According to posts last week from his family members, he had been in ICU for a week, fighting Covid caused pneumonia complicated by his ongoing oncology issues.
He was unvaccinated, and several have told me he opposed wearing masks.
Not unexpected. He hung on for a long time with the cancer. Really foolish of him, knowing he was immuno-suppressed, to not get a vaccine or wear masks.
I'd liked him when I first got involved in TWI. He got weird later, though.
In many ways, the embodiment of my post-TWI determination not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. He truly believed, as many of us once did, that we were privileged with something extraordinary but imperfect, and he dedicated his life to improving it.
Along the way he embraced and promoted some indefensible stuff, and he defended it with a stubborn passion that would be admirable in the service of a more worthy cause.
When he met me, I felt broken. He did his best to heal my heart, to restore the sense of spiritual family I lost at a time of personal crisis. He refused to judge me or condemn me.
I admire his dedication.
As it gave way to stubbornness... let his legacy be a warning.
In many ways, the embodiment of my post-TWI determination not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. He truly believed, as many of us once did, that we were privileged with something extraordinary but imperfect, and he dedicated his life to improving it.
Along the way he embraced and promoted some indefensible stuff, and he defended it with a stubborn passion that would be admirable in the service of a more worthy cause.
When he met me, I felt broken. He did his best to heal my heart, to restore the sense of spiritual family I lost at a time of personal crisis. He refused to judge me or condemn me.
I admire his dedication.
As it gave way to stubbornness... let his legacy be a warning.
Thanks for your words Raf. Im a bit emotional this morning after hearing the news and (for once...lol) really couldn't string the words together in an apporpriate manner to express what you said. I really liked him on a personal level but I just couln't follow him into another ministry when asked. I wish I could have done more for him on a personal level but stubbornness is a key word here. I respected him and my heart goes out to his loved ones.
Not unexpected. He hung on for a long time with the cancer. Really foolish of him, knowing he was immuno-suppressed, to not get a vaccine or wear masks.
I'd liked him when I first got involved in TWI. He got weird later, though.
Always sad when someone you know dies.
My friend is on chemo and already being immuno-suppressed, was not a candidate for the vaccine. I heard John finally went on a new chemo drug this year, and that may not have been an option anyway. So many years of fighting and his body could not take anymore. Death is sad, no matter what.
already being immuno-suppressed, was not a candidate for the vaccine. I heard John finally went on a new chemo drug this year, and that may not have been an option anyway.
Still no reason not to wear a mask. And those around him should have been masked and ideally vaxed as well.
That was my thought too... but I figured this is a time for eulogy, I chose not to say it out loud.
Yeah, this. Just how in the heck this became a platform to push masking and vaccines is beyond me - should we blame John Lynn for being dead without a vaccine or mask? This sort of stuff makes me not even wanna post here. And I mean that with all love and respect for those who chose this thread to push those agendas - not cool.
Yeah, this. Just how in the heck this became a platform to push masking and vaccines is beyond me - should we blame John Lynn for being dead without a vaccine or mask? This sort of stuff makes me not even wanna post here. And I mean that with all love and respect for those who chose this thread to push those agendas - not cool.
Yep; this is a page to announce a man's life coming to an end. World news should not be included.
I consider John Lynn my friend from the state of Indiana. Sad to hear him breath his last natural earthly life breath. About two months ago on July 29th, I sent John and his wife my biblical teaching book titled: "Our Loving Savior Jesus Christ". As payment John sent me one of his books: "Is There Death After Life?", that I agree with. A good book and in working with two other authors, they wrote a number of biblical teaching books. Simply, John has the hope of a future eternal life with Jesus Christ our loving savior. When Jesus Christ returns as 1 Thessalonians 4 and 1 Corinthians 15 teaches.
Since we do not have direct evidence that John avoided masks or the vaccine, and we don't have evidence of why, let's avoid the topic.
BUT
If he died of lung cancer and continued smoking while preaching about how smoking has never been linked to cancer except by anti-freedom junk scientists, we would mention it and it would not be controversial. You would be offended if I tried to stop the discussion.
So the topic is not off limits. But evidence, please, or let's just not go there.
