All I ever wanted was to get to know God and become a better man. Little did I know about the depth and depravity of vpw and his henchmen.
Great post skyrider.
Thanks JayDee........yeah, me too.
There is something really insidious about a cult leader who pontificated from afar........seducing others to his evil ways and raking in the money.
No transparency of manner of life, the finances, or documented history. Even his India trip and those damn snow stories were all fabrications of a demented, deceptive agenda.....which opens skepticism of all things wierwille AND his glassy-eyed brownshirts.
After all this, anyone who follows the newest splinter group, R&R...........has institutionalized imprinted in their brain cells.
I really like the clarity we are starting to develop when looking back with our 20/20 hindsight. The clarity of that section of scripture in 2 Peter 2 as it pertains to our experience in the Way is right on, sky. Sometimes I wish that clarity was not developed by personally experiencing the loss and ruinous destructive ways that we have. Everything has a cost. Jesus taught "beware of the leaven of the Pharisees". I never knew that would mean chasing down active yeast bubbles in my mind years later, to include patching up all that caused the loss.
In its least common denominator, the Way was and is a psychological manipulation group.
What they call being a "cop-out" is nothing more than people's normal defense mechanisms kicking in causing them to react against the manipulation. Now they have the conundrum to deal with that all the "cop-outs" are discussing scripture while their own spiritual leadership lies inept and inactive proclaiming that they no longer need to search out truth in scripture because Wierwille already had the truth revealed to him starting with his fabricated snow on the gas pump story. And they are making decisions not based upon scripture but hiding out in gray areas of scripture making decisions based upon legal counsel.
This is why churches don't have "cop-outs". They have categories they call "unchurched", and others that may have found something else in the body of Christ more suitable for them and their family.
And the R&R group, CFM, even the old hucksters like JAL, all of them are building a profession upon a house of cards. Trying to put new wine in old wineskins as so many on here have adeptly pointed out.
There is something really insidious about a cult leader who pontificated from afar........seducing others to his evil ways and raking in the money.
No transparency of manner of life, the finances, or documented history. Even his India trip and those damn snow stories were all fabrications of a demented, deceptive agenda.....which opens skepticism of all things wierwille AND his glassy-eyed brownshirts.
After all this, anyone who follows the newest splinter group, R&R...........has institutionalized imprinted in their brain cells.
I don’t believe there was ever a moment of real Christian service in his life or in that of the BOTS. The R&R group have the same “DNA” as their “father in the word”. Countless lives destroyed by their so called “ministries”.
I really like the clarity we are starting to develop when looking back with our 20/20 hindsight. The clarity of that section of scripture in 2 Peter 2 as it pertains to our experience in the Way is right on, sky. Sometimes I wish that clarity was not developed by personally experiencing the loss and ruinous destructive ways that we have. Everything has a cost. Jesus taught "beware of the leaven of the Pharisees". I never knew that would mean chasing down active yeast bubbles in my mind years later, to include patching up all that caused the loss.
In its least common denominator, the Way was and is a psychological manipulation group.
What they call being a "cop-out" is nothing more than people's normal defense mechanisms kicking in causing them to react against the manipulation. Now they have the conundrum to deal with that all the "cop-outs" are discussing scripture while their own spiritual leadership lies inept and inactive proclaiming that they no longer need to search out truth in scripture because Wierwille already had the truth revealed to him starting with his fabricated snow on the gas pump story. And they are making decisions not based upon scripture but hiding out in gray areas of scripture making decisions based upon legal counsel.
This is why churches don't have "cop-outs". They have categories they call "unchurched", and others that may have found something else in the body of Christ more suitable for them and their family.
And the R&R group, CFM, even the old hucksters like JAL, all of them are building a profession upon a house of cards. Trying to put new wine in old wineskins as so many on here have adeptly pointed out.
Yeast bubbles............
