Wayne Clapp also did a fantastic breakdown on this topic and zeroed in on the greek words for 'eternal' and 'everlasting'. In a nutshell, John 3:16...two options for mankind 1/ everlasting life or 2/ perish (be no more)...thanks Mark !
Here is an article that does not promote ancient Greek or Roman mythology and their pagan gods. Instead this article promotes Jesus Christ as the savior of mankind.
Just out of curiosity, having not read every entry "yet"...do any of you ever watch any youtube videos which give different people's experiences of having visited hell perhaps while going thru surgery( & having died or had complications) or the like?? Just curious..especially the ones who go to hell & then cry out for rescue from the place & end up coming back and being a good witness of the torment they esperienced??
Just out of curiosity, having not read every entry "yet"...do any of you ever watch any youtube videos which give different people's experiences of having visited hell perhaps while going thru surgery( & having died or had complications) or the like?? Just curious..especially the ones who go to hell & then cry out for rescue from the place & end up coming back and being a good witness of the torment they esperienced??
I'm for people reviewing their lives and making improvements. I'm highly skeptical of accounts of Near Death Experiences being an accurate portrayal of what is to come. I don't think they reflect a journey to that undiscovered country from which no traveler returns. There's other possibilities, and I'd expect those to reflect the situation more honestly. If the incident encourages the one living through it to mend their ways, great. I wouldn't discourage that no matter WHAT motivated the change.
yes "W-W"..I too was skeptical until themore of these different people I watched (as I watched perhaps a dozen)..the more I could tell that their lives had drastically changed based on this new information they had mentally experienced..as I couldn't see much of any $$$ motive for them pouring out their hearts in these different videos..in fact the way the experience impacted many of them was very "heart warming" & in not knowing any of them..I felt their sharings were genuine..Of course I could be wrong, as only God knows the true motives of the heart. But thats how they appreared to me..based on my curiosity..many coincided with each other in many areas..
You misunderstand me. I believe that THEY believe that's what happened- and mended their ways accordingly, with the end result that they improved and live more godly lives. I believe they're posting what they believe happened. I doubt they were factually correct.
Just out of curiosity, having not read every entry "yet"...do any of you ever watch any youtube videos which give different people's experiences of having visited hell perhaps while going thru surgery( & having died or had complications) or the like?? Just curious..especially the ones who go to hell & then cry out for rescue from the place & end up coming back and being a good witness of the torment they esperienced??
Sounds like they had a bad dream. However, my dreams when I sleep at night are better. Yes, people sometimes experience torment in life through a bad injury or an illness. Sorry, but I am not a fan of mystic pagan gods. Instead I call them spiritual p i s s ants. Yes, sometimes people get thoughts from spiritual p i s s ants. Figurative language for demonic spirits. I am sorry ants for comparing you to demonic spirits.
Mark..a good comparison..as some ants like fire ants here in Florida are not only very painful but destructive I think..like I said I've not watched many of the NDE's but they have several things in common......a) floating above their body looking down at themselves while being "worked on" by Dr's..b)being drawn by a bright white light c)going at high speed thru a tunnel d) meeting Jesus/relatives/friends and feeling unbelievable love e)extreemly bright colors in heaven f) gorgeous music g)being told "it isn't your time" and given the choice to return to earth h) being given an extensive life review in an instance ..with exceptional learning of how they had come across to others (how the other had been hert by what had been said by that person)i) telepathic communication with relatives & Jesus...I'm sure there are other common things but these are ones I realized were mentioned often.. & my mind goes towards the verse that says "even if one came back from the dead, they still won't believe"..interesting how there are many many NDE's available to anyone..if not just for entertainment value..LOL
I did not know about fire ants. Interesting, but obviously negative insects. Perhaps I should change my figurative language of demonic spirits to spiritual fire p i s s ants. Perhaps instead of p i s s i n g urine. They p i s s symbolic poisonous fire. However, I have read from the bible that when they are put in prison in the future, they will be darkened and blinded so that they can not see to deceive others. When darkened and blinded the only beings that they will be able to torture and p i s s on are each other.
Below is a link to information on the sometimes restriction on the fallen angles or demonic spirits as read.at the top of page 6. This restriction of being darkened and blinded will be part of their future judgement.