Some people are turning every possible subject into politics. Let's not.
We'll make mistakes as we try to navigate this, but let's start with something we can agree on: no hearsay. If you didn't hear him say it, or have it on "tape," leave it off GSC.
Since we do not have direct evidence that John avoided masks or the vaccine, and we don't have evidence of why, let's avoid the topic.
BUT
If he died of lung cancer and continued smoking while preaching about how smoking has never been linked to cancer except by anti-freedom junk scientists, we would mention it and it would not be controversial. You would be offended if I tried to stop the discussion.
So the topic is not off limits. But evidence, please, or let's just not go there.
Some people are turning every possible subject into politics. Let's not.
We'll make mistakes as we try to navigate this, but let's start with something we can agree on: no hearsay. If you didn't hear him say it, or have it on "tape," leave it off GSC.
Actually, there IS direct evidence, words out of his own mouth (youtube), to that effect. Perhaps at some point it will be appropriate to discuss it at GSC, but for now if you want to retain good remembrance of JAL, this a great place eulogy. There's always plenty of crap about every human by the time they hit their mid-70s, that eulogies are definitely in order at memorials and funerals.
Since we do not have direct evidence that John avoided masks or the vaccine, and we don't have evidence of why, let's avoid the topic.
BUT
If he died of lung cancer and continued smoking while preaching about how smoking has never been linked to cancer except by anti-freedom junk scientists, we would mention it and it would not be controversial. You would be offended if I tried to stop the discussion.
So the topic is not off limits. But evidence, please, or let's just not go there.
Some people are turning every possible subject into politics. Let's not.
We'll make mistakes as we try to navigate this, but let's start with something we can agree on: no hearsay. If you didn't hear him say it, or have it on "tape," leave it off GSC.
Have to agree with that. Besides/otherwise we could embark into a whole debate about whether masks etc...really work.
John Lynn was certainly dedicated and laser-focused on things that mattered to him. Whether it was biblical research, books that he authored or basketball at Emporia......John wanted everyone within earshot to enter into his world of interests. He was our Emporia Campus Corps Coordinator my last year in-residence and would turn our noon lunchtime into an hour of teaching. Other times, he had stories to make us laugh.
I agree with those who suggest keeping this as a memorial thread. Critiquing someone's life's choices publicly upon death is what twi-leadership would do.... especially when way corps died. It was grating and disturbing, not comforting and supporting. This is a time to comfort and eulogize a man who was deeply dedicated and passionate about life. May the God of all Comfort bless the Lynn family and loved ones in their sorrow.
This thread is what you guys will make it. It was deliberately left open and we very deliberately chose not to read the riot act before it started.
Keeping it uplifting and constructive is the mature thing to do. I tried to express my thoughts without getting insensitive [insofar as his faith gave way to stubbornness, let his legacy be a warning]. Others, trying to do the same, drew the line in a different place. There was no rule against that, but as a community, GSC seems to be coming together to say, as one of you put it, "not cool."
John put himself out there as a public figure. You do that, you take the hits. He knew that better than anybody. I've disagreed with him to his face, and we were still cool with each other in the short time we knew each other.
How "cool" we keep this thread is up to us.
I admired his dedication, his wit and his teaching style. I didn't admire everything he said about God or politics or public health. But I will say without hesitation that he did everything in his power to serve and promote the God he worshipped. Whether he did it wisely or perfectly or even well is not for me to judge.
I admired his dedication, his wit and his teaching style. I didn't admire everything he said about God or politics or public health. But I will say without hesitation that he did everything in his power to serve and promote the God he worshipped. Whether he did it wisely or perfectly or even well is not for me to judge.
Regarding politics I thanked John for helping me laugh when he wrote the following to me by email:
I simply explained to him through my research that California the state that I live in does not have the highest state taxes, but is above average for state taxes that people are required to pay when you live there. Also Indiana that state that John Lynn lived in does not have the lowest state taxes, but is above average for the lower state taxes that are required when people live there. I also helped John with his economic education about low import or tariff taxes in the USA as a whole nation compared to high income taxes also in the USA with the following link written by someone named Mark Sanguinetti. I wonder who he is???
for reminding me of what a memorial is about. It's a time to set aside our differences and instead talk about how we're all connected in some way.
