how many of them were corps coordinators? I think horney and magnelli are a bit younger, but still......were embedded in that "corps coordinator groupthink ilk." Of course, they have NO MARKETABLE SKILLS except *snake-oil salesmen"..... so there's that.
These guys moved their snake-oil booth across the street and put a different label on their shingle..... so THEY could run the business, and pocket the money, as they desired. How gullible do people have to be to not see this??????
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skyrider
According to someone I trust for reliable information......twi is starting to reach out and solicit/summon ex-corps grads to come back. Apparently, there is a growing demand for Limb coordinators. H
Bolshevik
In what's called the narcissist cycle of abuse, this is an example of hoovering.
penworks
I just love nostalgia ... it's so cozy and comforting and ... oops ... other stuff that's not so great. In case you missed the article I wrote on this topic (posted here on GSC back in 2009), here you
Twinky
You are bloody joking, aren't you?!
How do they propose to get people to come back? Are they sending out invitation letters? Will such letters begin with a humble and heartfelt apology for past treatment of the addressee (and his/her family)?
No?
Tough, then. Bye.
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Bolshevik
In what's called the narcissist cycle of abuse, this is an example of hoovering.
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skyrider
For the record............some of us have been exposing all the wrongdoings of twi since 1999, since Waydale. Sheeesh.
Bob Moneyhands isn't some "revival expert"........he probably plagiarized his stuff from GreaseSpot Cafe.
We've been talking about this stuff for 18 years......BEFORE that March 2017 letter was drafted. And, we know that Rosalie got copies of GSC threads dropped on her desk weekly. So, they did nothing......UNTIL TWI IS SPIRALING THE DRAIN.
Twi is run by evil Pharisees. Stay away !!!!!
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skyrider
Twinky.......I seriously doubt that they will send out invitation letters.
Have you ever noticed that twi DOES NOT like to put things in writing? Written information puts them at a disadvantage. Documenting things in writing is taboo. Even their *mark-and-avoid* policy is NOT in written form. Plus, they wouldn't want something to be posted on GSC....would they?
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Rocky
A helpful resource directly on point. Thanks Bolshie
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Rocky
Yeah, they can't plausibly deny it if they put it in writing.
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T-Bone
You know, this would be an opportune time to return to TWI, become a Limb coordinator and announce your presence with authority - - imagine this: “I’m going to make a few necessary changes around here. First off, every Monday will be opposite day. Everyone is required to say the opposite of what you actually mean and do things opposite of how they’re normally done.” (pauses for a moment – shuffles around the 3 by 5 index cards of talking points…then pulls out the AT-A-Glance QuickNotes Weekly/Monthly Planner from his briefcase…finds paperclip marking the page of today…eyebrows go up…sniffs…purses lips and says) “well what-a-you-know – today is Monday – okay cool. You can rely on me to never talk about any dirty little secrets of The Way International and I will even put that in writing.”
* * * *
DVD bonus feature: opposite day on SpongeBob
Edited by T-Boneedited by ex-way corps and future Limb coordinator
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WordWolf
It's funny how nobody wants to mention the GSC, but everybody reads it and know everybody else reads it.
-JAL advertised to us and commented to us, but refused to mention us BY NAME or to officially tell his people to post his correspondence to here. Also, when he deleted his letters to twi from his website, we reprinted them here. They reappeared on his website shortly thereafter.
-When twi announced they were kicking Mrs Wierwille out of her home and putting her in a nursing home, the announcement arrived here and the outrage began. twi INSISTED their reply be allowed to be posted here.
-Rosa-lie has had a staffer print out threads from here for her to read as hard-copies, which is rather inefficient.
-When Bob wrote about "what's wrong with twi?", the answers could have come straight from GSC posts- and all or some of them almost certainly did so.
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WordWolf
I'm just curious-
does anyone else wonder if the twi cadre is so clueless, so out-of-touch with reality that they think their escapees are just waiting for an excuse to come running back to twi?