Perhaps another interesting 'aside' to this is latest medical discovery that the brain does not necessarily die as soon as one's heart stops beating ! Medical scientists have 'discovered' that the human brain has a type of 'back up energy system' that keeps it functioning for as long as 4-6 hours after typical declaration of death. This could explain people seeing and hearing things after they had supposedly 'died'. Don't know if this is a particularly good thing ?!
Wayne Clapp also did a fantastic breakdown on this topic and zeroed in on the greek words for 'eternal' and 'everlasting'. In a nutshell, John 3:16...two options for mankind 1/ everlasting life or 2/ perish (be no more)...thanks Mark !
As the bible relates to the words eternal and everlasting. This Greek word is often translated as age or in the New Testament Greek using English letters, aion. Here is an article on this subject written by someone named Mark Sanguinetti. I wonder who that is? Thank you Allan.
yeh Mark..you really don't want to mes with fire ants..as they cling & bite..(food source) lol..evil little devils that you eradicate one smack at a time..lol
Rob Bell approached exactly this question in his controversial "Love Wins" book, which effectively excommunicated him from the American "Evangelical" community. I must say I find the scholarship sound. When I read the Bible, it is hard to square the love, grace, and universal message of Christ's words (the "red letters") with the eternal punishment of a theology of Hell. ESPECIALLY when that theology has most often been used as "fire-and-brimstone" preaching to scare people into authoritarian subservience by many a false prophet. It certainly isn't a message of salvation.
If Jesus' love is truly radical and transformative, there can be no place for Hell. I like how some Catholic theologians define Hell as "the absence of God," in other words, every human being has a choice to live with knowledge of God and God's love, or without it. And choosing to live without God or in denial of God leads one's eternal being to continue in that stance. This of course opens the door to purgatory (an even more spurious theological prospect, when looking at the Bible).
But what is faith without mystery?
Dead, to me at least.
I am instantly skeptical of any preacher or "representative" of God that claims to know anything for certain. That itself is putting oneself in God's place, and if there's one thing I learned from my experiences of spiritual abuse and my own attempts at control of others, that is fruitless and against scripture. "The first shall be the last," after all.
Good common sense humblebee. Regarding purgatory, at least in spelling it relates to the biblical Greek word for fire, which is "puros". Regarding, "know anything for certain". The Apostle Paul, in 1 Corinthians chapter 13, teaches, "that we know only in part". There is no reason to be arrogant and think we know everything now. It is only when we see Jesus Christ face to face that we will see and know spiritual things fully or completely. However, we can all learn and improve in our knowledge. 1 Corinthians chapter 13.
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Allan
Wayne Clapp also did a fantastic breakdown on this topic and zeroed in on the greek words for 'eternal' and 'everlasting'. In a nutshell, John 3:16...two options for mankind 1/ everlasting life or 2/ perish (be no more)...thanks Mark !
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jim jack
Just out of curiosity, having not read every entry "yet"...do any of you ever watch any youtube videos which give different people's experiences of having visited hell perhaps while going thru surgery( & having died or had complications) or the like?? Just curious..especially the ones who go to hell & then cry out for rescue from the place & end up coming back and being a good witness of the torment they esperienced??
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WordWolf
I'm for people reviewing their lives and making improvements. I'm highly skeptical of accounts of Near Death Experiences being an accurate portrayal of what is to come. I don't think they reflect a journey to that undiscovered country from which no traveler returns. There's other possibilities, and I'd expect those to reflect the situation more honestly. If the incident encourages the one living through it to mend their ways, great. I wouldn't discourage that no matter WHAT motivated the change.
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jim jack
yes "W-W"..I too was skeptical until themore of these different people I watched (as I watched perhaps a dozen)..the more I could tell that their lives had drastically changed based on this new information they had mentally experienced..as I couldn't see much of any $$$ motive for them pouring out their hearts in these different videos..in fact the way the experience impacted many of them was very "heart warming" & in not knowing any of them..I felt their sharings were genuine..Of course I could be wrong, as only God knows the true motives of the heart. But thats how they appreared to me..based on my curiosity..many coincided with each other in many areas..
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WordWolf
You misunderstand me. I believe that THEY believe that's what happened- and mended their ways accordingly, with the end result that they improved and live more godly lives. I believe they're posting what they believe happened. I doubt they were factually correct.