Over the years I’ve been to many funerals of parents and loved ones related to my friends and co-workers – many times I didn’t know the deceased personally. Afterwards I would try to think of something comforting and strengthening to say to my friend – and usually it was stuff about the loved one’s intangible legacy reflected in my friend’s life.
Of the memories I have of John Lynn – several really stand out…I vaguely recall a story of John Lynn taking the PFAL class at home by himself – I think the PFAL class was mailed to his home? – not sure on that. Anyway – as the story goes, he started off listening to the last session first (the session wierwille leads the class into speaking in tongues). That always stuck with me because it shows he was the type of person who was adventurous and would go all in – even if it was something new and different. I think fundamentally, that is part of what makes someone a good leader – someone who can inspire …influence…guide others through their own lifestyle. Like Paw said “he led the charge against the way. Opened the eyes of many”. Maybe some of John Lynn’s legacy is reflected in what Grease Spot means to me. For me it continues to be an adventurous journey and as far as checking out new and different perspectives – I’m all in.
Another thing that makes a good leader is being genuine. I think his enthusiasm was genuine and I loved his down-to-earth sense of humor – there was no pretension about being a perfect believer – his personal stories were relatable to many experiences I’ve had. He was passionate about what he preached – and I know I’ve commented about him being a good salesman – but even though I was never interested in some of what he said after leaving TWI – I’d give him a five-star rating for also being an honest salesman, who believed in “the product” – used it himself and thought it would help others.
Way back in 83 / 84 he and his wife were going around doing Way Corps promos. After being at one of those promos and hearing John’s laid back and humorous sales pitch, I was pretty much sold on going into the corps. His wife Pat came to our home one day while I was at work. My wife was usually so uptight and nervous around any TWI-leadership – but Tonto told me she wasn’t around Pat. After seeing that Pat was easygoing and friendly – just like John , Tonto was pretty much sold on going into the corps too.
It’s kind of jarring to me anytime I hear of someone I knew in TWI passing away. Especially if I didn’t see things eye to eye with them. Maybe it’s incongruous with being a human being. That's why I said at first a memorial is a time to set aside our differences and instead talk about how we're connected as human beings in some cosmic synchronicity sort of way.
There’s more to life than just arguing over Bible stuff. I get into doctrine and practice debates and forget that it’s human beings on the receiving end of my words – or that I’m receiving transmissions from other fellow human beings in cyberspace. Life is about human beings – each of us on a self-determined journey. ( Note to self: Inform SETI I will be taking a sabbatical to search for life among human beings...my way of honoring John Lynn's sense of humor )
I pray for God to supply comfort and strength to his family, friends, and fans.
(after posting this I thought of his sister Judy several times. Her and her husband Ken we’re in Family 12 when we were in our 2nd year as Family 11; I remember Judy as having a quick wit and electrifying personality just like her brother)
I didn't meet John, personally. I do remember rather vividly, though, a teaching of his on grace. He was a pitcher, presumably for his college baseball team.
"There I was -- up by a run in the bottom of the ninth. By SOME STRANGE TWIST OF FATE, the bases were loaded with nobody out. I struck out the next two batters with six BLAZING fastballs. At that point, the first baseman told me that with two out, he wouldn't be holding the runner on. Of course, I knew that. After two pitches to the batter, I could see the runner at first with a big lead, so I completely forgot what the first baseman had told me. I wheeled to throw to first, and life went into slow motion. I couldn't throw to first, because the first baseman wasn't there. I couldn't hold on to the ball, because that would be a balk and bring the tying run in. So, I threw it to the RUNNER. Reflexively, he caught it, then dropped it like a hot potato and started running. The umpire called him out for interference. Game over.
Grace: being completely in the wrong but coming out smelling like a rose."
I didn't meet John, personally. I do remember rather vividly, though, a teaching of his on grace. He was a pitcher, presumably for his college baseball team.