I've stated this many times before........while in-residence in 1978, I thought it was the pro-active corps who were questioning the "training." Then, when wierwille came to the Emporia campus......during his corps night teaching, he went off on a diatribe of cop-out insinuations and slander. Wierwille's manipulations were losing steam, and he had to resort to heavy-handed tactics to regain the upper hand. But.......even though, corps didn't storm out in an exodus during in-residence training, dozens and dozens of couples slipped away (back to their own lives, families and careers) in July.......before roa.
I vividly remember an incident in Uncle Harry Hall at Emporia Campus.......I had to return to my room for something mid-morning and crossed paths with a 7th corps guy carrying six or seven freshly-starched dress shirts from the dry cleaners. His wealthy Dad had set him up with an account at the local dry cleaners for weekly pickup and delivery. Of course, his Dad paid the bill on account. After the 7th corps graduation......I never saw this guy again.
As “merchandise” of a cult, one should be aware that they could be the subject of a "fire sale" at any given time.
“What is a fire sale in a cult?” you may ask.
Let me corps-splain…a fire sale is when a cult leader declares that you are “spiritually bankrupt” (they might say something like you are so worthless that "God won't even spit in your direction") or that your actions or supposed attitudes are indicative of the impending distress you will cause them…and as in any "fire sale" - all such problematic merchandise in a cult must go ! …see ancient archives of what happened to the Zero Corps.
Edited by T-Bone I think...therefore I am NOT in the way corps
I've stated this many times before........while in-residence in 1978, I thought it was the pro-active corps who were questioning the "training." Then, when wierwille came to the Emporia campus......during his corps night teaching, he went off on a diatribe of cop-out insinuations and slander. Wierwille's manipulations were losing steam, and he had to resort to heavy-handed tactics to regain the upper hand. But.......even though, corps didn't storm out in an exodus during in-residence training, dozens and dozens of couples slipped away (back to their own lives, families and careers) in July.......before roa.
I vividly remember an incident in Uncle Harry Hall at Emporia Campus.......I had to return to my room for something mid-morning and crossed paths with a 7th corps guy carrying six or seven freshly-starched dress shirts from the dry cleaners. His wealthy Dad had set him up with an account at the local dry cleaners for weekly pickup and delivery. Of course, his Dad paid the bill on account. After the 7th corps graduation......I never saw this guy again.
Sky, smart guy! He didn't waste his life in a Godless cult.
Though I regret some of my choices and some of what I did after leaving twi, I am who I am now because of those mistakes. That sentiment does not negate the notion that cults make merchandise of their followers/members.
I am tremendously thankful that I figured out that I needed to leave and actually did. And that the ensuing years have represented growth and development of insight I wouldn't have had otherwise.
Though I regret some of my choices and some of what I did after leaving twi, I am who I am now because of those mistakes. That sentiment does not negate the notion that cults make merchandise of their followers/members.
I am tremendously thankful that I figured out that I needed to leave and actually did. And that the ensuing years have represented growth and development of insight I wouldn't have had otherwise.
Though I regret some of my choices and some of what I did after leaving twi, I am who I am now because of those mistakes. That sentiment does not negate the notion that cults make merchandise of their followers/members.
I am tremendously thankful that I figured out that I needed to leave and actually did. And that the ensuing years have represented growth and development of insight I wouldn't have had otherwise.
Though I regret some of my choices and some of what I did after leaving twi, I am who I am now because of those mistakes. That sentiment does not negate the notion that cults make merchandise of their followers/members.
I am tremendously thankful that I figured out that I needed to leave and actually did. And that the ensuing years have represented growth and development of insight I wouldn't have had otherwise.
One of the reasons that cult was so treacherous was that there was plenty of truth entwined with the non-truth and evil stuff woven in. Most people could see the truth, but the cult was so sly, that you were lapping up the junk with the good stuff and didn't know the difference. Once you lived enough years in the world you developed some thinking skills regardless of what the cult tried to instill in you.