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Mark Sanguinetti
Sounds like they had a bad dream. However, my dreams when I sleep at night are better. Yes, people sometimes experience torment in life through a bad injury or an illness. Sorry, but I am not a fan of mystic pagan gods. Instead I call them spiritual p i s s ants. Yes, sometimes people get thoughts from spiritual p i s s ants. Figurative language for demonic spirits. I am sorry ants for comparing you to demonic spirits.
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jim jack
Mark..a good comparison..as some ants like fire ants here in Florida are not only very painful but destructive I think..like I said I've not watched many of the NDE's but they have several things in common......a) floating above their body looking down at themselves while being "worked on" by Dr's..b)being drawn by a bright white light c)going at high speed thru a tunnel d) meeting Jesus/relatives/friends and feeling unbelievable love e)extreemly bright colors in heaven f) gorgeous music g)being told "it isn't your time" and given the choice to return to earth h) being given an extensive life review in an instance ..with exceptional learning of how they had come across to others (how the other had been hert by what had been said by that person)i) telepathic communication with relatives & Jesus...I'm sure there are other common things but these are ones I realized were mentioned often.. & my mind goes towards the verse that says "even if one came back from the dead, they still won't believe"..interesting how there are many many NDE's available to anyone..if not just for entertainment value..LOL
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Mark Sanguinetti
I did not know about fire ants. Interesting, but obviously negative insects. Perhaps I should change my figurative language of demonic spirits to spiritual fire p i s s ants. Perhaps instead of p i s s i n g urine. They p i s s symbolic poisonous fire. However, I have read from the bible that when they are put in prison in the future, they will be darkened and blinded so that they can not see to deceive others. When darkened and blinded the only beings that they will be able to torture and p i s s on are each other.
Below is a link to information on the sometimes restriction on the fallen angles or demonic spirits as read.at the top of page 6. This restriction of being darkened and blinded will be part of their future judgement.
http://christian-universalism.info/myth-of-hell-pg6.html
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Allan
Perhaps another interesting 'aside' to this is latest medical discovery that the brain does not necessarily die as soon as one's heart stops beating ! Medical scientists have 'discovered' that the human brain has a type of 'back up energy system' that keeps it functioning for as long as 4-6 hours after typical declaration of death. This could explain people seeing and hearing things after they had supposedly 'died'. Don't know if this is a particularly good thing ?!
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Mark Sanguinetti
As the bible relates to the words eternal and everlasting. This Greek word is often translated as age or in the New Testament Greek using English letters, aion. Here is an article on this subject written by someone named Mark Sanguinetti. I wonder who that is? Thank you Allan.
http://christian-universalism.info/agegreekwords-pg1.html
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jim jack
yeh Mark..you really don't want to mes with fire ants..as they cling & bite..(food source) lol..evil little devils that you eradicate one smack at a time..lol
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humblebee
Rob Bell approached exactly this question in his controversial "Love Wins" book, which effectively excommunicated him from the American "Evangelical" community. I must say I find the scholarship sound. When I read the Bible, it is hard to square the love, grace, and universal message of Christ's words (the "red letters") with the eternal punishment of a theology of Hell. ESPECIALLY when that theology has most often been used as "fire-and-brimstone" preaching to scare people into authoritarian subservience by many a false prophet. It certainly isn't a message of salvation.
If Jesus' love is truly radical and transformative, there can be no place for Hell. I like how some Catholic theologians define Hell as "the absence of God," in other words, every human being has a choice to live with knowledge of God and God's love, or without it. And choosing to live without God or in denial of God leads one's eternal being to continue in that stance. This of course opens the door to purgatory (an even more spurious theological prospect, when looking at the Bible).
But what is faith without mystery?
Dead, to me at least.
I am instantly skeptical of any preacher or "representative" of God that claims to know anything for certain. That itself is putting oneself in God's place, and if there's one thing I learned from my experiences of spiritual abuse and my own attempts at control of others, that is fruitless and against scripture. "The first shall be the last," after all.
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Mark Sanguinetti
Good common sense humblebee. Regarding purgatory, at least in spelling it relates to the biblical Greek word for fire, which is "puros". Regarding, "know anything for certain". The Apostle Paul, in 1 Corinthians chapter 13, teaches, "that we know only in part". There is no reason to be arrogant and think we know everything now. It is only when we see Jesus Christ face to face that we will see and know spiritual things fully or completely. However, we can all learn and improve in our knowledge. 1 Corinthians chapter 13.
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