"There I was -- up by a run in the bottom of the ninth. By SOME STRANGE TWIST OF FATE, the bases were loaded with nobody out. I struck out the next two batters with six BLAZING fastballs. At that point, the first baseman told me that with two out, he wouldn't be holding the runner on. Of course, I knew that. After two pitches to the batter, I could see the runner at first with a big lead, so I completely forgot what the first baseman had told me. I wheeled to throw to first, and life went into slow motion. I couldn't throw to first, because the first baseman wasn't there. I couldn't hold on to the ball, because that would be a balk and bring the tying run in. So, I threw it to the RUNNER. Reflexively, he caught it, then dropped it like a hot potato and started running. The umpire called him out for interference. Game over.
Grace: being completely in the wrong but coming out smelling like a rose."
Rest in peace, John.
George
George, your comment highlights that many of us have fond remembrance of JAL based on long ago interactions and/or video or other communications with or from or about him.
To me, it's unfortunate and very sad that he evolved his persona the way he did. These are his words and they reflect who he became over the years.
I share this with you NOT to debate or discuss or bicker about the content of his views, just to document who he became. The vid claims it's from a "Biblical Worldview." That's debatable but hopefully not here.
Frank Z has posted at GSC before... not using his real name (many of us don't anyway)
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Rocky
I certainly wasn't a devoted follower, but he was hard to not like.
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T-Bone
my sentiments exactly Rocky
I wish for comfort and strength to his family, friends and fans
sincerely,
T-Bone
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HAPe4me
According to posts last week from his family members, he had been in ICU for a week, fighting Covid caused pneumonia complicated by his ongoing oncology issues.
He was unvaccinated, and several have told me he opposed wearing masks.
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pawtucket
We didn't see eye to eye.
I wish his family well.
I did like his sense of humor.
And he led the charge against the way. Opened the eyes of many.
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Twinky
Not unexpected. He hung on for a long time with the cancer. Really foolish of him, knowing he was immuno-suppressed, to not get a vaccine or wear masks.
I'd liked him when I first got involved in TWI. He got weird later, though.
Always sad when someone you know dies.
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Raf
A. A complicated man with a complicated legacy.
In many ways, the embodiment of my post-TWI determination not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. He truly believed, as many of us once did, that we were privileged with something extraordinary but imperfect, and he dedicated his life to improving it.
Along the way he embraced and promoted some indefensible stuff, and he defended it with a stubborn passion that would be admirable in the service of a more worthy cause.
When he met me, I felt broken. He did his best to heal my heart, to restore the sense of spiritual family I lost at a time of personal crisis. He refused to judge me or condemn me.
I admire his dedication.
As it gave way to stubbornness... let his legacy be a warning.
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OldSkool
Thanks for your words Raf. Im a bit emotional this morning after hearing the news and (for once...lol) really couldn't string the words together in an apporpriate manner to express what you said. I really liked him on a personal level but I just couln't follow him into another ministry when asked. I wish I could have done more for him on a personal level but stubbornness is a key word here. I respected him and my heart goes out to his loved ones.
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Rejoice
My friend is on chemo and already being immuno-suppressed, was not a candidate for the vaccine. I heard John finally went on a new chemo drug this year, and that may not have been an option anyway. So many years of fighting and his body could not take anymore. Death is sad, no matter what.
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Twinky
Still no reason not to wear a mask. And those around him should have been masked and ideally vaxed as well.
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Rocky
That was my thought too... but I figured this is a time for eulogy, I chose not to say it out loud.
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OldSkool
Yeah, this. Just how in the heck this became a platform to push masking and vaccines is beyond me - should we blame John Lynn for being dead without a vaccine or mask? This sort of stuff makes me not even wanna post here. And I mean that with all love and respect for those who chose this thread to push those agendas - not cool.
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Rejoice
Yep; this is a page to announce a man's life coming to an end. World news should not be included.
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Mark Sanguinetti
I consider John Lynn my friend from the state of Indiana. Sad to hear him breath his last natural earthly life breath. About two months ago on July 29th, I sent John and his wife my biblical teaching book titled: "Our Loving Savior Jesus Christ". As payment John sent me one of his books: "Is There Death After Life?", that I agree with. A good book and in working with two other authors, they wrote a number of biblical teaching books. Simply, John has the hope of a future eternal life with Jesus Christ our loving savior. When Jesus Christ returns as 1 Thessalonians 4 and 1 Corinthians 15 teaches.