That's why it was so hard for most folks to leave...and why those who left were stunned at first. It took time to unravel all the threads and decide which, if any, were worth keeping. The cult was so good at it; they could keep you believing all the lies they told while still keeping you believing that you knew the word of God. They were particularly adept at this deception.
Sometimes I'm embarrassed about the deception I swallowed. But, I'm thankful for the truth I learned. Some of it must have come from them, some I learned myself along the way, and I'm still learning now some 21 or 22 years out.
It was't easy. But - it was worth it to have the truth I now have.
One of the reasons that cult was so treacherous was that there was plenty of truth entwined with the non-truth and evil stuff woven in. Most people could see the truth, but the cult was so sly, that you were lapping up the junk with the good stuff and didn't know the difference. Once you lived enough years in the world you developed some thinking skills regardless of what the cult tried to instill in you.
That's why it was so hard for most folks to leave...and why those who left were stunned at first. It took time to unravel all the threads and decide which, if any, were worth keeping. The cult was so good at it; they could keep you believing all the lies they told while still keeping you believing that you knew the word of God. They were particularly adept at this deception.
Sometimes I'm embarrassed about the deception I swallowed. But, I'm thankful for the truth I learned. Some of it must have come from them, some I learned myself along the way, and I'm still learning now some 21 or 22 years out.
It was't easy. But - it was worth it to have the truth I now have.
And no doubt to have the depth of insight you wouldn't otherwise have now. Very well stated, Krys!
Hey.........take this class, it will change your life!
At the end of pfal class.......you need to be sure to sit in the next pfal class that's available. No one gets the depth of it the first time. And then, ........ the Renewed Mind class will be running in a couple of months, followed by Dealing with the Adversary class........and Christian, Family and Sex will be running in July, just before we go to the Rock of Ages.
Every class.......tethered you TO the twit-cult and isolated you FROM Christian doctrine and practice.
Every class.......led you further into the cult's chambers of dependence ON THEM.
Every class.......skewed biblical truths by cherry-picking verses and dismissing others.
The Renewed Mind ..........you are righteous now [confess your sins to God....and boom!....you are right back in fellowship]. Yeah, riiiight.
Witnessing and Undershepherding.......recruit, recruit and get them in the classes. Monitor them during the pfal class breaks, etc.
Dealing with the Adversary.........the four fronts of the devil, and YOU are culprit number 1 and cannot trust your own decisions.
The Way Tree........one of the most JADED classes of all. Even twi DROPPED it and all usage of the words "twig" and "leaf." LOL
Christian Family and Sex......had nothing to do with Christian family, but everything to do with male dominance and SEX.
With each class.......came buzzwords and wayspeak to further isolate you from the greater Christian communities. What we thought was "biblical truths and insight" was merely manufactured subterfuge with King Jimmy Sprinkle Cake. With each bite, we became indoctrinated into a cult......one cake at a time, one class at a time.
Not sure why I am commenting, as I have nothing new, but over the years since being out, I get moments of clarity on things that I always knew. All of these classes laid a groundwork for what we were supposed to believe and how we were to act. Any hint of thought or behavior that didn't jibe with those primers were alarm signals and justification to reprimand, yell at, devalue, criticize and find some existing 'fault' that needed to be corrected , until you were back to parroting the 'word' taught in the classes at all times. After several years of reproof sessions for various crimes, it dawned on me that I could avoid much of it be keeping my mouth shut, cleaning my room, and appearing to be onboard with any and every thing the way did. At one point, I was coordinating a twig, running a way home, class 'instructor', and bookstore manager for the state all at the same time. Thankfully I resisted going into the corps, largely because deep down I knew I would never live up to that standard 24 hours a day, and had no desire to live in a compound. All those classes created a core group of otherwise 'regular' people who had been indoctrinated with just enough way think to make independent goals and actions extremely difficult.