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Rocky
I certainly don't think any of them are, but hey, I've been away from them for more than 30 years, so what do I know? OTOH, I think what our friend Bolshevik posted about "hoovering" has plenty of merit. IF any of them, especially those who escaped with the R and R gang have any regrets about leaving, they could be SUCKED right back into the cult.
If some of them have not established much of an alternative social network, or found a way to make a living, they could be vulnerable.
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chockfull
A growing demand for limb coordinators. Riiiiiiiiiiggggggghhhhhhhhhhtttttt.
There's a growing demand for a new wine skin. From scriptures. This would include new leadership that didn't stand by for decades abusing people at what they want us to believe was Rosalies request? So sure. Step down from the bod lofty positions, implement an elected leadership body without lifetime appointed positions like the r and r crowd suggested.
Then we might believe you.
But step right back in to the abusive cycles run in the same system with the same people doing the same things, all to perpetuate teaching a stolen class and sending all the money in to New Hicksville Ohio the spiritual center of the universe lol
Riiiiiiiiiiiiggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhttttttttttttt.
I bet I could close my eyes and throw a dart at a map of my city, pick a church on the corner closest to where it lands, go connect with the Christians there, and have a less abusive time.
I think Bolsh has it 100%
Hoover ing. With a large sucking sound.
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Oakspear
Are there even TWI limbs that have a significant number of active people these days? I seriously doubt it. I left not too long after you did (2001) and there were already a number of "limbs" that were more than one state. My state of Nebraska was one of them. First we were "overseen" by the Limb Coordinator of South Dakota, then we we got handed off to the Kansas City Branch Coordinator. Before that, our "branch" was two anemic twigs. I can't imagine it got better in the last 20 years. I have no doubt that the paperwork and micro-managing from HQ will be just as onerous if running a busy Limb with dozens of twigs and heathy branches or a ghost limb with some scattered "believers".
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T-Bone
excellent post, Bolshevik !
Thanks for reposting the link Rocky.
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Oakspear
There's a certain amount of "believing their own b-s" that causes some TWI top dogs to be out of touch. Wierwille, in my opinion, knew he was running a long con; Martindale, on the other hand, believed it. He really believed that he was the MOGFOT. Even people who didn't buy the scam that either of them was ordained by God to "teach the Word", there was still the belief that TWI was where "The Word" was being taught, the doctrine is fine, if only we can "get back to The Word" in our practices it will all come together. I would guess that any Way Corp grads who left did it for a good reason and have landed on their feet somewhere, in a church, or an offshoot, or happily living a secular life with little thought given to religion. But a segment of TWI still buys into the "grease spot by midnight" line.
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chockfull
This is a quote from the hoovering article Bolsh listed. Key points are they are like a Hoover vacuum trying to suck you up and they consider you dirt.
"
A narcissist craves attention, validation, appreciation, and/or ego-boosting. It’s an addiction and they might need a lot of sources to fulfill their needs. A narcissist could thus be short of narcissistic supply and decide to try to lure you back in. They might sense you’re still vulnerable to them and try to manipulate you into re-engaging.
When in contact or in a relationship with you they will drain your energy by trying to get their unending needs fulfilled. They simply like to have control over you. They don’t care about your feelings or needs but are merely focused on fulfilling their own needs."
So with the Way reaching out to ex Corps grads again are they reaching out on a basis of the grads needs? Or is this another example of focusing on fulfilling their own needs once again of lack of leadership? Why do they have lack of leadership? Not because the wrong people were in charge. Because it is a cult system. This is why 95% of the leadership body they trained left them. Because the entire thing is a narcissistic sham, and they NEVER intend to care about the leaf in the twig so to speak. They don't know how to think or speak in terms of other people's interests. Their conscience is seared.
I mean will the Pope tear down St Peters Basilica? Will the elders stop making them wear fish hats? About then is when we can expect the Ways customs to change also.