Edited by Mark SanguinettiLink to comment
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Raf
Let's do this:
Since we do not have direct evidence that John avoided masks or the vaccine, and we don't have evidence of why, let's avoid the topic.
BUT
If he died of lung cancer and continued smoking while preaching about how smoking has never been linked to cancer except by anti-freedom junk scientists, we would mention it and it would not be controversial. You would be offended if I tried to stop the discussion.
So the topic is not off limits. But evidence, please, or let's just not go there.
Some people are turning every possible subject into politics. Let's not.
We'll make mistakes as we try to navigate this, but let's start with something we can agree on: no hearsay. If you didn't hear him say it, or have it on "tape," leave it off GSC.
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waysider
I never knew John personally, but I know quite a few people here did. To them and to his family and friends I offer my condolences.
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Rocky
Actually, there IS direct evidence, words out of his own mouth (youtube), to that effect. Perhaps at some point it will be appropriate to discuss it at GSC, but for now if you want to retain good remembrance of JAL, this a great place eulogy. There's always plenty of crap about every human by the time they hit their mid-70s, that eulogies are definitely in order at memorials and funerals.
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Allan
Have to agree with that. Besides/otherwise we could embark into a whole debate about whether masks etc...really work.
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HAPe4me
Fair enough Raf. Being as this is more of a memorial thread, I apologize for opening that can of worms. Not the place for it at this time.
I do express my condolences to Christine and Elizabeth.
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skyrider
John Lynn was certainly dedicated and laser-focused on things that mattered to him. Whether it was biblical research, books that he authored or basketball at Emporia......John wanted everyone within earshot to enter into his world of interests. He was our Emporia Campus Corps Coordinator my last year in-residence and would turn our noon lunchtime into an hour of teaching. Other times, he had stories to make us laugh.
I agree with those who suggest keeping this as a memorial thread. Critiquing someone's life's choices publicly upon death is what twi-leadership would do.... especially when way corps died. It was grating and disturbing, not comforting and supporting. This is a time to comfort and eulogize a man who was deeply dedicated and passionate about life. May the God of all Comfort bless the Lynn family and loved ones in their sorrow.
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Raf
This thread is what you guys will make it. It was deliberately left open and we very deliberately chose not to read the riot act before it started.
Keeping it uplifting and constructive is the mature thing to do. I tried to express my thoughts without getting insensitive [insofar as his faith gave way to stubbornness, let his legacy be a warning]. Others, trying to do the same, drew the line in a different place. There was no rule against that, but as a community, GSC seems to be coming together to say, as one of you put it, "not cool."
John put himself out there as a public figure. You do that, you take the hits. He knew that better than anybody. I've disagreed with him to his face, and we were still cool with each other in the short time we knew each other.
How "cool" we keep this thread is up to us.
I admired his dedication, his wit and his teaching style. I didn't admire everything he said about God or politics or public health. But I will say without hesitation that he did everything in his power to serve and promote the God he worshipped. Whether he did it wisely or perfectly or even well is not for me to judge.
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Mark Sanguinetti
Regarding politics I thanked John for helping me laugh when he wrote the following to me by email:
I then simply helped his economic education, while providing the following link about state taxes as he helped others with his biblical teaching books. https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2020/04/19/taxes-2020-states-with-the-highest-and-lowest-taxes/111555224/
I simply explained to him through my research that California the state that I live in does not have the highest state taxes, but is above average for state taxes that people are required to pay when you live there. Also Indiana that state that John Lynn lived in does not have the lowest state taxes, but is above average for the lower state taxes that are required when people live there. I also helped John with his economic education about low import or tariff taxes in the USA as a whole nation compared to high income taxes also in the USA with the following link written by someone named Mark Sanguinetti. I wonder who he is???
https://tppbadforus.info/u-s-constitution
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T-Bone
thanks all,
for reminding me of what a memorial is about. It's a time to set aside our differences and instead talk about how we're all connected in some way.
Over the years I’ve been to many funerals of parents and loved ones related to my friends and co-workers – many times I didn’t know the deceased personally. Afterwards I would try to think of something comforting and strengthening to say to my friend – and usually it was stuff about the loved one’s intangible legacy reflected in my friend’s life.