Excellent post - spot on - and I can so relate to all you’ve said; I’m sort of the Rob Petrie type (main character on the Dick Van Dyke show) - in other words I was a pushover and would never assert myself - and I SHOULD HAVE resisted all the sales gimmicks that they used to entice people to go in the corps...I pretty much went with the flow of things and did what I was told to think & do...thank god for Chris Ge3r’s passing of a turd paper. That was a great slap in the face to wake me up and start asking what the he11 is going on.
One of the reasons that cult was so treacherous was that there was plenty of truth entwined with the non-truth and evil stuff woven in. Most people could see the truth, but the cult was so sly, that you were lapping up the junk with the good stuff and didn't know the difference. Once you lived enough years in the world you developed some thinking skills regardless of what the cult tried to instill in you.
That's why it was so hard for most folks to leave...and why those who left were stunned at first. It took time to unravel all the threads and decide which, if any, were worth keeping. The cult was so good at it; they could keep you believing all the lies they told while still keeping you believing that you knew the word of God. They were particularly adept at this deception.
Sometimes I'm embarrassed about the deception I swallowed. But, I'm thankful for the truth I learned. Some of it must have come from them, some I learned myself along the way, and I'm still learning now some 21 or 22 years out.
It was't easy. But - it was worth it to have the truth I now have.
said so well - truth intertwined with non-truth.. Thus the cognitive dissonance that I experience to this day when trying to sort it all out. I can't explain it to people. If it were something totally off the wall, like we thought we were lizard people from Planet X it would be easier to disavow.
How did it all get so crazy? How did you get trapped in the hall-of-horrors at this amusement park? Simple: False teachers used fabricated classes to indoctrinate the unsuspecting.......and coveted your involvement to make merchandise of you.
How could you NOT suspect that splinter groups will do the same.......
II Peter 2: 1-3 fits the cultic-ways of TWI to a T:
1But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
The funny thing about being in a cult - the whole time I was involved in TWI - it never occurred to me that I was being exploited...I really believed wierwille was giving his all for God and the ministry - and so compared to him - many times i felt like I wasn’t doing or giving enough. It really took the wind out of my sails when I finally realized he wasn’t a good shepherd that did his best to care for the sheep - all he wanted was to fleece the flock!
Merchandise is something bought or sold...A Cult leader makes merchandise of people - their hearts and commitment are bought with lies and empty promises only to be sold down the river...betrayed!
Merchandise is something bought or sold...A Cult leader makes merchandise of people - their hearts and commitment are bought with lies and empty promises only to be sold down the river...betrayed!
II Peter 2: 1-3 fits the cultic-ways of TWI to a T:
1But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
The funny thing about being in a cult - the whole time I was involved in TWI - it never occurred to me that I was being exploited...I really believed wierwille was giving his all for God and the ministry - and so compared to him - many times i felt like I wasn’t doing or giving enough. It really took the wind out of my sails when I finally realized he wasn’t a good shepherd that did his best to care for the sheep - all he wanted was to fleece the flock!
Merchandise is something bought or sold...A Cult leader makes merchandise of people - their hearts and commitment are bought with lies and empty promises only to be sold down the river...betrayed!
and fleece the flock he certainly did. .... F**CK Em All!!!!!
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JayDee
All I ever wanted was to get to know God and become a better man. Little did I know about the depth and depravity of vpw and his henchmen.
Great post skyrider.
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skyrider
Thanks JayDee........yeah, me too.
There is something really insidious about a cult leader who pontificated from afar........seducing others to his evil ways and raking in the money.
No transparency of manner of life, the finances, or documented history. Even his India trip and those damn snow stories were all fabrications of a demented, deceptive agenda.....which opens skepticism of all things wierwille AND his glassy-eyed brownshirts.
After all this, anyone who follows the newest splinter group, R&R...........has institutionalized imprinted in their brain cells.