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skyrider
"A narcissist craves attention, validation, appreciation, and/or ego-boosting. It’s an addiction and they might need a lot of sources to fulfill their needs. A narcissist could thus be short of narcissistic supply and decide to try to lure you back in. They might sense you’re still vulnerable to them and try to manipulate you into re-engaging."
~~~~~~~~
Speaking of narcissists....... I find it interesting that some long-past Region/State coordinators and Corps coordinators ( Sann, Sailer and Strezpek) have been giving teachings to the R & R group.
The whole sham is more about these guys getting validation and attention for standing in front of people and "teaching." If you want to get a glimpse of what you are missing (LOL LOL)......even in splinter groups........R & R Group.
The whole thing is so bland. If this is "revival"............NO THANKS.
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Twinky
22Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know...
35God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ...
37Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 38Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. 40And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. 41Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Now that's "revival." Bold preaching of the message, of Jesus Christ, so convincingly that 3000 people were converted there and then.
Do you know what? That sort of thing still happens. In Africa, specifically I know in Burundi (Simon, a missionary from our church goes there a lot and tells great stories of the people there). Simon is passionate, enthusiastic, boundless in energy and vision, an evangelist of some high order. Not only does he do this in Africa - he travels the cities in the UK preaching the gospel in the streets.
Okay, we aren't all evangelists. But we do our best.
Does R&R even know what a real evangelist is?? Have they any passion for the lord Jesus Christ? Has any of them encountered him, away from the printed page?
Does TWI know what a real evangelist is?? Have they any passion for the lord Jesus Christ? Has any of them encountered him, away from the printed page? >> Now you know I'm joking, right?
!! << I did know one real "TWI" evangelist, likely some of you here know him too - and they crushed him into nothing, destroyed his family - wife was a petite blonde, "just the type" for certain people.
How about TWI "reaching out" to repair some of its horrendous damage to various individuals and families? Starting with paying, no strings attached, for genuine, qualified counsellors and therapists to help heal some of the wounds?
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skyrider
Twi won't even admit to wrongdoing......let alone, apologize for anything? Even when there was blatant negligence and mistakes like the LEAD accident.....twi did everything to whitewash the incident. That's one of their cornerstones.....NO ACCOUNTABILITY.
And, the splinter groups elevate wierwille at every turn. It's all "business as usual"......except different label (R&R, and others) on the packaging.
What does that tell you?
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T-Bone
“business as usual” yeah - it’s like the splinter groups are holding a perpetual wake for their beloved idol – and for some reason a bizarre revision of the last line in the “One Man Awake” poem came to mind:
Folks at the wake with dollar signs in their eyes multiplies
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skyrider
Most of these guys are 65-74 years old........moneyhands, fort, slavit, sann, sailer, strezpek, etc....... and how many of them were corps coordinators? I think horney and magnelli are a bit younger, but still......were embedded in that "corps coordinator groupthink ilk." Of course, they have NO MARKETABLE SKILLS except *snake-oil salesmen"..... so there's that.
These guys moved their snake-oil booth across the street and put a different label on their shingle..... so THEY could run the business, and pocket the money, as they desired. How gullible do people have to be to not see this??????
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T-Bone
Snake oil from a brood of vipers - well, it is a family business…the sales slogan could be “you never know when you’ll run into a squeaky snake”.
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Rocky
Slavit sells books on Amazon. And teaches, apparently Humanities. As well as running a home fellowship. And may have taught at a Rock of Ages clone in Montana over the 4th of July weekend. Btw, some others from the R and R group are also listed as teachers at the Montana Rock of Ages clone festival.
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skyrider
Yeah......and slavit associates with ex-corps coordinators and grifters......to keep his name on the "front burner?"
Not impressed. Corps Coordinators were the "indoctrinators and enforcers" of wierwillian-mythology.
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Rocky
I was neither impressed nor trying to impress anyone about him. Just posting what I easily found.
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