Of the memories I have of John Lynn – several really stand out…I vaguely recall a story of John Lynn taking the PFAL class at home by himself – I think the PFAL class was mailed to his home? – not sure on that. Anyway – as the story goes, he started off listening to the last session first (the session wierwille leads the class into speaking in tongues). That always stuck with me because it shows he was the type of person who was adventurous and would go all in – even if it was something new and different. I think fundamentally, that is part of what makes someone a good leader – someone who can inspire …influence…guide others through their own lifestyle. Like Paw said “he led the charge against the way. Opened the eyes of many”. Maybe some of John Lynn’s legacy is reflected in what Grease Spot means to me. For me it continues to be an adventurous journey and as far as checking out new and different perspectives – I’m all in.
Another thing that makes a good leader is being genuine. I think his enthusiasm was genuine and I loved his down-to-earth sense of humor – there was no pretension about being a perfect believer – his personal stories were relatable to many experiences I’ve had. He was passionate about what he preached – and I know I’ve commented about him being a good salesman – but even though I was never interested in some of what he said after leaving TWI – I’d give him a five-star rating for also being an honest salesman, who believed in “the product” – used it himself and thought it would help others.
Way back in 83 / 84 he and his wife were going around doing Way Corps promos. After being at one of those promos and hearing John’s laid back and humorous sales pitch, I was pretty much sold on going into the corps. His wife Pat came to our home one day while I was at work. My wife was usually so uptight and nervous around any TWI-leadership – but Tonto told me she wasn’t around Pat. After seeing that Pat was easygoing and friendly – just like John , Tonto was pretty much sold on going into the corps too.
It’s kind of jarring to me anytime I hear of someone I knew in TWI passing away. Especially if I didn’t see things eye to eye with them. Maybe it’s incongruous with being a human being. That's why I said at first a memorial is a time to set aside our differences and instead talk about how we're connected as human beings in some cosmic synchronicity sort of way.
There’s more to life than just arguing over Bible stuff. I get into doctrine and practice debates and forget that it’s human beings on the receiving end of my words – or that I’m receiving transmissions from
)
otherfellow human beings in cyberspace. Life is about human beings – each of us on a self-determined journey. ( Note to self: Inform SETI I will be taking a sabbatical to search for life among human beings...my way of honoring John Lynn's sense of humorI pray for God to supply comfort and strength to his family, friends, and fans.
Edited by T-Bone(after posting this I thought of his sister Judy several times. Her and her husband Ken we’re in Family 12 when we were in our 2nd year as Family 11; I remember Judy as having a quick wit and electrifying personality just like her brother)
updated
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GeorgeStGeorge
I didn't meet John, personally. I do remember rather vividly, though, a teaching of his on grace. He was a pitcher, presumably for his college baseball team.
"There I was -- up by a run in the bottom of the ninth. By SOME STRANGE TWIST OF FATE, the bases were loaded with nobody out. I struck out the next two batters with six BLAZING fastballs. At that point, the first baseman told me that with two out, he wouldn't be holding the runner on. Of course, I knew that. After two pitches to the batter, I could see the runner at first with a big lead, so I completely forgot what the first baseman had told me. I wheeled to throw to first, and life went into slow motion. I couldn't throw to first, because the first baseman wasn't there. I couldn't hold on to the ball, because that would be a balk and bring the tying run in. So, I threw it to the RUNNER. Reflexively, he caught it, then dropped it like a hot potato and started running. The umpire called him out for interference. Game over.
Grace: being completely in the wrong but coming out smelling like a rose."
Rest in peace, John.
George
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Rocky
George, your comment highlights that many of us have fond remembrance of JAL based on long ago interactions and/or video or other communications with or from or about him.
To me, it's unfortunate and very sad that he evolved his persona the way he did. These are his words and they reflect who he became over the years.
I share this with you NOT to debate or discuss or bicker about the content of his views, just to document who he became. The vid claims it's from a "Biblical Worldview." That's debatable but hopefully not here.
Frank Z has posted at GSC before... not using his real name (many of us don't anyway)
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