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chockfull
I really like the clarity we are starting to develop when looking back with our 20/20 hindsight. The clarity of that section of scripture in 2 Peter 2 as it pertains to our experience in the Way is right on, sky. Sometimes I wish that clarity was not developed by personally experiencing the loss and ruinous destructive ways that we have. Everything has a cost. Jesus taught "beware of the leaven of the Pharisees". I never knew that would mean chasing down active yeast bubbles in my mind years later, to include patching up all that caused the loss.
In its least common denominator, the Way was and is a psychological manipulation group.
What they call being a "cop-out" is nothing more than people's normal defense mechanisms kicking in causing them to react against the manipulation. Now they have the conundrum to deal with that all the "cop-outs" are discussing scripture while their own spiritual leadership lies inept and inactive proclaiming that they no longer need to search out truth in scripture because Wierwille already had the truth revealed to him starting with his fabricated snow on the gas pump story. And they are making decisions not based upon scripture but hiding out in gray areas of scripture making decisions based upon legal counsel.
This is why churches don't have "cop-outs". They have categories they call "unchurched", and others that may have found something else in the body of Christ more suitable for them and their family.
And the R&R group, CFM, even the old hucksters like JAL, all of them are building a profession upon a house of cards. Trying to put new wine in old wineskins as so many on here have adeptly pointed out.
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JayDee
I don’t believe there was ever a moment of real Christian service in his life or in that of the BOTS. The R&R group have the same “DNA” as their “father in the word”. Countless lives destroyed by their so called “ministries”.
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skyrider
Yeast bubbles............
I've stated this many times before........while in-residence in 1978, I thought it was the pro-active corps who were questioning the "training." Then, when wierwille came to the Emporia campus......during his corps night teaching, he went off on a diatribe of cop-out insinuations and slander. Wierwille's manipulations were losing steam, and he had to resort to heavy-handed tactics to regain the upper hand. But.......even though, corps didn't storm out in an exodus during in-residence training, dozens and dozens of couples slipped away (back to their own lives, families and careers) in July.......before roa.
I vividly remember an incident in Uncle Harry Hall at Emporia Campus.......I had to return to my room for something mid-morning and crossed paths with a 7th corps guy carrying six or seven freshly-starched dress shirts from the dry cleaners. His wealthy Dad had set him up with an account at the local dry cleaners for weekly pickup and delivery. Of course, his Dad paid the bill on account. After the 7th corps graduation......I never saw this guy again.
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T-Bone
As “merchandise” of a cult, one should be aware that they could be the subject of a "fire sale" at any given time.
“What is a fire sale in a cult?” you may ask.
Let me corps-splain…a fire sale is when a cult leader declares that you are “spiritually bankrupt” (they might say something like you are so worthless that "God won't even spit in your direction") or that your actions or supposed attitudes are indicative of the impending distress you will cause them…and as in any "fire sale" - all such problematic merchandise in a cult must go ! …see ancient archives of what happened to the Zero Corps.
Edited by T-BoneI think...therefore I am NOT in the way corps
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outandabout
I just wish I'd left sooner.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Sky, smart guy! He didn't waste his life in a Godless cult.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Outie, so do I.
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JayDee
I hear you. Wish I’d never been involved.
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Rocky
I don't share that wish with you.
Though I regret some of my choices and some of what I did after leaving twi, I am who I am now because of those mistakes. That sentiment does not negate the notion that cults make merchandise of their followers/members.
I am tremendously thankful that I figured out that I needed to leave and actually did. And that the ensuing years have represented growth and development of insight I wouldn't have had otherwise.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Taxi,
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JayDee
Good for you Rocky. I left 31 years ago.
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krys
One of the reasons that cult was so treacherous was that there was plenty of truth entwined with the non-truth and evil stuff woven in. Most people could see the truth, but the cult was so sly, that you were lapping up the junk with the good stuff and didn't know the difference. Once you lived enough years in the world you developed some thinking skills regardless of what the cult tried to instill in you.
That's why it was so hard for most folks to leave...and why those who left were stunned at first. It took time to unravel all the threads and decide which, if any, were worth keeping. The cult was so good at it; they could keep you believing all the lies they told while still keeping you believing that you knew the word of God. They were particularly adept at this deception.
Sometimes I'm embarrassed about the deception I swallowed. But, I'm thankful for the truth I learned. Some of it must have come from them, some I learned myself along the way, and I'm still learning now some 21 or 22 years out.
It was't easy. But - it was worth it to have the truth I now have.
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Rocky
Indeed. Good for you too, JayDee, that you left 31 years ago. Shortly after I left.
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Rocky
And no doubt to have the depth of insight you wouldn't otherwise have now. Very well stated, Krys!
Btw, Happy Birthday!
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skyrider
Every class.......tethered you TO the twit-cult and isolated you FROM Christian doctrine and practice.
Every class.......led you further into the cult's chambers of dependence ON THEM.
Every class.......skewed biblical truths by cherry-picking verses and dismissing others.
With each class.......came buzzwords and wayspeak to further isolate you from the greater Christian communities. What we thought was "biblical truths and insight" was merely manufactured subterfuge with King Jimmy Sprinkle Cake. With each bite, we became indoctrinated into a cult......one cake at a time, one class at a time.
.
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hiway29
Not sure why I am commenting, as I have nothing new, but over the years since being out, I get moments of clarity on things that I always knew. All of these classes laid a groundwork for what we were supposed to believe and how we were to act. Any hint of thought or behavior that didn't jibe with those primers were alarm signals and justification to reprimand, yell at, devalue, criticize and find some existing 'fault' that needed to be corrected , until you were back to parroting the 'word' taught in the classes at all times. After several years of reproof sessions for various crimes, it dawned on me that I could avoid much of it be keeping my mouth shut, cleaning my room, and appearing to be onboard with any and every thing the way did. At one point, I was coordinating a twig, running a way home, class 'instructor', and bookstore manager for the state all at the same time. Thankfully I resisted going into the corps, largely because deep down I knew I would never live up to that standard 24 hours a day, and had no desire to live in a compound. All those classes created a core group of otherwise 'regular' people who had been indoctrinated with just enough way think to make independent goals and actions extremely difficult.
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T-Bone
Hiway29,
Excellent post - spot on - and I can so relate to all you’ve said; I’m sort of the Rob Petrie type (main character on the Dick Van Dyke show) - in other words I was a pushover and would never assert myself - and I SHOULD HAVE resisted all the sales gimmicks that they used to entice people to go in the corps...I pretty much went with the flow of things and did what I was told to think & do...thank god for Chris Ge3r’s passing of a turd paper. That was a great slap in the face to wake me up and start asking what the he11 is going on.
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Grace Valerie Claire
Sky, I took the classes you mentioned, and I thought they were a waste of time, and money. They were boring!!
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outandabout
said so well - truth intertwined with non-truth.. Thus the cognitive dissonance that I experience to this day when trying to sort it all out. I can't explain it to people. If it were something totally off the wall, like we thought we were lizard people from Planet X it would be easier to disavow.
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T-Bone
II Peter 2: 1-3 fits the cultic-ways of TWI to a T:
1But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
The funny thing about being in a cult - the whole time I was involved in TWI - it never occurred to me that I was being exploited...I really believed wierwille was giving his all for God and the ministry - and so compared to him - many times i felt like I wasn’t doing or giving enough. It really took the wind out of my sails when I finally realized he wasn’t a good shepherd that did his best to care for the sheep - all he wanted was to fleece the flock!
Merchandise is something bought or sold...A Cult leader makes merchandise of people - their hearts and commitment are bought with lies and empty promises only to be sold down the river...betrayed!
Edited by T-BoneFormatting and clarity
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Rocky
Bam!
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Infoabsorption
and fleece the flock he certainly did. .... F**CK Em All!!!!!
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